Why Americans Love Being "German" (or "Irish", "Italian", "Greek"....)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 19 พ.ค. 2024
- Why is heritage so important to Americans? And why is this weird hyphenate of German-American, Irish-American, Polish-American so pervasive in the USA, but in other nations with similar migratory histories like Canada and Australia - not so much?
Chapters:
00:00 Intro
01:39 Made-in-America (-ish)
07:01 Heritage Tourism & Ancestry Obsession
10:51 Is it “Cringey” Though?
16:06 The Fun of It All
18:19 The Big Picture
Episode No. 141
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I once met an American who described himself as German. He didn't speak any German and everything he knew about Germany and German culture came either from documentaries about the Second World War or from fairy tales. To him, Germany was a fairy-tale country full of hard-working, beer-drinking laborers with funny names. He was constantly saying things like: "That's how we Germans are", "That's how we germans do it", "That's how we germans think" and so on. One day he annoued me so much that i told him that he was neither German nor had any idea about Germany or the Germans, it was as if i had ripped his whole personality out of him and stomped on it. He was really shocked and deeply hurt, but i think it was neccesary. Because today he can speak some German and has been to Germany several times.
If you Americans identify so much with your country of origin, then please lean into the culture and the language and don't build your own Disneyland reality. I think that's what makes most Europeans so angry because no one wants to be pigeonholed into a collection of outdated stereotypes. If you connect with our culture in a respectful way, we will definitly respect and appreciate that.
The dude thinking Germany is a fairy tale land is funny asf ☠️
"outdated" is the right word to describe it. Americans are culturally stuck in the 19th century, which is when the vast majority emigrated to America. That's why they tend to have a "fairy tale" view of Europe, as that's what they've grown up with and all they've ever known of the world outside the US.
I speak fluently german and i have lived there seven years,but i am less german than this guy you speak about,im Bulgarian. Yes i understand what you mean with your post,but i think genetics are a lot more important then what you have become trying to persuit and adapt to a different culture. And yes, Germany is a fairy tail country 😁😁
You have to go there to experience it. I spent a summer in Deutschland and it blew my stereotypes out of the water.
@@shaunsteele6926 Yeah this is definitely true. For me, my grandparents came from China in the 1960s, but when we compare the culture that they passed down to me to recent Chinese immigrants who've come in the past 10-20 years, it seems outdated. The clothes we wear, food we eat, phrases we say, etc. are remnants from a different era, and some of my Chinese friends who immigrated here more recently said I sound like a grandma when I speak Chinese. Well, I guess I do, since I learned it from my grandma lol.
To me, there is a difference - celebrating one's ancestry, and saying "I have Polish/Irish ancestry" or "my great granddad was Irish/Polish" - this is perfectly fine. But saying "I'm Polish" while being 4th generation Polish-American and not speaking the language, or knowing much about the country itself - this as Europeans we do find annoying because it's simply not true.
I think it’s because we simply have a different definition of “I’m polish.” We Americans are very fast people and use language shortcuts whenever we can. “I’m polish” is simply just short for “I have polish ancestry.” We don’t have to say we aren’t actually from the mainland because it’s obvious by the context of our accent and such.
When I talk to Americans like in person I jsut say I’m italian or whatever, but when talking on social media I say I have italian heritage because my accent isn’t heard and also my “audience” isn’t in the same country I am in and knowing full well the cultural context of italian Americans.
The thing that I personally don't like about the hyphen is that you say a 4th generation polish heritage is not polish and you are correct they have well assimilated into American culture. But that is NOT TRUE FOR A 4TH GENERATION MEXICAN THAT ONLY MARRIED MEXICAN AMERICAN TO THE MIND OF AMERICANS WE ARE ALWAYS MEXICAN and I hate that. My daughters don't speak Spanish yet to a mainstream American we are Mexican.... The worst thing is that in Mexico they don't consider us to be Mexican they discriminate against us saying you are (ni de aqui ni de alla) meaning you are not Mexican and you are not American. And that sucks. But I like living and being part of America.
