How To Hit SMOOTHER FOREHANDS In Tennis - Forget The “ATP” Forehand!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.ค. 2024
- Shout out to the most interesting tennis player the sport missed out on, clay Thompson! Did you learn something from his forehand? Let us know in the comments below!
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As long as they are 2/3 mins long, I would probably watch them
yes please do.
yes that would be grreat.
yes please!
One thing that helped me the most being the most inconsistent person on the court was by focusing on my technique less and focusing more on the ball,contact point, and follow through to direct the ball where I want it. Before just like you said I was obsessed with getting that lag and snap but that comes naturally depending on what kind of ball you get. Before I would always try to have the exact same technique on every forehand but every shot in tennis is different. My two cents :)
Well that's what I preach the most on the channel. Focus on good contact, footwork and being in good position. Over analyzing technique is never a good thing
@@MyTennisHQ ahhh yes how could I forget footwork 🤦🏽♂️ best tennis channel on TH-cam IMO 💯
Absolutely agree
This video has taught me that like the serve, the groudstrokes whilst keeping the fundamentals should develop into the individual's signature. I'm going to start honing in on MY forehand now.
That's exactly what I want you to do
Your strokes and playstyle are a part of your identity. Don’t bog down your individuality by trying to be someone you’re not.
@@commondirtbagz7130 I only started this year with the goal of being at least 5.5 by the end. I'm at 5.0 now but I couldn't get beyond 4.5 without leaving modelling behind. However every junior must watch the pros to learn which parts they want to emulate, like any artist taking a range of inspiration to become their final product.
@@harryherman5371 agreed. Also I had that same issue for several years. You see all of these videos saying “now here we have a slow motion video of Roger Federer, and you want to emulate this, this, and that”. Like, there’s only one Roger Federer. And because I and I assume a lot of people get so obsessed with looking and playing like our idols, our strokes become to rigid and manufactured. I used to want to play like nadal as well and was pretty successful at it for a few days. Years later I’ve worked on my own technique and now have that nadal topspin with a Federer like technique. It’s funny how that comes through later in life but I never would have achieved that result if I stopped worrying about looking like them and just practiced.
@@MyTennisHQ most important advice..the rest will just follow Naturally into place
Thanks K, great video...Clay is truly a joy to watch with his forehand! Thanks for analyzing his movements too. Keep up the good work!
This was something I could have used 3-4 years ago. I stunted my own growth on the forehand by obsessing over an “ATP forehand” over the last couple months I feel as though my consistency has improved 200%, just by not caring. Starting my college season this month, and I’ve beaten a lot of international players who have come to the college, hoping I can get to the #1 spot my first year.
I hope this video helps other players who were in a similar position!
Clay, what a forehand! Really beautiful and consistent! As far as pros go, I wish better quality video was invented a few years earlier so we could watch more Fed circa 2005 forehand. I think you mentioned it in another video, but that version was so damn fluid and had a nice looking loop! I'm sure he has a good reason for why he changed it, but it really did a number on amateur tennis lol. By the way I love that you understand that amateurs just physically can't do what pros do and that that is okay. We don't have the thousands of hours of training, nor the ridiculous levels of coordination and timing that you do and what will make us better is not necessarily the same things that make you better. Pro tennis and amateur tennis are just two completely different games.
Love your channel! So practical and straight to the point.
love your tone Bro. You truly seem like youre teaching for all the right reasons
Nice video Karue!
Thank you.
The slow motion narrative is extremely helpful, especially the side and rear view perspectives. It helps to break down the synchronization of the different muscle movements. I also use the Nike swoosh of the stroke path, and the resultant REVERSE nike flight path of the ball.
Love that. The reverse Nike path ahhah
Exact same forehand like Jose Acasuso! In my opinion, this is really good for timing and consistency.
Yeah Karue your 2HBH video really helped me "left, right, clear the hips". Looking forward to this one now to build my FH consistency
Super helpful video! You're right...too many videos out there showing you how to hit like Federer...which 98% of even decent players simply cannot do consistently! Thanks...very helpful!
