I'm sorry but let's have a nuanced discussion. "Socialism" as a defined political movement in much later than Jesus. That is true. But socialism as a concept (society existing for the benefit of all of its members and not being controlled by a wealthy ruling class) is not a new concept. "It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven." Or "My fathers house was meant to be a place of prayer, but you have made it a den of thieves." Jesus was a socialist in the latter sense.
Jesus was no Socialist. He was a stern authoritarian. The 'hippification' of Jesus is a travesty. The hard fact is, people have a proper place...Jesus was behind this 100%....He admonished people to know their place, and KEEP it...His message had a lot more to do with humility than upward mobility. Your kind cannot accept this because selfishness is your be-all and end-all. Christ had nothing to do with the nonstop narcissism and self-absorption of modern Westerners. Your kind would never be capable of understanding Him or His teachings. You are too immersed in all the modern filth.
OK, I’m not blown away with the nuance of your comment. Exploring more, we would have to distinguish between socialism as a government system, and “socialism” or jesusism found in the early church. The primary difference between the church and government practicing socialism is that the government has the military and force of law behind it to ruin peoples lives so don’t conform. The church does not have this power, but on voluntary action. Governmental socialism and inherently higher risk of drifting towards totalitarianism. I’m sure we could agree.
Salvation is free. Salvation is for all. For by Grace we are saved and not of work; lest that any man should boast. Not only was he a socialist; he was considered a liberal. He went against the social and political norms of his day. Funny how we now trying to be conservative and follow him.
You aren't making that up, as an older woman who is a registered independent. I have noticed this movement getting stronger and more violent. Giving the rise to militias who love nothing more then being violent. I am very concerned and i pray for all of us.
If the definition of being "evangelical" in any religious context is to seize political, social and cultural power in order to impose beliefs and control on others by force, demonizing and devaluing those who won't conform, then this is nothing less than abusive and extreme religious bigotry. I don't believe for a second that this is what Jesus had in mind, or demonstrated. Excellent discussion!
Exactly. The Christian Nationalists are NOT Christians. I'm a born again spirit filled Christian and I believe true believers AND followers of the Lord Jesus Christ need to live out everything Jesus taught I The Beatitudes and the Sermon on the Mount. Christian Nationalists along with their anti-christ spirit leader Trump are the antithesis of everything found in those Beatitudes.
when you're raised in a very conservative southern evangelical church they'd teach you how Jesus was a small-state-libertarian who mainly was against taxation - Bill O’Reilly wrote a book about this and he's not the worst fascist in the bunch, many racist preachers will be worse.
It's a sweet sentiment but it won't happen. In Islam, Christ is seen as a prophet and not a deity. Hinduism is all over, to some he's a guru, to some he's his own God, to some he's the divine descent and linked to Brahman. I, unfortunately, don't ever see us coming together in love as long as there is religion. When you introduce God's or ideas such as heaven and hell, there's always going to be someone who thinks THEIR version of that is the right one and everyone else is wrong. Until we can transcend that, I don't really believe we'll ever be able to fully come together. But what do I know I'm one guy on the internet lol
@@kyleyoung8476 Yeah...because telling people that they're just mammals competing for resources....that's SURE to bring about boatloads of peace and love!!!
There is a mindset focused on individualism and one that embraces wider community. Abortion is one example. The pro life lobby keep it individual, she. is to blame, she is a murderer she must be stopped. Yet also lobby against the very things proven to massively reduce the requests for abortion - those are systemic matters, a society level response. Good sex ed and exploring matters about consent; access to birth control (many unplanned pregnancies are in fsmies that can't afford another mouth to feed). Health care that won't bankrupt parents if the fetus diagnosed with major medical needs, affecting one part of the considerations those parents face. Not to mention how much even birth care costs in the US. But rather than ask how can we at a society level reduce abortions; the individualism makes it a war against individual women labelled sinners.
I could not agree more. Forced legislation will only send things the opposite direction as we are already seeing. We won't see a drop in abortions by banning them, we will just see a drop in safe abortions. The better way is through support and education as you've said. This isn't a theory. There is data out there to validate it.
@@helenr4300 Exactly. Every abortion started with a man unzipping his pants. After that it's between a woman and her doctor to determine the best course of action. Men, if you can't handle that, keep your pants and your mouth zipped up.
As a prolifer I can respect your comments on this. I think there is a delicate nature to what you are saying. It is one I have had trouble with. I hold that life begins at conception. I do concede that there is and needs to be medical exemptions in life threatening situations. I still wrestle with the medical conditions of the child. Hard part is if I hold to life begins at conception do we then base the worth of that life on the condition of the child. As a prolifer though I do not want to arrest anyone who has an abortion nor am I saying they are the bad guys. If anything my beef would be the men in that situation. I have found an overwhelming amount abortions are a result of men not having their house in order. To me abortion is not an unforgivable sin. I also hold that the only thing that changes for the baby is where he first takes his breath and open its eyes for the first time it will be in the glory of the Lord as an abortion does not simply delete the life. Jmo I know many will disagree with me on the topic. I do think as prolifers we do need to articulate our stances better and not be hijacked by the radicals on either side.
Thank you for what you are doing. I am not a religious person, and I enjoy your delivery without recruiting to the faith you believe in. Learned a lot just watching a few videos on your channel. For some period of time, I am trying to get different viewpoints on what is going on now days, and how we came to this point in our country. I do believe US on the way to the better future, but how it is happening sometimes when some person is ill for example, things are getting worse before they will be better. And once infection is gone, the organism immune system is becoming stronger. We have a lot of negative emotions, and some of them could be rightful, but not helpful. When organism is sick, it needs calmness to get healthier. My regards and wish you the best.
