Im camped in the belief that the egyptians found the pyramids already built (by a previous cycle of human advancement) and then lived there thousands of years working stone trying to mimic the work they found.
Same here, a total different society (The 'GODS') who then left-died-escaped-moved on taking their technology ... leaving only their throw away local stone foundations open for the indigenous tribes to move in & emulate those that departed.
Well, they didn't find pyramids from ancient civilizations, they themselves constructed the pyramids with thousands of labourers. It's stone masonry, something that happens today, really not that difficult.
at the beginning of the video is the inside bottom of a broken vase. The key to understanding how the bottom was made is if the tool mark is a spiral. If it is a spiral, the inner bottom is machined on a lathe where the movement of the tool is moved by a screw.
There's hundreds of manufacturing facilities in China that can manufacture vases to any specification for funery or architectural industries. European equipment manufacturers have been in China since the 1980s, and China has replicated their equipment used in their manufacturing. China and India had a huge effect on stone manufacturing in North America, which majorly shifted to offshore supply.
Hi! Sorry if I misunderstood, are you sure there is a spiral pattern and not just concentric circles? Did you check if the step is constant across the radius?
The profile of these artifact "The Shape" transitions from flat interior bottom,... to a round,... to an ellipse,.... as you move from the bottom to top as you measure up along the profile,... IF the centers of these geometric profile are parallel with The Datum Table as the profile is rotated 360 Degrees to make the vase then this is definitely a CNC Machine Part,... even if you could convince me that these artifacts were made by hand and made by the hundreds if not by the thousands,... it would mean that these manufacturing techniques would need to have been standardized person to person, location to location across time, in the strictest since,.... in modern manufacturing we call the Y14.5 standard,.... this last point is never discussed.
You shape the outside then bore a hole with a similar technique we see elsewhere in Egypt then its about time and abrasives to do the fine shaping and polishing.
my thoughts are if they did in predynastic Egypt it would be likely that we wouldn't have evidence due to erosion and rusting. i know they have found iron deposits in and around site close and to pyramids. they knew how to work with stone like it was butter they had and knew how to work with bronze and copper even if iron was rare. they really would have been able to forge iron with stone anvils. it would be difficult but its not to out of reach in my opinion. if you put things like quarts or diamond in the metal while cooling you could make saws and tools that would be strong and abrasive enough to explain a lot of the stonework. also i for sure think they new about the wheel in predynastic Egypt. they knew how to use water to their advantage, so i mean a wheel spinning in a stream connected to a round bonze, copper (i think iron too) saw/disc with abrasive properties like Quartz, anorthite or forsterite imbedded in to it could easily cut stone with out much effort. this is what i think personally there is evidence showing that they had most of these materials, they have evidence showing they worked stone like it was the easiest tasks. why sell them short because it seem too hard or they are to primitive. We haven’t found all the tool but we have the signatures of work the tools created. Hopefully some one reads this and gives me a shout out if they become a genius 😂
It is the vase interiors that are not possible to that precision that is unknown manufacturing nobody has stimulated that. And the material has variable density abrasion and hardness. So the vibration and destruction effect on the material.
Why suggest "lost technology"..."aliens" or some esoteric softening chemical when none of those are needed... Let me ask a question, have you turned stone on a lathe before of any type...modern, traditional, or otherwise? This is nothing more than stone craft for its period…nothing strange…just dedication to craft…and still practiced today but with modern tools…
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@@JayCWhiteCloud You are very welcome to reproduce it mr expert! Yes we asked modern stone masons and factories to reproduce it, they were not able to so far. They are not able to hallow out the interior and keep the wall thickness with the same consistency. Until its not reproduced even with modern tools, i condsider it lost. I think you just clearly dont understand the metrology and the meaning of the presented data.
Let us not start with condescending or challenges. Shall we? I asked questions, by all means, ask your own, but sarcasm like "Mr expert" is not conducive to open channel communication and exchange at all… I have produced stone bowls, grind mills, and cups, in my younger days in both modern, traditional, and mixed modalities. Many others have as well, so it is not up to me to "prove something" to you as the data is already out there if one is willing to sincerely look for it rather than offer up nonsensical theories based on "I think" notions. You prove to me that "you can't," first and why you can't.... The possibility is you start at the beginning, like most of us within the traditional guild arts, and learn the crafts directly yourself rather than start with “it can’t be done,” yet you have no knowledge and skills even developed at the basic level to suggest that. After gaining these basic skills, then one can formulate a hypothesis with details of how certain things may have been achieved. That is what the entire field of experimental archeology is all about. We know all of the ancient craft in architecture and utensils was done because we have the artifacts to look at and examine. We also still have artisans working in those modalties. What we don't know is the means within the material application in detail of style for how they may have been done comparatively to other methods known to exist in antiquity. There are a lot of wonderful things to learn, but starting from “lost technology,” or other nonsensical theories like “softening stone” is not productive, pragmatic, or logical… Your comment, “... They are not able to hallow out the interior and keep the wall thickness with the same consistency…” Is a statement based on your assumption…not from you trying to learn stone turning and the methods for doing so. That is not proof of any kind other than you don’t have the skills or knowledge…or at least not yet. And yes, they are produced with “modern tools,” stating otherwise is not true. TH-cam has several examples of turned thin-walled alabaster as just one example of many… All one has to do is search "turned stone on lathe" and several examples pop right up... As for “not understanding” perhaps vet someone’s credentials first as I have been working within the traditional arts (et al) for over 40 