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Aether Explained- Forbidden Magic, Final Fantasy 14
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 มี.ค. 2023
- I've been wanting to cover something like this for a bit but didn't know how until now. I'm really happy to see how magic develops further in the world of FFXIV! If you want to learn about what happened to the Ilse of Val click the link bellow!
The Tragedy of Baldesion: • FFXIV Lore- The Traged...
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#ffxiv #lore #magic
Can't imagine telling a woman like Y'Shtola what she can and can not do. If knowledge on how to do something exists, she will do it. She really is the most powerful dark sorceress that just happens to be on the heroic side. Nothing is off limits.
She's a prime example of dark magic not meaning evil. She's easily powerful enough to conquer most nations if she felt so inclined. But her interest in dark magic is more academic than for personal power
Hell, she's arguably perhaps the only Scion that could actually feasibly beat the WoL. Not through power, the WoL easily beats her in sheer might, but through knowledge and use of obscure arcane arts.
No, she very much will not do it, that's the point.
You can't keep her from learning things if she has the opportunity, but she's very much constrained in what she does with that information.
The difference is that she insists on using her own judgement to consider the if the restrictions on something are valid. This makes her a rebel, but keeps her from becoming a villain.
Balancing head and heart is the core of her character arc.
@@linkblade0 She would beat the WoL by making good on her threat to put them over her knee.
@@Puddingskin01 idk, I think the WoL likes pushing her buttons. They certainly tease her more than the other Scions. Only the twins come close to the amount of snark the WoL dishes out.
@@linkblade0 well she's basicly the only viable option, twins are just to enamoured with WoL and we know it might hurt their feelings if we were too mean to them, Thancred would just laugh it off, Uriange might just take it as a deserved jab for all the times he went behind our backs or just not get it and try to explain his actions in an essay, Estinien would most likely not understand the sarcasm, popotos don't count. So only Y'shtola stays as a viable option to make a sarcastic tease and expect a satysfying reaction.
I'm writing a story with a magic system based off aetherology and this helped me a ton! I've already established a forbidden or taboo form of magic and this will help me explain it
The tip I use in D&D for people is "Why?". Every decision (especially with lore/world-building) ask "Why is it this way?". Ask "What caused this to be taboo?", and the like.
This will give you a believable depth to your world.
I'm curious to see how that story turns out!
Thanks for the additional lore professor! I didn't do palace of the dead, so I didn't realize that there was proper necromancy. I had always assumed that sticking voidsent in corpses like Xande did to invade Meracydia was the only form of necromancy as undead seem to pretty much always be accompanied by voidsent in my memory. I am now wonder if that would count as void magic, or necromancy.
Speaking of Palace of the Dead, the upper levels contain rare mini-bosses that hit hard and take longer to beat. You also may recognize them if you look closely
@@kaihedgie1747 It was so wild when I ran into the first one I did and recognized them. I was aghast, it was awesome!
@@kaihedgie1747 ❓
@@intensellylit4100You can fight some MSQ enemies that have been brought back in Palace
It would be interesting if there was a side quest involving a job crystal containing spells too dangerous for even the Warrior of Light to wield, so it must be destroyed. (Or shoved in the darkest corner of the Sharlayan Forbidden Archives.)
Of course I'm sure enough players would just say "Damn the consequences, give us another Limited Job!"
And thus: Necromancy :D
@@jemm113
Though from what I've seen, a lot of necromancy is just another variation of void magic.
Summoning voidsent to possess a being's corpse.
(See: Edda)
I will still argue that necromancy could still be used with noble intentions. Raising the dead to defend their own families in times of dire need, when a standing army can not be feasible. Allowing a spirit a chance to fulfill itself as they're walked through their final moments again. Necromancy is only as good or as evil as the caster is who uses it.
It doesn't matter who is using it or what they are using it for, necromancy literally drives the souls trapped in their bodies insane. being stuck on the mortal plain and being unable to pass on is torture for the souls. Plain and simple. You cannot use necromancy in a way that is not torturing and traumatizing for the souls involved, so I would argue that necromancy is impossible to use in a good way.
Yes, let's just disrupt the cycle of reincarnation that sustains the star on a massive scale. That should end well. It's not about good or evil, it's about mucking with things that would halt the ability for new things to even be born.
this is an argument that comes up in any setting where necromancy is forbidden, and i think it mostly comes down to how the afterlife works in those settings. like thesuperratt said, we know that there is a cycle of reincarnation on Etheirys through the lifestream, and using necromancy to rip souls out of that could be viewed in much the same way as any art that siphons aether from the land; potentially catastrophic if not used extremely sparingly. That plus the fact that, as stated in the video, souls suffer for being dragged back to the material plane, makes necromancy on Etheirys pretty rightfully forbidden.
