the biggest weakness of heal herald is actually that you are not bringing quickherald. There is a reason all S tier builds are alac or rather can be alac in the case of chrono.
@@andrebasulo705Heal Scourge + Quick DPS Herald is a much better combination sadly. No matter how hard ANet tries, no other spec can beat the one who can consistently pump out boons in a 600 radius.
HFB is S tier if played right. Seems like many players are just trashtalking because of bad HFB players without thinking. I've seen bad HFBs and I've seen godlike HFBs that outclassed everything else. Perfect runs and esp. logs don't lie.
WRONG. ITS TIME TO WAKE UP YOUVE BEEN IN A COMA FOR 5 YEARS. FB is strictly worse than chrono in every way AND takes the quickness spot, meaning you dont get the god tier qHerald or qScrapper for fractals. PLEASE wake up, everyone misses you.
@@bobiboulon Also rebound's skills description is flat out wrong as well. It doesn't prevent lethal damage and heal, it sets your hp to the heal amount. So if a rebound said its heal was 3k and a player with 10k hp took 10k damage procing rebound. The way the skill says it should work, they'd have 13k hp. But How the skill actually works would set their hp to 3k instead of preventing the 10k damage then healing you for 3k. Yes the skills description has been wrong for nearly 9 years as of this comment.
i think that your tier list is actually quite good this time around. one addition to druid maybe: as long as you don't need massive constant healing from staff, i always default to running mace/mace on the second set. this allows for very consistent use of force of nature and with that crazy amonts of cc. no chrono or renegade will even get close to that cc. i can literally solo cc sammy without compromising on boons. and one remark that you might have overlooked or not seen in all its glory: heal scrapper is crazy good currently. since i do daily fractal cm's for years, i feel like it's actually better than hfb for fracs. you have insane boon uptime, way more cleanse, way more cc if you take battering ram, even more stab if you take elixir B (3 ranged stab sources with multiple stacks), almost as good barrier output as hscg, great superspeed and stealth access. i hate it every day we get a ham for fracs since boon application and utility, especially stab sucks hard in comparison. i would currently take a good heal scrapper over any other quickness healer in any content. imo the only real downside is that your fury only comes from relic of the midnight king, but that's easy fine as long as you have a target.
I'm inclined to agree with you on heal scrapper, but as someone new to fractal CM's it's rough figuring out what skills and traits to take for each encounter. Do you know of any kills from a healscrap PoV on youtube I could learn from?
@@campioneri mhh, sadly I don't, I basically learnt it myself. But for fractals you would take Shortbow for aegis and ranged cc, relic of the midnight king for fury. Utilities are always medkit, blast gyro and bulwark gyro. Depending on the fight, you want elixir fun for healing/cleanse, elixir B for fights that demand a lot of stab like skorvald or mama, personal battering ram for big cc like for Ai and artsariiv. For elite you take mortar kit for the heal on 5, on artsariiv I take elixir X for cc, sometimes you want supply crates for more immediate cc, sneak gyro for normal T4s. Make sure you run scrapper 322 for stab on f5. You play the build by spamming sb 2->3 for barrier and might, sb 5->4 for fury and more might, blast gyro off CD, f1 and f5 usually off CD, medkit 3->5 off CD for more boons, with elixir gun also skill 2 for more swiftness and the toolbelt for more regen. Biggest heals are on elixir gun 5, medkit 4, sb 3 and mortar kit 5. Big barrier on bulwark gyro, stab on f5 and defense field and throw elixir B if you have it. Aegis on sb 4, especially for artsariiv in the middle and ensolyss when he pulls after 33%.
Pretty much agree with the tier list I just need to get one thing out there…heal specter is certainly (lower) A tier. I can not only get the job done but it can be pretty much a perfectly working build AS LONG as 2 points are taken into consideration… 1) its obligatory to have proper key binds for personal target (set & take) and also set and take target (standard T). With that its easy to switch between youe preferred target and the enemy 2) dont use blinding powder off cooldown but instead as a situational tool when either am ally is very low and more away from the group or the group in general needs a strong additional heal Only real minus point which needs mentioning…it has right now NO aegis which limits it… Hope it gets it soon (strongly suspect it) But its heal and boons are awesome - barrier too; it can fit the role of healer quite well! And contrary to scourge (which is rightly S tier) it does not need a qdps to compensate…
Tbh, hfb is more or less a tier. And I feel like you argue like this as well. Just because other builts have the same kit derates a hfb. Hfb still has one of the best toolkit. It lacks a bit of sustain heal maybe but the burst heal is pretty good. I really see hfb in A tier honestly.
It's a bit unfortunate that the boon radius of Firebrand mantras is just a mere 180, same as Tempest Fire Overload. Also, contrast to the general belief, Firebrand doesn't lack sustain healing, it has: Regen, Tome 2 passive, symbols all ticking at once.
Atleast in my opinion. The only reason you would bring a heal firebrand is for it's stability and aegis, the boon radius is just to low and as you said, it's sustain healing is not onpar withost builds now
If heal untamed gets stability I think it'd be fine. You have plenty of boons through spirits, your ambushes, and the few good pet boons, as well as lots of blasts for Karakosa and you actually provide a lot more DPS than other healers (which is relevant in higher end groups). I'm not sure the numbers now, but pre-Force of Nature nerf with full harrier's gear and Vicious Quarry you did around 12k DPS (without losing much in the way of boons). While definitely worse than druid, it's definitely better than Teapot says (just like boon DPS untamed who could've guessed)
Nah, not gonna lie heal untamed is kinda bad lol. I know that identity is super tied into builds, but a build being not super great isn't an attack or a slight to that identity and it doesn't mean you can't enjoy that build or that you shouldn't play it. Untamed heal (and qdps) is weak compared to other options, that's just the reality.
