I KNOW IT WARY NOT WEARY. Please don’t comment this correction. Thanks to the hundreds who have reminded me daily of my mistake 😐😂 SECOND EDIT! March 2022- we all left together as a group. The couple in the shelter, Jonathan, Smiley and I. Many are assuming we left the couple by themselves with Jordan. We did not. Additionally, many are asking why we didn’t call the cops when we left the shelter after meeting Jordan. He had just been released from jail and they couldn’t keep him in forever. At this time he only threatened other hikers and had some marijuana on him. Around 2 weeks later was the murder.
I have lived my entire life in appalacia over 70 years in the very rural part. I would never go into the woods without being armed, I listen well in the woods. If it gets intensly quiet you can bet someone you don"t see is there. The small animals will act differently very quickly. I would assess quickly if I come upon someone I did not know in the woods and TRUST YOUR GUT FEELING. If something don't feel right it probably isn't. I would never stay in a trail shelter,makes you too vulnerable. You have some good ideas and you will learn more as you go. Safety first always.
I live in the city and even here I listen to the wild life around me if I suspect something is off...the bugs like crickets are very helpful in this matter.
@@hadassahgrace5 The crickets will stop making noise when somethings not right or Predators are near by. Same with birds. If you're in the woods and you notice everything got really quiet all of a sudden, you better have your wits about you.
(Novel alert! lol) THIS. I am learning more and more about how all animals behave around humans. I've always known dogs could sense danger in humans (for the most part) but some wild animals are even more sensitive to it. Crows are my new favorite animals because I've learned not only can they sense a bad/dangerous person, they will remember their face and pass it on to their babies genetically to remember that face as "dangerous" too. This is such great advice that is rarely discussed and even more rarely taken seriously. Having been in several very sketchy situations myself, it is the absolute truth though! You'll feel it too. Don't ignore it. It's easy to question whether you're just being paranoid or not, but the difference will be in how you're breathing and what your thought pattern is. A true gut feeling, animalistic sense, will quiet everything down. You'll breathe slower and softer and can suddenly hear a pin drop. You'll be weirdly calm and will move smoother and a bit slower, but will still be highly alert. Jaw may be clenched as an attempt to silence your voice or loud breathing, and you will instinctively move your eyes more than your whole head when looking around for signs of danger. And this will happen instantaneously for "no reason." Then, you may figure out in a few seconds or a few minutes later why your body suddenly went into survival mode. On the other hand, paranoia or just fear/phobia will present itself very loudly and may feel overwhelming if it's bad enough. It's not the same for everyone across the board, but some things you could notice yourself doing is talking MORE and talking LOUDER, rather than getting quiet. Your breathing may get heavier immediately after a scary thought, and you'll want to take huge deep breaths but it might feel difficult to do. You'll make sudden movements and be whipping your head side to side to look for anything dangerous. Fingers and hands may be fidgety, and you'll have the urge to distract yourself either by looking at your phone or singing a song, etc...whereas a gut feeling will have you completely zeroed in on your surroundings and you won't want to take your eyes off of whatever is in front of you for even a second. (This is also why some people have trouble calling 911 immediately in terrifying situations. They may need a second for all of their senses to rush back to them before they grab their phones. On the other hand, some people instinctively grab their phones to call for help, but it's with a very smooth, natural movement and still without taking eyes off of the surroundings except to quickly glance down at the keypad to dial 911) And for skeptics, none of this even has to be spiritual in any way. I think there are so many clues our nervous system picks up on that we as humans still just aren't aware of yet. For example, maybe people who are on the brink of violence emit a very subtle "stress" odor or maybe their breathing pattern is specific enough for our brains to recognize without realizing it. Just like crows, our genetics have been passed down to be more aware of particular dangers.
As a 32 yr seasoned retired game warden told me that he never goes into the woods unarmed. After telling me some stories, I understood why. Take that for what's it worth.
I was hiking in early spring through the Victorian Alpine country (Australia) so there was still about a foot of snow around and going was slow and tough. As I approached a hut I saw a man with a proper chopping axe, cutting wood and thought that was really out of place. Most people don't hike with a heavy chopping axe. When I passed him to go and sign into the hut, I said hi and he replied but it was a cold response. I opened the door of the hut and a dog cut sick at me and he laughed and said he would grab his dog so I could go in. I was on edge already and dogs aren't allowed up there so I was getting more apprehensive. I signed in and left. I got about 300m away and heard the dog growling and trying to run through the snow after me. I pulled out a knife and thought I would give the dog my arm and then knife it in the chest. With the dog bearing down on me the guy then yells "are you going to fk'en knife my dog" and starts heading towards me with the axe in hand. Thankfully I was fit and the dog couldn't get any speed up nor could this guy, so I kept on walking over a ridge. I was freaking out for the next few kilometres as they had a perfect set of prints to follow in the snow. I ended up going a long route home to avoid any possibility I would cross paths with him again.
That's horrifying, and I'm really glad you're okay. That's a suspicious situation, and I hope no one else was harmed. Other countries outside the U.S. handle guns WAY better, but it makes me nervous to think of not being able to have pepper gel/spray or a stun gun/taser. 😶
Hornet spray makes a good stand in for pepper spray. Heck a can of WD40 could work as a distraction. The advantage of hornet spray is it goes a good distance, but if you need to habe a reason to have something while hiking I could see saying, "Well I had the DW40 in case any of my zippers get stuck." In the states you can get little cans of it. Maybe that is an idea. If it can help any hikers reading this comment...
@@dasta7658 Should have never let your government un-arm you! The radicals here in the US are trying to use mass shootings to do that. But having a constitution makes us more protected from government over-reach!
As a retired firearms instructor, I want everyone to own, train with, and carry a gun. But they're not for everyone. I also teach Rule #1 - Situational Awareness is Everything! Your pre-planning for and execution of situational awareness and safety planning is amazing. And it is also now demonstrably proven having survived a mentally ill murderer. Very well done.
It's always a good idea to carry while in the woods. Never mind the animals that might be a problem, humans are the most dangerous thing you could possibly run into out there, and if they try any funny business a gun is an excellent deterrent (or tool if you are forced to use it). Show it to no one unless they are an immediate threat, don't talk about it, basically let no one except the people you're hiking with know that you're carrying. As the saying goes, it's always better to have something and not need it than need something and not have it
Exactly. The not talking about it is very important. a.) it could give someone with bad intentions time to figure out a plan to take it from you, or b.) give them more time to find or jerry-rig a weapon of their own so that they can ambush you when you have your guard down.
@@mariaa3457 Why would you go to prison? It's legal to carry firearms, and if you have a CCW, it's legal to hide them while carrying them even in public places. If you're in a private home or private vehicle or private tent, you wouldn't have to inform anyone about your weapon or leave it out regardless of if you have a CCW.
@@EastmanEditing It depended on the state and even your location within the state. In NY or NJ if you don’t have your cc for that state, you go to jail. WV is open carry but if you’re near a school and get pulled over with it, it’s a federal crime up to2 years in prison. DC mad MD are bad too. When you’re hiking you cross state lines so you better know the laws.
@@mariaa3457 I would assume and hope anyone carrying knew their rights and the laws across state borders. I still would keep it a secret from anyone around me on the trails unless it was my life partner traveling with me. Otherwise, it's kept secret for the safety of everyone. I wouldn't carry if it wasn't legal, so I agree it's important to check the laws and get any licenses and permits you possibly need.
Many years ago I went on a safety course. Two things they taught. First that being safe is about being aware of your environment at all times. Second if you ever feel unsafe take IMMEDIATE ACTION. Don't wait for the threat to go away or think that your running away will provoke them.
The worst thing, anyone can do... is get in denial about their feelings of doom, if they go any further or someone watching them. When I FIRST GET the feeling of being watched.. I usually am.. When I first get that gut feeling, something isn't right.. I immediately leave the area and round about area too. Always listen to your very first instinct and listen to you dog!
@@paulao7022 Before days of internet, when I was young, I met a person who seemed OK, my inner instinct said ''NO! ''. Stupidly I didn't listen to it as I thought ''He seems really nice, don't be silly'' Luckily, I got away, but it was a salient lesson. Never, ever, ever override that inner 'Gut' feeling, and always trust your dog!
@@Oakleaf700 If your dog doesn't like the person... then you shouldn't like them either...it's true. Dogs, senses things, about people. Watch your dog, when meeting new people!!
Hi. I’m from Erwin, Tn. I remember well when this happened. He was arrested and put in Erwin ,Unicoi ICounty, jail. For whatever reason he was released. There is a hostel in Erwin. I grew up seeing hikers in town often. My Mom brought one home for dinner, lol, he honestly ate everything left on the table. I was in High School at the time,but he was adorable. He wrote my Mom letters for years. After the man was released he went back on trail for a drastic ending. I believe that was in Damascus, Virginia. Erwin is such a gentle, friendly town and use to hikers. Unfortunately, he slipped through the cracks. I live near NC , VA, TN trailheads. Beautiful country here. In this day and age, the serene mountain trails have changed with the world, evil as it is. Be safe and while passing through my neck of the woods my prayers are with all. God Bless.
Ran into a homeless man while exploring some old mines here in AZ desert he was armed with a gun didn't point it at us. He was yelling saying he owned the property we knew it was BLM land not private. We were armed also but instead of arguing with the man we left I drove to the Sheriffs department. They went out there arrested the man I guess he also told them to leave they pulled their guns he dropped his gun. I later got a call from the deputy the man was a wanted felon for child molestation he was hiding out up there in some old mining ruins. I was happy didn't escalate to gun fire we had more firepower then he did 2 AR-15's but I'm glad no one was hurt. Even though some people say, "You should have shot the guy" I don't want to shoot anyone even if it's in self defense if I can get out of the situation by leaving I will always do that. Not worth shooting someone over let Law Enforcement handle it.
Good call. If you had shot the guy, you'd have a hard time proving self defense. Also you probably were not the first people he encountered. By handling it themselves, he remained a threat to others, and would not have been brought to justice.
@@fernandbaribeau5298 Would it have been better with any other rifle or hand gun? Would it have been better if he had a Desert Eagle or a 500 nitro express? Anything but the evil black rifle?
I still remember Geoff & Molly killed in 1990. Determine your own level of risk, don't let people tell you it's safe. Also, as silly as it seems, like going to summer camp, put your name on your stuff, & have your family take pictures of you & your stuff days before you leave (showing your starting trail haircut), if they need to send police a photo, an old yearbook photo may cause a delay. But one thing is sure, you two do us all a service by talking about it. Thank you.
Excellent point. Danger is a part of life. When you drive down a two lane road doing doing 50 mph ,you are passing oncoming motorists who might be travelling 50 mph as well. If one person has a blow out or swerves into your lane horrible devastation can result. Daily, multiple lives are lost this way. We face the risk of death as a part of our lives. Hiking is no different. Lots of possible bad events, that we accept, as part of the "highway" we traverse. But just like real driving you think defensively.The hiker is smart to practice defensive hiking. Thanks for all the helpful tips.
A few years back when I was packing the Caribou Wilderness in Northern California, at night time we could see by the firelight that there was this weird old guy peeking through the bushes. A little intimidating at first, but in the next few days I got to know him. He was a 85 year old guy who lost his wife a couple of years previously. He said that he was lonely, bored, and an old time backpacker. We had some long conversations over the campfire, turned out to be the nicest old man you would want to meet. You are correct, the trail can be a very dangerous place. Thanks
You are so nice. Thank you for being kind to an 85 year old lonely man who suffered the loss of his beloved wife. It's my little 65 year old man birthday today. Well, what's left of it anyways. A sweet present reading your comment indeed. Maine says 'hello'.
Awesome! He was probably freaked out at first too lol, you never know who’s out there but I don’t think that gives us an excuse to be disrespectful. Glad he ended up having some company 👏🏻
To each their own... As an avid hiker I personally never hike without multiple sources of self defense including a firearm. Be safe everyone much love!
