How Toxic Are WoW Players vs FFXIV? | Asmongold Reacts to Zepla
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 ส.ค. 2024
- Who's got the most toxic community!? Which game is more friendly!? What is the best game!? Is Wow dead ?! DAE ffxiv good? !? Asmongold watches Zepla answer every question in the universe about Final Fantasy XIV and WoW.
Original Video:
Zepla compares toxic players in FFXIV and WoW
• Zepla compares toxic p...
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i remember doing a heroic dungeon in wrath with no gems in any of my gear. one of the guys in my party called me a fuckin idiot and traded me 3k gold and told me to "buy some fuckin gems for christ sake." it was the nicest thing anyone had ever done for me in my entire time playing wow
Aggressively rude yet nice people are some of my favorite people I have ever encountered in MMOs
@@mjshorty101 lol same
See a lot of this in classic it’s refeshing retail not so much lol
sounds like my mom
Yea it's just the fact that never happened.
So I play League of Legends and FF14 regularly. In one match (about 30 minutes) of average daily league I experience more toxicity than in my 2 years of FF combined. It's actually insane.
In league there’s at least a matchmaking system so if someone’s being toxic you know they’re stuck in the same trash ELO as you so what do they know. but yeah it’s mad toxic and people who can’t handle losing shouldn’t play it (or any competitive online game cos you’ll always lose 50% of the time)
I mean that's league tho. I've been In discord calls where 4 generally nice people turn into savage monsters minutes into a game of league.
@@pete5516 so I only know low gold-low diamond Elo currently(last 3 years) and the most toxic people BY FAR are high Plat that can't get into Dia.
@@gokuby I've been playing league from plat-challenger since season 3, can confirm the most toxic players ever are in high plat. Its not even close lmao, people thinking gold/silver is toxic have no idea, and it actually gets much better in dia-challenger, you still get your occasional assholes, but the player pool is much more civilized than plat
@@prettyunicorn261 Oh yeah, as someone who's only gotten to high plat I completely agree. It's part of the reason I gave up going for diamond. I'm sure that's primarily one of the biggest reasons its so toxic, with diamond being a notable peak for your casual, everyday player and everyone getting on edge while trying to get there. The opposite for me though was high gold into plat, the general atmosphere I experienced was the most chill crowd outside of ARAMs and custom games.
In Endwalker MSQ, I was doing the 89 trial and about 4 of the players couldn't figure out how to stay alive. Unfortunately, two of those were healers. I was but a lowly dragoon also learning this fight, so I spent a decent portion of my time on the ground as well. However, I learned all the mechanics by around 20 minutes in.
45 minutes in after wiping yet again, one of the DPS says "healer, why didn't you LB3? we might've killed it" (LB3 was up and 5 people were dead). The healer goes "If you wanted to clear you should've gone to party finder, I'm here to practice". Party finder, to complete an MSQ trial all of us queued for. Long story short, we all left after that DPS decided this wasn't worth his time. Thanks for eating the penalty random dude!
When someone says something like "it's just practice", it reminds me of this special hour of hell several months ago. From when a healer absolutely refused to get better and used practice as an excuse. Don't be that guy.
The Mother crystal? Did that shit with the Trust, on my Reaper was honestly not that hard and the mechanics weren't horrible either.
damnn i also had a crap experience with a healer the other day, except they refused to heal and when asked to 'healers, please focus on healing over dps' when we kept wiping, they go: ''you dont pay for my sub" like they have the right of it lmao
I have to disagree there. It's 1) MSQ 2) Your retelling of this story doesn't include you guys giving advice. Did you really give some ? Were you just remarking how bad he played ? There's a difference. Also think of the wording you use. If your "advice" sounds like a command, it's not an advice, it's straight up patronizing. As lame as it sounds, add smileys to state your non-hostile intentions.
Know that story + MSQ + tool tip do not given enough info to increase your skill. Regardless if you managed it to find it in 20 min yourself. He wasn't totally in the wrong when he said to look for party finder to clear. Randoms duty finder encompass everyone.
@@JaB9999 1) we gave advice
2) this is a required duty to complete MSQ. It's not hard once you know mechanics.
3) ya know what they say about assumptions.
Surprising how my second group of randos completed it first pull. Weird amirite.
He was completely in the wrong. Their excuse for refusing to LB3 wasn't "I forgot" or "I didn't think about it". It was to immediately shift blame on 7 other people who wanted to complete their quest. We were supposed to use party finder to get a completion group for a non-extreme trial! How silly of us!
No. GTFO.
@@SaintSchield I'm questioning it because you definitely seem hostile regardless. So, your "version" might've not been what really happened.
If you gave advices, you didn't specify it in your text. That "advice" may have been worded out poorly. And it being MSQ doesn't mean that it's easy for everyone. Call me out if you want, but I still have troubles with normal content.
Last but not least, referring to your previous text, why are you asking "why didn't you LB3 ?" What answers did you expect ? Just say something like "hey, healer, don't forget LB3 next time :) ask for help if needed" and I can guarantee you people will be more willing to learn.
Works the same in real life office/work situations
I don't play either of these games but I come here for asmond saying "ohh my gawddd"
Asmond
Yes
and "what the fuck!"
I need him to say “he on xgames modeeeee”
From my experience oftentimes in Final Fantasy people use the environment of all-inclusiveness as a shield to do what ever they want. There are negatives to both sides.
Definitely, it really isn't uncommon to see people abuse the generosity of the community and the specifics of the rules to do whatever they want and sometimes even get someone else punished, by baiting for a "toxic" reaction and then reporting. The overall community is great but I've met my fair share of genuinely toxic and petty people that just hide behind passive-aggressiveness and a guise of "positivity."
I know exactly what you're talking about and that is huge problem with so called "tolerant" folks today. Haven't seen it in FF yet myself tho
Yeah I think the ffxiv community somewhat suffers from toxic positivity.
@@omarcomming722 Yeah, people non-stop mischaracterize competitiveness and trash talk as "toxicity" when it's just a part of the process.
@@d0tline468 I think that depends a lot on context. I know people who greet each other with "hey asshole", but greeting a stranger on the street the same way is unacceptable.
People you meet in online matchmaking are by all intents and purposes strangers in a public place, and the same standard of conduct applies until you build a rapport.
if you aren't gonna help the raid team or listen to advice they give you, you are the problem
Also i feel like people take getting kicked way more seriously than they should. Worst case scenario you find another group and do it with them like why are you acting like they killed your entire family?
Snowflakes gonna be insulted at anything. People are too entitled these days
@@Oxenia01that made me frustrated just looking at this convo and the fact he didnt get kicked
theres alot of people who play team games that dont want to listen. For me example, playing league on and off telling someone they shud play passive or back off will label you as toxic and will immediately int or full mute you. I played WoW as well and i feel like WoW players dnt even argue they will just kick you take it as you wish if thats toxic or not but i find it fair. People put their keys on the line with randoms or their hr or so doing raids; u have to meet expectations of the group or just find another casual group.
Bro i hate This new fragile bs. Back then if you came without Food Flask etc your mom dad and whole Family got insultet. And then next time you came with extra buffs. Nowdays if you say anything to anybody it’s hatecrime Or whatever. I fk cant Wait until this new horseS Generation comes to Power and „hatecrime“ etc will be jail Time, then i will leave my job, and just Report the whole Internet 24/7 for Everything god Damn i fk hate it Nowdays. Too Bad im too Poor to buy some big weapons and kill humanity.
True
Had a guy that insisted he didnt need his tank stance in FF14.