15:26 that German grandfather story is profound. And highlights the crowd factor and how leaders feed that and do things that the masses would not all have thought or done personally (though some of rank and file would agree with). I don't think that all of the religious right, the nationalists, maga etc are bad people, but they have always been fed one story of what is important and who is to blame. But yes once away from the set rhetoric people want people to flourish.
Thank you, this is such an important message! Moral character, honor & conduct matter in our elected leaders. Proud Texan, conservative Christian and patriot putting Country over a Republican party that has lost its moral compass - voting ALL BLUE. ✝️🇺🇸🧢🧢🧢 We will not bear good fruit in our country with a convicted felon. I choose Country over a fallen party. ✝️🇺🇸🧢🧢🧢 United we stand!
@@erinnmackie3507 Trump’s own General, Mark Millet, has stated Trump is unfit for office and more than 741 National Security Leaders have signed a letter stating Trump is unfit for office and a threat to our national security, this includes top Republicans. I’m going with the military and national security experts.
Did I hear you correctly? Did you just refer to yourself as a conservative Christian? Are you aware that Christian women are rotting away in prison RIGHT NOW for praying at abortion clinics...decent men have been dragged away by gun wielding law enforcement right in front of their terrified children for the same 'offense'....outraged fathers have been dragged out of PTA meetings because they objected to their daughters being raped by trannies in the shower room....These actions are taking place on behalf of DEMOCRATS....If you support them, that's your business. But don't come in here calling yourself a Christian....Conservative or otherwise...
At 5, in 1957, I attended Sunday School for the first time -- basically knowing nothing about God or Jesus, churches or religions. That church had let my mother know that Divorcees, like her, were NOT welcome in the pews. She was already a Fallen woman, or adultery waiting to happen. Not with their men and boys! And she was an RN -- a career woman -- what a horrible role model for their daughters. And when someone asked, "What about the children?" The elders said, "She divorced her husband and thus voided the marriage. Therefore the children are bastards, and Deuteronomy 23: 2 tells us we are to exclude the bastards from our congregations for 10 generations -- and let the sins of their mothers and fathers be revisited upon them." One mother of a friend I met in kindergarten, disagreed, and took me to Sunday School anyway -- through Easter. I had to ask a lot of questions, but that's when I learned about the Elders of the Churches. Dumbed Down Beyond Belief. DDBB.
That is not their definition of themselves. That is the title unethical people gave them to try to take away their rights as American. So much for tolerance of others and their opinions. Freedom for me, but not for thee. These people are truly as wicked as the fascist of Nazi Germany.
@@paulagrant1073the fascists are clearly the ones who want the Christian dictatorship with Trump as their leader. Nobody believes the nonsense right wing persecution complex. It's 1933 all over again.
Putin has been PUT IN charge of his own Christian Nationalist Beast -- Daniel 7: 5 -- Arise, devour much flesh. Project 2025 wants to be the Rod of Iron that forces men and women to obey God. ALL the Prophets on Christian TV -- and all the faith-healers and prosperity preachers, too, are FAKE EWES -- ravening wolves, dressed better than the sheep they fleece. 100's of millions of Christians, worldwide, deceived. Matthew 24: 24. So MANY so Horribly taught.
My mother is also from Mount Airy, NC and I grew up in Pilot Mountain, which is called “Mount Pilot” on The Andy Griffith Show. Knowing those towns I imagine that my “people” and his “people” were fairly well acquainted back in the day.
I’m learning about what people are calling flow. It occurred to me whenever the Bible talks about people influenced by the Holy Spirit, these are examples of flow. Creative, discerning truth, passionate and caring.
I am astounded that , in the comments, people are carrying on a little battle of Bible verses. The word Christian , I believe, means one who follows the teachings of Jesus Christ. Evangelical beliefs, I understand, means that one is ‘saved’. Once ‘saved’ one’s place in heaven is assured. Whereas the Christian who follows those teachings and honor the directives to , ‘love thy neighbor; feed the hungry; care for one another’ actually do the work and actions to fulfill these directives do not fit in the Evangelical movement. The words of Jesus are clear. When asked who Is my neighbor , answered , ‘everyone’. That means Jews, Muslims,Hindus, people of every, repeat, every ilk. Seems self explanatory. He also stated that God’s kingdom is NOT of this world. Christian Nationalism is advocacy for that kingdom to actually be of this world , literally of this nation in this world. Just a thought.
What I love about you as an interviewer is that you know how to ask a question and then stand back and let folks have the floor uninterrupted. Very rare these days. My thought about this "aberration" take on the negative forms of Christianity to which you are referring: it was only about 150-200 years after Jesus's death that Tertullian said it was OK to kill people who would not convert. And even closer to Jesus's life was Paul who told women to shut up and sit down. So I think the strain of authoritarianism, misogyny etc. run very deep and long. Better to say different "versions" of the faith rather than acting as if there was some "pure form" at the outset. The scholars I follow say that the opposite is true. In the beginning there were many, many Christianities. It's Paul who starts the homogenization trend and, of course, Constantine who finalizes it. And the Protestant "reformation" actually reintroduces brutal and more vicious forms than ever. (Protestants burned more witches, for instance than Catholics who tended to burn "heretics.") Christianity has and always has had many takes. It's up to you to follow the most humane, loving, inclusive, non-violent form you can find or make.
I have always functioned under the understanding that while there is and was only 1 Jesus, he had 12 disciples which he sent out across the earth to preach His word to the people. 12 people who were all present for his sermons, but in translation to their preaching heard 12 different meanings of what Jesus meant. It's how I got my mom to stop trying to get me to convert back to Catholicism.