My WoL is a student of Sharlayan who studies practical Aetherology, and this video series has been extremely illuminating for certain apsects of their characterization and character development. (and a perfect excuse to level every class)
Glad you enjoy the videos!
Man I would love a necromancer/blood magic healer
Rumour has it that there is a spell that makes Lalafel even more awesome but its forbidden as the rest of you could not handle out shear level of badassery .
Thank the gods
I was just looking for some worldbuilding inspiration through Aether/Ether as a concept and found this video. I know like nothing about final fantasy but I gotta say I was very entertained and really enjoyed your voice :)
Thank you! Happy you got some enjoyment out of it. ^^
I can stop whenever I want!
Im more so curious about magick called Break or Faze even time magic in general wasnt too sure if there was a video on it since im rather new to the channel, however always curious to learn about all forms of magick in this world forbidden or not so thank you for youre wonderful content that you do make ♪
Great video !
My favorite subject... well done!
Y'shtola Kitten: *Attempts to perform Flow*
Owner of Light: "Nooo."
Y'shtola Kitten: *Stops* 😶
Owner of Light: "Goo--"
Y'shtola Kitten: *Quickly casts Flow, disappearing into the Lifestream*
Owner of Light: "Shit! Not again!"
Cat Catcher-Selch: *Sighs* "Don't worry, I'm on it..."
I would think there might be room for some sort of ethical Necromancy : that kind of necromancy would be less about raising the dead but somewhat like Reapers and Summoners, forming a covenant with spirits of the recently dead to perform a task then be released. What would be the cost? Well, for the caster, perhaps some MP and whatever kind of resource they generate in combat. Like Reapers, they could gain that resource from defeated enemies or using certain abilities on them, or even use up some of their HP as 'payment'.
Then the spirit would assume the form agreed on by the covenant (spell) to perform the task then dissipate after a moment or last for a short duration afterwards.
On a game mechanic level, I envision the Necromancer as a spellcaster that has very short range spells that he can overcome by using spirits as focus points for long range spells. Basically, Necromancer AoEs would be centered on the caster but if they have a spirit "haunt" an enemy or ally (giving a debuff or buff respectively), then that target would become the centerpoint of your Necromancer spells. Kind of similar to the Sage with Kardia/Kardion except it would be used for offensive AoE spells.
I would assume most Necromancer spells would be DoTs or debuffs, kind of like an inverse Bard in that they might not dish out as much damage as other casters but they have high utility in making enemies weaker and dealt damage over time.
With the Summoner no longer having its AoE DoT capability, there is certainly room for a caster with DoT-centric mechanics and a unique way to use their spells. Probably would need to be looked at or balanced somehow but yeah, that's pretty much as close as an "ethical Necromancer" I can think of without right out raising the dead... or creating simple homunculi that the spirits can temporarily inhabit to perform the action.
I think the price would be to settle some/all of the spirits unsettled affairs. Anything from passing on a few words of thanks to a loved one. To finding the truth behind something that killed them. I'm imagining a sanctified dead sorta thing. With it's business concluded the spirit sheds it's regrets and hands it's soul to you for your designs, deeming you pure of heart and sound of mind, a spirit medium. Thus consecrated by your will it becomes a force for good in the world once more. Perhaps this is done in parts of the world where people are like to die suddenly and violently and thus, to prevent them from become ash fiends, these accords are stuck to finish their lives with more solace and dignity.
Ethical necromancy reminds me of old Imperial guild approved necromancer in Elder Scrolls.
Some mages practicing form of necromantic arts for pure expression. They usually limiting themselves to animal souls to practice on. Sometimes, some Colovian families also practice necromancy to their members to act as a cryp guard for their family's tomb.
@@GaleGrim You just described the plot of _Raven of the Inner Palace_ to some extent. I think that might be a valid way of tying it in to the game without breaking lore.
@@mrdoormat6809 Why is it considered ethical to muck up animal souls? They don't live dignified lives, at least let them have an afterlife, for the gods' sake.
Fantasias just help your become your "true self" right? Allow what's on the outside to match what's on the inside in the event your spirit was born into the wrong body. Something we as players can abuse but otherwise are useless for most people.
Fantasia exists in a perpetual state of dubious canon.
If we base the lore off of what Koji-Fox said in an interview. A Fantasia potion is nothing more than liquid courage. Something that helps you to "express" yourself in new ways by giving you the confidence you need for a new life choice. In the canon lore, it doesn't actually change you. If a potion was that powerful, criminals would be one sip away from getting a new face and avoiding the law.
