I‘m so happy, that I found your channel. It’s literally on the same level as other very big gaming TH-camrs, like Scott the woz. But the brilliant thing is, that I have a lot of other videos on your channel to watch. I was literally shocked when I found out your sub- and view count and especially your likes. Keep up this fantastic work. I’m stoked for the future!
@Another Blown Cartridge , thank the TH-cam algorithm. You're also very much like A + Start or Tech Rules. The quality of your videos is just mind-blowing and especially for your start. It can also be seen, that you invest very much of your time into them.
Second video I've seen from thie channel, I got the paper mario video on my recommendation and I'm glad I did, this channel is really good already! Keep up the great videos!
A big thing a lot of the classic fans want is the the return of the large cast of animal buddies from the retro games and K Rool. I think making Tropical Freeze but with more animal buddies, longer and more dynamic levels(possible integrate Mario World's overworld elements?), and the return of one of Nintendo's beloved villains(whose relevance has been reignited through Smash Bros) will be more than enough for a worthy successor to Tropical Freeze.
I couldn't agree more. And not just returning animal buddies, but new additions too! I do love how Retro Studios refined how the Kongs controlled and focused on the core elements of Rocket Barrel/Minecart levels, but a renewed focus on animal friends would be really great.
Personally, I would want the next Donkey Kong game to make up for lost time. Another A to B linear 2D sidescroller could still be amazing, but I think DK is too big to be confined to the second dimension. Give us a 3D Wind Waker style adventure, where the DK Crew travel around a dangerous sea from island to island, battling Kremling Pirates and maybe other factions of enemies. Nintendo could look to Rare's Sea of Thieves for inspiration on how to do an open world DK adventure.
I really love that idea. I think it would be a great way to maybe also use what works well in DK 64 while streamlining it a bit more so it's a less needlessly expansive collecting based 3D platformer. It would also be another fun way to incorporate the existing DK universe, like with lesser-known characters getting to show up and even play roles in the story.
eyy first comment? great video! tropical freeze really did feel like a peak of design for platformers in general, and i feel like itd be hard to top that. given the nintendo philosophy of "if it aint broke, then we need to put a jet engine on it if we ever make it again" i dont think your fears are necessarily too out there. but retro always has a way of wiggling their way into projects they want to make, so i dont think itll be the last we see of good ol' DK from them!
Thanks for your kind words. And yeah, I couldn't agree more. If Retro is still working on it, I'm sure it will be of high quality. I just have no idea where they'll take it.
For the next DKC game, they should have the Kremlings return as the main villains and the bosses are all mechanized animal buddies and after you defeat them, you gain access to a level surrounding their abilities
I love the idea of doing a mad scientist King K. Rool, almost doing a Kirby Planet Robotot on the animal life of DK Island. That would be a lot of fun.
All they need to do is make a new theme for everything like tropical freeze did with maybe some new mechanics and everybody will be happy. I'll be beyond happy with a 3d game as well.
TBH, they really could do more with animal buddies. Like sections with Expresso where you have to fly and catch updrafts and tail winds to stay afloat while dodging enemies, or maybe have more vertical focused platforming with levels requiring Rattly. (Similar to the mine levels in DKC 2, Poison Tower, or Ripsaw's Rampage) Also, Bonus Rooms are a major issue, they're all the same collect the banana minigame and only give you puzzle pieces or balloons. Adding more collectables like special coins and actual varied challenges to bonus rooms for late game rewards would give people an actual incentive to 100% the game.
@@anotherblowncartridge Exactly. I think a better question for future DKC games isn't "Where can we go from here?" but instead "Where could we go from here?" because there's still a decent chunk of level ideas and variety that can be done. I think Mario's a good example of this, New Super Mario was too scared to take risks and advance the gameplay from the first 2, and that led to more and more middling results and reception. But then game dev shakeup happened behind the scenes, and Mario Wonder came out completely upending the past decade of Mario standards and receive critical acclaim. (It also feels more like a sequel to SMB3 or SMW) So instead of trying to recapture TF, whoever develops the next game should try to focus on DK's strong points and what can be expanded upon. (Personally, I feel like it's been a good while since Diddy/Dixie got their own games, so maybe a game in the style of Rayman Origins/Legends or Mario Wonder. New art style, revamped gameplay, maybe using animal buddies to enhance fast or precision platforming, etc...) Or maybe focus more on themes and build mechanics around them instead of make mechanics work with themes. Most of TF's most beloved levels like Scorch n' Torch or Fruity Factory are where the themes decide the mechanics, not the other way around. So you get much more in-depth levels because the devs can go all out without worrying about repeating ideas and gimmicks.
@@crb8124 These are great ideas! And I wholly agree. No point in trying to recapture Returns or TF; there needs to be a refined evolution, or perhaps even a stylistic revolution in the future of the franchise
@@anotherblowncartridge Actually, I've been going through some older platformers as of late (Thanks to Wii and PS3 upgrades), and I actually came across something that could fit a new DKC perfectly: 2.5D platformers. Why? Because DKC TF already kinda dabbled with this with the minecart and barrel levels, and since the levels of pretty interconnected, they can build complex levels and multi-branching paths with much less space needing to be taken up. (Also, this could remedy the secret portal issue. Just split the paths, complete a puzzle or challenge or something, then go back and finish the rest of the level) Plus, there's as far as I can tell, only 3 games in total that have done this: Klonoa 1+2 and Kirby 64. That's it. (Klonoa's great btw, but no one's played it)
Great question. In terms of similarities to that style and pace, theres Yooka Laylee and the Impossible Lair that's really solid. If you're looking for something faster there's always Super Meat Boy. I also really enjoy the original Rocket Knight Adventures, Sonic The Hedgehog 3, and Castlevania 3.
