This channel of one of the few channels on TH-cam that is criminally undersubscribed. There is a great sense of satisfaction knowing that I’ve followed Jafro religiously throughout the years. Such a gem for the TH-cam car community.
@@muffinmonsta5302 back in the day, Jafro was the only channel that actually detailed the process of rebuilding an engine. I learned how to use specialized tools like bore gauge and micrometer from Jafro. Jafro shows the real struggle of real car guys. Most of the other shows fail to show the in between stuff.
392 horsepower in an elantra has got to be scary as hell. would love to know how much money is actually in this car right now. Jafro always kills it with the videos
It's really... not much at all... It's a timing belt, water pump and gasket set, a wiring harness, handful of sensors, a 3" exhaust cutout, a cheap Amazon fuel system, about $700 worth of stereo equipment. That's about it... the water methanol kit was a gift from my stepdad, and the car was free. Everything else that went into it were used hand-me-downs and leftover scraps. Probably $3,000 tops?
@@leefhead1 You mean he's not going to come out ahead if he sells it? Well no shit. He didn't ask about value or equity, he asked how much he had into the car.
O heck yeah doood! It's even better when there's a good used 6-puck sprung clutch for your exact car sitting on the shelf in front of the dyno where you burned it up! Wait until you see how it comes back...
@@Jafromobile Your truck really weights 6500lbs?! in a gasser? my 2nd gen cummins only weights 400 more pounds! nuts! As a smart man once said "want to go faster add more power. Want to go faster everywhere? add lightness" I have no clue how much power my 1g with 2.3 stroker with a e3 16g and 3inch exhaust makes but it sure feels lightyears faster then any of my 2g's feel.....really need to get them tuned as well.
2013 F-150 SuperCrew. Last of the steel bodies. Gen 1 Coyote. When I was pulling the trailer for the previous video, I got worse gas mileage with the trailer empty than I did with it full. I got .1mpg less with it empty. I added 4,000lbs between the truck bed and the trailer and got better... I just... ?!?!?!? I know why now... but just *feels* wrong.
Hahaha that's awesome you're so close to Ballenger! For what it's worth, I know those GM MAP sensors are still popular, but they are an ancient design at this point. There are newer style GM sensors, mostly made by Bosch now I believe, pretty much all MAP sensors seem to be Bosch now haha. Just saying it might be worth upgrading to a new piece of kit that is designed for a hotter engine bay, more vibration, and faster response. 😁
This is the same advice I give other people, lol! I approached this using the scientific method, attempting to change only one variable instead of several. Matt and Abe have put a lot of work in to troubleshooting Omni sensors to the point where their discoveries led to them changing the product. This sensor is not an Omni, but it fits all the other criteria of your post... yes, it's a rescaled piece of ancient technology. And it's plugged into an even older ECU that has a 17.7 Hz refresh rate. lol!
@@Jafromobile Hahaha love that. I pretty much assumed that you knew everything I said, but at the same time if you say nothing at all, nobody will ever know anything! I definitely appreciate and enjoy watching your process.
Not bad numbers! Really makes me miss my old S12 Nissan, 2300LBS chassis with a 400+HP SR20 swap... That thing was a rocket, no one in town wanted to race me at the time, they knew better. lol
Having been there for most of the YT life of the Elantra, it really feels good seeing you getting the car sorted and running so good. Looking forward to seeing whats next.
I had a similar issue happen with my MPA sensor. Sadly it happened on a 600 mile road trip and the car would shut down while driving. Sometimes it would start back up immediately. Other times, it took forever to restart. It took a while to track it down, but a tuning friend caught it in a log. Glad you found your issue as well.
Thank you for another great video!! Don't know anything of the tuning part but learning a lot each video. Only thing that I want to say is you need more stiffer engine mounts lol! :D
Man that car is journey in it self but one of good fun and learning.... I was looking back into when i started following you.... And that was the chainsav video of the big tree went down
Way off topic but its your current video. I have binged on your channel for about a week now. I love your videos and commentary. I would love to see a w5m33 teardown from you. I can even donate a bad transmission lmao
@Jafromobile 2g gsx. Out of a 97 talon. Has no 1st gear. Sourced a good trans and tcase from a 96 i found but i was either gonna try and learn to rebuild it myself or send it out. If you're serious we can talk off TH-cam
I love this kind of automotive sleuthing. Even though none of it will directly apply to me the concepts shared are going in the toolbox for a later date. Now how about that 4hr directors cut?
Was really hoping you’d find the cause of that weird electrical issue, it was sounding similar to mine but slightly different. My 8th gen galant with the 6a13tt will start up fine, idle, and rev like normal, however after a few minutes the car shuts itself off, no engine light, and then won’t start again. Have to wait an hour or more before I can try again, which made me think it was heat related. I’ve changed the ecu, cam sensor, checked the ifs, temp sensors, maf, but to no avail. I don’t have an evo scan and not really sure where to look next, other than sending it to a shop, which I really can’t afford, I’ve got a crank sensor to try next but dreading the job. But your videos given me some new motivation to try again on the troubleshooting path
Not sure if it was just my car but I use to get my map reading from that pcv port on the intake and me and my tuner found the map readings all over the place so I moved it to a different port and have a much cleaner map reading and tuning went smoother.
Likely because of a leak. One of the reasons it's a bad place for this is because the diameter of the nipple is more than twice that of the MAP sensor. That means it's going to be a bad fit on either one end of the hose or the other. It's why I used a smaller hose that had to be painstakingly stretched over the manifold port, and worm-gear clamped onto the sensor side. If it starts farting over ? PSI or under # vacuum, then you basically brought the ants with you to your picnic. I was aware of this and took precautions for it that proved to hold up, but it's still a problem with such wildly-different-sized barbs.
d'awwwww! I have to make a swivel mount for it now... that kinda does need to happen, but I don't know if it has enough weight to actually sway. It's so tiny and the dang thing has a rigid mount. I'm trying to get a 3D printed medallion for it to mount it on and to hide the 3V inverter.
