Carrying around the tool all day I'll take the M12. I started with an M18 and quickly realized I'd be better off with a smaller tool, it does everything my M18 can, just alittle slower which is worth it
I think it really depends. If the bigger tool saves 1sec per screw and I'm driving 700screws then it's worth the small bump in weight. But with smaller screws they can often be the same speed or when it's 12 screws then the M12 is the way to go every time.
Wow, you've developed quite the cordless tool procurement habit! But I can't blame you, the brushless revolution has quickly and substantially changed the cordless tool landscape. Even 5-year-old tools seem ancient these days.
This is how I break into new hobbies! I just have to try everything there is to learn and develop preferences. Could be worse, at least it's been super productive! From built in shelves, cabinets, replacing both sets of stairs, sandbox, tons of electrical, a few pieces of furniture, plumbing and general repairs. I'm trying to only buy new tools that add capability to my current setup but I new I wanted to try these out when they were announced!
Great point there. If the 20v is almost similar in size to the m12, why add cost of another tool plus the batteries. If anyone is on m12 platform, makes sense. But eventually, even if you are on m12 platform, you still need 18v tools as a professional. It took me a while doing tons of research to finally sell my m12 Gen 3 impact driver and go with the 20v 845. Similar in size and less batteries to worry about.
For most applications I still stand by this but truthfully working overhead in floor joists or rafters is where the M12 is incredibly useful still to me. Having the battery canted back or using a small one without the “toe” makes a big difference. I do default to the 20/18V though for everything else
The M12 Surge still is more comfortable. The new Gen 3 also has too much vibration in the hand. The DCF 840 with aa powerstack is lighter than the new Gen 3 and has much more power.
Damn, Is the 840 really that light? I’ve been thinking about the 850 for size but it’s the same weight as the 887. Seen good stuff on the 840 for sure so I might have to check it out.
Same which is why I end up using the surge 90% of the time unless I’m doing a bigger job and want the lightweight and small package then I’ll grab the gen3
I’ve actually changed my tune on the M12 after using it a lot over the past year. I LOVE this thing. Its size and weight are amazing and I don’t really notice the power difference in most applications. It’s my go to for everything from pocket screws to 3-1/8” framing screws.
I use my m12 and Makita 12v impacts for deck screws that are 1 5/8" and less. For deck screws larger than that I use my Gen 3 18v impact driver. It's by far the best impact driver I've used. For lag bolts I use my mid torque and high torque Milwaukee impact wrenches.
Love having a lightweight option and a beast option like you have with the 998. I use the Gen3 M12 hammer drill almost everyday but have the DCD999 for really gettin after it
No definitely not. But Milwaukee claims 18V speed from the gen3 M12. Also there is a question of only a 1/4lb difference between the two and not that much different size so why choose the 12V tool?
I've got that Dewalt (I guess a lot of people do 😅) so the comparison worked perfect for me. BTW, not as pleased with the s30 minibugout (i mentioned before) with continued use. Inevitably a little harder task comes up and it just can't hold that edge with a more acute angle like some knives it seems or so is my impression. Feeling kninda like it's just ok now. Oh well. I know it must be busy times for you, but always glad to see a video coming even if it's straying from the sharpening stuff! Best wishes.
The Dewalt 887 is a workhorse! Thats exactly my experience with S30V too. It does technically get the job done but it just ends up lightly rolling in multiple places and the working edge isn’t enough for me. Just okay. I really should start putting out more knives and sharpening stuff but I just don’t have a lot of new to add because I haven’t had the motivation to explore. The benchmade S90V turned out exactly like we thought and I carry Maxamet or LC200N pretty much is all right now.
@@EngineersPerspective701 yeah, that was exactly the turn off for me the mild rolling in places with the s30v. Same old thing i guess, hard to beat those harder tool steels. Looks like spyderco is putting out a couple s90v paramilitaries sprints/exclusives but coated blade which I'm not really a fan of so I'll probably just hold off on that. Looking forward to the magnucut Manix2 when it comes out and maybe some of the bd1n lightweights like the one they say has thinner blade stock, might be good.
