Muzzleloading, What Patch Works?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 ก.ย. 2024
- I am shooting Hawkenstein. im trying to find what patch combination works.#blackpowder #muzzleloading #muzzleloading
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A good day at the range.
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I think you may be onto the issue. I'd buy a few .495 balls and try before I bought a new mold. I started in the early 80s with a .54 T/C Renegade. My Maxi Balls and lube also were from T/C. I put a kit on it to use 209 shotgun primers for better ignition. It was deadly accurate out as far as those old irons would allow. I just have to believe you may have some "down the barrel" wiggle going on. You also might try NOT cleaning between every shot just to see what it would do. As always, though, the BEST WAY to do it is....... the way YOU like to do it! Go get'm!!!
Try using a larger powder charge. I have a TC and shoot 90g and I group better than lower charges.
I do it too. I started doing it to make sure the nipple is clear, so the next shot I can have confidence that it will go off.
I always wash my ticking before using, works better for me, takes lube much better as well.
I never used a patch with maxi balls, just lube the grooves
I agreed tha 90 grain charge is better but also the Side have to be little Higher so you can hit lower
T/C barre are machine made by pulling a carbide button type cutter through the bore that makes shallow grooves.
Your patch needs to be thick enough to fill the grooves and take up the space between the lands and the ball.
15 thousands thick cotton fabric will do nicely. I like pillow ticking fabric from Wal-Mart. The kind with the blue lines woven into it.
I wash it with a little soap and no bleach then I dry it in a hot dryer to tighten the weave.
Then try different sizes balls until you find one that loads easy enough so you don't have to pound it down the bore.
I start with one grain per caliber and by 1.5 grains per caliber usually find good accuracy and enough power for woods hunting on white-tails.
As for lube, if your bore is polished smooth and clean you don't have to use any ube at all for hunting.
Try dry patches and go up five grains at a time until you start to get burn through of you patches. If you don't think you have enough power then use a lube.
Soak your patches in lube then let them air dry .
I have tried many kinds of lube. I like just enough olive oil to saturate the patch. Olive oil will go rancid in a few months and weaken the fabric so I just make up enough to last for a month.
Lard is good lube too. Same as olive oil.
Some kind of organic oil with a little beeswax melted into it is good too.
Try some 495s in that barrel.
Thanks for the video.
I gifted my husband a Thompson Center Renegade in 1985. He has the booklet for it still. He says do not shoot plastic in the barrel as it will foul the grooves (per the booklet). Also, 80 grains of 2FG was the most accurate with a round ball (per booklet) and 90 grains with a maxi ball (per booklet). It also says if the patch fits too loosely, the ball will not spin and it's flight will be unstable.. if the patches vary in thickness, or manner of loading, or the amount of lubricant they carry, shot to shot stability and accuracy will be affected. You probably already know all of that...if you are interested I could try scanning the booklet, 39 pages but I can scan 2 at a page so half that, and send to you. This came with his muzzleloader. Just trying to help, no hollering here!
Enjoy all your videos, glad your mom is out of the hospital,get a red scotch pad and run it through the barrel about 100 strokes to polish the rifleing,load a patch first down on the powder then your80 patched ball, try 80grains 2f, that works for me since about the early 1970,also measure patch thickness big difference between the accuracy from 15,,,18 ,,,20 thousands,maby also try 75 grains 3f, good luck,,Jeff
I agree with others. Looks like the right track. But I'd definitely buy some Hornaday .495 swaged round balls. They're more uniform than cast. And would probably give the best possible outcome.
Keep up the good work and God Bless!
There is nothing wrong with blowing down a black powder barrel. A lot of BP cartridge guys have a "blow tube" for their rifles. It helps keep the fouling moist between shots. Might want to make a blow tube. Just thinking safety brother😉
Hey Justin!
This was a lot of fun to watch! Uncle S. is a reliable source... and has the experience to back it up! I am glad to see that you're making progress on getting the groupings tighter. Keep after it and victory will be yours. 'Bout the only variable that can't be corrected is the loose screw behind buttplate! Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha! But, we ALL have to deal with that to one degree or another! You take care and I'll see you down the Trail!
Mr. Martin, I cracked up about that "loose screw behind the buttplate" :) That was a good one! Some of us don't just have a loose screw.... Most of mine are plum stripped out!
@@tommylitchfield3450 Hey Tommy! I will admit that some of mine don't grip as tight as they used to! I don't think that it is Old Age... as much as outliving the implied warranty! Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!
@@martinmeltzer2696 I didn't even GET a warranty atall, but that don't stop them teleprompters from callin me and offerin to sell me an extended one for my noggin contents
@@martinmeltzer2696 Hey, at least you got an Implied Warranty. When I was hatched out, the doc took one look at me and automatically stamped "Warranty Void" right acrost my forehead! But that still don't keep them teleprompters from callin me durn near ever day and tryin to sell me an Extended Warranty...