@MightyTeapot in what way are the boon untamed builds weak? Just the lack of stability? I can see that for heal untamed, but both variants of quick DPS untamed are very solid in their own rights. Comparing them to something like chrono, chrono only really has portal and stability over untamed. Untamed has a reflect and multiple bubbles, multiple aegis sources, can upkeep protection without using a utility slot (invigorating bond+maces, which also gives you vigor) on the power variant, can upkeep 25 might and fury (dropping lynx or the 2nd pet on the condi variant for fury specifically), and has immobilization through both the relatively free elite slot (totally free for power quick) and pets (Jacaranda and drakehound). Untamed has better damage output than chrono on both builds, comparing power qunt to power boon chrono, condi quick unt to condi boon chrono, and condi quick unt to power boon chrono (and vice versa, but condi boon chrono is a bit of a meme). What specifically about untamed is bad? As far as I can tell, you only dislike it because of the loss of Fervent Force and are rating it poorer because of that. I can understand the healing output issues on heal untamed, but even still you have 3 blasts on your weapon skills alone, pet unleash F2 is another blast that (should, haven't checked if it was changed) proc karakosa, and you have pretty frequent poison fields to blast into to proc karakosa for more healing, so it isn't even that lacking in healing skill options. The boon DPS builds are way better than you're giving them credit for pound for pound, and the heal build is better than you seem to think (although I'd definitely rank it near where you did just because "it's not druid")
Loves your videos, it helped me alot❤ I started playing 1 month ago, i got rare drop "Fang of the Lion's Champion" 😍🔥waiting for it to get sold to buy all the living worlds ♥️♥️
I would consider all the S+ heals as S, and herald would drop down into A with mech and hb. In a game with so many reactive moments for supports, a healer whose utility is locked for 10 seconds after reacting to something is a huge drawback and doesn't deserve S tier.
The alac application for heal renegade is just as reliable and good as herold. It gives perma 33% incoming dmg reduction to group. It has no problems keeping up might. It has a strong group cleanse with 3(4) cleanses every 4-5 seconds. A mobile, perma'ish projectile blocking shield. Group 2-3% damage increase and lifesteal as well as other dmg modifiers. Extremely bursty, spammable strong heals. The point is, you're just wrong about healing renegade being B tier. It is most certainly the strongest build in A tier. HAM and HFB stronger than healing renegade?? No chance. I am willing to die on that mountain. You clearly haven't played it
Heal renegade is not even remotely close to those builds lol, the A tier builds have everything you listed but better healing, better boon access and better boon application. It's obviously playable, but it's not good compared to the really broken stuff.
Because too many people don't know how to really utilize the HFB. If a good player plays HFB, it's an absolute S Tier Healer. It's flexible and can counter almost anything. It's just not good in situations like HT CM, ToF CM or Kiting stuff. I'm a HFB main and I can also show you some logs with 25 Might and everything @99-100%. but I've seen soooo many bad HFB players out there. A (really) good HFB player can outclass most other heal builds easily.
@@cxmusicofficial I'd add that HFB requieres a good team, because despite its generous access to support boons like aegis or stability, it lacks in raw healing output, thus making it not able to save careless players. That's where Tempest will be supperior, imo: its ability to make up for your teammate mistakes with a big healing output and even a decent revive ability with the Glyph of Renewal (but still not as good as Druid's glyph, for instance).
@@bobiboulon I never had a problem with carrying bad pug teams with my HFB. The reason for the lower healing output is that the HFB is a prevention healer. You can counter many things in advance (pun intended) so you won't even need your healing that much. Of course, carrying has it's limits and you have to time your stuff wisely. Sorry for my bad english btw. HFB has a base rotation you need to follow (2x Staff 4, 2x Axe 2) while putting everything else in between. If you utilize your tomes correctly, you can aegis 5 times in a row (!) with 1. Advance, 2. Opening the F3 tome, 3. using F3 + 5, 4. Advance again 5. and Shield 4. That means, for example, perma aegis in situations like Deimos CM or Sunqua CM or just preventing the need of healing. You can also perma stab with SYG & F3 + 5 in tandem. If you combine your HFB with the Relic of the swarm, your healing get's also way easier since the barrier is very good. I almost never use the F2 Tome except for emergency situations (F2 + 5 -> Big Condi Cleanse & Heal Burst after for example, I rarely use F2+2 since I have the regen mantra equipped most of the time). My standard healing is my rotation and the group is almost always full life. The 2x Staff 4 and mantras on CD (but I'm not using the last ammo of my mantras, only if I need to go somewhere else) are already healing the group permanently. I know that the HFB can feel "weird" if you are used to something like a Druid. Many new or unexperienced players tend to use the healing bow for example, completely wasting a utility slot for a rather slow and bad healing. Staff 3+2 combo (another condi cleanse btw) has the same range and you won't need the healing bows. I ONLY use them for: Escorting Desmina on River and Statue of the Broken King . Otherwise, my standard is 3 mantras (Heal, Quick & Regen mantra) + 1 Utility (SYG or Advance) and Feel my wrath. There are other exceptions like MAMA CM where I prefer to use the Stab Elite (instead of Feel my wrath) + SYG in high dps groups. Or for Samarog CM, I'm always taking the stab elite and SYG to ensure perma stab Since F3 + 5 only gives Aegis and 1 stack of Stab. Thats better for a filler here between SYG and the Stab Elite. Otherwise, I'm almost always on my standard setup, just swapping out Advance or SYG (Depends if we need stab or aegis). Of course, sometimes you need Sanctuary for CC or other stuff or Wall of Reflection and so on. You always have to adapt to the encounter. I also upkeep 25 might all the time while using my might gens: Opening F1 tome gives you might, F1+5 gives you might, F1+4+2 + Staff 2 Double blasts might, Staff 4 on cd gives you might and mantras on cd are giving might. If you're struggling with it, you can take the trait for generating extra might. I don't need it and prefer the staff boost.