years, so I’m not speaking from an “I think” ultracrepidarian perspective but from valid skills developed over decades and applied applications in several mediums including understanding geology to a level of being a stone carver, working within traditional quarrying methods and demonstrating skills as a Historical Interpreter and Park Naturalist/Ecologist… If you have actually "asked" and did not get a positive reply then perhaps you should keep asking, as they are out there. The traditional systems are the same just much, much slower. We also don’t have as common these days the “water and wind” mills as we once did, and animal-powered mills are less common in “first world” areas to employ for testing unless you have the skills to design these devices (some of us do) or work with those that still use “animal line shaft” shops (which also still exist among the Old Order Amish..again, that some of us still work with.) Or you could google ..."muscle mills"..."animal powered mill"...etc. I would also suggest learning how to build a traditional lathe as this will be needed to turn stone. The larger the stone, the larger and more robust a lathe you will require, which in turn means developing skills in green woodworking and timber frame as well as basic Smithing as well...or assistance from those with those skills... You're not ever going to get a modern stone fabrication company to produce them using traditional modalties...there is no money in it! If that is your "they can't do it," then at least be honest about the reason as it is not a "they can't...but rather..." they won't." There are even people on TH-cam demonstrating these methods in the most basic forms for both moving mass stone objects and to fabrication of utensils and tools. All one has to do is look for them…
@Karoly Poka th-cam.com/video/O_4SaxVP44g/w-d-xo.html 36:54 shows an average modern granite vase with the exact same roundness accuracy as the scanned vases 36:54 shows a granite vase hollowed out on a modern lathe If modern lathes give the same accuracy in granite and can hollow-out vases, where exactly is the technical problem in making that vase? Seems you're so far gone into the lost-technology hole, that you simply deny reality rather than change your false beliefs.
Everyone says "they must have used a lathe as there is no other way to make this that accurate" Who is to say they didnt use a lathe? Why would they need electric power for a motor when they had one of the best power sources of all.... Water.... There were rivers. Who is to say they didnt harness the power of a water wheel to power a lathe,drill,saw, as a lifting device ?.I haven't seen a single channel address this obvious technology that is very possible
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Who said electric power? “Power tool” is a generic term and it doesn’t have to rely on electricity exclusively
Any bets that the Egyptian Government has some of the remains of those tools. For them to admit that their culture was not responsible for all these buildings and artifacts would be impossible for them. Look at their head archeologist who controls what people can look at. There was a reason that the older artifacts are more precision.
The machines and associated infrastructure likely does still exist somewhere on the planet, perhaps not much, likely only bits of it but there's gotta be some left somewhere. More than likely under water somewhere and very, very deep..
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The probability of this is high in my opinion since we only excavated a very few percent of our planet
I know no one likes 'Atlantis' as they feel it makes them sound like a quack but if we call it 'advanced civilization' instead it achieves the same thing really. Archaeology seems to have no issue with freely admitting that there are settlements and cities all over the world, literally all over the world, underwater, yet to suggest there's an Atlantis or advanced civilization or indeed civilizationS that we don't know about is fantasy? Like really?
Interestingly my comment has just been deleted and I'd assume it wasn't by the host as it was basically an expansive agreement. The joys of big brother youtube.
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@@CoffeeFiend1 which comment? I dont delete comments. Feel free to recomment, but please leave my mother alone 🤣
Hi. Why always vases? Could they be some kind of resonator, bell ? Had anyone investigated their vibrational qualities? Otherwise why the exactitude? Or....
Good point. The fact the bottoms are not flat. The luggs that are on a great number of these vases would point to the fact they may have been hung instead of supporting its self by the bottom.
cool clip. Been into this subject for years. Got experience in stonework as well. I think we are way off on the cutting and manufacturing of it all. At aswan it's clear cut that some kind of boring tech was present. Boring tech like a sand blaster or waterjet aka pressure cutter. It was this same boring tech that was implemented in the Serapeum. All these balloons measuring corners on the boxes and thinking they weren't machined because they're not perfect 90s missed the secret that sits in plain sight. Many of the unpolished boxes are sitting there wholly complete, without a single trace of chisel or saw cut on them. Saw manual or mechanized leaves smooth surface, chisel leaves grooves. Those boxes are super rough granite, yet finished and precise. The same boring tech was used to shape them, as at aswan. That tech is a jet cutter no doubt it my mind, with a variable setting. Wide like 1.5 feet or all the way to needle point. I have a feeling alot of these artifacts were cut with this tech. All their basalt was cut with it, all granite. When the setting is needle point, it leaves grooves like a circular saw. I don't think it was a sand blaster, or a jet cutter, but something that works like that, a high-pressure energy stream. And this energy stream could be curved, like you shoot out water out of a hose in a straight line, but this jet could be shot out as a hook. Terrifying tech was working aswan. Dual use purpose no doubt, boring tech and a weapons platform.
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They would need insaine amount of pressure for a jet cutter. Do you have an idea how would they have produced that high pressure?
we re talking about unknown break away tech. Cant look at it thru our machining methods. Could be an entirely different branch of physics. Not necessarily a jetcutter but an energy based stream cutter. They arrived to aswan and put 11 meter holes into granite first , reached the desired granite composition then blitzed 5 thousand tons of granite before they even got to the top side of the obelisk. Theres a whole mountain missing at the quarry. Whatever it was, it was powderizing the granite and wasn't exactly precise on the wide setting of the instrument, hence the test pit holes looking like worms that weave back and forth as they go deeper. The top of test pits is dead sharp, as you would see with pressure cutter then they weave as you go deeper as pressure is dispersed.
