Ep. 19 - Awakening from the Meaning Crisis - Augustine and Aquinas
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 23 พ.ค. 2019
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Podcast Links:
•Anchor: anchor.fm/john-vervaeke
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•Pocket Casts: pca.st/EYU4
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Books in the Video:
• Saint Augustine - Confessions
• Michael Casey - Sacred Reading: The Ancient Art of Lectio Divina
• Tom Cheetham - World Turned Inside Out: Henry Corbin and Islamic Mysticism
• Tom Cheetham - Imaginal Love: The Meanings of Imagination in Henry Corbin and James Hillman
• Marc Lewis - Memoirs of an Addicted Brain: A Neuroscientist Examines his Former Life on Drugs
Series Playlist: th-cam.com/users/playlist?list...
Facebook: / vervaeke.john
Twitter: / vervaeke_john
Nineteenth episode of Dr. John Vervaeke's Awakening from the Meaning Crisis.
As always, the books in each video are in the description! Enjoy. We have another Q & A on May 31st at 4 PM EST, so feel free to leave your questions in the comments below or send them on Twitter. See you next week.
Great ! 🌞
Q: I gotta say, I'm right with you on poetry. What a wonderful birthday party! But how do you square this with your condemnation of RomComs? Isn't a romantic comedy just like poetry? That is, in a romantic comedy, we witness meaning and expression in accord? Why so hostile John? Let me put it in the words of Wallace Stevens: "Let Be be finale of Seem!"
Thanks for doing this series John, it couldn't have come at a better time. Do you guys have plans to release the audio on Google Play in the US? It`s currently not listed.
Again, thanks for all you and your colleagues are doing
Could you comment on any of the following? Frances Yates, the art of memory, liberal arts, magic and the occult, and Giordano Bruno. Thanks!
Q: Hello John, first of all thank you for putting so much effort into sharing your ideas, it really makes a difference. Do you have any suggestions for finding work which effectively engages in alleviating the meaning crisis ? Are there institutions or organizations that offer useful help to people who want to develop wisdom and essential psycho-technologies within a community that is scientifically minded but not reductionistic ? I am especially concerned about young adults who without some encouragement and guidance quickly fall into nihilism, chronic procrastination and apathy. I often see attempts to form communities or organizations either swinging towards new-agey naiveté or reductionistic corporate commodification.
Greetings from Germany, Michael
This seems to be your life's work and you're offering it to us just as if it were any other course or lecture. You're a genius, John, tysm.
Thanks Professor. This course should be taught in high schools all over the world!
This would go over 99% of high schoolers heads
1. Coherence
2. Significance
3. Purpose
This one made me hopeful for the first time in....a very long time 🌟
I can't believe this is free. Thank you!
I find this one of the most profound lectures in the series yet. This one elucidates the source of our contemporary crisis in meaning quite well! It foreshadows a lot of problematic issues that will arise out of this crisis.
I grew up in a turbulent home and retreated into books and history to try and discovery the meaning to all. In my stumbling and perseverance I've arrived to episode 19 and in this episode you rectify the division of truths inside me. You proved what my intuition told me was real but had no words to describe and followed it adhering to a strict obedience to truth whilst maintaining an uncomfortable juggling of "what ifs" and "maybes".
Thank you for dedicating your life to pursuing this professor John Vervaeke, you have provided my soul with closure and are preparing me for the transformation to come. Sincerely thank you.
If you don't mind me asking, how has your journey been so far? And are you a Catholic or Orthodox?
How amazing is it that we can get this content for free?
I have a Philosophy degree, and this is such a radically better presentation of Augustine that it's as if I never learned anything in the first place. Bravo, John! #OntologicalRemediation
"L♡VE moves the will to assert things that cannot be known through reason"
Love this👍
This man , his voice, teaching and passion have kept me alive during the pandemic. In deepest terror and despair, not of virus (but of extermination) listening has helped le to understand that we are facing nothing more than a perennial threat... Viva Verveake !!
Viva
Thank you John^ to you and your team for gifting us with this series^ after every episode I feel overwhelming gratitude to you^ because there is always a marked upwardly difference between me before an episode and me after one^
This has helped me understand that love without God, is a very dangerous thing indeed.
Love of the glimpse of utopia is what drives totalitarianism.
Use a non-spiritual definition of God if you like, it is just the one universal or unity of being.
When I was a teenager, I (almost compulsively) copied the text of the Bible over and over again. I feel that this is a psychotechnology somewhere between reading out loud and reading for information. Maybe closer to the first. Only later did I learn that it was practiced in monasteries in the Middle Ages (maybe more for practical reasons, though). I do wonder what the effect of copying sacred text is.
"there is a love that is within reason, that can help you grow beyond reason, to what reason always sought" 12:57
Yeah, I also added this line to my notes. So beautiful!