Enjoyed this and tried it out yesterday - part of a seemingly eternal quest (feels like) for this kind of forehand. Tried it in a league match and some forehands felt really good. Will practise.
that is great to hear!! Keep up
@karue … this was one of the best videos … great focus
\
Very helpful clip. 👍🙏🎾
Clay's early racquet prep is really nice. It's kinda hard to tell from the video, but in person it's evident. I had the opportunity to hit with Clay several times and it's very hard to rush him because of the early unit turn.
TODD!!
@@MyTennisHQ Shout out to you, Clay and Max for putting on a great summer camp. Aiden loves it and so do I even though I can hardly walk the next day! ;-) app.universaltennis.com/events/55404
@@toddmueller Looks like a great event. Thanks for sharing it out. You CA folks have all the cool stuff.
I agree with this a lot. Something that helped me is always think about keeping the elbow high. I had the issue of keeping my elbow too close to my body
Yep. Elbow away from the body always helps
Could it be that "elbow high" is a trigger to get the upper arm swinging in the stroke? I think one of my main problems with power and timing is forgetting to use my upper arm in the swing; when I remember, the swing works out much better.
Best youtube channel for tennis! Brasileiro? Parabens pelo sucesso do canal
Muito obrigado!
Osaka is one that has a simple loop that a lot of people could probably replicate.
Yep. She has a very simple loop as well. That's the point of the video. Not to just hit like clay but to realize that most good forehands start with a simple loop, each person will have their own way of doing it so
with the high elbow and the nice loop his forehand reminds a bit of sampras forehand. very nice, clean and "simple" forehand. simple in the sense of pure, following the rule that less is more
Great video! I was wondering if you could make a video on how to lower your center of gravity to able to stay low when playing tennis. Are there any specific exercises to condition your body to stay low besides just “bend your knees!” haha. I feel like you probably had to do these exercises as a pro. Keep up the good work!
Enjoyed the video! Also, I was very happy to see a fellow Bruin making these videos so I was sure to subscribe. Keep up the great work!
Thank you! Go Bruins!
He has a great forehand. You guys were hitting very cooperative, this doesn’t happen often as people continuously want to hit a winner.
Harder when the second ball you receive is 6 inches from the service line and 2 inches high because your hitting partner blocks it back with a piece of plywood.
Just a comment from mi observations: For this pretty C shape fluid swing is always synced and with plenty of time to hit in front I notice he must start out the "first dot of the C" as early as the incoming ball is just crossing above the net.
Any time later and he'd be late or out of sync.
Wonderful example of your topic showing this motion. The best proof is the perfect rainbow that describes the ball over and over.
Started out from a perfect C and ends up with another but inverted one.
Excellent your remark on the continuous motion too unlike other forehands swings out there.
What I’m looking for at the moment (and practicing) is how all good forehands have the racket face closed at ALL times - like this guy is doing. You could possibly show the entire racket path by starting with arm hanging straight down (racket face pointing to ground) then move it back (racket face to back fence) then forward to contact (face to the ball) - the arm/racket structure never changes. This simplistic idea is helping me keep a consistent racket face angle at contact. What do you think?
Clay “pelvic thrust” Thompson. Oh yeah. He’s a legend!
Great videos! Do you have advice for the racquet face after contact? Like, at "12 o'clock" should the strings be facing the opponent or should the frame still be vertical?
Hey Karue, basically that's the next-gen forehand, used by players like kyrgios, sock, shapo and thiem (before making some changes with Massu)
Doing a long slow loop is fine when you're practicing rallies. But during point play things move faster. You don't always get the time to make the perfect technical swing.