The book The Explosive Child by Ross Greene talks about seeing children and by extension people of any age as instead of saying people do well if they want to, he changes the expression to people do well if they can. What he means is we have skills that help us do well that, if they are not learned well, we turn to explosive outbursts or we implode because we can’t achieve tasks we want to do. It’s worth reading, for Christians. It de-emphasizes punishment and focuses on building these skills.
Personal comment of Laura Botten: I like how Scotland History Tours put it in a video about Scottish slavery. "The colour of slavery isn't black or white, it's green." The only difference between indentured servitude and slavery is the contractual "end date". You better believe that slaves were tricked out of that end date continuously. Baptism gifts were given to workers when they had a child to "purchase" that child. By law giving someone as little as a pair of shoes was a contract of purchasing their loyalty and labour. If that child ran away, the parents were responsible for the lost labour. Even when coalminers were given the right to choose to come and go from employment, it took a further 10 years for the current slaves to be given freedom. The Scots invented public schooling so the average person could learn to read the Bible for themselves. Every area was required to have a public school and children had to attend, except coalmine towns. Puts a wee bit of a different spin on "I'm proud to be a coalminer's daughter" doesn't it? The colour of slavery is green greed!
Awesome... I'm from Ky and so often those in the mountains are overlooked. But our Democratic Gov won in many Counties the last time because he helped them during the flood. Andy Beshear...I live in Central Ky and it is discouraging when 2/3 of my county couldn't even vote for him, let alone Always red. So Poor white population is overlooked. They were wise enough to know the Gov Beshear a Democrat. Showed them real neighbor love.. Praise God
I agree with a lot of your stand points the only one I do not understand is why is it so wrong to both support Israel and Palestine the people. I was raised in the evangelical fundamentalist charismatic word of faith/prosperity gospel movement/churches that’s where I came to the Christ. My whole testimony is crazy because it’s still going on. But FYI about 11 years ago I accepted my sexuality as bisexuality and I still to this day I’m openly proud bisexual progressive Christian. It’s kind of weird for me now to call myself and consider myself a progressive Christian. Literally the type of progressive Christians that I’ve been watching before it seemed like they weren’t even following Christ at all and are bringing him up at all. But I now know it’s not just what you say it’s what you do as well those are your fruits. I go to a moderate conservative church that doesn’t 100% openly go against homosexuality and all forms but officially says on their website which nobody barely goes there that they are for traditional man and woman marriage. But at the same time they allow me that is openly bisexual and a strong believer in Christ to volunteer and help produce content for them on their website. My main gripe right now is I do not understand why progressives have to only be for the Palestinians. I personally and four is real getting back there hostages that were taken and taking down Hamas. On the other hand I’m also against how they are doing it personally. I am very much for the Palestinian people I really believe we should give them aid and or get them out of that country. What I have noticed in my own research of videos and such is that a lot of the countries that say they support the Palestinians will not allow the Palestinians to go to their country to flee the war. I’m not all saying I understand 100% the conflict it is very mixed with both historical social religious and political entanglements. I am definitely for the Israel people the Jewish people I’m definitely for the Palestinians both the Muslims Christians and etc. But I do not understand why we have to pick one over the other and I know technically that is what our countries doing I do think we should do stuff differently within that conflict. But I’m not one of those people that are just supporting Israel or Palestine. I really pray that God can touch each one of their hearts and help change their mindset. I don’t have money to donate to any of these causes all I can do is share videos pray and of course vote.
Just a heads up. Hartgrove's definition of idolatry, "a collective projection of the power that we want to be in control so we don't have to be afraid" can apply just as easily to how many people (Tim included) view Harris in this upcoming election.
Socialism may not have existed back when but it was born out of Christian faith. In UK the Labour Party was said to have many of its roots in working class Methodism (training to preach equipping the public speaking skills of the early unions etc). They saw a need for social justice, rather than the poor begging a rich philanthropist and competing to be the worthy one to get the handout. Communism is totally different in that it sought to overturn all the elites and made people units, who could be deployed to tasks equally, not individuals with different skills and strengths. Then there is unchecked capitalism where those that start with more get more and without legal protections would exploit workers into the ground in hours, lack of safety, lowest possible pay etc. Any thing that involves the society (via govt) supporting the population is socialist thinking. Like police funding, fire services (in past they were private and only came to fires that on their list of the insured properties) education.... Different countries have a different view and culture about what areas the wider society should support and help the population
I have said before that Christ is a socialist. I must say that Christ probably has His own system, but if he would favor a political system, he would pick socialism. I've been to socialist countries. They take care of their people. Free healthcare, free education. No homeless.
yes they need to pray for wisdom as these double-minded nationalists and humble themselves to accept Christ and pray that all come to Christ for we do not serve the God of this world
I think something that I'm very frustrated by in these kind of conversations is that "Republicans and Christians who vote for republicans/Trump are idolitrous" and then there seems to be no acknowledgement of that same kind of radical/idolitrous mentality from democrat politicians and some of the people who vote for them. Don't get me wrong, I very much dispise the deification and conflation of Trunp with Christ. It is a grievous sin and is in fact idolitry and should be called out and cut out of the body of Christ (so seriously, thank you for that). But it feels like this kind of discourse doesn't make room for people who are genuinely trying to faithfully follow Christ and love and serve their neighbors, but disagree on how we are to practically do that. People who say, "I don't hate people of a different race/lgbtq+ people. I want them to lead fulfilled lives and see them succeed. I just don't think that loving those people lines up with the prescriptions set out by the democratic party." Genuine questions: 1. If you have a problem with the militant (radical) Right (which I think we absolutely should) and see them as a threat to democracy, do you also have a problem with and think that the militant (radical) Left presents the same issue? 2. Do you think that a faithful Christian who (like yourself) desires for all people to be cared for and lifted up, and vote for Trump? And then why or why not? Hopefully nothing comes off as antagonistic or backhanded, even though we disagree on a lot and I sometimes get frustrated, I'm genuinely thankful for what you are doinng and for introducing new perspectives and ways of thinking. It's been helpful to confront and really think through my faith and how I live as a response. So seriously thank you.