And what reason always sought is the beatific vision! The intimate consummation of the soul with God, the feasting on Truth, Goodness, Beauty itself, drinking at the fount of life.
I'm turning you into an adjective. Vervaekian. I will define this adjective when I'm done with this series.
Oh my goodness ... I'm a Roman Catholic and have always found the Thomistic focus of Catholic discourse to be lacking. Now I finally know why.
Uploaded 45 seconds ago. My new record for this series. Hello friends!
Book List:
5:30 Saint Augustine - Confessions
8:58 Marc Lewis - Memoirs of an Addicted Brain: A Neuroscientist Examines his Former Life on Drugs
32:02 Tom Cheetham - Imaginal Love: The Meanings of Imagination in Henry Corbin and James Hillman
32:06 Tom Cheetham - World Turned Inside Out: Henry Corbin and Islamic Mysticism
35:50 Michael Casey - Sacred Reading: The Ancient Art of Lectio Divina
Other Links:
Manichaeism - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manichaeism
Great lecture as always!
Thanks for doing this. This is helpful.
I am here because of Paul VanderKlay...he brings you to our attention ALL THE TIME. and I see why, you bring out points that tie a lot of information together. I do love this video. Thanks.
I have a similar story, I found Jonathan pageau randomly(or the providence showed him to me because the algorithm is kinda brutal to him, as I never ever got another recommendation) then I listened to a talk with Paul Vanderclay and Jonathan, I immediately got interested in Paul's way of thinking and then It was just a matter of time for me to end up here
Besides the great content of these lectures is the fact that there are no advertisements!
Thank you so much for this. It's phenomenal.
Your explanation of the separation was much appreciated! The separated thought for change vs thought for coherence!
Well Johnny V, it’s been over two years since I listened the first time and going back over it again, I’m getting a lot more out of it. I think you accomplished something special with these videos and I thank you.
"There is a love, that is within reason, that can help you grow beyond reason, - what reason always sought."
love this series so much i'm watching it all again...
🙏
Revisiting this for the 4th time. ❤️. Right now is like a sacred text to my understanding 🤣. Sensei Jhon seems to be trying to get a system like the one that Agustín gave in his moment. 🤔. Now that Jhonatan Pageau and John himself are reviewing JB Peterson thesis, and Jhonatan and John seems to be closer in their world view, there is a hope to string science, esotericism (the christian at least) and practicalities of normal walking live.
Este capítulo es oro (this chapter is gold 🥇). It really opened my mind.
Thank you do so very much for your lessons. I look forward to listening to you every Saturday from Nairobi. I am learning every week. Namaste!
Tuko wengi. 🤗🤗🤗
Forgive me for all the AA comments John but that is the only thing I've experienced in my life that I can use to relate to your videos through. I am attesting that what you speak of is 'real and true' as I have experienced these things first hand. Regarding the different ways of reading.... It's common in AA when working with someone new to the program to sit down with them and the book AA and read it aloud and stop and discuss sometimes a paragraph or sentence at time how we identify with the text in our lives. And wonder how this guy could have written a book about me back in the 1930's. We say only an alcoholic can help another alcoholic and after watching you I now understand why that's true - we relate to each other not just on a propositional level but on a perspectival and participatory level in a way non-alcoholics just cannot relate.
Superb stuff John. Many thanks.
During this lecture, I realized why your lectures and Peterson's content complement each other.
Your lectures describe the structure of the psyche and how one can achieve wisdom (nomological order) and his lectures and books describe how to behave in the world in order to live a good life (normative order)
That part about singing... So true.
I'm getting so excited about the first half of this lecture, commenting midway. What beauty and personal resonance! ...and, having read Nietzsche for a decade, the diagnosis of the "death of God" seems become so much more deep. I assume the later episodes will address this... But whew. It's like I started this course with a strong sense of the premises making sense intellectually and to some extent in my own life, but now it seems I'm going through the "gnosis" of realizing on a new level how terrifying the Meaning Crisis is.
This series has restored the facination and meaning in humanities I sought for in the university for 8 years - without finding it.
Amending the crisis, profound work. And well put together.
John, I am inspired and encouraged by these very relevant topics you are teaching in this series. My desire to see the world more healthily and positive way has been enriched. I have lost (life meaning) through our modern culture and society but you have spoken words to open my mind and heart to transformation 37:03 37:06
Thank you John for making the internet wise again! The most epic episode so far B)
This lecture is an incredible lesson at so many levels. It bridges so many areas and is transformative. I am being changed by your work. Love and reason become one!
Extraordinary lecture.
It's really interesting to hear that coherence and things fitting together creates meaning. I've had 3 experiences with Ayahuasca and within each ceremony I felt like a tapestry of my life was being woven from disparate threads that I originally thought were disconnected. That experience of cohesion felt deeply healing.
