How to get Zwift or TrainerRoad super cheap (And still measure power!)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 เม.ย. 2019
- Less than $150 for a Zwift setup with pretty accurate power? It can be done. ⬇️
1) Buy the Kurt Inride 3 sensor: amzn.to/3dg57Y2
2) Check your hardware: You want a trainer that supports "ZPower" zwift.com/hardware
3) Classic trainers with Zwift: zwiftinsider.com/getting-star...
👇Some accessories I like:👇
▶️BUY THIS FAN. Seriously. This fan: amzn.to/2waInYD
▶️HR Monitor (For better calorie counts + HR classes): amzn.to/2IVJkGH
▶️HR Monitor strap (Longer battery life if you don't mind the strap): amzn.to/33sDhmu
▶️Fav foam roller: amzn.to/2TZq2GR
▶️Fav in-ride energy drink: amzn.to/3a5pi8L
▶️Fav recovery drink: amzn.to/396AC2Z
▶️Fav on-bike headphones: amzn.to/2IVJP3x
JustinDoesTriathlon is dedicated to helping first timers, beginners, and intermediate triathletes meet their athletic goals on the swim, bike, and run! Follow along my training vlog as I train and race. Stick around for gear tips, gear reviews, and more! If you're a beginner triathlete looking to improve your swimming, biking, or running, then it's my mission to help you out! Triathlon can be super intimidating, but it's a great sport if you can get through that initial intimidation and get out there. Triathlon gear reviews, training tips, and my own racing vlogs are here to help keep you motivated and up to date in the sport. Thanks for following!
#cheapzwiftsetup - กีฬา
After 7-8 years of regularly using my old magnetic trainer in the wintertime, I finally bit the bullet and bought a Kinetic T-2200. Used of course, for no less than 50€. It has the inride sensor and oh my god, I can’t believe how true the myths are - it really feels simply more “roadlike” like the magnetic Elite and following the Watts, even if they’re virtual is so interesting and satisfying. I can’t believe I held out for so long, the Kinetic really took these indoor sessions to a new level. I’ve done about 5 but I can’t wait to hop on the bike again for some more.
Great video! Answered a lot of questions I had. Thanks a lot.
Amazing scenic set up 👌
So cool! After your video I went shopping. I use to be into mountain biking but had a 360 spinal fusion after two spinal fractures. I was looking for a way to get back on a bike. I tried Mt biking even light trails and my spine and hips couldn't handle the bumps. They had to readjust my hips 45 degrees and pin them in my rods and hardware. Im only 39 yrs old.. Anyways I purchased a yardsale find road bike hybrid (dynametric), wahoo speed and cadence sensors (generic but compatible)and a wahoo ticker heart monitor(generic but compatible) . I just found a blackburn fluid trainer with a front wheel base for $50 that was practically new still. Now I'm ready for zwift. Altogether I spent
$75. On the bike
$75 on bike parts
$13. On a bike tablet holder
$40. On wahoo speed and cadence
$30 on wahoo ticker heart monitor
$50. On Blackburn fluid trainer
I'm ready to ride
That's awesome, hope you enjoy it. That's wild, that's a lot of injury. I've only done a little mtb (very little) and yeah, it's rough even without injury. Welcome back. :)
I have the Kurt Kinetic road and it is like real road riding. It has kept me in shape.
Thank you! I was considering getting a fancy Zwift trainer…I may wait and use what I have!
Thanks, lots of good advice.
thanks, got everything I needed for $40. Looking for a remote control fan now
thank you, very helpful
Thank you 😊
Being in Wisconsin around 3 months is not fun riding. Even with a fat bike, trails get flipped to cross country skiers. The rail trails get used by snowmobile. Thanks for this.
Thanks
There's a setting in zwift that averages your watts over the last three seconds, which is the default setting. You can change that setting to instant, which should help with responsiveness.
No, that's just the display in the top left. Actual data stays the same.