Fantasia is confirmed to be a pure meta item and isn't canon.
My headcanon is that fantasia is actually so powerful it changes reality so that you've always been whatever you changed into, so from everyone's perspective it did nothing.
@@BeefNinja7 That would explain why no one acknowledges it.
* scoffs* Ser I don't have a problem. I simply enjoy being a male Elezen from time to time. No harm in that ( Has used a total 10 fantasia)
You need Alchemist Anonymous for support. I think the Adventurer’s Guild has their number.
@@acgearsandarms1343 I dont have a problem I know when to stop ( Has a fantasia bottle in the cart )
only 10? I have a friend who fantasia'd every single week and I've known him for almost 2 years now. It's at the point that it became a game of £what shall he be next" for our guild XD
Thanks for the spoiler warning, then I'll be back once I cleared the Endwalker MSQ.
Of course! I hope you enjoy the expansion!
@@SynodicScribe Thank you, I will, but more like all expansions starting with HW, which I have yet to unlock in the game. I cleared "The Ultimate Weapon" today. So there's a lot to do.
You've got a long road ahead, enjoy the journey!
I realy hope we get Time mage one day.
I thought it was pretty neat how Gigi used the time magic casting sound effects from FF5.
I personally consider Astrologians to be Time Mages. Generally in FF, Astrologers are advanced versions of Time Mages (such as FFT). And in the AST job quest line, you fight a Sharlayan Astrologian who is able to temporarily halt time universally. Again, another reference to FFT’s Astrologer’s Stasis spell.
The PC AST also used to have time-related spells, but they simplified all classes themes in ShB.
I still consider AST to be better Time Mages.
@@toodleselnoodos6738 That's a really good point. I really wish there'd be an outfit based on the classic time mage outfit then.
White Magic is...complicated. I think the problem there is one of terminology. Conjury can TECHNICALLY be seen as a form of White Magic, just a lesser/constrained form. I'm sure you already know this, but as a scholar of sorts myself who enjoys sharing knowledge, perhaps you would be kind enough to indulge me? White and Black Magic aren't simply advancements on Conjury and Thamaturgy. Thamaturgy (and Red Magic) are distinct in HOW they are performed. Both use only the user's personal Aether to cast their spells. This is why Thamaturgy is so much weaker than Black Magic. Imagine if you had access to only the thermal energy your own body can produce. If you could tap, control, and direct it, there is easily enough heat energy in your body to produce small fires...but not roaring infernos. And draining that much heat out of your body would cause hypothermia and death.
On the other hand, now imagine you can draw energy out of your surroundings - the air, inanimate stone or pavement, sunlight - not you have a vast pool of energy to shape and direct, and aren't limited by your own personal body's stores. This is the difference between Thamaturgy and Black Magic, and was discovered by the wizard Shantotto, spuring Mhach's rise to power and prominence (which was initially driven by mastery of this Black Magic, not by their Voidsent magics, per se).
Like Black Magic, White Magic works in a similar way, drawing on the surrounding world for power stores. In both cases, they can be seen as lesser forms of Primal Summoning (without the Tempering) in that they drain the land over time, which is what led to the Calamity of Water/Floods, after which both became forbidden...
...but not QUITE. Conjury developed a bit later, after the Gridanians had established communications and agreements with the Elementals. The Elementals decided that mortals could not be trusted with such vast powers again, BUT, if they would limit how MUCH they drew, could be allowed to draw on ambient Aether to fuel their spells. Those who drew too much would incur the wrath of the Elementals, but those who drew with restraint would be allowed to continually return to the well for another bucket, as it were. Indeed, while many players (who want more DPS spells on Healers) draw the wrong conclusion from Sylphie in the CNJ questline, her "sin" was not that she didn't want to cast attack magic spells. Her "sin" was she was fueling her curative powers with her own personal Aether, like a Thamaturge would. This is what killed her mother, as drawing from your own VITALITY to heal others means you will kill your own body over time. It's also why E-Sumi-Yan was both shocked and terrified when she informed him she discovered how to use Raise, saying that doing so would kill her - in essence, she'd be using the Blue Magic spell Transfusion, giving her Aether to someone else to revive them, which would result in her own death.
Needless to say, personal-Aether derived White Magic would be fatal to the user, and personal-Aether derived Black Magic is as well, as we see in the BLM quests where the assailants burn up their own bodies because of fueling too powerful spells with their body's limited Aether stores.