I had an Omni 4bar on my STi for about 4 weeks before it kicked the bucket and read 3.5psi constantly. Thankfully I still had my stock MAP sensor and was still running a MAF/SD hybrid tune so it wasn't so much of an issue, but still annoying as hell!
Happy to give you the tour! They're awesome! The kind of cars I would probably rewire if I had that resource available to me inside my shop... ...the correct answer is any of them, but still...
Okay the dust has settled so to speak. Around 10:30ish the statement is made. To paraphrase "let's turn it off and then back on for those..........." The old thought of I just need it to work. It matters not that the problem isn't solved. It's working....for now. Have a great day. Tight lines.
I’ve had that map sensor problem for a long time never logged it until one day I decided to add it to the log and it would max out the Omni at 40 when hot
It depends on whether or not there's boost. Gains are exponential with boost, more so than it is with fuel type. Look at the differences between the wastegate pressure and high boost with 93 octane that I showed. Note the 117 foot pound of torque increase between start and finish after turning the boost up. So basically, I did previously did do that, and it's in the performance subwoofer video... but on a normally-aspirated car, 5-10% gains from it are typically pretty easy, and any increase in power is an increase in its overall efficiency. It doesn't look as impressive as a car that you can also turn up the boost on would look, but you'd still be able to tell.
It would be incredibly nice if we got the software on that ecu and u derstand how it's estimating that AFR values. It's obvious that something is not okay either in sensor input or some overlooked edge case in calculation that is messing with the value.
Search "ECMlink 101 Initial checks". There may be something I did wrong, but in 2010, AFRest changed in an update and is no longer automatic. There is likely some user-supplied data there that I need to update, but Matt may have done it while he was in there. I haven't quit digging, I just fudged my MAP signal enough to get good pulls for now. It's 100% in the math somewhere. Abe's scope proved that.
E85 can get pretty interesting with pushing AFRs, I ended up running cruise AFR of around 16:1, spool at around 13.5-12.9 and full load AFRs of 12.5~ I truly think if tuned and treated properly the efficiency losses of E85 aren't really that bad. I ended up daily driving my STi on E85 and only lost ~100km per tank when compared to traditional fuel.
Yeah for sure. I roll around in a pretty efficient engine these days (relatively speaking), and at an E60 blend without being hard into boost all the time, I don't particularly notice a big drop in fuel economy.
Engine Mounts Polyurethane ones ? Did you ever swap to them by chance? Nice pull 392 hp on a broken clutch. Electronic gremlins are horrible now watching this video it made me think that the throttle position sensor has a bug or dead spot. Be safe and keep going.
Hot map sensor will cause this along with condensation. I had a celebrity eurosport and gm had the map sensor in the farthest corner of the engine bay. I thought that was crazy to have a 4 foot vacuum tube. So I moved it closer and bang exactly what happen to your car happened to me it would over volt and kill the car. But different part number map for my fiero and it sits right next to egr valve and has been fine for 30 years. MAP sensors need to sit flat with the vacuum port pointing straight down and above the source of vacuum. This keep condensation out of the sensor cell.
@@Jafromobile heat will kill it over time to. The firewall mount is good just rotate it so the nipple points toward the ground. The vacuum line also needs to be smooth flowing to it. You don't want allow it to build condensation and have it shove it up the line. You are also running methanol injection that is basically injecting steam into the intake. Long as you have good vacuum at idle the line should stay clear and with the sensor nipple pointing down it should keep water out. Ps I had linked a white paper for the sensor in an earlier post but it got flagged for spam
Now correct me if I'm wrong but looking at the SD table it looks like it needs a global change. Looks like he is underreporting the airmass which will skew the load factor
Some days I wonder if it's worth it to double or triple the wires in a wiring harness so that every wire has indicators on it like an LED or digital display or something -- just so it meets the goal of glowing to indicate that electricity is running through it as expected. As with many problems, once I can visualize it, I can fix it. Other days I wonder if it's worth it to get rid of the old one-wire-per-signal system and replace it with TCP/IP. But most days I just fiddle with the 32-year-old wiring until it works well enough to get going again, knowing that someday the whole thing is gonna have to be redone.
I can see it now... The o2 sensor gets the new MAP sensor's IP address, steals it's identity, plants some malware... the MAP sensor begins DDoSing its own port on the ECU. My Norton subscription has expired so now I'm at Best Buy talking to the geek squad tryna get this malware removed so I can get my car to start... ...and now all I get is ADS on my RADIO!!!
@@Jafromobile imagine hitting the accelerator to make some donuts in the parking lot, and the pedal wants you to first accept cookies. :-) I wish it was a joke, but my garage door updated it's privacy policy, and wanted me to click to agree to a very long legal contract written by corporate lawyers for the benefit of the corporation before it would let me into my house. This is why I have a new garage door opener.
@@WilliamDye-willdyeI've actually had an idea similar to this for quite a while to make the dashboard of a car look like a circuit board with indicator lights for every function taking place. Purely aesthetic for like a showcar, but I just thought it would be fun. Also good for education if you will.
Your brain lit up the same brain cell addresses that mine did at one point. That's why it was so nice to have Abe here with the scope for a whole day of dyno pulls. There wasn't any noise in the input voltage or the sensor outputs, and if there was EMI or RFI, that scope would have found it.