Just purchased more stuff off Amazon with TennisHQ link...$85 eye cream for a client...lol...I've been concentrating on words like shape it with visualization and it does something magical that I can't explain...Its been effective as I'm sure it taps into the creative part of the brain rather than thinking more topspin or low to high...You have valuable knowledge you're sharing and if vlog helps deliver content, I'm for it...thanks HQ
Legend! Thank you RK. Glad our content is helping you improve
I would really like if you can comment on how he finishes across the body and down to the waist in stead of closer to the shoulder. I have the tendency of doing that, but with no success of fixing it
5:25 nice point in the background
I recently watched a video by Nishioka. His opinion is basically don't worry about the takeback at all and just focus on the contact point. I definitely agree with this. If there is one thing that's so important and brings such a big advantage, you'll probably every professional player does that. But the takeback style and where your racket should tip to is obviously not such a thing,
Yep I have a video on that as well. Basically just have good contact and everything else should follow. My focus is always on good contact, proper footwork and the stability
Yes
Hitting in semi open stance like the pros, sometimes I find it hard to get in as you are partially turned with your hips but fully turned shoulders, takes a while to get used to, but a little easier on your hips then a full open stance as you get older like me, 59
i wish i knew about your channel when i lived in LA...we could have hit!
Do you recomend spending the time on the tennis court just playing passes when you are a newbie? Or playing with rules like points, set etc?
I wonder if the lack of smoothness among amateurs using the ATP forehand is due to the fact that it's often broken down into 3 segments so players understand the stroke. Learning the forehand as positions 1, 2 and 3 may reinforce unnecessary hitches and pauses, especially around position 2.
Another thought might also be that among club amateurs the ball is coming back fairly slow, so the player may wait too long in position 1, preparing...
Yes that's exactly what it is. People try to make three different movements in order to place the racket in different areas of the swing instead of allowing the racket to move freely back and forth like a pendulum.
And yes that also helps where people turn too quickly and have to wait at position one too long
@@MyTennisHQ Great idea about the pendulum. Problem: how do you time the pendulum when the ball is coming in faster than normal? Thanks.
Just focus on catching the ball in front of you no matter what. At that point it's not about a perfect swing just a good contact and managing the ball accordingly
@@MyTennisHQ Great tip Karue. Just treat your forehand like your serve! You just don't pause your racket while striking a killer wide slice!
Connors had a backswing the started low with strings facing down. It is quite amazing how consistent you can be hitting that way. IMO, anyone who is struggling with topspin (ball flying way long) should try the Connors take back - it will explain (to your mind/body) what the contact should actually feel like. Then add a bigger take back and loop later. Too much nonsense going on in the stroke was the problem for me.
Contact on, he does a lot of windshield wiper motion with his arm - something I lack on my forehand, because I was thought to extend extend extend extend....
Would be awesome if you can do a video on a smooth amateur first serve that's suitable for NTRP 3.0-4.5 players who don't have the body height, flexibility, and accuracy of young pros.
I wish you would have a comparison to ATP forehand to see direction we need to head.
Can you make a video about the mentality of getting over the yips? I've been watching alot of forehand videos and I think I've ruined my forehand, even the fundamentals are not there. Should I just take a long break and try not to think about it?
Will do. Just do whatever feels natural to you. Stop trying to have perfect technique. All you need is a great contact point
He looks just like Tsitsipas!
My thoughts exactly
No.
I thought it was in the thumbnails haha
Clay Thompson looks like dollar store Tsitsipas lol
It's his little brother!
Nice car! :)
Hi Mr. Karue, is there somewhere you know that sells a Wilson Pro Staff V13 and delivers to the Philippines? Thank you.
i have too much topspin in my forehand and often i am contacting the ball in the middle of the racket how can i correct this ?
Looks like tsitsipas, name is "Klay Thompson" jeez this man is going places
What I like is how relaxed his arm is. It's not tight or tense or trying to muscle the shot.
yep he plays very relaxed
@@MyTennisHQ I play maybe a couple of times a week and have tried hard to use this and one thing I note is that in trying to use this swing, it really brings into focus all the other things that are not quite right, like timing, footwork, recovery, you name it. It can be frustrating but that's part of the process. Progress is happening.