1. As far as a radical left exists in America, it has a minute place in mainstream Democratic politics. The same cannot be said for the radical right- Trump has mainstreamed it into the entire GOP by demanding ultimate control and loyalty. So while I would be fine condemning harmful radical ideas on the left, you’re making a false equivalency. 2. I am not in the business of judging/sorting who is the “in-group” and “out-group” within Christianity. I do tend to think that a vote for Trump stems from some combination of fear, ignorance, hate, and/or greed. And those are not typically the attributes that people recognize in the stories about Jesus.
Robbie P. Jones's work on political violence seems quite biased/willfully blind in my review. There is indeed a rising population in the US that believe that political violence may be necessary, but that population is definitely not predominantly within Christian Evangelical groups. A recent study reported in the Guardian stated that two of the top issues that respondents indicated would justify political violence are "protecting the voting rights of Black Americans and other minorities," "Restore the Federal Right to Abortion," and "Prevent Donald Trump from Becoming President." Each of these issues saw nearly twice the support of political violence as other issues such as "Prevent the Prosecution of Trump." I find that many, including Jones, whistle past the rising tide of political violence being employed by the political left because it doesn't fit their perceived narrative. One can look no further than the attacks on crisis pregnancy centers and pro-life organizations in the wake of the Dobbs decision. The moment one hears of violence at a Planned Parenthood, it is immediately national news that consumes the airwaves for weeks. Most people don't even know that crisis pregnancy centers and pro-life organizations were firebombed in the wake of Dobbs. It may have to do with the fact that Planned Parenthood is one of the largest funders of certain politicians while crisis pregnancy centers have very little, if any, political lobbying power.
Sorry, I hit the send button before I was through commenting. Please examine your heart because I get the feeling that your reason for this channel is not something that furthers God's kingdom.
Please pronounce Kamala's name right. The emphasis is on the Ka. To mispronounce it shows the same disrespect as when MAGAs do that on purpose. It's a small thing, but a really big thing.
want to respond to the comments here. I wish every single person who calls themself a christian, would really study the Word of God from Genesis to Revelation. If you studied yourself, alone with G-d and not listen to your pastors, teachers you would know the following. The book of Acts makes it clear that the JEWS were teaching the pagans about G-d/Yeshua the Messiah. The non Jews were pagans, had never heard of the true G-d nor had ever read the scriptures, meaning Genesis, Prophets, and Writings. There was no written Gospels or Letters which were considered scripture. James said at the Council in Jerusalem in Acts 15, every Shabbat, Friday sunset to Saturday sunset, the pagans who wanted to convert to the True Holy G-d of Israel and accept the Jewish Messiah, Yeshua, would come to the synagogue and hear MOSES AND THE TORAH, so that they could begin to understand how to walk in G-d's commandments and honor Him. After the apostles died off, a new religion began, called christianity. It was led by gentiles, and eventually Roman Catholic Popes, who destroyed the Torah and all that G-d gave to the Jews to share with the world. Yeshua, the Jewish Messiah who always obeyed Torah and taught for His sheep to do the same, became a gentile Jesus who disobeyed Torah and told others to do the same. if you follow what the Popes dictated, rather than the Word of G-d in the Torah and Prophets and Writings, you have been deceived. Return to the Truth.
Jesus is one of the greatest Hebrew rabbis ever. Any true follower would not acknowledge Constantine’s Roman Empire collected Hebrew books including a reimagined Old Testament. Long story short, drop the Old Testament, gospels to include Matthew and gnostic gospel of Thomas, get rid of all of Roman citizen Paul and dump revelations a coded complaint against Romanism. There you go.
Wanna know who someone really is? Ask them what they read on a regular basis, instead of guessing what "Real Religion" is and wasting your time trying to figure it out. Just go out in public, ask people what they consume daily. Intent without personal responsibility makes you just as guilty when the so-called extremists continually get away with the things they do.
As an atheist, I wish all Christians were like you guys. It would be so, so nice. I suspect you would win converts far more easily, too.
there wouldnt be christianity then.
theyre atheists they dont belive jesus is God.
they just believe some of his teachings.
yeah they're interesting, no bigotry and no empty talk but real interest in people... nice but also a bit shocking 😬
I'm sorry but let's have a nuanced discussion. "Socialism" as a defined political movement in much later than Jesus. That is true. But socialism as a concept (society existing for the benefit of all of its members and not being controlled by a wealthy ruling class) is not a new concept. "It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven." Or "My fathers house was meant to be a place of prayer, but you have made it a den of thieves." Jesus was a socialist in the latter sense.
Thank you. I'm sure ppl just pretend to not understand it's the concept, not the title. Pretending is worse.
Jesus was no Socialist. He was a stern authoritarian. The 'hippification' of Jesus is a travesty. The hard fact is, people have a proper place...Jesus was behind this 100%....He admonished people to know their place, and KEEP it...His message had a lot more to do with humility than upward mobility. Your kind cannot accept this because selfishness is your be-all and end-all. Christ had nothing to do with the nonstop narcissism and self-absorption of modern Westerners. Your kind would never be capable of understanding Him or His teachings. You are too immersed in all the modern filth.