@@Jafromobilemy electronic mind kinda doubts the ECU/the ADC in the ECU. I would pull the ECU and replace any electrolytic cap that it uses. And I would send the logs to ECS tuning and ask for their opinion on what can amplify noise on the math section.
I know. And look at the knock on those logs. The knock is real, which we always thought was a lie because it loves doing it where it shouldn't... and that indicates a problem that I've apparently built into it. So I have to run it a bit fat like that to keep it from pulling all my timing out. I have a plan for that one day, but this is how I have to do it for now.
It might be, but don't forget what chassis this is! How impractical it is to turn a 30 year old 4-door Elantra into a race car? Much larger gains could be made just by putting all this in something else. That would actually cost less and be easier to do than a different ECM system at this stage. Some of the joy of this is not being a thoroughbred.
@@Jafromobile megasquirt systems aren't that expensive, and it might add some more life to the car. And yes, it's not a race car, but even if you don't want it to be, it's slowly evolving into one🤣🤣🤣
The Omni sensors have been through the costing department once or twice too many times in recent years and their quality has tumbled as a result. I won't touch them anymore, AEM 5 bar and done, never had one fail.
Certainly good advice. Matt and Abe actually helped Omni figure out what was going sideways, I just don't know where in the supply chain to get the new one? Could just be that I cooked it? If this one goes, I'll AEM next.
@@jdxnc04 The one I just got is not a Omni brand. Looks very similar, but it's someone else's? The spikes are happening somewhere in the math in the ECU. Has to be because we scoped every input used in it for anomalies and all the signals were clean. There were no fluctuations in any of the 5 or 12v sensor circuits or their outputs. None of the values except for AFRest and Injon show any fluctuations or spikes at all. AFRest is calculated from inputs, All the sensor signals are steady and smooth both in the logs and on the scope. I did a lot of research on this issue with Robert and in the ECU forums and other people had the same issue, several open-ended posts about airflow smoothing... The only people who had success fixing it far enough to stop posting used airflow smoothing. I'm not sure an AEM sensor would fix this? But someday when I go that route and make provisions for a different style of sensor, I'll turn airflow smoothing off and see what happens? In the meantime, I wish I had a better speed sensor input, but I've got a 1990 transmission. So naturally I'm left with the 30 year old Hyundai gauge cluster doing all the speed signal work. That's the only sensor or part I haven't replaced?
@@Jafromobile I'm assuming it's a 90 DSM ecu in the Hyundai? Perhaps it's time it gets a hand me down 2g ECU from the GSX. I can't say I've ever see an issue like this with the 2g ecu and it would also use the 2g speed sensor natively.
It's not an impossibility... I considered putting it in one of my Galants because I thought it would be pretty fancy? My 2g ECU needs a V3 upgrade, though. Hmmmmm...... Hhmmmmmmmmmmm....
You can tell it's running rich because it's pulling 10% out in the trims? Isn't that indication that it's *not* running rich, *because* it pulled that fuel out? If your trims are pegged to the max (typically 20%), you'd be either rich or lean. But you kind of need to look at the o2 to know for sure, don't you? According to your WB you were hovering around stoich. Is this an aftermarket ecu idiosyncracy?
Correct. It is not running rich, but only because it pulled the fuel out. The condition of it wanting more fuel than it's delivering in order to run correctly means the tune is rich. There are several places where it is pulling 20+%. The Wideband says I'm stoich, but it's having to pull the fuel to get there. I'd qualify that as rich all day long. I'm glad the fuel is not getting there, but I'd prefer my fuel ±0 instead of 20 points either way. That's when I'm confident with the tune. But truth be told, my Wideband sensor meters .4 points lean. That means when it's spot on, it's actually .4 points rich. I might try some other Wideband systems and see if I can get one that's closer?
How does the WMI play with E85? I’d assume it’s off when you’re running that? Then when it sees less ethanol content it turn on the WMI? She’ll be in the 400hp easily with the new clutch. Would you show how you pop the TOB out when you do a clutch job? That was the hardest part for me when I did my last clutch job. Just would like to see how you handle that aspect of a clutch job. Fantastic video brother! I’ll be watching this over and over and taking notes.
You're going to hate how easy I have it with the clutch. 1g/2g stuff ain't like yours. You've got a pull style clutch, not a pusher like DSMs do. People are freakin' out because I'm telling you this without you saying the word Evo... but on ol' blue it will be like the Hyundai. You'll need a F/W5M33 on that one. Don't try to do that with the KM210.
I missed part of this. Against Matt's best advice, I still have the kit active. It's complicated to explain why, but it's staying. Cliff notes include e85 isn't available everywhere, this car needs knock suppression with gasoline, it's a progressive controller with failsafes, I lose the failsafes without the controller, and, it was a Christmas gift from my dad.
@@Jafromobile gotcha, good to know. I am going to convert to flex fuel on the Evo eventually. Ole Blue will likely get that from the start, since we finally have E85 in my area now. I always wonder would it better to just run 93 pump with an additive?
Nah, there's a tiny little turbo in there that I got one bay for $224 new. It's a TD05H 20g. But the engine block is a stock non-turbo galant block. Stock crank, rods, OE replacement non-turbo pistons. Fel-Pro head gasket, 1.6L Elantra DOHC head. Clutch, cams, valve springs, turbo, manifold, and o2 housing are leftover parts from my old GSX 7-bolt. They fit. Somewhere everything has broken or blown up and been put back to use. This really shouldn't work. But both the cylinder head and everything below the head gasket are all factory stock parts from normally-aspirated cars. I did put ARP mains in it on its last rebuild, but I really didn't need to at all. They were just cheaper than new factory main bolts.