While a very powerful mage might be able to cast powerful spells using their own body's Aether alone, this requires tremendous mental AND physical vitality, and has limits. Enter Red Magic. Red Mages use powerful spells like Flare and Holy, but don't draw on the ambient Aether of the world. The art was, after all, formed after the Calamity of Water and White Magic and Black Magic being forbidden. How is this possible? First, because Red Mages train their minds AND bodies to have tremendous vitality to draw on. Second, because their spellcasting is done in a very specific way that blends schools of White Magic, Black Magic, and probably Arlcanistry, using the very motions of their bodies in a similar way to the arcane geometries. This collection of skills allows them to cast powerful spells FAR more efficiently than any White Mage or Black Mage could, and to reclaim the extra Aether that would normally be "lost" as "inefficiencies" in the spell cast. Where a WHM or BLM would just cast the spell and be relatively unconcerned about inefficiencies or losses, the RDM's reclaim that energy to use for further spellcasting and to prevent their bodies from dying in the process.
...that doesn't QUITE explain how they can cast Verraise, but yeah...
.
The only forms of forbidden magic that seem to be essentially universally forbidden are Necromancy, Voidsent summonings, and full on Primal summoning.
While the WoL Summoner has bridged the gap for Egi Primal summoning in a very limited way in Thanalan, the other two seem to be universally forbidden. Though the discovery that Primal summoning is just a broken/tainted form of Creation Magic is kind of interesting, and may lead to future changes.
There seem to be no cases where Necromancy is EVER condoned by ANY of the actual societies around, and as noted with Sil'di, Necromancy seems to be a warcrime any time it's used. I've not seen a single case where it is considered an acceptable art by anyone. Necromancy SPECIFICALLY is highly unethical. The only time it could be debateably ethical is if it was agreed on by the subject, but as the subject has to be dead, permission isn't exactly something that can be granted unless it is done before hand. And then you get into complications of "self-inflicted" vs "natural causes" clauses of such an agreement. That is (trying to avoid TH-cam censoring), whether it requires the participant to end themselves (which could be argued to be encouraging unethical behavior) vs not.
Voidsent SUMMONING, specifically, seems to also be universally condemned. The only exception seems to be the Reapers, which were a clandestine group, meaning their arts were more "looked over" by society rather than condoned or supported.
Hadn't thought about Amon's experiments. I guess I don't tend to think of those as a school of magic. Moreover, I don't think they're done often, so most cultures aren't really AWARE of them.
For Aetherochemistry, many of the Allagan experiments have popped up over time around Eorzea, so while the origins of them were at one point poorly understood, the very danger these beings posed would make a discovery of their origin lead to such magic being heavily censured.
On Red mages, considering you have to be a rather high level to raise, I imagine our WoL, or anyone really, would have trained their personal pools large enough to handle the spell, not to mention the efficiency needed to cast it. And considering Scholars, Summoners, and Archanists can also raise, it's likely these spell focusing techniques go a long way to making the spell accessible.
And remember, Raise et al. is not brining back the dead, we're just violently healing mortal injury and wounds that would normally require time and care to heal normally, let alone in the middle of a damn battlefield.
The ONE area I could see Necromancy as a useful area is the realm of immortal armies or workforces. Emperors on many worlds dream of having an immortal army, alongside an immortal self, that could be called upon at their whim. On Earth, the Terracotta Army is one such example. On Middle Earth, the spirits of the Oathbreakers. A power necromancer may find themselves in the employ of a country for the sake of easing the burden of certain manual labor like farming or construction. Simply enforce a culture that encourages families to see the bodies of their loved ones into eternal service to their nation and you'd find people proudly holding funeral rights for a new farm hand. From there an army is only the next logical step. A decidedly evil ruler would simply take the dead bodies from the bloody battlefields left in his wake and "conscript" them into his ranks of the undead. Or perhaps it is a service reserved for proud veterans and posthumously upon soldiers as a great reward for their sacrifice, like a grotesque Purple Heart, which I wouldn't put past such an emblem being used as an arcane focus for the spells involved.
Though that last bit definitely delves past the scope of FFXIV and into the realm of other fiction, I'll definitely be considering what I've written here for one or more fantasy campaign settings I've stalled on writing.
@@jemm113 It's not exactly unheard of. StarCraft's Protoss do this with their Dragoons - 4 legged robot exoskeletons they put their wounded/maimed/fallen battlefield warriors into where they will be in these things forever after but can continue fighting.
StarCraft 2 has a different version of this technology where the body was too badly damaged, so the minds were uploaded as AI and placed into entirely robot bodies.
Warhammer 40k does something like the former with their...Dreadnauts, I think it is? I'm not as versed in W40k lore, but I do know StarCraft was influenced by it, and they have a similar concept of Space Marines that weren't killed but were so wounded they were put in these walking tombs to be called on only in the most dire need and they sleep the rest of the time; they're revered for their wisdom and long lives/knowledge as much as their battle prowess.