@@EngineersPerspective701 It’s my every day carry. However the trigger control on my coworker’s 12V Bosch is far superior. The M12 Surge has waaay better trigger control however.
What I'm interested in is how many screws can you shoot with a 2.0ah or 2.5ah HO battery before the battery runs out? There should be a test because I think a lot of people are interested in this issue and so am I
What screw and application are you thinking of for high volume of screws? I can tell you that I got 75 3/4” holes in pine 2x12 on a 4.0ah battery using the gen3 hammer drill. Seeing as how screws are way less demanding and impacts are much more efficient I’d give a SWAG of 100-200 3” deck screws on a 2.0ah battery
@@EngineersPerspective701 In some groups, there is talk about the 3453-20 machine having an error when the trigger is pressed and the light stays on continuously without turning off, so is there any problem with your machine?
I'm new with buying Milwaukee tools and interested in buying the M12 fuel impact driver on the home depot website but I'm confused with the generation versions. How would I know if I'm buying the M12 fuel impact driver gen1, gen2 or gen3 model? Any help would be appreciated.........
For the gen3 impact just make sure you’re buying model 3453. Anything after the hyphen relates to kits or whatever. The biggest distinguishing feature is the flat front face and lights on the gen 3.
Does the Surge Hydrolic impact have the same capabilities as the regular brushless 18v? I don’t need speed, just wondering if there’s any trade off going with the quieter model.
I don't have either 18V impact or surge. However I have both the Gen3 M12 Impact and the M12 Surge. They're actually a lot different and I adore the Surge. It is definitely NOT fast but it's very smooth, quiet and controllable. I prefer it over the regular.
@@EngineersPerspective701 Thanks for clarifying. I was thinking that an 18v impact driver might have the best power-to-size ratio for an all-around tool. Plus the quick bit change is nice. Only downside is that they can be loud to use inside, so that’s why I was looking at the hydraulic model. I have hardly any power tools at this point, so I’m looking for something that would be small, but have the power to do construction when needed.
@@EngineersPerspective701 Thanks, that makes sense… I picked up an 18v impact-hammer drill set from Metabo (which is Hitachi-made). It was such a great deal, it was hard to justify spending more for the hydrolic 18v Milwaukee. It’s also IPX rated, which is nice for some of the work I do.
@Engineer’s Perspective I just bought the tool only for 70 on amazon, the 2.0 battery was 30 separate and I already have a charger but still feel a bit jipped
Just got the impact, drill driver, three batteries a charger and bag for $213 from Home Depot. Good deal. Batteries are a bitch to get in and out though. Bad design there.
Your comparing a 20v tool with stacked lithium batteries to a 12v cylindrical lithium ion....you cant possibly compare them. The milwaukee gen 3 or 4 18v makes the 886 look like a childs toy.
You bet I can! I did it right there in the video! Joking aside, the point is that the 887 is very close in size and weight to the M12 impact while being a better performer due to that stacked lithium battery. I do see a future where 18V tools get very close to 12V in terms of size and possibly make them redundant. As for the 887 vs the M18 impacts. Absolutely the M18s are a little smaller and faster but on the job site it really is splitting hairs.
@@keysautorepair6038 I run 70% 20V Dewalt and love their ergonomics and prefer their 12V ergos over the Milwaukees too. However the diversity in the lineups made way more sense to go into the M12 lineup for myself. I love my M12 tools. According to acme’s website the 901 is the same weight as the m12 stubby
I have the 2.5s. Using the right battery is very important for power tools but for a tool that really hangs it hat on being compact, not sure the 5.0 HO makes as much sense to me
@EngineersPerspective701 bigger battery should mean more runtime but not necessarily more power. 2.5 are HO but in this test you used ordinary 2.0 yes? I mean maybe with HO higher amperage would give it more umpf.