We Mexican-americans are changing the fabric of this nation both political groups are catering to us knowing that their power remains in the Hispanic vote. We are prospering as a group we are more richer than we were 50 years ago. We are slowly having a higher net-worth. Honestly, the prosperity my family enjoys would have never been possible in Mexico
Noone says "they're Polish" lol you Europeans have created an annoyance yourselves that doesn't exist
Nationality is genetic, that's why in today's social climate I wouldn't dream of traveling to the USA
@@dajjukunrama5695 well I am Hispanic and I am telling you as experience, being American is not defined as being white.... My experience that I mentioned is that white people in America will call you Mexican for seeing you brown but that never means that you are an immigrant in any sense of the word. A white person would consider me and specially my daughters as Americans and nothing else even though they might call us Mexican...Is there racism here? like any where else but for example a black person in USA is never considered an immigrant. An Asian in America is Asian descendent not an immigrant perse. The whole country is a mixture of every nationality if you go to a big city you will see variety.
As someone from Russia with Korean and German ancestry (look up "Koryo-saram" and "Volga Germans" if you care to find out how that happened) and also grew up in Kazakhstan I always found the American fixation on ancestry as a personal identity determinant extremely relatable. In fact it's quite a common attitude in Kazakhstan, where most people were nomads until about a century ago and where people from all over the Soviet Union ended up moving, voluntarily or otherwise. It's not considered at all rude to ask someone you meet for the first time which clan/tribe they're from if they look Kazakh or what ethnicity they are if they don't, just as it is normalized to respond with "I'm 50% Korean, 25% Russian and 25% German". I feel like I actually ended up weirding out a lot of people that way, not just in Europe but also people back in Russia, one of whom just flat out asked me "what's stopping you from identifying simply as Russian? A lot of us are a mix of one thing or another anyway".
I think one big reason to this is the discrimination all of these groups faced once they came to the US and settled there + with the predominant English-Americans looking down on them and being their leaders.
This rings true for my family experience for sure.
Yes, the discrimination they faced as "others" made them cling to their heritage more to help them develop an identity while living in the United States. The same things happens to many non-European immigrants that move to Europe. I have Vietnamese relatives who have moved to the UK, France, and Switzerland and they and their children, even those born in those respective countries, consider themselves Vietnamese not English, French, or Swiss.
@@patrickw123Why should they not?
On the other hand, if you go to some of these European Countries and you are actually the same ethnicity of the population you are treated differently. A German American will always be more German than a Turk how's family whose been there for 2 generations. Maybe people will deny this and call me names, but you know it's true.
Another case in point, most Europeans, even recent ones who actually move to the states typically move to an area with a high concentration of their own identity. Maybe it's a vague cultural similarity.
But not English-American. They don't seem to do this hyphenation.
An interesting difference right? I would imagine the revolution had a lot to do with it.
Another reason could be because it is (or was for a long time) the 'default' in most people's minds what 'American' means, so not worth emphasizing or even mentioning. Maybe that changes in the future.
Edit: typo
Oh, a certain percentage of americans _loooves_ to harp on about their _true_ "Anglosaxon" heritage.
Well, they are kinda proud of the pilgrims and so on. But true, it sometimes looks as if the English are the "original" population of America. While in fact there is no "original" Americans other than the native tribes. So basically everybody else "comes from somewhere" - and thats valid for the entire American continents. May thats part of the reason why people there are so eager to learn about their origins.
@@TypeAshtonthat’s surely a big factor - I remember reading tea drinking was rejected post independence in favour of coffee as being too conspicuously British and of course famously due to a british monopoly and tax over tea. Drinking tea represented colonial acquiesce. So I am sure calling yourself an English American sounded anti-patriotic - a nationalist oxymoron replaced an imperialist tautology. Either way, identifying as an English/British-American didn’t fly much until trumpish Anglo Saxon nativism etc. Interestingly, eight of the first US presidents were born British subjects.