I would love to hear about linkpears... and how many the WoL have xD
To many! They collect soul crystals and linkpearls like tictacts.
@@SynodicScribe damn right we do! XD there was once a point I was maxed out on linkshells!
So, would the practice of an Ishgardian drinking dragon's blood to transform technically be forbidden magic? They do it to themselves willingly, so I wonder.
Consuming dragon blood isn’t exactly transformation magic. It’s just a catalyst. Magic requires active manipulation by the user. This can be done with unwilling participants as well. It honestly seems more in line with physical mutation.
Forbidden by the Ishgardian church definitely, at least before Thordan was overthrown.
I maybe one of the only WoL not addicted to Fantasia
Mr. Professor you have told us today some good knowlege but the what exactly is fantasia now. I mean its a pretty stron drug and not light to handle but what exactly is it and how does it work
It's not officially canon. But Fantasia as described by Koji-Fox himself is, "Fantasia gives you courage." Essentially it's a potion that gives you the confidence to makes life choices. What that means is up to the player. But in canon lore, there is no magical elixir that can suddenly make someone a completely different species.
@@SynodicScribe Y'know that might explain why we can only replace retainers after drinking a retainer fantasia. lol
Now I just need a form of magic for Cocobusi to use. Or a therapy maybe, like a magic version of those tubes you blow into to fix your lungs after pneumonia.
Yeah there's no fixing what he's got. Just give'm a magiteck wand that shoots fireballs or something. haha
@Synodic Scribe I could see Conjury or maybe arcanima being a viable path. Of course that would require going to Gridania or Limsa and you know what never mind. Just get him a gun.
Thinking about teleportation, I wonder if the Ascians can do it bc they don’t have a proper tie to a mortal form any longer? So there is less risk-you don’t need to worry about a body. Or maybe they teleport instead through the Rift (between the mortal realm and the Sea)? And if it’s considered the same…Before the Sundering, we see short ranged teleports done by Emet-Selch and Hythlodaeus, are they less at risk bc the Sea (the Underworld) is more stable, or because their souls and bodies are much more aesthetically dense and able to deal with more? Or both?
In theory, anyone who's awakened to the Echo's 'Power and Transcendent Worlds' would have an easier time of teleportation magic. So you're not off base with that one!
the impression ive gotten from what weve seen of advanced Echo users (mainly the Sahagin leader in the Leviathan plotline and Zenos) is that they essentially gain a level of control over their soul. Their essence doesn't need a lifeline like an aetheryte because they can maintain the integrity of their souls and push through to their destination through sheer force of will, just as easily they can commandeer the bodies of other mortals without issue. For the ancients, this most likely was so effortless simply because the density of their souls and their ease of mastery of arcane arts made such control a simple matter, of course bearing in mind that Hades and Hythlodaeus would likely have a natural advantage in this regard given their unique attunement to souls.
Accurate
Stupid youtube moogle didn't alert me this was out. But the fantasia joke does remind me, how canon are items like that and totems we get from EX and Savage fights.
Being called out for my fantasia addiction made me laugh.
🎉
So, what is the lore behind fantasias?
It's nothing more than a potion that can temporarily boost your confidence. In Koji-Fox's own words, one would drink this potion when they need the courage to make a big life choice. Canonically, there is no potion that has the power to turn anyone into anything.
leave necromancy alone. We just want to raise a family in peace
I see what you did there. After all, you can't spell Necromancer without Romance!
I'm sure someone has asked this before, but what about time magic?
I've been looking for lore ff14 videos covering and diving into Ivalice and Seraph Ultima, hell even Bozja which is related is hardly covered in video format extremely disappointing a lot of players don't know what the hell Dalmasca is....so im asking pretty please please with a cherry ontop cover Ivalice to Bozja!
Hmmm. Well I can certainly try to put something together for both.
isnt black magic also a forbidden art until you complete the black mage questline?
So.. no talk about the blue juice? Okay, don’t mind me I’m leaving class…… 👀
Isn't dark knight dangerously close to forbidden magic?
If you're unable to control your emotions, I'd say yeah. It can be lethal to those who lack discipline and control. But to those strong enough, the Dark Arts are very powerful and a worthy tool.
@@SynodicScribe honestly I feel like legally it makes sense why dark knight was at one point considered heresy in Ishgard, WoL gets a free pass cuz their will is strong enough to defy even elder primals but your average joe would prob be banned from becoming a black knight, especially Ishgard lol.