lol my raid guild healers are usually untamed, hfb, heal temp, or heal scrapper 😂😂😂😂😂 i think we pulled out heal chrono once, heal herald like once or twice, and our untamed swapped to druid like once and then went back to untamed as soon as possible 😂😂😂
I wanna know how a support with one stack of aegis, relatively low healing, and unusable stability can be S tier. I really wanna know. I fucking hate having a heal scourge in my group,
The amount of support you provide just from your barrier is insane, allowing for you to completely negate mechanics. It also has the benefit that it has the best carry potential via its revive potential. Yes it doesn't have access to much aegis and stability, but you can easily have your BoonDps provide that.
@@EDGE-Chris To the build only is S tier if a herald can pick up the slack in terms of boons. Which is an odd way of rating a build. From my experience if i have a healscourge I need to prepare to evade every mechanic and interrupt my skills, cause I sure can't rely on the healer to share stab.
@@feniu10 I would still say scourge is a s tier healing, so what if you don't get permanent swiftness and stab from the scourge, most boon classes can cover that. Secondly, it's mainly used as a pug healer/carry healer where you can singlehandedly cover healing for both groups and keep anyone alive that downed state. Also, you can always position yourself and use skills effectively to negate the need of stability. Always better to play safe then caring for the highest damage possible :)
@@Xialohyou can provide all your boons without a target, but quickness/alacrity and protection you cant provide 100% uptime without one. This is almost never an issue cause you can build up a decent boon buffer for those at the start of the fight using continuum split and spamming all your shatters while in it and you overcap those boons so much during the encounter itself that the uptime of them becomes irrelevant to think about. This is more valid criticism to the boondps variant, but on the heal build its honestly a non-issue. For swiftness, relic of febe synergizes extremely well with the heal mantra on hchrono since itll allow you to proc it consistently off cd, make your 1 condi cleanse upon using a heal skill trait in inspiration even stronger cause the relic will remove movement impairing condis prior to it and in addition grant full swiftness uptime from just pressing your heal skill alone. An alternative if youre running staff is; you can also take the staff cd reduction trait over the regen on chaos aura trait and provide swiftness uptime like that; using chaos storm every 10 sec to provide relatively consistent swiftness uptime, its just slightly less reliable cause of the rng element to it and requiring you to stand still in it for maximum value.
Well, at least fractals are still owned by Firebrand (except on silent surf CM). Scourge, herald and druid have kind of 0 stab (except herald, but you need to know when you will need stab) and really low aegis. Chrono is kinda bad on pre-buffs, so you will start almost all fights without quick/alac. Also chrono have a delayed might application on really small areas, so it can hurt the start of the fights too. Firebrand needs NO utility from the offensive suports (except for huge breakbar bursts). To me Firebrand is still >. :3 ...you dont need to revive people if they dont die.
Chrono can pre-buff (yes even quick/alac) all fights so what you are saying there is simply not true xD It has stability, aegis and far more CC than HFB and it can reflect and boon strip on top of that. Might is not an issue either. So fractals are pretty much owned by Heal Chrono now but fractalers are still holding on to HFB because of good ol' reliable.
WRONG. ITS TIME TO WAKE UP YOUVE BEEN IN A COMA FOR 5 YEARS. FB is strictly worse than chrono in every way AND takes the quickness spot, meaning you dont get the god tier qHerald or qScrapper for fractals. PLEASE wake up, everyone misses you.
How much of a weakness for scourge is its stability access? You were talking about untamed's gaping hole of stability and I couldn't help but think of scourge too.
Herald being legend-locked is rough but the buffs to ventari with the ability to empower the tablet skills helps a lot, and it can handle mechanics more easily than you'd think as long as the herald knows how to adapt its build to handle them, but the skill check is certainly higher than some of the other S tier healers. It is absolutely the ultimate tank, though, so often you can have the other healer handle mechanics while the herald plays the role of main tank on the boss. Plus it has some other unique utility like the ability to keep up a ridiculously high uptime projectile block and its ludicrous amounts of CC it can bring, being able to hard-carry groups that don't know how to break blue bars, and the boon extension from glint can literally make your offensive support a more skilled player by pumping up their boon uptime. It is a super fun and good build that anyone who likes being a giga tank should try. Revive power is the one thing it feels like it lacks, much like chrono, plus the slight inflexibility on utilities from being legend-locked, but it does get to take twice as many utilities as other specs as a result so its pretty interesting. Anyways, love the build and cannot recommend it enough. The biggest downside is that you have to bring a mediocre boon dps because alac dps builds are worse than quick herald haha.
While certainly a solid raw output healer, especially sought after in WvW, the start of the video mentions key boons are mandatory for the list. Vindi is just healing, no quick or alac.
heal vindi is a pvp build this is pve. not every elite has the ability to do every role, the ones at the bottom aren't capable enough for defensive support.
While you may have been joking about the balance team and catalyst, it really is just a poorly design spec. I could rant for a long time about the obvious shortcuts taken and lazy/poor choices. As you mentioned, their utilities are basically fake in pve and that’s just the start
@@Midaspl its kind of a gimmicky build, though. It's viable, but it's mostly just hard carried by staff which feels awkward when you get locked into gunsaber every time you need to use dragon trigger for alac. Also gotta keep in mind it's competition. It'll work on many encounters, but it wont hard carry like a druid would.
