I gave my life to the Lord at age 10. I than lived the next 15 years like the devil. Until one day i came across The Word for Today and Chuck Smith. Bless you Pastor Chuck for your radio program. The Holy spirit flowed through you. I am proud to say i have been walking on the narrow path now for 27 years since that day.
I agree and think the very same thing about seeing him again someday. I sure miss those days going Calvary Costa Mesa back in the 80’s and 90’s hearing him teach.
What a blessing to be able to have Pastor Chuck right here in my living room today. This is total de je vu for me as I was there. Thank you for making this available.
Further, I notice that if a particular Bible teacher is firmly a pre-trib believer, you will notice that 2 Thes 2 is either ignored or is parsed in such a way to make this chapter say something other than what it plainly says.
I stand pre trib, whether it means falling away( depature of the church) or falling away as in from the faith, its up to the person to read it as they want, all i know is i will see the face of Jesus one day
God does not rebuke those who seek Him asking illumination of any part of scripture. You may be persuaded this way or that, but just as a gentle correction, we are not to read into scripture passages any which way we want. That isnt a good idea
I'm sitting here in 2024, listening to him talk about the church and the Israel situation back when he preached this and I'm like ... Oh just wait ... It gets much worse 😢 ... I'm sure someone a while down the road will say that to me. 😢🙏🙏🙏
I like the Calvary Chapel churches because they are biblically oriented. But I think there is a doctrine of pre-tribulation rapture. I'm quite sure 2 Thes 2 dispells this theory. it is a stumbling block not only for a Pre-Trib rapture postion but also other positions like Daniel 9:24-27 took place in 70 AD, or most of Revelation does not apply to us because we will be raptured for lack of a better word. But the stumbling block for many theories is not clear unless the entire chapter is read and is read in terms of what the subject of the chapter speaks about.
The rapture cannot be imminent since Paul made it clear that before our gathering together unto him (the rapture) there apostasy must occur and the man of lawlessness be revealed. So how can it be imminent?
2 Thessalonians 2 (KJV) falling away first, = that"s sacrifice and oblation to cease, the one who exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshipped, so he as God sits in the temple of God ( is Pharisees they sit in Moses seat Matthew 23:1-2=Exoudes 7:1-2)== they will sit there till the 40 years end ( EZEKIEL 4 ) =GOD will remove him ( Pharisees) v8 LORD shall consume with the spirit of his mouth and the brightness of his coming. ( in 70 AD ) ------ MAY GOD BLESS YOU AND KEEP YOU
it isn't a bad translation in the KJV. It is the correct translation. The Day of the Lord starts at the tribulation. Paul is saying the Day of the Lord HASN'T started and the Day of the Lord will not start until the man of sin is revealed, after the rapture. The KJV is correct. Looking forward to meeting Chuck in heaven one day. A genuine man of God
Falling away :apostasia" The apostasy began in Pauls day with the judaisers. Only got worse from there, The man of sin "anthropos" translated men many times, "Son" translated sons many times. Sons of destruction stand in pulpits in every tithe taking false teaching church world wide every sunday. The apostasy is on steroids' today.
@@dsheppard8492Not to mention all the “Unity Agreements” almost all Protestant Denominations and independent Evangelical churches have signed with the AC in Rome (Mystery Babylon). And the surge of Lordship Salvation Calvinism among Protestants, is nothing more than a renamed RCC’s works salvation (which is NO salvation).
@@jayjay-bz3rr Well, first off it is a noun not a verb - the apostasia. It could mean the departure but more likely it is the rebellion against God's people.