I should’ve gone this route. I bought a Zwift hub and I can’t figure out how to get the thing to work properly. It also came with this metal ring and the instructions don’t tell you what it’s for
off topic but, what kind of Felt bike is that? I'm looking to buy my first tri bike and would like to stick with Felt
Wow this was four year ago!! I have an Alpcour Fluid Trainer, and had a dismal opinion on how Zwift addresses power curves from a dumb trainer. While you roller have a hole on the right, the trainer I have put that hold on the left side of their roller. I just ordered the sensor/magnet, which will arrive in the wee hours of the morning.
I really hope this works, since I think it would help. I'm new to cycling so I'm seeing that I could have purchased a peddle based meter, but as you state if you aren't riding it all the time you maybe wasted money. I tore a Quad last October, so for not close of good enough..
Glad I found this....Thanks
Which sensor/magnet did you purchase and was it worth it? I have the same Alpcour trainer.
@ideeazz1 it would have been great if it had fit. Unfortunately, it is a Kenetic Inride Power sensor (Super cheap price)
Sadly, it's made to fit Kenetic wheel on Trainer.
With the alpcour I was using my bike computer with a cadence. speed and heart rate sensor. I never got a power reading, however.
So I purchased the InRide and a Kenetic whee-lon trainer, then installed the InRide.
With that done, I now get cadence,h rate, and power source, and now the dumb trainer is seen as being smarter. So I added zwift play controllers last.
if I had known better, I could have spent the 499 on zwifts smart trainer. But it is sooo hard to get an answer from other zwift users. And I won't talk about the non responses from Zwift.
@@gregchamberlain7554 thanks for taking the time to respond. I appreciate it
I own the Conquer Bike Trainer and hit that dreaded 400W limit. The InRide you mentioned, would that work on mine? I’m so confused with the magnet attachment and where to get an alternative.
Great video Justin! Clever ideas. I also couldn't justify the wheel off smart trainer. I went in the middle and got the Wahoo Kickr Snap at $499,00, Still expensive but less than half of the big boy.
I looked long and hard at that one! Ultimately the noise (if I choose to use it indoors) was a factor for me too. But absolutely, that's a great option. I know Instagram and everyone on TH-cam loves showing off their Neo 2s and Kickrs and everything, but ooof, just so much money. If I really fall deep into indoor training I'll consider it down the road, but I'm content for now. We can certainly get stronger that's for sure. Race this weekend, then recovery, then intend to dive into a TrainerRoad plan
I don’t have a Kinetic but my mag trainer appears to have a place for a magnet on the roller. Do you have a link for that sensor you attached?
@@faithforgedfathers Crap, sorry, thought I had that in the description. Fixed. That said, that specific sensor will only work with the Kurts. Which trainer do you have?
Check the link here. You're looking to see if yours supports "ZPower," not "Estimated Power."
zwift.com/hardware
JustinDoesTriathlon Sportneer. I don’t see it on the list unfortunately!
Thanks for a really good video and channel!! I bought a used kinetic kurt, only because of this video! BUT i´m trying to connect the sensor (the black one) to my phone using "Kinetic Fit". The app only tells me that i need to upgrade the inride... ? I gonna try connecting to zwift via my MAC and see if i have better luck there. Do you know why im experience this problem with the app? Is the sensor too old maybee or what? Best regards, Magnus
Does the battery in the InRide2 need to be replaced?
I actually found one of these trainers on the Marketplace for 30 dollars. As soon as I saw it I sold my crappy stationary bike and set up my back up road bike as a smart trainer that feels 1000 times better. I just had to buy the new sensor for 50 dollars but still it's way better than my stationary bike with no power readings at all. Not to mention it was so uncomfortable.
That's fantastic! $30 for a Kurt is a STEAL! Enjoy it! 🙌👌
It also can be done by Virtual Power Meter
Nice video, not sure to have understood but will this setup let you participate in group rides and races even without power meter since you already have the kinetic sensor
it will give you a power meter reading
I am thinking to buy exercise bike to use with zwift, I am totally new to zwift, but I also have a foldable bike, not sure what is the best. I guess any good performance should be fine, to use as motivation to cycle more. thanks
Really helpful video, thanks. I have the Kurt Kinetic Smart 1 Road (same as yours, by the looks of it). I have two questions, if you have time to respond. Q1: I have added the pro flywheel, so my flywheel is heavier. Do you know if the speed test/calibration test will adjust for this, or do I need to somehow enter this information somewhere? Q2: I have read in various places that I need to calibrate my KK unit using the Kinetic Fit app, but from your video it seems this is not necessary to connect to Zwift. Is that correct? Again, thanks for the very clear video. My days of triathlon are long gone (I started in the 1980s), but I still like to keep my fitness up.