@@Jafromobile I did not realise that was a non-turbo bottom end! I assume the N/t Galants used the same compression ratios as the N/T dsm 4g's or are they different?
Yes. 9:1 cr. It's a 10cc dome piston. Both the head and block have been machined so far past its service limits that I had to make them fit by opening up their fly cuts. Valve clearance was tricky on this one. The Elantra engine assembly videos are some of my best work. "DOHC valve timing" and "fighting the valve clearance" are the best parts, I think, but the whole build is here in HD.
no not an act extreme.. .its extreme pedal pressure and shock to your drivetrain. also get ready for a new master/slave. do yourself a favor just go with a clutchmasters or maybe even a twin disc. i dont wanna say i told you so.. ive been there already. huge headache. the psi plate being so stiff causes excess pedal pressure and hyd psi in the system. causing the fluid to overcome the seals sealing power. but your left leg will get much bigger from the daily workouts.
The clutch in it is an ACT Extreme 2600. I just pushed through a 2600 lol. The 6-puck uses the exact same pressure plate, so it's going to be the same as it is right now, actually. I've used the XT2600 in all of my projects so far, and yes, RCLS is real!
@@lostwill86 Yes. My forensic analysis reveals this car was likely under a fallen tree at one point. There was damage to the rear C-pillar, and that section of the roof that were previously "repaired" with bondo, which has since waterlogged and flaked off, revealing a bare metal spot that rusted. It was found in the junkyard this way, poorly repainted but otherwise appeared straight, and with only 53,000 miles on the clock. The whole car was picked up and set on a flatbed to be hauled away to this new life.
I wish there was a way I could get in contact with you man I love all your videos and I watch them all the time I have a 2005 evo and need so much of your help and opinion can I some how give you my email or something like that or are you on the evo forms?
This channel of one of the few channels on TH-cam that is criminally undersubscribed. There is a great sense of satisfaction knowing that I’ve followed Jafro religiously throughout the years. Such a gem for the TH-cam car community.
Sub'd since Foofy
Yes, send all the idiots to prison!
@@muffinmonsta5302 back in the day, Jafro was the only channel that actually detailed the process of rebuilding an engine. I learned how to use specialized tools like bore gauge and micrometer from Jafro. Jafro shows the real struggle of real car guys. Most of the other shows fail to show the in between stuff.
He got me with the Colt. The kung fu sound effects when the was doin the trans tunnel.
Killed me.
Aaroncake is criminally unsubscribed
392 horsepower in an elantra has got to be scary as hell. would love to know how much money is actually in this car right now. Jafro always kills it with the videos
It's really... not much at all... It's a timing belt, water pump and gasket set, a wiring harness, handful of sensors, a 3" exhaust cutout, a cheap Amazon fuel system, about $700 worth of stereo equipment. That's about it... the water methanol kit was a gift from my stepdad, and the car was free. Everything else that went into it were used hand-me-downs and leftover scraps. Probably $3,000 tops?
And with minimum wage labor figured in he's around $50k or so...
@@Milkmans_Son sweat equity has a value of 0$/hr in shitboxes. Its the shitbox way.
@@leefhead1 You mean he's not going to come out ahead if he sells it? Well no shit.
He didn't ask about value or equity, he asked how much he had into the car.
@@Milkmans_Son Actually, this might be the only one where it might have me on top? Probably by only a small margin, but I could easily ruin that.
A clutch not holding the power is better than breaking things. Thanks for taking us for the learning curve drive! Great video!
O heck yeah doood! It's even better when there's a good used 6-puck sprung clutch for your exact car sitting on the shelf in front of the dyno where you burned it up! Wait until you see how it comes back...
@@Jafromobile well now we are in suspense - don’t let us wait long.
Love the video Jafro! Still in awe of how many extensions you have at the ready! 😂
We miss your videos Tom!
Man I'd be just fine with that power all day, make a riot of a street car. Thanks for helping waste my evening in portland waiting to get out of here.
My 6500lb truck is a blast with that much power! My Elantra weighs 2650.
@@Jafromobile Your truck really weights 6500lbs?! in a gasser? my 2nd gen cummins only weights 400 more pounds! nuts!
As a smart man once said "want to go faster add more power. Want to go faster everywhere? add lightness"
I have no clue how much power my 1g with 2.3 stroker with a e3 16g and 3inch exhaust makes but it sure feels lightyears faster then any of my 2g's feel.....really need to get them tuned as well.
2013 F-150 SuperCrew. Last of the steel bodies. Gen 1 Coyote.
When I was pulling the trailer for the previous video, I got worse gas mileage with the trailer empty than I did with it full. I got .1mpg less with it empty. I added 4,000lbs between the truck bed and the trailer and got better... I just... ?!?!?!? I know why now... but just *feels* wrong.
The Godly Extension method. Only those worthy of a DSM can wield its power. Many have tried and failed but Jafro prevails.
I'd watch the 4 hour tuning video! Haha. Great video, loved watching you troubleshoot and fix each thing. So close!!
Impressive power out of that little beast. Can't wait to see the next drag runs!
Drastic changes coming this winter! Hilarity will ensue!
Hahaha that's awesome you're so close to Ballenger! For what it's worth, I know those GM MAP sensors are still popular, but they are an ancient design at this point. There are newer style GM sensors, mostly made by Bosch now I believe, pretty much all MAP sensors seem to be Bosch now haha. Just saying it might be worth upgrading to a new piece of kit that is designed for a hotter engine bay, more vibration, and faster response. 😁
This is the same advice I give other people, lol! I approached this using the scientific method, attempting to change only one variable instead of several. Matt and Abe have put a lot of work in to troubleshooting Omni sensors to the point where their discoveries led to them changing the product. This sensor is not an Omni, but it fits all the other criteria of your post... yes, it's a rescaled piece of ancient technology. And it's plugged into an even older ECU that has a 17.7 Hz refresh rate. lol!