@@Anabee3 Maybe we should start calling it Jesusism.
OK, I’m not blown away with the nuance of your comment. Exploring more, we would have to distinguish between socialism as a government system, and “socialism” or jesusism found in the early church. The primary difference between the church and government practicing socialism is that the government has the military and force of law behind it to ruin peoples lives so don’t conform. The church does not have this power, but on voluntary action. Governmental socialism and inherently higher risk of drifting towards totalitarianism. I’m sure we could agree.
Salvation is free. Salvation is for all. For by Grace we are saved and not of work; lest that any man should boast. Not only was he a socialist; he was considered a liberal. He went against the social and political norms of his day. Funny how we now trying to be conservative and follow him.
Thank you for your commitment to truth, freedom and justice for all. ❤
You aren't making that up, as an older woman who is a registered independent. I have noticed this movement getting stronger and more violent. Giving the rise to militias who love nothing more then being violent. I am very concerned and i pray for all of us.
22:49 Yes, we need to vote 💙 and then help these people reenter the political discourse in a respectful way on both sides
If the definition of being "evangelical" in any religious context is to seize political, social and cultural power in order to impose beliefs and control on others by force, demonizing and devaluing those who won't conform, then this is nothing less than abusive and extreme religious bigotry. I don't believe for a second that this is what Jesus had in mind, or demonstrated. Excellent discussion!
Exactly. The Christian Nationalists are NOT Christians.
I'm a born again spirit filled Christian and I believe true believers AND followers of the Lord Jesus Christ need to live out everything Jesus taught I The Beatitudes and the Sermon on the Mount.
Christian Nationalists along with their anti-christ spirit leader Trump are the antithesis of everything found in those Beatitudes.
Amen 🙏🏾
when you're raised in a very conservative southern evangelical church they'd teach you how Jesus was a small-state-libertarian who mainly was against taxation - Bill O’Reilly wrote a book about this and he's not the worst fascist in the bunch, many racist preachers will be worse.
I hope we can eventually all come together in love even when we have different views. To follow Christ is to love one another. 🙏🏿💖✝️
It's a sweet sentiment but it won't happen. In Islam, Christ is seen as a prophet and not a deity. Hinduism is all over, to some he's a guru, to some he's his own God, to some he's the divine descent and linked to Brahman.
I, unfortunately, don't ever see us coming together in love as long as there is religion. When you introduce God's or ideas such as heaven and hell, there's always going to be someone who thinks THEIR version of that is the right one and everyone else is wrong.
Until we can transcend that, I don't really believe we'll ever be able to fully come together. But what do I know I'm one guy on the internet lol
@@kyleyoung8476 Yeah...because telling people that they're just mammals competing for resources....that's SURE to bring about boatloads of peace and love!!!
There is a mindset focused on individualism and one that embraces wider community. Abortion is one example. The pro life lobby keep it individual, she. is to blame, she is a murderer she must be stopped. Yet also lobby against the very things proven to massively reduce the requests for abortion - those are systemic matters, a society level response. Good sex ed and exploring matters about consent; access to birth control (many unplanned pregnancies are in fsmies that can't afford another mouth to feed). Health care that won't bankrupt parents if the fetus diagnosed with major medical needs, affecting one part of the considerations those parents face. Not to mention how much even birth care costs in the US.
But rather than ask how can we at a society level reduce abortions; the individualism makes it a war against individual women labelled sinners.
I could not agree more. Forced legislation will only send things the opposite direction as we are already seeing. We won't see a drop in abortions by banning them, we will just see a drop in safe abortions. The better way is through support and education as you've said. This isn't a theory. There is data out there to validate it.
@@helenr4300 Exactly. Every abortion started with a man unzipping his pants. After that it's between a woman and her doctor to determine the best course of action. Men, if you can't handle that, keep your pants and your mouth zipped up.
As a prolifer I can respect your comments on this. I think there is a delicate nature to what you are saying. It is one I have had trouble with. I hold that life begins at conception. I do concede that there is and needs to be medical exemptions in life threatening situations. I still wrestle with the medical conditions of the child. Hard part is if I hold to life begins at conception do we then base the worth of that life on the condition of the child.
As a prolifer though I do not want to arrest anyone who has an abortion nor am I saying they are the bad guys. If anything my beef would be the men in that situation. I have found an overwhelming amount abortions are a result of men not having their house in order. To me abortion is not an unforgivable sin. I also hold that the only thing that changes for the baby is where he first takes his breath and open its eyes for the first time it will be in the glory of the Lord as an abortion does not simply delete the life. Jmo I know many will disagree with me on the topic. I do think as prolifers we do need to articulate our stances better and not be hijacked by the radicals on either side.
Oooh mic 🎤 drop. Yes!!
This was awesome. Thank you both.
Thank you for what you are doing. I am not a religious person, and I enjoy your delivery without recruiting to the faith you believe in. Learned a lot just watching a few videos on your channel. For some period of time, I am trying to get different viewpoints on what is going on now days, and how we came to this point in our country. I do believe US on the way to the better future, but how it is happening sometimes when some person is ill for example, things are getting worse before they will be better. And once infection is gone, the organism immune system is becoming stronger. We have a lot of negative emotions, and some of them could be rightful, but not helpful. When organism is sick, it needs calmness to get healthier. My regards and wish you the best.
So well said and hopeful. Thank you. I needed that. 🙏🏾
15:26 that German grandfather story is profound. And highlights the crowd factor and how leaders feed that and do things that the masses would not all have thought or done personally (though some of rank and file would agree with).
I don't think that all of the religious right, the nationalists, maga etc are bad people, but they have always been fed one story of what is important and who is to blame. But yes once away from the set rhetoric people want people to flourish.