@@jipgg I wouldn't call it gimmicky. It isn't without issues and probably won't be adding side wheels to a bike like HSC does, but it still has less issues than heal specter or even druid (IDK what druid is even doing on S+ tier there...). Heal bladesworn has very nice burst healing, good mobility and can apply boons really quickly and on a long duration, so even being locked out of staff for few seconds is not an issue. What it lacks is big barrier, large cc and lower cd on rez ability. Putting it below heal specter and untamed and on par with catalyst and mirage is just ignorance.
@@Midaspl Looks like you are in the same boat. Saying druid doesnt belong in S+ tier is also ignorance. And i disagree, it IS a gimmicky build. You essentially get forced out of your main healing source just to apply alacrity. This is not mentioning that you cant use a secondary weaponset AND dont have access to the staff burst skill. It'll work on many encounters just fine, but does it compete with its current competition? Not even close. Teapot even explicitly stated that all these builds are viable for most content, some are just significantly better at it. Imo hbladesworn is on par with hharbinger, theyre hard-carried by anything other than the spec itself and the spec even actively cripples its effectiveness.
@@jipgg well... Druid not being S+ is just experience. It's clunky in many ways to the point we resigned from it in our Cerus group in favour of tempest after first LCM kill. Healing and alacrity application suffers if the other healer does his job as well as giving alac in a very small aoe on some spells are main drawbacks for that. It's pretty good healer, but often feels terrible to play, thus I'd rate it more as low S/high A tier. About bladesworn, it deserves at least B tier. I disagree it being just carried by anything offspec. If anything, in niche scenarios, the spec is what carries it above everything else in other tiers - it is the longest duration alac applied in a single skill. It is by no means HSC, but it works well in most fights. Give me fights in raids/EoD Cams where you think it won't work and I'll send logs.
I do think heal catalyst is a little slept on. While it is definitely not a good build, it can be sorta ok. It doesn't provide stab at all and it's aegis is part of it's rotation but it does maintain 100% uptime of 25 stacks of might, fury, resolution, vigor, swiftness, prot, quick, and regen. Keep in mind that fury and resolution are two boons that tempest does not provide. It also does enough healing to keep itself and allies alive in an extremely damaging field in the golem room. The real sketchy thing is meme'ing yourself by not being able to generate energy in a real fight. If you take icebow, you can pump some really crazy healing numbers, I'm talking sustained 2000+ healing per second per target. Heal catalyst is by no means good, it's stressful to play, but it's not as bad as people think it is.
@@slikskils1603 oh there are absolutely always better options. Like I said, the build isn't good, but it's not unusable like most people think. I've done all of the ibs strikes with it and most of the EoD strikes. It actually can pump as much healing as tempest, it's just kinda easy to meme yourself with the energy mechanic if you are not careful.
just finished my light legendary armor a month ago and i have been using the riffle heal chrono build and its been awesome. Have done cm 99 and cm 100 with it and it works great.
"Heal berserker" is the poster child for the "bland sameness" mentality that anet has implemented. everyone must be able to do everything because nobody is allowed to be special anymore. Can't just roll a new alt to fill your team's needs. nono! You MUST be able to do EVERYTHING on whatever class you chose to bring that day, or the late millennial middle management at anet will be sad.
@@Werkzeug-100 cant imagine support build being more Effective than dps build at soloing content lol. I wanna see minstrel druid clearing content faster than zerker xD
@@TheNaughtyPetey They didn't say for soloing, they said for solo carrying. As in, you go into group content, but can't vouch for the skills of the others because you're pugging. As a DPS build, the impact you can make on the run succeeding or failing is far smaller than a defensive support.
the biggest weakness of heal herald is actually that you are not bringing quickherald. There is a reason all S tier builds are alac or rather can be alac in the case of chrono.
Pretty much lol
Facts. Heal herald is honestly busted despite not having a revive but it suffers from success by not working alongside the dps version of itself XD
Adps scourge
@@andrebasulo705Heal Scourge + Quick DPS Herald is a much better combination sadly.
No matter how hard ANet tries, no other spec can beat the one who can consistently pump out boons in a 600 radius.
@@sanguin3And there is me, an ancient main tempest with a 180 radius... Ridiculous
We are finally at a point where you count run an entire raid squad comprised of one profession for each profession.
Willbender is pretty decent at 15k dps without sacrificing healing potential and boon uptime :) Pretty good for speed runs
HFB is S tier if played right. Seems like many players are just trashtalking because of bad HFB players without thinking. I've seen bad HFBs and I've seen godlike HFBs that outclassed everything else. Perfect runs and esp. logs don't lie.
WRONG. ITS TIME TO WAKE UP YOUVE BEEN IN A COMA FOR 5 YEARS. FB is strictly worse than chrono in every way AND takes the quickness spot, meaning you dont get the god tier qHerald or qScrapper for fractals. PLEASE wake up, everyone misses you.
As a support tempest enjoyer, I'm looking forward to the day that it finally arrives.
And for starter, we need is a good elite skill. That Rebound shout is not on par with other support elites, neither are our trusted elementals.
@@bobiboulon Also rebound's skills description is flat out wrong as well. It doesn't prevent lethal damage and heal, it sets your hp to the heal amount.
So if a rebound said its heal was 3k and a player with 10k hp took 10k damage procing rebound. The way the skill says it should work, they'd have 13k hp.
But How the skill actually works would set their hp to 3k instead of preventing the 10k damage then healing you for 3k.