@@Jafromobile Hahaha love that. I pretty much assumed that you knew everything I said, but at the same time if you say nothing at all, nobody will ever know anything! I definitely appreciate and enjoy watching your process.
@@802Garage Awww, don't give me too much credit! I just work here? lol
@@Jafromobile 😂 AND A LOT OF WORK IT IS!
Glad to see another video I always enjoy them, I look forward to seeing how much more power it makes with the upgraded clutch.
I have to get so much stuff out of my way to do this one... lol... I'm working on alternative means of speeding it up. I'm just as anxious as you are.
As someone who is an avid TH-cam watcher, you are one of the only channels I would watch no matter how long the video was.
You've done it again, you've inspired me to continue struggling with my Legacy GT. Fantastic work on the video Jafro.
That turbo is putting in work I was for sure thinking it’s going to be the bottleneck
Oh yes, it's totally the bottleneck. 100%! I'm way off the compressor map here. It's still 150hp more than one wheel drive can use.
Best. TH-camr. Ever. ❤❤
Not bad numbers!
Really makes me miss my old S12 Nissan, 2300LBS chassis with a 400+HP SR20 swap... That thing was a rocket, no one in town wanted to race me at the time, they knew better. lol
this really makes me excited to work on my own car
Thanks, Jafro, geeky to the max! Never mind the clutch, I think it cooked my brain. I will watch this again later.
Having been there for most of the YT life of the Elantra, it really feels good seeing you getting the car sorted and running so good. Looking forward to seeing whats next.
Wpadłeś mi przypadkiem i zadziwiłeś mnie.
Muszę obejrzeć przed pytaniami Twoje filmy
I had a similar issue happen with my MPA sensor. Sadly it happened on a 600 mile road trip and the car would shut down while driving. Sometimes it would start back up immediately. Other times, it took forever to restart. It took a while to track it down, but a tuning friend caught it in a log. Glad you found your issue as well.
40 PSI at idle, baby! Achievement unlocked!
Seeing the notification from a jafro upload 🙌🏽 great video as always
Ballenger is great. I have picked up a few electrical connectors from them.
6:21 Ohh this gives me all the feelz for "Tool Time" w/Tim the "Toolman" Taylor.
Thank you for another great video!! Don't know anything of the tuning part but learning a lot each video. Only thing that I want to say is you need more stiffer engine mounts lol! :D
Really hoping to see this thing at The Shootout next year!
Wild. Love the work you put in. Thanks for sharing.
6:07 I needed that laugh this morning, nice :D
Man that car is journey in it self but one of good fun and learning....
I was looking back into when i started following you.... And that was the chainsav video of the big tree went down
I like this trend where I dyno it every time it gets a mod. New subwoofers? Put 'er on the dyno!
@@Jafromobile should be standart Test of cars and engines! :D
Jafro is a genius btw
Way off topic but its your current video. I have binged on your channel for about a week now. I love your videos and commentary. I would love to see a w5m33 teardown from you. I can even donate a bad transmission lmao
It's in the timeline, but I might take you up on that, lol! 1g or 2g?
@Jafromobile 2g gsx. Out of a 97 talon. Has no 1st gear. Sourced a good trans and tcase from a 96 i found but i was either gonna try and learn to rebuild it myself or send it out. If you're serious we can talk off TH-cam
Awesome video, love the detail. Looking forward to more.
I added a ground directly from battery to ecu grounds near the mpi relay. This clean up my afrest signal.
FYI, I heard this... Thank you!
Another great video, As Always.
I love this kind of automotive sleuthing. Even though none of it will directly apply to me the concepts shared are going in the toolbox for a later date. Now how about that 4hr directors cut?
I learn something every time I work with Abe. Every time.
Give us the 4 hours!!! Give it to us now! Some of us enjoy watching dyno tune videos.
also i had the same temp problem as you back in the day! it turned out to be my mdp/map sensor!!!! exactly the same problem!
...why?!?!? Why dinchoo say something?!?!?!? LOL! :P
great video jafro!!!
Some guy at Hyundai is out of his mind for not sponsoring this channel yet.
Was really hoping you’d find the cause of that weird electrical issue, it was sounding similar to mine but slightly different.
My 8th gen galant with the 6a13tt will start up fine, idle, and rev like normal, however after a few minutes the car shuts itself off, no engine light, and then won’t start again. Have to wait an hour or more before I can try again, which made me think it was heat related. I’ve changed the ecu, cam sensor, checked the ifs, temp sensors, maf, but to no avail. I don’t have an evo scan and not really sure where to look next, other than sending it to a shop, which I really can’t afford, I’ve got a crank sensor to try next but dreading the job.
But your videos given me some new motivation to try again on the troubleshooting path
Not sure if it was just my car but I use to get my map reading from that pcv port on the intake and me and my tuner found the map readings all over the place so I moved it to a different port and have a much cleaner map reading and tuning went smoother.
Likely because of a leak. One of the reasons it's a bad place for this is because the diameter of the nipple is more than twice that of the MAP sensor. That means it's going to be a bad fit on either one end of the hose or the other. It's why I used a smaller hose that had to be painstakingly stretched over the manifold port, and worm-gear clamped onto the sensor side. If it starts farting over ? PSI or under # vacuum, then you basically brought the ants with you to your picnic. I was aware of this and took precautions for it that proved to hold up, but it's still a problem with such wildly-different-sized barbs.