Thank you, this is such an important message! Moral character, honor & conduct matter in our elected leaders. Proud Texan, conservative Christian and patriot putting Country over a Republican party that has lost its moral compass - voting ALL BLUE. ✝️🇺🇸🧢🧢🧢
We will not bear good fruit in our country with a convicted felon.
I choose Country over a fallen party. ✝️🇺🇸🧢🧢🧢 United we stand!
I want to, but im so scared trump will be right about there being a third world war with kanala in office.
@@erinnmackie3507 Trump’s own General, Mark Millet, has stated Trump is unfit for office and more than 741 National Security Leaders have signed a letter stating Trump is unfit for office and a threat to our national security, this includes top Republicans. I’m going with the military and national security experts.
@@acpote as a pagan, please do not be demeaning towards others, even if they are Christian.
Did I hear you correctly? Did you just refer to yourself as a conservative Christian? Are you aware that Christian women are rotting away in prison RIGHT NOW for praying at abortion clinics...decent men have been dragged away by gun wielding law enforcement right in front of their terrified children for the same 'offense'....outraged fathers have been dragged out of PTA meetings because they objected to their daughters being raped by trannies in the shower room....These actions are taking place on behalf of DEMOCRATS....If you support them, that's your business. But don't come in here calling yourself a Christian....Conservative or otherwise...
@@acpote Remind me again...how many wars did we embark upon under Trump?
WOW! Tremendous interview and perspective. Thank you
Thanks!
Wow! This was impressive.
Jonathan, good to meet you here. God bless and take care.
At 5, in 1957, I attended Sunday School for the first time -- basically knowing nothing about God or Jesus, churches or religions. That church had let my mother know that Divorcees, like her, were NOT welcome in the pews. She was already a Fallen woman, or adultery waiting to happen. Not with their men and boys! And she was an RN -- a career woman -- what a horrible role model for their daughters. And when someone asked, "What about the children?" The elders said, "She divorced her husband and thus voided the marriage. Therefore the children are bastards, and Deuteronomy 23: 2 tells us we are to exclude the bastards from our congregations for 10 generations -- and let the sins of their mothers and fathers be revisited upon them."
One mother of a friend I met in kindergarten, disagreed, and took me to Sunday School anyway -- through Easter.
I had to ask a lot of questions, but that's when I learned about the Elders of the Churches. Dumbed Down Beyond Belief. DDBB.
By their very definitions, the terms "Christian" and "nationalist" are antithetical. One cannot be both.
That is not their definition of themselves. That is the title unethical people gave them to try to take away their rights as American. So much for tolerance of others and their opinions. Freedom for me, but not for thee. These people are truly as wicked as the fascist of Nazi Germany.
@@paulagrant1073the fascists are clearly the ones who want the Christian dictatorship with Trump as their leader. Nobody believes the nonsense right wing persecution complex. It's 1933 all over again.
Putin has been PUT IN charge of his own Christian Nationalist Beast -- Daniel 7: 5 -- Arise, devour much flesh.
Project 2025 wants to be the Rod of Iron that forces men and women to obey God. ALL the Prophets on Christian TV -- and all the faith-healers and prosperity preachers, too, are FAKE EWES -- ravening wolves, dressed better than the sheep they fleece. 100's of millions of Christians, worldwide, deceived. Matthew 24: 24. So MANY so Horribly taught.
👏
My mother is also from Mount Airy, NC and I grew up in Pilot Mountain, which is called “Mount Pilot” on The Andy Griffith Show. Knowing those towns I imagine that my “people” and his “people” were fairly well acquainted back in the day.
good message gets to the root of the evils of nationalism and wanting to have power in this world
I’m learning about what people are calling flow. It occurred to me whenever the Bible talks about people influenced by the Holy Spirit, these are examples of flow. Creative, discerning truth, passionate and caring.
I am astounded that , in the comments, people are carrying on a little battle of Bible verses. The word Christian , I believe, means one who follows the teachings of Jesus Christ. Evangelical beliefs, I understand, means that one is ‘saved’. Once ‘saved’ one’s place in heaven is assured. Whereas the Christian who follows those teachings and honor the directives to , ‘love thy neighbor; feed the hungry; care for one another’ actually do the work and actions to fulfill these directives do not fit in the Evangelical movement. The words of Jesus are clear. When asked who Is my neighbor , answered , ‘everyone’. That means Jews, Muslims,Hindus, people of every, repeat, every ilk. Seems self explanatory. He also stated that God’s kingdom is NOT of this world. Christian Nationalism is advocacy for that kingdom to actually be of this world , literally of this nation in this world. Just a thought.
Great pod Tim!
What I love about you as an interviewer is that you know how to ask a question and then stand back and let folks have the floor uninterrupted. Very rare these days. My thought about this "aberration" take on the negative forms of Christianity to which you are referring: it was only about 150-200 years after Jesus's death that Tertullian said it was OK to kill people who would not convert. And even closer to Jesus's life was Paul who told women to shut up and sit down. So I think the strain of authoritarianism, misogyny etc. run very deep and long. Better to say different "versions" of the faith rather than acting as if there was some "pure form" at the outset. The scholars I follow say that the opposite is true. In the beginning there were many, many Christianities. It's Paul who starts the homogenization trend and, of course, Constantine who finalizes it. And the Protestant "reformation" actually reintroduces brutal and more vicious forms than ever. (Protestants burned more witches, for instance than Catholics who tended to burn "heretics.") Christianity has and always has had many takes. It's up to you to follow the most humane, loving, inclusive, non-violent form you can find or make.