Vote kick went fast, he could not keep aggro at all.
I can't even imagine this mindset, even back to pre-Shadowbringers days when stance swapping was the norm.
I've seen someone say the same thing. It's literally "I forgot to put my stance on and I'm too proud to admit my mistake".
Lol I could not imagine the thought process, it’s one button that you press at the beginning of dungeon/raid, like even if you really think you didn’t need it why not just press the button when everyone’s asking you to. Why get kicked instead of just doing the reasonable thing. The only thing I could imagine is it’s like some new player and it’s their 2nd or third time tanking and the healer let them down last match or they over pulled, so they don’t want to turn on stance in fear that they’ll Afro and die, at which point just be dps
Its 1 button. They deserve to be kicked
I've definitely seen some dickheads and "you don't pay my sub" types in FF14... these people exist everywhere... but I agree with Asmon that the hostility is kinda the default in a lot of WoW. There are also some people in FF14 who use the noob-friendly atmosphere as a shield to not be a basic team player in content because they know no one can tell them to fuck off. Not a lot of them, but I've definitely seen it.
Tanks and melees are usually the ones i see the most being these types, personnally
This entire thing is just stupid. It should not have to even be a video, its pathetic how ridiculous people look to be offended grow the fuck up!
one of the reasons I keep my crown on even though it opens me up to a lot of negative shit... I can see it, you can see it, we all can see it. This adds pressure on me to keep playing to the best of my ability, because I'm going to get judged to shit if I dont, I kinda like that. True though, I've seen what you pointed out plenty of times
xIV good, wow bad
It's entirely up the individual.
Any time we have a "you don't pay my sub, so I don't have to even attempt pulling my weight" people in groups, we just reply with "Yeah and you don't pay ours, so we won't carry you" followed with a kick.
Imma keep it 55th street Custer, I haven’t encountered a single person in FFXIV that I’d consider toxic lmao. Nothing but nice people really. I like me some toxicity but I haven’t seen any of it.
On Hood !!!!
Same. I have played FFXIV about two years and i have never encountered to toxic person. Everyone always talks here: "Dude, FFXIV players are so toxic🤡" but where are all the toxic players? 😅 I can't see anyone anywhere?! 😂😂
Not really toxic, but I have come across quite a few creepy guys in game, more so than others. Not sure why that is. Toxic though, definitely not.
@@MegaAndyGG honestly, its just the FF14 twitter community. then again, its twitter.
Foshitsho
To quote someone:
“Other games expect basic competence, FFXIV is pleasantly surprised by it. Other games have toxic elitism. FFXIV has toxic casualism.”
Oh absolutely, the most toxic people you come across in raid is casuals, they expect everything to be handed to them on a silver platter and everyone else is the problem and not them.
True
In the words of the man, "Big true."
I couldnt play a game like that lol , if your bad gtfo
It's true, however. I do prefer how nice and helpful people are when you ask a question or fail at something a few times. Instead of the typical "LOL you fucking suck, bro!!!" They actually say "hey when this happens make sure you're here and not here". I always make it a point to watch boss guides before I do anything in FF14 because I was a HC wow raider years ago and I just hate failing a group of people, but some fights in FF are long and have a ton to remember, so I'm glad people are patient when I'm sucking.
The way I see it. If someone doesn't want ot use food or pots for ENDGAME content then they don't have to, but at the same time, I dont have to play with that person either.
Leave the instance, kick, find someone new. It's the only solution.
if your dps sucks and you don't know mechanics food doesnt make that much of a difference.
@@flygonkerel781 HP diff is huge though lol, as even Asmon knows from playing only ARR and HW EX/savage. In terms of prog, it's not about the damage buff at all. And it's a huge misconception that the HP buffer "doesn't matter".
I've cleared this entire tier and the three before it, so I'm still considered a zoomer compared to the ARR/HW/StB vets.
But I've played a lot as both DPS and healer, and it's CRAZY how often somebody just barely lives through a mechanic with
I was the most annoying tank in WoW when I played. I was not very good at english back then, so I played a tank up until level 70 without knowing what "Aggro" was. Some people I played with must've been so annoyed with me.
I was your healer, thanks for that
@@nillywilly2176 I'm so very sorry...
She doesn't even notice who was being toxic in the FF14 example just because he was the first one to say the word toxic. You don't have to be vulgar to be uncivil. Being obstinate and stubborn no matter how eloquently, can also show lack of civility.
yea and honestly that's usually as bad as it gets on ff14 from my experience which is like nothing like WoW lol.
I played WoW for over 12 years and have played FFXIV for 6+ years. In my experience, WoW players are much more outwardly toxic. The general mindset of the community is more negative, the relationship that the community has w/ Blizz is usually hostile, and Blizz also doesn't do a very good job of moderating & handling toxic behavior in public channels like Trade and LFG. FFXIV also has its fair share of toxicity, but it's not as in-your-face. The general vibe of the community is more positive, the relationship between the community and the devs is friendly, and SE also does a better job of stamping out toxicity when it's reported.
Having a good relationship between the community and dev team is what makes all the difference imo. If people are generally happy with a game and its team, that automatically creates a more positive, welcoming atmosphere.
Bullshit comment of the year
Whoever typed “wow players have shorter fuzes but smell the bull shit faster” stated the most based thing I’ve read in 2022.
Trueing
WOW really the most based thing ever? You must be really based to recognize that... Just kidding! lol truth man...
@@IKIGAIofficial Which while admirable isn't always beneficial.
there are a lot of ff players that see the bs but just deal with it in a more respectful and reasonable way
Having just gotten into Extreme/Savage the other day, the fact they let me start as main tank for a fight I had yet to beat was really nice of the rest of the team, and unlike the Red mage in the vid, I was more receptive to the food buff thing since I want to learn, not regress in skill
Thank you. Hope you enjoy it ^^
I have been enjoying it quite a bit, I enjoy that feeling of working my way up to that clear for a boss, like yesterday where I spent an hour and and a half learning the Extreme of the ShB final boss before our group beat it, it was so much fun
@@thebrave9971 that's such a good fight, feels like a savage fight tbh lol congrats.
People will often let less experienced players MT because they need the experience more.
I’ve been playing WoW since 2005 and I can say that the community doesn’t exist anymore. People are HORRIBLE. They’re rude and do whatever they can to piss off the other players.
I started FF14 recently and I’m blown away by how nice everybody is. How they’re willing to help.
On WoW if you ask for help you get insulted. :/
Just need a guild. Pugs and trade have been toxic since classic
@@MrVengeancenzsas yeah that's the problem. I don't have to be in a guild to be treated like a human being in ff14.
2:00 Ive encountered shit like this in wow too. Only in specific scenarios though, like friends of officers.
9:35 dont even think that guy was coming around, that dude was just like "to me it was aggressive and what matters is what i think"
Wow toxic is like disagreeing with someone and they tell you to go die in a ditch, maybe they pay rogues on the other faction to hunt you.
FFXIV toxic tends to be like "educate yourself, you dont pay my sub".
Neither is worse/better
BUT I see toxic people far more often in wow than ffxiv.
I have played ff for 3 years and had maybe 6 toxic encounters, when i came back for tbc i had 10 in the first week lol
Yeah agreed I don’t think he realised his mistake and the ‘move on now’ was just him sulking after everyone agrees he’s wrong
From personnal experience, WoW toxicity was very generic, but happened more often and FFXIV toxicity was more aggressive and went way overboard (but was less common)
@@SheinelI I dunno man, you ever been mentally tortured by your guild master because you forgot consumes in classic? I sure have.