Next up on jafro: i convert my cheap 4g63 elantra to awd! Hahaha the power and torque this thing makes is seriously impressive
Shhhh... hey, no spoilers!
@Jafromobile LOL hey you DO have to pull the trans to change the clutch after all 😉
I missed you jafro. For some reason TH-cam didn't notify me :(
I'm still waiting to see the chandelier swing during a launch. Looking forward to see it.
d'awwwww! I have to make a swivel mount for it now... that kinda does need to happen, but I don't know if it has enough weight to actually sway. It's so tiny and the dang thing has a rigid mount. I'm trying to get a 3D printed medallion for it to mount it on and to hide the 3V inverter.
@@JafromobileIf it moves or shakes one bit I'm happy, I still can laugh about the battle between the elantra and the truck.
There could be worse problems on dyno day than needing more clutch, lol. I'd say that's a congrats in order, honestly.
I agree! Not to shabby for a grocery getter!
I had an Omni 4bar on my STi for about 4 weeks before it kicked the bucket and read 3.5psi constantly.
Thankfully I still had my stock MAP sensor and was still running a MAF/SD hybrid tune so it wasn't so much of an issue, but still annoying as hell!
the best thing about buying a used clutch for the Hyundai is that it came with a free Galant!
Actually that one's a leftover from Matt's pile. But indeed great things are happening right now with that Galant! You will see soon!
I would suggest probing the ecu to see if the readings are similar at the sensors. Like you said could be induced noise.
I get pretty much all my wiring stuff from Ballenger ❤️
Happy to give you the tour! They're awesome! The kind of cars I would probably rewire if I had that resource available to me inside my shop... ...the correct answer is any of them, but still...
Okay the dust has settled so to speak. Around 10:30ish the statement is made. To paraphrase "let's turn it off and then back on for those..........." The old thought of I just need it to work. It matters not that the problem isn't solved. It's working....for now. Have a great day. Tight lines.
I’ve had that map sensor problem for a long time never logged it until one day I decided to add it to the log and it would max out the Omni at 40 when hot
Now I'm wondering what could be gained by re-tuning a pre-ethanol engine. Probably not a ton but it'd be fun to see
It depends on whether or not there's boost. Gains are exponential with boost, more so than it is with fuel type. Look at the differences between the wastegate pressure and high boost with 93 octane that I showed. Note the 117 foot pound of torque increase between start and finish after turning the boost up. So basically, I did previously did do that, and it's in the performance subwoofer video... but on a normally-aspirated car, 5-10% gains from it are typically pretty easy, and any increase in power is an increase in its overall efficiency. It doesn't look as impressive as a car that you can also turn up the boost on would look, but you'd still be able to tell.
It would be incredibly nice if we got the software on that ecu and u derstand how it's estimating that AFR values. It's obvious that something is not okay either in sensor input or some overlooked edge case in calculation that is messing with the value.
Search "ECMlink 101 Initial checks". There may be something I did wrong, but in 2010, AFRest changed in an update and is no longer automatic. There is likely some user-supplied data there that I need to update, but Matt may have done it while he was in there. I haven't quit digging, I just fudged my MAP signal enough to get good pulls for now. It's 100% in the math somewhere. Abe's scope proved that.
E85 can get pretty interesting with pushing AFRs, I ended up running cruise AFR of around 16:1, spool at around 13.5-12.9 and full load AFRs of 12.5~
I truly think if tuned and treated properly the efficiency losses of E85 aren't really that bad.
I ended up daily driving my STi on E85 and only lost ~100km per tank when compared to traditional fuel.
Yeah for sure. I roll around in a pretty efficient engine these days (relatively speaking), and at an E60 blend without being hard into boost all the time, I don't particularly notice a big drop in fuel economy.
Engine Mounts
Polyurethane ones ? Did you ever swap to them by chance?
Nice pull 392 hp on a broken clutch.
Electronic gremlins are horrible now watching this video it made me think that the throttle position sensor has a bug or dead spot.
Be safe and keep going.
The roll stopper mounts are windowelded. TPS would show on the log or the scope. I will totally get 400 out of this turbo before I quit it.
Hot map sensor will cause this along with condensation. I had a celebrity eurosport and gm had the map sensor in the farthest corner of the engine bay. I thought that was crazy to have a 4 foot vacuum tube. So I moved it closer and bang exactly what happen to your car happened to me it would over volt and kill the car. But different part number map for my fiero and it sits right next to egr valve and has been fine for 30 years. MAP sensors need to sit flat with the vacuum port pointing straight down and above the source of vacuum. This keep condensation out of the sensor cell.
If you can't mount with the vacuum port straight down, you can perhaps also install the sensor on your 270°F cam angle sensor and burn it all off?
@@Jafromobile heat will kill it over time to. The firewall mount is good just rotate it so the nipple points toward the ground. The vacuum line also needs to be smooth flowing to it. You don't want allow it to build condensation and have it shove it up the line. You are also running methanol injection that is basically injecting steam into the intake. Long as you have good vacuum at idle the line should stay clear and with the sensor nipple pointing down it should keep water out. Ps I had linked a white paper for the sensor in an earlier post but it got flagged for spam
Now correct me if I'm wrong but looking at the SD table it looks like it needs a global change. Looks like he is underreporting the airmass which will skew the load factor
Man...that EXTRA long tool was totally unnecessary! 🤣🤣
I’d watch a 4 hour video from you.