I remember back in the day thinking that DKCR and especially DKCTF were PERFECT games, but now that I am older and more cynical, I think they are flawed, but still very fun games. One thing that I really don't like about these newer games are the bonus rooms! They are so dull and interrupt the pacing of the game constantly when the game is encouraging you to go out of your way to find secrets. When playing DKC2's bonus rooms, each one was different! It was actually a fun surprise; this is just a much more annoying downgrade! It was especially bad with TF because every bonus room is the same temple theme, taking you out of the world each level has set! It's just a total pace-breaker! What doesn't help the bonus rooms is the fact that collectables are a much more prioritized element compared to the previous games. Because of that, the gameplay is slower, and you are more prone to enter one of those dreadful bonus rooms. The level designs have changed to feature several secrets, which can alienate those who just want to speed through the game, knowing that collectables are EVERYWHERE! It reminds me of Yoshi's Island, which is supposed to a much slower paced game compared to DKC. Also, several collectables are locked behind the same thing, becoming very predictable and boring fast! For example: by collecting all bananas in a group, by plucking a random peg, blowing a random flame/flower, finding a secret wall, or ponding some hidden panel or block. It's not a huge deal because the tasks never take very long, but then since they don't take long at all, what's the point in adding them at all? They are just kind of brainless and make the game slower. :/ Along with that, I think the co-op is much worse in the newer games. In the older games, it was this tag team where it felt like you were taking turns to make progress in the game, but now the experience feels more divided and less like you working together. Plus, the more collectable-focused and slower-paced gameplay doesn't do well with co-op in my opinion. I also think Dixie Kong was way too overpowered in this game. She basically outclasses Diddy at everything! Her main ability, her banana ability, her swimming, all of it is much better than Diddy's! Cranky Kong is cool and offers a new way of playing, that actually has several perks The addition of secret exits is cool, but not handled as well as I would like. Many of the exits are near the end of the stage and require you to use one of your Kong's abilities (aside for Diddy, who is useless at these). These levels are fairly long, so replaying them just to access a different level is annoying sometimes, especially if the player can't find the exit. I think finding the secret exit should open the normal and secret path. Besides all that, every level features new ideas, making for some really great surprises! The theming here is just phenomenal and you never really know what to expect! Older games did this too, but not to the same extent as Returns and especially DKCTF. The music is also absolutely sublime, doing a masterful job capturing the prefect atmosphere and feeling for every situation. Even though the physics have changes, I'd argue that they have changed for the better. For the first time DK and friends feel exactly like how you'd imagine them! When you are playing a DK game, you'd want to feel like you are playing as DK. Although I criticized the level design for featuring too many collectables, I can also respect it for always introducing several fresh elements in each level! It's still very stimulating and enjoyable!
Your criticism is really fair, and I complete agree with many of your points. I would respond though, with the collectibles and bonus rooms encouraging re-playability, rather than a faster campaign thats easy to fully complete. Finishing a campaign of levels is one thing, but to fully complete it, the developers wanted to task players with being investigatory. I don't mind this, but I can completely understand where you are coming from. The core appeal of the DKCR and DKCTF is the smooth, fast, bouncy platforming, after all.
I agree with your point about the bonus rooms; easily the worst thing about tropical freeze, and the return games in general. Given that you'll be entering these rooms a shit ton of times, it's a shame retro studios didn't take cues from the way Rare handled these bonus challenges in the original trilogy; i.e theming them around a specific design section from the level while categorizing the challenges into a variety of clearing objectives. For the immense amount of creativity in the levels, it's absolutely baffling that retro didn't use them as templates with remixed designs for the bonus rooms; hopefully a future DKC returns capitalizes on this idea and remedies this persistent flaw across the two DKCR games I also sorta see your point about the way the secret exits were handled but I don't find the end result to be problematic. Of the 10 secret exits, about 5 of them are directly at the end of the level while the others are at located between 66-78% of the level's completion. I think it would be a bit much to just have a level that has at least 30% of its content unplayed to just unlock the other path for the player. The solution Tropical Freeze implements is a sensible one, which is at the very least, to make the secret exits still allow the player to make it to the end of the map without needing to replay the level from which the secret exit originated. It would be a far worse design issue if the player were forced to have to replay the level in order to progress from the world, which TF doesn't do. If your problem is simply the fact that the player needs to replay the level to get 100% completion, I'm not sure I even find that to be a meaningful negative against the game, especially since replayability is etched into the DNA of this series and similar games of this genre as a whole. A part of the value these games present is the thrill of replaying the levels and attaining mastery of each of their challenges; at some point, the player is going to be compelled to replay levels. It's not like these levels drag on for minutes on end. TF, despite how large a handful of the levels get, has some of the most kinetically-paced level design in the franchise. That being said, maybe a viable solution would have been to program the secret exits to unlock both pathways only based on HOW FAR into the level they were: if the exit was located between 0-60% of the stage's duration, those exits would not open the normal path; any further than that would open both paths; though maybe that sounds a bit convoluted. I don't know, I just think it would feel too rewarding to have both paths open just for finding the secret exit, especially if the exit was near the beginning or middle of the stage because you'd probably have to go back and replay it anyway to retrieve the collectables you missed for taking the secret path I most certainly don't agree with your take about returns and TF being "slower-paced country games." I'd agree if the levels themselves were designed in a way to restrict fast-paced play and made basic level/world progression incumbent on collectables, but since it isn't, I don't think the criticism tracks from a level-design perspective. These games are in-fact the 2 games out of the franchise designed with speed-running in mind; and as such, are structured from the ground up with momentously propulsive play at the forefront. Secondly, I don't find the criticism of the collectables slowing down gameplay to be valid here. Now I get that your point is that the increase in collectables throughout these larger stages may weigh on a player's mind, provoking them to tread carefully and explore a bit more. Moreover, because the return games have more secrets littered across the stage per area as well as a plethora of objects in the levels to entice the player to interact with IN CASE there is a secret hiding behind them, you as the player will probably slow down your approach to make sure you don't miss anything. Now while what you're saying is true of how someone might DECIDE to approach their playthrough of the return games, this criticism you're making, I feel, doesn't accurately reflect the manner by which these games, particularly TF, is designed around this. First and foremost, the collectables in the return games are not necessary in order to progress through the main campaign; therefore, a player NEVER needs to slow down their gameplay in order to collect the secrets; 2. All of the "meaningful" gameplay unlockables for TF are tied to the KONG letters which unlock the temple levels/extra world, and beating all of the game's levels