Yeah I think Zepla misread that for sure lol.
Purple was not going to food and he was going to continue to grief the healers and he was aggressive about it. But eventually he realized that literally nobody in the party except his own friend (Red) agreed with him, so he didn't want to talk about it anymore. He didn't realize the error of his ways at all.
He just feels empowered to be a shithead and have the FFXIV GMs pat his head and take his side if he cries foul for any reason.
Any paradigm of moderating an MMO community has its ups and downs. Of course I would definitely agree that FF's method has led to a largely positive experience for everyone, but the downsides are still worth talking about as well. Don't enable bad behavior. Teach your friends to do better. If you're Red and that's your friend acting like a clown, just encourage a reasonable response from him instead. It's not that hard.
Yeah I havent encountered any real toxicity in FF in 2 years, those "snowflake" people tend to be retaliative, so if you dont provoke them there isnt much to it, but WoW also isnt THAAT toxic depending on what you do if you dont do much m+ and pvp honestly wow can be pretty cool. However the moment you step into m+ that shit is almost as toxic as league, it not even the words, its the instant quit mentality when someone fucks up, the gatekeeping with rio score (Which i get for highly competitive stuff, but man do you really need rio for a +8 key dude come on ) etc, pvp is kinda the same because of LFG being full of entitled people thinking they're the single best rogue/mage in the game. Anyway done ranting, just wanted to say that most of wow's toxicity is in those two "game modes", and if you stay away from them, honestly the rest of the community is pretty nice !
Zepla forgot that as soon as they're kicked in WoW they try to pull and wipe everyone
Whenever there was drama or toxicity happening in chat, I would always immediately move myself slightly out of the boss room while we waited pre-pull, just for this very reason.
Oh it can get worse. A buddy of mine was kicked. On a N'zoth pug. So he pulled the boss as a tank. The boss literally can't kill him for multiple minutes. Iirc the game doesn't remove you in combat.
As someone who used to play both, I found the toxicity in FF more subtle, but FAR more well spread. The sense of entitlement was astounding.
wow-toxicity: u suck, uninstall / kicked and blocked for no reason
ffxiv-toxicity: let me play how i want to, ure toxic
Lol, I played wow for 2 weeks at most and the amount of n word, literally all kind of slurs every single day. Toxic for everything, ff has the problem of "tolerating" low effort people in an attempt to not be toxic but unfortunately it lets toxic people be toxic :/
@@TheWolfteamGamerN00b Thats mindboggling. Ive literally never seen anyone use the n word in wow before ever and i played since 2009/10.
@@stylishskater92 no fucking way im calling bs
@@TheWolfteamGamerN00b Im sorry my experiences dont reflect your portrayals.
Bottom line: Those who don't want to be a team player, don't get to be a team player.
Except if their dps is huge ofc
@@OkamiSamaa Well yeah but if you die 10 sec into the fight your effective dps is gonna be garbage anyways. Having huge dps implies being a team player.
26:55 - Not typing in Party chat. Yep. WoW trained me to stop doing it. I still get shy about doing it. When Asmon mentioned early on about kicking someone who didn't respond when we suggested a change... that'd be me getting kicked. You learn in WoW that anything in chat is going to be used as a trap to go after you. Most of the time you will be kicked for what you DO SAY, and not kicked if you just stay silent. Asmon is the rarer person that will kick the silent people. Your odds in WoW are just better staying quiet.
By contrast in FFXIV, ESO, and GW2 - a discussion in chat is usually better to type into. If someone is being a jerk (yes they exist everywhere) - they are more obvious about it. They don't "set traps". When someone asks "do you guys not know this fight?" after a wipe, they are not looking for who to kick, they are prepping a guide... In WoW, anyone who says 'yes' is gone. Better to just stay quiet and try to figure out where you're messing up.
pussy mentality
Leader "Do you know Karate?"
random guy "Yes"
Leader "then dodge this kick"
*Random guy has been kicked from group*
Wow is so toxic there are troll guilds that just que for dungeons to kick people to annoy them it does not need to make sense.
This is ironic for me because I was an avid hardcore wow player for years and just now got ffxiv for something different and relaxed, and if ffxiv is this relaxed I think I'm down for sure.
Stress relief, Khaotic?🤣
@@genkki4776 hahaha, yessir I was very khaotic in my younger years, but I can't abandon my OG xbox live and steam gamertag! Lol
Food buff is a minimum it gives health which allows you to live raid damage you otherwise wouldn't and secondary stats which is good for your damage, melds are basically free secondary stats so without them you do less damage, anyone looking to get into savage should be required to have these two things. it's just that simple, not taking these things into a savage fight and calling it practice is like you aren't intending to actually kill the fight.
I mean...there is a tag you can use called practice. So they could actually be practicing the progression of the fight before they finish it. Melds and food are key for higher tiers of raids but at the same time, if people want to practice and not waste the food/tincture buffs before the actual clear then that I can understand. Melds however should be at least a given at least
@@muchluck7981 how do y wanna practice lets say as healer if ppl not gonna use food ur healing and ogcd allocation can change quite a lot depending how much hp ppl have
@@marioharrer9999 True but at the same time, Like I said before not everyone wants to burn food when they are just practicing. Sure HP levels won't be matching but at the same time, not everyone makes their own food and thus can afford to freely burn them
I remember at the beginning of Shadowlands when the raids finally came out and i had joined a solid raid guild. I was a DK and hadn't played the game as anything other than casual since Wrath to be honest. I took Shadowlands more seriously but were doing Sun King and my DPS was just not hitting enough. They wanted 2.5k minimum and i think i was hitting 2.1k (unholy dk and hadn't played serious in years lol)
Regardless, they simply asked me to go upgrade and take the time to work on my rotations and try again next week. I voluntarily left the raid, and that was that. No biggy, i got better and enjoyed doing so because then I felt like a contribution instead of a burden. If you can't deal with that as an MMO player that is part of a raid guild, then leave the guild or don't engage in guilds that are super hardcore.
I had a similar experience at the end of Shadowbringer doing the Savage raids, and I was pretty garbage (and a bard >_>). In the end I left of my own accord; I just wasn't improving fast enough and I stopped having fun. Having a much better time and I learnt on my own how to do my rotations properly rofl! Don't need these defensive!Andy's in our MMOs, but they'll always be there.
Yea but what if all the guilds are super hardcore.
@@belstar1128 Then maybe guilds arent right for you but realistically there is a guild out there for everyone
@@jedeyemindprick1511 I was in some fun guilds in cata and mop but in classic you really need a guild do do anything in the end game in modern versions of of wow i just up from guild to guild if they do something annoying
This reminds me of another toxic moment where i was looking for a guild i typed lf guild every 5 minutes and people said i was spamming while there was a bunch of actual gold spam.
Always use food, then when you have the fight down and you want to clear.... Use raid pots.
Not at all biased take zepla
"It is to me" is not self reflection. Its doubling down.
"Now move on okay" is basically just saying stfu.
Easy kick + blacklist
yep "I don't care if you all didn't think it was offensive, it was to me and that is all that matters"
Zepla is a terrible TH-camr who helps breed the toxic casual environment on ff14.
@@delix8869 In what way? She's literally laughing at how absurd it is that the person thinks doing the bare minimum is toxic, which is what you're saying she's promoting.