Have you ever watched the guy on the Everything Black Powder channel? I know he mostly experiments with his homemade powder but his shots seem to be pretty consistent. You may be able to get some hints from him about loads, patch size etc..
Ol Jake is on to some real good homemade BP. Been watching him since he started. Everything bp great info.
Take a micrometer to the cloth store and measure the cloth. In those looser barrels I have used 100%cotton denim for patching. I used old blue jeans, however you have to check them for thickness to get consistency. Denim holds up well to heavy powder charges and you can use your .490 balls that way. It's a bit easier to load than a large ball and thin patch.
Shooting 100 yards is tough....no matter what anyone says.....you got sun and shadow dancing on your front sight.....more fun to shoot 49 rto 60 yards....i see one guy on UTube shoots 480 in his 50 at 20 yards all day noloading problems. Just fun....originally Hawkins had a 1 in 48 twist...they had no complaints.....se Idaho lewis channel...he is a sticler for consistency in loading and gets some spectacular results with his TC hawks and renegade.....personally i stay at 50 to 75 yards..that big front site covers alot of the target.....enjoy
I blow the embers out of my barrel too. Did it at a public range one time, and the guy next to me nearly had a heart attack. I tried to explain what i was doing and how the fact that the gun fired and is smoking clearly indicated it was empty but he just couldn't wrap his mind around it. Oh well ill keep doing it and ill keep my eyebrows.
Don’t feel bad I was at a muzzleloader club for the first time I visited and I scolded because I put a clean patch in my mouth a spit patch.
The guy said why are you putting that in your mouth you don’t know where that patch has been. LOL😂
Just in time it's Frankenstein😊
I had a big difference in group with a .01 vs 015 patch. Also I misunderstood my powder measure and was using 125 grains of powder instead of 80. I think I am closer now
I have a little brass box. I keep patches, balls and lube in the box all mixed together.
Have you tried putting a felt wad between your powder and patch. I tried that and found i have much better accuracy because the wad is protected as the powder only burns the wad. Enjoy the videos. Remember the journey is part ot the process on these old guns and thats the reason i still like to fool with them.
Justin I went thru all those same issues many years ago. The old smokepoles are cool looking and nostalgic, but wounding an animal due to poor performance of a primitive weapon is not an option. Swabbing between shots is good but use rubbing alcohol instead of water! And a brass brush. IMO Goex is too nasty never liked it. Tamping the rod was done with smoothbores and a nice firm push till it stops is best. If it's not seated all the way it could misfire. I went to an inline with a scope with 209 primers 3 Whitehot pellets and Federal borelok bullets and hit the kill zone at 100 yards Everytime. The old smokepole looks cool hanging on the wall but iron sites on deer at distance aren't precise especially in lowlight conditions. I don't expect you to agree with none of this but this is how I do it. Got er 👍 done.
@@randybeeson3424 you not wrong. Its harder to do than most folks think. Im not gonna shoot past 100 with this as most of our woods are thick anyway. Its a step up from archery . My whole think is if we lost the ability to buy ammunition black powder can be made so that is my reason for doing to begin with . The fact its what the mountain men used and dressing in buckskin is fun is a bonus but im with you on the wounded deer part and that is why i didnt hunt with it last year. Before i shoot my inline i load the 45/70 with black powder
@@SpiritoftheOutdoors I fully understand why your looking to bring back the old smokepole making powder and balls in a pinch. I went the route of having more 22 ammo than I'd ever need a long with a bunch of legholds and conibears. I prep for hard times that are coming as you do. When our grid gets sabotaged and diesel pumps no longer fill food trucks it's gonna be survival of the fittest friend. God help us all.
I have a 35 Whelen acting like that!
Just a suggestion, have you ever tried the sabot rounds in there to just see what they do. I know those are not what you want to shoot because you are trying to stay with traditional ammo. Just a suggestion my friend.
@@richardt6277 not yet . I may try some if i dont make any progress
@@SpiritoftheOutdoors Like just a suggestion. May want to use a set of micrometers and check the barrel. You know yourself if it's factory made there could be some variation. I shoot sabots in mine the groupings are pretty good. I have an older t/c inline muzzleloader.
Don’t let anyone fool you those high twist rate kit rifles will flat out shoot when you figure out your load
Justin, I think you need more powder 70-80 grain, use 1 patch of pillow, with maxi. Low powder charge has always been inconsistent mostly. I sent ya a link to Idaho Lewis, his set up might work, I have heard good things on the sights he uses as well, made here in Michigan, most importantly to put that animal done in 1 shot. Also goex is not best powder, Swiss or shutzen beter, but homemade is gonna be it if things go sideways, and Jake from everything black powder is the man who has it fine tuned. Mind u gotta have an open mind , or we never learn. Good luck you'll get there.