I have always functioned under the understanding that while there is and was only 1 Jesus, he had 12 disciples which he sent out across the earth to preach His word to the people. 12 people who were all present for his sermons, but in translation to their preaching heard 12 different meanings of what Jesus meant. It's how I got my mom to stop trying to get me to convert back to Catholicism.
The book The Explosive Child by Ross Greene talks about seeing children and by extension people of any age as instead of saying people do well if they want to, he changes the expression to people do well if they can. What he means is we have skills that help us do well that, if they are not learned well, we turn to explosive outbursts or we implode because we can’t achieve tasks we want to do. It’s worth reading, for Christians. It de-emphasizes punishment and focuses on building these skills.
Very informative ‼️‼️‼️
Personal comment of Laura Botten: I like how Scotland History Tours put it in a video about Scottish slavery. "The colour of slavery isn't black or white, it's green." The only difference between indentured servitude and slavery is the contractual "end date". You better believe that slaves were tricked out of that end date continuously. Baptism gifts were given to workers when they had a child to "purchase" that child. By law giving someone as little as a pair of shoes was a contract of purchasing their loyalty and labour. If that child ran away, the parents were responsible for the lost labour. Even when coalminers were given the right to choose to come and go from employment, it took a further 10 years for the current slaves to be given freedom. The Scots invented public schooling so the average person could learn to read the Bible for themselves. Every area was required to have a public school and children had to attend, except coalmine towns. Puts a wee bit of a different spin on "I'm proud to be a coalminer's daughter" doesn't it? The colour of slavery is green greed!
Awesome... I'm from Ky and so often those in the mountains are overlooked. But our Democratic Gov won in many Counties the last time because he helped them during the flood. Andy Beshear...I live in Central Ky and it is discouraging when 2/3 of my county couldn't even vote for him, let alone Always red. So Poor white population is overlooked. They were wise enough to know the Gov Beshear a Democrat. Showed them real neighbor love.. Praise God
I agree with a lot of your stand points the only one I do not understand is why is it so wrong to both support Israel and Palestine the people. I was raised in the evangelical fundamentalist charismatic word of faith/prosperity gospel movement/churches that’s where I came to the Christ. My whole testimony is crazy because it’s still going on. But FYI about 11 years ago I accepted my sexuality as bisexuality and I still to this day I’m openly proud bisexual progressive Christian. It’s kind of weird for me now to call myself and consider myself a progressive Christian. Literally the type of progressive Christians that I’ve been watching before it seemed like they weren’t even following Christ at all and are bringing him up at all. But I now know it’s not just what you say it’s what you do as well those are your fruits. I go to a moderate conservative church that doesn’t 100% openly go against homosexuality and all forms but officially says on their website which nobody barely goes there that they are for traditional man and woman marriage. But at the same time they allow me that is openly bisexual and a strong believer in Christ to volunteer and help produce content for them on their website. My main gripe right now is I do not understand why progressives have to only be for the Palestinians. I personally and four is real getting back there hostages that were taken and taking down Hamas. On the other hand I’m also against how they are doing it personally. I am very much for the Palestinian people I really believe we should give them aid and or get them out of that country. What I have noticed in my own research of videos and such is that a lot of the countries that say they support the Palestinians will not allow the Palestinians to go to their country to flee the war. I’m not all saying I understand 100% the conflict it is very mixed with both historical social religious and political entanglements. I am definitely for the Israel people the Jewish people I’m definitely for the Palestinians both the Muslims Christians and etc. But I do not understand why we have to pick one over the other and I know technically that is what our countries doing I do think we should do stuff differently within that conflict. But I’m not one of those people that are just supporting Israel or Palestine. I really pray that God can touch each one of their hearts and help change their mindset. I don’t have money to donate to any of these causes all I can do is share videos pray and of course vote.
so what you are saying is that you are also bi -political . 👍🏻🙃
Just a heads up. Hartgrove's definition of idolatry, "a collective projection of the power that we want to be in control so we don't have to be afraid" can apply just as easily to how many people (Tim included) view Harris in this upcoming election.
As a trans person I see conservatives as a existential threat to my very life and progressive faith.
You’re probably interpreting conviction as a threat
@@johnsmith-ti9yz, maybe you’re confusing conviction with gaslighting???
And you also have song " chosen one" someone wrote about him
Socialism may not have existed back when but it was born out of Christian faith. In UK the Labour Party was said to have many of its roots in working class Methodism (training to preach equipping the public speaking skills of the early unions etc). They saw a need for social justice, rather than the poor begging a rich philanthropist and competing to be the worthy one to get the handout.
Communism is totally different in that it sought to overturn all the elites and made people units, who could be deployed to tasks equally, not individuals with different skills and strengths.
Then there is unchecked capitalism where those that start with more get more and without legal protections would exploit workers into the ground in hours, lack of safety, lowest possible pay etc.
Any thing that involves the society (via govt) supporting the population is socialist thinking. Like police funding, fire services (in past they were private and only came to fires that on their list of the insured properties) education....
Different countries have a different view and culture about what areas the wider society should support and help the population
I have said before that Christ is a socialist. I must say that Christ probably has His own system, but if he would favor a political system, he would pick socialism. I've been to socialist countries. They take care of their people. Free healthcare, free education. No homeless.
TOO LITTLE, TOO LATE.
yes they need to pray for wisdom as these double-minded nationalists and humble themselves to accept Christ and pray that all come to Christ for we do not serve the God of this world
I love Otis!!