- "He's new and he's learning"
Well, time to learn how to apply food buffs and stop being a hinderance
I can't stand "peacemakers". There is a such thing as Toxic Positivity and it is usually associated with these peacemakers. To suggest there that we simply ignore the problem and move on doesn't solve anything but makes things way worse for everyone. The "new" guy doesn't learn the value of the lesson trying be taught, the person teaching will be jaded and probably decide not to help in the future, the white knight guy defending the new guy will think he has done a great justice when all he really did was hamstring an upcoming player to thinking cutting corners is okay. These examples are the game but you can extrapolate it to any real life situation of peacemakers too.
The peacemakers are annoying honestly, if they arent on anyone's side then they should just stay silent. Avoiding confrontation and wanting to continue the run doesnt do anything. I totally agree that these ppl just make it 'ok' for the fk-up of the group to think its ok to cut corners and not get better
perfect example of casual toxicity and someone that is entitled af that guy expects to basicly put in 20% of the effort while the others have to be performing at 200% so that they can event get close to a kill or to the point of the fight they wanna practice then complains about toxicity
If you've been playing for more than 3 hours, you should know food = hp lmao
Wait he isn't using a food buff? For savage? Dude, am I the only one who always has a food buff on for something? Raiding, farming, crafting, gathering I always have a food buff on. It gives you extra 3 percent of experience and it makes your stats better why the hell not.
Practice or not I would kick them.
Food is super cheap too. No reason to not have food..
@@scotaloo77g73 sure but when im new I dont act so entitled to say "i wont use food, stop pushing me to use it, i dont care, im here to practice"
if anything I'd apologize and go get whatever i need for the practice. If you cant do even minimal preparation (which in ff14 is almost nothing compared to other mmos) then how can anyone expect you to do the mechanics properly and consistently? if anything, they'd expect that person to not care at all if they are doing well or not.
@@scotaloo77g73 Okay, but you wouldn't do minimum prep at all? Like I am not even saying meld all your gear. But, you can get a steak or something for 150 Gil or less from the Golden Saucer at least. Practice, isn't just about just understanding how to bring a boss down but also getting into the habit of prep. It can only make you and your group better and the boss die quicker.
@@scotaloo77g73 if everyone is using food then they should be too, otherwise go find another party that doesn’t care. That’s the beauty of an MMO, it’s in the name…
I think he was being forced to play by a friend who claimed he was new early on in the scuffle. So he was already perturbed. Then someone he doesn't know is also telling him he has to do something else. So he got even madder and took his initial frustration out on the new offender who he doesn't know. Don't force people to play team games with you, folks. If they don't want to, accept it.
had a returner in a dungeon saying "if u ever call out a returner ever again, u might as well return to wow" my only message in the entire dungeon was "dont stand in aoes pls" love healing :), funny thing was we was doing a lvl 70 dungeon and he left immediately after sending it
"Don't stand in aoes please" is a pretty redundant and passive aggressive thing to say though, right?
It's the same tier as "Don't die please" etc, returners are gonna be rusty, if it's not advice for a specific mechanic you probably shouldn't say anything. Especially in content as chill as dungeons.
@@lolaandjoe123 if youre a returning player and someone says stuff like that, just tell them youre rusty/tired/returning whatever and leave it at that. no deal to make a huge scene out of it and leave instantly. most players are surprisingly udnerstanding in those regards. i had a lot of leveling sessions at 3:30 am where i was tired af and i just wrote the issue at the beginning. never have i received a complaint/advice once because of that.
@@lolaandjoe123 people like you with your attitude is part of the problem
@@customizablemilk353 Why would they have to say they're returning and rusty when it's literally showed to them with the icon?
@@lolaandjoe123 i wouldn’t say anything if they accidentally stood in them, but he never moved for a single aoe, and didnt say anything for the entire dungeon, till the end?
Since venturing into savage this tier, I've come to realize that the XIV community is full of people who aren't able to take criticism, be it gentle or not. As I transition into ultimates, I've learned to just not even entertain them and either leave the party or kick them. XIV has an issue with players who use the victim mentality as a defense mechanism when they're called out on anything, and it's tiring to deal with.
You can play as sub-optimally as you want for the rest of the game, but when you join savage or ultimate raids - where the goal is to progress and eventually clear the fight/tier, and hold the party back, don't be surprised when people start criticizing you/trying to give you advice.
No way... The "safe space" game is full of thin skinned people? I never would have thought.
In FFXIV, for savage practice you use food, for clears you use food and tinctures. Anything less than that, alongisde melding and watching a guide, is sandbagging.
God, I remember doing the EW opening weekend, and we hit the first Trial, and we... we were getting absolutely pasted. There were no guides, no veterans of the trial to lead or know the mechanics, and you hit that trial, and it's like, "Well, best of luck"!
I main White Mage, so I tend to stand a bit back, and noticed something during the early section of the raid, and I jumped on chat for everyone to run to the front right of the boss. The telegraphs weren't showing up in that one spot, so we all grouped up and got to skip the first phase. Then we hit a phase where the boss flies around, can't be targeted or anything, and sets up a massive attacks with only a few safe zones. If you're not in those safe zones, that are almost not telegraphed in any way on the field, you're dead.
So after that wipe, we're talking and one of the guys is talking about how cool the details are, like with the constellations. I hadn't seen any constellations. I'm WHM in a trial where everyone keeps almost dying, I wasn't looking up. This round, we going back through, and I'm watching during the phase, and I clocked it. The constellations map the safe zones. I pop a Follow Dorito, and start going to the safe zones. The whole fight was like this, cause there was no expectation, and we're just trying to work out anything that can work to see us through.
After, I let everyone know that the one guy had pointed out the telegraph on the constellations, to give him the Recs. I'm a healer, I'll get recs, he was DPS.
He PMed me, and was... awkward. I finally realized what was going on, "You're a WoW refugee, right? I started in Vanilla, through WotLK, came back in during Cat, and again at Warlords and Legion."
We spent the next couple hours chatting as we pushed through MSQ. He had never had anyone in WoW literally stop their own praise to put it on someone else who helped, and no one had started yelling despite how many times we died, and it was truly a lot. It's a different vibe in XIV, and I've met a few refugees who have leftover stuff from WoW, and even other MMOs when they come in.
Somebody gave me tips once, and another player tried defending me calling them out for being toxic? I had to say I appreciate the tips because they honestly do help a lot, and u learn a lot from just random players in dungeons sometimes
I only parse in FFXIV to make sure my DPS is a net positive to the team and to see if I need to tweak my rotation
I played WoW for years. I encountered more assholes than nice people. Assholes on PVP servers who would camp my lowbie characters. Assholes on PVE servers would bully me into leaving dungeons if my DPS wasn't high enough, even if it was my first time doing the dungeon and I was still trying to get geared. Assholes in battlegrounds would bully me into leaving because I wasn't geared enough, even when I was just trying to get into PVP.
It honestly left me traumatized to the point that I didn't want to even do dungeons in FFXIV. Took everything I had to do it, and I was surprised as hell at how nice everyone was.
Meanwhile my first toxic experience:
"MONKEY HEALER, YOU OVERHEAL"
*Proceeds to rage and intentionally leave the boss 14 seconds into the fight to troll the whole team*
"hAvE yOu LeArNeD yOuR lEsSon???"
I literally started Playing FF14 because of all the malding WoW streamers complimenting the game. Last time I played WoW was like 15 years ago and I used one of those 10 day free trial cards they used to give away all the time. This has been my first MMO experience and I've loved every second of it.