unlock hard mode. None of these rewards, which are the game's biggest incentivizing perks, require the player to slow down in order to achieve them. Again, levels are designed for players to zip right through with platforming grace and the reward for doing so are unlockable gameplay extras that expand the overall experience; to say that the return titles are inherently slower games just doesn't track under scrutiny; at least in my view. The only collectable in the return games that require extensive exploration and gameplay interactions are the puzzle pieces, and those only matter in that they count to your 100% completion; the investment to find them is only if you want that 100% completion mark on your file (and the concept art of course) but that's it. See, I would agree with you about the whole "slower gameplay" thing if collectables like the puzzle pieces were actually necessary to unlock anything that require progression or if your end level performance was affected it, but it's not. See, something like that would mean that you as the player HAS to slow down to find as much as you can during a level, otherwise you can't move on during a particular point in the game. An example of this design concept would be Kirby and the forgotten Land, where the player isn't able to access the boss room unless they collect a certain amount of waddle dees hidden in the world's levels. As I alluded to earlier, the return games, especially TF, are designed in a way to make both playstyle approaches viable as opposed to just outright making one playstyle necessary. The speed-runner esque levels are structured in a way to incentivize swift play, while the larger levels and the hidden puzzle pieces and secret exits incentivize patient exploration and inquisitive interactivity with the world's mechanics; none of these approaches are discouraged and the player is always incentivized appropriately for whichever approach they choose. I get the impression you may feel as if playing slowly is necessary to have an optimized playthrough, but it's actually not, as illustrated by points regarding unlockables, level design hierarchy, and replayability design considerations. On a side note, I get your criticism about some of the puzzle pieces having redundant ways to discover them, and I somewhat I agree with this. That being said, I would also argue that a great deal of the puzzle pieces in TF push the player to investigate their surroundings, and even some of the pieces that require banana collecting will mix things up by engaging the player to navigate a platform challenge or to avoid hazards while doing so, which makes them more interesting than just the ones that require collecting bananas floating in-place that disappear after a short amount of time. There are also situations where puzzle pieces are hidden off the beaten path, priming the player to be extra particular about interacting with everything in the level, but these moments in design are far less common in comparison to TF's normal gameplay flow when collectables are involved Regarding Dixie, I think a lot of people oversell just how much she "breaks" the game. I would agree with this observation if Dixie actually trivialized most of the challenges in the game, but seeing as she doesn't, I find the claims of her gaming-breaking presence to not be fully evidenced, and honestly a bit overblown. Yes, she makes landing on difficult platforms safer; yes she can be a get-out-jail free card if you mess up the timing of one of your jumps but she can't save you from other perilous hazards that are littered within levels if you don't have your reflexes refined. This idea that she breaks the game never resonated with me because a player can't undermine all challenges simply by having her equipped. There's a difference between a feature giving a player an easier time, and one that actually removes the skill commitment (Funky is pretty much that). And honestly, while Dixie has the most versatility in levels, I'd argue that Cranky Kong is the best partner at high-level play, as a skilled player can take him to gameplay heights that Dixie and Diddy will never be capable of reaching
Finally, to your point about the way Co-op is designed, I don't know if I agree that it's worse. The original trilogy version of co-op was more so a glorified "pass me the controller" type of deal. You guys aren't really playing together in real-time; y'all are just simply passing control back and forth to each other with the tag system while the other person watches, hence why it comes off more so as two friends helping one another get through challenges. While I understand why you prefer this co-op design for the DK games, as it focuses both players participating in the campaign with achieving the same goal, "unifying" your causes so to speak, the second player is just waiting for their turn really; cooperative play isn't fully being realized here. The return games however, take on a more modern approach to co-op by allowing both players to actually engage with the game's levels simultaneously, which in turn, gives each player the freedom to interact with the mechanics as they choose. The return games also make certain design choices to allow co-op to function, even in high-speed, perilous moments unlike its contemporaries like New Super Mario bros. For one, enemy hurtbox's linger long enough after death that two players could bounce of an enemy in sequence without an issue. This design choice is intentional, as the game wants co-op players to master how to play together at a high-level so as to clear challenges that look like they wouldn't be possible with 2 people. Secondly, unlike the New Super Mario Bros games with co-op, players are unable to collide into each other or impede one another's jumps, reducing the amount of unnecessary error. Having 2 players play cooperatively is also conducive for making boss fights more manageable, and this is especially a clear instance where gameplay goals aren't divisive, but rather inclusive of the second player's presence, allowing for this design of co-op to shine in a way that it couldn't in the Country trilogy. And lastly, a player having the ability to assist in offense or platforming when perched on top of DK, gives the player a way of passively interacting in cooperative play while also ensuring their general gameplay doesn't run the risk of interfering with progression if their skill isn't up there. The best thing about this design choice to co-op in the return games are the options a second player has to be either active or passive during their gameplay experience. You frame this approach to co-op as being divisive of each player's efforts, and while I genuinely understand where you're coming from as I hope I made clear with my earlier overview of your position, real co-op is suppose to be about friends being able to engage with a game's campaign simultaneously. When two people play co-op in a shooting game for example, they're not just sitting around waiting to be tagged in; both players can engage with the game and experience it in tandem with their friends. I get that for platformer games designed like the country series, this approach to co-op can AT TIMES put the action of the players at odds with each other, but I don't think the preferred solution is a glorified pass-me-the controller system like the original trilogy; that style worked for how those games were designed. Developers should be trying to figure out the best way to make simultaneous cooperative play work in fast-paced, 2d platformers, and I'd argue that how the return games handle it, providing the player both active and passive ways to be a part of the action in real-time with their friend, is a step in the right direction. In the end, all of this is to say that there is no perfect game; but regardless, it's important to understand how we evaluate a game's design choices and scrutinize whether or not they're shortcomings or elements that are born from strong, sensible design choices that are mechanically cohesive. Granted, not every choice, whether or not it made sense to do it, means it's good, but practicing efficient differential diagnosis of game design can help with deducing these elusive questions
I honestly struggled to like this game at first. It was just…different from the DKC I liked. No Animal Buddies besides Rambi, no tag team, etc. It took me a minute, but I now see how absolutely genius this game is in terms of level design and flow, music, and graphics. It is easily one of the best platformers I’ve ever played alongside DKC2. I’m excited to see what Retro is cooking next for DKC and I would like to see some elements from the classics return.