Thank you John
If I watch something twice and get even more out of it I really should be allowed to give a second like!
This is amazing
Hey John, you've got me coming back to rewatch parts of AFTMC. This episode in particular now that I'm reading St. Augustine's 'Confessions' and his biography by Robin Lane Fox. Thank you again for your brilliant work. God bless.
In response to what you are coining the "normative order", evil to good and vice versa, the term 'diabolic' implies 'scattering' and in contrast there is a union with God where He 'gathers' into oneness. Beautiful crossing over of language here.
Thank You!
If only I had the time to read all of those books mentioned...
Now this episode is particularly juicy in my opinion 👌🏼 so good
I’m speechless
Wow! The cliffhanger in the end is too good😆
“The good man, though a slave, is free; the wicked, though he reigns, is a slave, and not the slave of a single man, but - what is worse - the slave of as many masters as he has vices.”
-- St. Augustine
thats kind of a nice elaboration upon "the last shall be the first and the first shall be the last"
I just had a wee Jungian synchronicitious moment which struck me deep - I would like to share it. Apologies in advance for tarring this lecture with the grimy brush of superstition!
The messages and learning in this particular episode are relevant to my personal struggle, and this is my third time watching it.
Just moments after creating a reddit post encouraging others, who wrestle with the same affliction as I, to watch this, I read a comment by "Darth Pro" (below in TH-cam) posted one year ago;
"there is a love that is within reason, that can help you grow beyond reason, to what reason always sought" 12:57
Literally the first instant my eyes grazed the initial syllables of that comment, and in perfect unison, you uttered the same words John. The video had been playing the background as I posted on reddit.
Perhaps I've had one too many glasses of wine tonight, but it was an emotional, revelatory experience nonetheless. Thanks so much, I am getting a lot out of your work!
John did mention a book from a modern author that explains how there is nothing more rational than love in an earlier episode, didn't he?
Saw you on a Jordan Peterson podcast and then found this series. Thank you this is amazing.
John, This series is amazing!
A huge amount of insights, wisdom and so inspiring.
Feels like this ep is the KAIROS of the series, can't wait to see what is coming ahead of us!
I'm sending a lot of love and appreciation, thank you so much for this profound work.
man, this was an important lecture! It really popped off
I appreciate YOUR time JV ❤️🍄 magnificent work you’ve done and continue to do!
This lecture series are god damn epic!
Often when I read fiction what happens is that I'm deeply drawn into it, deeply gripped by it, like I'm really participating with my whole body - and that feels very meaningful and enriching.
The shift from outer conformity - neoplatonically to inner coherence in the more Aristotelian way is very interesting. 41:34
Thank you,
Thanks John . Mind-fueling as always .
Great thanks. Happy Birthday
Brilliant lecture!
Really enjoyed how you handled or are handling the transition of worldviews from symbolic spiritual to scientific... I feel myself becoming less and less inclined to comment midstream and will simply wait for the next installment... too much fun John ...thank you so much for you and your team's efforts...
This is definitely my favorite episode so far! Really think that things are starting to come together and you can see the beginning of the schism
Saint Augustine’s confessions are a prayer, a biography, and a theology of soteriology. For Augustine the good and love are God in a Trinitarian ontology. In the confessions, Augustine is invited to partake in God’s ontological goodness and love. Augustine did not know Greek and because of this his influence stayed in the Latin west. His articulation of the Trinity may have played a part in the great schism of 1054. Augustine’s book “City of God” is where he develops a fully formed Christian narrative.
Thank you for this series John. Really putting some things together for me!!!
Loving this! Looking forward to the 2nd half of the series. I loved listening to Dreyfus' "Man, God, and Society in Western Literature" back in the day, and this is reminding me a bit of that. I realize this lecture series has a sharper focus on our "meaning crisis", but it pairs well with Dreyfus' tracing of paradigm shifts in the West, and how they were epitomized in various works of art.
An unbelievably deep and meaningful series. I wonder whether it is ever going to be edited into a book.
It has been turned into two books. We have a publisher for the books.
@@johnvervaeke Are the books available?
This helped me understand the melodic reading of the Quran more deeply. Very interesting. Thank you John.
What meaning did you derive from Muhammad marrying a 6 year old?
I sometimes find it difficult to make it through these lectures, my mind tends to become divided between so many things so focusing for such a time intellectually can become challenging. But I’m glad I made it through this one. You very succinctly manage to sum up the axial forces at work and the reasons why we find ourselves in a meaning crisis. Great work John. I only wish I could find this in podcast form, as I can dedicate much longer periods of undivided time to podcasts.
28:00 Beginning to understand the crisis
Keys to a meaningful life:
Coherence
Significance
Purpose
Time stamp 21:00
Thank you for this series
Thank you very much for this series.