Cool , now get a personality instead of listening to influencers
@@lolilol535 cringe and stupid lol. Keep malding wow Andy
Awesome. I’m glad that your experience has been a fun one
@@lolilol535 Damn dude no need to be rude to someone enjoying a game recommended to them
@@lolilol535 y u have to be so mad? Is just a game.
@1:45 There are variables you’re changing with and without food buff, so it definitely changes between practice and “real” pulls. I don’t differentiate the two really; every pull is an attempt to see at least how far your team gets.
This is exactly correct. Every attempt should be intending to progress further than the previous attempt. The entire purpose of practice is to actually learn and progress. For someone to use that as an excuse shows two things: 1. They don't know the meaning of practice and 2. They're effing lazy and shouldn't be a part of the group.
The most toxic people online are actually drunk people. Most people don't know but 9/10 the people fking up or ruining team based games online are just drunk. I found this out while playing moba, every time we lost because 1 player out of 5 was obviously playing badly, I would ask them: "lol you drunk as well ^^?" and 9/10 those people thinking I was chill about losing would confirm that they are drunk or on some other drug. I imagine that the number of people home from work, drunk and doing raids is very high,
Starting at 8:29 is pretty much my idea of the situation as well:
You play with your homies? Who cares what you do, have fun!
You play with randoms? Be mindful that everyone in the group has different expectations so rather than assume that everyone is okay with you not fully melding/food because "practice", why not take like a few extra minutes to do so? It's not even that big of a hassle at this point lol
FF toxicity is G-rated compared to WoW.😂
idk, the few toxic person I found in FFXIV where extremely aggressive and insidious, while the frequent toxic players I found in Wow where just morons
@@SheinelI it's like Asmon said, toxicity exists in every game. It's the sheer volume in WoW that is staggering, however. I played it for 14 years--in that time, I saw exactly what Asmon and Zepla talked about.
Sounds like you met the rare aggressively toxic people in FF, and the rare patient people in WoW. That's just RNG.😅
The same people play both games, so they can be equally toxic at times. That said, I think the systems in WoW push people into more toxic interactions.
It's the monopoly of video games. It doesn't matter if you're playing with friends or strangers, someone is going to tip the board over.
@@Hooga89 I don't think WoW is alot harder, however there are certain things that are happening in the game that can be somewhat of a big aggressor for people. Recently did my full keystone hero, aka every dungeon in +20! And mostly had to push up my own key...
Everytime it got up to +20, i was more or less praying that the people i pugged with were good enough to get it done. Since otherwise i'm back in the +19 club, which noone wants to do. And pushing back up again can take a full day if unlucky enough! That one bad run can absolutely fuck you over so badly, that you may not even get a second chance... It can be understandable that some people get a little bit pissed in those situations. And don't think that's something that really could happen in FF in comparison?... I may be wrong, but even for Savage and Ultimate. It's not worse than just trying again.
ya wow had mythic plus that shit breeds toxicity but I get it it's timed where not there to hold your hand in the key know what your doing bring your flask and food and don't fuck up lol
@@Hooga89 I've met openly mean players and aggressively bad players, but passive aggressive is something I have really not seen.
Yes but mostly no. The vast majority of FF14 players include almost all of the elite have never played a MMO before. FF14 keep reeling in more and more baby's first players thanks to how accessible the entire game is. And the kind of people FF14 has unfortunately attracted are easily worse than WoW's.
This game was made to be accessible first, challenging later. Peeps complain to no end how easy all of this is, and these dipshits are desperate to use any illegal mod to cheat.
@Jay Bee FF14 is easily the worst, most evil, compared to WoW's. I never had to report so many players in WoW. I have to report rule breakers, horrible people on a weekly basis. There's so many of them because so much of the playerbase are doormats, elitists, and/or will defend them just to avoid negativity or confrontations.
There will always be a ninja-pull after a kick, which makes shit way more funny.
True
Alot of people care more about their in-game progress than being friends in WoW. While in FF it's different. One isn't more wrong or right than the other. Mythic WoW raiding is also harder than anything in FF, so when someone really wants to get cutting edge they can't really tolerate people who don't respect that
I don't get the "practice" argument. Like yeah, sure its practice. But if your hp is too low you'll die to mechanics and since it's savage, you're gonna wipe the entire raid because you won't be able to do your part. Practice doesn't do you any good if you can't see the following mechanics because you killed the group.
It won't even do you good if you survive, since both you and the group have to work around a different health pool. You'll just get really good at playing it badly.
I've only encountered one toxic player in final fantasy XIV. It was a cat boy scholar who was getting frustrated that he was paired up with three sprouts and they were all new, me being one of the sprouts. It was the first time the mechanic for sliding ice floors was introduced. It took a while to understand how it all worked but his frustration carried on to the next boss fights and all he would do is talk shit in chat. If I log into my final fantasy 14 I can find out who he is because he's one of the only blacklisted people in my account
@@brandonkruse6412 It's what keeps me from buying the new expansion. I don't have the time to risk potentially running into crap like that. I'll just treat it as a single-player experience, run through the quests and be done with it. Doesn't seem worth it.
@@NormalJinx You're very unlikely to meet any of that shit in game. I think the most likely reason some people see toxicity everywhere in FF14 is that they are the ones bringing it.
@@brandonkruse6412 That's probably because people can report toxic behavior and it gets investigated deeply with chat logs and by a GM that the reporter will talk to. I've had 1 instance in 6+ years that I used the reporting for.
Aetherochemical Research Facility?
Mentor healers are the worst.
In WOW, you wouldn't waste time in a conversation like that. You don't want to pull your weight? OK, bye. In WOW, we respect each other's time.
*Lights a cigar*
“When it downloads it cleanses your soul” probably explains why I can’t download it
Asmongold is the only father I've ever had who managed to find his way back home from the store.
Thats weird af
bruh
That's depressing
Huh
@@Kyrones Yeah, but other than that I've met some weird af ppl in WoW. It's very hard to find a decent raiding group after they implemented the Cross Realm "feature." Lots of thieves and back stabbers in guilds, too. Those ppl might as well have had father issues!
A fun thing regarding toxicity is that is many times can be avoided trough game mechanics and design that doesn't cause friction between players or a single player experiencing the game.
That said FF is far from a saint when it comes to toxicity as it simply has it in different areas or have moderators who are more stringent about negative behaviour against other players.
Just a few days ago when I was playing at in a dungeon with other players (it was my first time doing that as I was playing it with NPC only), one of the players in after the final boss was defeated chatted me about how I spam an AoE attack in the boss (14 is my first MMO and I usually spam flashy attacks when I played Single-player RPG games) and suggested me for review my character's abilities. I like it how he said it in a very nice way, that it encouraged me to take my playstyle seriously and practice rotations and stuff
Yeah, I don't think people who never played WoW and only played FF understand how much more people parse in WoW. In FF, having add-ons installed is fairly niche, and if you do have addons installed, that doesn't specifically mean ACT is one of them. And in most cases you don't bother logging outside savage/ultimate. You don't even log in Extreme. Current tier extremes have such gentle DPS checks that if you're failing it, it's because too many people in the raid have the "I stood in fire" dunce cap. Avoiding mechanics almost always does more for improving your DPS than hitting your buttons in a better order. People don't bother parsing extremes usually.
In WoW, if you are capped and don't have any addons you're considered pretty strange. If you have addons but none of them is a DPS meter (Details, Recount, Skada, etc) you're even weirder still. And people will point out your DPS in Heroic Dungeons (roughly equivalent to Expert Roulette). The meters are always running. Your teammates are always watching you, always judging you. I've even seen DPS call outs in low level dungeons.