Hi David! Well if I'm still on my bike in 30 years, I'll call that a win, so you're doing something right! 1) So big asterisk: I don't know, and I couldn't find anything online with the searching I did. There's not a place to enter that info that I know of. The flywheel speed *shouldn't* (asterisk again, not postive) affect the results when you're holding steady power, so your steady state power should still track. Now, the trainer will require higher force to spin up and will take longer to spin down, so those are the moments I would expect the data to drive. The good news is.... 2) Question two, the whole point of the calibration is to time the spin down, so even with the larger flywheel, you might still be able to account for that. You're right that Zwift doesn't have a built in calibration, which is annoying. Calibration isn't required, but yes, it's ideal. Interestingly the calibration data is actually stored in the Inride itself, not the app you calibrate in, so you can do a 10ish min warmup, connect to the Fit app, do the calibration, then move over to Zwift. It's a bit of a hassle, yes, but you don't really *need* to calibrate every time, especially if your variables stay the same. If you're in a temp controlled room, keep the wheel at the same tightness (I always did two full turns), and the tire at the same PSI, things shouldn't drift too much. And even if they do drift a little bit, the nice thing about the Kurts is that they're very consistent if you keep your variables the same, so they're not likely to drift much between workouts. They're seriously great little trainers. Hope that helps, sorry I wasn't more confident.
@@JustinDoesTriathlon That must be the most comprehensive answer I've ever got on TH-cam - thank you! Your answer concurs with what I was thinking, but was very unsure about. As you say, the key thing if I'm not going to recalibrate every time is to ensure the roller is at the same tension, and that the tyres are inflated the same. Even if it does vry a bit, I can live with that - my training has been "dumb" for the past 10 years, watching rugby, track & field, and of course cycling, on TV, so Zwift will be a big step up for me.
I was wondering how calibrating with Kinetic Fit would carry over to Zwift, but if it's stored in the Inride wee boxie thingy, that would make sense. Amazing how much computer power we now have in small units these days. Thanks again!
how much is that green trainer that you were talking about.?
what are the wireless adapters called you don't tell us any details about it
Thanks for the quick info.
Do you think a kinetic set up in the way you described would be more or less accurate than say the wahoo kickr snap?
Very very closely, yes. DCRainmaker has done tests of the InRide sensor and it tracks very tightly. It's absolutely close enough for structured interval training, if that's what you're looking for. I now have both Assioma pedals and a Kickr, but accurace was not the reason I moved on.
@@JustinDoesTriathlon awesome, nice to hear. I'm about to get started (brand new to riding) thanks for your information
Please put a video on how to set the trainer knob.
Contact with the tire and two full turns. 👍
What is an outdoor ❤
Thanks for the info I'm pretty sure I bought the exact same one as you. I bought it used for 80 dollars but I looked in that little hole and I didn't see the magnet. How much is it and why do I need I don't really understand why I need it?
The older ones don't have the magnet hole. If you use a bluetooth speed sensor, both TrainerRoad and Zwift can still pull quite accurate data out of it. It's a ZPower certified trainer and TrainerRoad has directly said they have a very accurate power curve out of it.
@@JustinDoesTriathlon thanks.Do u know the name of the little magnet as i may buy it cause mine has the hole but no magnet..
Oh! Great! Yeah if you have the hole you want to get the "Kurt Kinetic Inride 3" sensor. It comes with the magnet
@@JustinDoesTriathlon thank you sir!
Bought this trainer before seeing this video ... luckily mine does have the magnet hole. Overall this setup will cost me around $100 without the fan.
Excellent!