Thank you Karue! Can you do a video for the two handed backhand please? 🙏
Plenty of videos on the channel. Just browse our library
Thank you 😊
Any idea what camera he uses? And the app for slow mo?
Didnt know klay thompson played tennis
Clay has great footwork too.
Ugh I wish I’d seen this before working on the atp forehand…now I have to get over tennis elbow from the atp “mirror mirror” position :(
His playstyle and footwork look similar to Stefanos tsitsipas.
My thoughts exactly. Very similar to Tsitsipas FH
In my own experience that high elbow loop is critical for boosting power. What it does is orient the racket head to about the 2 o'clock position--rather than at the traditional 12 o'clock position during the unit turn. This allows a longer loop path for the same amount of unit turn and the longer the loop path the more racket head speed can be achieved. The other important effect is that it promotes formation of the wrist lag as the racket accelerates to the bottom of the loop and then the racket arm is thrust forward, creating that wrist lag.
Replicated this from lefty side and jesus, I have great forehand now. The high loop really gave me leverage and im not so robotic now.
Let’s go!! Crush them
Ya got any advice on how to play really good without a proper warmup? I always see the trainers and the ball boys play with the club members and they literally warmup hitting one ball and boom theyre game ready destroying evey ball
Awesome video. Somewhat of a beginner here. If with this stroke I find my bicep and other side of my elblow is sore, is there something I’m likely doing wrong? It’s mildly sore after about an hour or two of playing.
Honestly not sure. Soreness is part of the process. If you are a beginner, you probably haven’t used a lot of those muscles before so they are sore. No issues
@@MyTennisHQ correct. It’s got a lot better / not as noticeable with more reps. Cheers. This is a great stroke.
With this stroke I’ve got more consistent. I can sometimes get power but more often get good consistency and that up/down movement of the ball as a beginner. Any tips for adding power to this stroke?
Don't worry about power yet. Continue to perfect the rhythm of your stroke and an optimal contact point. To add more power try to move your body towards the target as you hit the ball
@@MyTennisHQ cool. I watched the sink and push video. Another solid one - assuming that is part of your message here. Another Q with the stroke is clearance above the net. I can get a variety of clearances but would love to cut it closer to the net more often. Any videos you’d suggest to help here. I’m kind of figuring this out as I play. Seems like it’s about target, contact point, racket head
yay karue, ur on netflix! I saw you, looking fresh
what for a grip is he using?
At 10:00 the follow through is not as extended as others. I do this a lot and have been criticized by coaches for this, they say its too wristy.
Not sure if its the result of being a bit late?
That's just the way clay has found to generate extra topspin when he needs it or when the situation requires it. It's the same as going over your head like rafa
What racquet is he using?
I tried doing that Thiem-style loop once and it didn't feel right - I think for beginners copying players like Agassi or Andy Murray is better.
You talked about your own FH before and that you want to switch to a little bit more like del potro style. I think that's a lot easier to copy (especially for beginners) then this one because of the timing issue's when the tip of the racket pointing forward in the backswing. My question is why are you not trying this with your FH instead of the del potro FH?
I never said point the tip of the racket like clays. I only focused on creating a solid loop so the racket can move freely with a natural flow. You aren't supposed to copy the stroke to the teeth.
@@MyTennisHQ Good point. My whole goal is to just hit a heavy-shaped ball that lands 2 ft from the lines consistently. How I get to that method is irrelevant as far as emulating a certain technique.
Start from the very basics, and how you stroke when you expand the swing and acceleration, keeping true to the basics, is your own style.
Tbh best forehands to copy right off the bat are very compact simple forehands like David Ferrer, Murray, Agassi, Nalbandian. Klay’s a heck of a player but that forehand is too funky to copy. No one does crazy loops like that no more. That’s like Hewitt style. Takes too long to load up.
Most amateurs have plenty of time to create a good, repeatable loop. I never said it had to be just like clays, the point is to show how repeatable a proper loop can be. Way more effective than abbreviated swings with pauses and hitches. The focus is on the shoulder turn, time of acceleration and base/footwork
The start of the loop is an unusual, awkward action in this video. The frame is pointed towards the net and the elbow is high and away from the body. Would be better for the frame to be pointed more vertical and the elbow more tucked.