@@pawekurek4050 bigger batteries generally mean more power as well. Power is amps x voltage. Larger batteries tend to have less voltage sag under heavy loads because they can spread the load over more cells. Type of cells and other factors play a huge role too of course!
You’re not getting 18v power but it’s like a half a second slower with way less weight 😂😂 clown shoes .. you could probably use a screw driver for the stuff you do.
No way, screw drivers are way too much work for my poor hands. I call the pros for hard work like that. Honestly it’s been my go to though. Renovating my lower level I had it in my bags the whole time because it was smaller and lighter.
Carrying around the tool all day I'll take the M12. I started with an M18 and quickly realized I'd be better off with a smaller tool, it does everything my M18 can, just alittle slower which is worth it
I think it really depends. If the bigger tool saves 1sec per screw and I'm driving 700screws then it's worth the small bump in weight. But with smaller screws they can often be the same speed or when it's 12 screws then the M12 is the way to go every time.
Wow, you've developed quite the cordless tool procurement habit! But I can't blame you, the brushless revolution has quickly and substantially changed the cordless tool landscape. Even 5-year-old tools seem ancient these days.
This is how I break into new hobbies! I just have to try everything there is to learn and develop preferences. Could be worse, at least it's been super productive! From built in shelves, cabinets, replacing both sets of stairs, sandbox, tons of electrical, a few pieces of furniture, plumbing and general repairs.
I'm trying to only buy new tools that add capability to my current setup but I new I wanted to try these out when they were announced!
Great point there.
If the 20v is almost similar in size to the m12, why add cost of another tool plus the batteries. If anyone is on m12 platform, makes sense. But eventually, even if you are on m12 platform, you still need 18v tools as a professional.
It took me a while doing tons of research to finally sell my m12 Gen 3 impact driver and go with the 20v 845. Similar in size and less batteries to worry about.
For most applications I still stand by this but truthfully working overhead in floor joists or rafters is where the M12 is incredibly useful still to me. Having the battery canted back or using a small one without the “toe” makes a big difference. I do default to the 20/18V though for everything else
The M12 Surge still is more comfortable.
The new Gen 3 also has too much vibration in the hand. The DCF 840 with aa powerstack is lighter than the new Gen 3 and has much more power.
Damn, Is the 840 really that light? I’ve been thinking about the 850 for size but it’s the same weight as the 887. Seen good stuff on the 840 for sure so I might have to check it out.
Love my m12 driver only complaint I have is it’s really loud
Same which is why I end up using the surge 90% of the time unless I’m doing a bigger job and want the lightweight and small package then I’ll grab the gen3
The dewalt is stronger and almost the same size but if you use the new 2.5 ah battery, the m12 becomes much smaller without sacrificing power.
I’ve actually changed my tune on the M12 after using it a lot over the past year. I LOVE this thing. Its size and weight are amazing and I don’t really notice the power difference in most applications. It’s my go to for everything from pocket screws to 3-1/8” framing screws.
I recommend the torque test channel , highly recommended 👌
LOVE torque test channel! Also Workshop addict and Man Caver Tools
I use my m12 and Makita 12v impacts for deck screws that are 1 5/8" and less. For deck screws larger than that I use my Gen 3 18v impact driver. It's by far the best impact driver I've used. For lag bolts I use my mid torque and high torque Milwaukee impact wrenches.
That's the way I look at it too. Up to a certain size the 12V is a total win but start talking 3" deck screws and I'm moving toward 18V
Depends the job but i ise m12 impact and 998 for hammer drill. Great gor trim work. Gonna swap my gen 2 for 3.
Love having a lightweight option and a beast option like you have with the 998. I use the Gen3 M12 hammer drill almost everyday but have the DCD999 for really gettin after it
I don't think anyone was surprised a 20v tool beat a 12v tool. A better comparison would be Milwaukee M18 Gen4 2953-20 vs DeWalt Max 20v 877.
No definitely not. But Milwaukee claims 18V speed from the gen3 M12. Also there is a question of only a 1/4lb difference between the two and not that much different size so why choose the 12V tool?