Yes the skills description has been wrong for nearly 9 years as of this comment.
i think that your tier list is actually quite good this time around. one addition to druid maybe: as long as you don't need massive constant healing from staff, i always default to running mace/mace on the second set. this allows for very consistent use of force of nature and with that crazy amonts of cc. no chrono or renegade will even get close to that cc. i can literally solo cc sammy without compromising on boons.
and one remark that you might have overlooked or not seen in all its glory: heal scrapper is crazy good currently. since i do daily fractal cm's for years, i feel like it's actually better than hfb for fracs. you have insane boon uptime, way more cleanse, way more cc if you take battering ram, even more stab if you take elixir B (3 ranged stab sources with multiple stacks), almost as good barrier output as hscg, great superspeed and stealth access. i hate it every day we get a ham for fracs since boon application and utility, especially stab sucks hard in comparison. i would currently take a good heal scrapper over any other quickness healer in any content. imo the only real downside is that your fury only comes from relic of the midnight king, but that's easy fine as long as you have a target.
I'm inclined to agree with you on heal scrapper, but as someone new to fractal CM's it's rough figuring out what skills and traits to take for each encounter. Do you know of any kills from a healscrap PoV on youtube I could learn from?
@@campioneri mhh, sadly I don't, I basically learnt it myself. But for fractals you would take Shortbow for aegis and ranged cc, relic of the midnight king for fury. Utilities are always medkit, blast gyro and bulwark gyro. Depending on the fight, you want elixir fun for healing/cleanse, elixir B for fights that demand a lot of stab like skorvald or mama, personal battering ram for big cc like for Ai and artsariiv. For elite you take mortar kit for the heal on 5, on artsariiv I take elixir X for cc, sometimes you want supply crates for more immediate cc, sneak gyro for normal T4s. Make sure you run scrapper 322 for stab on f5. You play the build by spamming sb 2->3 for barrier and might, sb 5->4 for fury and more might, blast gyro off CD, f1 and f5 usually off CD, medkit 3->5 off CD for more boons, with elixir gun also skill 2 for more swiftness and the toolbelt for more regen. Biggest heals are on elixir gun 5, medkit 4, sb 3 and mortar kit 5. Big barrier on bulwark gyro, stab on f5 and defense field and throw elixir B if you have it. Aegis on sb 4, especially for artsariiv in the middle and ensolyss when he pulls after 33%.
Pretty much agree with the tier list
I just need to get one thing out there…heal specter is certainly (lower) A tier. I can not only get the job done but it can be pretty much a perfectly working build AS LONG as 2 points are taken into consideration…
1) its obligatory to have proper key binds for personal target (set & take) and also set and take target (standard T). With that its easy to switch between youe preferred target and the enemy
2) dont use blinding powder off cooldown but instead as a situational tool when either am ally is very low and more away from the group or the group in general needs a strong additional heal
Only real minus point which needs mentioning…it has right now NO aegis which limits it…
Hope it gets it soon (strongly suspect it)
But its heal and boons are awesome - barrier too; it can fit the role of healer quite well! And contrary to scourge (which is rightly S tier) it does not need a qdps to compensate…
Tbh, hfb is more or less a tier. And I feel like you argue like this as well. Just because other builts have the same kit derates a hfb. Hfb still has one of the best toolkit. It lacks a bit of sustain heal maybe but the burst heal is pretty good. I really see hfb in A tier honestly.
It's a bit unfortunate that the boon radius of Firebrand mantras is just a mere 180, same as Tempest Fire Overload.
Also, contrast to the general belief, Firebrand doesn't lack sustain healing, it has: Regen, Tome 2 passive, symbols all ticking at once.
Atleast in my opinion. The only reason you would bring a heal firebrand is for it's stability and aegis, the boon radius is just to low and as you said, it's sustain healing is not onpar withost builds now
If heal untamed gets stability I think it'd be fine. You have plenty of boons through spirits, your ambushes, and the few good pet boons, as well as lots of blasts for Karakosa and you actually provide a lot more DPS than other healers (which is relevant in higher end groups). I'm not sure the numbers now, but pre-Force of Nature nerf with full harrier's gear and Vicious Quarry you did around 12k DPS (without losing much in the way of boons). While definitely worse than druid, it's definitely better than Teapot says (just like boon DPS untamed who could've guessed)
Nah, not gonna lie heal untamed is kinda bad lol. I know that identity is super tied into builds, but a build being not super great isn't an attack or a slight to that identity and it doesn't mean you can't enjoy that build or that you shouldn't play it.
Untamed heal (and qdps) is weak compared to other options, that's just the reality.
@MightyTeapot in what way are the boon untamed builds weak? Just the lack of stability? I can see that for heal untamed, but both variants of quick DPS untamed are very solid in their own rights.
Comparing them to something like chrono, chrono only really has portal and stability over untamed. Untamed has a reflect and multiple bubbles, multiple aegis sources, can upkeep protection without using a utility slot (invigorating bond+maces, which also gives you vigor) on the power variant, can upkeep 25 might and fury (dropping lynx or the 2nd pet on the condi variant for fury specifically), and has immobilization through both the relatively free elite slot (totally free for power quick) and pets (Jacaranda and drakehound). Untamed has better damage output than chrono on both builds, comparing power qunt to power boon chrono, condi quick unt to condi boon chrono, and condi quick unt to power boon chrono (and vice versa, but condi boon chrono is a bit of a meme).
What specifically about untamed is bad? As far as I can tell, you only dislike it because of the loss of Fervent Force and are rating it poorer because of that. I can understand the healing output issues on heal untamed, but even still you have 3 blasts on your weapon skills alone, pet unleash F2 is another blast that (should, haven't checked if it was changed) proc karakosa, and you have pretty frequent poison fields to blast into to proc karakosa for more healing, so it isn't even that lacking in healing skill options. The boon DPS builds are way better than you're giving them credit for pound for pound, and the heal build is better than you seem to think (although I'd definitely rank it near where you did just because "it's not druid")
Loves your videos, it helped me alot❤
I started playing 1 month ago, i got rare drop "Fang of the Lion's Champion" 😍🔥waiting for it to get sold to buy all the living worlds ♥️♥️
I would consider all the S+ heals as S, and herald would drop down into A with mech and hb. In a game with so many reactive moments for supports, a healer whose utility is locked for 10 seconds after reacting to something is a huge drawback and doesn't deserve S tier.