I'm never sick of looking at that log. Those sorts of home build weir intermittent issues eh.
mine on E85 Makes more than 5th gear holds
At 37:28 there is a puff of smoke from somewhere front right, is that important?
i think u need to drill sum speed holes in the hood / bumper that should fix the heat soak issue and also add 4 mayb 5 hp
Some days I wonder if it's worth it to double or triple the wires in a wiring harness so that every wire has indicators on it like an LED or digital display or something -- just so it meets the goal of glowing to indicate that electricity is running through it as expected. As with many problems, once I can visualize it, I can fix it. Other days I wonder if it's worth it to get rid of the old one-wire-per-signal system and replace it with TCP/IP. But most days I just fiddle with the 32-year-old wiring until it works well enough to get going again, knowing that someday the whole thing is gonna have to be redone.
I can see it now... The o2 sensor gets the new MAP sensor's IP address, steals it's identity, plants some malware... the MAP sensor begins DDoSing its own port on the ECU. My Norton subscription has expired so now I'm at Best Buy talking to the geek squad tryna get this malware removed so I can get my car to start... ...and now all I get is ADS on my RADIO!!!
@@Jafromobile imagine hitting the accelerator to make some donuts in the parking lot, and the pedal wants you to first accept cookies. :-)
I wish it was a joke, but my garage door updated it's privacy policy, and wanted me to click to agree to a very long legal contract written by corporate lawyers for the benefit of the corporation before it would let me into my house. This is why I have a new garage door opener.
@@WilliamDye-willdyeI've actually had an idea similar to this for quite a while to make the dashboard of a car look like a circuit board with indicator lights for every function taking place. Purely aesthetic for like a showcar, but I just thought it would be fun. Also good for education if you will.
You could try shielding the map sensor like they do with Guitar electronics
Your brain lit up the same brain cell addresses that mine did at one point. That's why it was so nice to have Abe here with the scope for a whole day of dyno pulls. There wasn't any noise in the input voltage or the sensor outputs, and if there was EMI or RFI, that scope would have found it.
@@Jafromobilemy electronic mind kinda doubts the ECU/the ADC in the ECU. I would pull the ECU and replace any electrolytic cap that it uses. And I would send the logs to ECS tuning and ask for their opinion on what can amplify noise on the math section.
Cheers
❤
ELANTRA VIDEO RAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
Old style but with a dyno instead of a track! I think the shop was a good move for the channel!
The schematic for the CAS looks like it's fiberoptic or a laser diode...
Dude, 10s is super fat on e85. That thing has quite a bit left in it. What was the timing up top?
I know. And look at the knock on those logs. The knock is real, which we always thought was a lie because it loves doing it where it shouldn't... and that indicates a problem that I've apparently built into it. So I have to run it a bit fat like that to keep it from pulling all my timing out. I have a plan for that one day, but this is how I have to do it for now.
Maybe it's the ancient dsm ecu? Maybe time to get crazy and put a megasquirt ecu on it? Or spend the coin and get a haltech or?
It might be, but don't forget what chassis this is! How impractical it is to turn a 30 year old 4-door Elantra into a race car? Much larger gains could be made just by putting all this in something else. That would actually cost less and be easier to do than a different ECM system at this stage. Some of the joy of this is not being a thoroughbred.
@@Jafromobile megasquirt systems aren't that expensive, and it might add some more life to the car. And yes, it's not a race car, but even if you don't want it to be, it's slowly evolving into one🤣🤣🤣
Cool video , but why not throw in a new clutch instead some old stuff
Because this car was built entirely from used parts. No foolin'! It's a free car built from 3 people's spare scrap parts.
Pretty sure i saw him smirk when it slipped
The Omni sensors have been through the costing department once or twice too many times in recent years and their quality has tumbled as a result. I won't touch them anymore, AEM 5 bar and done, never had one fail.
Certainly good advice. Matt and Abe actually helped Omni figure out what was going sideways, I just don't know where in the supply chain to get the new one? Could just be that I cooked it? If this one goes, I'll AEM next.
@@JafromobileThey seem to just glitch out randomly, even when mounted to the firewall. Changed manufacturer at some point maybe?
@@jdxnc04 The one I just got is not a Omni brand. Looks very similar, but it's someone else's? The spikes are happening somewhere in the math in the ECU. Has to be because we scoped every input used in it for anomalies and all the signals were clean. There were no fluctuations in any of the 5 or 12v sensor circuits or their outputs. None of the values except for AFRest and Injon show any fluctuations or spikes at all. AFRest is calculated from inputs, All the sensor signals are steady and smooth both in the logs and on the scope.
I did a lot of research on this issue with Robert and in the ECU forums and other people had the same issue, several open-ended posts about airflow smoothing... The only people who had success fixing it far enough to stop posting used airflow smoothing. I'm not sure an AEM sensor would fix this? But someday when I go that route and make provisions for a different style of sensor, I'll turn airflow smoothing off and see what happens?
In the meantime, I wish I had a better speed sensor input, but I've got a 1990 transmission. So naturally I'm left with the 30 year old Hyundai gauge cluster doing all the speed signal work. That's the only sensor or part I haven't replaced?
@@Jafromobile I'm assuming it's a 90 DSM ecu in the Hyundai? Perhaps it's time it gets a hand me down 2g ECU from the GSX. I can't say I've ever see an issue like this with the 2g ecu and it would also use the 2g speed sensor natively.
It's not an impossibility... I considered putting it in one of my Galants because I thought it would be pretty fancy? My 2g ECU needs a V3 upgrade, though. Hmmmmm...... Hhmmmmmmmmmmm....
I've got an old clutch you can try 😂👍
Is this why haltech puts the map in the box
This would be one good reason, yes.
You can tell it's running rich because it's pulling 10% out in the trims? Isn't that indication that it's *not* running rich, *because* it pulled that fuel out? If your trims are pegged to the max (typically 20%), you'd be either rich or lean. But you kind of need to look at the o2 to know for sure, don't you? According to your WB you were hovering around stoich.
