Escape from Tarkov's DLC Bait and Switch | Cold Take
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 พ.ค. 2024
- Escape from Tarkov had a huge player revolt recently. Let's understand why.
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Oh, I get it! Negative hype is the truth. It all makes sense now. The truth might affect game sales.
Or criticism, or just any speech they don't like. You know, just another way to say they're abusing the copyright law to censor people without using the censorship word.
Yeah, this is a continuation of the old song and dance of companies thinking TH-camrs, reviewers and journalists are supposed to be an arm of their commercial branch and are supposed to exclusively sell their product. So they get pissy and offended when that is not what happens.
Angry truth, anger seeps in when you're affected by this nonsense, and it makes you twist the truth to be even more damning. Neutral hype is just relying the info, by the numbers, and positive hype is like the Bethesda showcases, where the normal and even buggy content are explained as bonus features.
Damn bro spoilers (JK I don't care) 😭
Negative hype is when a controversy becomes bigger than the community of the game, I think. That is not *necessarily* the truth, people can be fooled after all, but it most often is.
There is no negative hype in Ba Sing Se!
Here we are safe - here we are free.
The CEO of BattleState games has invited you to Lake Laogai.
Hi, I'm-
All I can say is that the Wayback Machine is one of the single most important tools to exist on the internet, so frequently providing a reliable paper trail that otherwise could not exist. And also that Frost's sand garden is looking lovely!
There is a reason corps keep trying to get it shut down. It exposes their lies.
Putting the 'class act' in class action lawsuit.
What made this DLC controversy so notable to me were the sums involved. Video game companies trying to pull scummy crap like that is nothing new, but it generally involves small amounts of maybe of a few dozen bucks max, but with Tarkov, we're talking about special editions that cost *hundreds* of dollars, which seemed insane to me.
I could justify paying 250 bucks for the special edition of a game if it came with say a gold plated figurine of the main character, the soundtrack on vinyl, a poster hand-signed by each dev, an exclusive making-of documentary miniseries and a complimentary t-shirt. Ain't no way I can justify paying that amount for a digital copy of a game that's mostly just chock-full of cosmetics and for a game that's ostensibly still in early access or something!
"no microtransactions", so they had to go for *macro* transactions instead.
"We said no micro transactions so we put in honkin' HUGE transactions! It's what the people want, right?"
Like I already own Tarkov. Why would I pay $250 for the PvE mode that interests me when I could spend nothing on the PvE mod.
@@sabinekine2737 It's kind of like a more extreme version of how Bethesda keeps trying to monetize mods
“Negative hype” is probably the most legalese word for “criticism” i’ve ever heard. The absolutely massive brass balls on this company…
Are they massive or in fact absolutely tiny?
@@RowbotMaster If you had a set of massive spheres dangling between your legs, would you dare doing anything at all? Who came up with the term anyway, it's not about bravery, risking those being so much as struck with a candyfloss is nothing but stupid.
Brass balls, yet no spine.
Few years ago, playing online is a feature. Now, playing offline is the feature.
factorio reigns supreme yet again
I fully thought the membership mark next to your username was a stake emoji for a couple of minutes 🥩
It's amazing how far some businesses will go to justify ripping off their customers: redefining words, censoring criticism, changing products after purchase, flagrantly lying... and then acting like the customers are at fault when they fail.
Yep, the devs lie to customers face, get called out for it, and then retroactively try to change the wording and redefine what the term “DLC” means in order to double down and fuck over the people who supported them.
me when plagiarism means not crediting the source
Checked the internet and the developer pulled something similar in 2018.
Clearly it worked out for them back then, considering how Escape from Tarkov got really hyped up "recently" (positive hype, mind you).
POV: You trusted Russian game developers to not do awful, illegal things.
Nah
I don't know if it's just me but hearing that a company takes down videos that qualify as "Negative Hype" sure does produce a lot of "Negative Hype" for that company.
If only we had some sort of term for this common phenomenon. I wonder, for no particular reason, if Mike Masnick has any ideas.
"This 'No Negative Hype' T-shirt...."