Top tip for anyone visiting Scotland who's inclined to say they're Scottish: if you're cool and say you have Scottish ancestry but don't harp on about it, you'll get on grand and it's a nice way to get to know you! If, however, you come over claiming to be part of am "ancient clan", say you have an "ancestral castle", and act like you're somehow more Scottish than people who live in Scotland (this happens ALL THE TIME) - yeah, that blood-based identity stuff doesn't fly here at all, you'll be a ripe target for ire and people will absolutely mess with you.
tl;dr be curious and don't act like you're some long-lost family member and you're grand; be a deluded twit who thinks you're "one of us" because your great-great-great-great-granny happened to get on a boat in Glasgow, and it's piss-taking time.
Yup just say i traced my origine to Scotland and it was a good excuse to come over for a visite. Or i just got curious about Scotland because of that. Nothing wrong with wnating to know where you otiginale came from but don't go claiming you're still a part of that society.
Is this strange attitude possibly rooted in guild about the genocide and slavery when the US was build
@@thatguy8869what?
I used to live in Edinburgh and the American tourists wearing a tartan tat shop Royal Stewart kilt over their jeans on the Royal Mile were... let´s just say low hanging fruit for the older primary school children of the school near Holyrood Palace.
@@abbofun9022what?
The Italian-Americans are about as Italian as pineapple pizza 😂
More Italian than you
That shit is delicious but created in Canada.
@@Nehmiyup, “Hawaiian” pizza was created in Canada by a Greek immigrant 😂 look it up
@@Nehmi not shit but totally good manna! agree delish
Best pizza invented in Canada and a favourite.
I’m Irish, lived in Ireland all my life. Americans idea of culture of almost all European cultures are stuck in a weird time warp. With Ireland it’s almost the idea of a backward rural idyll like something out of the Quiet Man from 1950. It’s like the idea that the countries once left behind have the same culture today rather than being thriving modern places. Irish Americans are some of the most cringe worthy people with no idea of modern Ireland (the current president being a prime example), but I can only imagine how other countries this side of the Atlantic which don’t speak English feel..
Would you still feel it is cringe if you knew that despite your family living in the USA for three or four generations, the local community and the media regularly made fun of you and your family for decades, openly discriminated against you, and teachers told as a small child that you could NEVER be anything but the lowest laborer because you were just a "Stupid Mick"? Then when you asked you grandparents, who might vaguely remember what life was like 60+ years before in their tiny village, all you got were bits and pieces of half-accurate traditions that your grandparents insisted was the "real deal". So, when you try to push back against the discrimination by being proud of what your roots were, all you had to go on was what you were told. That is how it was for MILLIONS of Americans.
I feel it probobly annoys Irish / Scottish / German and so on a bit more then some other, part because it's just more common, and partially because it comes with some wierd steriotypes more from USA then other.
Like I'm from Sweden, and while a lot of Swedes moved over to USA, it's not as many as Irish or Germans, 1,5 Million Swedes Migrated while around 6Million Germans & Irish each Migrated, so like 4 times as many, and even the ones who do DNA research or check their family history and figure out they are Scandinavian / Swedish, there are less well known festivals and steriotypes that comes with it too, so I think they don't asociate that as much with how Sweden was back in the 1800's - 1950's.
I think the less defined culture heritage comes from the Swedes not settleling together as much, they didn't stay around the cities to form unified districts almost at all, and all spread out making their own farms mostly, mostly to The agricultural areas in western Illinois, Iowa, Minnesota, and western Wisconsin
But I have deffinetly felt a bit annoyed a select few times, talking with people online claming they'r "Swedish" and born and live in America, while knowing like NOTHING about sweden, like what? But overall I and most swedes just find it cool that they might want to learn about Sweden, They have Swedish Heritage, and saying thats cool, and they'r free to come and explore that heritage in Sweden if they'd like, learn history and so on, but like I don't go around Calling myself basically "American" because I know I have some relatives who are.
@@PannkakaMedSylt What you Europeans do not understand is one of the most important causes is the US Census & the way immigrants were treated. First, you have the problem of "one drop" of African blood classified a person as a Negro. Second, from 1850 to 1890, Irish and any central or southern European immigrant were listed as Non-White, only a half step above blacks. Third, from 1880 to about 1960 anyone with Irish, eastern or southern European heritage, no matter how many generations removed was treated as a second-class citizen at best. Therefore, it became VERY important for "good" immigrants like Germans, to remember and emphasize their heritage, while "bad" immigrants could never be allowed to forget theirs. As late as the 1979, the US media regularly made fun of "bad" immigrant heritage - Google "Polack or Wop Jokes". In response most Americans became super attached to their ethnic roots, celebrated their heritage, and made sure that their children & grand children would NEVER forget their ethnic roots.