If I had a lathe on hand I would try turning granite with a Tangentail cutter that is diamond impregnated, I also wonder how hard is the material in an asteroid like the dagger that King Tut had.
Most likely , the tools employed , if not all plundered, will be excavated close to the stones bearing their witness, and situated amongst settlements stiill buried along the Nile’s ancient course.
Great assessments, excellent questions. Had his headsets and bottom brackets for decades on every bike i've owned. So nice to see him talking machining and manufacturing.
This is amazing! There was a post iron age culture that predated the dynastic Egyptians. When I tell this fact to "scientists" and academics they say... so you think it was aliens? To which I respond... wtf? That's not at all what I said. We have created a generation of childish priests that worship scientism and don't have the first clue about basic: 1. laws of physics and chemistry 2. measurement 3. Engineering and materials science, 4. Manufacturing, tools or modern technology. This is very dangerous. These findings are a huge warning... we've forgotten once before we can forget again...we seem to be rapidly moving towards this outcome. Ignorance and arrogance are indistinguishable on a long enough timescale.
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Can you elaborate on that post iron age culture please? Sounds very interesting. What do you know about it?
To cut the granite vases, you need materials with more stiffness and hardness than you can make using stone wood and bronze. That's bronze age technology, the technology level of the dynastic Egyptians, Greeks, etc. You don't do lathe work on granite without a different technology foundation for your industry (steel, composites ceramics etc for example). You can't do this with iron age tech. You need more than the soft brittle output of a bloom furnace to make the fixtures tool holders posts etc. Regardless of the methods used (steel, chemicals, corundum, diamond etc) you have multiple lines of evidence demonstrating knowledge beyond that of the pre-industrial age nations like Britain France and the US colonies. This is a very big deal. As a species we regressed from post medieval pre Enlightenment mastery of measurement manufacturing technology materials etc to barely above stone age (aka early bronze age) which took over 4000 years to recover from. During the medieval warm period, we built cathedrals that took hundreds of years with supposedly "superior" iron age technology and a larger economic surplus and a larger economy that the dynastic Egyptians. This should terrify everyone who fancies themselves "educated" and uses things like computers everyday but doesn't have the first clue how they really work at the level of the electrons interacting with the semiclassical semiconductor materials let alone a vague sense of how the machine that make the components for the machines that make those chips actually function. During the pandemic the global "superpower" that invented the advanced materials used to manufacture N95 masks ~40 years ago couldn't figure out how to manufacture them domestically with effectively infinite resources... the knowledge of all the little things necessary to do that comparatively simple task no longer exists in the United States or really any Western country for that matter. Practical knowledge is gone institutional memory gone.
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@@robmorgan1214 Interesting text! I think this knowledge was also privileged thousands of years ago. I don’t think everyday people had the knowledge of creating these vases; only the initiated ones did. By initiation, I mean higher education, such as learning how to use and interpret hieroglyphs, use the tools etc. What you are describing is good, in my opinion, but a little bit too dystopian. Thanks for sharing it, though!
My point speaking as an experimental physicist who does know this stuff, is that most of my colleagues fall into the above priestly cast of scientism...they don't know this stuff. Let the sink in. If anyone in the academy still does, they live in China or Korea and are probably 60 years old and responsible for keeping the plates spinning and the lights on in the west.
You should get in contact with Matt Beall, he is also an owner of the vases and hosts his own Podcast called Limitless, he would b a good guest to talk to as well. He owns quite a few of these vases and has worked closely with Ben and his colleagues.
In my mind, I see a tool that is spinning into the inside of the vase. It is a cutting tool that is spinning into the rock, and the cutting tools expands as it enter the initial cut. Keeps expanding to a precise point to get the precise thickness of the walls. Would be a very sophisticated cutting machine, industrial. It would have to be to cut stone of that hardness like granite.
It would once you have the center cut out, then the machine can also hang onto it tightly to turn it on their lathe. Again, a very sophisticated, hydraulic CNC type machine.
See the Matt Beall videos about this. As I demonstrated there - the vases are made to specific units of Egyptian fingers. So definitely not hand made, they have to be machine made. R
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I think first we have to define what is machine and what is hand made. These definitions are not well defined in this topic. I will check out your conversation, thanks for recommending!
This is the best assessment of how these things could have been manufactured I've seen. Chris makes some great points. Interesting to hear about some of the features on top of the lug handles showing signs of hand work, that is the first I've heard of this. What a truly fascinating topic, no matter what the method of manufacture, I think we can all agree that these really are exquisitely crafted objects
never discount the fact that these could've been altered later in antiquity, especially the handles because they would be the easiest portion of the vase to augment.
seems like the vase was machined on a lathe with the ability to machine the inside and out at the same time. The lathe held on to the mouth of the lathe. The tooling came in from one side of the fixture and another tooling was working on the outside.
I think that if you have a cutting tool internally going up against hard stone, you understand the concepts of hardness, material sciences, etc. Youd be using something either electrical(edm), which would essentially negate hardness, or youre using something harder than the stone or at least the same hardness of the stone to cut it. Lets say you have a brass tool holder holding this harder material, it gets put up to the stone, it would most likely deform and you would see that in the cut, if you used wood it would most likely also deform or deflect. Could you use such materials on a holder in such a tight space? That could be tested. for example if you 3d print a tool holder, it could hold a tool but what sort of cut would it produce? Most likely not a precise cut. I would suggest even rudimentary iron or cast iron does not have the right properties for the job. Clearly they have an understanding of data and tolerances also material science, then its just a matter of time.