The alac application for heal renegade is just as reliable and good as herold. It gives perma 33% incoming dmg reduction to group. It has no problems keeping up might. It has a strong group cleanse with 3(4) cleanses every 4-5 seconds. A mobile, perma'ish projectile blocking shield. Group 2-3% damage increase and lifesteal as well as other dmg modifiers. Extremely bursty, spammable strong heals. The point is, you're just wrong about healing renegade being B tier. It is most certainly the strongest build in A tier. HAM and HFB stronger than healing renegade?? No chance. I am willing to die on that mountain. You clearly haven't played it
Heal renegade is not even remotely close to those builds lol, the A tier builds have everything you listed but better healing, better boon access and better boon application. It's obviously playable, but it's not good compared to the really broken stuff.
Putting hfb next to tempest is crazy imo
Because too many people don't know how to really utilize the HFB. If a good player plays HFB, it's an absolute S Tier Healer. It's flexible and can counter almost anything. It's just not good in situations like HT CM, ToF CM or Kiting stuff. I'm a HFB main and I can also show you some logs with 25 Might and everything @99-100%. but I've seen soooo many bad HFB players out there. A (really) good HFB player can outclass most other heal builds easily.
@@cxmusicofficial I'd add that HFB requieres a good team, because despite its generous access to support boons like aegis or stability, it lacks in raw healing output, thus making it not able to save careless players. That's where Tempest will be supperior, imo: its ability to make up for your teammate mistakes with a big healing output and even a decent revive ability with the Glyph of Renewal (but still not as good as Druid's glyph, for instance).
@@cxmusicofficial I agree with you, and every single word you said. HFB is S tier and always will be
@@bobiboulon I never had a problem with carrying bad pug teams with my HFB. The reason for the lower healing output is that the HFB is a prevention healer. You can counter many things in advance (pun intended) so you won't even need your healing that much. Of course, carrying has it's limits and you have to time your stuff wisely. Sorry for my bad english btw.
HFB has a base rotation you need to follow (2x Staff 4, 2x Axe 2) while putting everything else in between. If you utilize your tomes correctly, you can aegis 5 times in a row (!) with 1. Advance, 2. Opening the F3 tome, 3. using F3 + 5, 4. Advance again 5. and Shield 4. That means, for example, perma aegis in situations like Deimos CM or Sunqua CM or just preventing the need of healing.
You can also perma stab with SYG & F3 + 5 in tandem. If you combine your HFB with the Relic of the swarm, your healing get's also way easier since the barrier is very good. I almost never use the F2 Tome except for emergency situations (F2 + 5 -> Big Condi Cleanse & Heal Burst after for example, I rarely use F2+2 since I have the regen mantra equipped most of the time). My standard healing is my rotation and the group is almost always full life. The 2x Staff 4 and mantras on CD (but I'm not using the last ammo of my mantras, only if I need to go somewhere else) are already healing the group permanently.
I know that the HFB can feel "weird" if you are used to something like a Druid. Many new or unexperienced players tend to use the healing bow for example, completely wasting a utility slot for a rather slow and bad healing. Staff 3+2 combo (another condi cleanse btw) has the same range and you won't need the healing bows. I ONLY use them for: Escorting Desmina on River and Statue of the Broken King . Otherwise, my standard is 3 mantras (Heal, Quick & Regen mantra) + 1 Utility (SYG or Advance) and Feel my wrath. There are other exceptions like MAMA CM where I prefer to use the Stab Elite (instead of Feel my wrath) + SYG in high dps groups. Or for Samarog CM, I'm always taking the stab elite and SYG to ensure perma stab Since F3 + 5 only gives Aegis and 1 stack of Stab. Thats better for a filler here between SYG and the Stab Elite. Otherwise, I'm almost always on my standard setup, just swapping out Advance or SYG (Depends if we need stab or aegis). Of course, sometimes you need Sanctuary for CC or other stuff or Wall of Reflection and so on. You always have to adapt to the encounter.
I also upkeep 25 might all the time while using my might gens: Opening F1 tome gives you might, F1+5 gives you might, F1+4+2 + Staff 2 Double blasts might, Staff 4 on cd gives you might and mantras on cd are giving might. If you're struggling with it, you can take the trait for generating extra might. I don't need it and prefer the staff boost.
what is more crazy is putting hfb below heal Herald.
Catalyst isn't nearly as bad as he's saying but it certainly does struggle
lol my raid guild healers are usually untamed, hfb, heal temp, or heal scrapper 😂😂😂😂😂 i think we pulled out heal chrono once, heal herald like once or twice, and our untamed swapped to druid like once and then went back to untamed as soon as possible 😂😂😂
I wanna know how a support with one stack of aegis, relatively low healing, and unusable stability can be S tier. I really wanna know. I fucking hate having a heal scourge in my group,
The amount of support you provide just from your barrier is insane, allowing for you to completely negate mechanics.
It also has the benefit that it has the best carry potential via its revive potential.
Yes it doesn't have access to much aegis and stability, but you can easily have your BoonDps provide that.
@@EDGE-Chris To the build only is S tier if a herald can pick up the slack in terms of boons. Which is an odd way of rating a build. From my experience if i have a healscourge I need to prepare to evade every mechanic and interrupt my skills, cause I sure can't rely on the healer to share stab.