Your Prime Minister and his woke leadership is cringe worthy. I can't wait until you have a new government and get rid of the globalist and communists. I'm an American whose grandparents and many relatives of Ireland. I have zero dissullisions of Ireland. I'm glad likec 70% of your population rejected changing the definition of marriage. Your modernism and progressive liberalism is cringe worthy.
Your president and priminister are more concerned about non irish citizens and your educated young people. The Irish-Irish are leaving in droves to Australia, and if they can get into the states, they are coming. I find you cringe worthy by evening mentioning your current political leadership that hate their own people.
As a European, I have nothing against Americans cherishing their roots. I mean, who doesn't have a recipe passed down from a great-great-grandmother still being made every now and then, or a weird custom that nobody really remembers how it started? It's just that over here, that great-great-grandmother was likely the same nationality as you (heck they may even have lived in the same house), and most of those customs are local to your village. I think it's cool and interesting how bits of culture survived and slowly evolved over sometimes hundreds of years.
Really, the only gripe I have is the way Americans talk about it. I think if they stopped saying "I'm Irish," or "I'm German," when they very clearly aren't, they'd have a much easier time with the actual Irish or Germans. It's not about cultural appropriation, which I personally find ridiculous as a concept. If they want to do their own Oktoberfest and Christkindlmarkt and whatever, they're absolutely welcome to do so. It's the presumptiveness with which they present their ignorance as fact. As you have experienced, Ashton, an American who comes politely and with a willingness to learn will be greeted with open arms. It's those who believe they already have all the answers who get told off.
Yes, they should stop feeling any longing for their ancestors that we drove away in the first place!
Celebrating Oktoberfest or having a Christkindlmarkt because you enjoy German culture, that is indeed no problem. But claiming YOU ARE German when you are not is exactly cultural appropriation.
@@trnoggerthen you'd better stop eating potatoes, tomatoes, chocolate, coffee, etc because none of those is native to Germany. Otherwise, as you say, its cultural appropriation. ;)
Yes. This. A couple of years ago I (a Finn) talked with an American (from the USA) who told me, you know, I'm part Finnish! I was like, really? So one of your parents was a Finn? He replied, no but my great grandmother came from Finland! Right...
After talking a bit with him I found he doesn't speak Finnish, has never been to Finland, doesn't basically know anything about us - and the great grandmother of his? He never even met her as she died before his birth. I mean, how does that make him even remotely Finnish?
He was also apparently part Irish or something...
@@kirancourt Did you read any part of what was there? There is nothing wrong with taking from other cultures, its claiming to be of that culture that is objectionable.
It doesn't bother me at all when US-Americans want to learn about their heritage. It seems to me to be part of the American identity which I might never fully understand but can respect. But they have to accept that they view their heritage through a very americanised lens and therefore can't claim authenticity. That's not a bad thing, cultures and traditions are fluid and change over time. What I'm trying to say is: don't try to out-european Europeans. Accept that you don't know everything about your heritage and be open to learn and it's all cool
Europeans are Caucasian
Mexican American, i know i am not really a “Mexican” when speaking to a Mexican and my culture is different but it is nice to know that some of my family’s traditions can still live. It feels like we are slapping our ancestors in the face if we don’t at least acknowledge where we came from and the many pains they had to go through just so I can have a better life.
@@MrSophire You’re not really an American either, though tbf. A Mexican American is still Mexican while an American American is American.
@@wtfdidijustwatch1017 Totally untrue. My friends who are of Mexican ancestry are not considered not American at all. There people who are bigots, but it's not the majority of Americans. We do despise our President for not securing our Southern border, so they can flood America with immigrants that the DEmocrats assume will vote Democrat forever - which is a racist stereotype: "we'll give them welfare, so they will be loyal to us forever" seems to be their plan.