And pre cut patching is more consistent. 100 pcs of the thickness of your liking is worth it cost is $7.99-13 .
Been down this road stick with the round ball.when I shot the saboted bullets they were tumbling at 50 yrds
@@charlesrock7770 i just gotta find that sweet combination every rifle likes. Its frustrating yet fun all at the same time.
I think that table is causing some of that it's wobbling pretty good
@@geneallday8683 not till the shot is over
@@SpiritoftheOutdoors Look at the footage in slow motion looks mighty wobbly
@@geneallday8683 the table needs rebuilding whether its the problem or not and i plan to do that . I didnt have time. To build it right last year and knew the legs wouldn’t last so i didnt brace them
Look at your fired patches look for cuts by the rifling too tight look for burn through too loose
@@randallross7683 they are all going in that pond. I set up there to prevent one from catching the woods on fire
Swab with a dri patch after 2 shots
Increase your powder charge by 5 grains and try again.
Use that barrel as a trotline weight and get another one. Or better buy a traditions St Loius hawken kit and build it on the show. Thanks
@@tophat8190 probably gonna build one like my poor boy.
Justin that stringing has nothing to do with patching i would say your problem lay between a bad barrel or the bedding of the barrel.
Order some .495 round balls before you order a mould. If those were cast balls, were you making sure to put the sprue up?
@@UncleSasquatchOutdoors no i had cleaned them all so you dont see it so i wouldnt have to hunt it when im in the woods
Try some denim patches (old blue jeans)
They are about .035 thickness
Also as someone else said try some .495 balls
@@craigcook1571 i do think thicker is the key here. The other goes down the barrel to easy
@@SpiritoftheOutdoors I’m fixing to try both the denim patches and .495 ‘s in my Kibler.
Cut up an old pair of jeans into patches today.
You might also try an over powder patch and then your patch and ball. Some people swear by it
I’m not a professional by far on muzzles loaders. But I always tamp my load in my barrel, and I don’t have any issues doing it. So I take it, we shouldn’t do that? Why is that it’s a no no? Just curious….
@@davidthomas2126 i dont know honestly. I get people telling me not to do about everything i do lol
At 9:02 sounded like a Bigfoot yelling in the background
@@Cannonbawlz he may be out there
I thought the same thing! 😂
@@rodneydunaway2945 If anything sounds like them, it's that! Maybe he's got some wild neighbors IDK 😆
Range rod!
I ain't even watched past 12 minutes and I already see that you're doin it wrong... You're usin a sand bag... What you need is a old pillow to prop your rifle on. :) Now, Imma watch the rest of the video :) Edit: You cooking with gas with them thick patches! And you KNOW she don't like long bullets. Progress! On a side note, it was stringin shots vertically at the start, so it's possible that your rear sight could be loose in the adjuster. It looks like an adjustable sight, so there is a spring inside. It is possible that it may be faulty. If it is adjustable and it's not bottomed out, you should be able to push down on the sight blade and it should come right back up. If there is corrosion under it, and the sight does not move freely, if you put pressure on the sight, by touching it or laying it down on the sandbag or going in a gun case or something, then it won't return to the same place and that will affect your zero. Push down on it and see if it feels gritty or like it's binding. It may just need a squirt of oil. And it could be loose in the dovetail. I have a tale to tell about a rear sight that got whacked one time...
@@tommylitchfield3450 ill check that sight.
I think you got a bad barrel.
Thompson use to have lifetime warranty on there barrels.
I sent one back before and got a new barrel but I dont know what they think about hawkenstin
Hey bud check out Mr Johnny Walker Alaska Awfuls a great Christian man and wealthy of knowledge on muzzle loaders. He’s a good friend and blackpowder mentor for me. He also built me an East Tenn special in 50 flintlock.
You should make more chicken vidoes!!!
@@kkhelton4462 im trying to get rid of most of them
@@SpiritoftheOutdoors what state are you in I may want to buy one If your interested in that sort of thing.
whens yalls deer season start
@@longbowbanjoAL week before thanksgiving i think
@@SpiritoftheOutdoors deer in general or just muzzleloader
@@longbowbanjoAL i think archery is october 1st and primitive weapon is November 11
Do you have a po. Box?
@@cory8791 i should tomorrow
@@cory8791 it is P.O. Box 144 Philadelphia MS 39350
Swaying your problem stop and your problem will go away
You prodably got something working for you but dont kbow it because you are changing up too much😢
I think you’re pulling your shots. 🪖🧐🍦
@@allenwalker307 😂