Just getting around to seeing this after picking up a Nashbar Fluid trainer earlier today. Will the Inride 3 still work even though mine doesn’t have a magnet?
No it will not. You may need speed sensors for that.
Where’d you get the adapter?
Anyone know if you can get one of those flywheel sensors for a Cycleops Fluid 2? Zwift says it supports "zpower" but I can't find a sensor for it. I guess zpower for the Cycleops Fluid 2 is just based upon the speed sensor?
In that case you'll need some sort of Bluetooth or ant speed sensor for the wheel. That'll track your wheel speed, and Zwift will calculate Zpower from those numbers. In my experience it isn't as responsive as the flywheel sensor (fewer rotations resulting in fewer data points) but it gets the job done with a 2-4s delay. Not perfect, but this is more about getting going rather than 2% accuracy with perfect response rates. If you get into Traineroad and start doing lots of fast over under intervals, could get a little frustrating
I have an identical Kurt Kinetic Road Machine with the bluetooth and Magnet..what I would value is what Laptop will give the sort of display you have and do you need to calibrate it with software as the Kinetic stuff has vanished off Playstore
I have this set up and it is very accurate to what I do out on the road.
What would happen if I put bmx pegs on the wheels and built a wooden stand to lift the back wheel off the ground? Could i just increase resistance by switching gears, or do I actually need a trainer for the resistance part?
You need a trainer, yeah, otherwise the wheel would just spin super fast.
I have a KK Road Machine Smart 2 (Green) w/ the Pro (heavy) flywheel. I’ve noticed that it is very slow during sprint accelerations, however it seems right on with hill and TT simulations. Would it be better to go back to the stock flywheel for my Sufferfest training?
It could be. I haven't used the heavy flywheel so I can't answer directly, but yes, with a heavier flywheel that's exactly what to expect: harder to spin up but a smoother steady state. If you were using power pedals, the pedals would capture your increased force, but either way you're running the risk of slippage if you're throwing down fast, high-effort surges. I haven't used the heavy, but my stock was still a great road feel. I wouldn't say that the stock is 'better,' but if it's getting in the way of your workouts, then I'd personally swap, yeah
I’m doing a lot on Sufferfest, and all the NM and AC workouts are hard to time up for max power. It’s fine when I’m on RGT for group rides and other training.
I’ll try it with the original flywheel soon.
I just bought the same trainer on Craiglist for $170. but I still have to get the 12x142 Axle and a new bluetooth sensor.
Have fun!
JustinDoesTriathlon thanks, btw is the Bluetooth sensor important? Because I’ve already have Garmin speed sensor and cadence sensor.
@@citicleaners Depends on your use. If you're using it in TrainerRoad, the VirtualPower from the speed / cad sensor is very accurate because the Kurt has a predictable power curve. If you're using Zwift and the BT speed sensor, you'll have a 400W cap because Zwift is only estimating the power. 400W is plenty for most people for steady state, but you'll be affected on sprints. If you got the InRide sensor, Zwift removes the 400w cap because it considers it a power meter. I'd probably say start with the speed sensor for now and if you find yourself frustrated by the limit, then consider grabbing the other sensor.
JustinDoesTriathlon thank you so much for all the details.
No prob!
Easy to use like it cause it portable
How tight do you tighten the knob on the trainer from the moment of contact with the wheel?
Two full rotations, but also important is keeping that consistent between rides.
@@JustinDoesTriathlon i was wondering why i wasnt getting as high as other people in terms of Watts and RPM. i was getting around 110 watts and RPM 40-60 while going pretty hard. I realized i tightened the knob waaay too much. Thanks a bunch!
@@jayelevate4127 No prob! It definitely makes a difference. Pump your tire up to about 100psi as well. :)
2:10 - unless it’s a fixed gear then you do
Hi Justin, you mentioned this can be done for only $120 with a compatible Kinetic trainer. If the Kinetic sensor is $50, what's the additional $70 for that I missed?
Prices have gone up across the board since I made this with everyone wanting trainers. The additional $70 used to be the trainer itself. Could get basic Kurts for 80-100 on CL all the time, and with sensors for 110-130. I think that's harder now
where can I buy that trainer please.
what happened if you don't have that provision to put a magnet, how do you do it then?