Look up Fernando Gonzalez
@@MyTennisHQ yes Gonzo does have a high elbow, but he uses the offhand on the throat nicely to create an easy momentum for the top of the loop.
Hi Karue, could you explain what you meant by “he’s not using his chest”? Thanks!!!
Means that he isn't using too much of his chest to bring the racket forward. A lot of amateurs tend to force the racket forward by using their chests instead of just allowing the racket to move freely like a pendulum
Does the shoulder pull the racquet forward? I guess I’m having trouble understanding the chest/shoulder relationship.
his high elbow take back is prominent
This guy has a hybrid of modern and 'next gen'. Do those terms get on your nerves too or are they valid distinctions? I'm just trying to land on something that I can call my own!
It does because what is the "next gen" forehand? All these guys just have forehands. Some more compact like tsitsi, some with long loops like Medvedev or shapo.. Those terms make no sense hahah
I guess 'next gen' is the whipper high elbow kind that starts in the Jedi light saber pose and modern being the box style Fed pat the dog loop..I'm sick of all this info as well, I've been watching too many videos. I'm going to try and forget the terms and continue building something consistent and comfortable. Thanks.
@@harryherman5371 funny thing, I started doing "next gen" pointing the racquet forward at the beginning of the stroke before I knew it was a thing, then I see all the young guys start doing it. I think Kyrgios started it all.
@@MyTennisHQ It's called a next gen forehand because the term get clicks on youtube :-)
Difficult to replicate I think, this is a very advanced forehand in my humble opinion.
It is very clearly stated that you are not supposed to replicate his forehand. The point of the video is to show you a few things you can try to ad to your stroke. The flowing loop, allowing the racket to move freely like a pendulum, the low to high contact, the base.
This is not a beginners channel.
His backhand looks great, too. Next video..?
Karue, a tons of video out there also teaches the loop too. However most of rec players still can’t achieve this smoothness. I think the issue is not that people don’t know how to play loopy shot is that most people focus on the racquet/hand and forget the overall body balance and posture. When I say focus on the racquet, most amateurs instinctively focus on their hands and shoulder, then they forget to open their chest, they forget to rotate into the shot, and then their shot will be late because they are focusing too much on pushing that arm back. So yea, I agree, there should be smoothness, but I think the real issue is communication and focus.
The smoothness comes from the ability to time the shot. Most players can't the ball well so, they have to force things a little bit.
Karue, I noticed your name got mentioned a few times in Naomi Osaka Netflix docuseries. :)
What is your definition of an ATP forehand? How is that not an ATP forehand? An ATP forehand is defined by the racquet head starting on the outside and above the hand, in the backswing + the racquet swing is on the hitting side of the body. His backswing is more elaborate and complicated because the hitting side of the racquet face is pointing at the back fence in the backswing.
I don't have a definition for the atp forehand because no coach I've ever worked with has ever used that term. What you said about that definition, I didn't understand. My point is, those terms make tennis more complicated than it actually is and are confusing most amateurs
His has more of a next gen forehand
Its funny how it looks like he's not using the crosses in his racket stringbed.
👍
He is starting his stroke early. That is why his stroke looks so relaxed. You have to read the opponent well to do that. Most people react to late …
Yep. Shoulder turn starts early
Quick ball recognition equates to early unit turn. Look how grounded he is on contact.
This.. made a noticeable difference to me when I started shouting out "forehand" or "backhand" and initiating a unit turn as fast as possible - I gave myself the goal of shouting before the ball crossed the net. The less experienced you are the faster your brain fills up processing the flight of the ball, so the more you can get done before that happens the more likely you are to succeed.
@@NamesAreRandom I do the same thing with my directionals. I call them out before I even hit the ball.
Does Clay hit a one hander now?
Don’t understand how this huge loop will work at lower levels where timing is usually quite poor.