In FF, maybe 5% of the actual playerbase parses. In WoW, there is a 50-90% chance any given player you're matched with is watching your meters, depending on what sort of content it is.
This why I don't raid with randoms anymore. Started in 2017 and still playing, it's always have been a bunch of sissies since then and toxic people here and there but it has gradually increased as the years went on.
Lately been running into more sensitive and emotional players this year since the boom of Endwalker and it hasn't even been in savage raids.
Was in a Titan Extreme run in duty finder and one of the mentors who was a healer was just giving people advice about the mechanics but I guess 2 of the party members took it as being toxic.
They both tried voting him out, I backed him and then they tried voting me out.
Everyone backed both me and the healer except those 2 snowflakes, they soon left right after.
I reported them to a GM but the GM couldn't do anything since I wasn't really the "victim" of the whole confrontation.
IDK if this has to do with the boom of WoW refugees but I don't think it is, I think it has to do with some of the free players all over trying the game out. I play on PS4 and let me tell you, people who play free games on PS4, are not very nice most of the time, especially those young kids.
Glad more people are playing regardless but holy damn people take everything so offensive nowadays, damn people need to socialize more and take a break from video games. Losing a grip on reality just like crazy drivers.
IDK. Like man the fuck up. Love the XIV community but as someone who has worked at Target, it reminds me a lot of it like Asmon said. The entitlement is through the roof.
shortly after the wow migration i had a tank is tsukiomi ex say yeah I AM going south for the meteors mechanic. when we tried to tell him tanks go north, thts the norm in every pf he said no. kicked and reported him so damn fast xD
@@slimfastsubaru2043 bro in tsuki? that guy must've skipped, otherwise he would've heard about what's normal.
The other part of this is that Llama went out of his way to get this person full crafted gear, melded and still helped this person get their clear.
If the person learned from it and truly appreciated the help I would see this as a positive. But it would be negative if that person was still entitled throughout this and didn't learn anything. Hard to judge but I would like to think it's the prior.
The person who refused to meld and eat raid food is not the same person that was given fully melded crafted gear. The person who refused to meld didn't want any suggestions and the only concession was the consumption of some dusty ass piety food. They did in fact clear but it was real spooky.
I came from the Halo community (CE-Reach), I have always felt that the FFXIV community was a lot "squishier" and "soft" in comparison.
I'm fairly new to FFXIV (wow refugee) and anytime I do something with my FC there is always a 'Food Check!' in chat. It's helpful to always have it up.
more toxic than anything i've experienced in wow, is the feeling of entitlement to waste everyones time and be carried in ff14
I think 14 suffers from positive toxicity. It has the reputation of being the best community so the toxicity ends up being back handed and passive aggressiveness instead of any sort of real communication. I think it’s worse than just straight up toxic shit in a way
In FF I do not really like the over sensitivity of some people, but I also don't like the "you don't pay my sub" Andys that go apeshit and make everyone's life hard in fights by being an asshole... Just a note to any of the people who belong these categories. If you think in extremities - I will instantly assume you are a child regardless of your age. As usually, mentally grown people can understand the world is not black and white...
I had some jackass sperg out on me because I lifegripped them out of the fire and messed up their "rotation" in a normal dungeon. I attempted to explain the situation but they weren't having it, choosing to scream rather than understand that I saved his life. He wouldn't let it go even after the rest of the party was like "dude, it's normal and you were standing in the fire, chill". So, I responded in the only reasonable way, by yoinking him around every cd (even between pulls). The problem rage quit within 5 mins and we had great fun with his replacement.
P.S. Calling someone "toxic" in an attempt to shut them up, even though they're being reasonable, is in fact toxic behavior.
That honestly sounds fun tbh. I wish I was there to see it lmfao
In my experience, toxic players in FF14 are just more passive aggressive. I way rather deal with toxic players in WoW.
Yeah for sure. FF14 toxic is brutal. Other games they call a player shit. FF14 you get called toxic for giving a suggestion... which is pathetic
Easy test:
Tell a WoW player that their game is shit.
Tell a FF14 player that their game is shit.
You will get the answer right in your face.
Well yea, people will defend what's good and shit on what's bad. Tell a WoW player their game is shit and they'll more often than not agree and join you. But that doesn't reflect the toxicity of the in-game community and how the players treat one another. Keeping that in mind, FF14 has a significantly less toxic player base (towards one another), but a more toxic relationship with non-FF14 players when they shit on their game (without first trying it).
@@scotaloo77g73 I've had 4 angry WoW players all insult me at once in one of Asmon's comment sections because I dared to mention FF14 in a WoW video....that was also a video about FF14 too.
Not to mention the amount of Dedicated WoW trolls is insane, there's one person who's been seemingly going onto every FF14 video they can find and spam commenting stuff like: "WOW IS KING, FF14 WEEBS COPE, SHITTY FURRY DEAD GAME, ASMON IS BACK AT HOME IN WOW, ASMON DOESN'T ACTUALLY LIKE FF14 COPE" and they've been spamming that shit for 7 months.
Seven. Entire. Months. Ever since Asmon first started FF14, they literally have not stopped writing a thousand comments a day about how much they hate and despise FF14....in the comment sections of multiple FF14 videos.
You don't even have to be talking about FF14 for them to rant about it in your replies either, I typed a comment that said nothing about either FF14 or WoW, and one person apparently remembered that I typed something like "I'm enjoying the Ff14 content so far" a few months ago and got pissed off at me, calling me a furry and a weeb, for some reason. Because I made a comment....months ago....that had "FF14" in it.
Wow players have been hating on their game since at least 2006 and by 2008 it was 99% negativity but the game was very popular at that time i remember they added something i really liked but other wow players hated it but in ff14 it is the opposite the fan base act like a cult sometimes.
I think it may be a east vs west thing because i notice it with other Asian games too like lost ark or all the Nintendo games while fans of other western mmos like runescape also complain all the time for minor things acting like the game is ruined.
@@belstar1128 It's overall the same thing, both just make up nonsense to defend their religion. If you worship a god "Everything sucks" or one of "Everything is perfect, UwU", does not make much difference.
Beside this: while Blizzard simply LET you shit talk about the game, Square, especially at start, went brutally against criticism, forging an echo chamber and from this it spread a lot towar other social media with the typical cult character: if you say somethign against the cult, all the fanatics will gang up on you.
WoW got more the standard internet asshole behaviour and when you don't got the problems with a cult, talking shit brings you more views than talking nice.
It’s funny cuz people who set the bar this low on what toxic is, clearly they have not played league of legends 😂
You know what grinds my gears ? Wow wannabe VIPs.
Story time:
We were at the endboss of the current raid (normal). Group was made out of randoms. The main tank flamed, after 2 wipes, he will report everyone who does not the tactics and he will screenshot the group and make it public like " do not play with these people". What a lunatic. I said " jesus, calm down". He left a few minutes later ( but the raid didnt dissolved and i put him on ignore). A few Minutes later we found a new tank ( an even better one). We probably wiped 4 times in total but suddenly, we beated the jailor and everyone was on 100% health. Not even one single dead.
We wrote out every mechanic and we explained how this boss works. (felt like classic). The people learned and probably were happy af to beat the jailor with a random group.
My morale of the story ?
Kick every flamer (even if its a healer or a tank). Do not leave the raid after 2 wipes if you consider to join a random group.
