There are a few areas on the boat where I absolutely refuse to compromise or try to economize. Sea cocks are one of them, I bite the bullet and buy silicon bronze fittings for all. Engine maintenance, life vests, rigging, and very oversized and extra bilge pumps, are some others. Basically anything that could cost me my boat or a life. I even keep two bungs at every through hull, one to replace the first if it should somehow fail. What can I say, spent to much time in the US Navy on damage control teams. Great video on a vital subject, please keep them coming!
Hi Bob, that seems to be an excellent approach to us. We have had people laugh at the badly damaged spray-hood on our new boat. We are concentrating on the safety critical things first and we will work our way down the priority list as the years progress. I wonder how many boats there are out there with shiny new expensive spray-hoods, but are at risk of sinking due to dezincified seacocks... Thank you for your contribution and fair winds! Chris 👍
The sad thing is that builders such as Bavaria who sell million dollar sailboats feel the need to cut corners on the one item that could be the most catastrophic. It boggles the mind and makes me thing these builders have re-organized to have nit wit bean counters running their companies rather than experienced boar builders.
It happened to me!! On purchasing the boat I thought it was overkill the previous owner had so many wooden bungs placed in the boat. I don’t now. I was in a mooring field, by myself, cleaning the cupboard in the head when a ferry came through causing a wake. I overbalanced and caught hold of the large toilet seacock and it snapped at the hull. The boat was still rocking so every time it went down the swell water rushed in. Found the bung, thank you ex owner, tapped it in, rang the marina. Motored for 2 hours, hauled out, great ending to my tale. The brass fitting had only 1 ml of brass left on the outer rim. The rest looked like soft wet cardboard. All seacocks being replaced in 2 weeks!!
Hi Janet, thank you for sharing your experience. No doubt this was quite a shock. Hopefully this video will get seen by lots of people so that they can avoid what can be a very dangerous situation. We will have some seacock replacement videos coming soon... Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Very informative! I have eliminated every through hull on our boat, except for the cockpit and deck drains which empty above the waterline. We use a composting head, and an outboard motor, so none needed! Great feeling of peace of mind now, much less worries as the boat is kept on a mooring for the season.
It should be noted that stuffing boxes are considered a thru-hull fitting and are also a common point of failure. This is something I have never seen mentioned when people talk about thru-hull fitting failure. I religiously check all seacocks and skin fittings every week and replace them every three years regardless of how they look. It is reassuring, from a safety standpoint, that 70% of boats find their way to Davy Jones' Locker while unattended at a dock. A well designed and maintained boat rarely ever sinks unless it happens to hit, or be hit by something.
Hi Jacobus, it's great to hear that you are so diligent with your through-hulls. It certainly sounds like you will never have a problem with yours! I absolutely agree about the stuffing boxes. Also the cockpit drains can (and do) sink boats. I didn't cover these points in this video but they are also areas where boat owners should pay attention. Fair winds! Chris (plus Rossella & Emma 😊)👍
It is easy for me to diligent about the through-hulls because I have so few and they are relatively small. It is one of the good points of having a small sailboat. Maybe you should make a video about all the creative ways people sink their boats. Everybody seems overly concerned about hitting a shipping container or reef while in reality it will probably be a handful of leaves in a cockpit drain that sink them. I have spent a good bit of my life living in marinas and have saved dozens of boats from sinking during that time. Slow leak from a stuffing box, marine life or garbage plugging cockpit drains, broken dock lines resulting in boat being trapped under dock during rising tide, etc. etc... Almost all could be prevented by proper maintenance.
That was my sailboat at the end. It was no accidental sinking, I just needed to replace a bulb in a spreader light and thought rather then climbing the mast I’d sink the boat till I could reach the light from the dingy!
That's not how you do it ,silly. You drive over to the bridge and paddle real quick to shore and run up on the bridge and lean over and put it on. See?
🔔 SUBSCRIBE ➜ bit.ly/Subscribe⛵ Share your dodgy through-hull assembly stories below! (Read the comments, there are lots of them!!) Get more from us on Patreon ➜ patreon.com/sailingbritaly Hire Chris for videocall technical assistance ➜ sailingbritaly.com/videocalls Fair winds, Chris, Rossella & Emma 😁
I would love to be able to help support your channel. Unfortunately I decided at an early age that I never wanted to be rich and so far I have been doing pretty good. I started out my voyage with practically nothing and have most of it left. My family sends me a 120 liter box of supplies every three months that unfortunately does not contain cash. I would however like to thank you, Rossella and Emma for making sailing videos that are about sailing instead of bikinis and beer.
Hi Jacobus, that's no problem at all! We love all our viewers and without each and every one of you we would be doing nothing more than uploading files onto a cloud server! Your intelligent and constructive comments add value to our videos and we are very glad to have you come along on this journey with us. Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
I used to donate to a channel that was using Patreon . And believe me I was charged for every video that was uploaded by him . It was costing me a fortune .. it was a farce . No clear clarity no nothing . Very poor on his part imho . Irony is he was getting sponsored by companies to use there products
Hi Colin, we tell our Patrons (at the bottom of our introduction) that they are very welcome to set a limit on their pledges of one video per month. If someone pledges $1 per video and limits their pledge to one video per month then they will never pay more than $1 per month, even if we release 31 videos that month! We actively encourage our Patrons to do this because it gives them clarity for their budgeting. If 10% of our subscribers pledged $1 per month and set a limit of one video per month, we would be free to make videos all through the year, even though the $1 per month per Patron is just a piece of loose change that could just as easily end up down the back of a sofa! It's a shame you didn't enjoy your experience on Patreon because for creators like us it is a huge blessing. In the past month we have put well over 200 hours of work into our channel, yet we have earned less than $70 from TH-cam advertising revenues in that timeframe. For people like us, who have the opportunity to earn very good money doing other jobs (and have a young baby that we continuously struggle to spend time with because we are working so much), Patreon is the platform that keeps us doing what we do. Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Nice summary, and your so right that is the #1 reason for sinking and it most often occurs while no one is onboard. I've seen a few sunk boats, but the scariest thing is being on a boat and finding a seacock that is on the brink of failure; like a seized ball valve, corrosion so bad that it looks very brittle, and my personal favorite - bases that are made of wood or fiber-board that are rotten. I would recommend showing seacocks with triangular bases for the most solid mounting as well as going over the prep and installation of large backing plates made of G10 or handmade with scrap fiberglass and epoxy. I prefer the composite or thermoplastic seacocks only because light weight is important for muti-hulls, plus completely corrosion proof. A big concern with plastic/composite units, but true for any any seacock, is possibly breaking them if they are stepped on or something heavy impacts them. Again, a large flanged based with a backing plate is key, but also proper placement in a safe location and securing anything that could slide into it in heavy weather. Oh yeah, and don't step on it... seriously, not even the bronze ones were designed for that.
Hi there, thank you. We were considering fitting Trudesign seacocks, but they were too bulky to fit in the small space under the galley, hence the DZR Brass we used (Videos later today about this - a loooooong version with all details, and a short version covering our seacock replacement). Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Hi Mark, thank you for your comment. :-) Stay afloat looks pretty good (we've never used it, we've just seen videos) and one of our viewers just brought the Seabung to our attention, which looks fantastic. Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Best practical boatowner vlog so far I have seen and I follow many of them. I just found you recommend by another sailing vlog, sailing parley with hurricane salvage catalagoon 45 located in Panama.
Saw a heads seacock on a bavaria 36 go at the hose tail exactly the same as the one in your video .when we tried to close the ball valve the whole lot snapped off.that made life fun for a few minutes and put an end to a good cruise
Have seen a seacock failure. PNW not far from Desolation Sound we arrived at a small anchorage where a mast top at a 45 degree, maybe 3 meters of, was poking out of water. The sailors had gone on a 3 hr hike and returned to find the boat gone. They thought it stolen and had dingyed off to report it so. High tide had hidden it from them. We radioed a report to Coast Guard as low tide had revealed it to us. They were thrilled to have the news of a sunken rather than stolen sv and set about getting her raised and repaired. It was a seacock failure and the salvage crew told them it likely went down in under 1 hr. Since then any sv I've travelled on gets a particularly close through hull inspection inside & out regardless how cold the water. Thx 4 channel
Exactly what happened to me 2 days ago... was cleaning around big seacock of the sink, basically bumped it and it broke in half...BELOW valve 😢 was a helluva battle to stop the water and not sink the boat, as I was alone.... got it sorted tho. TIP!! Keep these cone shaped wooden thingies CLOSE to the seacocks... trying to find them almost cost me my boat... Great video..thanks 👍🏼 😂
Chris, great vid. Very informative. I agree about having quality thru-hulls and seacocks is paramount on a boat. I’m going to look at replacing/upgrading my skin-fittings/thru-hulls and seacocks this year. I’m looking at Marelon. It’s not just plastic, it is made with modern composites with carbon fiber and mold injected polymers. Marelon provides strength, light weight and is an internationally approved underwater system which provides years of trouble free, corrosion free and electrolysis free use. I believe it meets and exceeds all Marine U.L., ABYC and ISO standards. Marelon can be a great alternative to Bronze and/or DZR brass. Just an idea.