Here is 2 Thes 2:1-12 (which is really the meat of what the subject is in the first sentence): The Great Apostasy 1 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God. 5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness. NKJV Interesting that whoever came up with the heading for this passage is not "The Coming of our Lord" or "The Day of Christ" or "The Rapture." The chapter heading is wrong, and I don't really care that much, just an observation. That is not the subject of this chapter or passage through verse 12. The subject concerns the coming of Jesus and our gathering together to Him. What did Paul tell the Thessalonians the first time? 1 Thes 4:13-18. As far as the rapture, our gathering together to Him is the rapture. Paul tells us that this time will not come UNTIL the two events he speaks of takes place. Also, and this is very important, Paul tells us that this is the Anti-Christ (in so many words) from verse 6 on. Tie in this chapter to Daniel 9:27, Matthew 24:15, Mark 13:14, Luke 21:20 and 1 Thes 4:13. 1 Thes 4:13-18 The Comfort of Christ’s Coming 13 But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus. 15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words. NKJV 1 Thes 4:17 is the rapture as the term is used, harpazo in the Greek. 2 Thes 2:1 is the rapture, "our gathering together with him," episynagōgḗ in the Greek which means gathering together. This is what Paul told the gentiles in his first visit. Although this isn't exhaustive obviously of what he said. If you put together this and 2 Thes 2, we have a clearer understanding. It's important if you want to be prepared for what may be coming very soon and not be very deceived, not to put your faith in them, to not be deceived by doctrines or teachings or what have you. This chapter 2 Thes 2, is a stumbling block to incorrect doctrines and interpretations and theories. Be sober and mature in the Word of God. Do not be deceived.
yep, I was a pre-tribber ( meaning not being here for the anti-christ/beast) for 38 plus years, 2 thes 2 says something different we will be here for the revealing of the beast
Absolutely correct! Thank you. A topic sentence (in this case, the Rapture) tells you what the passage is about. Paul does not veer from that subject, the Rapture, immediately to the Day of the Lord. Rather, he is stating when the Rapture is relative to the apostasy and the Abomination of Desolation (revelation of Antichrist). So many Bible versions use Day of the Lord instead of Day of Christ because they are based on the Nestle-Aland Greek manuscripts, not Textus Receptus. Day of Christ is positive, whereas Day of the Lord is negative. Paul is speaking about the Day of Christ--the Rapture. This is the only passage that actually gives you the order of these events...apostasy, revelation of AC, Rapture. The 7 years are not all the wrath of God, only the Day of the Lord is, which starts after the midpoint, not at the beginning of the 7 years. Note: It was not the Day of the Lord that the Thessalonians were asking about, it was that they thought they had missed the Rapture (Day of Christ).
He is wrong! There is no departure of the church in that verse. This is where man adds and changes the word to fit their narrative. Instead of reading it the way God intended it to be read. Falling away in Greek is apostasy it is to fall away from the truth. To depart from it. Plain and simple! Don’t go adding church to the end of it bc church is not in the definition. There is no rapture before the tribulation and Christ didn’t teach it nor did the prophets. We do NOT gather back with Christ until all things are fulfilled! Matthew 24:34 “Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.” Luke 24:44 “And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.” He said wait upon Him!!! He doesn’t return until after the tribulation. And the tribulation is NOT 7 or 3 1/2 years, it’s a 5 month period which is in Rev 9. God shortened the time (tribulation) for the elects sake or no flesh would be saved. Why?? Bc that’s how good Satan is going to be claiming he is God. Brothers and sisters, I encourage you you ask our Father for wisdom and knowledge of His word. Do not trust man’s teachings. All wisdom comes from our Father. Our Father said to wait upon Him. DO NOT fall for the first Christ that appears! It is not Christ but the Antichrist. Psalms 37:34 “Wait on the LORD, and keep his way, and he shall exalt thee to inherit the land: when the wicked are cut off, thou shalt see it.” You can’t see it if your raptured! So we know, we’re going to see it. If you are taken first, you are taken spiritual by Satan bc that’s the whole purpose of him coming is to deceive Fathers children. You better be mentally and physically prepared for what’s coming. Satans not coming to physically kill anyone, he’s coming to try an destroy your soul. He wants you to worship him. Bc he wants to be God. Please go read Fathers word! It’s very important to put that gospel armour on in these end times. We are still in our flesh bodies when the Antichrist comes. As soon as Christ returns we are all changed into our spiritual bodies. That’s how you know the fake from the true Messiah. 1 John 3:2 “Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.” Psalms 37:9 “For evildoers shall be cut off: but those that wait upon the LORD, they shall inherit the earth.” Job 14:14 “If a man die, shall he live again? all the days of my appointed time will I wait, till my change come.” Psalms 27:14 “Wait on the LORD: be of good courage, and he shall strengthen thine heart: wait, I say, on the LORD.” Zephaniah 3:8 “Therefore wait ye upon me, saith the LORD, until the day that I rise up to the prey: for my determination is to gather the nations, that I may assemble the kingdoms, to pour upon them mine indignation, even all my fierce anger: for all the earth shall be devoured with the fire of my jealousy.”