Imagine the dust would immediately have to be kept out of the machine parts and bearings especially those Rock cut Indian temples and underground churches
95% of 'lost ancient technology' is merely that all stone can be cut because stone cuts itself, and that using giant stone tools to do the cutting creates its own precision due to the stabilization of the large cutting mass. Relating it to modern machine tools is simply incorrect.
Absolutely the best demonstration of ancient technology I have ever seen. Tremendous work you have done here. You are making world shattering history yourselves by sharing the findings of your work. Bravo gentleman, bravo!
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Thanks a million, but we would be nowhere without the other team who scanned the objects and started the project.
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We are just following up their work and trying to extend it
Cymatics , this looks like bagdad battery so did you know sound can be mupltiplied to light also light an be turned into crystals or electrical currents sounds electricity
It’s a dude who made transmittable energy by using a piezo in a vacuums the radio waves are controlled w a Eq Like a Musical eq tunes in to a frequency and produces energy in the vacuums is can plasma by exploding the compounds inside the vacume
Teljesen jó és érthető .A lényeg az ,hogy smart tévén is működik :) Már ha beállítják . 1-2 csatorna van ami a témával foglalkozik és ezt megteszi.( felirat ) Universe Inside You az egyik. Na meg most te !
Tisztelettel megkérhetnélek rá ,hogy engedélyezd a magyar feliratot a videódban ? Okostévén illetve androidos mobilokon nincs magyar felírat csak akkor ,ha azt a feltöltő bekapcsolja ! Köszönöm !
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Próbáld meg most! Igyekeztem beállítani, bár csak az automatikus fordítást, ami azért hagy némi kívánnivalót maga után. Szólj ha esetleg nem működik!
Why doesn't anyone simply put these bowls and tube cores on a turntable. An oblique light to emphasise the surface. Find optimal speed where its obvious that the grooves are spiral or concentric.
When discussing the petrie core and the penetration rate, everyone is amazed at how fast the tool is cutting into the stone. What if the groove isn't a mark caused by penetrative, but a product of debris caught between the surface of the tool and the material. Anyone using a drill in a hard surface knows it's much easier to withdraw a bit when you have reached the desired depth.
these guys should talk to stone masons and they would find many answers
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Thanks for the suggestion! We've actually chatted with a few stone masons, and their insights have been invaluable. It's fascinating how ancient techniques still baffle modern experts. We're always open to learning more, so if you have any stone masons in mind who specialize in predynastic precision hard stone vases, do let us know. In the meantime, we'll keep exploring and sharing these groundbreaking discoveries, whether they're welcomed by mainstream academia or not. Stay curious!
Do you have any idea the number of things that would have to have been invented back then to produce the sounds? They obviously didn't have speakers and equipment that could soften or levitate anything.
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Pure speculation on the way: You can create soundwaves like Tibetan monks do with horns etc. and you can soften chemically. I will have an episode on the stone softening actually soon.
If they softened stone, it was most likely chemically. That would be the one that would fit the timeline reasonably with what we have found they had at the time.
Im camped in the belief that the egyptians found the pyramids already built (by a previous cycle of human advancement) and then lived there thousands of years working stone trying to mimic the work they found.
Egyptians did not make these vases..
Could be. Happened with the Incas, abysmal the difference.
Same here, a total different society (The 'GODS') who then left-died-escaped-moved on taking their technology ... leaving only their throw away local stone foundations open for the indigenous tribes to move in & emulate those that departed.
Well, they didn't find pyramids from ancient civilizations, they themselves constructed the pyramids with thousands of labourers. It's stone masonry, something that happens today, really not that difficult.
at the beginning of the video is the inside bottom of a broken vase. The key to understanding how the bottom was made is if the tool mark is a spiral. If it is a spiral, the inner bottom is machined on a lathe where the movement of the tool is moved by a screw.
You also can use a mirror to look inside that joint
its getting interesting when its concentric
the fact that the tooling marks are glazed is what's really remarkable to me.
There's hundreds of manufacturing facilities in China that can manufacture vases to any specification for funery or architectural industries. European equipment manufacturers have been in China since the 1980s, and China has replicated their equipment used in their manufacturing. China and India had a huge effect on stone manufacturing in North America, which majorly shifted to offshore supply.
Hi! Sorry if I misunderstood, are you sure there is a spiral pattern and not just concentric circles? Did you check if the step is constant across the radius?
The profile of these artifact "The Shape" transitions from flat interior bottom,... to a round,... to an ellipse,.... as you move from the bottom to top as you measure up along the profile,... IF the centers of these geometric profile are parallel with The Datum Table as the profile is rotated 360 Degrees to make the vase then this is definitely a CNC Machine Part,... even if you could convince me that these artifacts were made by hand and made by the hundreds if not by the thousands,... it would mean that these manufacturing techniques would need to have been standardized person to person, location to location across time, in the strictest since,.... in modern manufacturing we call the Y14.5 standard,.... this last point is never discussed.
Maybe the work piece was stationary an the cutting tools rotated..
You can see the tool marks as clear as day
You shape the outside then bore a hole with a similar technique we see elsewhere in Egypt then its about time and abrasives to do the fine shaping and polishing.