Is this an aftermarket ecu idiosyncracy?
Correct. It is not running rich, but only because it pulled the fuel out. The condition of it wanting more fuel than it's delivering in order to run correctly means the tune is rich. There are several places where it is pulling 20+%. The Wideband says I'm stoich, but it's having to pull the fuel to get there. I'd qualify that as rich all day long. I'm glad the fuel is not getting there, but I'd prefer my fuel ±0 instead of 20 points either way. That's when I'm confident with the tune.
But truth be told, my Wideband sensor meters .4 points lean. That means when it's spot on, it's actually .4 points rich. I might try some other Wideband systems and see if I can get one that's closer?
How does the WMI play with E85? I’d assume it’s off when you’re running that? Then when it sees less ethanol content it turn on the WMI? She’ll be in the 400hp easily with the new clutch. Would you show how you pop the TOB out when you do a clutch job? That was the hardest part for me when I did my last clutch job. Just would like to see how you handle that aspect of a clutch job. Fantastic video brother! I’ll be watching this over and over and taking notes.
You're going to hate how easy I have it with the clutch. 1g/2g stuff ain't like yours. You've got a pull style clutch, not a pusher like DSMs do. People are freakin' out because I'm telling you this without you saying the word Evo... but on ol' blue it will be like the Hyundai. You'll need a F/W5M33 on that one. Don't try to do that with the KM210.
I missed part of this. Against Matt's best advice, I still have the kit active. It's complicated to explain why, but it's staying. Cliff notes include e85 isn't available everywhere, this car needs knock suppression with gasoline, it's a progressive controller with failsafes, I lose the failsafes without the controller, and, it was a Christmas gift from my dad.
@@Jafromobile gotcha, good to know. I am going to convert to flex fuel on the Evo eventually. Ole Blue will likely get that from the start, since we finally have E85 in my area now. I always wonder would it better to just run 93 pump with an additive?
392 naturally aspirated?
did you miss the front mount?? no not naturally aspirated, stock internals tho.
Nah, there's a tiny little turbo in there that I got one bay for $224 new. It's a TD05H 20g. But the engine block is a stock non-turbo galant block. Stock crank, rods, OE replacement non-turbo pistons. Fel-Pro head gasket, 1.6L Elantra DOHC head. Clutch, cams, valve springs, turbo, manifold, and o2 housing are leftover parts from my old GSX 7-bolt. They fit. Somewhere everything has broken or blown up and been put back to use. This really shouldn't work. But both the cylinder head and everything below the head gasket are all factory stock parts from normally-aspirated cars. I did put ARP mains in it on its last rebuild, but I really didn't need to at all. They were just cheaper than new factory main bolts.
@@Jafromobile I did not realise that was a non-turbo bottom end! I assume the N/t Galants used the same compression ratios as the N/T dsm 4g's or are they different?
Yes. 9:1 cr. It's a 10cc dome piston. Both the head and block have been machined so far past its service limits that I had to make them fit by opening up their fly cuts. Valve clearance was tricky on this one. The Elantra engine assembly videos are some of my best work. "DOHC valve timing" and "fighting the valve clearance" are the best parts, I think, but the whole build is here in HD.
...but it's really 9.875:1cr. I'm using a 1.6L Elantra head that's 4cc's smaller per dome. This is why it likes Ethanol so much.
no not an act extreme.. .its extreme pedal pressure and shock to your drivetrain. also get ready for a new master/slave. do yourself a favor just go with a clutchmasters or maybe even a twin disc. i dont wanna say i told you so.. ive been there already. huge headache. the psi plate being so stiff causes excess pedal pressure and hyd psi in the system. causing the fluid to overcome the seals sealing power. but your left leg will get much bigger from the daily workouts.
The clutch in it is an ACT Extreme 2600. I just pushed through a 2600 lol. The 6-puck uses the exact same pressure plate, so it's going to be the same as it is right now, actually. I've used the XT2600 in all of my projects so far, and yes, RCLS is real!
Is that rust on the roof?
On which car? 2/6ths of them do, so depending on which one, probably.
@@Jafromobile on the hyundai above the drivers side back door. Or am I seeing things 🤔
@@lostwill86 Yes. My forensic analysis reveals this car was likely under a fallen tree at one point. There was damage to the rear C-pillar, and that section of the roof that were previously "repaired" with bondo, which has since waterlogged and flaked off, revealing a bare metal spot that rusted. It was found in the junkyard this way, poorly repainted but otherwise appeared straight, and with only 53,000 miles on the clock. The whole car was picked up and set on a flatbed to be hauled away to this new life.
@@Jafromobile with all the work you've put into that chassis it's probably worth looking at repairing it properly but appropriately for what she is
I hate the wiring in this car. LOL
:( Dang. I worked hard making it. ... and Abe said it was fine! But one thing is for sure... the clutch hates all of us!
thermal issues? that is easy, just dont run a hood lol
Was that an Idiocracy refernce? 🤣🤣
Check if you are subscribed, I just noticed I wasn't subscribed even though I subscribed years and years ago. 🤬
Omni sensors are crap
eBay gm sensors last longer
Welp there goes going to sleep on time
It's a better excuse than football.
Anyway, thank you Jafro. I'll watch like I usually do. Super happy that we get to see the Elantra again
@@Jafromobile I watch your channel more often than I watch football 😅
Wait until you see how this one comes back from this one...
@@Jafromobilemore Elantra coming! I love this car so much. Stinks about the problems, but I'm glad we get to see more
I wish there was a way I could get in contact with you man I love all your videos and I watch them all the time I have a 2005 evo and need so much of your help and opinion can I some how give you my email or something like that or are you on the evo forms?