Real question-Can you hike the AT strapped? Doesn’t it depend on the state? My state -which is on the trail-doesn’t allow for conceal carry. So you never see people hiking with guns. My parents live in a southern state and you see people with them all the time on a trail. But can you get in trouble by crossing state lines with one-is there a special permit you can apply for? Edit:I’m all for it!! I just live in a crazy state and don’t want to accidentally get 5 to 10 lol. But I suppose jail is better than dead 🤷♀️
@@ggaffgaff966 you have to have a permit or CHL/LTC and it must be recognized by any state that you choose to hike. However it is discouraged to carry specifically on the AT. I don't visit any state I can't take my personal protection but that's a personal choice. I carry for the chance of bad wildlife encounters more than other ppl. Thank God I've never been in a position on a hiking trail that I've felt the need to pull it. I have been bitten by a snake on trail in TX but other than that my experience in nature has been very pleasant.
@@CheeksTX Like you said to each their own but i think refusing to hike anyware that wont let you bring a gun is beyond fucking stupid. Like i understand if people want to carry and it doesnt bother me if they do, but that being said, using the AT as an example. 3 million people hike parts of the trail every year. The "murder rate" on the AT is the Equivalent to about 1 person per every five years. so are you really so SCARED of being that ONE out of FIFTEEEN MILLION people. to get killed. that you would refuse to enter any forested area that didnt let you bring your safety blanky(gun)? Like you said to each their own but i refuse to live my life in fear like that. Shits kinda pussy TBH id hate to live my life like that.
@@ggaffgaff966 If your against a huge bear, big foot, dog man... you can't run, their faster.. they all can climb tree's.. you had better have a gun on you, that would take down a grizzly! I'd rather get fined, than dead somewhere.
@@wstmag8 honestly depending on the wilderness I'm hiking I will open carry due to the lack of time to retrieve my weapon in the case of bear and mountain lion. If I'm hiking here in TX majority of the time I conceal carry however again depending on the area and threat of mountain lion I will open carry. It's never for show and tell its for the protection of my life and those around me. Again, to each their own I don't give hate regardless of one's decision to carry or not, open or conceal but for myself I will do what I feel is necessary to stay safe while enjoying our beautiful country and the God given scenery I'm viewing.
This makes hiking sound more like a big social encounter than communion with nature and the great outdoors. If I'm going to the trouble of carrying gear and map and a plan I honestly don't want a big convo with every person or group. If I wanted that I'd just stay in town where you get that 24/7 and don't even get blisters or fatigue.
Basic Safety Rule #0: Use the "Buddy System" & Hike with someone you know. 1. Create a "safe word" as a cue for your partner 2. Figure out who to trust among your nearby hikers 3. Trust your gut instincts if something "feels wrong" (maybe it's a bear?) 4. If someone gives you "bad vibes," leave them behind 5. Communicate your concerns with other hikers 6. Remember that you are in the public arena, don't leave yourself open to strangers
For real with the gut feeling. One time I was alone on the woods in Kentucky, just chilling on a log. All of a sudden, the hairs on my back all stood up and I didn't feel right. So, I just and listened for a second and I could hear crunching behind me. So, I stood up with my axe, got up on the log and faced that direction. Out of no where, I saw a cougar run off. The kitty was stalking me. Luckily, nothing past that happened. But, your gut always knows best.
This is good advice. BUT, its all kind of worthless if someone wants to hurt you. NUMBER ONE on the list should be: ARM YOURSELF. Have a means of defending yourself against violent attack. If you are not carrying a gun, i dont give a donkey's ass what other plans or preparations you make, you are VULNERABLE, and an easy target, period. Im sure that all of those things you mentioned would have helped Stronghold out tremendously when James Jordan was STABBING HIM TO DEATH. Im sure that list would have stopped James Jordan right in his tracks! If he had a safe word, and used the buddy system, right? Oh..wait..he wasnt alone..he DID hike with a buddy, who also got stabbed and nearly killed. You are not just in the "public arena" when you are on trail...you are in the middle of the Wilderness. Relying on others to protect you, or expecting someone to save you, or that having a safe word and watching out for bad vibes is going to keep you safe..is incredibly naive, and downright FOOLISH. R.I.P. Stronghold
Great tips from real experience. I liked the distinctions of 'communicate, but don't gossip' and 'be wary, but understand that others need to be wary of you as well.'
I hiked with Ron "StrongHold" thru the Ponies and up Mt Rogers 2 days before James Jordan cut him down. It effected me for the next 1,000 miles. Thanks for making this video
This was really good! I wish baskets and I had a safe word. There were times I felt unsafe around a guy as a woman before and didn’t know how to tell him in front of the guy and we ended up hiking with him for a while until I could tell him when he was alone. A safe word would’ve totally helped me!
Retired police officer here……your safety is always your responsibility. Sadly…..society has turned on law enforcement…..defund the police etc…..and they are no longer proactive. This is a fact. My recommendation is…..if you are in the wilderness without a firearm and the proper training…… you are a victim looking for a crime scene. Make your own decision but…… better to carry and never use it than to end up in a horror scene because you are at the mercy of a killer. Stay safe.
I’m glad you had a security plan, it’s certainly something I did not give much thought to prior to my hike.I was a few days ahead of you .I started in late February and I only had two encounters with questionable characters. It’s a shame we have to worry about these things but it is a reality. Congratulations on your hike!
Thank you. Awareness is the key to personal safety both in the woods and in the city. Most people don’t know what is going on around them. Great video.
Yes, it drives me crazy when people pronounce "wary" as if it is spelled "weery." I knew someone with a Bachelor's degree in Philosophy, and Master's in Library Science who pronounced it this way (as well as hearing many others say it this way over the years). So apparently it is a common mistake. I just don't understand why, though.
I kind of hate to be the one to say this, but someone needs to. People tend to ruin good things just by making something more and more popular. The popularity of the Appalachian Trail has grown by leaps and bounds over the past ten years or so and the truth is, anything or anyplace that becomes more popular in a way that attracts increasing numbers of people tends to also see an increasing percentage of nutjobs and idiots. I’m already looking at other trails in the U.S. that are far less popular and less traveled.
I think safety should be everyone's concern. We have too many missing people according to 411 missing people. We have some people that are very mentally ill and what better place for a serial killer to get by with his or her killings...? Carry a gun. Cougars and mountain lions, bears and etc. are out there too. Bears will attack if you get too close to their cubs too.
Honestly it doesn’t matter where you go in the world there will always be bad and good... it’s kind of ignorant to say unknown places are ruined once their is more exposure... how do you think the application trail is maintained? I do understand your point but their are nutritious s in your own backyard shouldn’t stop you from discovering
And people need to realize that when they walk/hike The Appalachian Trail , they are walking through someones back yard......Mountain People were living their long before it was the "in thing to do"
My friend and I were walking the trails at the Hoh Rainforest I'm WA. On our way back, we stopped at the ocean because I've never seen the Pacific ocean. Anyways, by that time, it was almost night, so we were the only 2 there. I took pics and recorded the waves. At this time, 3 men walked up. We walked away but I made sure I kept my phone recording until we were safely back in the truck.
I was camping near where Stronghold was murdered when it happened. It was pretty scary. It was horrible what happened to him and definitely sobering when we heard what happened the next day.
Did Police question then let Jordon go? Could this couple check about shovel incident and if assault charge can be filed, press charge ? His violent action w throwing log or telling couple, “ You’re Not staying here ! “ would initiate a quick check w cops.
Police have always had a bad habit of arresting & releasing crazy people back out on the street especially in big city areas where the jails are crowded so we should never assume a nutty person will stay in jail. Also some park rangers say that it is a good idea to carry a gun when out hiking & camping especially if you do it a lot and make long hiking treks deep into the woods. Pepper spray & big knives are helpful but may not be much good against a crazy person with a gun. Stay Safe Everyone!
A major problem with arresting James Jordan in VA in April 2019 before tragically murdering Stronghold in May 2019, was that although many hikers called cops in April because he was threatening them, none of the hikers wanted to wait around to testify!!! So cops had no choice but to release him and of course he ended up back on the trail. So the mug shot Tara Treks saw on their smart phone while running into James Jordan may have been taken in April 2019. James Jordan is extremely paranoid/schizophrenic and should have NEVER have been running loose. There is a long article online about him and his history back to childhood up north. His life is a total disaster.
@@NCAdventuress Yes Indeed, that`s why it`s so very important to keep alert out on the trail where crazy people can come up on you at any moment during the night or day. It`s a great idea to go out with a trained guard dog or any dog big enough to protect you. Dogs will hear the crazy person coming & alert you by barking loudly so you will wake up and have plenty of time to grab your gun to defend yourself. Even small lap dogs can be very useful if they have a habit of barking at noises they hear at night.
Thanks for the safety tips ...its unfortunate that an adventurous endeavor like hiking or camping ,raises alot of questions and awareness on safety issues...if it's not mosquitoes or deer ticks or mountain lions or bears ,its the other humans on the trails to be concerned about ...every year ,you hear about missing people...or animal attacks,etc....one has to ask themselves if they want to pursue this .....if so,be wary ,be alert travel in groups, and protect yourself beforehand....just stay safe....great post,guys!🐻🐻🐻
In 1986 we did the Trail with a cluster of young strapping, strong men at the same pace where we usually ended up at the same camp or shelter together so nobody was going to f with us...Nobody tried and it was a great adventure...The crazies and trouble-makers usually don't hike far in to the hard hills so you are usually OK...The AT is a very safe place and most through-hikers are good adventurous souls...Geoff & Molly ran in to an unwell person who knew of the Trail because of its popularity...The Appalachian Trail has a network of Park Rangers, volunteers, and hikers who will hunt down and do hard justice on any criminals who prey on Trail hikers...
Isn't it sad that our #1 concern in the wilderness is our own species? I mean, wow. It just makes you wonder just how deserving or even capable we are of being good stewards of Mother Earth 🌎
Hello! Although we have had black bears & coyotes sighted in our forest in SW VA., these are so rare, I have not seen a bear [which usually appear in Autumn: eating-to-hibernate] & I go out there several times each week. My main concern is Humans. Most people I meet in the wilder places, are friendly & helpful. But then, there are a few to be wary of. Meanwhile, Carry on and Happy Trails....
It's the same for all species. It's not a specific human -byproduct. Members of the same species compete for exactly the same resources, whether for immediate survival, or long term, i.e. mating...etc. So, our intelligence simply allows us to deceive with more sophistication, but we exhibit the same interspecies dynamic as the rest..
I checked with law enforcement in the Shenandoah National Park in Va which contains about 105 miles of the AT. They said if you have a CWP you can carry on the trail but dont go into any of the buildings with a firearm. FYI
I so wish that more of the people who get into wilderness exploration would exercise the wisdom and protection you are offering here. Someone needs to rescue that poor dog, captive of a psycho.
WOW!! What an incredible thread of comments. The bottom line is straightforward - YOU are responsible for your safety. YOU must always be able to protect your person [self]. Quickly get out of suspicious situations. IF you think it is really bad, be sure to warn others if there is a group. Don't take chances as there is no need. BUT, if confronted, BE PREPARED to defend yourself and others. YOU are the person that can make a difference. Be that person.
All good tips: I have had nothing but great interactions while section hiking but you never know!!! In my opinion, The most dangerous animal on the trail however is the lowly deer tick.
Always, always, always bring a fire arm and bear spray and a personal locator beacon!!! Please do this! You never know what can happen out there. I've been backpacking and camping regularly for over 30 years and have had several incidents occur. These items potentially saved my life more than once. Better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it. Most importantly have fun and please be safe. Great video guys, take care!