Hi Chris, thank you! As per my other comment I am aware of Marelon valves (Forespar) but I have heard of the handles snapping off (with occasionally a resultant leak from the spindle and an expensive haulout to rectify). If I was to fit composite I would go for Trudesign. I have heard of zero failures with these. Of course this is just my opinion based on my own research but please do your own before deciding. Fair winds, Chris 👍
Hi Dan, congratulations on your purchase, the Tartan 37 is a beautiful boat! We're glad you find these technical videos useful and you are very welcome. Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 🙂
Excellent and important advice...I have only ever seen a sea cock fail once (I generally sail the on the great lakes). We were able to save the boat before it completely sunk but it is remarkable how much water flows through one of those openings. Thank you for this video :)
Hi Jeffrey, thank you for your feedback on the video, and for sharing your experience of a seacock failure. I'm sure the old heartbeat would be going just as fast as the bilge pump... Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
It was someone else's boat and I was just helping - but it filled crazy fast until we found the faulty sea cock and plugged it - If the boat wasn't in shallow water, ti would have been gone.
Sobering stuff Jeffrey, I'm glad it ended well. We have just heard about the Seabung www.seabung.com from another viewer's comment. Looks like a very clever product. Cheers, Chris 👍
Brilliant tip there, I'm slowly learning everything I need to know before I do finally get my first boat, Thanks to you of course :) The outtakes are a brilliant idea, so funny to watch, you should put them in all of your videos :)
Thank you Garreth, I'm glad you are enjoying the videos and that they are informative too. There's a lot to learn about owning a boat, but if you keep learning as you are then there's no reason why you can't tackle any of the jobs yourself on the whatever boat you eventually buy. We do put outtakes in when we can, so we'll have some more for you in the future! Fair winds, Chris 👍
@@SailingBritaly I think I'll definitely need your expert advice as someone who knows what they're looking at before I buy my first boat, and maybe some sailing lessons too haha 👍😊⛵
I'm a fan of getting rid of though-hull assemblies, we did the same durinhg our DIY Seacock replacement job: th-cam.com/video/9bV1rqqvw-k/w-d-xo.html Cheers, Chris 👍
Using modern plastic valves (so cheap they can be replaced every two years if they start to get crusted up with sea animal growth in the inside - say £10-£25 each as at 2021) or use stainless steel (as long as it's the right Marine Grade) are also good options. And have as few through - hull fittings as possible.
Hi Tom, that's extremely kind of you to say. I think my fuse is a bit short for me to be a teacher... 07:05 😂 I'll give Emma a kiss for you. Cheers, Chris 😊
I had 1 snap on me when trying to remove the hose to my sea water intake for my engine. Luckily the boat was on land in the boat yard. This was 2 years ago and I repaired it straight away, I didn't do the others as they seemed OK. Problem is it has always worried me since then, my boat is coming out for antifouling and anodes this week for a whole month. So I'm going to change all mine so I know they are done.
Good call Lee, good luck with the job and check out our videos on DIY through-hull replacement (I recommend the long one for the extra info you may find useful). Cheers, Chris 👍
Thank you Chris for this video, it was really informative. After I post this comment I will be composing an email to ask the guys who recently replace our through hulls which material was used.
Hi Barry & Aannsha, thank you! If you can, try to find out the exact models fitted. There are bronze seacocks out there with standard brass balls and spindles so it's a bit of a minefield for consumers. Fair winds, Chris 👍
Hi Paul, thank you! That's a very 'how long is a bit of string'-esque question... The very best seacocks might last 30 years or more in the absence of any external influence such as stray currents. On the other hand, brass seacocks in my mind should never be fitted in the first place but if they have been then I'd say when they are 5 years old they would need replacing regardless of how good they look externally... Just my personal opinion though! Cheers, Chris 👍
Happend to me, had a 28' plywood yacht (A Daydream for Aus readers, built in a technical college in New Guinea). Went to close off one of the toilet sea cocks and the whole thing came apart in my hand, water rushed in so I plugged it with a rag, then some wood then filled the hole with some underwater Araldite then waited for the tide so I could careen it for a proper fix. Also suspect you might have to be careful where you buy them, lots of Chinese stuff pretending to be quality UK/Euro/US bits and pieces. Like some magnetic 316 Stainless I bought for a project on my trailer sailer a few years ago.
great video! I was wondering why not use stainless steel? other question is is there any boat that doesn't have any thruhole, I mean to have another system like a outboard that you lower the tubes or lift them when not in use and holding tanks inside the boat until you deploy the tubes ("system")
Hi Ant & Cid, Trudesign have an impeccable reputation and we were tempted to fit those. On our boat we didn't have the room to fit Trudesign under our galley as there is not enough clearance, so we went DZR with all of them. Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Not a total failure, but my dad had one on his boat start leaking when it was launched one spring. Hauled back out, had it replaced with a more modern ball valve.
I will soon be purchasing a sailing vessel as a liveabord and your videos are extremely useful. I am especially grateful for your attention to detail. I am curious about the two units atop the forward cabin. Are they fans? If so how is water entry mitigated?
Hi Jim, Rossella and I were boat dealers in a previous life. We learnt a lot about negotiating when buying used boats. We sold our previous boat for more than we paid for her after using her for 4 years and we negotiated the price of Britaly down by £8,000 by writing a 3-page PDF document listing all the defects on the boat, without having seen her (after very carefully studying the photographs online). We ended up getting our Bavaria 350 at aproximately 50% of the price of others from the same period, without having to pay a surveyer (we've never had a survey on any boat we have bought). If you are interested in drawing from our experience and having us work for you one-to-one when you come to buy a boat, contact us on Patreon. I guess you mean the vents on above the head on our previous boat, VinceRo. These were two stainless steel dome vents, one just a trickle-flow vent which also allowed light to enter, and the other one which had an extractor fan fitted. Their internal construction prevented water ingress. It's easier to see it, rather than explain it: www.aliexpress.com/item/Marine-Stainless-Steel-Deck-Ventilator-Cover-Boat-Yacht-Dome-Vent-Cover-Caravan-Exhaust-Fan-Cover/32833040638.html (This is not an endorsement of that product, it is just the first one I found in a google image search which shows the internal construction of the vents). Best regards, Chris
The solution to the #1 cause of sailboat sinking-don't have any through-hull fittings in a boat. It reminds me of the story about a guy who goes to his doctor and complains that every time he hits his head with a hammer his head hurts. My 30' catamaran has no through-hull fittings-and incidentally, no bilge pump. It's been in the sea almost constantly for nearly 50 years, sailed across the Atlantic, and many thousands of miles. Furthermore, the eye of hurricane Irma passed over my cat last year without any significant damage. Although two hatch covers blew off (I forgot to lock them down) as the 140+ mph winds passed over, it only had one inch of water in the bilge (which I mopped up in less than an hour). The mast and boom stood strong, and the mainsail remained on the boom. They just don't make sailboats today as robust as they used to long ago. I saw many modern sailboats sink that were many miles away from the brunt of the record-breaking hurricane Irma. In the Florida Keys where I live, the #1 cause of sailboat sinking is hurricanes, not through-hull fittings. More than a thousand boats sank last year in the Keys, due to hurricane Irma.
Thanks enjoyed never had a through hull fail and dont want to🤞have removed my speed log a good few times to clean and the amount of water that comes in on the few seconds it takes to put the cap on is scary. Good advice with the wooden bungs have them on my boat tied off to the through hull last owner had put ptfe tape round them, dont think it will make much difference when i am banging them in anger.