Where did they get the electricity for that? :)
my thoughts are if they did in predynastic Egypt it would be likely that we wouldn't have evidence due to erosion and rusting. i know they have found iron deposits in and around site close and to pyramids. they knew how to work with stone like it was butter they had and knew how to work with bronze and copper even if iron was rare. they really would have been able to forge iron with stone anvils. it would be difficult but its not to out of reach in my opinion. if you put things like quarts or diamond in the metal while cooling you could make saws and tools that would be strong and abrasive enough to explain a lot of the stonework. also i for sure think they new about the wheel in predynastic Egypt. they knew how to use water to their advantage, so i mean a wheel spinning in a stream connected to a round bonze, copper (i think iron too) saw/disc with abrasive properties like Quartz, anorthite or forsterite imbedded in to it could easily cut stone with out much effort.
this is what i think personally there is evidence showing that they had most of these materials, they have evidence showing they worked stone like it was the easiest tasks. why sell them short because it seem too hard or they are to primitive. We haven’t found all the tool but we have the signatures of work the tools created.
Hopefully some one reads this and gives me a shout out if they become a genius 😂
It is the vase interiors that are not possible to that precision that is unknown manufacturing nobody has stimulated that. And the material has variable density abrasion and hardness. So the vibration and destruction effect on the material.
Similar to a human finger and the actual tool was much harder than diamonds on this planet
No the tool just did the cutting and the object is turned IMO
31:07 - He seemed uncomfortable there
@@onlyonewhyphy the beer kicked of his histamine level probably. I was trying to edit out the sneezings, so that is why he seems like uncomfortable
So the ancients have to discover the G97 😅 absolutely cool!!
WWG1WGA 🇺🇸 MACHINIST FOR TRUMP🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
There was no softening/chemical proccess. They just had the same tools as we have today.
Why not?
Why suggest "lost technology"..."aliens" or some esoteric softening chemical when none of those are needed...
Let me ask a question, have you turned stone on a lathe before of any type...modern, traditional, or otherwise?
This is nothing more than stone craft for its period…nothing strange…just dedication to craft…and still practiced today but with modern tools…
@@JayCWhiteCloud You are very welcome to reproduce it mr expert! Yes we asked modern stone masons and factories to reproduce it, they were not able to so far. They are not able to hallow out the interior and keep the wall thickness with the same consistency. Until its not reproduced even with modern tools, i condsider it lost. I think you just clearly dont understand the metrology and the meaning of the presented data.
Let us not start with condescending or challenges. Shall we? I asked questions, by all means, ask your own, but sarcasm like "Mr expert" is not conducive to open channel communication and exchange at all…
I have produced stone bowls, grind mills, and cups, in my younger days in both modern, traditional, and mixed modalities. Many others have as well, so it is not up to me to "prove something" to you as the data is already out there if one is willing to sincerely look for it rather than offer up nonsensical theories based on "I think" notions. You prove to me that "you can't," first and why you can't....
The possibility is you start at the beginning, like most of us within the traditional guild arts, and learn the crafts directly yourself rather than start with “it can’t be done,” yet you have no knowledge and skills even developed at the basic level to suggest that. After gaining these basic skills, then one can formulate a hypothesis with details of how certain things may have been achieved. That is what the entire field of experimental archeology is all about. We know all of the ancient craft in architecture and utensils was done because we have the artifacts to look at and examine. We also still have artisans working in those modalties. What we don't know is the means within the material application in detail of style for how they may have been done comparatively to other methods known to exist in antiquity. There are a lot of wonderful things to learn, but starting from “lost technology,” or other nonsensical theories like “softening stone” is not productive, pragmatic, or logical…
Your comment, “... They are not able to hallow out the interior and keep the wall thickness with the same consistency…”
Is a statement based on your assumption…not from you trying to learn stone turning and the methods for doing so. That is not proof of any kind other than you don’t have the skills or knowledge…or at least not yet. And yes, they are produced with “modern tools,” stating otherwise is not true. TH-cam has several examples of turned thin-walled alabaster as just one example of many… All one has to do is search "turned stone on lathe" and several examples pop right up...
As for “not understanding” perhaps vet someone’s credentials first as I have been working within the traditional arts (et al) for over 40 years, so I’m not speaking from an “I think” ultracrepidarian perspective but from valid skills developed over decades and applied applications in several mediums including understanding geology to a level of being a stone carver, working within traditional quarrying methods and demonstrating skills as a Historical Interpreter and Park Naturalist/Ecologist…
If you have actually "asked" and did not get a positive reply then perhaps you should keep asking, as they are out there.
The traditional systems are the same just much, much slower. We also don’t have as common these days the “water and wind” mills as we once did, and animal-powered mills are less common in “first world” areas to employ for testing unless you have the skills to design these devices (some of us do) or work with those that still use “animal line shaft” shops (which also still exist among the Old Order Amish..again, that some of us still work with.) Or you could google ..."muscle mills"..."animal powered mill"...etc. I would also suggest learning how to build a traditional lathe as this will be needed to turn stone. The larger the stone, the larger and more robust a lathe you will require, which in turn means developing skills in green woodworking and timber frame as well as basic Smithing as well...or assistance from those with those skills...
You're not ever going to get a modern stone fabrication company to produce them using traditional modalties...there is no money in it! If that is your "they can't do it," then at least be honest about the reason as it is not a "they can't...but rather..." they won't." There are even people on TH-cam demonstrating these methods in the most basic forms for both moving mass stone objects and to fabrication of utensils and tools. All one has to do is look for them…
@Karoly Poka th-cam.com/video/O_4SaxVP44g/w-d-xo.html
36:54 shows an average modern granite vase with the exact same roundness accuracy as the scanned vases
36:54 shows a granite vase hollowed out on a modern lathe
If modern lathes give the same accuracy in granite and can hollow-out vases, where exactly is the technical problem in making that vase? Seems you're so far gone into the lost-technology hole, that you simply deny reality rather than change your false beliefs.