What a great video, thanks for making it. The first hand experience you shared is priceless. I'm currently in the planning stages for a through hike and deliberating how I'm going to protect myself. One thing I found all the popular you-Tube through hikers had in common was that at some point in their hike they all had encounters with dangerous animals and/or sketchy people. That matches up with my own personal experience on section hikes, and I haven't even factored in hitch-hiking and staying in low rent locations. Through hiker personal safety is a definitely a topic that needs more attention so bravo to you guys.
Take a gun, that would have the capacity to take down a bear. There is cougars and panther's and bears on that trial and perhaps, a serial killer or two. Bring extra batteries and flash lights. Lighter n matches in a zip lock, baggy.
I stayed with Stronghold (then Engineer) at Trey Mountain Shelter and Top Of Georgia the end of January. My tramily and I were 40 miles ahead of where he was murdered. My heart still hurts.
I never go to bed, around stranger's. That's a very vulnerable time, for anyone. Killer's, will usually wait till they hear one, snoring.. Personally, I would never sleep in one of those shelter's unless I was with a large group of people, I knew before the hike.
We have the same thing, my partner and I. We don't hike, but for some reason we started bs-ing and came to a safety word. It just feels like something every single person should do.
thanks for your advice. I have done a lot of solo hiking in my day....I have been followed from trail heads, caught a man in full camo-hunting gear hiding behind a tree watching me, a photographer with a huge camera on me, and so on. I have a keen sense when I am being watched or when runners or other hikers are approaching. That being said, I have never done a solo overnight or ventured too far of of well traveled areas, the creepos have ruined that for me.
HI Lilee, I have always went with my( first gut feeling) about things, especially out in the woods. I read one time, this young woman would run everyday down a trail in the woods, one day a man jumped out behind a tree and grabbed her and she kneed him in his crotch and escaped. She told the police and they caught the man and he was put in a mental institution. be careful out there!
Solo overnight hikes definitely are more risky for women than guys as far as contending with possible rapists/murderers that see victims of opportunity. Both of my parents are dead so I just always have the idea in my head that they are watching over me and they would never let a crazy killer cross my path. Positive thoughts like that help me sleep at night when I am out in the wilderness alone. I definitely feel much safer camping alone at a place called graveyard meadows then I do being in a city like LA or NO and worrying about getting robbed and murdered over something so inane as my puma suit.
That's sad - maybe see a counselor who specializes in these (rational) fears so you aren't as limited. Maybe you won't solo camp but find a group and go with them - it's fun and safer in every way. I say this as a partial hypocrite because I am the lone hiker, but the things that scare you don't scare me and this isn't being better or stronger it's just we all have different things that trigger us and too bad to miss out if you can find a way that works, increases your safety and joy.
Nice heads up. I hope to hike the AT in 2023. I have been a peak bagger in the Northeast over the past 40 years and have seen very few weird, scary people. The majority of hikers are good people; it's the 2%ers that are a problem. Much of my peak bagging put me on the AT to bag 4000-Footers or 100-Highest. I never saw another person while bushwhacking to 100-Highest. Once I had a SOBO Thru Hiker get too close to me on Wild Cat Mt on the Carter Range in NH. He was asking me questions about where I was going, had spent the night, and how he would like to have spent the night with me. He had said he worked for food the previous night at the AMC's Carter Notch Hut. Suddenly I said to him: Excuse me, you just entered my personal zone. There was a moment of silence, and my dog jumped up and came over and stood between him & me. He began backing away slowly. I told him my dog was an American Pit Bull Terrier and could bite the living hell out of him. He backed off 20 feet and started running with his full pack.
I was watching this very closely (I referred to him as 'machete guy'), because my son was always about a day behind him. I told my son that if he came across anyone fitting his description to just keep going and do not interact. Then I heard what happened in the real early hours on Mother's Day and I couldn't reach my son for hours. Freaked me the hell out, but fortunately he was just in a bad spot for cell reception. I think this affected all of those closely on the trail that year. Just a sad thing to happen.
I've never done a through hike but take day hikes here and there usually in Maine where I am originally from. I'm sure I get labelled CREEPY GUY until people get to know me. Middle-aged guy who hikes alone, keeps to myself, carries a .44 mag revolver in a bandoleer holster when I hike deep in the woods/mountains. But I am pleasant and would help anyone in trouble. Honesty and integrity are the way to go. That said I can't be everyone's cup of tea and I respect that but I don't bother anyone so long as they are not dangerous to me. By the way - I respect you don't bring a gun on the trail, everyone has choices and if a person is ambivalent with firearms it's probably better they don't bring them because without safe practice, solid judgment and knowing your firearm it is less safe to have it. Nice couple and video - thumbs up.
I think that is a respectful, smart attitude you have about firearms. Knowing they aren't the best choice for everyone. Safe travels to you. I imagine it sucks for certain people to be seen as creeps when they actually are not and I sometimes wonder if it's hard for men that being male makes some people somewhat more likely to be fearful about a person than if they were female.
@@Highlander9740 that’s kinda the point is being able to let your guard down while your out in nature. I get what your saying though you encounter some folks who are just crazy and you have to be cautious with what you say or do around them
I suggest, putting up some barrier, around your tent and you... like fishing twine and some can's or a device you can get on amazon, that makes a noise, when someone comes inside this perimeter.
Wow, yup. That is where we also met him. I knew several other people that went there and did the same thing in moving ahead. He must of been the only one in there for the night.
I am planning to section hike the AT solo. I’m pretty nervous as a 63 yr old female. Thank you for these tips. I won’t stay in any shelters! Mice? Yuk!
I read most of the crime that happens on the trails is usually around towns, and cities, that the trail snakes through. Mt.GRAYLOCK IN MASSACHUSETTS is one place it does, and I have run into some strange people on it. Jordan is one individual that was being searched for as well back in the early 90s, my dad and I saw him peeking at us hiding in the bushes, he disappeared and we never heard jack again, until the murders.
When camping or hiking in any woods i am always armed. Mainly due to the threat of bad people more than animals however due to a few experiences, don't be conceited and think you know everything that can be out there. It took my friend years before he would step a foot back in the woods even with the biggest gun he has.
Ah Derek,what a man you are .Great to Be discovering some much about Yourself.Thanks for sharing so much Of your heart.Travel well and may God Bless you.
That won’t be for a very long time, if ever. A trial would have to take place first, which is why I want others to talk about their experiences so future classes aren’t left feeling afraid!
Part of being in the outdoors is restoring our sense in and with nature. Still too often our instinct of safety threats is lost and our senses dull. This just emphasizes how important it is to follow yoir gut instinct snd trust your senses. It can keep us alive. Grrat video snd tips!
Thank you very much. I am sort of new to the hiking community(more of a day hiker), but am expanding, so I watch all of these to learn more. Thank you so much.
Going hiking on busy trails is not my thing! I hike mostly private or less popular public trails. I have never been interested in hiking with strangers! My rules are: NEVER hike alone! ALWAYS bring a handgun! (Bringing a knife to a gunfight is pointless)! ALWAYS tell at minimum 2 people where you're going and when you're returning! If you have cell reception, check-in with your home-based contacts daily. Make sure your hbc know your safety word! Carry a personal locator device! Carry a flare gun in case you need rescuing! And of course, all the essentials needed for survival while hiking/backpacking. Be safe!
Exactly, I NEVER go without 2 things strapped to me at all times a handgun & a personal locator beacon with a rifle at arm's length and also the rest of the rules you wrote
It's a sad fact of life that in the wilderness you'll have both animal & human predators, so there's always the potential for being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Don't wander or camp too far off-trail, try to travel in groups or within earshot of one if possible, and maintain your sense of situational awareness. Some folks, me included, like to hike in seclusion or solitude so it's important to keep it in mind that being alone increases your vulnerability and you should exercise extra caution. Even though I know it's against regulations to have a firearm on some trails, I still bring a small .22 mag for personal safety. I'm thinking that the one time I decide not to bring it will be the day I run into a pack of rabid dogs or an escaped criminal.
@@donkeysaurusrex7881 If you are committed to carrying legally the laws vary from state to state but you are an interstate traveler or technically a "sojourner" so I would ask a lawyer how you would do that while traveling on foot & not in a motor vehicle. I myself believe in the 2A where it says that "the right to keep & bear arms shall not be infringed" so when I carry I do concealed rather than open carry. I don't care about local laws since it's nobody's business, I'm not hunting, & don't plan to pull out my weapon unless absolutely necessary. I won't consent to a search but will show an ID & whatever permits are required. I also won't answer any questions that aren't relevant to my hike. Basically I'd give the authorities no reason to think I've committed a crime & I behave myself when on public lands so there's no legitimate reason for an LEO to start fishing & asking personal questions. In the event I was arrested for carrying then I'd lawyer up & wait for my day in court.
Your right.. it usually happens that way.. when you don't bring it.. something will happen.. its the way it goes.. it's called life. A 357 magum, hollow point bullets, will bring down something large. A small caliber gun, just make it mad...
You are both smart and took a lot of precautions, all within reason but clearly the situation on the AT needs some things addressed. Hike with at least 1, preferably 2, other people you do fully trust, on the AT.
I believe when Jordan attacked Stronghold and the woman hiker there were at least two other people at that camp site/shelter who were able to run away.
All this advice is really cool and nice, but I'm not going out on any trail anywhere without at least a Ruger SR22 or something, and if I run into someone with bad intentions then they are either gonna be in handcuffs or a black zip-up bag in the ambulance.
The safe word is a good idea. I can see where the PB thing could raise a red flag if you said it but the guy never saw you eat any PB... Also, the guy might offer you some PB, lol... I'd choose something like a piece of gear that we both know we've never used, like Gaiters, perhaps. Or an umbrella. And say "Hey, did you ever find your umbrella?" and then the affirmative response would be "No, darn the luck! I think I left it back in the hostel..." That would be a totally casual way to deliver the safe word without getting trapped.
llowel Mayfield omg umbrella is our safe word !!!!wifey was massaging out a bad shoulder cramp !! hurt so bad a yelled out umbrella ! UMBRELLA! out of nowhere cause it was summer no rain she checked up, We laugh anout it today!!!ya know kinda like Fiftyshadesof Gray 'did you roll your eyes at me?' ha!
99% of the time in outdoor activities you’ll be running into good people out there on the trail. But as with the rest of life you should always be careful.
There's plenty of small pistols that weigh next to nothing these days, even an 11oz smith and wesson .357 magnum. You can just carry pepper spray, also very effective. Your safety is your responsibility, don't count on others, and don't be a victim. Good luck everyone, stay safe.
No no no .Pistol ,period.carry it carry it carry it.It is handy not just against humans but animals too or just to signalise.So i totally agree with you and as a message to all ,please do not let your "last"tought to be;"if only i had my pistol with me" Bright blessings and safe hike
I used to do a lot of back packing up in the Sierra Nevada mountains with my late father when I was young and he just always taught me to avoid making contact with people if you see them first. If we noticed people from afar, we would get off the trail a bit and wait until they would pass us the other way. This way if the person is some kind of nut, they wouldn’t notice us and visit us at our new camp at night. I will be honest though I never thought of serial killers up in the Edison Lake area of the John Muir trail. Rattlesnakes and mountain lions were my main worry and I always had a gun on me even as a 14 year old that I put under my pillow at night so people didn’t scare me other than Jason Vorhees. My dad always told me the serial killers are on the Appalachian Mountain trails, because all the local towns along the Appalachian mountains allow for easier blending in and escaping, then where we would backpack where there was only one road in and out. Further north by Yosemite is where you have to be careful in the Sierra Nevada mountains, because you are dealing with a lot more people and easier blending in.
@@enwin1912 I grew up with one former LRRP's that survived deep in NVA territory teaching me all he knew about being stealthy and avoiding detection in an environment that is more applicable to the place I backpack in then say someone that fought and survived in Fallujah. Now there is always a chance, I come across some trained killers that watch me and laugh before then deciding to toy with me, but that would be like winning the unlucky lottery.