I think something that I'm very frustrated by in these kind of conversations is that "Republicans and Christians who vote for republicans/Trump are idolitrous" and then there seems to be no acknowledgement of that same kind of radical/idolitrous mentality from democrat politicians and some of the people who vote for them. Don't get me wrong, I very much dispise the deification and conflation of Trunp with Christ. It is a grievous sin and is in fact idolitry and should be called out and cut out of the body of Christ (so seriously, thank you for that). But it feels like this kind of discourse doesn't make room for people who are genuinely trying to faithfully follow Christ and love and serve their neighbors, but disagree on how we are to practically do that. People who say, "I don't hate people of a different race/lgbtq+ people. I want them to lead fulfilled lives and see them succeed. I just don't think that loving those people lines up with the prescriptions set out by the democratic party."
Genuine questions:
1. If you have a problem with the militant (radical) Right (which I think we absolutely should) and see them as a threat to democracy, do you also have a problem with and think that the militant (radical) Left presents the same issue?
2. Do you think that a faithful Christian who (like yourself) desires for all people to be cared for and lifted up, and vote for Trump? And then why or why not?
Hopefully nothing comes off as antagonistic or backhanded, even though we disagree on a lot and I sometimes get frustrated, I'm genuinely thankful for what you are doinng and for introducing new perspectives and ways of thinking. It's been helpful to confront and really think through my faith and how I live as a response. So seriously thank you.
1. As far as a radical left exists in America, it has a minute place in mainstream Democratic politics. The same cannot be said for the radical right- Trump has mainstreamed it into the entire GOP by demanding ultimate control and loyalty. So while I would be fine condemning harmful radical ideas on the left, you’re making a false equivalency.
2. I am not in the business of judging/sorting who is the “in-group” and “out-group” within Christianity. I do tend to think that a vote for Trump stems from some combination of fear, ignorance, hate, and/or greed. And those are not typically the attributes that people recognize in the stories about Jesus.
Do you have an example of a radical leftist in American politics?
Jesus was a Jew who said he was God.
I GUESS JESUS IS AN INDEPENDENT HAVE A NICE DAY GOD BLESS AMERICA LET FREEDOM RING PLEASE VOTE BLUE
If you really want to look at the most correct form of government in history... study the reign of Solomon...
Robbie P. Jones's work on political violence seems quite biased/willfully blind in my review.
There is indeed a rising population in the US that believe that political violence may be necessary, but that population is definitely not predominantly within Christian Evangelical groups. A recent study reported in the Guardian stated that two of the top issues that respondents indicated would justify political violence are "protecting the voting rights of Black Americans and other minorities," "Restore the Federal Right to Abortion," and "Prevent Donald Trump from Becoming President." Each of these issues saw nearly twice the support of political violence as other issues such as "Prevent the Prosecution of Trump."
I find that many, including Jones, whistle past the rising tide of political violence being employed by the political left because it doesn't fit their perceived narrative. One can look no further than the attacks on crisis pregnancy centers and pro-life organizations in the wake of the Dobbs decision. The moment one hears of violence at a Planned Parenthood, it is immediately national news that consumes the airwaves for weeks. Most people don't even know that crisis pregnancy centers and pro-life organizations were firebombed in the wake of Dobbs.
It may have to do with the fact that Planned Parenthood is one of the largest funders of certain politicians while crisis pregnancy centers have very little, if any, political lobbying power.
Sorry, I hit the send button before I was through commenting. Please examine your heart because I get the feeling that your reason for this channel is not something that furthers God's kingdom.
Please pronounce Kamala's name right. The emphasis is on the Ka. To mispronounce it shows the same disrespect as when MAGAs do that on purpose. It's a small thing, but a really big thing.
wow. christrump... it is scary that someone could earnestly produce that book.
Thinking killing babies and disfigured young children is not Christian
want to respond to the comments here. I wish every single person who calls themself a christian, would really study the Word of God from Genesis to Revelation. If you studied yourself, alone with G-d and not listen to your pastors, teachers you would know the following. The book of Acts makes it clear that the JEWS were teaching the pagans about G-d/Yeshua the Messiah. The non Jews were pagans, had never heard of the true G-d nor had ever read the scriptures, meaning Genesis, Prophets, and Writings. There was no written Gospels or Letters which were considered scripture. James said at the Council in Jerusalem in Acts 15, every Shabbat, Friday sunset to Saturday sunset, the pagans who wanted to convert to the True Holy G-d of Israel and accept the Jewish Messiah, Yeshua, would come to the synagogue and hear MOSES AND THE TORAH, so that they could begin to understand how to walk in G-d's commandments and honor Him. After the apostles died off, a new religion began, called christianity. It was led by gentiles, and eventually Roman Catholic Popes, who destroyed the Torah and all that G-d gave to the Jews to share with the world. Yeshua, the Jewish Messiah who always obeyed Torah and taught for His sheep to do the same, became a gentile Jesus who disobeyed Torah and told others to do the same. if you follow what the Popes dictated, rather than the Word of G-d in the Torah and Prophets and Writings, you have been deceived. Return to the Truth.
Jesus is one of the greatest Hebrew rabbis ever. Any true follower would not acknowledge Constantine’s Roman Empire collected Hebrew books including a reimagined Old Testament.
Long story short, drop the Old Testament, gospels to include Matthew and gnostic gospel of Thomas, get rid of all of Roman citizen Paul and dump revelations a coded complaint against Romanism. There you go.
let your guest talk...............
My best friend is in Galax, VA
Wanna know who someone really is?
Ask them what they read on a regular basis, instead of guessing what "Real Religion" is and wasting your time trying to figure it out. Just go out in public, ask people what they consume daily. Intent without personal responsibility makes you just as guilty when the so-called extremists continually get away with the things they do.
That's really smart. I might make that a date question.
,la
You have to have Christian values to be Christian. Evangelicos are not Christian
That’s a broad brush brother
Thanks!