Great series, too much rambling.
Everyone says "they must have used a lathe as there is no other way to make this that accurate"
Who is to say they didnt use a lathe? Why would they need electric power for a motor when they had one of the best power sources of all.... Water....
There were rivers. Who is to say they didnt harness the power of a water wheel to power a lathe,drill,saw, as a lifting device ?.I haven't seen a single channel address this obvious technology that is very possible
Who said electric power? “Power tool” is a generic term and it doesn’t have to rely on electricity exclusively
land of chem does
I forget who it was, but he made the claim of a motor running off of electrical power... Not the only one either.
Any bets that the Egyptian Government has some of the remains of those tools. For them to admit that their culture was not responsible for all these buildings and artifacts would be impossible for them. Look at their head archeologist who controls what people can look at. There was a reason that the older artifacts are more precision.
Zahi hawass wants it to remain a mystery unless he's credited for its discovery
The machines and associated infrastructure likely does still exist somewhere on the planet, perhaps not much, likely only bits of it but there's gotta be some left somewhere. More than likely under water somewhere and very, very deep..
The probability of this is high in my opinion since we only excavated a very few percent of our planet
I know no one likes 'Atlantis' as they feel it makes them sound like a quack but if we call it 'advanced civilization' instead it achieves the same thing really. Archaeology seems to have no issue with freely admitting that there are settlements and cities all over the world, literally all over the world, underwater, yet to suggest there's an Atlantis or advanced civilization or indeed civilizationS that we don't know about is fantasy? Like really?
you're the anti-Dibble
Interestingly my comment has just been deleted and I'd assume it wasn't by the host as it was basically an expansive agreement. The joys of big brother youtube.
@@CoffeeFiend1 which comment? I dont delete comments. Feel free to recomment, but please leave my mother alone 🤣
Hi. Why always vases? Could they be some kind of resonator, bell ? Had anyone investigated their vibrational qualities? Otherwise why the exactitude? Or....
They could be, but i had to name it somehow
Good point. The fact the bottoms are not flat. The luggs that are on a great number of these vases would point to the fact they may have been hung instead of supporting its self by the bottom.
cool clip. Been into this subject for years. Got experience in stonework as well. I think we are way off on the cutting and manufacturing of it all. At aswan it's clear cut that some kind of boring tech was present. Boring tech like a sand blaster or waterjet aka pressure cutter. It was this same boring tech that was implemented in the Serapeum. All these balloons measuring corners on the boxes and thinking they weren't machined because they're not perfect 90s missed the secret that sits in plain sight. Many of the unpolished boxes are sitting there wholly complete, without a single trace of chisel or saw cut on them. Saw manual or mechanized leaves smooth surface, chisel leaves grooves. Those boxes are super rough granite, yet finished and precise. The same boring tech was used to shape them, as at aswan. That tech is a jet cutter no doubt it my mind, with a variable setting. Wide like 1.5 feet or all the way to needle point. I have a feeling alot of these artifacts were cut with this tech. All their basalt was cut with it, all granite. When the setting is needle point, it leaves grooves like a circular saw. I don't think it was a sand blaster, or a jet cutter, but something that works like that, a high-pressure energy stream. And this energy stream could be curved, like you shoot out water out of a hose in a straight line, but this jet could be shot out as a hook. Terrifying tech was working aswan. Dual use purpose no doubt, boring tech and a weapons platform.
They would need insaine amount of pressure for a jet cutter. Do you have an idea how would they have produced that high pressure?
we re talking about unknown break away tech. Cant look at it thru our machining methods. Could be an entirely different branch of physics. Not necessarily a jetcutter but an energy based stream cutter. They arrived to aswan and put 11 meter holes into granite first , reached the desired granite composition then blitzed 5 thousand tons of granite before they even got to the top side of the obelisk. Theres a whole mountain missing at the quarry. Whatever it was, it was powderizing the granite and wasn't exactly precise on the wide setting of the instrument, hence the test pit holes looking like worms that weave back and forth as they go deeper. The top of test pits is dead sharp, as you would see with pressure cutter then they weave as you go deeper as pressure is dispersed.
The logical way: th-cam.com/video/umhfvtjyCps/w-d-xo.html
If I had a lathe on hand I would try turning granite with a Tangentail cutter that is diamond impregnated, I also wonder how hard is the material in an asteroid like the dagger that King Tut had.
Why don’t scientist ever Invite musicians !!
The obvious question that no one seems to be asking is "Where did he get that shirt?", and I don't mean the Dickies plaid :-)
Thanks a million! I love shirts! Actually its from Egypt obviously 😅
Most likely , the tools employed , if not all plundered, will be excavated close to the stones bearing their witness, and situated amongst settlements stiill buried along the Nile’s ancient course.
Great assessments, excellent questions.
Had his headsets and bottom brackets for decades on every bike i've owned.
So nice to see him talking machining and manufacturing.
This is cool!
Those lugs baffle me no end!