Wow, that is precisely how I go in wilderness, There is one particular person in our forest, which I try to always avoid, so I look all around, especially ahead & behind. Like it was said in Many TV Westerns: "Study your backtrail & the trail ahead." Plus I read how a successful hunter(or hiker) will stop often, to look & listen and smell the air. This has alerted me many a time, and let me see wild animals, who sometimes come close to me when I am quiet & not moving. And for the non-predators, like white-tail deer & turkeys, this is a delight. Happy Trails........
In the Sierras you have to worry about running into a Mexican drug cartels marijuana grow. If they see you out there too close to their grow they may kill you. Not something we should be having to worry about trying to get away on a hike.
Hello Dower Duo, I'm an (old) hiking enthusiast, and I kept running across the name of this man. I thought that it could not mean Rep. James Jordan (R-OH), a member of Congress. Nor could it be the father of Michael Jordan, the great athlete (James Jordan, Sr.). So, when I ran across this video of yours, I watched it., and, then did research on the person, the topic, the crime, and the victims. Thank you for sharing. Scary. Traveling solo can be very dangerous, and even traveling as a couple can be risky. - Dr Dave (retired physics prof)
TDD, Thank you for this informative video. I followed you on most of your thru-hike this year. Congratulations on completing the AT. You deserve a lot of credit for your tenacity and endurance, all the while keeping a positive attitude. Respect to you! I believe 1000 will be achieved soon because your are people with integrity and compassion. Regarding the bad guy you're discussing. I read one account that said after he was arrested the first time, he was released because none of the hikers he threatened were willing to stay around and testify against him. Can you comment on this information? I'm on the west coast far removed from the AT. You were there and actually encountered this guy. Do you think it's hikers' responsibility to testify in court, possibly delaying their journey, if they have important information that could lead to a conviction?
Yes! I remember hearing that. I believe we know who was threatened and know by the time they found Jordan, that individual was already gone..way down trail. The police did the best they could and busted him for a drug charge and tried to keep him in jail as long as they could. They also took his massive weapon I believe. However I do not have an opinion on the matter of whose responsibility it is to testify in court. This is still a sensitive topic for some and there are a lot of factors to it. You raise good questions though. I think this is important for future thru hikers to consider and come to their own conclusions about.. hopefully nothing like this ever happens again. Thank you for following our journey this year. We appreciate your support :)
JOHN DIVITA.... I can't imagine that after James Jordan killed Stronghold and nearly killed a woman with him, that those hikers who called cops beforehand who arrested Jordan based on the threats those hikers received, that they now deeply regret not hanging around to testify. If they have a conscience, it should be they never forget that they could have saved a life and the trauma to that poor woman badly injured hiker who had to walk 5-6 miles to get to paramedics. She could have bled out! And the trauma with which she will live forever is unimaginable. If those accusing hikers had testified, Jordan could have been held and subjected to a psychiatric evaluation forcing him to be institutionalized. If good people don't stand up to evil and violent mental illness, who will?
@@taratreks I find it astounding that you "don't have an opinion" about whether or not the hikers who had Jordan arrested, should have stayed around to testify! You are a lovely young couple of influencers but you are too young, too naive and too inexperienced in life. Obviously you have never been victims of violent crime. Tragically, this country is in an epidemic of violent crime especially in our big cities and large metro areas. I have lived thru it in Center City Philadelphia for 22 years, a very expensive part of that city and was a victim of muggings with guns held to my head in addition to home broken into, apt bldg I owned broken into, car broken into, handbag ripped off me, etc. I left the NE Corridor after being there my entire life in big cities and moved to a beautiful, safe, sane, conservative Western NC mountain county, a region with which I was very familiar. We have practically no violent crime! There has been one murder in 14 years in my county and the two guys knew each other. Philly had 562 murders in 2021! But Philly caused me to have my head on a swivel, see and hear everything. That will never leave but at least I have relaxed now living in a civilized and beautiful place and I never want to move again.
There’s so many people on trail and always around each other. Not very much to worry about. There’s always a worry when you step out of your house. Lol
Judgement and judging are two very different things. I see many people letting go of a well reasoned and intuitive skill of judgement because of this current fixation on non-judging. We need to be wise to be truly well.
The primary difference are the situation and context and people in general have to learn this. In everyday life, a wrong judgment ist sometimes awkward but rarely dangerous. Out in "the wild", with no other people around and no possibilities to call for fast help it could end fatal.
Yes trusting our judgment and intuition in life is incredibly important. Trying so hard to be polite and never speak ill can be taken to the extreme where it is very naive or dangerous or in certain cases enables harm or is a missed opportunity to help prevent or protect in appropriate ways. I have some life stories I've seen that play out. In my experience, people trying to shame or distract people away from their right to make a judgment call about what feels safe and yes and resonant enough to them...are not necesarily always the safest of people. Because if they were they'd generally support the person in knowing their safety limits and when they need to exit a situation - instead of saying something like, "You're over-reacting or over-thinking when you say that situation makes you uneasy" or "Just trust everyone equally...that's what kind people do." I'm speaking in run-on sentences and not wording that super clear but hope it makes sense.
Question: When Jordan began yelling and getting aggressive towards your wife/gf, what was your reaction? And in retrospect, whatever your given response was at the time, would you have done something differently if you could go back now?
I don't hike yet. I just read and listen to alot of stories, but I think the safe word is great! Couples have a secret word we use to let our Sig Other know when we are ready to leave a gathering so we'll slowly move towards the door st the same time 🙂. A safe word in the wilderness sounds fantastic.
You guys make this sounds very doable, but with like the points people rarely seem to include. Me personally though, I'm packing heat if I go. I'm a small female and I'm not trying to take on nature without firepower.
I KNOW IT WARY NOT WEARY. Please don’t comment this correction. Thanks to the hundreds who have reminded me daily of my mistake 😐😂
SECOND EDIT! March 2022- we all left together as a group. The couple in the shelter, Jonathan, Smiley and I. Many are assuming we left the couple by themselves with Jordan. We did not. Additionally, many are asking why we didn’t call the cops when we left the shelter after meeting Jordan. He had just been released from jail and they couldn’t keep him in forever. At this time he only threatened other hikers and had some marijuana on him. Around 2 weeks later was the murder.
nobody is perfect, if thats the worst thing youve done your golden lol.
@@jeaniejbutler4911 Yeah, I'm one of the "grammar nazis". I have to work to keep my mouth shut. I see every deviation from academic grammar rules.
@@edm9704 but you know you were secretly bothered by @Jeaniej Butler's misuse of your in the above comment with your instead of you're 🤣
Some people have nothing better to do. Prob. all named Karen or Kevin too. LOL
@@TheOOP72 😂😂
I have lived my entire life in appalacia over 70 years in the very rural part. I would never go into the woods without being armed, I listen well in the woods. If it gets intensly quiet you can bet someone you don"t see is there. The small animals will act differently very quickly. I would assess quickly if I come upon someone I did not know in the woods and TRUST YOUR GUT FEELING. If something don't feel right it probably isn't. I would never stay in a trail shelter,makes you too vulnerable. You have some good ideas and you will learn more as you go. Safety first always.
First thing you do is watch the animals, I live in CT on a wooded property, and yes a gun is always with me. But I a l ways watch the animals
I live in the city and even here I listen to the wild life around me if I suspect something is off...the bugs like crickets are very helpful in this matter.
@@dal8963 crickets? Like specifically do you look for.
@@hadassahgrace5
The crickets will stop making noise when somethings not right or Predators are near by. Same with birds. If you're in the woods and you notice everything got really quiet all of a sudden, you better have your wits about you.
(Novel alert! lol) THIS. I am learning more and more about how all animals behave around humans. I've always known dogs could sense danger in humans (for the most part) but some wild animals are even more sensitive to it. Crows are my new favorite animals because I've learned not only can they sense a bad/dangerous person, they will remember their face and pass it on to their babies genetically to remember that face as "dangerous" too. This is such great advice that is rarely discussed and even more rarely taken seriously. Having been in several very sketchy situations myself, it is the absolute truth though! You'll feel it too. Don't ignore it.
It's easy to question whether you're just being paranoid or not, but the difference will be in how you're breathing and what your thought pattern is. A true gut feeling, animalistic sense, will quiet everything down. You'll breathe slower and softer and can suddenly hear a pin drop. You'll be weirdly calm and will move smoother and a bit slower, but will still be highly alert. Jaw may be clenched as an attempt to silence your voice or loud breathing, and you will instinctively move your eyes more than your whole head when looking around for signs of danger. And this will happen instantaneously for "no reason." Then, you may figure out in a few seconds or a few minutes later why your body suddenly went into survival mode.
On the other hand, paranoia or just fear/phobia will present itself very loudly and may feel overwhelming if it's bad enough. It's not the same for everyone across the board, but some things you could notice yourself doing is talking MORE and talking LOUDER, rather than getting quiet. Your breathing may get heavier immediately after a scary thought, and you'll want to take huge deep breaths but it might feel difficult to do. You'll make sudden movements and be whipping your head side to side to look for anything dangerous. Fingers and hands may be fidgety, and you'll have the urge to distract yourself either by looking at your phone or singing a song, etc...whereas a gut feeling will have you completely zeroed in on your surroundings and you won't want to take your eyes off of whatever is in front of you for even a second. (This is also why some people have trouble calling 911 immediately in terrifying situations. They may need a second for all of their senses to rush back to them before they grab their phones. On the other hand, some people instinctively grab their phones to call for help, but it's with a very smooth, natural movement and still without taking eyes off of the surroundings except to quickly glance down at the keypad to dial 911)
And for skeptics, none of this even has to be spiritual in any way. I think there are so many clues our nervous system picks up on that we as humans still just aren't aware of yet. For example, maybe people who are on the brink of violence emit a very subtle "stress" odor or maybe their breathing pattern is specific enough for our brains to recognize without realizing it. Just like crows, our genetics have been passed down to be more aware of particular dangers.
As a 32 yr seasoned retired game warden told me that he never goes into the woods unarmed. After telling me some stories, I understood why. Take that for what's it worth.
Every week, all the sense less violence, in News, I carry everywhere its legally allowed.
@@stevefournier6375 kkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk
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I was hiking in early spring through the Victorian Alpine country (Australia) so there was still about a foot of snow around and going was slow and tough. As I approached a hut I saw a man with a proper chopping axe, cutting wood and thought that was really out of place. Most people don't hike with a heavy chopping axe. When I passed him to go and sign into the hut, I said hi and he replied but it was a cold response. I opened the door of the hut and a dog cut sick at me and he laughed and said he would grab his dog so I could go in. I was on edge already and dogs aren't allowed up there so I was getting more apprehensive. I signed in and left. I got about 300m away and heard the dog growling and trying to run through the snow after me. I pulled out a knife and thought I would give the dog my arm and then knife it in the chest. With the dog bearing down on me the guy then yells "are you going to fk'en knife my dog" and starts heading towards me with the axe in hand. Thankfully I was fit and the dog couldn't get any speed up nor could this guy, so I kept on walking over a ridge. I was freaking out for the next few kilometres as they had a perfect set of prints to follow in the snow. I ended up going a long route home to avoid any possibility I would cross paths with him again.
In the US there would have been gunfire. Maybe pack some pepper spray? Is that legal to carry?
@@asmith7876 I'm not aware of anywhere in Australia pepper spray or tasers are legal. Our weapon laws are fked.
That's horrifying, and I'm really glad you're okay. That's a suspicious situation, and I hope no one else was harmed.
Other countries outside the U.S. handle guns WAY better, but it makes me nervous to think of not being able to have pepper gel/spray or a stun gun/taser. 😶
Hornet spray makes a good stand in for pepper spray. Heck a can of WD40 could work as a distraction. The advantage of hornet spray is it goes a good distance, but if you need to habe a reason to have something while hiking I could see saying, "Well I had the DW40 in case any of my zippers get stuck."
