Tom, Thanks for taking the time to make these videos, I love metalwork but I have no proper training. You are a great teacher and my work is better and my time more enjoyable in the shop. Many Thanks.
Tom, I have searched Utube for good knurling calcs (heaps available) & found that your method in this video is the most simple one that I have come across thus far... Knurling is a more involved procedure than just running wheels against a job diameter. I have done some really nice knurls just going against a diameter without calcs - assy! I've also struggled with crap knurls & machined them off & redone them several times & the knurl comes good... A diameter was found without my knowing it! thanks for showing why... pedro...
Hi Johnnym, The knurls act like gears when they contact the work diameter. As soon as there is any pattern the two knurls are synchronized. When you set the height of the knurls they should both make contact at pretty much the exact same time. Hope I answered your question. Thanks for the comment. Regards, Tom
I set my height a little differently... Loosen the height adjustment so that the head is floating. bump the rollers against the stock, then turn the height screw snug. Lock it down. Gets ya close, fast. Just my $.02. Love your videos and always learn! Thank you, good Sir!
This is the first time exposed to the calculations, so this video will receive quite a workout before I fully understand it. A major THANKS for showing us something we should have known, or at least have been aware of long before this, JD
I thought one advantage of the scissor type knurl was that if the knurls were aligned vertically centered on the center of the stock, it eliminates any pushing affect against the stock. In which case, you would not pull off the stock in the X direction but you could go off the end of the stock in the Z direction. Never used this type so I don’t know if you want to be off the stock to deepen the imprint or stay on the stock and try it there. Thoughts?
Better add to my question that I did see the earlier comment about using the same diameters. Guess I just wanted confirmation on on calculations. Also, I just though of another question. On someone's else's video they set the tool about 5 degrees off of perpendicular to the chuck. The knurling wheels thus did not contact fully across there face. You had yours at 90 degrees, which is what I have been doing. The rest of what I was doing was wrong, but now thanks to you will be corrected. Thanks!
Tom, Really like the simple idea you have had for using bar stock welded to your homemade toolholder in place of cutting a dovetail. Some new BXA holders plus a clamp knurling tool will have to go on the to-do list in my home shop :-) Thank you for all of the informative and entertaining videos :-) Ger :-)
Hi Ger, I did a blog article on what I call the Skeleton Aloris tool holder. Check out the blog and search for the article. It shows how it was all put together. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
I got one of those Aloris Kurlers, I love it. I set the diameter at around 11:30 and 6:30 for my Aluminum 5/8" and 1/2" tubes. I use coarse conical diamond knurls, I do it all in one pass as length is around 12 inches. no second pass as I use a follow rest that is close as I can get to knurl tools. I got to a fast feed rate as I got better. Rpm doesn't seem to matter much. I tend to faster as I get tied of the wait. I was using oil mister, and by accident got some water in it. After I stopped crying about the water I realized the knurl looked better and had less flakes in the knurl. those suck to remove. Swapped to kool-mist mix and quality jumped up, and cleaning as much easier. Pretty good at it now, but 100's of hours on one design. Had a job on CNC for straight type. Trick was the OD of knurl was the spec they wanted as this part rotated in a cup fixture and OD was important , Had to adjust the depth of cut for this. Actually was not much of a problem. Designer did his homework on kurl TPI and starting OD. Did oil flood and no issues. 303 btw. I go thru the math on diameter vs TPI, just makes sense. Made up an Excel sheet for it, lost on the back up drive by now. Happy to look and send it if someone wants it. I got a cut type kurler as well, not much luck for a pretty part. Play with it and give up after a bit. Different animal. Before I got the aloris, my knurling really sucked.
How does the knurl line itself back up once you pull it away from the part? I don't understand that. It seems to me it would hit anywhere on the part and possibly hit in between the existing knurls.
Hi Star, The knurl acts like a small gear. It seems to easily pick up the already formed tooth as you saw in the video. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
Hi Stewart, Excellent question. In fact some folks have done just that. The lead angle is beyond what most manual machines can do. I have heard of people doing it with CNC lathes and very high lead multiple start threads. The key is you need many grooves to make a knurled pattern. Regards, Tom
Thanks For the great videos Tom! I always find myself learning a lot from your demonstrations. Could you do a video showing how you made the tool to adapt the knurling attachment?
A whisker bigger may have to do with how the imprint will dig slightly into a smaller diameter. Some knurled material deforms upward but I think rolling over a slightly longer circumference is probably why you'd get a better result.
Tom, I've watched this video a couple of times now & written down your calcs for a straight knurl. My interest in knurling has jumped of late, & I have bought a new AT-19 "Aloris" knurling tool - (new) with diamond wheels, from the US. (Yet to arrive) on ebay. I did not know the complexity in knurling on a workshop lathe. This is an expensive tool that I know will pay for itself if I can use it properly. Thanks again mate for showing us how to use this tool with straight knurling calcs. I am also going to set the tool up with a variety of knurling wheels & would appreciate any advice on which way to go. More "Vegemite coming buddy". Yours Truly - Pedro...
Tom, plain and simple that is a good knurl, I have a knurl tool like that one, and another I made years ago that is a scissors type. The scissors type doesn't put side pressure on the part but I usually use the one like you did because it is handier.
Hi James, This is the only one I have access to. Have to make it work. I have tried the scissor type but it was a long time ago in a land far far away on 316 stainless to boot. cheers, Tom
Hi Tom, Well I have just about watched all of your videos now (thumbs up by the way) so thanks for the loss of sleep,:>) It's funny how somethings are different either side of the pond, generally over here we set the scissor type knurl holder with the wheels in the 12 & 6 o'clock position and use the big knob, with tommy bar holes, to apply pressure. Granted on your big lathe and stout stock it makes little difference but on smaller machines/workpiece pure torsion saves any tendency to bend.
Know nothing about knurling, but I don't understand how you can back off contact and contact again and have the valleys and mountains line up. Thanks for another helpful video.
Hi HH, Its like a manual transmission or a set of gears once you have the first imprint. Most guys don't disengage with the work once they start. Cheers, Tom
Hi Chris, Knurling is one of those things that you end up needing every trick in the book when its not going well. All the shops I worked in never had a scissor type knurling tool so I have never had the chance to play with one. For most things I prefer flutes on the knob instead of knurling. Thanks for the comment and words of encouragement. Hope you get some sleep. Regards, Tom Lipton
I rarely see a 6 jaw chuck, they are very useful grabbing square stocks by removing two opposite jaws (if the square is square enough)and very gentle with thin wall parts. Can you indicate any other advantage using them instead of 3 or 4 jaw chucks? Helpful calcs regarding pitch and circumference.
+Panagiotis Damalos Hi Damalos, Well better kind of hands down against a three jaw. Grips better and doesn't distort. The only disadvantages are initial cost and smallest gripping diameter is sometimes bigger than an equal sized three jaw. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
Just figured out who you remind me of...Jay Ingram. From daily planet. Dude used to come into my work from time to time. Love these machining videos. Might go get a mini lathe and start playing around on it.