@@feniu10 I would still say scourge is a s tier healing, so what if you don't get permanent swiftness and stab from the scourge, most boon classes can cover that.
Secondly, it's mainly used as a pug healer/carry healer where you can singlehandedly cover healing for both groups and keep anyone alive that downed state.
Also, you can always position yourself and use skills effectively to negate the need of stability.
Always better to play safe then caring for the highest damage possible :)
Green number gang REPRESENT
It's funny that Vindi is top notch healer for WvW, but in pve it is just wrong.
Simply no alac or quick.
What about an updated dps tier list?
The innate issue with untamed and its potential access to stab is they gave it cantrips for utility skills which are always selfish
Oh my, is it tier list season again? Let me grab my popcorn and my salt. :P
Heal Chrono and Alac HSCG are just so damn smooth to play, after trying them I cant touch any other
Druid says hellllllloooooo????
@@mateusznawrot8941 playing druid is harder than those two so understandable
So odd to me that no one is bothered by the target requirements to do anything on Chrono. Bugs me that it doesn't do swiftness that well either..
@@Xialohyou can provide all your boons without a target, but quickness/alacrity and protection you cant provide 100% uptime without one. This is almost never an issue cause you can build up a decent boon buffer for those at the start of the fight using continuum split and spamming all your shatters while in it and you overcap those boons so much during the encounter itself that the uptime of them becomes irrelevant to think about. This is more valid criticism to the boondps variant, but on the heal build its honestly a non-issue. For swiftness, relic of febe synergizes extremely well with the heal mantra on hchrono since itll allow you to proc it consistently off cd, make your 1 condi cleanse upon using a heal skill trait in inspiration even stronger cause the relic will remove movement impairing condis prior to it and in addition grant full swiftness uptime from just pressing your heal skill alone. An alternative if youre running staff is; you can also take the staff cd reduction trait over the regen on chaos aura trait and provide swiftness uptime like that; using chaos storm every 10 sec to provide relatively consistent swiftness uptime, its just slightly less reliable cause of the rng element to it and requiring you to stand still in it for maximum value.
Doesn't chrono have the 5man aoe 25% per tick AT RANGE revive utility? xd
It's not really a trait pick that you can fit into the build super well unfortunately.
@@MightyTeapot Gotcha
Well, at least fractals are still owned by Firebrand (except on silent surf CM). Scourge, herald and druid have kind of 0 stab (except herald, but you need to know when you will need stab) and really low aegis. Chrono is kinda bad on pre-buffs, so you will start almost all fights without quick/alac. Also chrono have a delayed might application on really small areas, so it can hurt the start of the fights too. Firebrand needs NO utility from the offensive suports (except for huge breakbar bursts). To me Firebrand is still >.
:3
...you dont need to revive people if they dont die.
Nah, anet spoiled child of a class can go eat dirt.
Chrono can pre-buff (yes even quick/alac) all fights so what you are saying there is simply not true xD It has stability, aegis and far more CC than HFB and it can reflect and boon strip on top of that. Might is not an issue either.
So fractals are pretty much owned by Heal Chrono now but fractalers are still holding on to HFB because of good ol' reliable.
@@glael38 Of course, but dont say me that 3 seconds of quick/alac is a pre-buff. x3
@@LiatDrazilit prestacks 15 sec of quick/alac + 25 might, prot, vigor, fury, 6 stab, aegis and regen. This is disregarding flex utility skills.
@@LiatDrazil As the other commenter said: it's 15secs + the other boons. If you only manage 3 seconds then you do the pre-buffing wrong.
ah someone is channeling his inner Nike here 1:10
What? FB is at least high a tier, if not s...
WRONG. ITS TIME TO WAKE UP YOUVE BEEN IN A COMA FOR 5 YEARS. FB is strictly worse than chrono in every way AND takes the quickness spot, meaning you dont get the god tier qHerald or qScrapper for fractals. PLEASE wake up, everyone misses you.
How much of a weakness for scourge is its stability access? You were talking about untamed's gaping hole of stability and I couldn't help but think of scourge too.
Healbrand is kind of scuffed, but it's A tier. Meanwhile, staff zerker is here and it's actually pretty good. B tier.
What?
Sad to see it confirmed that guardian got the Ele treatment, we've been on the top for far too long it seems.. 😢
Anyone recommend a good sourge build? Was a mech main but getting abit bored with it now.
Just use the Heal Alac Scourge build from Snowcrows.
Herald being legend-locked is rough but the buffs to ventari with the ability to empower the tablet skills helps a lot, and it can handle mechanics more easily than you'd think as long as the herald knows how to adapt its build to handle them, but the skill check is certainly higher than some of the other S tier healers. It is absolutely the ultimate tank, though, so often you can have the other healer handle mechanics while the herald plays the role of main tank on the boss. Plus it has some other unique utility like the ability to keep up a ridiculously high uptime projectile block and its ludicrous amounts of CC it can bring, being able to hard-carry groups that don't know how to break blue bars, and the boon extension from glint can literally make your offensive support a more skilled player by pumping up their boon uptime. It is a super fun and good build that anyone who likes being a giga tank should try. Revive power is the one thing it feels like it lacks, much like chrono, plus the slight inflexibility on utilities from being legend-locked, but it does get to take twice as many utilities as other specs as a result so its pretty interesting.
Anyways, love the build and cannot recommend it enough. The biggest downside is that you have to bring a mediocre boon dps because alac dps builds are worse than quick herald haha.
why would you cut the video off before putting everything on the tier list? vindicator?
While certainly a solid raw output healer, especially sought after in WvW, the start of the video mentions key boons are mandatory for the list. Vindi is just healing, no quick or alac.
heal vindi is a pvp build this is pve. not every elite has the ability to do every role, the ones at the bottom aren't capable enough for defensive support.