In the states you can get little cans of it. Maybe that is an idea. If it can help any hikers reading this comment...
@@dasta7658 Should have never let your government un-arm you! The radicals here in the US are trying to use mass shootings to do that. But having a constitution makes us more protected from government over-reach!
Always trust your creep alarm and remember no one is coming to save you. You must be prepared and capable of doing what you must.
Always bring a gun, that would at least take a bear down. Hind sight, is 20/20
Yepper, your all alone out there... and no one is coming to your aid. Sad.
Always, carry a knife in your belt. Not inside your pack.. u may have to get it out.. in a big hurry.
@@MrWolfheart111 A large caliber gun, may mean the difference between living or dying. Personally, I stay out of the woods now!
@@MrWolfheart111 I don't live in the city.. can't tell you that.
As a retired firearms instructor, I want everyone to own, train with, and carry a gun. But they're not for everyone. I also teach Rule #1 - Situational Awareness is Everything! Your pre-planning for and execution of situational awareness and safety planning is amazing. And it is also now demonstrably proven having survived a mentally ill murderer.
Very well done.
Wait just one minute.... I was under the impression that Rule: #1 is cardio, cardio, cardio. If not you'll only die tired!
It's always a good idea to carry while in the woods. Never mind the animals that might be a problem, humans are the most dangerous thing you could possibly run into out there, and if they try any funny business a gun is an excellent deterrent (or tool if you are forced to use it). Show it to no one unless they are an immediate threat, don't talk about it, basically let no one except the people you're hiking with know that you're carrying. As the saying goes, it's always better to have something and not need it than need something and not have it
Exactly. The not talking about it is very important. a.) it could give someone with bad intentions time to figure out a plan to take it from you, or b.) give them more time to find or jerry-rig a weapon of their own so that they can ambush you when you have your guard down.
Unless you get caught with it then go to prison.
@@mariaa3457 Why would you go to prison? It's legal to carry firearms, and if you have a CCW, it's legal to hide them while carrying them even in public places. If you're in a private home or private vehicle or private tent, you wouldn't have to inform anyone about your weapon or leave it out regardless of if you have a CCW.
@@EastmanEditing It depended on the state and even your location within the state. In NY or NJ if you don’t have your cc for that state, you go to jail. WV is open carry but if you’re near a school and get pulled over with it, it’s a federal crime up to2 years in prison. DC mad MD are bad too. When you’re hiking you cross state lines so you better know the laws.
@@mariaa3457 I would assume and hope anyone carrying knew their rights and the laws across state borders. I still would keep it a secret from anyone around me on the trails unless it was my life partner traveling with me. Otherwise, it's kept secret for the safety of everyone. I wouldn't carry if it wasn't legal, so I agree it's important to check the laws and get any licenses and permits you possibly need.
Many years ago I went on a safety course.
Two things they taught. First that being safe is about being aware of your environment at all times.
Second if you ever feel unsafe take IMMEDIATE ACTION. Don't wait for the threat to go away or think that your running away will provoke them.
Excellent advice! Trust your first Gut feeling and take immediate action.
Meanwhile, Happy Trails to us all.....
Always go with your intuition... If something doesn't feel right... Leave now and watch your back!
The worst thing, anyone can do... is get in denial about their feelings of doom, if they go any further or someone watching them. When I FIRST GET the feeling of being watched.. I usually am.. When I first get that gut feeling, something isn't right.. I immediately leave the area and round about area too. Always listen to your very first instinct and listen to you dog!
@@paulao7022 Before days of internet, when I was young, I met a person who seemed OK, my inner instinct said ''NO! ''.
Stupidly I didn't listen to it as I thought ''He seems really nice, don't be silly''
Luckily, I got away, but it was a salient lesson.
Never, ever, ever override that inner 'Gut' feeling, and always trust your dog!
@@Oakleaf700 If your dog doesn't like the person... then you shouldn't like them either...it's true. Dogs, senses things, about people. Watch your dog, when meeting new people!!
Hi. I’m from Erwin, Tn. I remember well when this happened. He was arrested and put in Erwin ,Unicoi
ICounty, jail. For whatever reason he was released. There is a hostel in Erwin. I grew up seeing hikers in town often. My Mom brought one home for dinner, lol, he honestly ate everything left on the table. I was in High School at the time,but he was adorable. He wrote my Mom letters for years. After the man was released he went back on trail for a drastic ending. I believe that was in Damascus, Virginia. Erwin is such a gentle, friendly town and use to hikers. Unfortunately, he slipped through the cracks. I live near NC , VA, TN trailheads. Beautiful country here.
In this day and age, the serene mountain trails have changed with the world, evil as it is. Be safe and while passing through my neck of the woods my prayers are with all. God Bless.
I remember he had been harassing some hikers a few days prior toml my arrival @ Uncle Johnny's back in 2016.
Ran into a homeless man while exploring some old mines here in AZ desert he was armed with a gun didn't point it at us. He was yelling saying he owned the property we knew it was BLM land not private. We were armed also but instead of arguing with the man we left I drove to the Sheriffs department. They went out there arrested the man I guess he also told them to leave they pulled their guns he dropped his gun. I later got a call from the deputy the man was a wanted felon for child molestation he was hiding out up there in some old mining ruins. I was happy didn't escalate to gun fire we had more firepower then he did 2 AR-15's but I'm glad no one was hurt. Even though some people say, "You should have shot the guy" I don't want to shoot anyone even if it's in self defense if I can get out of the situation by leaving I will always do that. Not worth shooting someone over let Law Enforcement handle it.
Good call. If you had shot the guy, you'd have a hard time proving self defense. Also you probably were not the first people he encountered. By handling it themselves, he remained a threat to others, and would not have been brought to justice.
ok so you are hiking with AR-15's ???? why ??is it common in Arizona?
@@fernandbaribeau5298 Would it have been better with any other rifle or hand gun? Would it have been better if he had a Desert Eagle or a 500 nitro express? Anything but the evil black rifle?
@@XX1SICKNTWISTED1XX just asking...i am wondering why carry a gun when you go for a hike...maybe evey body do that in you part of the country....???
@@fernandbaribeau5298 I hope so.
I still remember Geoff & Molly killed in 1990. Determine your own level of risk, don't let people tell you it's safe. Also, as silly as it seems, like going to summer camp, put your name on your stuff, & have your family take pictures of you & your stuff days before you leave (showing your starting trail haircut), if they need to send police a photo, an old yearbook photo may cause a delay. But one thing is sure, you two do us all a service by talking about it. Thank you.
Good Advice!
Excellent point. Danger is a part of life. When you drive down
a two lane road doing doing 50 mph ,you are passing oncoming
motorists who might be travelling 50 mph as well. If one person
has a blow out or swerves into your lane horrible devastation can
result. Daily, multiple lives are lost this way. We face the risk of
death as a part of our lives. Hiking is no different. Lots of possible
bad events, that we accept, as part of the "highway" we traverse.
But just like real driving you think defensively.The hiker is smart to
practice defensive hiking. Thanks for all the helpful tips.
Very good tip!!!
@@billlincolnmd9159 "Defensive Hiking", is a great idea!
@@billlincolnmd9159 Carry a lethal weapon and stop being in denial!
Their James Jordan story starts at 11:12 roughly, if anyone came here for it
Ty
If 2 people start talking about peanut butter amongst themselves, I'm packing up QUICKLY 😂
Buuuud, you start hiking, you might be one them 2 ppl... lol
@@MISTERKIC ...but do you leave the pb with those 2 or do you secretly steal away with it all to yourself while those 2 distracted?
A few years back when I was packing the Caribou Wilderness in Northern California, at night time we could see by the firelight that there was this weird old guy peeking through the bushes. A little intimidating at first, but in the next few days I got to know him. He was a 85 year old guy who lost his wife a couple of years previously. He said that he was lonely, bored, and an old time backpacker. We had some long conversations over the campfire, turned out to be the nicest old man you would want to meet. You are correct, the trail can be a very dangerous place. Thanks
You are so nice. Thank you for being kind to an 85 year old lonely man who suffered the loss of his beloved wife. It's my little 65 year old man birthday today. Well, what's left of it anyways. A sweet present reading your comment indeed. Maine says 'hello'.
Awesome! He was probably freaked out at first too lol, you never know who’s out there but I don’t think that gives us an excuse to be disrespectful. Glad he ended up having some company 👏🏻
I would have gunned him down.
To each their own... As an avid hiker I personally never hike without multiple sources of self defense including a firearm.
Be safe everyone much love!
Real question-Can you hike the AT strapped? Doesn’t it depend on the state? My state -which is on the trail-doesn’t allow for conceal carry. So you never see people hiking with guns. My parents live in a southern state and you see people with them all the time on a trail. But can you get in trouble by crossing state lines with one-is there a special permit you can apply for?
Edit:I’m all for it!! I just live in a crazy state and don’t want to accidentally get 5 to 10 lol. But I suppose jail is better than dead 🤷♀️
@@ggaffgaff966 you have to have a permit or CHL/LTC and it must be recognized by any state that you choose to hike. However it is discouraged to carry specifically on the AT.
I don't visit any state I can't take my personal protection but that's a personal choice. I carry for the chance of bad wildlife encounters more than other ppl. Thank God I've never been in a position on a hiking trail that I've felt the need to pull it.
I have been bitten by a snake on trail in TX but other than that my experience in nature has been very pleasant.
@@CheeksTX Like you said to each their own but i think refusing to hike anyware that wont let you bring a gun is beyond fucking stupid. Like i understand if people want to carry and it doesnt bother me if they do, but that being said, using the AT as an example. 3 million people hike parts of the trail every year. The "murder rate" on the AT is the Equivalent to about 1 person per every five years. so are you really so SCARED of being that ONE out of FIFTEEEN MILLION people. to get killed. that you would refuse to enter any forested area that didnt let you bring your safety blanky(gun)? Like you said to each their own but i refuse to live my life in fear like that. Shits kinda pussy TBH id hate to live my life like that.
@@ggaffgaff966 If your against a huge bear, big foot, dog man... you can't run, their faster.. they all can climb tree's.. you had better have a gun on you, that would take down a grizzly! I'd rather get fined, than dead somewhere.
@@wstmag8 honestly depending on the wilderness I'm hiking I will open carry due to the lack of time to retrieve my weapon in the case of bear and mountain lion. If I'm hiking here in TX majority of the time I conceal carry however again depending on the area and threat of mountain lion I will open carry. It's never for show and tell its for the protection of my life and those around me. Again, to each their own I don't give hate regardless of one's decision to carry or not, open or conceal but for myself I will do what I feel is necessary to stay safe while enjoying our beautiful country and the God given scenery I'm viewing.
This makes hiking sound more like a big social encounter than communion with nature and the great outdoors. If I'm going to the trouble of carrying gear and map and a plan I honestly don't want a big convo with every person or group. If I wanted that I'd just stay in town where you get that 24/7 and don't even get blisters or fatigue.
Basic Safety Rule #0: Use the "Buddy System" & Hike with someone you know.
1. Create a "safe word" as a cue for your partner
2. Figure out who to trust among your nearby hikers
3. Trust your gut instincts if something "feels wrong" (maybe it's a bear?)
4. If someone gives you "bad vibes," leave them behind
5. Communicate your concerns with other hikers
6. Remember that you are in the public arena, don't leave yourself open to strangers
"Safe word" ? -- sort of like BDSM! LOL
For real with the gut feeling. One time I was alone on the woods in Kentucky, just chilling on a log. All of a sudden, the hairs on my back all stood up and I didn't feel right.
So, I just and listened for a second and I could hear crunching behind me. So, I stood up with my axe, got up on the log and faced that direction.