You may be frustrated if you get a mini lathe because they aren't nearly as rigid as the big ones. However, if you learn to use the mini lathe and make the adjustment necessary and sharpen tools for the lower horsepower, anything you learn will translate to the big lathe. When you can keep your cut within .001" on the mini lathe, bigger lathes are simple.
Nice! I always thought once you had the knurl started, you should not back it out otherwise you risk loosing the alignment. That did not seem to be a problem when you did it. I guess the knurl wheels find the highs and lows and self align? Is that true for diamond patterns also? Thanks for the videos!
That knurling looks pretty good from here. A question: How do the two knurls not fight each other? Does one or the other slip at the beginning of the cut until it meshes and then your golden? And does the diamond pattern operate the same way. ie can you feed across and they all just soldier up and fall in line? Thanks, Tom. Great video.
They behave much like gears do. The straight knurls track in each others groove directly. Diamond knurls do the same thing but they track in their own grooves. If you think about the knurl groove as continuous much like a really coarse thread its helpful. Hope this helps. Cheers, Tom
Everybody that does demonstrations on brass must have bought it years ago. Priced 3" solid round stock last week for a gear. $271.40 per foot Canadian. Guess I won't be buying any brass. Thanks for the helpful demonstration.
Hi Jeff, Prices have eased here at least. I still buy most of mine through industrial recyclers that sell on Ebay. Temco is one that I use and is close by. Half the price of McMaster every time.Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
I followed what you did and the calculations for straight knurling. My question is for the cross hatch type would the same theory apply or does it all change?
Tom Herd Hi Tom, Same basic calculations. Take a look at Dorian Tools website. They have a great technical section on everything you ever wanted to know about knurling. Best, Tom
The way I calculate diameter is to make sure that the minor diameter (The inscribed circle of the deepest parts of the knurl) is a multiple of the pitch of the knurl. This accounts for the change in diameter as the material is reformed. The other option is to just try jamming the rollers into whatever it is, without doing any calculations, and I find that it usually doesn't cross-knurl too bad unless the rollers come around so that the sharpest point on the rollers hits dead center of one of the high points on the work. I like using some old knurling tools from an Armstrong lantern type tool post that I milled down to fit in a QCTP. Those tools allow both the rollers to pivot into the work on a hinge so that there is uniform and equal contact of both. The idea of knurling with a higher feed and speed is one I have never done; I'll have to do so. I also like the idea of knurling dry. Nice radio station too, I haven't heard and SRV played on any of the ones around here in forever. I'm glad I watched this, I learned a lot.
Hi Always, Knurled stock grows in diameter as you knurl it. How do you compensate for the growth? Many knurls are sized to work on standard 1/64 increment stock sizes. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
Hey Tom loved this video! I noticed when you were putting away your Allen keys you have a unique holder for them. Could you do a quick show and tell in the next meatloaf? I'm always curious about the little different ways fellow machinist do things. I was also wondering if your books are available on kindle and if so do they include the same photos/illustrations as the paperbacks? Thanks, always looking forward to the next video! Shawn
Hi Shawn, Good question. I don't know what electronic formats are available. I'll have to ask my publisher. The allen key holder is a dead copy of this one. www.mcmaster.com/#53045A61 In fact I stole the spring for mine off a broken plastic one. Mine is made of BeCu left over from a water cooled injection mold core. All the best, Tom
The reason you want to be a shade bigger, is that you just calculated the diameter for the base of your knurled grooves, with no material to be displaced *into* the tool, the sums to allow accurately for that would be a royal pain though you *could* calculate it by how much valley needs displacing to form your peak, some fun with areas of triangles, unless you're doing a knurl which is coarse on small diameters, the trick is to just go in hard enough and let the tool find it's pitch, which it usually will.... it's easier to get right with scissor type tools, the fine pitch thread on the clamp screw lets you apply much more force (typically with a wrench on a nut) without feeling like you're reefing on the controls like you feel if you're going in using the coarse acme thread of your cross-feed using a small diameter handwheel and pushing against the part. After all those pointless sums and starting at the "correct" size, probably ended up with one less groove/peak than your calculations predicted, since you left nothing to be displaced into the peaks... I bet you don't have the patience to count them though... As for "typically short lengths", depends if you're making knobs & thumbscrews or, tool handles, centre punches, & scribes..... The last two being where that separation adjustment for the wheels on your tool come in.. as you can clamp top & bottom of the really small diameter stuff (use it like a scissor knurl) with your work still supported both ends, instead of pushing in and bending it regardless of support. Then again, I'm an electrical engineer by training, not a machinist, sadly haven't operated a lathe in 35+ years.... so I actually probably know nothing, regardless of what I dimly remember.
I have got to agree, a scalloped edge wins hands down for big knobs, but for small "instrument" knobs a straight knurl, or diamond knurl for pull and twist knobs, looks right. What looks great for old style small knobs is a rope knurl, but that is a bit esoteric for most home shops. As for sleep, it's 3 AM here so that's were I'm off to now.
Thanks Tom for another great video. My knurling tool is marked 250-210. It is part of a set of tool holders that came with a Chinese QCTP. I have no idea what tpi the wheels are. Is there a way to figure this out before I make a mess of a good part?
Put some ink on the knurls and roll them on a piece of paper set along the edge of a table. You can count the number of knurls per inch. I am not sure but if they are made for nominal metric diameters you might come up with some odd number per inch.
If you are straight knurling, what benefit do you get from having 2 knurls? Seems to me that one knurl on center would do the job and have no chance of having the 2nd knurl get out of time. As far as the optimal diameter question goes, I think a good test would be to make a test with several steps with relief in between to make a comparison.
Hi Roger, Sounds like some good content for your first video. There are single roll knurls out there. Most folks have a dual roll holder so they just use that. It traps the round in a virtual vee and is less sensitive to center height settings. I don't think I have ever seen the rolls get out of time unless it was damaged somehow. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
Hi metal, Its almost always easier to advance in off the part then feed onto the part. This takes the twisting under load off the cross feed screw. The knurling tool I have seems to have a provision for using a tool to apply torque to the clamp down screw. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
Thanks. I understand that it's better to feed in from the side, but what about say when you are knurling between shoulders, or for like a rope knurl. Then I guess it would be better to clamp?
It will depend on several factors. Lathe, material, type of knurl etc. Clamping and infeed are just two variables you can play with to get good results. Better is a relative word not an absolute. Hope that makes sense. Best, Tom
I once discussed exactly this issue (=there has to space around the stock that fits an WHOLE number of knurling teeth) with some nutheads and they laughed at me because I said this - they said I was WAY TOO sofisticated - so I'm very happy that you dive into this issue in this video - I'll make a small program (Excel or EXE-file) that calculates a diameter from the TPI - one diameter LESS THAN and one BIGGER THAN the WANTED diameter. Is the knurling wheeles always classified some TPI ?