Thanks Al, with a 1.5 inch fitting it wouldn't take long for the water in the boat to rise to such a level that it would no longer be easy to determine where it was coming from. Quite a sobering thought really. As you can see from the comments, this is a common problem so lets hope we can raise awareness about dezincification. Cheers, Chris 👍
I had a sink seacock open during a knockdown and the water rushed in with incredible force. Thankfully the sailboat righted itself fairly quickly but it was a vivid reminder to close all unnecessary seacocks.
I want to give my twopence, hoping it will be useful to other people, Two years ago I took my boat to a boatyard for the usual cleaning of the hull. The boss there told me: look your sea-cocks are very old and in bad conditions, it's better to change them. I said OK but I want them by bronze and not by brass as most boatyards use. I could not find them in the shipchandlers in my area so I resorted to internet. Found a shop who had them for twice the price of the brass ones. After just one month I noticed that the seacock of the engine cooling system was all green outside, being in the bilge which had collected sea water and so stayed submerged for a while... I made a photo of it and sent it to a good marine surveyor. He said that it couldn't be of good quality marine bronze. His opinion was that it was a seacock produced in China and commercialized with an Italian brand... I complained with the seller but he never replied... now after two years all the seacocks I can have a look at are completely green outside, so it means they are oxidized. I can only imagine how they can be inside.... they should have lasted at least 8-10 years... So how can we know whether the product we buy is of good quality?
Hi there, thank you for sharing your experience. It is very difficult for consumers. I had to spend a LOT of time digging around to find good components to install on our boat. Many sellers don't have the technical knowledge to provide the information that an informed consumer needs to be able to purchase these vitally important items. Here is a datasheet for our ball valves. media1.svb-media.de/media/snr/500981/pdf/datasheet_2016-11-24_15-39-03_14d6fbc4383edc31fc981e471f325d33.pdf (We did not buy from this supplier, but this is the exact valve we bought) According to this datasheet, all of the component parts of our ball valves are made from corrosion / dezincification-resistant materials. Not only is the body DZR brass, but the ball is made from chrome plated DZR brass. The valve stem is also made from DZR brass, and the handle and retaining nut are stainless steel. There are bronze seacocks out there (which consumers might think are the best) with normal yellow brass balls and valve stems, which can then fail due to dezincification... It can be something of a lottery unless you spend a lot of time digging around for information. It's crazy that we have to waste time doing this, but it appears that it is necessary to avoid problems. Buon Vento! Chris 👍
Good advice Chris - thanks. I used to maintain Yachts used by the Royal Marines at Plymouth and every one of their boats had soft wooden conical bungs attached by chord to every 'through Hull fitting' inside each relevant locker. I think its general 'Royal Navy' practice. So in the event of failure, a bung of the correct diameter was immediately to hand.....thay is, always assuming someone's 'on-board' at the time.
I wasn't aware that this was standard Royal Navy practice but it certainly makes sense. There is a lot of experience behind all their procedures! Fair winds, Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Actually I would have thought misuse of heads was the greatest causal factor, kinda the same thing in a way though One of Zaya'a skin fittings came off in my hand while removing the hose during the post land transport refit. I had actually thought about sailing her the 1500 miles down the coast but opted to have her trucked due to seaworthiness worries that couldnt be repaired in a short time I knew the valve looked bad, [not that it mattered I was changing all of them] and we were up on the slip but wow it can be a bit of a shock Especially considering the VHF didnt work, the bilge pump had 2 complete breaks in the exit line, the battery was only loosely connected, and the fuel tank cracked open ditching 10 or so gallons of diesel into the bilge.
Hi there. This happens very frequently and can have dire consequences without some level-headed quick thinking (which is much easier to achieve when sitting at a computer than it is when you're at sea on a boat which is sinking!). We're glad Zaya has had these essential systems upgraded by you. Fair winds, Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Hi guys. What a coincidence. I'll pick up your brains then. I have booked the boat on the slip I have researched greatly and decided to go the coppercoat way. Now I'm realizing longer maintenance intervals will mean I have to check the seacocks to match the potential 10 year plus lifespan of the antofouling. While converting my toilet to a composting head with urine separator, pulling out a hose the stem snapped like it was made out of glass. Good lord it was after the valve but now I got that memory in the back of my head. I researchers bit and I found each bronze seacock in shipped to NZ could cost 450nzd or 300 usd. I researched the CR brass but now I wonder if a grounding problem or stray current will affect them. Can you make a video with your costs and reasoning? Why you pick those ones and where can you find them online? In NZ retail mark up could be up to 300% from the same stuff you can buy online directly. Please help me decide on this subject I don't feel comfortable with. Best regards yo both and your little helper
Hi there, I'm happy to assist you with this. I can't make a video as we already have about a 250 GB backlog of footage to edit, so you'd be waiting a very long time for your answers! I'll do my best to help you out here. I applied a copper-based anti-fouling paint before we launched our last boat and we didn't have it hauled out again for the 4 years that we owned her, (I cleaned the hull wearing a mask and snorkel and we saved an absolute fortune on the extortionate haul-out fees in the Med) so I agree with your train of thought. It's definitely a good time to make sure all your seacocks are going to last many years also. Having the hose tail snap like that is just another demonstration of how widespread this problem is. I thought long and hard about our through-hull assembly replacement job. Here's a bullet-point outline of my thoughts. Bronze: best but too flipping expensive. DZR Brass: just as good as bronze (Properties are virtually identical), good price. Forespar Marelon: handles can snap off (and the stem can leak if this happens), so no. Trudesign: Excellent reputation (I know of no failures), pretty good price, too big to fit space available in galley. Rather than have a mix and match of Trudesign and DZR, I decided to get all DZR. Be aware that you have to dig quite deeply as a consumer to make sure you buy the right gear. I have heard of Bronze seacocks (Groco, for example) having sub-standard stems, made from stainless steel or even yellow brass. SO you might buy a bronze valve thinking you have the best, when in fact the stem might fail prematurely. Here is a datasheet of our DZR ball valves: media1.svb-media.de/media/snr/500981/pdf/datasheet_2016-11-24_15-39-03_14d6fbc4383edc31fc981e471f325d33.pdf As you can see, every part is made from appropriate materials, which will resist dezincification. It takes a lot of time to source the parts you need and then double check that the ones you find meet this kind of stringent scrutiny. I wouldn't worry about grounding/stray current problems when choosing through-hull assemblies as you will always have something metallic in the water, so even if you use composite seacocks & skin fittings you would not eliminate these problems if they were to exist and would have to address them separately... We bought our parts from asap-supplies.com (No affiliation to us). UK based, we have found them to be excellent and they deliver worldwide. An alternative supplier of the same ball valves we bought is svb24.com (No affiliation to us) based in Germany. They also deliver worldwide. I hope this helps! Cheers, Chris 👍(plus Rossella & Emma) 😊
Sailing Britaly. Thanks a lot Chris. I know you are an extremely busy guy so I really appreciated the effort of a very complete answer. Thanks heaps for the links and datasheet. I lost track of all websites I have researched but never got to do a full part scrutiny check. Your advise will be of great use. I'll start the seacock purchases in a couple of weeks. BTW I hope you guys do the south Pacific to NZ in the future. Would be great to share the local knowledge. Regards Josue
Hi Cameron, I presume you mean anodes, but zinc anodes have nothing to do with dezincification on any boat where the through-hull assemblies are not electrically bonded. You can have 100% functioning and working anodes and still have dezincification occur on your through-hull assemblies. Fair winds, Chris
Chris, In one of your previous videos when you replaced a valve that was brass with a plastic valve you replaced the plastic with an aluminum fitting. What happens when you get bimetallic electrolysis. Did you consider this?
Hi Jonathan, the only other valve I have replaced in our videos was the seawater intake valve on our saildrive unit. That was a bronze-bodied gate valve with a plastic spindle and handle. I think these are rubbish (I've had one seize before and there's not much you can do to free them up without risking breaking the spindle), so I replaced it with a DZR ball valve. Bronze and DZR brass are very close together on the galvanic scale, so replacing the original valve with a replacement made from DZR brass had almost no affect on the factory installation. Also, in a galvanic cell between the aluminium alloy saildrive leg and the DZR fitting screwed into it, the aluminium is the anode. Because the wetted area of the saildrive leg is hundreds of times larger than the fitting screwed into it, the rate of any galvanic corrosion in any case would be negligible. I hope this answers your question! Cheers, Chris 👍
The funniest part of sunken and foundered boats is how fast they become an ecosystem especially those oysters and barnacles. Does founder mean the same thing as sink?