The day of the Lord is the Thousand-Year millennium after the seventh Trump in 1st Corinthians 15:52 2nd Peter 3 verse 8-9 say that the day of the Lord is a thousand years and a thousand years is one day. Rapture is not in the KJV Bible nor any Bible and God condemns the word rapture in flying away in Ezekiel 13 verses 18 through 21 if you look up the word are in 1st Thessalonians 4 verse 16 and 17 it means Breath of Life or spiritual body it's not atmosphere you have to look up the original meaning of the words in the Strong's concordance for the Hebrew and Greek God bless
I gave my life to the Lord at age 10. I than lived the next 15 years like the devil. Until one day i came across The Word for Today and Chuck Smith. Bless you Pastor Chuck for your radio program. The Holy spirit flowed through you. I am proud to say i have been walking on the narrow path now for 27 years since that day.
Pride goes before a great fall!
Oh how I miss this man. Chuck will always be one of my heros. What a great teacher of God's Word. I can't wait to see him again ❤
I agree and think the very same thing about seeing him again someday. I sure miss those days going Calvary Costa Mesa back in the 80’s and 90’s hearing him teach.
Thank you Jesus for pastor chuck
This teaching is such an encouragement! Thank you Lord that these messages from Pastor Chuck are available to us today🙏🏼
What a blessing to be able to have Pastor Chuck right here in my living room today. This is total de je vu for me as I was there. Thank you for making this available.
Further, I notice that if a particular Bible teacher is firmly a pre-trib believer, you will notice that 2 Thes 2 is either ignored or is parsed in such a way to make this chapter say something other than what it plainly says.
I stand pre trib, whether it means falling away( depature of the church) or falling away as in from the faith, its up to the person to read it as they want, all i know is i will see the face of Jesus one day
God does not rebuke those who seek Him asking illumination of any part of scripture. You may be persuaded this way or that, but just as a gentle correction, we are not to read into scripture passages any which way we want. That isnt a good idea
Wonderful teaching
I'm sitting here in 2024, listening to him talk about the church and the Israel situation back when he preached this and I'm like ... Oh just wait ... It gets much worse 😢 ... I'm sure someone a while down the road will say that to me. 😢🙏🙏🙏
I agree with Pastor Chuck
Blessed blessed 👍👍
41:50 Chuck, seemingly without fail, clarifies tricky passages like no other.
Chuck has got this badly wrong. See Dr Ken Gentry ' 2 Thess 2 and also The Bible Answer Man Hank Hanegraaff " 2 Thess 2"
There is no Rapture not in the KJV Bible and God condemns it in Ezekiel 13 verses 18 through 21 in the KJV Bible
Folks, we need to fast and ask God for his Armor and also for THE GIFTS OF HEALINGS🙏
Hallo from Germany. Are you a Brother from Chuck Missler?
I like the Calvary Chapel churches because they are biblically oriented. But I think there is a doctrine of pre-tribulation rapture. I'm quite sure 2 Thes 2 dispells this theory. it is a stumbling block not only for a Pre-Trib rapture postion but also other positions like Daniel 9:24-27 took place in 70 AD, or most of Revelation does not apply to us because we will be raptured for lack of a better word. But the stumbling block for many theories is not clear unless the entire chapter is read and is read in terms of what the subject of the chapter speaks about.
The rapture cannot be imminent since Paul made it clear that before our gathering together unto him (the rapture) there apostasy must occur and the man of lawlessness be revealed. So how can it be imminent?