Sometimes cancel culture can get out of hand, but it's also the only way for consumers to fight back. Boycotting has been a thing forever and if you don't like it, then you need to change as a company. Way too many protections for companies instead of consumers now adays
Voltaire once gave a scathing review of a book he didn't like. The king also didn't like the book, so he tried to have it banned. The resulting backlash turned the book into a smash hit, and Voltaire lost face for the bad review. It was in that light, not one of higher principle, that Voltaire remarked, "I may disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."
Isn't cancel culture only when the portion didn't do it? @@carolbaker2773 otherwise it is... Consequences of one's actions?
"Negative hype" is the second coming of "surprise mechanics"! It's so delightfully corpospeak and orwellian.
I really whish some based politician bring forward some take-the-piss-law proposal to end this sort of "Actually, screw you" behaviour. Call it... contract of the sale law!
"It's a *feature*...etc."
I'm surprised anyone looked at the what was it, $250 for the most expensive? - And said "Ah, yes that's reasonable for any single video game"
I mean I've given shitloads of money to grinding gear games, but then again I've spent 5-digit hours in their game so feels fair idk
Especially since it doesn't come with say; a statue, physical soundtrack, physical artbook, or anything like that.
It's a fucked up world, some people do just have so much money that the differemce between 60 vs 250 on a game isn't all that substantial. Which is at least kinda understandable in my opinion, when you have so much money it must be really different trying to judge the worth of something. Then of course there are others who are actually spending a significant portion of thejr income, and that's something I just don't understand.
Star Citizen would like a word with its $55k+ JPEG
The only video game that might be worth that, from my hours played, is Morrowind. But Bethesda in 2003 still remembered being indie and would have found that absurd.
The Fragrance of Dark Coffee. Best song from Ace Attorney.
I immediately recognized it as well. I love that song so much!
"To err is human, to forgive, divine. Humans aren't machines... they have souls, feelings. They live, they die, they love, they hate... and yes, they even make mistakes."
- Tarkov devs, probably
Jazz version too
Fucking thank you, I thought I heard it somewhere before but couldn't remember where, the jazz version is just amazing.
“Blacker than a moonless night, hotter and more bitter than hell itself… that is coffee.”
So, when will folks in the EU raise this issue for being illegal marketing strategies?
I bet this is clearly against EU marketing practices and should be a slam dunk to get governments involved.
they're a russian company based in a tax haven whose ceo has allegedly ties to some oligarch or another
Not sure if they even have the time to spare to go after individual developers.
They seem to have their hands full trying to get Aple to behave...
@@richardvlasek2445 They may be "based" in Russia but technically they operate out of the UK. At the very least their operations in the EU could likely be shut down over this anyway, which would massively impact sales.
@@richardvlasek2445 In that case, let me make some "they are actually spyware" allegations based on nothing and watch the flames!
@@richardvlasek2445 Probably even more reasons to fuck them over in that case then. Europe isn't so enamoured with Russia right now...
Ooh, Promise Tracker sounds like a great thing for countering hype. Might need to look into that myself when my friends get too excited for games.
As someone who's very insulated from the major developments in gaming news, I love the bite-sized updates I get from Cold Take.
"I am altering the deal, pray I don't alter it any further"
This deal's getting worse all the time.
"I'mma drop the deal and just pirate whatever you were offering, byeee"
@@mrheisenberg83 "Furthermore you must call yourself Mary and peddle around on this unicycle!"
Sorry, couldn't resist.
@@shadiafifi54 Never apologize for adding to the joke. You made me laugh and took me a little ways down memory lane!
Frost... playing it cool... so cool... it's cold.
Wow, I can't imagine there will be a bigger player revolt over a perceived bait-and-switch for a while.... >.>
We did see something like this with Overwatch 2. They sold it on the PvE mode, only to yank it away after the release of the game.
@@legomaniac213 I think OP is referring to the Helldivers 2 debacle that transpired over the weekend.
@@legomaniac213 Didn't they do that three times? Once when they reported that the PvE was largely being scrapped in favor of a handful of missions coming later, once when they said there would only be 3 missions instead of more and once when they fully dropped the idea altogether.