Another issue with brass/bronze, or even stainless fittings is that boatyards or owners attempt to protect them by grounding them in a process called 'bonding' and it is often done incorrectly. Bonding is supposed to 'ground' them to protect them from stray current in the water which will rapidly accelerate the de-zincification process (in just weeks!). Bonding is tricky, you can't bond the seacocks to the same ground-bus bar as other mechanized equipment like AC pumps or even the engine itself. If you bond incorrectly in the manner I just mentioned you accomplish the opposite of 'protecting' the seacocks. There are huge arguments about when to bond and when not to bond. I just avoid it all by not using any type of alloy and prefer composite seacocks, lol. I have actually designed a carbon fiber or E-Glass 'cage' to be bonded around a composite seacock to protect it from impact while still allowing full functionality and replacement of hoses/parts/removal etc. Just a concept, haven't put it into practice but I'm sure others have had the same though and given a try.
Hi Mike, it happens all over the world - hence this video! Let's hope we can help raise awareness and make a difference. Fair winds, Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Just to let you guys know we make skin fittings in AB2 bronze the same as your propeller. then with a DZR gate valve, not a ball valve. ball valves have two metals that produce an electric current in sea water and yes they then fail. contact black bear boating on the internet they are made to suit each boat
Hi Peter, not all ball valves are equal. Some use a mix of materials, such as bronze body and brass ball & stem, or bronze body and stainless steel ball & stem. These materials cause problems down the line. Our ball valves have a DZR Brass body, chrome plated DZR Brass ball and a DZR Brass valve stem. These should last an extremely long time. Another advantage of ball valves is that you have a visible indication as to whether the valve is open or closed. Fair winds, Chris 👍
Hi Andy, stainless steel fittings are not a good choice for this application. Stainless steel is corrosion-resistant thanks to a very thin passive film on its surface. This passive film can be destroyed by low oxygen. Seawater has enough dissolved oxygen for this not to be a problem a lot of the time. However, if there are crevices present (Like there would be on a skin fitting/seacock installation) or if the water becomes stagnant for some reason (Like when you close the valve and leave it closed for a prolonged period) the water becomes oxygen-depleted and the passive layer is damaged. Once this occurs you then get a reaction between the passive and non passive areas of the stainless steel (regardless of the alloy, 316 is also susceptible), which is very similar to galvanic corrosion between dissimilar metals, in the sense that there is a minuscule galvanic cell set up within the individual stainless steel component. The resulting corrosion tends to penetrate in a way that is very difficult to spot unless the components are disassembled. I personally wouldn't use stainless steel fittings below the waterline for the above reasons. Cheers, Chris 👍
Has anyone ever plumbed a pipe over the transom down to the bottom of the keel? I'm looking at fiber-glassing a tube into the keel , over the transom and into a saltwater holding tank. All of my seacocks can either pump water in or can pump water out. If my holding tank can pump or siphon seawater in I could have one opening below the waterline. If siphoning is a concern I could put a valve at the top of the transom to provide a vapor break. If I'm off the boat, the only danger I have is if I actively pump water into my boat. That could never happen if I pop one vapor lock valve. I've seen boats with 6 or 7 seacocks all in very difficult locations. The engine is my only concern but it has a pump and that pump can siphon water over the transom by itself. There would be enough water in the holding tank to take the air out of the siphon line. I've never seen this - what am I missing?
HI Tim, that is an innovative solution. Many larger vessels use sea chests: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_chest Which achieve a similar result in a different way. Fair winds! Chris 👍
A sea chest is exactly what I would use but I would not fill it from a through hull below the waterline. I believe I can do this with no openings below water level.
Not a sea-cock story, but almost the same... Guess what is the major cause of flooding in houses? Broken pipes? Freeze burst? Nope... failure of angle-stop valves and supply hoses serving every fixture in your house... H&C water at sinks, toilets, dishwasher, icemaker. Contractors install cheap ones, a way to save a few bucks (cutting corners to make more profit). They corrode and fail from the inside... they look ok to the eye, but when they fail it happens quickly. I have seen over $100,000 US damage from a failed supply hose. Change all now, inspect annually by "exercising" valves.
We had 2 sailboats destroyed this year at my club! One got hit by lightning and the other one got hit by another sailboat whose bow thruster "failed"........ Both really nice boats. One guy had literally taken a month off of work to get his boat ship shape before some A-hole rammed him.......... Anyway yes at another club just last week here on the Chesapeake a seacock (why does that sound dirty?) failed and the guy lost his boat. Other guys at the club were going to haul his boat out for him since he was at work but because he was a big jerk and a general nuisance at the club they let his boat sink in his slip..... Anyway. Great videos keep them coming!
Hi Patrick, thank you very much for sharing your experiences. It sounds like it has been quite an eventful season in your area! Thank you for your words of encouragement, we really appreciate them. Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
DON'T LISTEN TO THIS GUY! 😈I want more,please! Just bought our third sailboat that had been sunk. It's my retirment hobby and diet plan😊! Each one had sunk because of old seacocks. One day this 38'ketch was worth $25k after sinking at the dock the next day $1,800. That's what I paid, Here in Florida. It amazes me. It's like those people that drive around and around a parking lot to get close to the front door the spend hundreds to join a gym to get exercise😨.
![Saildrive Diaphragm Replacement | ⛵ Sailing Britaly ⛵ [Boat Work]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/o_Bv7_tAOY4/mqdefault.jpg)
There are a few areas on the boat where I absolutely refuse to compromise or try to economize. Sea cocks are one of them, I bite the bullet and buy silicon bronze fittings for all. Engine maintenance, life vests, rigging, and very oversized and extra bilge pumps, are some others. Basically anything that could cost me my boat or a life. I even keep two bungs at every through hull, one to replace the first if it should somehow fail. What can I say, spent to much time in the US Navy on damage control teams.
Great video on a vital subject, please keep them coming!
Hi Bob, that seems to be an excellent approach to us. We have had people laugh at the badly damaged spray-hood on our new boat. We are concentrating on the safety critical things first and we will work our way down the priority list as the years progress. I wonder how many boats there are out there with shiny new expensive spray-hoods, but are at risk of sinking due to dezincified seacocks... Thank you for your contribution and fair winds! Chris 👍
The sad thing is that builders such as Bavaria who sell million dollar sailboats feel the need to cut corners on the one item that could be the most catastrophic. It boggles the mind and makes me thing these builders have re-organized to have nit wit bean counters running their companies rather than experienced boar builders.
It happened to me!! On purchasing the boat I thought it was overkill the previous owner had so many wooden bungs placed in the boat. I don’t now. I was in a mooring field, by myself, cleaning the cupboard in the head when a ferry came through causing a wake. I overbalanced and caught hold of the large toilet seacock and it snapped at the hull. The boat was still rocking so every time it went down the swell water rushed in. Found the bung, thank you ex owner, tapped it in, rang the marina. Motored for 2 hours, hauled out, great ending to my tale. The brass fitting had only 1 ml of brass left on the outer rim. The rest looked like soft wet cardboard. All seacocks being replaced in 2 weeks!!
Hi Janet, thank you for sharing your experience. No doubt this was quite a shock. Hopefully this video will get seen by lots of people so that they can avoid what can be a very dangerous situation. We will have some seacock replacement videos coming soon... Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
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Very informative! I have eliminated every through hull on our boat, except for the cockpit and deck drains which empty above the waterline. We use a composting head, and an outboard motor, so none needed! Great feeling of peace of mind now, much less worries as the boat is kept on a mooring for the season.
Elimination is an excellent solution where possible. Good on you! Chris 👍
It should be noted that stuffing boxes are considered a thru-hull fitting and are also a common point of failure. This is something I have never seen mentioned when people talk about thru-hull fitting failure. I religiously check all seacocks and skin fittings every week and replace them every three years regardless of how they look.
It is reassuring, from a safety standpoint, that 70% of boats find their way to Davy Jones' Locker while unattended at a dock. A well designed and maintained boat rarely ever sinks unless it happens to hit, or be hit by something.