This is the POPE no question
2 Thessalonians 2 (KJV) falling away first, = that"s sacrifice and oblation to cease, the one who exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshipped, so he as God sits in the temple of God ( is Pharisees they sit in Moses seat Matthew 23:1-2=Exoudes 7:1-2)== they will sit there till the 40 years end ( EZEKIEL 4 ) =GOD will remove him ( Pharisees) v8 LORD shall consume with the spirit of his mouth and the brightness of his coming. ( in 70 AD ) ------ MAY GOD BLESS YOU AND KEEP YOU
it isn't a bad translation in the KJV. It is the correct translation. The Day of the Lord starts at the tribulation. Paul is saying the Day of the Lord HASN'T started and the Day of the Lord will not start until the man of sin is revealed, after the rapture. The KJV is correct. Looking forward to meeting Chuck in heaven one day. A genuine man of God
This must be around 1985 when the Jesus Seminar was organized?
Finally! Thanks. @ 08:25
@34:46 reads and yet overlooks it telling him that is when the bride IS THERE
th-cam.com/video/dHRdJnjDUyw/w-d-xo.html
The departure is the church fallen away in deception
Falling away :apostasia" The apostasy began in Pauls day with the judaisers. Only got worse from there, The man of sin "anthropos" translated men many times, "Son" translated sons many times. Sons of destruction stand in pulpits in every tithe taking false teaching church world wide every sunday. The apostasy is on steroids' today.
@@dsheppard8492Not to mention all the “Unity Agreements” almost all Protestant Denominations and independent Evangelical churches have signed with the AC in Rome (Mystery Babylon). And the surge of Lordship Salvation Calvinism among Protestants, is nothing more than a renamed RCC’s works salvation (which is NO salvation).
@@SSNBN777 Well said. Perhaps you could benefit from a good book on this,,,, on Amazon,,, THE BOOK OF THE REVELATION. THE OVERCOMER, AND THE APOSTASY.
Anti christ will be revealed at the abomination of desolation. Before that it's not going to be clear that he is the beast.
The Bible is the only voice***
Apostasy does NOT mean depart.
Yes it does.
@@jayjay-bz3rr Well, first off it is a noun not a verb - the apostasia. It could mean the departure but more likely it is the rebellion against God's people.
No he didn’t. He wrote about where are the dead not no rapture theory that was started in 1836.
You present a Strawman argument.
Here is 2 Thes 2:1-12 (which is really the meat of what the subject is in the first sentence):
The Great Apostasy
1 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness. NKJV
Interesting that whoever came up with the heading for this passage is not "The Coming of our Lord" or "The Day of Christ" or "The Rapture." The chapter heading is wrong, and I don't really care that much, just an observation. That is not the subject of this chapter or passage through verse 12.
The subject concerns the coming of Jesus and our gathering together to Him.
What did Paul tell the Thessalonians the first time? 1 Thes 4:13-18.
As far as the rapture, our gathering together to Him is the rapture.
Paul tells us that this time will not come UNTIL the two events he speaks of takes place.
Also, and this is very important, Paul tells us that this is the Anti-Christ (in so many words) from verse 6 on. Tie in this chapter to Daniel 9:27, Matthew 24:15, Mark 13:14, Luke 21:20 and 1 Thes 4:13.
1 Thes 4:13-18
The Comfort of Christ’s Coming
13 But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.
15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words. NKJV
1 Thes 4:17 is the rapture as the term is used, harpazo in the Greek.
2 Thes 2:1 is the rapture, "our gathering together with him," episynagōgḗ in the Greek which means gathering together.
This is what Paul told the gentiles in his first visit. Although this isn't exhaustive obviously of what he said. If you put together this and 2 Thes 2, we have a clearer understanding.