This is amazing! There was a post iron age culture that predated the dynastic Egyptians. When I tell this fact to "scientists" and academics they say... so you think it was aliens? To which I respond... wtf? That's not at all what I said. We have created a generation of childish priests that worship scientism and don't have the first clue about basic: 1. laws of physics and chemistry 2. measurement 3. Engineering and materials science, 4. Manufacturing, tools or modern technology. This is very dangerous. These findings are a huge warning... we've forgotten once before we can forget again...we seem to be rapidly moving towards this outcome. Ignorance and arrogance are indistinguishable on a long enough timescale.
Can you elaborate on that post iron age culture please? Sounds very interesting. What do you know about it?
To cut the granite vases, you need materials with more stiffness and hardness than you can make using stone wood and bronze. That's bronze age technology, the technology level of the dynastic Egyptians, Greeks, etc. You don't do lathe work on granite without a different technology foundation for your industry (steel, composites ceramics etc for example). You can't do this with iron age tech. You need more than the soft brittle output of a bloom furnace to make the fixtures tool holders posts etc. Regardless of the methods used (steel, chemicals, corundum, diamond etc) you have multiple lines of evidence demonstrating knowledge beyond that of the pre-industrial age nations like Britain France and the US colonies. This is a very big deal. As a species we regressed from post medieval pre Enlightenment mastery of measurement manufacturing technology materials etc to barely above stone age (aka early bronze age) which took over 4000 years to recover from. During the medieval warm period, we built cathedrals that took hundreds of years with supposedly "superior" iron age technology and a larger economic surplus and a larger economy that the dynastic Egyptians. This should terrify everyone who fancies themselves "educated" and uses things like computers everyday but doesn't have the first clue how they really work at the level of the electrons interacting with the semiclassical semiconductor materials let alone a vague sense of how the machine that make the components for the machines that make those chips actually function. During the pandemic the global "superpower" that invented the advanced materials used to manufacture N95 masks ~40 years ago couldn't figure out how to manufacture them domestically with effectively infinite resources... the knowledge of all the little things necessary to do that comparatively simple task no longer exists in the United States or really any Western country for that matter. Practical knowledge is gone institutional memory gone.
@@robmorgan1214 Interesting text! I think this knowledge was also privileged thousands of years ago. I don’t think everyday people had the knowledge of creating these vases; only the initiated ones did. By initiation, I mean higher education, such as learning how to use and interpret hieroglyphs, use the tools etc. What you are describing is good, in my opinion, but a little bit too dystopian. Thanks for sharing it, though!
My point speaking as an experimental physicist who does know this stuff, is that most of my colleagues fall into the above priestly cast of scientism...they don't know this stuff. Let the sink in. If anyone in the academy still does, they live in China or Korea and are probably 60 years old and responsible for keeping the plates spinning and the lights on in the west.
You should get in contact with Matt Beall, he is also an owner of the vases and hosts his own Podcast called Limitless, he would b a good guest to talk to as well. He owns quite a few of these vases and has worked closely with Ben and his colleagues.
seconding this!!
Yes, I agree! That would be supercool! I hope I can get him on the show in the near future.
In my mind, I see a tool that is spinning into the inside of the vase. It is a cutting tool that is spinning into the rock, and the cutting tools expands as it enter the initial cut. Keeps expanding to a precise point to get the precise thickness of the walls. Would be a very sophisticated cutting machine, industrial. It would have to be to cut stone of that hardness like granite.
Are you thinking the tool would be similar to a cylinder hone jig which has springs to keep the stones against the side of the piston cylinder wall?
Yes, but on a tear drop CNC type tool that drills into the uncut vase, then it expands with hydraulic force to cut the vase pattern.
It would once you have the center cut out, then the machine can also hang onto it tightly to turn it on their lathe. Again, a very sophisticated, hydraulic CNC type machine.
Or the machine cuts the inside and outside at the same time….
Come on, gentlemen! These guys only had copper chisels and pounding stones. 😂😂
See the Matt Beall videos about this.
As I demonstrated there - the vases are made to specific units of Egyptian fingers.
So definitely not hand made, they have to be machine made.
R
I think first we have to define what is machine and what is hand made. These definitions are not well defined in this topic. I will check out your conversation, thanks for recommending!
How to do it... th-cam.com/video/umhfvtjyCps/w-d-xo.html
love your channel buddy just subscribed. I think these vases were used to store chemicals. How they are made is a big question.
This is the best assessment of how these things could have been manufactured I've seen. Chris makes some great points. Interesting to hear about some of the features on top of the lug handles showing signs of hand work, that is the first I've heard of this. What a truly fascinating topic, no matter what the method of manufacture, I think we can all agree that these really are exquisitely crafted objects
Thank you! 🙏
never discount the fact that these could've been altered later in antiquity, especially the handles because they would be the easiest portion of the vase to augment.
@@AustinKoleCarlislewhat??
@@josteincarlsen2905 the vase handles are the easiest and most likely portion of the vases to be augmented.
seems like the vase was machined on a lathe with the ability to machine the inside and out at the same time. The lathe held on to the mouth of the lathe. The tooling came in from one side of the fixture and another tooling was working on the outside.
On yourube : STONE SOFTENING , Precision cutting, transportation of MEGALITHS. Ancient technomagick , VERSADOCO
Good podcast. What is the electrical method you mentioned after 40 mins?
th-cam.com/video/y5UdkQlxyQY/w-d-xo.htmlsi=Z_5KNVRQHsoGGHdj
The High Level Constructions in Egyptis Far more Developed
than 'advanced technology'.