@@alienxotic5028 I agree, especially as Metroid Prime 4 wraps up, I get the feeling we're in for something special for the next DK outing. I hope, anyway.
Amazing video, but honestly I dont think that 2d Donkey kong will be left in the dust, frist of all, if Nintendo EPD(aka the masterminds behind odyssey,galaxy and 3d world) are working in a 3D Donkey kong games we can expect amazing things, second of all, with 2 studios developing donkey kong,one for 2d(retro) and one for 3d(nintendo) we will get more games more frequently with more gameplay variety, because we got 2 amazing dk games back to back and we didnt got anything on the switch(aside from funky mode), so if Nintendo is pushing foward the ideia of new donkey kong games(probably because of shigero miamoto) I can only expect great things, also Mario Wonder reveal proves that with enought time the team can build another great 2d games Also david wise said in a interview that he is working on a project for the last few years, so we can also expect some great dk ost coming soon
I finished Mario Wonder and loved it but my goodness DKTC is so much better. I think they can do alot more to a new DKC game but forsure people’s reaction is going to be “Another 2D DK game? Thats boring” which I kind of agree. If Kirby was able to go 3D and succeed, i think DK can do it even better
I don't buy the "we don't have a new idea for it yet" excuse. If it makes money, Nintendo will do it. That's how we got 4 NSMB games that were identical to each other, because they'd sell really well. They only use that excuse for franchises that don't perform well. Miyamoto said the same about F-Zero, and surprise surprise, F-Zero is a franchise that hardly sells. Tropical Freeze port sold 5 million or so on the Switch, so I can definitely see a new game eventually. But I'm concerned why it's taking so long. Apparently Retro studios always has a lot of the talent that work on these games leaving the studio, that's probably why.
@@anotherblowncartridge yea, but I hate it. I really, really, really hate this game. To the core. It's annoying. It steals my time. I will never ever touch it again.
@@anotherblowncartridge I love the aesthetics of Returns. It looks more vibrant and is a bit more zoomed in, the levels therefore feel more dense. I prefer how it’s all on the same island, it really feels like you’re constantly moving forward and climbing to the top. In the sequel, the barrels might as well blast you back to DK island instead of the other islands we visit. It was just such a perfect game, and playing Tropical Freeze after is like playing TOTK after BOTW, it doesn’t hit the same. Returns is the game I keep coming back to, could be nostalgia but tropical freeze never hit the same even though I 100% completed both I prefer the first one. Thanks for the interactivity! You earned a sub :)
@@OlleWtn Very well said. While I might not agree, I do appreciate your points. I do agree that Returns has some elements that feel better than Tropical Freeze. For me personally, I think the overall collection of aesthetics and mechanics feels better in Tropical Freeze, and I prefer the level design, too. That being said, Returns is an absolute masterpiece in its own right so there's nothing wrong about ranking it higher. Appreciate the comment and sub. I'll do a Returns video soon, in your honour.
DKCTF is a great game, very focused on the substance of gameplay. What irritated my about DKCTF is some naive presentation/marketing decisions. Many great and original ideas are too far in the game to impress casual players and reviewers. Some of the best levels are even hidden (e.g. the level with brambles in the savannah world). For example, some Mangrove levels are just too derivative: why not starting with the Windmill world directly and postpone the classic Jungle world later? Why not unlocking/saving Cranky later in the game (just to add some "story")? Why not adding another animal to ride just to add nostalgia? Those things add little to the gamplay but a lot to presentation
@@banjobro64 I agree completely. Especially on the last point on adding at least one more animal buddy. And I agree too about maybe saving Cranky Kong to be rescued after World 1 (or just some point later to add to the story) Though, the DKC games are extremely lax when it comes to narrative.
@@anotherblowncartridge Yes, true. I understand that because I am not a fan of videogames B-movie-like stories. But some more context can make the difference and make everything feel fresher even withouth a story. I appreaciate that some DKCTF levels have an own "lore" (e.g. the factory producing fruit-lollies, the penguin being eaten, etc.) but its barely noticeable.
The content on this channel is incredible. Without a doubt one of the most underrated channels on the platform
Thank you so much for the kind words. You've got some great content, yourself!
I‘m so happy, that I found your channel.
It’s literally on the same level as other very big gaming TH-camrs, like Scott the woz.
But the brilliant thing is, that I have a lot of other videos on your channel to watch.
I was literally shocked when I found out your sub- and view count and especially your likes.
Keep up this fantastic work. I’m stoked for the future!
Wow, thanks! You're far too kind comparing me with creators like Scott. And I'm glad you're interested, I'm just getting started.
@Another Blown Cartridge , thank the TH-cam algorithm. You're also very much like A + Start or Tech Rules. The quality of your videos is just mind-blowing and especially for your start. It can also be seen, that you invest very much of your time into them.
Second video I've seen from thie channel, I got the paper mario video on my recommendation and I'm glad I did, this channel is really good already! Keep up the great videos!
Thank you so much! You are too kind. I will continue to try my best!
Funky Kong should lead the reformed DK crew, especially his time in rehab.
Right, yes.