Speed sensor with Zpower. In Zwift you're limited to (I belive) 400W when using Zpower, which may impact you at times, but the Kurt has a very predictable power curve, so the numbers belowe that should still be accurate. If you're on TrainerRoad, you don't have the 400W imposed liit when using VirtualPower.
How is the rpm sensor of the trainer also acting as a cadence sensor?
Also it looks like you could buy a small round magnet from hobby lobby drill a shallow hole the depth of the magnet. Then place the magnet and see if the sensor reads it if it doesn’t flip the magnet and check again. When it works glue it in.
They're actually doing some really interesting data analysis. Essentially, it's looking for power impulses through the the minor variations in drum speed and using that to derive cadence. Because the trainer roller is so small it turns many more times than the bike wheel does each turn. So they can look for tiny variances in the roller speed and use that to identify cadence. DC Rainmaker did some testing with it. It isn't perfect, but it's pretty darn good. That said, a dedicated sensor is quite cheap too (~$20) and could be added in simply too.
@@JustinDoesTriathlon awesome thanks for sharing. This video helped me a lot tonight I setup my trainer for Zwift thanks to you.
What’s a phone book
Fritz Cohen hahahahahahah
Phonebook? Is this 1980?
If my road bike has a cadence sensor do i still need the added attachment in your video?
Most cadaver sensors are supported by Zwift. I use speed , cadence, and heart from wahoo. They are ok and I use a magnet trainer . It isn’t ideal but it works. I’m switching to a fluid or the wahoo snap.
Is there a substitute for the Kurt Inride 3? I cannot find that available ANYWHERE!!
Standard BT speed sensor is going to be your alternative. The con is that I don't think they report acceleration as quickly (fewer rotations vs the little magnet) but it's a solid alternative. They both use the same power curve and you should be fine!
They are available again on the website, I bought one a month ago and have been happy with it.
I'm not sure I understand how the sensor on the roller senses anything different than a speedo sensor would. roller rpm is dependent on wheel rpm; no?
Great question! A wheel speed sensor is also quite accurate, but the roller sensor ads a lot more resolution. A 700c wheel has a circumferience of about 91"; a 2" roller has a circumf. of about 6. So, 15 roller revolutions per wheel revolution. That gives a lot faster of data, as well as allows them to (roughly) calculate cadence based on subtle speed changes. The sensor isn't required, but it's an improvement. Both options are good though
Hi Justin, thx for the video, my English is not perfect and I'm not sure I've understood everything properly. Does the Magneto trainer takes account of the resistance if you're on a hill or not ? Or onbly speed and power (watts)? Thank you
Factor in a new rear tire every year if you use any type of resistance trainer. They are murder on tires due to friction. Though more expensive, this is not a problem with direct drive smart trainers.
There are tires made for use on trainers. Others have suggested saving old worn tires for dedicated use on trainers. These are anecdotal answers, as I haven't ridden enough on my trainer to wear out anything.
Hey, just fyi link 3) is broken (leads to a 'not found' page) and the product from link 1) isn't being sold anymore. Do you have access to updated links for those?
Thanks David! I've got the support link updated, and it looks like the InRide is sold out everywhere. :(
It looks like InRide3 is available again: www.kurtkinetic.com/trainers-products/road-machine-control
But how much noise does it make?
Can I hear the tv without having to crank up the volume too much?
Direct drive smart trainers are quieter no doubt. The Kurt Kinetic is one of the most quiet traditional trainers, but it isn't silent. It's not nearly as bad as the old school mag trainers though; those are brutal. I would say... Not super loud, but not good enough for someone to sleep in the next room either.
How can you increase power on this trainer when you can’t change resistance on it ?
By shifting gears just like you do on the road. Basically the fluid pushes back harder against you the more power you put in. It's a very realistic feel that does a good job of replicating the actual road and the way it feels to apply or reduce power. It's different than magnetic trainers that always put out the exact same amount of resistance all the time.
Can you use a power pedal and a dumb trainer with zwift?
Yup, great option
What’s the trainer your using called again?