How did you align the first pass to the second pass? Would they not overlap? Thanks for the vid! (just read the reason below! crazy how that works lol)
"A whisker bigger" because the knurl penetrate the surface and runs at a slightly smaller diameter than your working piece. Just my thoughts on the matter. Keep up the good work!
+marmo Last Hi Marmo, It will depend on the lathe you have and the material you plan on knurling. If you have a light machine you may need a scissor type that takes less pressure to use. If you want to knurl stainless then you will want a heavy unit. Hope this helps. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
I just tried knurling using your method on 1" PG 304 stainless steel and a 25tpi straight knurl. The knurl starts off great but doesnt cut as deep as I move into the piece. Also if I try to start the knurl in the middle of the piece it doesnt track properly. Any suggestions or insight to what I'm doing wrong?
Hi Blank, Stainless needs a LOT of pressure. Sounds like the tool is pushing back on you. I would suggest starting off the piece and making a couple of passes at increasing crossfeed depths. What is the diameter and length you are knurling? Cheers, Tom
oxtoolco Tom, thanks for the video and the reply. The stainless rod is 1.000 +.000/-.0005. At 3/4" long, the knurl OD measures 1.004. At the start of the knurl its measuring 1.012. With a second pass it didnt improve.
Tom, Quick question, and I'm really going to display my ignorance here: I've got a Chinese-made, combo knurling tool and tool holder that has no markings other than "250-110 China" on it. Any idea what the TPI would be? v/r, Rick
Rick Rose Hey Rick, You can ink the knurls and roll them on a piece of paper and actually measure the pitch. Be sure to measure the pitch at right angles to the center of rotation of the roll. Don't use the parallel space between the angled lines. You would see pitch numbers anywhere between 12 to 80 TPI. Cheers, Tom
Hi Alex, The diamond knurls need to be done on certain diameters as well to come out nice. Dorian tool has a great little technical and troubleshooting guide on their website. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
im confused, ive only knurled a few times with a clamp type knurl tool.. i place the rollers on top center and make passes back n forth , increasing the force each pass,,,it works great. I thought that was the idea behind that type of tool to lower side force? , where as you are feeding in. Keep up the great videos
Thanks this helped me understand more, I'm trying to do a straight knurl on 360 brass with a Chinese small lathe and Little Machine Shop scissors knurl at 33 tpi, total failure first try. Some good tips so I'll try it again tomorrow after I kick a hole in the wall from getting nowhere tonite ;-)
Hi SD, Knurling is one of those things that can make you really frustrated. That and parting cause the most grief for new to machine work folks. Cheers, Tom
oxtoolco Man, 3 days wasted, I was using some math formula print outs from another youtube video, my knurling attachment is from Little Machine Shop and the formula they give you (which isn't even posted on their knurling machine page) gives radically different results than the tables I copied, so I was doomed to failure from the beginning. So my knurls were completely covering the surface with lines closely spaced together, I think I may have ruined the 33 line knurl by trying to force into the brass too, then one of these videos said never use cutting oil on 360 brass which is probably right too. One more try this weekend and hopefully should get it this time...
Yes sorry, at 2:40 and 10:50 you show a tool holder you made using round rod in place of the dovetail slots. Was just wondering if you ever went over it detail in one of you past videos
Is there any reason why you would not want to set your Aloris tool holder to position the knurling wheels at 12 and 6 o'clock rather than 7 and 10, using the height adjustment on the tool holder to set your depth rather than the crossslide? It would certainly reduce lateral stress on your chuck/ work, etc. 2thferry
T 2thferry Hi Ferry, This particular knurling holder moves both knurls at the same time. Setting the knurls at 12 and six would still have a fair amount of pressure on the spindle. Fortunately lathes are designed for just this kind of loading. If you noticed I don't try to screw the crossfeed in while the knurls are engaged in the cut. Rather they run in from the end of the bar. Cranking on the screw while the knurls are loaded up is generally not a good idea. All the best, Tom
+oxtoolco Tom, I was wondering on this pressure deal while watching, where is the point that you decide you need to use a dead or live center as more support so as not to apply pressure to the spindle bearings, seems to me any job that has to apply the pressure to cut into the material like knurling does, should always have the end supported, I am very new to this and just a small 9 X 20, but sure don't want to hurt the bearings or bend spindle,, I am learning so much by watching your videos,. thanks Jim
+jbrunson1949 Hi Jim, I start thinking about centers when the diameter to length ratio gets above 1:3 That is a one inch shaft sticking out of your workholding three inches. If your sticking out further than that then a center is a good idea. Material also plays a part in this. Stainless would be less maybe 1:2.5 and brass could probably be a little more. Just general guidelines. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
I was taught that, once you start the knurl, you don't disengage the tool until you are done knurling so that the grooves aren't double cut. Yet, here in your video, you do exactly that. How is it that the tool realigns exactly in the grooves?
Roger Banks Hi Roger, They do realign if given a chance. Like you when I was taught as a lad how to knurl they showed us that method. Funny thing was my knurling always looked crappy until I saw somebody else do it this way. Now my knurling looks good. Try it. I think you will like it. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
My small program is very smart when you train knurling from the bigger diameter, turn the done knurl pattern off again and use the program to get the new (smaller) diameter !
Greetings Houm, I don't have any video's specifically on surface grinding. I do have a couple on grinding small tools in the Deckel single lip grinder. Take a look at Andreykush's channel for some good video's on grinding, th-cam.com/users/andreykush He has a few good ones but you need to speak Russian to understand him. Kind regards, Tom
Wayyy to much math ! I made a copy of Guy Lautard's floating arm knurling tool 25 years ago and still use it on a regular basis. Dead simple to use - center on the part - tighten the clamp nut - engage the feed. When you are up against the chuck - stop - if the knurl needs more form, tighten the clamp nut a bit and reverse the lathe. Fine, medium, coarse, and straight (coining) knurl - no problem, no head scratching, you just make parts.
Sorry to disagree but no math is necessary. Diameter doesn't matter as long as opposing knurls are set deep enough on the first pass. It does take a little practice to set the depth just right. The reason it's possible to get a perfect knurl on any diameter is that the knurling wheels must "slip" slightly to fit into the deep grooves made on the first rotations. If not deep enough you'll get a split or double knurl. After the initial slip the wheels will continue to track as the knurls get deeper. I use a heavy duty scissors type knurling tool with 14 pitch diamond knurls and a heavy flow of motor oil from my sump on the top wheel. One pass left to right with heavy feed and return pass right to left to starting point completes the knurl on aluminum. A few more passes are needed on mild steel but the same procedure works. The secret is setting the knurls deep enough with oil, then letting them track for a few turns before engaging the feed.