'Technologies', is Illiteracy
I think that if you have a cutting tool internally going up against hard stone, you understand the concepts of hardness, material sciences, etc. Youd be using something either electrical(edm), which would essentially negate hardness, or youre using something harder than the stone or at least the same hardness of the stone to cut it. Lets say you have a brass tool holder holding this harder material, it gets put up to the stone, it would most likely deform and you would see that in the cut, if you used wood it would most likely also deform or deflect. Could you use such materials on a holder in such a tight space? That could be tested. for example if you 3d print a tool holder, it could hold a tool but what sort of cut would it produce? Most likely not a precise cut. I would suggest even rudimentary iron or cast iron does not have the right properties for the job. Clearly they have an understanding of data and tolerances also material science, then its just a matter of time.
Ancient Technology Podcast - Lost GPS Receivers in Ancient Egypt | Chris King - Part 4
Imagine the dust would immediately have to be kept out of the machine parts and bearings especially those Rock cut Indian temples and underground churches
95% of 'lost ancient technology' is merely that all stone can be cut because stone cuts itself, and that using giant stone tools to do the cutting creates its own precision due to the stabilization of the large cutting mass. Relating it to modern machine tools is simply incorrect.
would it make any difference if the object / vase would be inside a fluid,
to reduce vibrations and temperature stress ?
The Land of Chem channel explains everything about pyramids.
Keep posting quality content and your channel will grow exponentially 👍🏼
Absolutely the best demonstration of ancient technology I have ever seen. Tremendous work you have done here. You are making world shattering history yourselves by sharing the findings of your work. Bravo gentleman, bravo!
Thanks a million, but we would be nowhere without the other team who scanned the objects and started the project.
We are just following up their work and trying to extend it
Hey guys. I’m the caretaker of the spinner vase. This is great work. I learned several things. Well done
@@mattbealllimitlessThanks a million! Such a great honor having your comment here!
🙏❤️👊🏼
Amazing show... Please don't stop....can never have enough alt history
Thanks! Haha! I was not planning on stopping
Out of curiosity, why the Guinness and Irish music? Have you an Irish connection?
I have no Irish heritage i am aware of, but I love the culture and the Guinness
That's cool. I'm Irish myself.
Great conversation! Thankyou! 🌱
Thanks a lot! ☺️
I almost spit it out my vodka when you mention wood Lathe😳
Why?
right? if wood lathes were that precise we never would've created metal lathes, lol
Was it cut from both sides at same time to keep equal pressure on both sides?
The tip of This tool had to be articulating to cut the bottom and sides
MASON JARS FOR WATER, MINUS THE PERISHED LIDS
Looks like a record to me either a sound or electricity not mechanical
Can you elaborate on this? You made me curious
Cymatics , this looks like bagdad battery so did you know sound can be mupltiplied to light also light an be turned into crystals or electrical currents sounds electricity
It’s a dude who made transmittable energy by using a piezo in a vacuums the radio waves are controlled w a Eq Like a Musical eq tunes in to a frequency and produces energy in the vacuums is can plasma by exploding the compounds inside the vacume
Look into the piezo crystal that shit trippie
Chris King is on point pun intended
Köszönöm ! Működik
Elnézést a felirat minőségéért, sajnos nincs időm kézzel lefordítani, a gépi viszont nem a legjobb.
Teljesen jó és érthető .A lényeg az ,hogy smart tévén is működik :) Már ha beállítják . 1-2 csatorna van ami a témával foglalkozik és ezt megteszi.( felirat ) Universe Inside You az egyik. Na meg most te !
great work, keep growing the conversation!
Thank you! Will do!
The Egyptians were such incredible stone masons.
Mirrors are a easy way to peep wat Chu got goin on inside
Do they use a first vase as a scribe, like a handwriting duplicator arm, guiding the diamond tipped armature as it describes different curves inside?
There are different shapes, so I am not sure.
Finite copper and sound frequency.
Tisztelettel megkérhetnélek rá ,hogy engedélyezd a magyar feliratot a videódban ? Okostévén illetve androidos mobilokon nincs magyar felírat csak akkor ,ha azt a feltöltő bekapcsolja ! Köszönöm !
Próbáld meg most! Igyekeztem beállítani, bár csak az automatikus fordítást, ami azért hagy némi kívánnivalót maga után. Szólj ha esetleg nem működik!
Why doesn't anyone simply put these bowls and tube cores on a turntable. An oblique light to emphasise the surface. Find optimal speed where its obvious that the grooves are spiral or concentric.
When discussing the petrie core and the penetration rate, everyone is amazed at how fast the tool is cutting into the stone. What if the groove isn't a mark caused by penetrative, but a product of debris caught between the surface of the tool and the material. Anyone using a drill in a hard surface knows it's much easier to withdraw a bit when you have reached the desired depth.
these guys should talk to stone masons and they would find many answers
Thanks for the suggestion! We've actually chatted with a few stone masons, and their insights have been invaluable. It's fascinating how ancient techniques still baffle modern experts. We're always open to learning more, so if you have any stone masons in mind who specialize in predynastic precision hard stone vases, do let us know. In the meantime, we'll keep exploring and sharing these groundbreaking discoveries, whether they're welcomed by mainstream academia or not. Stay curious!
Do you have any idea the number of things that would have to have been invented back then to produce the sounds? They obviously didn't have speakers and equipment that could soften or levitate anything.
Pure speculation on the way: You can create soundwaves like Tibetan monks do with horns etc. and you can soften chemically. I will have an episode on the stone softening actually soon.
If they softened stone, it was most likely chemically. That would be the one that would fit the timeline reasonably with what we have found they had at the time.