That's a Kurt Kinetic Road Machine.
@@JustinDoesTriathlon how can I reach you? I need your help
Can’t find Inride 3 sensor anywhere :( All sold out
Oh yeah, crap. Well, if you're using Zwift or TR, the a standard bluetooth sensor is still going to be pretty decently accurate, since the fluid trainers have predictable power curves. It's not technically as good as a power meter, but for saving $500, it's a very solid solution. Keep your tire pumped to the same amount, always use the same number of rotations on the tire knob (I did two full turns), and things are decently consistent, and consistency matters more than absolute accuracy. I used a Kurt for a very long time. Functionally, I do prefer the Core overall, but a DD smart trainer doesn't mean you get fitter than a good fluid trainer
Why do you need a fan?
You'll overheat to the point of performance impact very quickly unless you're in a super cool environment without one
0:18 well bro that was a bee next to you.
🐝
cant wait until elon musk's son gets into cycling and he start making cheap smart trainers lol
what is a phone book?
A stack of 5 iPhones!
Wear a helmet all the time 🙂🙂 Good video.. toms up
this whole concept is way too difficult. i have to pass and keep riding outside.
For a dumb trainer setup, a trainer with a manual resistance cable is better. A fluid trainer gets harder with faster wheel rotation and higher gearing. When climbing hills, you want the resistance to get harder even though the wheel speed is the same or less. So a fluid trainer will be good only for flat courses. Anything with long climbs will be not realistic. You can only mimic climbing by increasing resistance by the trainer getting harder to rotate the drum independent of the gearing. Many people are accused of cheating on Zwift, but what is happening really for many is they are using dumb trainers without a resistance cable, or not using the resistance cable to make the effort more difficult independent of gearing.
Hi, if you could help me I'd be very grateful. I am new to this but have reached the same conclusion as you, which is that a 'dumb' fluid trainer would be useless for hill simulation. I have just bought a Saris Mag+ with adjustable resistance cable. What should I add to it to get most use - a speed sensor? Is there any further way of estimating actual power? thanks
Technically correct, but there are still ways around it while maintaining accurate power. On the Kurt, for instance, you just shift 'opposite' of what you would do in the real world. That is, if you want to simulate climbing, you just shift into higher gears. Now, to maintain the same power, you are spinning at much lower cadence. It's very possible to get real-world climbing cadences with high-force on a Kurt. That's actually more accurate than a mag with cable, because when you adjust the cable, you lose the accurate power estimation (unless you have an actual power meter, of course, but that's separate from a sub-$150 setup.)
@@JG-yh2bj " a 'dumb' fluid trainer would be useless for hill simulation" Not at all, you just have to shift the other way (to higher gears.) You can get tons of resistance out of a fluid trainer that way, you're just doing it by going into the big ring and 11/12/13/14/15 in the back. With a trainer with a cable, you can't change the resistance on the fly and keep accurate power estimation. Your training program tells you what setting to use, and then uses the speed sensor to estimate power. By changing the resistance through the cable, that equation is no longer valid at all. That actually puts you back at the same place: if you stay in the same res setting, you have to reverse-shift to replicate hills. And at that point, a fluid trainer is still better, because fluid trainers have extremely predictable power:speed curves, moreso than mag trainers. TL;DR: Fluid trainers are still better, but if you're using a mag trainer and want to adjust the resistance using a cable, power estimation is no longer accurate unless you have a PM.
@@JustinDoesTriathlon That makes sense - thanks for explaining - and I defer to your expertise here. But sorry, I forgot to mention a critical thing about my set up - I have a cheap bike with no gears! So on a single-speeder, I am reliant on a magnetic adjuster. My bad!
@@JG-yh2bj Gotcha, no problem! That makes sense. In that case yeah, I totally get your point... A fluid isn't going to work in the way you're looking for... A mag trainer with adjustment won't be power accurate in your app, but it'll replicate the feel better. Uhhh.... closest thing I can think of without spending more money would be to use HR as a guide more than power, but yeah, I get your point; if you're looking for accurate-ish estimation within Zwift, it won't work well. :(