@@wtfdidijustwatch1017 What kind of bullshit is that? If she's born and raised US American she's as US American as the president.
Whilest living in the US for six years, this constant, "Oh, I'm French, or Italian, or....." infuriated me. This was particularly so when the speaker didn't know anything about the country from which they claimed to belong, hadn't been there, couldn't speak a word of the language, and often spoke of their "roots" in a way someone who had been there knew to be wrong. It also amused my son, who was born and raised in East Africa, to have classmates who were "African American" and couldn't name three countries on the continent. When D would say, "Well I'm an African", he was laughed at by his blacker classmates....until he spoke to them in Kiswahili, or Kibukusu, or Sabaot - in each of which he is fluent.
It's frustrating! I'm English. I've had Americans tell me they're Irish-Scottish and I was excited. Where in Ireland and Scotland? How long have you been in America? And the6 had the gall to laugh at me. It feels like fraud. I was excited because my father was born in Ireland and I my mother's parents were from Scotland.
We weren't having a conversation about our ancestry! They asked where I was from. They're not from these places. They don't share any cultural similarities with my family. I did ancestry DNA and it wasn't really relevant to my heritage. We're from the British Isles and my DNA is predominantly Scandinavian. Not shocking given how I look. But DNA doesn't disprove my heritage. It showed I was related to other people who share the same ancestors in last few hundred years as my genealogy says I have. But DNA isn't heritage. It's just a lot of my ancestors shared common ancestors with Scandinavians. I don't walk around telling people I'm Irish, yes I have an Irish passport but at most I've spent a few summers with my grandparents there. I've never lived there. I don't call myself Scottish, I've never lived there. And I would never call myself Scandinavian regardless of what a DNA test says. It would be fraudulent making any such claims.
I still can't stand Americans lying about where they're from and this video doesn't make it better.
@@runningfromabear8354 It's a bit like todays Germans talk to the Amish. It's kind of a window into history, a copy of 1860 or so. Of course history took different paths, depending on the point they separated. But I think they still have a right to claim to have a german heritage.
When I was in USA and someone said "I'm german" then I just talked german to him. And (s)he realized very soon that indeed they aren't. By culture, schooling, raising, language, customs, social interactions they are US-Americans. Not Germans.
@@runningfromabear8354 Heritage isn't genetic, it's cultural. Cooking or eating the dishes my mother made (she's from Northern Germany where is a distinct cuisine to other parts of the country) makes me happy - but that's because these are things from my childhood, not because half of my genes come from there.
Though in the US, if you say (and feel) Irish-American or Italian-American, you mean what you know of that culture - and often that's not more than St. Patrick's Day or pizza ;)
@@holger_p that's not what Americans do though. They say: "I'm Scottish." Saying: "I have Scottish ancestry or heritage." Wouldn't garner such a negative reaction. Words have meaning. Is it really so difficult to understand the difference between claiming a heritage vs claiming a nationality?
I as a German, don't mind Americans caring about their roots, but if you tell me "oh I'm German too" and you've never been to Germany, don't speak a bit of German and only go to these festivals in the US, which often get a lot about German culture wrong - especially because they're only about south German culture - then your just straight up not German...
@JNeace-uk8ue Woah, you seem quite fed up.
To explain myself I was talking about German as the cultural group, now obviously not all regions in Germany are the same and there is different subcultures, but they are united by one history and one language. Also the French whom you used as an example, did also suppress cultural minorities like the Occitans in the south of France or the Bretons in the Northwest or the Walloons in the North. France also wasn't always a unified nation, they just made the same development Germany did a few hundred years prior. Another example would be the Italians, of course they're all from different small nations initially, but nowadays you wouldn't see them as such, neither the actual Italians nor their descendants in the US. I hope I could answer your question, and you that your now able to see my point.
Even Americans who primarily speak German as a native language are way to culturally detached from Germany to be considered Germans
The Pennsylvania Dutch are an example
To me it’s not about ancestry or heritage languages it’s about the lived experience
I am Norwegian about your age Ashton, and I visited Minnesota in the mid 2000s. There I got introduced to things regarded as very Norwegian thing amongst American-Norwegians. Only problem to me was that I had heard of any of these things. 😂
I've read a Reddit thread where a Norwegian-American claimed tater tots were "Norwegian". Jeg er også norsk. I'm Norwegian too. Neither me nor any of the other Norwegians have any clue what tater tots are.