This has to be my favorite one....fantastic.... thank you
💞💕so true...
At 37:13 when you speak of the singing/reciting of the reading- what you’re really saying is that it is right brain open awareness access- which by the way increases retention of the material precisely because of the architecture of the right brain- while silent reading is more compatible with the left brain processing- I may be off- but I feel drawn to Dr Ian Mcgilchrist’s work. You both are on to something. Thank you for the titanic work you do!
Thanks for making this available
This series is wonderful work.
John, this is beautiful. thoroughly enjoying the series. great work.
Amazing. Once again thank you for putting all of this together for us.
The part about how change in reading changed mentality is very interesting considering we are now experiencing a similar shift - from literacy to post-literacy. Wondering how it will shape the minds of future generations.
How is this guy only an assistant professor? He should be the dean!
Affirmative action plus his surname doesn’t end with -stein or -berg.
You came up in my recommendations. I love philosophy and you used Erik Satie in your intro, so I had to sub, looking forward to the content.
Thanks John and thanks for the comment last week.
Thomism is where I have found faith and reason to really unite.
The normative order reminds me of Jonathan Pageau, when “heaven and earth” (facts and values) agree, there is space, dry land, or order. When they disagree, there is flood, wandering, chaos
St. Augustine went from the carnal Roman bathhouses to the waters of baptism, from this, some historians believe, that had he lived to own a Game Boy in the 1990's, he would have chose Squirtle as his starter Pokemon.
Wonderfull episode, as many others. So it seems that the world of how is the world outside is not equivalent of the why of the world inside, the mind or psyche seems to operate in a diferent way of with diferent drives that the forces of the material world, I guess we need to create a bridge to comunicate this two "worlds" or dimensions or spects of reality and make them dance with love and reason. How intresting perspective.
Dear Professor, it would be good to write a book based on the awakening from the meaning crisis series. Best regards from Switzerland.
So much knowledge and really also love in this series :D I'm working on a review essay about the western ideal of romantic relationships and how it frames our possibilities of self-knowledge and self-transcendence. I believe you helped me with so many obstacles, it's like getting above the treeline after a long walk trough woods.
Brilliant topic.
50:20 Actually, I think he does unite faith and reason to the "supernatural": natural theology & theology,, natural law & moral theology. . . from then on, philosophy (reason) was seen as the "handmaid" of theology (faith). . .
Right. Thomistic Existentialism knitted together Faith & Reason, Body & Soul , Will & Intellect rather than dis-integrating these concepts in the world. Supernatural truth is knowable through philosophy but more perfectly through Faith. Right
You are most definitely right, but I think what John is doing here is marking the turning points that led us to where we are today, the meaning crisis. The unity of faith and reason by Aquinas, powerful as it may be, got lost along the way, as science grew stronger and more coherent.
History as it is taught in Greek high-school, is a boring subject. You on the other hand turn it into something beautiful. Thank you.
You're the real deal! Thanks for this series. Just like in the comments of the other episodes I'm hoping someone is willing to share some notes on this. Maybe even like a discord group so we can discuss this.
A discord channel might be a good idea alright .
Rebel Wisdom (who interviewed John) has a rather lively Discord that has, from time to time, discussed the series.
Here's the link: discord.gg/RK4MeYW
I'm on a facebook group dedicated to the exploration of John's stuff
@@jasetheacity link?
@@hazardousjazzgasm129 facebook.com/groups/451730882297281/
A feeling of "X" does not imply the reality of, or falsify, what is being felt.
YES
I’m returning to this video to follow up on something you said at Thunder Bay, could you please elaborate (perhaps as a video) on the current developments on Aquinas and his disciples. This video made a strong impact on me, making me think Aquinas was to blame for most of our problems in western Christendom and post-Christendom.
Yes I now think of Aquinas as a Neoplatonist rather than an Aristotelian. I also think that my criticism applies more to some of his followers called the pure nature philosophers.
@@johnvervaeke Thank you! I had to cancel my plans to attend the conference at the last minute, but I'm glad to hear some of the conversations that occurred. I hope you enjoyed it!
Fantastic talk. This shift from participatory to propositional, recitation to silent reading etc. sounds like what Iain McGilchrist would call a turn towards the left hemisphere, does that make sense?
It makes perfect sense. I started reading The Master and His Emissary now.
Remind me who "Kranz" is, discussed at 40:30 involving the extensive vs. intensive self?
12:58 "There's a love that is within reason, that can help you grow beyond reason to what reason always sought"
How do we grow in love? Participating in Agape
23:25 Meaning is to have...
What I realised when I read Confessions was that within the Manichean group there where the elect and those that where inferior. The same inner conflict that Augustine felt inside of himself out of that later came the idea of Original sin influenced by him. Is that a possible conclusion?