A big thing a lot of the classic fans want is the the return of the large cast of animal buddies from the retro games and K Rool. I think making Tropical Freeze but with more animal buddies, longer and more dynamic levels(possible integrate Mario World's overworld elements?), and the return of one of Nintendo's beloved villains(whose relevance has been reignited through Smash Bros) will be more than enough for a worthy successor to Tropical Freeze.
I couldn't agree more. And not just returning animal buddies, but new additions too! I do love how Retro Studios refined how the Kongs controlled and focused on the core elements of Rocket Barrel/Minecart levels, but a renewed focus on animal friends would be really great.
Personally, I would want the next Donkey Kong game to make up for lost time. Another A to B linear 2D sidescroller could still be amazing, but I think DK is too big to be confined to the second dimension.
Give us a 3D Wind Waker style adventure, where the DK Crew travel around a dangerous sea from island to island, battling Kremling Pirates and maybe other factions of enemies.
Nintendo could look to Rare's Sea of Thieves for inspiration on how to do an open world DK adventure.
I really love that idea. I think it would be a great way to maybe also use what works well in DK 64 while streamlining it a bit more so it's a less needlessly expansive collecting based 3D platformer. It would also be another fun way to incorporate the existing DK universe, like with lesser-known characters getting to show up and even play roles in the story.
eyy first comment? great video! tropical freeze really did feel like a peak of design for platformers in general, and i feel like itd be hard to top that. given the nintendo philosophy of "if it aint broke, then we need to put a jet engine on it if we ever make it again" i dont think your fears are necessarily too out there. but retro always has a way of wiggling their way into projects they want to make, so i dont think itll be the last we see of good ol' DK from them!
oh and mario 3 > mario world any day, u right
Thanks for your kind words. And yeah, I couldn't agree more. If Retro is still working on it, I'm sure it will be of high quality. I just have no idea where they'll take it.
For the next DKC game, they should have the Kremlings return as the main villains and the bosses are all mechanized animal buddies and after you defeat them, you gain access to a level surrounding their abilities
I love the idea of doing a mad scientist King K. Rool, almost doing a Kirby Planet Robotot on the animal life of DK Island. That would be a lot of fun.
No
2:24 Well Wonder is finally the 2d Mario game on the level of World
In fact I love both Wonder and Tropical Freeze, but I honestly slightly Wonder
Wonder does edge things out for me, too
All they need to do is make a new theme for everything like tropical freeze did with maybe some new mechanics and everybody will be happy. I'll be beyond happy with a 3d game as well.
TBH, they really could do more with animal buddies.
Like sections with Expresso where you have to fly and catch updrafts and tail winds to stay afloat while dodging enemies, or maybe have more vertical focused platforming with levels requiring Rattly. (Similar to the mine levels in DKC 2, Poison Tower, or Ripsaw's Rampage)
Also, Bonus Rooms are a major issue, they're all the same collect the banana minigame and only give you puzzle pieces or balloons. Adding more collectables like special coins and actual varied challenges to bonus rooms for late game rewards would give people an actual incentive to 100% the game.
@@crb8124 Well said. I especially agree with the point about more animal buddies. Even more opportunities for level variety.
@@anotherblowncartridge Exactly.
I think a better question for future DKC games isn't "Where can we go from here?" but instead "Where could we go from here?" because there's still a decent chunk of level ideas and variety that can be done.
I think Mario's a good example of this, New Super Mario was too scared to take risks and advance the gameplay from the first 2, and that led to more and more middling results and reception. But then game dev shakeup happened behind the scenes, and Mario Wonder came out completely upending the past decade of Mario standards and receive critical acclaim. (It also feels more like a sequel to SMB3 or SMW)
So instead of trying to recapture TF, whoever develops the next game should try to focus on DK's strong points and what can be expanded upon. (Personally, I feel like it's been a good while since Diddy/Dixie got their own games, so maybe a game in the style of Rayman Origins/Legends or Mario Wonder. New art style, revamped gameplay, maybe using animal buddies to enhance fast or precision platforming, etc...)
Or maybe focus more on themes and build mechanics around them instead of make mechanics work with themes. Most of TF's most beloved levels like Scorch n' Torch or Fruity Factory are where the themes decide the mechanics, not the other way around. So you get much more in-depth levels because the devs can go all out without worrying about repeating ideas and gimmicks.
@@crb8124 These are great ideas! And I wholly agree. No point in trying to recapture Returns or TF; there needs to be a refined evolution, or perhaps even a stylistic revolution in the future of the franchise
@@anotherblowncartridge Actually, I've been going through some older platformers as of late (Thanks to Wii and PS3 upgrades), and I actually came across something that could fit a new DKC perfectly: 2.5D platformers.
Why? Because DKC TF already kinda dabbled with this with the minecart and barrel levels, and since the levels of pretty interconnected, they can build complex levels and multi-branching paths with much less space needing to be taken up. (Also, this could remedy the secret portal issue. Just split the paths, complete a puzzle or challenge or something, then go back and finish the rest of the level)
Plus, there's as far as I can tell, only 3 games in total that have done this: Klonoa 1+2 and Kirby 64. That's it. (Klonoa's great btw, but no one's played it)
@crb8124 Klonoa definitely deserves more love! Great comment! Thank you!
Nice video! Would you happen to know of more 2D platformers as good as Tropical Freeze or Super Mario World?
Great question. In terms of similarities to that style and pace, theres Yooka Laylee and the Impossible Lair that's really solid. If you're looking for something faster there's always Super Meat Boy. I also really enjoy the original Rocket Knight Adventures, Sonic The Hedgehog 3, and Castlevania 3.
I remember back in the day thinking that DKCR and especially DKCTF were PERFECT games, but now that I am older and more cynical, I think they are flawed, but still very fun games.
One thing that I really don't like about these newer games are the bonus rooms! They are so dull and interrupt the pacing of the game constantly when the game is encouraging you to go out of your way to find secrets. When playing DKC2's bonus rooms, each one was different! It was actually a fun surprise; this is just a much more annoying downgrade! It was especially bad with TF because every bonus room is the same temple theme, taking you out of the world each level has set! It's just a total pace-breaker!