Seems they're basically small Rösti... which would put them more in the Alps than Scandinavia.
@@Llortnerof I'm assuming you're responding to my tater tots comment? Yes, that may be the case.
On that nore, I've noticed Americans often confusing Scandinavia and the German speaking countries. In the latest Rick & Morty episode they apparently (I don't watch the show) were in Norway, which looked suspiciously like Switzerland.
I've also noticed Americans "speaking Swedish" in films by imitating a bad German accent (exaggerated "Ja!"'s). To us it's very strange since it's so obvious we're different. I can imagine the German-speaking part of Europe would think the same thing.
@@Llortnerof Nope, they don‘t belong to us.
@@Onnarashi Aldri hørt om tater tots heller 😅
I don't think most Europeans who have never moved out of their countries can understand how important the connection to one's own roots is. I am Norwegian, and have always lived in Norway, but I can still understand it. My family is originally Sami. The Sami's are the indigenous people of Northern Scandinavia, Finland and the Cola Peninsula in Russia. Due to the Norwegian state's attempt to wipe out Sami language and culture, I grew up without knowing/understanding that I actually was Sami. All my grandparents could speak Sami. Even my father could speak the language, but when I asked why, the answer was that it was useful to learn the language of people who lived in the same county.
Because parts of the Sami people were nomadic reindeer herders, it was difficult to subsume them. Therefore, the language and culture survived in parts of Norway. The policy that was pursued was a typical divide-and-rule culture, where it was possible to pit different Sami groups against each other. It was very devastating, and I had to be close to 40 years before it dawned on me that Sami was actually the mother tongue not only of all my grandparents, but also of my own father. Then I aready had moved south and married a Norwegian.
I had always felt that there was something missing in my life. I had all the material goods in place, but even though I embraced my own Norwegianness, the attachment to the Norwegian was something that came from outside. My culture was not properly Norwegian, and I could sense it. Norway's northernmost university has referred to my home village as the largest Sea Sami community, but when I was growing up I only knew of one Sami, and he came from the core Sami areas inland, where the reindeer-herding Sami lived in the winter, and where Sami language and culture were natural.
Discovering and acknowledging that I was actually Sami was very important to me. Missing pieces in life's puzzle fell into place. Even if some Sami's who have always known that they were Sami do not completely agree with me that I am Sami, I knew that I actually was. I didn't have the language, but I had grown up in a redefined Sami culture, in my own home area where my family had lived as far back as we knew - probably very far back. I understand how important it is for Americans to know their own roots. Our genetic and ethnic heritage helps to shape who we are, and if we do not know this heritage we are not whole as people.
It is possible Norwegians in general are more open to Americans embracing their Norwegian heritage than other Europeans, because most Norwegians are very proud to be Norwegian, and traditionally we have been proud that Americans still in our time embrace the country and culture their ancestors emigrated from.
I warmly welcome them to Norway, even though I am ethnically Sami. It was not my choice to become Norwegian, and it was not their choice to become Americans. When their ancestors left, they did so out of necessity, and the longing for their homeland and family (which they would never see again) must have been immense.
It is natural that their descendants several generations later, when they have the opportunity, will travel back to familiarize themselves with the land their ancestors came from. That they refer to themselves as X% Norwegian, German or Greek we should take as a compliment instead of being offended that they do so. This is nothing to be offended by. It is an honor, and is done out of love for the land their ancestors migrated from. By visiting the country, most of them will also very likely realize that they are more American than anything else, but it is also possible that they will finally realize why they themselves stand out from what is typical for Americans.
love this! my last name comes from Oslo
@@christianhansen3292
Your surname is actually the most common surname in Norway.