@@legomaniac213 Methinks @oceandark3044 is being a bit sarcastic here. 😅 What was it now… HadesPlungers 3?
*Cough cough* Helldivers *cough*
Sorry, I had something caught in my throat.
Deregulating businesses is like playing sports where the only rule is “the people who own the equipment get to make the rules. And they can change them mid-game too.”
And everyone has to play sports, unless they own their own equipment and can have people play for them.
I love the slow transition from Zen garden to litter box.
So “extraction shooter” means “shooter that extracts more money from customers.”
Did it ever mean something else?
Always has been
They already lost me on ever buying their games when they started trying to suppress critisism. I don't need "negative hype" to know that any company that engages in that kind of anti-consumer bs is not worth buying from.
Seriously. A good company addresses criticism directly, a bad company deflects from it, but it takes a particularly shitty company to try and suppress it entirely.
Tarkov is the Star Citizen of extraction shooters.
Tarkov at least produced a playable game.
@@kylekonop4801 Star Citizen is a playable game, it just suffers from eternal feature creep.
At least star citizen doesn't have micro transactions, just macro transactions
touch grass edition $1499
@@iamtherealzombie and it's designed that way by the request of the majority of people who play it unfortunately
they'll have no issues funding the game in 10 years time when they're still releasing concept ships purchasable through war bonds
My brother is very hopeful for beta this year :/
I can't wait for the Helldivers shenanigans coverage next week. Massive W for customer rights.
Sony is just helping Frost deliver an actual cold take about Helldivers so he can stop delivering hot ones about it; how nice of them.
IDK, I've seen comments claiming that Sony hasn't done anything to revert the PSN account requirement for countries that can't make an account yet.
Ah the Fragrance of Dark Coffee Jazz version. A perfect bed on which Frost can lounge around luxuriously on. I like this.
Lol
shoutout to phoenix wright godot jazz track, it could be one of my favorite genders.
The zen garden was hilarious, excellent work frost
Finally I understand the sunk cost that keeps people playing this wretched game.
everyone i know bought the base edition and just downloaded the free offline pve mod that BSG doesn't want people to know exists
@@weezusQL Same
"Unheard" edition ? Those guys don't know about Star citizen, do they ? 250$ is nothing
I guess "no lube edition" was considered too honest
I was wondering if Star Citizen had a website to track their promises like this game has, but I suppose the number of things in "not implemented" and "broken" would crash the internet.
I hear that turnabout jazz soul back there, you can't hide that from me
Love the rock garden
I've listened to pretty much all Second Wind Cold Take episodes, and only just noticed how the background music has at least one long motif from Godot's theme (Ace Attorney Trials and Tribulations), especially noticeable from 1:20 to 1:50.
Next week will we see how players and bad reviews made Sony bend a knee?
Can’t wait for that video
But it wasn’t players and bad reviews, or at least not primarily. It was almost certainly that they pulled their product from storefronts AFTER RELEASE, after people had already spent money on it, effectively locking out anyone that lived in a country where PSN wasn’t available. They also silently changed their statement on the Sony site from “PS games on PC won’t require a PSN account” to “some PS games will require a PSN account on PC”.
This is extremely illegal in many places, and some of the countries they delisted the game from are part of the EU, which means they were about to get sued by not just a few countries, but an entire coalition. Sony might have the money to fight a few countries off, especially poorer ones and those with fewer/no consumer protection laws, but they’re not going to be able to fend off the entire EU. They had to bend the knee to not immediately go out of business; no amount of corporate fuckery lets you escape THAT big of a lawsuit.
@@tribblesfoxfolk god I hope you're right. Considering you're a rando in a youtube comment, I won't hold my breath, but damn would it be sweet.
@@Hawk7886 Good policy. I'll admit, I can't produce any hard evidence, so it's less of a theory and more of a hunch. I'm pretty confident with my hunch, though, considering one of the locations that got delisted was Metropolitan France, and France does NOT fuck around.
i love that i quit tarkov like 3 months before this drama, i jumped of a sinking ship, before the armoury exploded!
nice
Engagement for the algorithm
Reply for the algorithm
Blood for the blood God, Korn for the cornflakes!