@Samuel Warner any basis for that opinion?
@Samuel Warneryou’re right that factually the M12 is smaller and lighter than the 887 and DeWalt’s parent company is Stanley Black and Decker
Dewalt makes the lightest 20v tool in the game. No doubt the Gen4 Milwaukee would spank it however in weight comparison Dewalt is much lighter
I've got that Dewalt (I guess a lot of people do 😅) so the comparison worked perfect for me.
BTW, not as pleased with the s30 minibugout (i mentioned before) with continued use. Inevitably a little harder task comes up and it just can't hold that edge with a more acute angle like some knives it seems or so is my impression. Feeling kninda like it's just ok now. Oh well.
I know it must be busy times for you, but always glad to see a video coming even if it's straying from the sharpening stuff! Best wishes.
The Dewalt 887 is a workhorse!
Thats exactly my experience with S30V too. It does technically get the job done but it just ends up lightly rolling in multiple places and the working edge isn’t enough for me. Just okay.
I really should start putting out more knives and sharpening stuff but I just don’t have a lot of new to add because I haven’t had the motivation to explore. The benchmade S90V turned out exactly like we thought and I carry Maxamet or LC200N pretty much is all right now.
@@EngineersPerspective701 yeah, that was exactly the turn off for me the mild rolling in places with the s30v. Same old thing i guess, hard to beat those harder tool steels.
Looks like spyderco is putting out a couple s90v paramilitaries sprints/exclusives but coated blade which I'm not really a fan of so I'll probably just hold off on that. Looking forward to the magnucut Manix2 when it comes out and maybe some of the bd1n lightweights like the one they say has thinner blade stock, might be good.
@@EngineersPerspective701 so another video on the s90v coming out then?
The drive on the previous gen fuel impact is definitely not something I enjoy when working on cabinet hinge screws, or similar small fasteners. ☹️
You use the gen3 much? I never used it much because it wasn't really my jam either
@@EngineersPerspective701 It’s my every day carry. However the trigger control on my coworker’s 12V Bosch is far superior. The M12 Surge has waaay better trigger control however.
Any comparison between dewalts 850 vs m12 fuel 3453-20?
I wish. I don’t have one though…… yet
What I'm interested in is how many screws can you shoot with a 2.0ah or 2.5ah HO battery before the battery runs out? There should be a test because I think a lot of people are interested in this issue and so am I
What screw and application are you thinking of for high volume of screws?
I can tell you that I got 75 3/4” holes in pine 2x12 on a 4.0ah battery using the gen3 hammer drill. Seeing as how screws are way less demanding and impacts are much more efficient I’d give a SWAG of 100-200 3” deck screws on a 2.0ah battery
@@EngineersPerspective701
In some groups, there is talk about the 3453-20 machine having an error when the trigger is pressed and the light stays on continuously without turning off, so is there any problem with your machine?
No such issue with mine. Always reliable
I prefer the my m12 impact over my xr impact.
Just for weight savings? I think I might change my tune once I get some 2.5 HO batteries. Get the better performance at lower weight and size
I'm new with buying Milwaukee tools and interested in buying the M12 fuel impact driver on the home depot website but I'm confused with the generation versions. How would I know if I'm buying the M12 fuel impact driver gen1, gen2 or gen3 model? Any help would be appreciated.........
For the gen3 impact just make sure you’re buying model 3453. Anything after the hyphen relates to kits or whatever. The biggest distinguishing feature is the flat front face and lights on the gen 3.
@@EngineersPerspective701 So are both of these models gen3: Milwaukee 3453-20 and Milwaukee 3453-22?
@@wallacelawson9027 yes. The “-20” means it’s a bare tool and the “-22” means a kit.
@@EngineersPerspective701 Thank you very much.....
Does the Surge Hydrolic impact have the same capabilities as the regular brushless 18v? I don’t need speed, just wondering if there’s any trade off going with the quieter model.