You make the material a tad over size because the pitch diameter is about halfway down the tooth. Your metric for stopping when you get flakes is probably correct for steel, but probably not so good with brass. Brass work hardens very rapidly, and will flake a great deal as the knurl tool rolls over the knurl. Low speed and lots of cutting oil helps float the flakes away, that or run fast enough to fling them off. Coolant or light oils like WD40 are useless. It is also best to make the knurl in a single pass wit materials that work harden. Depth of cut should be about equal to the pitch (for a 90* knurl) + some windage for flexing of the work and tool. I would have started at about 0.045" DOC, your knurl looked incomplete to me though. Does your cross slide measure diameter? In other words, you only knurled 0.025 deep? That would explain why it look incomplete. A complete knurl is often sharp enough to be painful and requires filing or turning.
Hi Joshua, Can't remember what depth I went to on this knurl. Why would I want to turn a knurl to deburr it? Seems like getting to the correct visual and feel are the metrics here. Knurls are generally not called out to precision diameters. Cross slide does measure diameter. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
Hi Francis, How did you get that idea? Take a look at 11:31. I'm allowed to have my reading glasses on my apron and wear safety glasses. Get your facts straight. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
I am sorry to take up your time! I have some equipment, but nothing which compares upon yours! I wish it were different, but that is life. I watched your video named "Press pin 1" & this video in which you calucaled & pressed a knurling into a work surface. I am confused about how the mathematical result of ".8785" is useful. The mathematics, I understand! The purpose & how to use this calculation is used or what it indicates is where I got lost. Is it a machine setting? It seems as an exercise in mathematics with no purpose. Did I miss something? "I don't have a inkling why I should be a whisker bigger!" I apologize Tom, but I guess, I want to understand why. Then I am not operating from just, "That is the way it has always been done!" thinking. There was a reason for this practice to become industry accepted.
The light just shined! Praise! This calculation is use to determine the dimension, (before knurling), the end piece, before knurling, which the work should be turned to. Please confirm! Tom, I see the day when the printed book is no longer offered. The video book will become the valued vehicle of educational delivery. (At least for the vocational skills. How do I . . . ). I wonder if your book publisher has a 'video book' in their future offerings? There is a way to control editions distribution & who is entitled to access them.
Hey Roach, The .8785 is the diameter of the round bar that will knurl with those particular knurls and not have a remainder. In knurling if there is an non whole number of teeth on the circumference of the knurled diameter it will make multiple impressions that don't line up. The 25 tpi knurls can only knurl on diameters with whole number solutions to the number of teeth around the circumference. I just noticed your response below that it clicked. Well I'll leave this for you anyway. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
oxtoolco Got it! You want to knurl such that the teeth of the knurling tool land exactly in the previous depressions made by the previous revolution of the the knurling tool over the circumferential surface of the finished product. Every revolution is meant to 'marry' the teeth depressions with the previous revolution where the knurling tool made contact with the product surface. (Not meaning a second pass over the product to make a deeper depression). Thus the mathematics is meant to determine the dimension to 'trim' the product diameter to BEFORE knurling task commences! Turn & cut the product to the calculated dimension before applying the knurling tool to it's surface.
A couple of comments to improve the quality of your videos (which are very helpful): --Turn off the radio in the background. It's competing with your commentary. --In the knurling video, nothing is in focus. Maybe you need a better camera. Keep up the good work.
Hi Keith, Thanks for the comment and feedback. This is a pretty early video where I was using a lower res camera. I think we have that fixed. You should check out some of the new material. Regards, Tom
So, even on straight knurls, you need two knurling rollers. My question is will only one roller do straight knurls? Why do you need two rollers, you are not crossing the lines to make diamond impressions...!
slad roznik Hi Slad, You don't need two rollers to make a straight knurl. They actually sell holders for single straight knurls. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
But I have problems sending LINKS as part of these comments ! The link doesn't work, you say ... did you change the D O T to a . when you copied it to the address line of your browser ? (We are NOT allowed to insert a link in these comments - that's why I did this D O T shit - even this message I have problems sending ... !) Private messaging ... do you mean e-mail or ... ?
Don’t make a video and have the radio playing in background it’s annoying, before turning radius down show me if it works on the bigger diameter, don’t need to see you turn diameter down for 3 min it’s about knurling , too many wide shots keep it close so I can see the knurling. Sorry 👎
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As a CAD designer this completely saved my life!! Thank you so much
Tom, Thanks for taking the time to make these videos, I love metalwork but I have no proper training. You are a great teacher and my work is better and my time more enjoyable in the shop. Many Thanks.
Great info Tom. I really appreciated seeing the math necessary to make it work! Thanks Tom 👍
Tom,
I have searched Utube for good knurling calcs (heaps available) & found that your method in this video is the most simple one that I have come across thus far... Knurling is a more involved procedure than just running wheels against a job diameter. I have done some really nice knurls just going against a diameter without calcs - assy! I've also struggled with crap knurls & machined them off & redone them several times & the knurl comes good... A diameter was found without my knowing it!
thanks for showing why...
pedro...
Thanks for the numbers breakdown Tom. Very useful stuff to have.
Thanks for the video. I got hung up on some knurls on a production job a couple months back. I appreciate the expert advice.
Hi Johnnym,
The knurls act like gears when they contact the work diameter. As soon as there is any pattern the two knurls are synchronized. When you set the height of the knurls they should both make contact at pretty much the exact same time. Hope I answered your question. Thanks for the comment.
Regards,
Tom
I set my height a little differently... Loosen the height adjustment so that the head is floating. bump the rollers against the stock, then turn the height screw snug. Lock it down. Gets ya close, fast. Just my $.02. Love your videos and always learn! Thank you, good Sir!
Thanks Tom! Beautiful. The calculations are greatly simplified.
Hi Tom,
Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Hi Donner,
Thanks for the tip. It never seems right to close the rolls or open the rolls to either extreme. Thanks for the comment.
Best,
Tom
This is the first time exposed to the calculations, so this video will receive quite a workout before I fully understand it. A major THANKS for showing us something we should have known, or at least have been aware of long before this, JD
JD Wisdom Hi JD,
Thanks for the comment. The textbooks seem to gloss over this really important step to getting good knurling.
Cheers,
Tom
Thank you, Tom. One advantage over threading: no worry if the correct # comes around on a threading wheel.
Hi Keld,
I'll try it out. Do I need to learn Danish to use it?
Regards,
Tom
I thought one advantage of the scissor type knurl was that if the knurls were aligned vertically centered on the center of the stock, it eliminates any pushing affect against the stock.
In which case, you would not pull off the stock in the X direction but you could go off the end of the stock in the Z direction. Never used this type so I don’t know if you want to be off the stock to deepen the imprint or stay on the stock and try it there. Thoughts?
Better add to my question that I did see the earlier comment about using the same diameters. Guess I just wanted confirmation on on calculations.
Also, I just though of another question. On someone's else's video they set the tool about 5 degrees off of perpendicular to the chuck. The knurling wheels thus did not contact fully across there face. You had yours at 90 degrees, which is what I have been doing. The rest of what I was doing was wrong, but now thanks to you will be corrected. Thanks!