Don't need to make as big a loop as him. It is about take-back, letting gravity do it's work and one smooth motion. But practice is important as footwork is just as key.
Yep footwork and spacing are incredibly important. Loading on the back leg EVERY shot and driving forward. Takes practice 😄
Thank you for the comment and understanding what I meant to show with the video! Exactly that, RK
At lower club levels the unit turn is so late. Try the unit turn after the ball has made contact with your opponent's racket. I see so many club players unit turn on the bounce on their side of the court.
Would rather see the same analysis of Carue's forehand.
It actually is insane how good Clay is considering how bad his footwork is. If he could tidy that up, he would be insane
Unrelated to this video, but I was just watching the Naomi documentary on netflix, was that you in the preparation for Australian Open?
I haven't watched it yet but potentially yes
Update. That was me
@@MyTennisHQ yes, watching carefully, she also mentions you!
Thompson's forehand looks like a more normal version of Medvedev's forehand
It actually does hahaha
What happened to the delpo forehand?
That was just one video
Appreciate the comment about the pause (in baseball called a hitch). It's caused me a lot of problems. Does Thompson's low finish carry advantages?
Whenever he finishes it low it is just because that's the way he found to be more effective when the shot that was hit to him calls for extra spin. I do the opposite of that and go over my head
The finish is the result of how the racquet goes through the ball. I don't pay attention to the finish, only on what I want to do to the ball.
@@transklutz thanks. Me too, tho' my coach scolds me if i finish low on anything besides a low approach ball.
If I hit just one forehand like that I could die happy.
i remember clay thompson from this youtube glory reel years ago (when he was like a character straight out of a wes anderson flick :) th-cam.com/video/kBsekr89-B0/w-d-xo.html
Tempo and timing
Why is Karue so good looking? And I'm a straight guy 🤣
What car you drive?
2018 Mustang
important question: where are those shades from? lol
10 bucks at Pacsun
The ATP forehand is created to be easy. Easy timing, short Rom, all to be as eazy and simple as possible. I agree a loop forehand looks way cooler and it can be effective but in my opinion your completly wrong when u say its easier to. Still a great channel for sure!
The best forehands in the world are all simple loops. The atp forehand is just BS created to get views. Not one coach I've ever worked with in professional tennis has used that term nor they focused on the "atp" forehand fundamentals. But hey, what do I know?
@@MyTennisHQ sure most of the atp pro's use some kind of loop. Its just to hard to teach to starters. The elbow and racket start going everywhere as in de "atp forehand" its all simpel. I see the atp forehand as a base of the forehand like the basics. After that its easier to make it smoother and play more relaxed. Its how i developed my own forehand. Calling it BS is not fair in my opinion. Everyone has is own way. Besides that its called atp forehand because most WTP didnt use it. But thats years ago right know thats not the case anymore in my opinion
@@yaridejong5819 A loop is just a fundamental part of any forehand no? Pretty sure every player on tour loops their forehand just some more than others.
It's like saying that you shouldn't focus on contact with the ball just do the ATP forehand. Of course, every forehand needs a good contact point.
@@DjokovicIsOurLordAndSaviour wtf is your point im saying most of the players are using a loop?
@@yaridejong5819 You said that ATP forehands are easier than loop forehands as if ATP forehands aren't using a loop.
Then later you said that it's not easy for beginners to use a loop forehand. Therefore, they should start with an ATP forehand... But, swinging from low to high (this motion is most of what creates the loop) is just fundamental to hitting a ball over the net consistently. Even if you can't generate topspin yet a loop is about as basic as it gets when you think about it.
So my point is that I strongly disagree with you that pretty much anything else should come before this step and that it's not relevant for beginners.
Clay went to a one hander??
Nope, he just likes training both
Too complicated on the back swing, that’s why he’s late so much. You should do Mackenzie Mcdonald, best forehand to come out of us college.
The left doesnt look nearly as good as the fh, amazing fh tho.
Traffic sucks!!