What doesn't help the bonus rooms is the fact that collectables are a much more prioritized element compared to the previous games. Because of that, the gameplay is slower, and you are more prone to enter one of those dreadful bonus rooms. The level designs have changed to feature several secrets, which can alienate those who just want to speed through the game, knowing that collectables are EVERYWHERE! It reminds me of Yoshi's Island, which is supposed to a much slower paced game compared to DKC. Also, several collectables are locked behind the same thing, becoming very predictable and boring fast! For example: by collecting all bananas in a group, by plucking a random peg, blowing a random flame/flower, finding a secret wall, or ponding some hidden panel or block. It's not a huge deal because the tasks never take very long, but then since they don't take long at all, what's the point in adding them at all? They are just kind of brainless and make the game slower. :/
Along with that, I think the co-op is much worse in the newer games. In the older games, it was this tag team where it felt like you were taking turns to make progress in the game, but now the experience feels more divided and less like you working together. Plus, the more collectable-focused and slower-paced gameplay doesn't do well with co-op in my opinion.
I also think Dixie Kong was way too overpowered in this game. She basically outclasses Diddy at everything! Her main ability, her banana ability, her swimming, all of it is much better than Diddy's! Cranky Kong is cool and offers a new way of playing, that actually has several perks
The addition of secret exits is cool, but not handled as well as I would like. Many of the exits are near the end of the stage and require you to use one of your Kong's abilities (aside for Diddy, who is useless at these). These levels are fairly long, so replaying them just to access a different level is annoying sometimes, especially if the player can't find the exit. I think finding the secret exit should open the normal and secret path.
Besides all that, every level features new ideas, making for some really great surprises! The theming here is just phenomenal and you never really know what to expect! Older games did this too, but not to the same extent as Returns and especially DKCTF. The music is also absolutely sublime, doing a masterful job capturing the prefect atmosphere and feeling for every situation. Even though the physics have changes, I'd argue that they have changed for the better. For the first time DK and friends feel exactly like how you'd imagine them! When you are playing a DK game, you'd want to feel like you are playing as DK. Although I criticized the level design for featuring too many collectables, I can also respect it for always introducing several fresh elements in each level! It's still very stimulating and enjoyable!
Your criticism is really fair, and I complete agree with many of your points. I would respond though, with the collectibles and bonus rooms encouraging re-playability, rather than a faster campaign thats easy to fully complete. Finishing a campaign of levels is one thing, but to fully complete it, the developers wanted to task players with being investigatory. I don't mind this, but I can completely understand where you are coming from. The core appeal of the DKCR and DKCTF is the smooth, fast, bouncy platforming, after all.
I agree with your point about the bonus rooms; easily the worst thing about tropical freeze, and the return games in general. Given that you'll be entering these rooms a shit ton of times, it's a shame retro studios didn't take cues from the way Rare handled these bonus challenges in the original trilogy; i.e theming them around a specific design section from the level while categorizing the challenges into a variety of clearing objectives. For the immense amount of creativity in the levels, it's absolutely baffling that retro didn't use them as templates with remixed designs for the bonus rooms; hopefully a future DKC returns capitalizes on this idea and remedies this persistent flaw across the two DKCR games
I also sorta see your point about the way the secret exits were handled but I don't find the end result to be problematic. Of the 10 secret exits, about 5 of them are directly at the end of the level while the others are at located between 66-78% of the level's completion. I think it would be a bit much to just have a level that has at least 30% of its content unplayed to just unlock the other path for the player. The solution Tropical Freeze implements is a sensible one, which is at the very least, to make the secret exits still allow the player to make it to the end of the map without needing to replay the level from which the secret exit originated. It would be a far worse design issue if the player were forced to have to replay the level in order to progress from the world, which TF doesn't do. If your problem is simply the fact that the player needs to replay the level to get 100% completion, I'm not sure I even find that to be a meaningful negative against the game, especially since replayability is etched into the DNA of this series and similar games of this genre as a whole. A part of the value these games present is the thrill of replaying the levels and attaining mastery of each of their challenges; at some point, the player is going to be compelled to replay levels. It's not like these levels drag on for minutes on end. TF, despite how large a handful of the levels get, has some of the most kinetically-paced level design in the franchise. That being said, maybe a viable solution would have been to program the secret exits to unlock both pathways only based on HOW FAR into the level they were: if the exit was located between 0-60% of the stage's duration, those exits would not open the normal path; any further than that would open both paths; though maybe that sounds a bit convoluted. I don't know, I just think it would feel too rewarding to have both paths open just for finding the secret exit, especially if the exit was near the beginning or middle of the stage because you'd probably have to go back and replay it anyway to retrieve the collectables you missed for taking the secret path
I most certainly don't agree with your take about returns and TF being "slower-paced country games." I'd agree if the levels themselves were designed in a way to restrict fast-paced play and made basic level/world progression incumbent on collectables, but since it isn't, I don't think the criticism tracks from a level-design perspective. These games are in-fact the 2 games out of the franchise designed with speed-running in mind; and as such, are structured from the ground up with momentously propulsive play at the forefront. Secondly, I don't find the criticism of the collectables slowing down gameplay to be valid here. Now I get that your point is that the increase in collectables throughout these larger stages may weigh on a player's mind, provoking them to tread carefully and explore a bit more. Moreover, because the return games have more secrets littered across the stage per area as well as a plethora of objects in the levels to entice the player to interact with IN CASE there is a secret hiding behind them, you as the player will probably slow down your approach to make sure you don't miss anything. Now while what you're saying is true of how someone might DECIDE to approach their playthrough of the return games, this criticism you're making, I feel, doesn't accurately reflect the manner by which these games, particularly TF, is designed around this.