Hi Jacobus, it's great to hear that you are so diligent with your through-hulls. It certainly sounds like you will never have a problem with yours! I absolutely agree about the stuffing boxes. Also the cockpit drains can (and do) sink boats. I didn't cover these points in this video but they are also areas where boat owners should pay attention. Fair winds! Chris (plus Rossella & Emma 😊)👍
It is easy for me to diligent about the through-hulls because I have so few and they are relatively small. It is one of the good points of having a small sailboat. Maybe you should make a video about all the creative ways people sink their boats. Everybody seems overly concerned about hitting a shipping container or reef while in reality it will probably be a handful of leaves in a cockpit drain that sink them.
I have spent a good bit of my life living in marinas and have saved dozens of boats from sinking during that time. Slow leak from a stuffing box, marine life or garbage plugging cockpit drains, broken dock lines resulting in boat being trapped under dock during rising tide, etc. etc... Almost all could be prevented by proper maintenance.
That was my sailboat at the end. It was no accidental sinking, I just needed to replace a bulb in a spreader light and thought rather then climbing the mast I’d sink the boat till I could reach the light from the dingy!
What a brilliant idea, I am surprised others haven't thought of it before. 😁
That's not how you do it ,silly. You drive over to the bridge and paddle real quick to shore and run up on the bridge and lean over and put it on. See?
IT"S THE REVELATION!!!!! Now why didn't I think of that? That way, my one set of clean underwear doesn't get all wet...
That my friend is beyond FUNNY! ;P
Great videos, very informative. This is one of my favorite TH-cam channels, liked 👍
That is a brilliant compliment coming from you Paul, thank you. Fair winds, Chris, Rossella & Emma 👍
Good information! Love the out takes!
Thank you Randy!
🔔 SUBSCRIBE ➜ bit.ly/Subscribe⛵ Share your dodgy through-hull assembly stories below! (Read the comments, there are lots of them!!) Get more from us on Patreon ➜ patreon.com/sailingbritaly Hire Chris for videocall technical assistance ➜ sailingbritaly.com/videocalls
Fair winds,
Chris, Rossella & Emma 😁
I would love to be able to help support your channel. Unfortunately I decided at an early age that I never wanted to be rich and so far I have been doing pretty good. I started out my voyage with practically nothing and have most of it left. My family sends me a 120 liter box of supplies every three months that unfortunately does not contain cash. I would however like to thank you, Rossella and Emma for making sailing videos that are about sailing instead of bikinis and beer.
Hi Jacobus, that's no problem at all! We love all our viewers and without each and every one of you we would be doing nothing more than uploading files onto a cloud server! Your intelligent and constructive comments add value to our videos and we are very glad to have you come along on this journey with us. Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
I used to donate to a channel that was using Patreon . And believe me I was charged for every video that was uploaded by him . It was costing me a fortune .. it was a farce . No clear clarity no nothing . Very poor on his part imho . Irony is he was getting sponsored by companies to use there products
Hi Colin, we tell our Patrons (at the bottom of our introduction) that they are very welcome to set a limit on their pledges of one video per month. If someone pledges $1 per video and limits their pledge to one video per month then they will never pay more than $1 per month, even if we release 31 videos that month! We actively encourage our Patrons to do this because it gives them clarity for their budgeting. If 10% of our subscribers pledged $1 per month and set a limit of one video per month, we would be free to make videos all through the year, even though the $1 per month per Patron is just a piece of loose change that could just as easily end up down the back of a sofa! It's a shame you didn't enjoy your experience on Patreon because for creators like us it is a huge blessing. In the past month we have put well over 200 hours of work into our channel, yet we have earned less than $70 from TH-cam advertising revenues in that timeframe. For people like us, who have the opportunity to earn very good money doing other jobs (and have a young baby that we continuously struggle to spend time with because we are working so much), Patreon is the platform that keeps us doing what we do. Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Nice summary, and your so right that is the #1 reason for sinking and it most often occurs while no one is onboard. I've seen a few sunk boats, but the scariest thing is being on a boat and finding a seacock that is on the brink of failure; like a seized ball valve, corrosion so bad that it looks very brittle, and my personal favorite - bases that are made of wood or fiber-board that are rotten. I would recommend showing seacocks with triangular bases for the most solid mounting as well as going over the prep and installation of large backing plates made of G10 or handmade with scrap fiberglass and epoxy. I prefer the composite or thermoplastic seacocks only because light weight is important for muti-hulls, plus completely corrosion proof. A big concern with plastic/composite units, but true for any any seacock, is possibly breaking them if they are stepped on or something heavy impacts them. Again, a large flanged based with a backing plate is key, but also proper placement in a safe location and securing anything that could slide into it in heavy weather. Oh yeah, and don't step on it... seriously, not even the bronze ones were designed for that.
Hi there, thank you. We were considering fitting Trudesign seacocks, but they were too bulky to fit in the small space under the galley, hence the DZR Brass we used (Videos later today about this - a loooooong version with all details, and a short version covering our seacock replacement). Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
I had always read to keep a wax toilet seal aboard to plug holes. Thanks again always learning from Chris
Hi Mark, thank you for your comment. :-) Stay afloat looks pretty good (we've never used it, we've just seen videos) and one of our viewers just brought the Seabung to our attention, which looks fantastic. Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Best practical boatowner vlog so far I have seen and I follow many of them. I just found you recommend by another sailing vlog, sailing parley with hurricane salvage catalagoon 45 located in Panama.
Hi Mike, thank you very much for your kind words and thanks for letting us know how you found us. Welcome aboard! Chris, Rossella & Emma :-)
Congrats on 10k subs, I'm one of them. ⛵
👍👍👍
Saw a heads seacock on a bavaria 36 go at the hose tail exactly the same as the one in your video .when we tried to close the ball valve the whole lot snapped off.that made life fun for a few minutes and put an end to a good cruise
Thanks for sharing Bob! Fair winds, Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Have seen a seacock failure. PNW not far from Desolation Sound we arrived at a small anchorage where a mast top at a 45 degree, maybe 3 meters of, was poking out of water. The sailors had gone on a 3 hr hike and returned to find the boat gone. They thought it stolen and had dingyed off to report it so.
High tide had hidden it from them. We radioed a report to Coast Guard as low tide had revealed it to us.
They were thrilled to have the news of a sunken rather than stolen sv and set about getting her raised and repaired. It was a seacock failure and the salvage crew told them it likely went down in under 1 hr. Since then any sv I've travelled on gets a particularly close through hull inspection inside & out regardless how cold the water.
Thx 4 channel
Exactly what happened to me 2 days ago... was cleaning around big seacock of the sink, basically bumped it and it broke in half...BELOW valve 😢 was a helluva battle to stop the water and not sink the boat, as I was alone.... got it sorted tho.
TIP!! Keep these cone shaped wooden thingies CLOSE to the seacocks... trying to find them almost cost me my boat... Great video..thanks 👍🏼 😂
Thank you for sharing and good luck with the clean up! 👍
Great stuff Chris, many thanks for that - guess I'd better go give my seacocks a good going over!
My pleasure Rich. :-) Cheers, Chris 👍
Chris, great vid. Very informative. I agree about having quality thru-hulls and seacocks is paramount on a boat. I’m going to look at replacing/upgrading my skin-fittings/thru-hulls and seacocks this year. I’m looking at Marelon. It’s not just plastic, it is made with modern composites with carbon fiber and mold injected polymers. Marelon provides strength, light weight and is an internationally approved underwater system which provides years of trouble free, corrosion free and electrolysis free use. I believe it meets and exceeds all Marine U.L., ABYC and ISO standards. Marelon can be a great alternative to Bronze and/or DZR brass. Just an idea.
Hi Chris, thank you! As per my other comment I am aware of Marelon valves (Forespar) but I have heard of the handles snapping off (with occasionally a resultant leak from the spindle and an expensive haulout to rectify). If I was to fit composite I would go for Trudesign. I have heard of zero failures with these. Of course this is just my opinion based on my own research but please do your own before deciding. Fair winds, Chris 👍
Very informative, thanks!
Great information, thank you so much for making this video! I just bought my first boat (Tartan 37) and really appreciate these types of videos!