I don't have either 18V impact or surge. However I have both the Gen3 M12 Impact and the M12 Surge.
They're actually a lot different and I adore the Surge. It is definitely NOT fast but it's very smooth, quiet and controllable. I prefer it over the regular.
@@EngineersPerspective701 Thanks for clarifying. I was thinking that an 18v impact driver might have the best power-to-size ratio for an all-around tool. Plus the quick bit change is nice. Only downside is that they can be loud to use inside, so that’s why I was looking at the hydraulic model. I have hardly any power tools at this point, so I’m looking for something that would be small, but have the power to do construction when needed.
@@FreedomFox1 if you don’t have many tools then get the standard impact because it’s more versatile unless you’re very nose constrained
@@EngineersPerspective701 Thanks, that makes sense… I picked up an 18v impact-hammer drill set from Metabo (which is Hitachi-made). It was such a great deal, it was hard to justify spending more for the hydrolic 18v Milwaukee. It’s also IPX rated, which is nice for some of the work I do.
99 dollars at home depot for m12 tool battery and charger. Not sure how long deal will last
Absolute steal
What size battery
@@Boojyman I think it was a 2.0
@Engineer’s Perspective I just bought the tool only for 70 on amazon, the 2.0 battery was 30 separate and I already have a charger but still feel a bit jipped
Just got the impact, drill driver, three batteries a charger and bag for $213 from Home Depot. Good deal. Batteries are a bitch to get in and out though. Bad design there.
Your comparing a 20v tool with stacked lithium batteries to a 12v cylindrical lithium ion....you cant possibly compare them. The milwaukee gen 3 or 4 18v makes the 886 look like a childs toy.
You bet I can! I did it right there in the video!
Joking aside, the point is that the 887 is very close in size and weight to the M12 impact while being a better performer due to that stacked lithium battery. I do see a future where 18V tools get very close to 12V in terms of size and possibly make them redundant.
As for the 887 vs the M18 impacts. Absolutely the M18s are a little smaller and faster but on the job site it really is splitting hairs.
thanks for the video.. did you find the m12 impact to be quieter than the 887?
no one ever talks about the grip on the m12 its not as nice as the 18v tools
I do hear it mentioned plenty. I definitely prefer the M18 grip but honestly the M12 doesn't bother me with large to XL hands.
If u sell the m12 I'll buy it
I'll keep you in mind.
This is actually Gen 4
The M18 ones are gen 4
@@EngineersPerspective701 thanks for clarification
Just bought the 3453-20 and it’s heavy and the handle absolutely sucks.
Heavy? Not sure what impacts you’re used to using brother.
I can see the handle but the M12 grip and my hand are mates
@@EngineersPerspective701 Use the dewalt 12v no comparison dcf902 you will never use a Milwaukee again
@@keysautorepair6038 I run 70% 20V Dewalt and love their ergonomics and prefer their 12V ergos over the Milwaukees too. However the diversity in the lineups made way more sense to go into the M12 lineup for myself. I love my M12 tools.
According to acme’s website the 901 is the same weight as the m12 stubby
Maybe try new HO battery
I have the 2.5s. Using the right battery is very important for power tools but for a tool that really hangs it hat on being compact, not sure the 5.0 HO makes as much sense to me
@EngineersPerspective701 bigger battery should mean more runtime but not necessarily more power. 2.5 are HO but in this test you used ordinary 2.0 yes? I mean maybe with HO higher amperage would give it more umpf.
@@pawekurek4050 bigger batteries generally mean more power as well. Power is amps x voltage. Larger batteries tend to have less voltage sag under heavy loads because they can spread the load over more cells. Type of cells and other factors play a huge role too of course!
You’re not getting 18v power but it’s like a half a second slower with way less weight 😂😂 clown shoes .. you could probably use a screw driver for the stuff you do.
No way, screw drivers are way too much work for my poor hands. I call the pros for hard work like that.
Honestly it’s been my go to though. Renovating my lower level I had it in my bags the whole time because it was smaller and lighter.