Its not my fault if some 40 year old neckbeard cant play due to his Karen wife and is pissed off after 2 wipes.
i mean.... if people are crying over every little thing, if they refusing to pull their weight and putting the minimum of thought into something.... wouldnt that mean ff14 is more toxic than wow?
its amazing how aggressiv casual ff14 players can get as soon as you mention something about more difficult dungeons (NOT mythic+), about healers doing dmg (NOT maximizing it) or dmg meter (NOT for blaming people on your group for weak dmg (experienced players can see the really bad players without act anyway).
(not that it matters since nowadays everything is toxic anyway)
I fear that trusts are somewhat encouraging that behaviour. Hell even if you like a cool reward behind some sort of hard content, they call that gatekeeping. Some of these toxic people expect everyone to behave like ncp's.
i like looking at the differences between WoW and FFXIV toxicity because its a nice break from Lost Ark where people are just kind of.... dumb. And also emboldened in their stupidity. In LA, especially on the forums, people will say objectively incorrect things about mechanics or systems with incredible confidence.
Man I got early into t3 and voiced my annoyance about Knowledge Transfer caps forcing you to replay the story on alts on the forum. I did it twice for the fun. And holy shiet I was like 1v30ppl telling me how they all have several alts in t3 without playing the story cuz KT can just boost you for gold(which it can't unless you replay the story).
It's funny cuz last week I saw more ppl getting mad about it lol, just took awhile xD
The way people talk with 100% certainty about stuff they have no idea about is almost weird.
Everytime I see a person like this I say to myself "It's unreasonable in and of itself to try to reason with an unreasonable person"
I used to raid lead for a guild in ESO and holy shit at the people who didn't want to do anything. Had a girl who signed up to to raid with a broken keyboard and she couldn't move in certain directions which meant she would get killed by shit nonstop. She asked about improving DPS as a magsorc and I gave her advice on putting pets on both bars to keep it simple and play properly without having to summon pets nonstop. She refused and did abysmal dps in comparison to anyone else.
She refused and I ended up not letting her raid when I was leading. Other officers took up for her since we were a "casual" guild and they all left in the end. Casual guild or not she's wasting other people's time when we could 've had someone else who actually wanted to learn the fights properly. I was called toxic for not wanting to carry her through content as she was dead weight on the group. She was the only constant issue when we raided.
If I raid lead I try to be reasonable, but I apply the same rules to myself as I would other people.
The "there are a million people out there so blocking names is kinda needed" thing depends on the server and time of the day you play. I've easily recognized a few dozen names while pugging in PF on Primal, even sometimes during peak hours. Often, the questionable people make the same mistakes as seen from months ago VS today, but it's still a case-by-case basis at the end of the day.
Though I still believe it's better to white out the names. No one wants to be responsible for being sent unwanted messages ESPECIALLY if it's over trivial matters.
I ran into these types of players during the height of Destiny 1 - 2 for me. Me and four other guys would need another class for our strategy to work in a raid with little to no trouble but when it came time to assign a role such as kill these empowered enemies or use your ability here, there, or at this time they would say along the lines of you can't order me around.....uh when the party leader who knows what to do and when tells you something, DO IT.
If you are not calling the shots, you follows the shots that are called. Teamwork, its the name of the game
Brooo, the fact that they even talked to Him is crazy. He would have just been booted and whispered in my day as we searched for someone to replace him.
MMO’s are so weird when you think about it. they’re marketed to the nerds who went through school and most likely didn’t play any sports. But now they’re expected to work as a team and understand pulling your weight for the good of everyone else. Something they’ve never had to do, but something the jocks would take for granted.
these streams fail to realize that not all ppl don't have hundreds or thousand stream sniping waiting to get on their party... so I think they think is easy to kick out people, some of us take a good while for people to get other players to join their group, especially when you run raids on non-peak raiding days
I'll take sitting in PF all day to dealing with someone like this and his enabler friend.
When I was new to wow , once I used the wrong cd at the beginning of a boss fight. My friends who were teaching in discord along with the entire 40 man raid proceeded to shout and type all sorts of friendly things in chat wondering who did it Lol 😭🤣🤣
yeah you used bloodlust + they were right to flame you
@@gillsejusbates6938 you're clueless dude .. 🤦♂️. So sad lol 😆
Git gud
I've never seen anyone in-game FF14 be toxic, but if you go on the reddit it's a different story entirely!
It's because it's the same players that are on wow, just afraid to lose their accounts to tell people to use food in game
"If you don't eat food why don't you go eat SHIT!?" LMAO, best comment ever
In the 63 ingame days that I've spent in FF, I can point to maybe 3-4 toxic experiences. I haven't done any full-on endgame stuff like the Savage raids as much as I want to just because I haven't sat down and actually done them, so my experience may be tainted by the filthy-casual atmosphere, which is nice, as I started out tanking without any prior experience with MMO dungeons, and having heard of how toxic the WoW community could get, coupled along the usual toxicity levels of the gamingsphere in anything even resembling mainstream, it was pleasant to load into Sastasha and be greeted with "That's fine"
The toxic experiences I've encountered has generally just been from people who can't seem to fathom the idea of someone not really knowing what's going on in an instance they haven't done before. The FF community is generally great at being patient with people while they get their bearings, from what I've seen the toxicity is either on the extremes of telling someone they could do better and overly defending someone who could be doing better, or people who suffer massively from "main-character" syndrome. The latter is especially bad when it's someone who could be doing a LOT better...
Well I can see their point of view, wow players will be aggressive to lower level new players, and they usually wind up being highly defensive, they are given 0 chance to learn the game, in wow, they constantly get kicked by experienced people either carrying their friend through a low level dungeon or leveling their alts. Toxicity creates a very defensive climate by the toxicity of experienced players not giving the new guys the opportunity to learn. It is a very stressful environment for new players, it's the very reason why I won't pug any more, because these assholes will not give new guys their opportunity to learn. I will immediately come to the defense of new players every time, and arguments will ensue, I just don't want the aggravation any more.
When you attack someone, they become more and more anxious, and less likely to learn. I am going to give you a lesson in psychology, human beings can only learn when we feel safe, the minute fight or flight mechanism is triggered, humans cannot learn. All that pressure and yelling, will not get someone to play better. If the environment is kept fun, relaxed, you will be able to get learning to happen. The very minute you start the yelling and screaming the game is over pack it up, call it a day, morality drops more people get stressed, it's a snowball effect.
People mistake "FFXIV community isn't toxic" for "Not a SINGLE PERSON is toxic in FFXIV".
When I first started ff14 I Struggled with Shiva extreme really badly as a black mage. We were all newbies at one point. But with harder content than extreme should come with higher expectations
The reason I quit WoW wasnt because the game was bad (BFA), but because of the constant "F your mother", "Kill yourself" and negative comments in RDF groups to (mostly) other players that made small mistakes.
It was several times a week and it actually made me sad that it's so easy for some people to act like assholes to other people and I had no joy in playing the game anymore.
I know many people quit for the same reason.
A game is supposed to be fun and act like a break off from the real world when you are tired and get home from work, not be a cesspool of negativity.
I feel like i havent seen such comments or flaming in general since like catacylsm. It feels like an outdated stigma to me somehow.I played ffxiv and was somehow more stressed out tanking, primarily bc the low level dungeons are a nightmare of getting lost and extremely dull dark shading and contrast, but i had passive aggressiveness from watching cutscenes like im coming out of a scene and two people are emoting to be sleeping on the ground and stuff like that lol.