Hi Dan, congratulations on your purchase, the Tartan 37 is a beautiful boat! We're glad you find these technical videos useful and you are very welcome. Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 🙂
Excellent and important advice...I have only ever seen a sea cock fail once (I generally sail the on the great lakes). We were able to save the boat before it completely sunk but it is remarkable how much water flows through one of those openings. Thank you for this video :)
Hi Jeffrey, thank you for your feedback on the video, and for sharing your experience of a seacock failure. I'm sure the old heartbeat would be going just as fast as the bilge pump... Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
It was someone else's boat and I was just helping - but it filled crazy fast until we found the faulty sea cock and plugged it - If the boat wasn't in shallow water, ti would have been gone.
Sobering stuff Jeffrey, I'm glad it ended well. We have just heard about the Seabung www.seabung.com from another viewer's comment. Looks like a very clever product. Cheers, Chris 👍
Wow, such a great idea! thanks Chris.
Brilliant tip there, I'm slowly learning everything I need to know before I do finally get my first boat, Thanks to you of course :)
The outtakes are a brilliant idea, so funny to watch, you should put them in all of your videos :)
Thank you Garreth, I'm glad you are enjoying the videos and that they are informative too. There's a lot to learn about owning a boat, but if you keep learning as you are then there's no reason why you can't tackle any of the jobs yourself on the whatever boat you eventually buy. We do put outtakes in when we can, so we'll have some more for you in the future! Fair winds, Chris 👍
@@SailingBritaly I think I'll definitely need your expert advice as someone who knows what they're looking at before I buy my first boat, and maybe some sailing lessons too haha 👍😊⛵
Great information
Thanks Chris I just learned something new. It's always a good day if you're wearing something new.
Thank you Larry, I appreciate your feedback. Cheers, Chris 👍
Yep, I am compulsive about closing me seacocks. Want as few as possible. One reason switching to compost toilet, get rid if two thru hulls.
I'm a fan of getting rid of though-hull assemblies, we did the same durinhg our DIY Seacock replacement job: th-cam.com/video/9bV1rqqvw-k/w-d-xo.html Cheers, Chris 👍
Thank you so much for this important information!
You are very welcome Ruthie. Please share with your boating friends. Fair winds, Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Using modern plastic valves (so cheap they can be replaced every two years if they start to get crusted up with sea animal growth in the inside - say £10-£25 each as at 2021) or use stainless steel (as long as it's the right Marine Grade) are also good options. And have as few through - hull fittings as possible.
Chris you should have been a teacher. You make education fun and easy to understand. Hi Emma I miss you.
Hi Tom, that's extremely kind of you to say. I think my fuse is a bit short for me to be a teacher... 07:05 😂 I'll give Emma a kiss for you. Cheers, Chris 😊
Excellent information! Thank you!
You are very welcome. :-) Fair winds, Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
I had 1 snap on me when trying to remove the hose to my sea water intake for my engine. Luckily the boat was on land in the boat yard. This was 2 years ago and I repaired it straight away, I didn't do the others as they seemed OK. Problem is it has always worried me since then, my boat is coming out for antifouling and anodes this week for a whole month. So I'm going to change all mine so I know they are done.
Good call Lee, good luck with the job and check out our videos on DIY through-hull replacement (I recommend the long one for the extra info you may find useful). Cheers, Chris 👍
Lol the bloopers🤣👍🏻❤
😉👍
Chris, r u familiar with Adventure Adrift? They just published an episode in which (you guessed it) a through hull failed mid ocean
Hi Frank, it happens all the time!
Thank you Chris for this video, it was really informative. After I post this comment I will be composing an email to ask the guys who recently replace our through hulls which material was used.
Hi Barry & Aannsha, thank you! If you can, try to find out the exact models fitted. There are bronze seacocks out there with standard brass balls and spindles so it's a bit of a minefield for consumers. Fair winds, Chris 👍
Great video once again. How often do you reckon they should be replaced?
Hi Paul, thank you! That's a very 'how long is a bit of string'-esque question... The very best seacocks might last 30 years or more in the absence of any external influence such as stray currents. On the other hand, brass seacocks in my mind should never be fitted in the first place but if they have been then I'd say when they are 5 years old they would need replacing regardless of how good they look externally... Just my personal opinion though! Cheers, Chris 👍
Thanks for the video. Subcribed and shared. Love the outtakes :-)
Thank you Mike, welcome aboard and thank you for the share! Fair winds, Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Happend to me, had a 28' plywood yacht (A Daydream for Aus readers, built in a technical college in New Guinea). Went to close off one of the toilet sea cocks and the whole thing came apart in my hand, water rushed in so I plugged it with a rag, then some wood then filled the hole with some underwater Araldite then waited for the tide so I could careen it for a proper fix.
Also suspect you might have to be careful where you buy them, lots of Chinese stuff pretending to be quality UK/Euro/US bits and pieces. Like some magnetic 316 Stainless I bought for a project on my trailer sailer a few years ago.
Thank you for sharing your story Steve - this is a really common problem and hopefully this video can help spread the word! Chris 👍
great video! I was wondering why not use stainless steel? other question is is there any boat that doesn't have any thruhole, I mean to have another system like a outboard that you lower the tubes or lift them when not in use and holding tanks inside the boat until you deploy the tubes ("system")
Good info, well told. When Impavidus needs them we are going plastic. Mads did a good video on them. Sail Safe. Ant & Cid xx
Hi Ant & Cid, Trudesign have an impeccable reputation and we were tempted to fit those. On our boat we didn't have the room to fit Trudesign under our galley as there is not enough clearance, so we went DZR with all of them. Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Not a total failure, but my dad had one on his boat start leaking when it was launched one spring. Hauled back out, had it replaced with a more modern ball valve.
Thanks for sharing. 👍
I will soon be purchasing a sailing vessel as a liveabord and your videos are extremely useful. I am especially grateful for your attention to detail.
I am curious about the two units atop the forward cabin. Are they fans? If so how is water entry mitigated?
Hi Jim, Rossella and I were boat dealers in a previous life. We learnt a lot about negotiating when buying used boats. We sold our previous boat for more than we paid for her after using her for 4 years and we negotiated the price of Britaly down by £8,000 by writing a 3-page PDF document listing all the defects on the boat, without having seen her (after very carefully studying the photographs online). We ended up getting our Bavaria 350 at aproximately 50% of the price of others from the same period, without having to pay a surveyer (we've never had a survey on any boat we have bought). If you are interested in drawing from our experience and having us work for you one-to-one when you come to buy a boat, contact us on Patreon.
I guess you mean the vents on above the head on our previous boat, VinceRo. These were two stainless steel dome vents, one just a trickle-flow vent which also allowed light to enter, and the other one which had an extractor fan fitted. Their internal construction prevented water ingress. It's easier to see it, rather than explain it: www.aliexpress.com/item/Marine-Stainless-Steel-Deck-Ventilator-Cover-Boat-Yacht-Dome-Vent-Cover-Caravan-Exhaust-Fan-Cover/32833040638.html (This is not an endorsement of that product, it is just the first one I found in a google image search which shows the internal construction of the vents).
Best regards,
Chris
My boat had one of those leaking and it almost foundered in A river in Florida. Braden River at the Marina.
Thanks for sharing Adam. This is a really common problem! Fair winds, Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
The solution to the #1 cause of sailboat sinking-don't have any through-hull fittings in a boat. It reminds me of the story about a guy who goes to his doctor and complains that every time he hits his head with a hammer his head hurts. My 30' catamaran has no through-hull fittings-and incidentally, no bilge pump. It's been in the sea almost constantly for nearly 50 years, sailed across the Atlantic, and many thousands of miles.
Furthermore, the eye of hurricane Irma passed over my cat last year without any significant damage. Although two hatch covers blew off (I forgot to lock them down) as the 140+ mph winds passed over, it only had one inch of water in the bilge (which I mopped up in less than an hour). The mast and boom stood strong, and the mainsail remained on the boom. They just don't make sailboats today as robust as they used to long ago. I saw many modern sailboats sink that were many miles away from the brunt of the record-breaking hurricane Irma. In the Florida Keys where I live, the #1 cause of sailboat sinking is hurricanes, not through-hull fittings. More than a thousand boats sank last year in the Keys, due to hurricane Irma.
Cheers, just about to change the head intake fitting; the previous owner fitted a domestic brass valve from B&Q 😳
It happens all the time!... Well spotted and good luck with the replacement. Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Grazie mille!