Out of no where, I saw a cougar run off. The kitty was stalking me. Luckily, nothing past that happened. But, your gut always knows best.
This is good advice. BUT, its all kind of worthless if someone wants to hurt you. NUMBER ONE on the list should be: ARM YOURSELF. Have a means of defending yourself against violent attack. If you are not carrying a gun, i dont give a donkey's ass what other plans or preparations you make, you are VULNERABLE, and an easy target, period. Im sure that all of those things you mentioned would have helped Stronghold out tremendously when James Jordan was STABBING HIM TO DEATH. Im sure that list would have stopped James Jordan right in his tracks! If he had a safe word, and used the buddy system, right? Oh..wait..he wasnt alone..he DID hike with a buddy, who also got stabbed and nearly killed. You are not just in the "public arena" when you are on trail...you are in the middle of the Wilderness. Relying on others to protect you, or expecting someone to save you, or that having a safe word and watching out for bad vibes is going to keep you safe..is incredibly naive, and downright FOOLISH.
R.I.P. Stronghold
@@mattjack3983 "safe words" are for BDSM perverts and their silly games, not for personal safety on the AT !
@@mikesgoodmann9349 very well said! I completely agree
Great tips from real experience. I liked the distinctions of 'communicate, but don't gossip' and 'be wary, but understand that others need to be wary of you as well.'
I hiked with Ron "StrongHold" thru the Ponies and up Mt Rogers 2 days before James Jordan cut him down. It effected me for the next 1,000 miles.
Thanks for making this video
Big bugs
TONY hang tough man feel you from east of mt SHASTA 🏔🎒🥾
I was 100 miles behind you. Sorry for your loss. We all felt it on trail. RIP STRONGHOLD 2019
These are great points of safety. I would add Bear Spray which
can be used for all sorts of animals- including human ones--
just for emergencies.
I'm so sorry for your loss. Even now, I imagine it's sometimes hard to wrestle with.
Sending love from the Australian Capital Territory. 💕
This was really good! I wish baskets and I had a safe word. There were times I felt unsafe around a guy as a woman before and didn’t know how to tell him in front of the guy and we ended up hiking with him for a while until I could tell him when he was alone. A safe word would’ve totally helped me!
Thank you Garden State
A good line to use is, did you bring those hostess cakes? It works;
Look them in the eyes and do the old "we outta here"
@@samgibson684 My secret word is YIKES!!
@@paulao7022 Not anymore.
Retired police officer here……your safety is always your responsibility. Sadly…..society has turned on law enforcement…..defund the police etc…..and they are no longer proactive. This is a fact. My recommendation is…..if you are in the wilderness without a firearm and the proper training…… you are a victim looking for a crime scene. Make your own decision but…… better to carry and never use it than to end up in a horror scene because you are at the mercy of a killer. Stay safe.
I’m glad you had a security plan, it’s certainly something I did not give much thought to prior to my hike.I was a few days ahead of you .I started in late February and I only had two encounters with questionable characters. It’s a shame we have to worry about these things but it is a reality. Congratulations on your hike!
Thank you, same to you!
The more replies I read...there is NO WAY I'm goin on ANY trail w/o a weapon & my dog..90# shepherd very well trained, wakes me up if a mouse farts!!
Being wary?
@@leeriutzel4780 I say, keep a fire burning at night. Put a few good size logs on the fire. It usually will keep predator's away.
I always go with two or more people, besides myself.
Thank you. Awareness is the key to personal safety both in the woods and in the city. Most people don’t know what is going on around them. Great video.
Agreed!
Being "weary" is to be tired or sleepy.
Being "wary" is to be cautious.
And does no one know the difference between subject and object pronouns anymore? 🇺🇦🌻
@@7catsmom959 No they don’t… It’s the other pronouns that some people are so concerned about. 😀
Yes, it drives me crazy when people pronounce "wary" as if it is spelled "weery." I knew someone with a Bachelor's degree in Philosophy, and Master's in Library Science who pronounced it this way (as well as hearing many others say it this way over the years). So apparently it is a common mistake. I just don't understand why, though.
@@stephenrice5938 That is funny!
imagine actually to be caring about how words spell when every word is the same thing as the other
I kind of hate to be the one to say this, but someone needs to. People tend to ruin good things just by making something more and more popular. The popularity of the Appalachian Trail has grown by leaps and bounds over the past ten years or so and the truth is, anything or anyplace that becomes more popular in a way that attracts increasing numbers of people tends to also see an increasing percentage of nutjobs and idiots.
I’m already looking at other trails in the U.S. that are far less popular and less traveled.
I think safety should be everyone's concern. We have too many missing people according to 411 missing people. We have some people that are very mentally ill and what better place for a serial killer to get by with his or her killings...? Carry a gun. Cougars and mountain lions, bears and etc. are out there too. Bears will attack if you get too close to their cubs too.
Honestly it doesn’t matter where you go in the world there will always be bad and good... it’s kind of ignorant to say unknown places are ruined once their is more exposure... how do you think the application trail is maintained? I do understand your point but their are nutritious s in your own backyard shouldn’t stop you from discovering
And people need to realize that when they walk/hike The Appalachian Trail , they are walking through someones back yard......Mountain People were living their long before it was the "in thing to do"
The same is true of Mt. Everest as I understand it.
@@Evergreenforest33 "Application Trail?"
My friend and I were walking the trails at the Hoh Rainforest I'm WA. On our way back, we stopped at the ocean because I've never seen the Pacific ocean. Anyways, by that time, it was almost night, so we were the only 2 there. I took pics and recorded the waves. At this time, 3 men walked up. We walked away but I made sure I kept my phone recording until we were safely back in the truck.
LOL
Some one had been praying, for you and your friend. It could've turned out badly. Good for you, that it didn't. Stay safe out there.
@@paulao7022 no
I was camping near where Stronghold was murdered when it happened. It was pretty scary. It was horrible what happened to him and definitely sobering when we heard what happened the next day.
Did Police question then let Jordon go? Could this couple check about shovel incident and if assault charge can be filed, press charge ? His violent action w throwing log or telling couple, “ You’re Not staying here ! “ would initiate a quick check w cops.
Police have always had a bad habit of arresting & releasing crazy people back out on the street especially in big city areas where the jails are crowded so we should never assume a nutty person will stay in jail. Also some park rangers say that it is a good idea to carry a gun when out hiking & camping especially if you do it a lot and make long hiking treks deep into the woods. Pepper spray & big knives are helpful but may not be much good against a crazy person with a gun. Stay Safe Everyone!
A major problem with arresting James Jordan in VA in April 2019 before tragically murdering Stronghold in May 2019, was that although many hikers called cops in April because he was threatening them, none of the hikers wanted to wait around to testify!!! So cops had no choice but to release him and of course he ended up back on the trail. So the mug shot Tara Treks saw on their smart phone while running into James Jordan may have been taken in April 2019. James Jordan is extremely paranoid/schizophrenic and should have NEVER have been running loose. There is a long article online about him and his history back to childhood up north. His life is a total disaster.
@@NCAdventuress Yes Indeed, that`s why it`s so very important to keep alert out on the trail where crazy people can come up on you at any moment during the night or day. It`s a great idea to go out with a trained guard dog or any dog big enough to protect you. Dogs will hear the crazy person coming & alert you by barking loudly so you will wake up and have plenty of time to grab your gun to defend yourself. Even small lap dogs can be very useful if they have a habit of barking at noises they hear at night.
@@stevesheartone2998 Good idea.
@STEVE Sheartone • They should have locked him up in a mental institution forever instead of letting him out. He literally got away with murder!.
One has to get awfully close, with the knife and pepper spray... Try Hornet's spray.. it shoots a long distance and very effective.
Thanks for the safety tips ...its unfortunate that an adventurous endeavor like hiking or camping ,raises alot of questions and awareness on safety issues...if it's not mosquitoes or deer ticks or mountain lions or bears ,its the other humans on the trails to be concerned about ...every year ,you hear about missing people...or animal attacks,etc....one has to ask themselves if they want to pursue this .....if so,be wary ,be alert travel in groups, and protect yourself beforehand....just stay safe....great post,guys!🐻🐻🐻
Or like the old saying: "Walk tall and carry a Big Stick" and be aware of y/our surroundings as much as possible. Happy Trails~
In 1986 we did the Trail with a cluster of young strapping, strong men at the same pace where we usually ended up at the same camp or shelter together so nobody was going to f with us...Nobody tried and it was a great adventure...The crazies and trouble-makers usually don't hike far in to the hard hills so you are usually OK...The AT is a very safe place and most through-hikers are good adventurous souls...Geoff & Molly ran in to an unwell person who knew of the Trail because of its popularity...The Appalachian Trail has a network of Park Rangers, volunteers, and hikers who will hunt down and do hard justice on any criminals who prey on Trail hikers...
Yes, if they happen to be around, at the time of an attack...?
Isn't it sad that our #1 concern in the wilderness is our own species? I mean, wow. It just makes you wonder just how deserving or even capable we are of being good stewards of Mother Earth 🌎
Well said my friend.😇
There are always rogues whether it be human or animal. The majority are safe to be around
Hello!
Although we have had black bears & coyotes sighted in our forest in SW VA., these are so rare, I have not seen a bear [which usually appear in Autumn: eating-to-hibernate] & I go out there several times each week.
My main concern is Humans. Most people I meet in the wilder places, are friendly & helpful. But then, there are a few to be wary of.
Meanwhile, Carry on and Happy Trails....
It's the same for all species.
It's not a specific human -byproduct.
Members of the same species compete for exactly the same resources, whether for immediate survival, or long term, i.e. mating...etc.
So, our intelligence simply allows us to deceive with more sophistication, but we exhibit the same interspecies dynamic as the rest..
You've forgotten man is merely an animal
I checked with law enforcement in the Shenandoah National Park in Va which contains about 105 miles of the AT. They said if you have a CWP you can carry on the trail but dont go into any of the buildings with a firearm. FYI
I so wish that more of the people who get into wilderness exploration would exercise the wisdom and protection you are offering here. Someone needs to rescue that poor dog, captive of a psycho.
Maybe Felicia dog, was some comfort and may have calmed him even slightly. Plus the dog may have carried some of his Gear.
He is mentally ill and obviously not treated, he's not psycho :/
WOW!! What an incredible thread of comments.
The bottom line is straightforward - YOU are responsible for your safety.
YOU must always be able to protect your person [self].
Quickly get out of suspicious situations.
IF you think it is really bad, be sure to warn others if there is a group.
Don't take chances as there is no need.
BUT, if confronted, BE PREPARED to defend yourself and others.
YOU are the person that can make a difference.
Be that person.
Thank you for having this talk. It is needed. One day, when it’s my turn to give thru hiking a shot, I need to think about Safety first.
Thank you for your kind words
Thanks. It was good to hear from you two folks giving good examples and ideas. Exiting and stealth camping a mile or two away is excellent advice.
If they do stealth camping, it's good to tie something to a few trees, to find their way out to the main trail.
All good tips: I have had nothing but great interactions while section hiking but you never know!!! In my opinion, The most dangerous animal on the trail however is the lowly deer tick.
I hope that's all you run into. Others haven't been that fortunate.
Not true. Even more dangerous is the horned deer who found out that his wife gave him horns :)))
That's your opinion, Greg...
sounds like you guys dodge a situation that could have been really bad. thanks for passing along your story.
Always, always, always bring a fire arm and bear spray and a personal locator beacon!!! Please do this! You never know what can happen out there. I've been backpacking and camping regularly for over 30 years and have had several incidents occur. These items potentially saved my life more than once. Better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it. Most importantly have fun and please be safe. Great video guys, take care!
Hornet spray, has a longer stream when used. You don't have to get that close as when you use bear spray.
@Chris Penfield your welcome. Keep your head on a swivel, when in the woods. Stay safe now.