Tom,
Really like the simple idea you have had for using bar stock welded to your homemade toolholder in place of cutting a dovetail.
Some new BXA holders plus a clamp knurling tool will have to go on the to-do list in my home shop :-)
Thank you for all of the informative and entertaining videos :-)
Ger :-)
Hi Ger,
I did a blog article on what I call the Skeleton Aloris tool holder. Check out the blog and search for the article. It shows how it was all put together. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco Thanks Tom :-)
I am liking that set up as well don't have all the tooling to make dovetails right now but have nice old tig machine.
Hi Tom, Is the process the same for knurling tools that produce other patterns? Great video. Until now, I had no clue how to knurl correctly!
Very interesting I have only used a clamp type knurl however I have never done any calculations yet I have always had good results?
I got one of those Aloris Kurlers, I love it. I set the diameter at around 11:30 and 6:30 for my Aluminum 5/8" and 1/2" tubes. I use coarse conical diamond knurls, I do it all in one pass as length is around 12 inches. no second pass as I use a follow rest that is close as I can get to knurl tools.
I got to a fast feed rate as I got better. Rpm doesn't seem to matter much. I tend to faster as I get tied of the wait.
I was using oil mister, and by accident got some water in it. After I stopped crying about the water I realized the knurl looked better and had less flakes in the knurl. those suck to remove. Swapped to kool-mist mix and quality jumped up, and cleaning as much easier.
Pretty good at it now, but 100's of hours on one design.
Had a job on CNC for straight type. Trick was the OD of knurl was the spec they wanted as this part rotated in a cup fixture and OD was important , Had to adjust the depth of cut for this. Actually was not much of a problem. Designer did his homework on kurl TPI and starting OD. Did oil flood and no issues. 303 btw.
I go thru the math on diameter vs TPI, just makes sense. Made up an Excel sheet for it, lost on the back up drive by now. Happy to look and send it if someone wants it.
I got a cut type kurler as well, not much luck for a pretty part. Play with it and give up after a bit. Different animal.
Before I got the aloris, my knurling really sucked.
How does the knurl line itself back up once you pull it away from the part? I don't understand that. It seems to me it would hit anywhere on the part and possibly hit in between the existing knurls.
Hi Star,
The knurl acts like a small gear. It seems to easily pick up the already formed tooth as you saw in the video. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Hi Stewart,
Excellent question. In fact some folks have done just that. The lead angle is beyond what most manual machines can do. I have heard of people doing it with CNC lathes and very high lead multiple start threads. The key is you need many grooves to make a knurled pattern.
Regards,
Tom
where did you get the spectacles? I need something like that, the old 2x readers don't cut it anymore.
Knurling with Bush - Machine Head playing in the background. That's the kind of life I want to lead.
Knurly, dude
Nicely explained and demonstrated. Can't figure out why there's 18 who disliked this though.
Pete
Thanks For the great videos Tom! I always find myself learning a lot from your demonstrations. Could you do a video showing how you made the tool to adapt the knurling attachment?
+kromair22 Hi Kromair,
Take a look at this article I wrote about it. oxtool.blogspot.com/2013/01/skeleton-aloris-holder.html
Cheers,
Tom
A whisker bigger may have to do with how the imprint will dig slightly into a smaller diameter. Some knurled material deforms upward but I think rolling over a slightly longer circumference is probably why you'd get a better result.
Always enjoy you sharing knowledge
Just a question on the use of a six jaw chuck comparison to a 4 jaw chuck, why do people use them compared to a 4 jaw
Hi Kelds,
The link didn't work. Try sending it whole through private messaging.
Best,
Tom
Tom,
I've watched this video a couple of times now & written down your calcs for a straight knurl. My interest in knurling has jumped of late, & I have bought a new AT-19 "Aloris" knurling tool - (new) with diamond wheels, from the US. (Yet to arrive) on ebay.
I did not know the complexity in knurling on a workshop lathe. This is an expensive tool that I know will pay for itself if I can use it properly. Thanks again mate for showing us how to use this tool with straight knurling calcs.
I am also going to set the tool up with a variety of knurling wheels & would appreciate any advice on which way to go.
More "Vegemite coming buddy".
Yours Truly - Pedro...
+Peter Spence Hey Pedro,
That is an expensive tool. One of the reasons I don't like knurling....... Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Thanks Tom. That does make sense.
when knurling what PPE am I to wear
Tom, plain and simple that is a good knurl, I have a knurl tool like that one, and another I made years ago that is a scissors type. The scissors type doesn't put side pressure on the part but I usually use the one like you did because it is handier.
Hi James,
This is the only one I have access to. Have to make it work. I have tried the scissor type but it was a long time ago in a land far far away on 316 stainless to boot.
cheers,
Tom
Hi there, would one achieve the same effect if the bar to be knurled was instead threaded l/h and r/h?
finally understand how to calculate without table, very helpful thanks
Hi Ed,
Thanks for the comment. Don't feel bad. Its not like the knurls come with an instruction sheet.
Cheers,
Tom
Hi Tom, Well I have just about watched all of your videos now (thumbs up by the way) so thanks for the loss of sleep,:>) It's funny how somethings are different either side of the pond, generally over here we set the scissor type knurl holder with the wheels in the 12 & 6 o'clock position and use the big knob, with tommy bar holes, to apply pressure. Granted on your big lathe and stout stock it makes little difference but on smaller machines/workpiece pure torsion saves any tendency to bend.
Know nothing about knurling, but I don't understand how you can back off contact and contact again and have the valleys and mountains line up.
Thanks for another helpful video.
Hi HH,
Its like a manual transmission or a set of gears once you have the first imprint. Most guys don't disengage with the work once they start.
Cheers,
Tom
By the way, how did you locate the holes for the dowel pins in your improvised holder?
Hi Chris,
Knurling is one of those things that you end up needing every trick in the book when its not going well. All the shops I worked in never had a scissor type knurling tool so I have never had the chance to play with one. For most things I prefer flutes on the knob instead of knurling.
Thanks for the comment and words of encouragement. Hope you get some sleep.
Regards,
Tom Lipton
I rarely see a 6 jaw chuck, they are very useful grabbing square stocks by removing two opposite jaws (if the square is square enough)and very gentle with thin wall parts. Can you indicate any other advantage using them instead of 3 or 4 jaw chucks?
Helpful calcs regarding pitch and circumference.
+Panagiotis Damalos Hi Damalos,
Well better kind of hands down against a three jaw. Grips better and doesn't distort. The only disadvantages are initial cost and smallest gripping diameter is sometimes bigger than an equal sized three jaw. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Hi Tom when straight knurling what makes the teeth line up on each knurling wheel when they start at two differant point of the stock, thanks
Hi Bill,
Its a big steady rest. There is a whole series of video's on the construction.
Best,
Tom
Just figured out who you remind me of...Jay Ingram. From daily planet. Dude used to come into my work from time to time. Love these machining videos. Might go get a mini lathe and start playing around on it.