Feed it. Make it grow fat with your comments.
Rabble rabble
Calories incoming!
Yeesh.
Also, absolutely cultured for using the Jazz Rendition of Ace Attorney's Godot.
Excellent video! Loved the care to avoid "negative hype"
Oh hey it’s the Phoenix Wright jazz album music in the background, spectacular choice.
The Godot theme is the cherry on top, GOSH I love this channellllll
"It's the only one you've heard about"... the others are "unheard"
Absolute complete sidenote:
Did anyone else think the sandpit was fun to watch? Raking with the stones in the sand. Now, what to do with all that? XD
5:18 - Bro, Poolseidon? Okay, you got me there.
6:58 - Aww, the stop-motion fish! That's fun. Stop motion may be a bit time consuming, but it is satisfying when done nicely. :D
Yet another great video! I have in recent weeks started looking forward to Cold Take as much as I have Fully Ramblomatic. Well done, and keep this great content coming!
It's a lucky day to be Frost. What with this and Sony being Silly with Helldivers 2, he doesn't have to spend a lot of time trying to think of Next week's topic
I was so hoping you would get ahold of this, I'm so pleased to hear your take, however cold it is.
Frost must have the Helldivers 2 script ready for next week lol
To be fair, that whole thing happened over the course of 3ish days and only wrapped with Sony walking back on the decision earlier today. No time to edit it yet.
@@ninacochrane569 Yeah it was just a comment, not a complaint. Don't worry, we chillin here
Great video (as is to be expected from Second Wind), and I just wanted to say that this is quickly becoming one of my "must click" video series in my YT feed. I always know I'm in for a treat.
Damn your voice really helps that whole calm stone garden vibes
Great video! well done!
the 'namaste' at the end got me better then it should have XD
I can't wait for the upcoming helldivers video
Nice choice of music, the Fragrance of Dark Coffee...
This is easily becoming one of my favorite series on this channel.
Not exactly the same thing, but I'm very much reminded of games selling a premium deluxe edition that promises in big bold letters to include ALL DLC, but when you look at the fine print what is actually included is just the season pass, meaning any other DLC not explicitly part of the season pass is still extra.
Heck, even season passes themselves often fall foul to similar confusions, when customers think they are getting EVERYTHING on hyoe, only to realize afterwards there had been an itemized list of what was actually included in the fine print.
Dam, a thoughtful and observant critique of the situation, and yet all I can think about now is why don't I have a miniature Zen garden?
Helldivers 2: Stumbles and manages to get back up... Tarkov: Hold my beer!
TH-cam hid this video from me. Despite my watching every Monday and it always being at the top of my feed I had to go hunting for it after the Patreon reminder email
Holy shit, Godot's theme.
I really appreciate your exploration on these issues in gaming as they continue to appear
The perfect man for the job when it comes to narration.
Love me some cold take
Best music choice to go with this!
Awesome videos, keep them coming
Ah is that a slow version of Godot’s theme from Ace Attorney in the background? Love that music ☕️
Enjoyed the breakdown of the situation.
Cold Take and hot coffee
Are Extraction Looters just mildly cursed?
Escov from Tarkape over here weaseling around its unSustaniability, Dark and Darker exploring the intricacies of Corean Kopyright, SEGA's Hyena-fruit shriveling and rotting out on the vine just as it ripened...
I love the play with the format here
The Fragrance of Dark Coffee, a light rain/thunderstorm, and an endless loop of Frosts voice over *chef's kiss*. Cold Take without a Break to go to sleep to for some would be a good thing. Just saying
Good man. I like the fallow through and address of presumed backlash. Remember to cover what you love!
that little stopmotion animation at the end was cute
I will say, I was flooded with positive hype when I saw the little fish in the sand garden.
As the story progresses, Frost's sand box stops being raked and he then pulls out a hammer.
Thanks for another great video!