I travel a lot. One thing I always go by is, if I have a bad gut feeling, or just feel a little uncomfortable I leave.
What a great video, thanks for making it. The first hand experience you shared is priceless. I'm currently in the planning stages for a through hike and deliberating how I'm going to protect myself. One thing I found all the popular you-Tube through hikers had in common was that at some point in their hike they all had encounters with dangerous animals and/or sketchy people. That matches up with my own personal experience on section hikes, and I haven't even factored in hitch-hiking and staying in low rent locations. Through hiker personal safety is a definitely a topic that needs more attention so bravo to you guys.
Thank you for the comment! When are you planning on thru hiking?
I've had both situations walking the 1/2 mile to work in the middle of the day.
@@missmodern LOL you must live in a big city?
@@NCAdventuress Medium sized.
Take a gun, that would have the capacity to take down a bear. There is cougars and panther's and bears on that trial and perhaps, a serial killer or two. Bring extra batteries and flash lights. Lighter n matches in a zip lock, baggy.
I stayed with Stronghold (then Engineer) at Trey Mountain Shelter and Top Of Georgia the end of January. My tramily and I were 40 miles ahead of where he was murdered. My heart still hurts.
I never go to bed, around stranger's. That's a very vulnerable time, for anyone. Killer's, will usually wait till they hear one, snoring.. Personally, I would never sleep in one of those shelter's unless I was with a large group of people, I knew before the hike.
LOL
We have the same thing, my partner and I. We don't hike, but for some reason we started bs-ing and came to a safety word. It just feels like something every single person should do.
thanks for your advice. I have done a lot of solo hiking in my day....I have been followed from trail heads, caught a man in full camo-hunting gear hiding behind a tree watching me, a photographer with a huge camera on me, and so on. I have a keen sense when I am being watched or when runners or other hikers are approaching. That being said, I have never done a solo overnight or ventured too far of of well traveled areas, the creepos have ruined that for me.
HI Lilee, I have always went with my( first gut feeling) about things, especially out in the woods. I read one time, this young woman would run everyday down a trail in the woods, one day a man jumped out behind a tree and grabbed her and she kneed him in his crotch and escaped. She told the police and they caught the man and he was put in a mental institution. be careful out there!
Solo overnight hikes definitely are more risky for women than guys as far as contending with possible rapists/murderers that see victims of opportunity. Both of my parents are dead so I just always have the idea in my head that they are watching over me and they would never let a crazy killer cross my path. Positive thoughts like that help me sleep at night when I am out in the wilderness alone. I definitely feel much safer camping alone at a place called graveyard meadows then I do being in a city like LA or NO and worrying about getting robbed and murdered over something so inane as my puma suit.
Creepos are unfortunately nearly EVERYWHERE ‼️‼️👎🏻
Same I won’t even walk a trail in my town alone, been watched many times even chased.
That's sad - maybe see a counselor who specializes in these (rational) fears so you aren't as limited. Maybe you won't solo camp but find a group and go with them - it's fun and safer in every way. I say this as a partial hypocrite because I am the lone hiker, but the things that scare you don't scare me and this isn't being better or stronger it's just we all have different things that trigger us and too bad to miss out if you can find a way that works, increases your safety and joy.
Good video thanks. My advice to everyone is trust your gut feelings. Trust other people’s gut feelings. Hike on when it doesn’t feel right.
Well said!
Never walk at night in the woods, there are cliffs and drop off's. Better to always travel in the daytime. Predator's, mainly hunt at night. Beware!
Nice heads up. I hope to hike the AT in 2023. I have been a peak bagger in the Northeast over the past 40 years and have seen very few weird, scary people. The majority of hikers are good people; it's the 2%ers that are a problem. Much of my peak bagging put me on the AT to bag 4000-Footers or 100-Highest. I never saw another person while bushwhacking to 100-Highest. Once I had a SOBO Thru Hiker get too close to me on Wild Cat Mt on the Carter Range in NH. He was asking me questions about where I was going, had spent the night, and how he would like to have spent the night with me. He had said he worked for food the previous night at the AMC's Carter Notch Hut. Suddenly I said to him: Excuse me, you just entered my personal zone. There was a moment of silence, and my dog jumped up and came over and stood between him & me. He began backing away slowly. I told him my dog was an American Pit Bull Terrier and could bite the living hell out of him. He backed off 20 feet and started running with his full pack.
I was watching this very closely (I referred to him as 'machete guy'), because my son was always about a day behind him. I told my son that if he came across anyone fitting his description to just keep going and do not interact. Then I heard what happened in the real early hours on Mother's Day and I couldn't reach my son for hours. Freaked me the hell out, but fortunately he was just in a bad spot for cell reception. I think this affected all of those closely on the trail that year. Just a sad thing to happen.
Wow! I would have freaked too. Get him a gun.
Oh my gosh I’m so glad he was okay!!! I was reading that with my heart racing!! 🤍
Make sure he has a weapon to protect himself.
It's weird I'm watching this and it's almost mothers day.
They should have committed this creep, to a mental asylum.
I catch so much hate for it but this is exactly why I carry.
Anyone thay hates on you for exercising your rights is a fool and not worth anymore of your time.
I've never done a through hike but take day hikes here and there usually in Maine where I am originally from. I'm sure I get labelled CREEPY GUY until people get to know me. Middle-aged guy who hikes alone, keeps to myself, carries a .44 mag revolver in a bandoleer holster when I hike deep in the woods/mountains. But I am pleasant and would help anyone in trouble. Honesty and integrity are the way to go. That said I can't be everyone's cup of tea and I respect that but I don't bother anyone so long as they are not dangerous to me. By the way - I respect you don't bring a gun on the trail, everyone has choices and if a person is ambivalent with firearms it's probably better they don't bring them because without safe practice, solid judgment and knowing your firearm it is less safe to have it. Nice couple and video - thumbs up.
I wouldn't be caught in the wilderness without a gun.. Daniel Boone, never went into the forest alone, without his muzzle loader!
I think that is a respectful, smart attitude you have about firearms. Knowing they aren't the best choice for everyone. Safe travels to you. I imagine it sucks for certain people to be seen as creeps when they actually are not and I sometimes wonder if it's hard for men that being male makes some people somewhat more likely to be fearful about a person than if they were female.
Smart!!! Thank you. I'm overly trusting and very friendly. Guess maybe I should button it up a little. Again thank you.
Same
This is why I will carry on the trail when I do go
Lol u and I both know that's retarded
Always be ready to defend yourself. Never let your guard down.
@@Highlander9740 that’s kinda the point is being able to let your guard down while your out in nature. I get what your saying though you encounter some folks who are just crazy and you have to be cautious with what you say or do around them
griffin bbb You're too naive man. A handgun could be the difference between life and death out in the wild.
I suggest, putting up some barrier, around your tent and you... like fishing twine and some can's or a device you can get on amazon, that makes a noise, when someone comes inside this perimeter.
I do not hike, or go into the woods, without a pistol….sorry. Grew up at the foot of Springer Mtn. GA and just heard of too many incidents….
So, I know a couple whose safe-phrase was, “moments seem like hours when hemorrhodial tissue flares up.”
Had the same thing happened to me. A few days after he got out of jail. Had to leave in a rain storm from a shelter.
rob crane similar situation, was it also hailing? Near Roan Mtn
@@taratreks Clyde Smith shelter.
Wow, yup. That is where we also met him. I knew several other people that went there and did the same thing in moving ahead. He must of been the only one in there for the night.
Using a safe word is great. Never thought to implement it on a trail. Thanks for that idea.
Thanks for telling your story and the tips. Hard earned wisdom.
You're welcome! Happy to help in any way we can.
I was a week behind you guys, so glad you two are good! OneGear✌
I am planning to section hike the AT solo. I’m pretty nervous as a 63 yr old female. Thank you for these tips. I won’t stay in any shelters! Mice? Yuk!
If you can, take a trusted person with you and take a gun.. big enough caliber to take down a bear, if you are attacked by one!
Incredible story. Very sound, mature advice.
Good on you for sharing.
Well done.
Thank you Mark!
I read most of the crime that happens on the trails is usually around towns, and cities, that the trail snakes through.
Mt.GRAYLOCK IN MASSACHUSETTS is one place it does, and I have run into some strange people on it. Jordan is one individual that was being searched for as well back in the early 90s, my dad and I saw him peeking at us hiding in the bushes, he disappeared and we never heard jack again, until the murders.
#2. There was a guy who was really good at getting strangers to trust him. You may have heard of Ted Bundy.
Oh excellent point!
When camping or hiking in any woods i am always armed. Mainly due to the threat of bad people more than animals however due to a few experiences, don't be conceited and think you know everything that can be out there. It took my friend years before he would step a foot back in the woods even with the biggest gun he has.
A lot of people, quit hunting or hiking all together.. Too many missing people.. and not a trace of them to be found!
That's the strangest part.. not a trace of them, anywhere..!
Ah Derek,what a man you are .Great to
Be discovering some much about
Yourself.Thanks for sharing so much
Of your heart.Travel well and may
God Bless you.
glad you guys are talking about it because we can’t right now.
Understood, We are here for y'all whenever you need to talk. Thru hikers stick together. :)
💪🏻
Be interested to hear the details of your encounter when you are able to talk about it.
That won’t be for a very long time, if ever. A trial would have to take place first, which is why I want others to talk about their experiences so future classes aren’t left feeling afraid!
Part of being in the outdoors is restoring our sense in and with nature. Still too often our instinct of safety threats is lost and our senses dull. This just emphasizes how important it is to follow yoir gut instinct snd trust your senses. It can keep us alive.
Grrat video snd tips!
Thank you for watching!
Love the safe word😉 lol that would actually work with every one in life not just on trail THANKS!!
100% agree
True .a safe word could be used in any situation
Was thinking the same thing
Thank you very much. I am sort of new to the hiking community(more of a day hiker), but am expanding, so I watch all of these to learn more. Thank you so much.
Of course! Thank you for watching.
Going hiking on busy trails is not my thing! I hike mostly private or less popular public trails. I have never been interested in hiking with strangers! My rules are: NEVER hike alone! ALWAYS bring a handgun! (Bringing a knife to a gunfight is pointless)! ALWAYS tell at minimum 2 people where you're going and when you're returning! If you have cell reception, check-in with your home-based contacts daily. Make sure your hbc know your safety word! Carry a personal locator device! Carry a flare gun in case you need rescuing! And of course, all the essentials needed for survival while hiking/backpacking. Be safe!
Exactly, I NEVER go without 2 things strapped to me at all times a handgun & a personal locator beacon with a rifle at arm's length and also the rest of the rules you wrote
Wild stuff! I passed him on Easter that year, just North of Hot Springs. Glad you guys were safe!
Wow! I'd have nightmares.
It's a sad fact of life that in the wilderness you'll have both animal & human predators, so there's always the potential for being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Don't wander or camp too far off-trail, try to travel in groups or within earshot of one if possible, and maintain your sense of situational awareness. Some folks, me included, like to hike in seclusion or solitude so it's important to keep it in mind that being alone increases your vulnerability and you should exercise extra caution. Even though I know it's against regulations to have a firearm on some trails, I still bring a small .22 mag for personal safety. I'm thinking that the one time I decide not to bring it will be the day I run into a pack of rabid dogs or an escaped criminal.
How do you keep a gun legal on one of these trails where you are running through multiple states?
@@donkeysaurusrex7881 If you are committed to carrying legally the laws vary from state to state but you are an interstate traveler or technically a "sojourner" so I would ask a lawyer how you would do that while traveling on foot & not in a motor vehicle. I myself believe in the 2A where it says that "the right to keep & bear arms shall not be infringed" so when I carry I do concealed rather than open carry. I don't care about local laws since it's nobody's business, I'm not hunting, & don't plan to pull out my weapon unless absolutely necessary. I won't consent to a search but will show an ID & whatever permits are required. I also won't answer any questions that aren't relevant to my hike. Basically I'd give the authorities no reason to think I've committed a crime & I behave myself when on public lands so there's no legitimate reason for an LEO to start fishing & asking personal questions. In the event I was arrested for carrying then I'd lawyer up & wait for my day in court.