It's important if you want to be prepared for what may be coming very soon and not be very deceived, not to put your faith in them, to not be deceived by doctrines or teachings or what have you. This chapter 2 Thes 2, is a stumbling block to incorrect doctrines and interpretations and theories. Be sober and mature in the Word of God. Do not be deceived.
yep, I was a pre-tribber ( meaning not being here for the anti-christ/beast) for 38 plus years, 2 thes 2 says something different we will be here for the revealing of the beast
Absolutely correct! Thank you. A topic sentence (in this case, the Rapture) tells you what the passage is about. Paul does not veer from that subject, the Rapture, immediately to the Day of the Lord. Rather, he is stating when the Rapture is relative to the apostasy and the Abomination of Desolation (revelation of Antichrist). So many Bible versions use Day of the Lord instead of Day of Christ because they are based on the Nestle-Aland Greek manuscripts, not Textus Receptus. Day of Christ is positive, whereas Day of the Lord is negative. Paul is speaking about the Day of Christ--the Rapture. This is the only passage that actually gives you the order of these events...apostasy, revelation of AC, Rapture. The 7 years are not all the wrath of God, only the Day of the Lord is, which starts after the midpoint, not at the beginning of the 7 years. Note: It was not the Day of the Lord that the Thessalonians were asking about, it was that they thought they had missed the Rapture (Day of Christ).
Man your off base
Please Explain
So wrong finish the verse the gathering won’t happen till the man of sin is revealed . Stop false teaching
th-cam.com/users/shortsuG1Q22TFZsI?si=8J20gSz58LfTSTFE
He is wrong! There is no departure of the church in that verse. This is where man adds and changes the word to fit their narrative. Instead of reading it the way God intended it to be read. Falling away in Greek is apostasy it is to fall away from the truth. To depart from it. Plain and simple! Don’t go adding church to the end of it bc church is not in the definition. There is no rapture before the tribulation and Christ didn’t teach it nor did the prophets. We do NOT gather back with Christ until all things are fulfilled!
Matthew 24:34
“Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.”
Luke 24:44
“And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.”
He said wait upon Him!!! He doesn’t return until after the tribulation. And the tribulation is NOT 7 or 3 1/2 years, it’s a 5 month period which is in Rev 9. God shortened the time (tribulation) for the elects sake or no flesh would be saved. Why?? Bc that’s how good Satan is going to be claiming he is God. Brothers and sisters, I encourage you you ask our Father for wisdom and knowledge of His word. Do not trust man’s teachings. All wisdom comes from our Father. Our Father said to wait upon Him. DO NOT fall for the first Christ that appears! It is not Christ but the Antichrist.
Psalms 37:34
“Wait on the LORD, and keep his way, and he shall exalt thee to inherit the land: when the wicked are cut off, thou shalt see it.”
You can’t see it if your raptured! So we know, we’re going to see it. If you are taken first, you are taken spiritual by Satan bc that’s the whole purpose of him coming is to deceive Fathers children. You better be mentally and physically prepared for what’s coming. Satans not coming to physically kill anyone, he’s coming to try an destroy your soul. He wants you to worship him. Bc he wants to be God. Please go read Fathers word! It’s very important to put that gospel armour on in these end times. We are still in our flesh bodies when the Antichrist comes. As soon as Christ returns we are all changed into our spiritual bodies. That’s how you know the fake from the true Messiah.
1 John 3:2
“Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.”
Psalms 37:9
“For evildoers shall be cut off: but those that wait upon the LORD, they shall inherit the earth.”
Job 14:14
“If a man die, shall he live again? all the days of my appointed time will I wait, till my change come.”
Psalms 27:14
“Wait on the LORD: be of good courage, and he shall strengthen thine heart: wait, I say, on the LORD.”
Zephaniah 3:8
“Therefore wait ye upon me, saith the LORD, until the day that I rise up to the prey: for my determination is to gather the nations, that I may assemble the kingdoms, to pour upon them mine indignation, even all my fierce anger: for all the earth shall be devoured with the fire of my jealousy.”
You have the right idea... please explain the 5 months comment.
The day of the Lord is the Thousand-Year millennium after the seventh Trump in 1st Corinthians 15:52
2nd Peter 3 verse 8-9 say that the day of the Lord is a thousand years and a thousand years is one day.
Rapture is not in the KJV Bible nor any Bible and God condemns the word rapture in flying away in Ezekiel 13 verses 18 through 21 if you look up the word are in 1st Thessalonians 4 verse 16 and 17 it means Breath of Life or spiritual body it's not atmosphere you have to look up the original meaning of the words in the Strong's concordance for the Hebrew and Greek God bless
False teacher! 😮😢
Why? State your case - please