Hi Lead,
Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
You may be frustrated if you get a mini lathe because they aren't nearly as rigid as the big ones. However, if you learn to use the mini lathe and make the adjustment necessary and sharpen tools for the lower horsepower, anything you learn will translate to the big lathe. When you can keep your cut within .001" on the mini lathe, bigger lathes are simple.
good lesson, thanks
Nice! I always thought once you had the knurl started, you should not back it out otherwise you risk loosing the alignment. That did not seem to be a problem when you did it. I guess the knurl wheels find the highs and lows and self align? Is that true for diamond patterns also? Thanks for the videos!
I still get confused on using the calculated diameter. Doesn't the wheels cut on the surface and then as you cut deeper the diameter changes?
That knurling looks pretty good from here. A question: How do the two knurls not fight each other? Does one or the other slip at the beginning of the cut until it meshes and then your golden? And does the diamond pattern operate the same way. ie can you feed across and they all just soldier up and fall in line? Thanks, Tom. Great video.
They behave much like gears do. The straight knurls track in each others groove directly. Diamond knurls do the same thing but they track in their own grooves. If you think about the knurl groove as continuous much like a really coarse thread its helpful. Hope this helps.
Cheers,
Tom
Everybody that does demonstrations on brass must have bought it years ago. Priced 3" solid round stock last week for a gear. $271.40 per foot Canadian. Guess I won't be buying any brass. Thanks for the helpful demonstration.
Hi Jeff,
Prices have eased here at least. I still buy most of mine through industrial recyclers that sell on Ebay. Temco is one that I use and is close by. Half the price of McMaster every time.Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
I followed what you did and the calculations for straight knurling. My question is for the cross hatch type would the same theory apply or does it all change?
Tom Herd Hi Tom,
Same basic calculations. Take a look at Dorian Tools website. They have a great technical section on everything you ever wanted to know about knurling.
Best,
Tom
The way I calculate diameter is to make sure that the minor diameter (The inscribed circle of the deepest parts of the knurl) is a multiple of the pitch of the knurl. This accounts for the change in diameter as the material is reformed. The other option is to just try jamming the rollers into whatever it is, without doing any calculations, and I find that it usually doesn't cross-knurl too bad unless the rollers come around so that the sharpest point on the rollers hits dead center of one of the high points on the work.
I like using some old knurling tools from an Armstrong lantern type tool post that I milled down to fit in a QCTP. Those tools allow both the rollers to pivot into the work on a hinge so that there is uniform and equal contact of both.
The idea of knurling with a higher feed and speed is one I have never done; I'll have to do so. I also like the idea of knurling dry.
Nice radio station too, I haven't heard and SRV played on any of the ones around here in forever.
I'm glad I watched this, I learned a lot.
Hi Always,
Knurled stock grows in diameter as you knurl it. How do you compensate for the growth? Many knurls are sized to work on standard 1/64 increment stock sizes. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Hey Tom loved this video!
I noticed when you were putting away your Allen keys you have a unique holder for them. Could you do a quick show and tell in the next meatloaf? I'm always curious about the little different ways fellow machinist do things.
I was also wondering if your books are available on kindle and if so do they include the same photos/illustrations as the paperbacks?
Thanks, always looking forward to the next video!
Shawn
Hi Shawn,
Good question. I don't know what electronic formats are available. I'll have to ask my publisher. The allen key holder is a dead copy of this one. www.mcmaster.com/#53045A61
In fact I stole the spring for mine off a broken plastic one. Mine is made of BeCu left over from a water cooled injection mold core.
All the best,
Tom
The reason you want to be a shade bigger, is that you just calculated the diameter for the base of your knurled grooves, with no material to be displaced *into* the tool, the sums to allow accurately for that would be a royal pain though you *could* calculate it by how much valley needs displacing to form your peak, some fun with areas of triangles, unless you're doing a knurl which is coarse on small diameters, the trick is to just go in hard enough and let the tool find it's pitch, which it usually will.... it's easier to get right with scissor type tools, the fine pitch thread on the clamp screw lets you apply much more force (typically with a wrench on a nut) without feeling like you're reefing on the controls like you feel if you're going in using the coarse acme thread of your cross-feed using a small diameter handwheel and pushing against the part.
After all those pointless sums and starting at the "correct" size, probably ended up with one less groove/peak than your calculations predicted, since you left nothing to be displaced into the peaks... I bet you don't have the patience to count them though...
As for "typically short lengths", depends if you're making knobs & thumbscrews or, tool handles, centre punches, & scribes..... The last two being where that separation adjustment for the wheels on your tool come in.. as you can clamp top & bottom of the really small diameter stuff (use it like a scissor knurl) with your work still supported both ends, instead of pushing in and bending it regardless of support.
Then again, I'm an electrical engineer by training, not a machinist, sadly haven't operated a lathe in 35+ years.... so I actually probably know nothing, regardless of what I dimly remember.
I have got to agree, a scalloped edge wins hands down for big knobs, but for small "instrument" knobs a straight knurl, or diamond knurl for pull and twist knobs, looks right. What looks great for old style small knobs is a rope knurl, but that is a bit esoteric for most home shops. As for sleep, it's 3 AM here so that's were I'm off to now.
Thanks Tom for another great video. My knurling tool is marked 250-210. It is part of a set of tool holders that came with a Chinese QCTP. I have no idea what tpi the wheels are. Is there a way to figure this out before I make a mess of a good part?
Put some ink on the knurls and roll them on a piece of paper set along the edge of a table. You can count the number of knurls per inch. I am not sure but if they are made for nominal metric diameters you might come up with some odd number per inch.
If you are straight knurling, what benefit do you get from having 2 knurls? Seems to me that one knurl on center would do the job and have no chance of having the 2nd knurl get out of time.
As far as the optimal diameter question goes, I think a good test would be to make a test with several steps with relief in between to make a comparison.
Hi Roger,
Sounds like some good content for your first video. There are single roll knurls out there. Most folks have a dual roll holder so they just use that. It traps the round in a virtual vee and is less sensitive to center height settings. I don't think I have ever seen the rolls get out of time unless it was damaged somehow. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
For low powered lathes on stationary knurls, can you clamp down with the height adjuster instead of feeding in with the cross-slide?
Hi metal,
Its almost always easier to advance in off the part then feed onto the part. This takes the twisting under load off the cross feed screw. The knurling tool I have seems to have a provision for using a tool to apply torque to the clamp down screw. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Thanks. I understand that it's better to feed in from the side, but what about say when you are knurling between shoulders, or for like a rope knurl. Then I guess it would be better to clamp?
It will depend on several factors. Lathe, material, type of knurl etc. Clamping and infeed are just two variables you can play with to get good results. Better is a relative word not an absolute. Hope that makes sense.
Best,
Tom
Boston playing in the background! Nice touch!