I really appreciate your content
This mini sand garden quickly became quicksands for the devs and now they can't get out.
wait, you mean the company that sold pre-order for an unfinished game for 250$ is pulling some shady shit? Well I never would have imagined such a thing. How audacious! How totally unexpected! How shocking! I can totally see how EFT fans were caught blindsided by such a company - after all, they've always been such reasonable and level-headed folks.
Lets hope that "negative hype" gets properly transferred into "Streisand effect"
the "negative hype" bit was hilarious. Love it.
I very much appreciate the hard journalism the world needs more of, but, i doubt your efforts will stop them from fradulently taking down the video
A games industry wide promise tracker is an incredible and sorely needed idea.
Your noir approach is so appropriate to talking about corporate shenanigans and greed.
i am engaged with this audiovisiual experience
those little ceramic fish are adorable
Nice piece!
The Fragrance of Dark Coffee...
1:36 correction, this was for the offline practice coop mode, which we got, offline pve is technically different
tbh i watch your stuff more than yahtzee these days,. keep it up frost, youre doing awesome content
I miss the days when pre-orders involved physical things. For example, I preordered Resident Evil 5 way back in the day and got a little statue of Chris Redfield, and a few other things like an art book and a pouch with the Tricell logo. It only cost about $10 more. Now, I'd be lucky to even get a sticker for paying $50 more.
Using a Zen Garden background and negative hype while discussing gaming controversies is a good standard.
Thanks for the insight and chill vibes Frost. It’s always interesting to see more about how games and communities interact.
On a related note, I recently heard there’s been another victory for democracy. And this time it’s not against bugs or bots
Because of the late upload, sadly I was unable to enjoy my Monday bagel along with cold take, but at least I can still watch cold take
Your Anti-Zen Garden is lovely.
It's funny how much devs overlook the benefits of honesty and working with their community if money gets tight.
If online costs are an issue and you don't have a recurring income source, throw up a "here's exactly what the servers cost us in detail" alongside an accurate donation tracker and a paypal link.
Maybe the community will prefer cosmetics or some other mtx, then let them dictate that and provide some nice cosmetics. Hell, let community members create cosmetics that get sold and a portion of the income.
Make the act of supporting the game a way of being part of the community and part of the fun, then you won't have any issues keeping servers up.
I've never been a fan of negative hype.
I prefer positive suppression.
I don't really know anything about what's gone on "behind the scenes" with Tarkov throughout its life, because I don't play it and don't want to, but I've always been aware of how impressive its depiction of firearms is and for that reason always respected it. I gotta say, it makes me sad to see that a team that is evidently talented and passionate enough to make the game that they have is also sleazy enough to resort to such scumbag tactics.
If developing a game for so long without funding is so difficult- and I'm sure it is- would it really be that hard to be transparent about it, communicate with players, and find a way to procure more funds without breaking promises or doing scummy shit to get it? I don't know, but for some reason I imagine that it wouldn't be too hard... but it is harder than just breaking the promises you made.
The other thing that comes to mind immediately is- at what point do they decide that the game is complete and stop working on it? Is the plan to stay in "beta" forever? I don't think you get to spend 8 years selling a game that, at this point, has enough content to be a finished product, and still say that it's in beta and needs more work.
What the hell ever happened to making finished games and being content with the fact that your player count will eventually taper off, but that your game is fun enough to retain relevance for many, many years?
"Tarkov's not the only one with this kind of problem, it's just the one you've heard about." Good reminder.
I'm surprised the zen sand pit didn't end up flung out the office window by the end of this video.
This is fantastic.
I approve of the way this content was made, very intelligent.
Can't wait for the cold take on Helldivers 2.
I'm of the belief that if they had truthfully said,
"We are losing money maintaining the game that people are enjoying because of a promise we made eight years ago."
and then asked for some understanding from the player base, they'd have gotten some slack. As it's played out though I'm not convinced that things were so dire that what they did can be justified.
Thanks for reporting about this. Your contributions are always quality. As a long time fan of the game, BSG has totally soured me to their products. I definitely no longer trust them with my money.