Prego! Chris 👍
@4:56 stainless steel isn't the best?
Why?
The potential for crevice corrosion makes stainless steel less suitable than other materials.
Thanks enjoyed never had a through hull fail and dont want to🤞have removed my speed log a good few times to clean and the amount of water that comes in on the few seconds it takes to put the cap on is scary. Good advice with the wooden bungs have them on my boat tied off to the through hull last owner had put ptfe tape round them, dont think it will make much difference when i am banging them in anger.
Thanks Al, with a 1.5 inch fitting it wouldn't take long for the water in the boat to rise to such a level that it would no longer be easy to determine where it was coming from. Quite a sobering thought really. As you can see from the comments, this is a common problem so lets hope we can raise awareness about dezincification. Cheers, Chris 👍
I had a sink seacock open during a knockdown and the water rushed in with incredible force. Thankfully the sailboat righted itself fairly quickly but it was a vivid reminder to close all unnecessary seacocks.
Thanks for sharing Jacobus 👍
I want to give my twopence, hoping it will be useful to other people,
Two years ago I took my boat to a boatyard for the usual cleaning of the hull. The boss there told me: look your sea-cocks are very old and in bad conditions, it's better to change them. I said OK but I want them by bronze and not by brass as most boatyards use. I could not find them in the shipchandlers in my area so I resorted to internet. Found a shop who had them for twice the price of the brass ones. After just one month I noticed that the seacock of the engine cooling system was all green outside, being in the bilge which had collected sea water and so stayed submerged for a while... I made a photo of it and sent it to a good marine surveyor. He said that it couldn't be of good quality marine bronze. His opinion was that it was a seacock produced in China and commercialized with an Italian brand... I complained with the seller but he never replied... now after two years all the seacocks I can have a look at are completely green outside, so it means they are oxidized. I can only imagine how they can be inside.... they should have lasted at least 8-10 years...
So how can we know whether the product we buy is of good quality?
Hi there, thank you for sharing your experience. It is very difficult for consumers. I had to spend a LOT of time digging around to find good components to install on our boat. Many sellers don't have the technical knowledge to provide the information that an informed consumer needs to be able to purchase these vitally important items. Here is a datasheet for our ball valves. media1.svb-media.de/media/snr/500981/pdf/datasheet_2016-11-24_15-39-03_14d6fbc4383edc31fc981e471f325d33.pdf (We did not buy from this supplier, but this is the exact valve we bought) According to this datasheet, all of the component parts of our ball valves are made from corrosion / dezincification-resistant materials. Not only is the body DZR brass, but the ball is made from chrome plated DZR brass. The valve stem is also made from DZR brass, and the handle and retaining nut are stainless steel. There are bronze seacocks out there (which consumers might think are the best) with normal yellow brass balls and valve stems, which can then fail due to dezincification... It can be something of a lottery unless you spend a lot of time digging around for information. It's crazy that we have to waste time doing this, but it appears that it is necessary to avoid problems. Buon Vento! Chris 👍
Thank you for your useful and kind answer and the datasheet. Now I have a reference.
You are very welcome
Good advice Chris - thanks. I used to maintain Yachts used by the Royal Marines at Plymouth and every one of their boats had soft wooden conical bungs attached by chord to every 'through Hull fitting' inside each relevant locker. I think its general 'Royal Navy' practice. So in the event of failure, a bung of the correct diameter was immediately to hand.....thay is, always assuming someone's 'on-board' at the time.
I wasn't aware that this was standard Royal Navy practice but it certainly makes sense. There is a lot of experience behind all their procedures! Fair winds, Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Well done Chris
Cheers Gus 👍
good point, so often forgot. it doesn't make it pretty, so ignored....
Actually I would have thought misuse of heads was the greatest causal factor, kinda the same thing in a way though
One of Zaya'a skin fittings came off in my hand while removing the hose during the post land transport refit.
I had actually thought about sailing her the 1500 miles down the coast but opted to have her trucked due to seaworthiness worries that couldnt be repaired in a short time
I knew the valve looked bad, [not that it mattered I was changing all of them] and we were up on the slip but wow it can be a bit of a shock
Especially considering the VHF didnt work, the bilge pump had 2 complete breaks in the exit line, the battery was only loosely connected, and the fuel tank cracked open ditching 10 or so gallons of diesel into the bilge.
Hi there. This happens very frequently and can have dire consequences without some level-headed quick thinking (which is much easier to achieve when sitting at a computer than it is when you're at sea on a boat which is sinking!). We're glad Zaya has had these essential systems upgraded by you. Fair winds, Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Hi guys. What a coincidence. I'll pick up your brains then. I have booked the boat on the slip I have researched greatly and decided to go the coppercoat way. Now I'm realizing longer maintenance intervals will mean I have to check the seacocks to match the potential 10 year plus lifespan of the antofouling. While converting my toilet to a composting head with urine separator, pulling out a hose the stem snapped like it was made out of glass. Good lord it was after the valve but now I got that memory in the back of my head. I researchers bit and I found each bronze seacock in shipped to NZ could cost 450nzd or 300 usd. I researched the CR brass but now I wonder if a grounding problem or stray current will affect them. Can you make a video with your costs and reasoning? Why you pick those ones and where can you find them online? In NZ retail mark up could be up to 300% from the same stuff you can buy online directly. Please help me decide on this subject I don't feel comfortable with. Best regards yo both and your little helper
Hi there, I'm happy to assist you with this. I can't make a video as we already have about a 250 GB backlog of footage to edit, so you'd be waiting a very long time for your answers! I'll do my best to help you out here. I applied a copper-based anti-fouling paint before we launched our last boat and we didn't have it hauled out again for the 4 years that we owned her, (I cleaned the hull wearing a mask and snorkel and we saved an absolute fortune on the extortionate haul-out fees in the Med) so I agree with your train of thought. It's definitely a good time to make sure all your seacocks are going to last many years also. Having the hose tail snap like that is just another demonstration of how widespread this problem is. I thought long and hard about our through-hull assembly replacement job. Here's a bullet-point outline of my thoughts. Bronze: best but too flipping expensive. DZR Brass: just as good as bronze (Properties are virtually identical), good price. Forespar Marelon: handles can snap off (and the stem can leak if this happens), so no. Trudesign: Excellent reputation (I know of no failures), pretty good price, too big to fit space available in galley. Rather than have a mix and match of Trudesign and DZR, I decided to get all DZR. Be aware that you have to dig quite deeply as a consumer to make sure you buy the right gear. I have heard of Bronze seacocks (Groco, for example) having sub-standard stems, made from stainless steel or even yellow brass. SO you might buy a bronze valve thinking you have the best, when in fact the stem might fail prematurely. Here is a datasheet of our DZR ball valves: media1.svb-media.de/media/snr/500981/pdf/datasheet_2016-11-24_15-39-03_14d6fbc4383edc31fc981e471f325d33.pdf As you can see, every part is made from appropriate materials, which will resist dezincification. It takes a lot of time to source the parts you need and then double check that the ones you find meet this kind of stringent scrutiny. I wouldn't worry about grounding/stray current problems when choosing through-hull assemblies as you will always have something metallic in the water, so even if you use composite seacocks & skin fittings you would not eliminate these problems if they were to exist and would have to address them separately... We bought our parts from asap-supplies.com (No affiliation to us). UK based, we have found them to be excellent and they deliver worldwide. An alternative supplier of the same ball valves we bought is svb24.com (No affiliation to us) based in Germany. They also deliver worldwide. I hope this helps! Cheers, Chris 👍(plus Rossella & Emma) 😊
Sailing Britaly. Thanks a lot Chris. I know you are an extremely busy guy so I really appreciated the effort of a very complete answer. Thanks heaps for the links and datasheet. I lost track of all websites I have researched but never got to do a full part scrutiny check. Your advise will be of great use. I'll start the seacock purchases in a couple of weeks. BTW I hope you guys do the south Pacific to NZ in the future. Would be great to share the local knowledge. Regards Josue
@@josuehernandezmago Our pleasure Josue, it's a small world so perhaps we'll share an anchorae somewhere one day! 👍
you should add to check your zinc electrodes as that is a major contributing factor
Hi Cameron, I presume you mean anodes, but zinc anodes have nothing to do with dezincification on any boat where the through-hull assemblies are not electrically bonded. You can have 100% functioning and working anodes and still have dezincification occur on your through-hull assemblies. Fair winds, Chris
Chris, In one of your previous videos when you replaced a valve that was brass with a plastic valve you replaced the plastic with an aluminum fitting. What happens when you get bimetallic electrolysis. Did you consider this?