Hey Joe,
The days before the youtube music robots were on to me. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
I once discussed exactly this issue (=there has to space around the stock that fits an WHOLE number of knurling teeth) with some nutheads and they laughed at me because I said this - they said I was WAY TOO sofisticated - so I'm very happy that you dive into this issue in this video - I'll make a small program (Excel or EXE-file) that calculates a diameter from the TPI - one diameter LESS THAN and one BIGGER THAN the WANTED diameter. Is the knurling wheeles always classified some TPI ?
How did you align the first pass to the second pass? Would they not overlap? Thanks for the vid! (just read the reason below! crazy how that works lol)
The knurl will index with the previous pass. I didn't do anything special to align the pattern. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Did you film this in a bus station?
"A whisker bigger" because the knurl penetrate the surface and runs at a slightly smaller diameter than your working piece. Just my thoughts on the matter.
Keep up the good work!
What would be the best knurling tool to purchase for general use?
+marmo Last Hi Marmo,
It will depend on the lathe you have and the material you plan on knurling. If you have a light machine you may need a scissor type that takes less pressure to use. If you want to knurl stainless then you will want a heavy unit. Hope this helps. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Thank you for slowly and patiently going through the math!
Uglydog
I haven't seen an RPN calculator in a very long time!
hey tom, do you have a video on you custom tool holder using 1/2 round rod?? thanks
Hi Hoffman,
Not sure what you mean here. Can you give me a time stamp in the video.
Cheers,
Tom
I just tried knurling using your method on 1" PG 304 stainless steel and a 25tpi straight knurl. The knurl starts off great but doesnt cut as deep as I move into the piece. Also if I try to start the knurl in the middle of the piece it doesnt track properly. Any suggestions or insight to what I'm doing wrong?
Hi Blank,
Stainless needs a LOT of pressure. Sounds like the tool is pushing back on you. I would suggest starting off the piece and making a couple of passes at increasing crossfeed depths. What is the diameter and length you are knurling?
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco Tom, thanks for the video and the reply. The stainless rod is 1.000 +.000/-.0005. At 3/4" long, the knurl OD measures 1.004. At the start of the knurl its measuring 1.012. With a second pass it didnt improve.
Great demonstration--Thanks!
Hey Rick,
Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Tom,
Quick question, and I'm really going to display my ignorance here: I've got a Chinese-made, combo knurling tool and tool holder that has no markings other than "250-110 China" on it. Any idea what the TPI would be?
v/r,
Rick
Rick Rose Hey Rick,
You can ink the knurls and roll them on a piece of paper and actually measure the pitch. Be sure to measure the pitch at right angles to the center of rotation of the roll. Don't use the parallel space between the angled lines. You would see pitch numbers anywhere between 12 to 80 TPI.
Cheers,
Tom
Thanks! Looks like 16TPI. I'll try to copy your demonstrated method.
Hi Tom, is the TPI calculation required for all knurl types or just the straight type? Thanks :)
Hi Alex,
The diamond knurls need to be done on certain diameters as well to come out nice. Dorian tool has a great little technical and troubleshooting guide on their website. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
cool thanks tom :) have a great night
im confused, ive only knurled a few times with a clamp type knurl tool.. i place the rollers on top center and make passes back n forth , increasing the force each pass,,,it works great. I thought that was the idea behind that type of tool to lower side force? , where as you are feeding in. Keep up the great videos
Hi Bubster,
There is more than one way to skin a job in this game. That's what makes it so interesting. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Thanks this helped me understand more, I'm trying to do a straight knurl on 360 brass with a Chinese small lathe and Little Machine Shop scissors knurl at 33 tpi, total failure first try. Some good tips so I'll try it again tomorrow after I kick a hole in the wall from getting nowhere tonite ;-)
Hi SD,
Knurling is one of those things that can make you really frustrated. That and parting cause the most grief for new to machine work folks.
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco Man, 3 days wasted, I was using some math formula print outs from another youtube video, my knurling attachment is from Little Machine Shop and the formula they give you (which isn't even posted on their knurling machine page) gives radically different results than the tables I copied, so I was doomed to failure from the beginning. So my knurls were completely covering the surface with lines closely spaced together, I think I may have ruined the 33 line knurl by trying to force into the brass too, then one of these videos said never use cutting oil on 360 brass which is probably right too. One more try this weekend and hopefully should get it this time...
Is the process the same for a diamond knurl?
Hi Christopher,
Yes the process is similar. Take a look at my video's named Seattle Press Pins for a diamond knurling demonstration.
Regards,
Tom
Yes sorry, at 2:40 and 10:50 you show a tool holder you made using round rod in place of the dovetail slots. Was just wondering if you ever went over it detail in one of you past videos
Hi Hoffman,
I did an article on my blog about it called "Skeleton Aloris holder".
Cheers,
Tom
Is there any reason why you would not want to set your Aloris tool holder to position the knurling wheels at 12 and 6 o'clock rather than 7 and 10, using the height adjustment on the tool holder to set your depth rather than the crossslide? It would certainly reduce lateral stress on your chuck/ work, etc. 2thferry
T 2thferry Hi Ferry,
This particular knurling holder moves both knurls at the same time. Setting the knurls at 12 and six would still have a fair amount of pressure on the spindle. Fortunately lathes are designed for just this kind of loading. If you noticed I don't try to screw the crossfeed in while the knurls are engaged in the cut. Rather they run in from the end of the bar. Cranking on the screw while the knurls are loaded up is generally not a good idea.
All the best,
Tom
Keep on threading!
+oxtoolco Tom, I was wondering on this pressure deal while watching, where is the point that you decide you need to use a dead or live center as more support so as not to apply pressure to the spindle bearings, seems to me any job that has to apply the pressure to cut into the material like knurling does, should always have the end supported, I am very new to this and just a small 9 X 20, but sure don't want to hurt the bearings or bend spindle,, I am learning so much by watching your videos,. thanks Jim
+jbrunson1949 Hi Jim,
I start thinking about centers when the diameter to length ratio gets above 1:3 That is a one inch shaft sticking out of your workholding three inches. If your sticking out further than that then a center is a good idea. Material also plays a part in this. Stainless would be less maybe 1:2.5 and brass could probably be a little more. Just general guidelines. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
I was taught that, once you start the knurl, you don't disengage the tool until you are done knurling so that the grooves aren't double cut. Yet, here in your video, you do exactly that. How is it that the tool realigns exactly in the grooves?
Roger Banks Hi Roger,
They do realign if given a chance. Like you when I was taught as a lad how to knurl they showed us that method. Funny thing was my knurling always looked crappy until I saw somebody else do it this way. Now my knurling looks good. Try it. I think you will like it. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
holy crap ... that chuck ... wow
EXCELENTE, apesar de que no entiendo bien el ingles, i like very much this video
Hi Jorge,
Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
where is supply??
My small program is very smart when you train knurling from the bigger diameter, turn the done knurl pattern off again and use the program to get the new (smaller) diameter !
Hi Sir please do you have videos showing surface grinding , thanks
Greetings Houm,
I don't have any video's specifically on surface grinding. I do have a couple on grinding small tools in the Deckel single lip grinder. Take a look at Andreykush's channel for some good video's on grinding,
th-cam.com/users/andreykush
He has a few good ones but you need to speak Russian to understand him.