Yea well i don't mind getting insulted but they kick me from groups just to mess with me ninja loot refuse to answer my questions they would spam insults non stop try to scam me in classic wow mobs don't respawn fast so you are supposed to group up but a lot of players refused to join my group and just wasted everyone's time while insulting me in Swedish there was a level 60 killing all the mobs in a low level zone just to anger people mocking everyone i played on a pve server but you had opposite fraction players killing all the quest givers
These geeks have a lot of tricks up their sleeves i duelled a priest a few years ago and he mced me into the wall and i was stuck in combat they are hackers i never duelled another player after that i don't think i am bad at the game but a lot of players have become so skilled they are like those pokemon speed runners they know everything about the game so yea in the end it was the community that cased me to quit
In WoW you generally have a parser installed if you use any kind of combat addons, plus it's usually always active. In FF14 you need to install and launch a third party app that technically breaks ToS. So yeah the barrier for parsing is lower in WoW making it more common place. Anyone that actually thinks parsing is as "normal" in FF14 as it is in WoW is deranged. 🙃
The big difference IS the parsing mentality.
As soon as you say you ARE using those kind of tools, whoever is with you turns aggressive and reports you INSTANTLY.
The moment you admit it.
They'll not even let you the opportunity of being toxic or not, you're dust.
I find it a bit extreme, but I understand where it comes from.
A lot of FF players come from other games where they had those kind of experiences, and they value the cleanliness of the ambient in the game.
They remember LOL (my god LOL), WOW, etc., and the simple idea that the parsing mentality and that kind of toxicity could spread in 14 too makes them instantly bloodthirsty.
They do a 180, from kind and supportive to violent and oppressive.
Some of them are basically traumatized and go in full PTSD rage mode.
They kill knowing that probably the parser did not really mean any harm or did not even want to discuss anything specific, they just admited using an external tool. They kill the innocent because they're too scared the little shits hidden here and there will feel encouraged to start doing the same fuckery they do in every other game.
I mean...coming from WoW and LoL myself...I kinda like them being so protective of their wellbeing.
The only thing I had to do is not being a dick, and don't use parsing tools. A bargain I can accept
I haven't played since last expansion but its literally just LAZINESS to not meld. The materia is FREE in the form of stellaclusters. You can exchange them for battle materia
The PTSD from games like WoW and LoL is real. Maybe it's not felt by everyone equally but it's real. Obviously every single person isn't a saint. There are bad apples in every community but from what I've experienced it seems like the percentage in FFXIV it's lower than other MMOs. GG TY!
PTSD from games are not real thing so stop the crybully snowflake BS behavior..
Yea i don't trust any players in online games i play i just assume they want to mess with me in my last days of playing classic wow i would log in late at night so i would avoid other players i refused to join dungeons and guilds because they where so annoying one of the guilds i was in would just spam my chat with weirdness
@@belstar1128 sorry to hear that. I hope you manage to find like minded people to hang out with. I gave up a long time ago on that but I'm fine being alone. Kinda nice to be honest. Helps with my anxiety.
It' ptsd for you it's funny memories for me. I never really foudnd the toxicity and bickering demoralizing and instead found it to be more funny. I guess everyone's just different.
@@tahmkench118 Well we can both agree that there is toxicity in & out of games and that different people's minds can process the same things in different ways. Unfortunately, how it affects you isn't a choice.
FF14 toxicity is a different breed. The "You don't pay my sub!" crowd and the people who will defend sub par play. You'd see more of the normal breed of toxicity in Eureka(more so) and Bozja when they were current. Having played both games for years FF 14's toxicity is more of the knife in the back and talk behind your back type while in WoW(and other online games) its in the front.
Unironically, I prefer WoW. At least they just straight up tell you suck while 14 will try their best to say you suck in the nicest manner, which IMO, makes you feel more like a dick.
People who act like they've been offended from helpful and basic advice actually piss me off more than someone being extremely toxic to me...
Like it's infuriating and it's just sucks ass because it makes our community look like everyone's gunna cry over literally nothing...
Grow up and take advice people, especially if you're running hard content...
FFXIV has a huge problem with toxic casuals, instead of toxic elitists. there are a load of people that simply REFUSE to learn.
I played FF14 hundreds of hours,. first time learning what food is LOL
@@richardshiflett5181 nope. playing as a RDM.
spoilers but yeah wow is toxic
And I wouldn't have it any other way.
I rather have it that way then how the ff14 community is
spoilers but yeah ffxiv is a trash game with a trash community
@@iamvee87 Wait, you _want_ WoW to be toxic?
@@lucylu3342 I know what I said.
"What is your history of MMO toxicity?" Me: "5 years as a miner in EVE Online"
Final Fantasy has a LOT of passive aggressive toxicity. It’s like the twitter of mmos, no one’s out and out toxic but if you make a social lapse they’ll pile drive you into the ground with moral grandstanding and out of proportion responses.
Yeah, about 240 hours in and this has been my experience, and god forbid you mention something critical about anything in the game, lol.
WoW is less toxic than FF from my experience.
In WoW if you're an asshole you're just an asshole nothing more, nothing less.
In FF if you're anything other than black mirror creepy happy you're toxic. Like the second you say anything that's not 100% positive you're toxic.
Haha exactly my experience with FF.
"Being an asshole is the norm in WoW so it's not toxic" is next level denial.
@@Tyrbris WoW players are next level degenerates with no lives. It's quite astonishing how people compare ff14 to WoW. FF14 is not better but I would rather waste my time in that game than a shitty old grandpa smoking baby slapping cussing ......... TLDR: I lost my opinion
26:50 I had the opposite experience. But to be fair, I'm mainly playing Classic. But my FF14 groups rarely had any group interaction beyond greeting each other (if at all) unless I specifically asked something about the dungeon. People just wanted to get through and didn't say anything until the end. As opposed to WoW, where I'm talking with the group all the time. I think the problem with FF14 is for one that the UI is a little more awkward, and typing in group chat is not as easy to set up (in my experience) compared to just typing /p. But I think the main problem is that people are instantly teleported to the dungeon, are complete unknowns to each other when they meet IN the dungeon, and most of the time it's a downranked higher level player who has seen the dungeon a billion times and simply wants to rush through for the reward, when I as a fresh player want to get to know the dungeon and experience it. One time I watchted the cutscene of the boss, and when I was through the boss was dead and everyone had left. I think FF14 really sucks in this regard. What sucks too is that the "exit" portal spawns directly behind the final boss, and you have barely any time to say thanks and farewell before you are left alone. It doesn't feel like an "authentic" human environment in FF14, at least when you are using the dungeon finder tool.
You can just type /p in FF as well. In my experience players usually wait for sprouts to watch cutscenes and at least say hello at the start and thank you/gg at the end, though I've definitely seen exceptions to both.
Some early dungeons do have long cutscenes after the boss kill, and players rarely stick around for those since a few can last minutes, but in general it's cordial enough I feel.
I don't know played claasic too and didn't have any interactions lol ?
@@Poldovico this a lot of times people will wait and tanks me included will just let the dps die if they pull while others watch cutscene lol
@@slimfastsubaru2043 Yeah, I tend to do the same. Let people watch the stuff, they only get one first time.
I had only a couple of toxic interactions in FFXIV playing for almost 1 year. I was learning how to play Sage, so I send to chat I was learning to play the job and asked if the tank can do small pulls, unfortunately the tank was an asshole who did BIG pulls even if my mana was low and can't stop complaining how bad I was doing.
"were gonna move on" "very mature"
they stop asking him to use food he wont use any food even in future raids