First and foremost, the collectables in the return games are not necessary in order to progress through the main campaign; therefore, a player NEVER needs to slow down their gameplay in order to collect the secrets; 2. All of the "meaningful" gameplay unlockables for TF are tied to the KONG letters which unlock the temple levels/extra world, and beating all of the game's levels unlock hard mode. None of these rewards, which are the game's biggest incentivizing perks, require the player to slow down in order to achieve them. Again, levels are designed for players to zip right through with platforming grace and the reward for doing so are unlockable gameplay extras that expand the overall experience; to say that the return titles are inherently slower games just doesn't track under scrutiny; at least in my view. The only collectable in the return games that require extensive exploration and gameplay interactions are the puzzle pieces, and those only matter in that they count to your 100% completion; the investment to find them is only if you want that 100% completion mark on your file (and the concept art of course) but that's it. See, I would agree with you about the whole "slower gameplay" thing if collectables like the puzzle pieces were actually necessary to unlock anything that require progression or if your end level performance was affected it, but it's not. See, something like that would mean that you as the player HAS to slow down to find as much as you can during a level, otherwise you can't move on during a particular point in the game. An example of this design concept would be Kirby and the forgotten Land, where the player isn't able to access the boss room unless they collect a certain amount of waddle dees hidden in the world's levels.
As I alluded to earlier, the return games, especially TF, are designed in a way to make both playstyle approaches viable as opposed to just outright making one playstyle necessary. The speed-runner esque levels are structured in a way to incentivize swift play, while the larger levels and the hidden puzzle pieces and secret exits incentivize patient exploration and inquisitive interactivity with the world's mechanics; none of these approaches are discouraged and the player is always incentivized appropriately for whichever approach they choose. I get the impression you may feel as if playing slowly is necessary to have an optimized playthrough, but it's actually not, as illustrated by points regarding unlockables, level design hierarchy, and replayability design considerations. On a side note, I get your criticism about some of the puzzle pieces having redundant ways to discover them, and I somewhat I agree with this. That being said, I would also argue that a great deal of the puzzle pieces in TF push the player to investigate their surroundings, and even some of the pieces that require banana collecting will mix things up by engaging the player to navigate a platform challenge or to avoid hazards while doing so, which makes them more interesting than just the ones that require collecting bananas floating in-place that disappear after a short amount of time. There are also situations where puzzle pieces are hidden off the beaten path, priming the player to be extra particular about interacting with everything in the level, but these moments in design are far less common in comparison to TF's normal gameplay flow when collectables are involved
Regarding Dixie, I think a lot of people oversell just how much she "breaks" the game. I would agree with this observation if Dixie actually trivialized most of the challenges in the game, but seeing as she doesn't, I find the claims of her gaming-breaking presence to not be fully evidenced, and honestly a bit overblown. Yes, she makes landing on difficult platforms safer; yes she can be a get-out-jail free card if you mess up the timing of one of your jumps but she can't save you from other perilous hazards that are littered within levels if you don't have your reflexes refined. This idea that she breaks the game never resonated with me because a player can't undermine all challenges simply by having her equipped. There's a difference between a feature giving a player an easier time, and one that actually removes the skill commitment (Funky is pretty much that). And honestly, while Dixie has the most versatility in levels, I'd argue that Cranky Kong is the best partner at high-level play, as a skilled player can take him to gameplay heights that Dixie and Diddy will never be capable of reaching
Finally, to your point about the way Co-op is designed, I don't know if I agree that it's worse. The original trilogy version of co-op was more so a glorified "pass me the controller" type of deal. You guys aren't really playing together in real-time; y'all are just simply passing control back and forth to each other with the tag system while the other person watches, hence why it comes off more so as two friends helping one another get through challenges. While I understand why you prefer this co-op design for the DK games, as it focuses both players participating in the campaign with achieving the same goal, "unifying" your causes so to speak, the second player is just waiting for their turn really; cooperative play isn't fully being realized here. The return games however, take on a more modern approach to co-op by allowing both players to actually engage with the game's levels simultaneously, which in turn, gives each player the freedom to interact with the mechanics as they choose. The return games also make certain design choices to allow co-op to function, even in high-speed, perilous moments unlike its contemporaries like New Super Mario bros. For one, enemy hurtbox's linger long enough after death that two players could bounce of an enemy in sequence without an issue. This design choice is intentional, as the game wants co-op players to master how to play together at a high-level so as to clear challenges that look like they wouldn't be possible with 2 people.
Secondly, unlike the New Super Mario Bros games with co-op, players are unable to collide into each other or impede one another's jumps, reducing the amount of unnecessary error. Having 2 players play cooperatively is also conducive for making boss fights more manageable, and this is especially a clear instance where gameplay goals aren't divisive, but rather inclusive of the second player's presence, allowing for this design of co-op to shine in a way that it couldn't in the Country trilogy. And lastly, a player having the ability to assist in offense or platforming when perched on top of DK, gives the player a way of passively interacting in cooperative play while also ensuring their general gameplay doesn't run the risk of interfering with progression if their skill isn't up there. The best thing about this design choice to co-op in the return games are the options a second player has to be either active or passive during their gameplay experience.
You frame this approach to co-op as being divisive of each player's efforts, and while I genuinely understand where you're coming from as I hope I made clear with my earlier overview of your position, real co-op is suppose to be about friends being able to engage with a game's campaign simultaneously. When two people play co-op in a shooting game for example, they're not just sitting around waiting to be tagged in; both players can engage with the game and experience it in tandem with their friends. I get that for platformer games designed like the country series, this approach to co-op can AT TIMES put the action of the players at odds with each other, but I don't think the preferred solution is a glorified pass-me-the controller system like the original trilogy; that style worked for how those games were designed. Developers should be trying to figure out the best way to make simultaneous cooperative play work in fast-paced, 2d platformers, and I'd argue that how the return games handle it, providing the player both active and passive ways to be a part of the action in real-time with their friend, is a step in the right direction.