Kind regards,
Tom
Thanks Tom
Knurling on CNC with LMT Fette rolling head and 3 knurl rolls
Bush rules! He has good music taste!
Wayyy to much math !
I made a copy of Guy Lautard's floating arm knurling tool 25 years ago and still use it on a regular basis.
Dead simple to use - center on the part - tighten the clamp nut - engage the feed.
When you are up against the chuck - stop - if the knurl needs more form, tighten the clamp nut a bit and reverse the lathe.
Fine, medium, coarse, and straight (coining) knurl - no problem, no head scratching, you just make parts.
Sorry to disagree but no math is necessary. Diameter doesn't matter as long as opposing knurls are set deep enough on the first pass. It does take a little practice to set the depth just right. The reason it's possible to get a perfect knurl on any diameter is that the knurling wheels must "slip" slightly to fit into the deep grooves made on the first rotations. If not deep enough you'll get a split or double knurl. After the initial slip the wheels will continue to track as the knurls get deeper. I use a heavy duty scissors type knurling tool with 14 pitch diamond knurls and a heavy flow of motor oil from my sump on the top wheel. One pass left to right with heavy feed and return pass right to left to starting point completes the knurl on aluminum. A few more passes are needed on mild steel but the same procedure works. The secret is setting the knurls deep enough with oil, then letting them track for a few turns before engaging the feed.
Omfg wish i spent more time in school when i was younger did you multiply by a pie see i thought a pie was what you get from the shop :).
Hey Bear,
Its not the eatin kind of pie. Some old Greek dude thought it up out of thin air thinking about zillion-a-gons
All the best,
Tom
You make the material a tad over size because the pitch diameter is about halfway down the tooth.
Your metric for stopping when you get flakes is probably correct for steel, but probably not so good with brass. Brass work hardens very rapidly, and will flake a great deal as the knurl tool rolls over the knurl. Low speed and lots of cutting oil helps float the flakes away, that or run fast enough to fling them off. Coolant or light oils like WD40 are useless.
It is also best to make the knurl in a single pass wit materials that work harden. Depth of cut should be about equal to the pitch (for a 90* knurl) + some windage for flexing of the work and tool. I would have started at about 0.045" DOC, your knurl looked incomplete to me though. Does your cross slide measure diameter? In other words, you only knurled 0.025 deep? That would explain why it look incomplete. A complete knurl is often sharp enough to be painful and requires filing or turning.
Hi Joshua,
Can't remember what depth I went to on this knurl. Why would I want to turn a knurl to deburr it? Seems like getting to the correct visual and feel are the metrics here. Knurls are generally not called out to precision diameters. Cross slide does measure diameter. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
good
Hi Jesus,
Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Mr tom i noticed you didn't have any SAFETY GLASSES ON DURING THE VIDEO thats a OSHA requirement.
Hi Francis,
How did you get that idea? Take a look at 11:31. I'm allowed to have my reading glasses on my apron and wear safety glasses. Get your facts straight. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Hi Hugh,
Get your facts straight. Look at 11:31. Reading glasses on apron. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
That chuck looks like it's 10 meters in diameter!
I am sorry to take up your time! I have some equipment, but nothing which compares upon yours! I wish it were different, but that is life.
I watched your video named "Press pin 1" & this video in which you calucaled & pressed a knurling into a work surface.
I am confused about how the mathematical result of ".8785" is useful. The mathematics, I understand! The purpose & how to use this calculation is used or what it indicates is where I got lost. Is it a machine setting?
It seems as an exercise in mathematics with no purpose.
Did I miss something?
"I don't have a inkling why I should be a whisker bigger!"
I apologize Tom, but I guess, I want to understand why. Then I am not operating from just, "That is the way it has always been done!" thinking. There was a reason for this practice to become industry accepted.
The light just shined! Praise!
This calculation is use to determine the dimension, (before knurling), the end piece, before knurling, which the work should be turned to.
Please confirm!
Tom, I see the day when the printed book is no longer offered. The video book will become the valued vehicle of educational delivery. (At least for the vocational skills. How do I . . . ).
I wonder if your book publisher has a 'video book' in their future offerings? There is a way to control editions distribution & who is entitled to access them.
Hey Roach,
The .8785 is the diameter of the round bar that will knurl with those particular knurls and not have a remainder. In knurling if there is an non whole number of teeth on the circumference of the knurled diameter it will make multiple impressions that don't line up. The 25 tpi knurls can only knurl on diameters with whole number solutions to the number of teeth around the circumference.
I just noticed your response below that it clicked. Well I'll leave this for you anyway. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco Got it! You want to knurl such that the teeth of the knurling tool land exactly in the previous depressions made by the previous revolution of the the knurling tool over the circumferential surface of the finished product. Every revolution is meant to 'marry' the teeth depressions with the previous revolution where the knurling tool made contact with the product surface.
(Not meaning a second pass over the product to make a deeper depression).
Thus the mathematics is meant to determine the dimension to 'trim' the product diameter to BEFORE knurling task commences!
Turn & cut the product to the calculated dimension before applying the knurling tool to it's surface.
A couple of comments to improve the quality of your videos (which are very helpful):
--Turn off the radio in the background. It's competing with your commentary.
--In the knurling video, nothing is in focus. Maybe you need a better camera.
Keep up the good work.
Hi Keith,
Thanks for the comment and feedback. This is a pretty early video where I was using a lower res camera. I think we have that fixed. You should check out some of the new material.
Regards,
Tom
But you HAVE TO have Microsoft Framework installed - you probably already have it installed.
I even think the DON'T like mentioning the name Microsoft !
So, even on straight knurls, you need two knurling rollers. My question is will only one roller do straight knurls? Why do you need two rollers, you are not crossing the lines to make diamond impressions...!
slad roznik Hi Slad,
You don't need two rollers to make a straight knurl. They actually sell holders for single straight knurls. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
But I have problems sending LINKS as part of these comments !
The link doesn't work, you say ... did you change the D O T to a . when you copied it to the address line of your browser ?
(We are NOT allowed to insert a link in these comments - that's why I did this D O T shit - even this message I have problems sending ... !)
Private messaging ... do you mean e-mail or ... ?
NO, no, ... I had to learn English - or sort of - to do the programing ;-)) !
No it was these Words: "DOT NET"
it didn't like !
Math, damn it! :-(
What are the odds of that, right? :-)
It's part of machining. Don't fear it.
don't say uhm !!!so much.
Leave him alone
youre too far away, cant see details
Don't lean or rest hand on Lathe! Wake Up! Please, more show and less tell.
Don’t make a video and have the radio playing in background it’s annoying, before turning radius down show me if it works on the bigger diameter, don’t need to see you turn diameter down for 3 min it’s about knurling , too many wide shots keep it close so I can see the knurling. Sorry 👎