Actually, the Europeans who think that Americans stand out in this regard are mistaken because most of the world identifies themselves like how Americans are said to identify themselves here. I’m a Filipino who grew up in Australia and I always felt so weird only speaking English since I didn’t maintain the language due to immigrating at such a young age. Also, it only makes sense that you would integrate your parents’s ethnicities into your label because while you are your own person, you are still largely made up of what your parents and their ancestors are. Also, your parents would quite certainly have influenced you in upbringing too, so you would be mixed culturally. It’s only natural that you will have a multidimensional identity.
You are lucky. I come from New Zealand, and most Americans have no idea the country exists. Americans think they are Europeans.
@@peace-now A lot of Americans have no clue about Norway, either. They might think it is a Swedish town or something. I don't care what they think. All that matters is what your country actually is. New Zealand for sure have a good reputation among people with some knowledge.
A co-worker recently went to norther Italy to visit the town his great grandfather was from. He considered himself Italian because of those roots. When he arrived he found out they did not consider his grandfather to be Italian. His last name comes from the French. Around 1600 the French occupied that land and several French families settled there. To this day those families are still considered non- native by Italians.
I am Northwestern Italian and here many people have French sounding last names but we consider them Italians because they are but it’s complicated for foreigners, especially Americans, to understand our history. I don’t know what part of the country your friend went to.
Ouch 😮😂😢
Tell him not to feel so bad. Italy wasn't even a country until 1860, so yeah. It's a mess. My great-grandmother was from Fiume, Italy but it is now Rijeka, Croatia. People move and so do borders.
Ask Napoleon how he felt about that
Generally we italians consider you as a peer italian if you are deeply rooted in our culture and speak our language. We appreciate more and can call "italians" people who have not italian roots but have established in Italuy and are ingrained in the italian culture than the reverse case.
@@cdpbryant why do you even care about this? I really don't get that. You didn't grow up speaking italian and living that culture, so you are not Italian. End of story. I have no interest where my ancestors come from.
Thx for your your video. I m a German, living in Germany. Parts of my family did immigrate in the 19.century in the US, near Austin Texas, an other part went later to Australia, Hobart Tasmania. Both parts are still living there and we are in contact with each other. And you are right, the Americans say, we are German Americans, but the Aussies say, omg we are Tasmanians. It is funny.
If you look at the perspective of indigenous people, whether that be Australia, or the United states, white people are infinitely closer culturally to Europeans than the original inhabitants of the countries they live in. That’s why I think it’s so silly that Europeans get offended when Americans want to claim their European roots. If you take a genuine look at American mannerisms, culture, outlook on life, etc, this all stems from European culture. Can you imagine what an Australian Aboriginal thinks when white Australians vehemently claim to be “Tasmanians”? They have zero connection to the land and original culture of what is now Australia. From an indigenous perspective, they are simply Europeans who do everything in a European way but happen to live closer to the equator.
And I’ll give you an example of the Diné (Navajo people) a native American nation in the southwestern United States. They originally branched off of the northern Dene people of Canada over 1,000 years ago. Throughout centuries, they learned to live in the dry southwestern desert which was the opposite of where they originally came. They learned a different way to survive on the land, with nature, and they adopted and integrated in many ways to the original southwestern indigenous cultures. Now, they have a right to claim to be the indigenous peoples of the southwest, they have earned that title over hundreds and hundreds of years. White Australians on the other hand, have done absolutely everything in their power to maintain their European way of life, at the expense of the aboriginals who they forced into labor to build their European settlements. Not making any effort to adapt into the natural way of living in the Australian land, not giving respect to the culture that has survived off the land for 50,000 years. They even went so far as to try to eradicate them completely. European settlers will always be European. White Americans will always be European.
@@Adam-tx1trincorrect and disrespectful viewpoint. Where did his relatives get born and grow up? Oh right, tasmania. They’ve never even set foot on my side of the globe so why would they claim to be european??? Hot mess. Also the word tasmania is from a dutch word so why would aboriginals be so attatched to the label of "tasmanian" when they most likely got their own words for their identity??? And your last statement is laughably wrong.
French Canadian refer to themselves as Québécois in Québec or Franco-something in the rest of the country, except for Acadiens in New-Brunswick. Franco-ontarien, Franco-manitobain etc.