@@kst357 Excellent! Totally agree.
Only a trusting fool, would go on these trails without a gun, that would take a bear down.
Your right.. it usually happens that way.. when you don't bring it.. something will happen.. its the way it goes.. it's called life. A 357 magum, hollow point bullets, will bring down something large. A small caliber gun, just make it mad...
I want to do the trail so bad. You guys are such an inspiration. If I ever get to go I will bring protection.
You are both smart and took a lot of precautions, all within reason but clearly the situation on the AT needs some things addressed. Hike with at least 1, preferably 2, other people you do fully trust, on the AT.
I believe when Jordan attacked Stronghold and the woman hiker there were at least two other people at that camp site/shelter who were able to run away.
Some great advice for life in general. Thanks for the video guys and safe adventures.
All this advice is really cool and nice, but I'm not going out on any trail anywhere without at least a Ruger SR22 or something, and if I run into someone with bad intentions then they are either gonna be in handcuffs or a black zip-up bag in the ambulance.
Ok
it's better to carry, than end up dead.
My .02 - always be aware of your surroundings and carry a readily accessable firearm and be confident in its use.
The safe word is a good idea. I can see where the PB thing could raise a red flag if you said it but the guy never saw you eat any PB... Also, the guy might offer you some PB, lol... I'd choose something like a piece of gear that we both know we've never used, like Gaiters, perhaps. Or an umbrella. And say "Hey, did you ever find your umbrella?" and then the affirmative response would be "No, darn the luck! I think I left it back in the hostel..." That would be a totally casual way to deliver the safe word without getting trapped.
lowell mayfield that’s a great point! I think you are right, thanks for that
llowel Mayfield omg umbrella is our safe word !!!!wifey was massaging out a bad shoulder cramp !! hurt so bad a yelled out umbrella ! UMBRELLA! out of nowhere cause it was summer no rain she checked up, We laugh anout it today!!!ya know kinda like Fiftyshadesof Gray 'did you roll your eyes at me?' ha!
I would say, have you seen my hairspray?,
Wow, thank you for the tips. We are only dreaming about hiking the AT but who knows we might get there one day.
Imagine being afraid of potentially encountering dangerous people out in the middle of nowhere, hours from help, yet not being armed.
99% of the time in outdoor activities you’ll be running into good people out there on the trail. But as with the rest of life you should always be careful.
Excellent video, well balanced. I appreciate a family friendly resource I can share with my nieces and nephews. Blessings to you and yours 🙏🏻
They are so family-friendly aren't they 🤗
There's plenty of small pistols that weigh next to nothing these days, even an 11oz smith and wesson .357 magnum. You can just carry pepper spray, also very effective. Your safety is your responsibility, don't count on others, and don't be a victim. Good luck everyone, stay safe.
No no no .Pistol ,period.carry it carry it carry it.It is handy not just against humans but animals too or just to signalise.So i totally agree with you and as a message to all ,please do not let your "last"tought to be;"if only i had my pistol with me" Bright blessings and safe hike
What am i as a foreigner going to do not being able to buy a gun..
@@Za7a7aZ . I guess you're sol other countries gun laws are bs
@@Za7a7aZ buya gun from a private citizen
I have been wanting to solo hike the application trail, and this gives me pause. Im glad you made it out ok!!
I used to do a lot of back packing up in the Sierra Nevada mountains with my late father when I was young and he just always taught me to avoid making contact with people if you see them first. If we noticed people from afar, we would get off the trail a bit and wait until they would pass us the other way. This way if the person is some kind of nut, they wouldn’t notice us and visit us at our new camp at night. I will be honest though I never thought of serial killers up in the Edison Lake area of the John Muir trail. Rattlesnakes and mountain lions were my main worry and I always had a gun on me even as a 14 year old that I put under my pillow at night so people didn’t scare me other than Jason Vorhees. My dad always told me the serial killers are on the Appalachian Mountain trails, because all the local towns along the Appalachian mountains allow for easier blending in and escaping, then where we would backpack where there was only one road in and out. Further north by Yosemite is where you have to be careful in the Sierra Nevada mountains, because you are dealing with a lot more people and easier blending in.
@@enwin1912 I grew up with one former LRRP's that survived deep in NVA territory teaching me all he knew about being stealthy and avoiding detection in an environment that is more applicable to the place I backpack in then say someone that fought and survived in Fallujah. Now there is always a chance, I come across some trained killers that watch me and laugh before then deciding to toy with me, but that would be like winning the unlucky lottery.
Wow, that is precisely how I go in wilderness, There is one particular person in our forest, which I try to always avoid, so I look all around, especially ahead & behind. Like it was said in Many TV Westerns: "Study your backtrail & the trail ahead." Plus I read how a successful hunter(or hiker) will stop often, to look & listen and smell the air. This has alerted me many a time, and let me see wild animals, who sometimes come close to me when I am quiet & not moving. And for the non-predators, like white-tail deer & turkeys, this is a delight.
Happy Trails........
In the Sierras you have to worry about running into a Mexican drug cartels marijuana grow. If they see you out there too close to their grow they may kill you. Not something we should be having to worry about trying to get away on a hike.
@@bigmacfullerton7870 Wow! I've heard of this but that's awful.
@@soysaucehairdye7869 Do you set up a safety perimeter of alert, around you and your tent, when you camp?
Hello Dower Duo, I'm an (old) hiking enthusiast, and I kept running across the name of this man. I thought that it could not mean Rep. James Jordan (R-OH), a member of Congress. Nor could it be the father of Michael Jordan, the great athlete (James Jordan, Sr.). So, when I ran across this video of yours, I watched it., and, then did research on the person, the topic, the crime, and the victims. Thank you for sharing. Scary. Traveling solo can be very dangerous, and even traveling as a couple can be risky. - Dr Dave (retired physics prof)
DrDave Menke thank you for the comment Dr. Dave!
TDD, Thank you for this informative video. I followed you on most of your thru-hike this year. Congratulations on completing the AT. You deserve a lot of credit for your tenacity and endurance, all the while keeping a positive attitude. Respect to you! I believe 1000 will be achieved soon because your are people with integrity and compassion.
Regarding the bad guy you're discussing. I read one account that said after he was arrested the first time, he was released because none of the hikers he threatened were willing to stay around and testify against him. Can you comment on this information? I'm on the west coast far removed from the AT. You were there and actually encountered this guy. Do you think it's hikers' responsibility to testify in court, possibly delaying their journey, if they have important information that could lead to a conviction?
Yes! I remember hearing that. I believe we know who was threatened and know by the time they found Jordan, that individual was already gone..way down trail. The police did the best they could and busted him for a drug charge and tried to keep him in jail as long as they could. They also took his massive weapon I believe.
However I do not have an opinion on the matter of whose responsibility it is to testify in court. This is still a sensitive topic for some and there are a lot of factors to it. You raise good questions though. I think this is important for future thru hikers to consider and come to their own conclusions about.. hopefully nothing like this ever happens again.
Thank you for following our journey this year. We appreciate your support :)
JOHN DIVITA.... I can't imagine that after James Jordan killed Stronghold and nearly killed a woman with him, that those hikers who called cops beforehand who arrested Jordan based on the threats those hikers received, that they now deeply regret not hanging around to testify. If they have a conscience, it should be they never forget that they could have saved a life and the trauma to that poor woman badly injured hiker who had to walk 5-6 miles to get to paramedics. She could have bled out! And the trauma with which she will live forever is unimaginable.
If those accusing hikers had testified, Jordan could have been held and subjected to a psychiatric evaluation forcing him to be institutionalized. If good people don't stand up to evil and violent mental illness, who will?
@@taratreks I find it astounding that you "don't have an opinion" about whether or not the hikers who had Jordan arrested, should have stayed around to testify! You are a lovely young couple of influencers but you are too young, too naive and too inexperienced in life. Obviously you have never been victims of violent crime. Tragically, this country is in an epidemic of violent crime especially in our big cities and large metro areas.
I have lived thru it in Center City Philadelphia for 22 years, a very expensive part of that city and was a victim of muggings with guns held to my head in addition to home broken into, apt bldg I owned broken into, car broken into, handbag ripped off me, etc. I left the NE Corridor after being there my entire life in big cities and moved to a beautiful, safe, sane, conservative Western NC mountain county, a region with which I was very familiar. We have practically no violent crime! There has been one murder in 14 years in my county and the two guys knew each other. Philly had 562 murders in 2021! But Philly caused me to have my head on a swivel, see and hear everything. That will never leave but at least I have relaxed now living in a civilized and beautiful place and I never want to move again.
I would've testified against him. It keeps the forest's safe for the rest of us.. who knows.. the next time.. it could happen to any one of us...?
Being a child of the 70's who grew up watching westerns, I'm a firm believer in packing a pistol.
I'm never shy about being rude.
There’s so many people on trail and always around each other. Not very much to worry about. There’s always a worry when you step out of your house. Lol
My safe word is Glock 40 and my Husky. I've been lucky never met a dangerous person yet.
me too and my Rottie
@@elaine-li7wt Cool let's go camping 🏕
I avree withe glock
I don't think it's odd your safety should be your 1st concern. So that why you can enjoy your hike 🚶♂️ 🏕
Judgement and judging are two very different things. I see many people letting go of a well reasoned and intuitive skill of judgement because of this current fixation on non-judging. We need to be wise to be truly well.
The primary difference are the situation and context and people in general have to learn this. In everyday life, a wrong judgment ist sometimes awkward but rarely dangerous. Out in "the wild", with no other people around and no possibilities to call for fast help it could end fatal.
DAN JUST THINKING... Bingo! You have said exactly what the danger is about "the current fixation on non-judging." TY so much.
Yes trusting our judgment and intuition in life is incredibly important. Trying so hard to be polite and never speak ill can be taken to the extreme where it is very naive or dangerous or in certain cases enables harm or is a missed opportunity to help prevent or protect in appropriate ways. I have some life stories I've seen that play out.
In my experience, people trying to shame or distract people away from their right to make a judgment call about what feels safe and yes and resonant enough to them...are not necesarily always the safest of people. Because if they were they'd generally support the person in knowing their safety limits and when they need to exit a situation - instead of saying something like, "You're over-reacting or over-thinking when you say that situation makes you uneasy" or "Just trust everyone equally...that's what kind people do." I'm speaking in run-on sentences and not wording that super clear but hope it makes sense.
Question: When Jordan began yelling and getting aggressive towards your wife/gf, what was your reaction? And in retrospect, whatever your given response was at the time, would you have done something differently if you could go back now?
What questions would you ask the others to get to know them?
I don't go ANYWHERE unarmed... even on the trail. Bad people can be any place you are. In the woods, chances are that you are your ONLY help.
It's interesting that the best blessing and the highest danger on the trail are other people.
Wow, harrowing story! "Peanut butter" may have saved your life! Awesome tips!
We will never know if it did thank God! And thank you!
The Dower Duo or you all could have texted each other
Brian Cline sometimes we don’t have service out there and most people keep their phones on airplane mode. It’s hard to rely on that
I don't hike yet. I just read and listen to alot of stories, but I think the safe word is great! Couples have a secret word we use to let our Sig Other know when we are ready to leave a gathering so we'll slowly move towards the door st the same time 🙂. A safe word in the wilderness sounds fantastic.
Thank you... Super important lesson. Better safe than sorry
Glad it was helpful!
Deliverance is a must see documentary before attempting this trail...
You guys make this sounds very doable, but with like the points people rarely seem to include.
Me personally though, I'm packing heat if I go. I'm a small female and I'm not trying to take on nature without firepower.