Hi Jonathan, the only other valve I have replaced in our videos was the seawater intake valve on our saildrive unit. That was a bronze-bodied gate valve with a plastic spindle and handle. I think these are rubbish (I've had one seize before and there's not much you can do to free them up without risking breaking the spindle), so I replaced it with a DZR ball valve. Bronze and DZR brass are very close together on the galvanic scale, so replacing the original valve with a replacement made from DZR brass had almost no affect on the factory installation. Also, in a galvanic cell between the aluminium alloy saildrive leg and the DZR fitting screwed into it, the aluminium is the anode. Because the wetted area of the saildrive leg is hundreds of times larger than the fitting screwed into it, the rate of any galvanic corrosion in any case would be negligible. I hope this answers your question! Cheers, Chris 👍
The funniest part of sunken and foundered boats is how fast they become an ecosystem especially those oysters and barnacles. Does founder mean the same thing as sink?
Is there any data on the lifetime of a 316 s/s skin fitting (v.s. bronze) under the waterline?
This discussion covers it quite well: www.ybw.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-177430.html
perfect, thanks :)
Another issue with brass/bronze, or even stainless fittings is that boatyards or owners attempt to protect them by grounding them in a process called 'bonding' and it is often done incorrectly. Bonding is supposed to 'ground' them to protect them from stray current in the water which will rapidly accelerate the de-zincification process (in just weeks!). Bonding is tricky, you can't bond the seacocks to the same ground-bus bar as other mechanized equipment like AC pumps or even the engine itself. If you bond incorrectly in the manner I just mentioned you accomplish the opposite of 'protecting' the seacocks. There are huge arguments about when to bond and when not to bond. I just avoid it all by not using any type of alloy and prefer composite seacocks, lol. I have actually designed a carbon fiber or E-Glass 'cage' to be bonded around a composite seacock to protect it from impact while still allowing full functionality and replacement of hoses/parts/removal etc. Just a concept, haven't put it into practice but I'm sure others have had the same though and given a try.
One thing I always do with suppliers, ask for a certificate of conformity, just in case you want to sue them
Sleeping. Will do that too .
How about stainless steel?
Siete in gamba!!
Grazie Stefano! Buon vento, Rossella, Chris ed Emma 😊
It's that they fill with water.
Correct. The important part is how it gets there... Fair winds, Chris
Clips on cockpit drains need to be renewed if they pop of it may flood the bilge🐳🐳🐳
Absolutely Sean, cockpit drains are another huge cause of boats sinking. Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Another youtube channel, Wicked Salty, had a through hull fail. By the time he got to his boat it was sitting on the bottom.
Hi Mike, it happens all over the world - hence this video! Let's hope we can help raise awareness and make a difference. Fair winds, Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
7.62 and some 5.56 rounds cause hull holes when beligerant pirates near Columbia are not placated.
Just to let you guys know we make skin fittings in AB2 bronze the same as your propeller. then with a DZR gate valve, not a ball valve. ball valves have two metals that produce an electric current in sea water and yes they then fail. contact black bear boating on the internet they are made to suit each boat
Hi Peter, not all ball valves are equal. Some use a mix of materials, such as bronze body and brass ball & stem, or bronze body and stainless steel ball & stem. These materials cause problems down the line. Our ball valves have a DZR Brass body, chrome plated DZR Brass ball and a DZR Brass valve stem. These should last an extremely long time. Another advantage of ball valves is that you have a visible indication as to whether the valve is open or closed. Fair winds, Chris 👍
why not use stainless steel fittings and stainless steel pipe work where you can ?
Hi Andy, stainless steel fittings are not a good choice for this application. Stainless steel is corrosion-resistant thanks to a very thin passive film on its surface. This passive film can be destroyed by low oxygen. Seawater has enough dissolved oxygen for this not to be a problem a lot of the time. However, if there are crevices present (Like there would be on a skin fitting/seacock installation) or if the water becomes stagnant for some reason (Like when you close the valve and leave it closed for a prolonged period) the water becomes oxygen-depleted and the passive layer is damaged. Once this occurs you then get a reaction between the passive and non passive areas of the stainless steel (regardless of the alloy, 316 is also susceptible), which is very similar to galvanic corrosion between dissimilar metals, in the sense that there is a minuscule galvanic cell set up within the individual stainless steel component. The resulting corrosion tends to penetrate in a way that is very difficult to spot unless the components are disassembled. I personally wouldn't use stainless steel fittings below the waterline for the above reasons. Cheers, Chris 👍
Crevice corrosion, it's an insidious thing, once you've seen what happens to 316 you'll never trust it again👍
I have known many people who helped their boats to sink because they were tired of them.
Has anyone ever plumbed a pipe over the transom down to the bottom of the keel? I'm looking at fiber-glassing a tube into the keel , over the transom and into a saltwater holding tank. All of my seacocks can either pump water in or can pump water out. If my holding tank can pump or siphon seawater in I could have one opening below the waterline. If siphoning is a concern I could put a valve at the top of the transom to provide a vapor break. If I'm off the boat, the only danger I have is if I actively pump water into my boat. That could never happen if I pop one vapor lock valve. I've seen boats with 6 or 7 seacocks all in very difficult locations. The engine is my only concern but it has a pump and that pump can siphon water over the transom by itself. There would be enough water in the holding tank to take the air out of the siphon line. I've never seen this - what am I missing?
HI Tim, that is an innovative solution. Many larger vessels use sea chests: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_chest Which achieve a similar result in a different way. Fair winds! Chris 👍
A sea chest is exactly what I would use but I would not fill it from a through hull below the waterline. I believe I can do this with no openings below water level.
Not a sea-cock story, but almost the same... Guess what is the major cause of flooding in houses? Broken pipes? Freeze burst? Nope... failure of angle-stop valves and supply hoses serving every fixture in your house... H&C water at sinks, toilets, dishwasher, icemaker. Contractors install cheap ones, a way to save a few bucks (cutting corners to make more profit). They corrode and fail from the inside... they look ok to the eye, but when they fail it happens quickly. I have seen over $100,000 US damage from a failed supply hose. Change all now, inspect annually by "exercising" valves.
Real No1 reason why boats sink is:
filling with water
We had 2 sailboats destroyed this year at my club! One got hit by lightning and the other one got hit by another sailboat whose bow thruster "failed"........ Both really nice boats. One guy had literally taken a month off of work to get his boat ship shape before some A-hole rammed him.......... Anyway yes at another club just last week here on the Chesapeake a seacock (why does that sound dirty?) failed and the guy lost his boat. Other guys at the club were going to haul his boat out for him since he was at work but because he was a big jerk and a general nuisance at the club they let his boat sink in his slip..... Anyway. Great videos keep them coming!
Hi Patrick, thank you very much for sharing your experiences. It sounds like it has been quite an eventful season in your area! Thank you for your words of encouragement, we really appreciate them. Fair winds! Chris, Rossella & Emma 😊
Is that a banana on your boat?
Whoever had the silly idea of putting holes in boats to begin with?
They tried to make a boat without any holes but they couldn't get in it... 😉
"... talk about the biggest reason that boats sink." Hm, reason: make hull that dont sink :-)
even DZR is not trustworthy, better go with bronze
I thought it was because they couldn't swim
#1 reason is the water didn't stay on the outside
Correct. The important part is how it got inside... Fair winds, Chris
DON'T LISTEN TO THIS GUY! 😈I want more,please!
Just bought our third sailboat that had been sunk. It's my retirment hobby and diet plan😊! Each one had sunk because of old seacocks.
One day this 38'ketch was worth $25k after sinking at the dock the next day $1,800. That's what I paid, Here in Florida.
It amazes me. It's like those people that drive around and around a parking lot to get close to the front door the spend hundreds to join a gym to get exercise😨.
Hi Howard, you got yourself a bargain Ketch there! It is such a common problem... Fair winds, Chris 👍
holes
For legal reasons I was not here
"Boats sink"." No ones knows why! they just do"
Good information and important. Thanks for sharing.
👍