In the end, all of this is to say that there is no perfect game; but regardless, it's important to understand how we evaluate a game's design choices and scrutinize whether or not they're shortcomings or elements that are born from strong, sensible design choices that are mechanically cohesive. Granted, not every choice, whether or not it made sense to do it, means it's good, but practicing efficient differential diagnosis of game design can help with deducing these elusive questions
Okay okay, I'll buy it.
I'm one of the people who bought it twice (still not sure where my Wii U copy went, so I grabbed the Switch version when it went on sale)
I bought this game thanks to your review, im so excited to try it tomorrow :)
It's the best 2D platformer Nintendo has ever made (in my opinion)
I honestly struggled to like this game at first. It was just…different from the DKC I liked. No Animal Buddies besides Rambi, no tag team, etc. It took me a minute, but I now see how absolutely genius this game is in terms of level design and flow, music, and graphics. It is easily one of the best platformers I’ve ever played alongside DKC2. I’m excited to see what Retro is cooking next for DKC and I would like to see some elements from the classics return.
@@alienxotic5028 I agree, especially as Metroid Prime 4 wraps up, I get the feeling we're in for something special for the next DK outing. I hope, anyway.
they can improve the bonus levels , and adds more animal buddies
Yeah, agreed. Especially on the animal buddies. We need some new ones, and classics to return.
Amazing video, but honestly I dont think that 2d Donkey kong will be left in the dust, frist of all, if Nintendo EPD(aka the masterminds behind odyssey,galaxy and 3d world) are working in a 3D Donkey kong games we can expect amazing things, second of all, with 2 studios developing donkey kong,one for 2d(retro) and one for 3d(nintendo) we will get more games more frequently with more gameplay variety, because we got 2 amazing dk games back to back and we didnt got anything on the switch(aside from funky mode), so if Nintendo is pushing foward the ideia of new donkey kong games(probably because of shigero miamoto) I can only expect great things, also Mario Wonder reveal proves that with enought time the team can build another great 2d games
Also david wise said in a interview that he is working on a project for the last few years, so we can also expect some great dk ost coming soon
David Wise working on something is huge! And thank you for the compliment! Let's hope you're right!
i want anything DK related but if it's another 2d platformer and not 3D a very small part of me would be dissapointed
I think we're due for a 3D DK platformer.
Never had such a hard time with a 2D sidescroller made for kids 😅
Every DKC is a challenge!
you should play the og trilogy lol
I finished Mario Wonder and loved it but my goodness DKTC is so much better. I think they can do alot more to a new DKC game but forsure people’s reaction is going to be “Another 2D DK game? Thats boring” which I kind of agree. If Kirby was able to go 3D and succeed, i think DK can do it even better
@@extzombie1658 I agree. I'm just wondering if we are ever going to see that "New 3D Donkey Kong" game rumour ever come to fruition
@@anotherblowncartridge i hope so too!
I don't buy the "we don't have a new idea for it yet" excuse. If it makes money, Nintendo will do it. That's how we got 4 NSMB games that were identical to each other, because they'd sell really well. They only use that excuse for franchises that don't perform well. Miyamoto said the same about F-Zero, and surprise surprise, F-Zero is a franchise that hardly sells. Tropical Freeze port sold 5 million or so on the Switch, so I can definitely see a new game eventually. But I'm concerned why it's taking so long. Apparently Retro studios always has a lot of the talent that work on these games leaving the studio, that's probably why.
It's freaking hard
It's a very difficult game
@@anotherblowncartridge yea, but I hate it. I really, really, really hate this game. To the core. It's annoying. It steals my time. I will never ever touch it again.
@@jogymogy3691 oh dang, that's too bad.
Return was better imo
Interesting. What makes you say that?
@@anotherblowncartridge I love the aesthetics of Returns. It looks more vibrant and is a bit more zoomed in, the levels therefore feel more dense.
I prefer how it’s all on the same island, it really feels like you’re constantly moving forward and climbing to the top.
In the sequel, the barrels might as well blast you back to DK island instead of the other islands we visit.
It was just such a perfect game, and playing Tropical Freeze after is like playing TOTK after BOTW, it doesn’t hit the same.
Returns is the game I keep coming back to, could be nostalgia but tropical freeze never hit the same even though I 100% completed both I prefer the first one.
Thanks for the interactivity!
You earned a sub :)
@@OlleWtn Very well said. While I might not agree, I do appreciate your points. I do agree that Returns has some elements that feel better than Tropical Freeze.
For me personally, I think the overall collection of aesthetics and mechanics feels better in Tropical Freeze, and I prefer the level design, too.
That being said, Returns is an absolute masterpiece in its own right so there's nothing wrong about ranking it higher.
Appreciate the comment and sub. I'll do a Returns video soon, in your honour.
DKCTF is a great game, very focused on the substance of gameplay. What irritated my about DKCTF is some naive presentation/marketing decisions. Many great and original ideas are too far in the game to impress casual players and reviewers. Some of the best levels are even hidden (e.g. the level with brambles in the savannah world). For example, some Mangrove levels are just too derivative: why not starting with the Windmill world directly and postpone the classic Jungle world later? Why not unlocking/saving Cranky later in the game (just to add some "story")? Why not adding another animal to ride just to add nostalgia? Those things add little to the gamplay but a lot to presentation
@@banjobro64 I agree completely. Especially on the last point on adding at least one more animal buddy. And I agree too about maybe saving Cranky Kong to be rescued after World 1 (or just some point later to add to the story) Though, the DKC games are extremely lax when it comes to narrative.
@@anotherblowncartridge Yes, true. I understand that because I am not a fan of videogames B-movie-like stories. But some more context can make the difference and make everything feel fresher even withouth a story. I appreaciate that some DKCTF levels have an own "lore" (e.g. the factory producing fruit-lollies, the penguin being eaten, etc.) but its barely noticeable.
@banjobro64 I agree. The lore between worlds and levels is very well done in the DKC games, especially the Retro Studios titles.
Too high a standard