While you may have been joking about the balance team and catalyst, it really is just a poorly design spec. I could rant for a long time about the obvious shortcuts taken and lazy/poor choices. As you mentioned, their utilities are basically fake in pve and that’s just the start
I noticed that the core classes aren't really touched anymore... I wonder...
So, Healer Vindi with that omega trash scepter is scrapped? 😅
heal cata is Bladesworn level - I rather see a heal Sworn then Cata
Heal bladesworn is legit good. Especially for any kiting jobs. IDK what Teapot is on to hate it so much, lol.
@@Midaspl its kind of a gimmicky build, though. It's viable, but it's mostly just hard carried by staff which feels awkward when you get locked into gunsaber every time you need to use dragon trigger for alac. Also gotta keep in mind it's competition. It'll work on many encounters, but it wont hard carry like a druid would.
@@jipgg I wouldn't call it gimmicky. It isn't without issues and probably won't be adding side wheels to a bike like HSC does, but it still has less issues than heal specter or even druid (IDK what druid is even doing on S+ tier there...). Heal bladesworn has very nice burst healing, good mobility and can apply boons really quickly and on a long duration, so even being locked out of staff for few seconds is not an issue. What it lacks is big barrier, large cc and lower cd on rez ability. Putting it below heal specter and untamed and on par with catalyst and mirage is just ignorance.
@@Midaspl Looks like you are in the same boat. Saying druid doesnt belong in S+ tier is also ignorance. And i disagree, it IS a gimmicky build. You essentially get forced out of your main healing source just to apply alacrity. This is not mentioning that you cant use a secondary weaponset AND dont have access to the staff burst skill. It'll work on many encounters just fine, but does it compete with its current competition? Not even close. Teapot even explicitly stated that all these builds are viable for most content, some are just significantly better at it. Imo hbladesworn is on par with hharbinger, theyre hard-carried by anything other than the spec itself and the spec even actively cripples its effectiveness.
@@jipgg well... Druid not being S+ is just experience. It's clunky in many ways to the point we resigned from it in our Cerus group in favour of tempest after first LCM kill. Healing and alacrity application suffers if the other healer does his job as well as giving alac in a very small aoe on some spells are main drawbacks for that. It's pretty good healer, but often feels terrible to play, thus I'd rate it more as low S/high A tier.
About bladesworn, it deserves at least B tier. I disagree it being just carried by anything offspec. If anything, in niche scenarios, the spec is what carries it above everything else in other tiers - it is the longest duration alac applied in a single skill. It is by no means HSC, but it works well in most fights.
Give me fights in raids/EoD Cams where you think it won't work and I'll send logs.
I do think heal catalyst is a little slept on. While it is definitely not a good build, it can be sorta ok. It doesn't provide stab at all and it's aegis is part of it's rotation but it does maintain 100% uptime of 25 stacks of might, fury, resolution, vigor, swiftness, prot, quick, and regen. Keep in mind that fury and resolution are two boons that tempest does not provide. It also does enough healing to keep itself and allies alive in an extremely damaging field in the golem room. The real sketchy thing is meme'ing yourself by not being able to generate energy in a real fight. If you take icebow, you can pump some really crazy healing numbers, I'm talking sustained 2000+ healing per second per target. Heal catalyst is by no means good, it's stressful to play, but it's not as bad as people think it is.
@@slikskils1603 oh there are absolutely always better options. Like I said, the build isn't good, but it's not unusable like most people think. I've done all of the ibs strikes with it and most of the EoD strikes. It actually can pump as much healing as tempest, it's just kinda easy to meme yourself with the energy mechanic if you are not careful.
Bro please make a sPVP tier list, it's been toooo long
just finished my light legendary armor a month ago and i have been using the riffle heal chrono build and its been awesome. Have done cm 99 and cm 100 with it and it works great.
Heal quick zerker is strong just sucks thst you must be casting burst skills constantly for quickness. Staff is nuts for burst healing.
Honestly Heal Berserker has insane burst healing
Thank you teapot for making this... Was wondering heal vindicator.. Is not a thing?
Kinda lame that q-herald defines the healer meta
Lol, you're so wrong about heal bladesworn... xD
th-cam.com/users/clipUgkxUTuBQgfpYSQe9UzvACIxRxJxpX6CQp-b?si=bWMzTsADwRJiFsFM is this a good example of druid healing a open world zerg?
oh look , warrior scores bottom of another list... the consistancy!
cant log in ? : log in = "support" advice
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hello
I never understand if these tiers are wvw or pve....
Theyre always PvE unless clarified
rifle staff mirage healer lowkey pops off
"Heal berserker" is the poster child for the "bland sameness" mentality that anet has implemented. everyone must be able to do everything because nobody is allowed to be special anymore. Can't just roll a new alt to fill your team's needs. nono! You MUST be able to do EVERYTHING on whatever class you chose to bring that day, or the late millennial middle management at anet will be sad.
This guy's favorite boon is Aegist.
Guardian F tier
You are just trashtalking without any reasoning or knowledge.
Why would you even play a support in PVE in this game lol?
Because you can solo carry content. It’s nice in world content that isn’t over populated also.
@@Werkzeug-100 cant imagine support build being more Effective than dps build at soloing content lol. I wanna see minstrel druid clearing content faster than zerker xD
@@TheNaughtyPetey They didn't say for soloing, they said for solo carrying. As in, you go into group content, but can't vouch for the skills of the others because you're pugging. As a DPS build, the impact you can make on the run succeeding or failing is far smaller than a defensive support.
Do you play anything other than open world content..? Doesn't sound like it.
You know there are raids, high tier and CM fractals and strikes? Good luck on solo carrying with raw dps.