The other French speaking group in the US who have managed to survive until now are the descendants of Acadiens in Louisiana, the Cajuns, who still speak French among older generations. I met some of them back in the 90s and I really didn't have problems speaking with them. Actually, there was very little emigration from France to the US compared to most other European countries, and most of the people with French descent in the US comes from French settlers in Nouvelle France and Acadie, who came and created a distinct identity as far as the 18th century.
Interesting. The Acadians (aka Cajuns) migrated from Canada. France used to own Louisiana and sold it to Jefferson. Baton Rouge means "red stick." But Bourbon comes from Kentucky which had limited French influence and only started calling the whiskey bourbon due to the county, named in gratitude for Louis XVI of France's assistance during the American Revolutionary War.
one of my classmates here in Germany did an exchange year in Quebec to learn french better.
when we went on a holiday in France a french person turned to me once in extremely broken english just to tell me that my friends accent was horrendous lol
There is a unique dialect in New Brunswick that is a mix of English and French. I've heard it spoken in New Hampshire.
There was also a lot of inter-marriagr between the Quebecois and Irish in Quebec. This trend continued with migration into New England in the last century
Similar with Nova Scotian Gaels, we came from Scotland, and still have probably a stronger cultural connection to Scotland than Québec does with France because we were *forced* to migrate, but we are our own thing
I'm a second-generation immigrant from Slovakia living in Belgium. Both of these are European but their cultures are also very different. I was raised by Slovak parents in the Slovak language and our cuisine is also very Slovak, but I went to school in Belgium, have Belgian friends, and am exposed to Belgian media.
And the thing is... I don't really feel connected to either of the cultures. I am _familiar_ with them but I don't really want to practice either of them. I feel abandoned by both and I don't know what to say my culture is.
This is very common for immigrants in Europe, feeling disconnected from both the home country and the new country. Sadly
You are one among a multitude globally who fall between stools, and do not feel they belong in either group. The answer is: you are simply you. Nationality inherently defines nothing, it's just an administrative definition unless you choose to be part of it. It's just a flag you hang on your ship. Your culture is wholly your own to define, you don't need to be one or the other or even both. Give whatever answer is convenient and don't worry about it. I would encourage you to see it as liberating, if you can frame it to yourself that way; you have a chance to be free of any expectations nationality puts on you.
I'm in the same situation
As a U.S citizen, yes I grew up in the same country, but for me it was still in a somewhat similar manner as you because even though I was born in Washington State, which is on the west coast, both of my parents where from Iowa State, and it is in the mid-west. One difference between the two states is that Washington is a more open state to people from different countries while Iowa is a more firm when it comes to religion, another was the geological and how things where done and seen because of that, for Washington it was water and mountains with all types of nature all around which in turn has people look at and care for nature, where for Iowa it was flat land that is seen and used as farmland along with the Missouri river.
So, yes, I went to school and made friends in Washington, but because of my parents splitting up and having one go back to Iowa, I would go there to visit them along with other family out there, and I would then get a different type of feel from both them and Iowa state itself compared to Washington state and the people from Washington. So in the end run there have been times that I was asked, and wondered myself, which state can I say I belong to and only go by, since I was able to become familiar with each states way of thinking and doing things, a.k.a culture, yet I don't practice one over the other.
But again, that is just somewhat similar since I did not change from one country to another like you and have to learn things like a different language. It is just that even though the states that make up the country that United States are counted as United, that doesn't mean that each state doesn't have their own type of culture that was at one time brought in by or added to ones that where already there. Nowadays it is just a matter of looking for it because of politics making things look like one state is the exact same as all the other states and so on.
That’s kind of pride leads to a lot of great restaurants for all.
If someone online says "I am 50% Irish." it's always Americans. They are also 100% American. I know a guy who's American friend told him he could cook any German dish. When the American guy visited Germany they found out that the American only knew "fake" German dishes that are unknown in Germany.
What's also weird is that if you tell Americans that they are 100% American they refuse to say "Yes". In my brain this doesn't connect to "We are the greatest country in the world.". Why would you deny being only American if you think it's the greatest country on earth?
Countries that are not the result of centuries of immigration never seem to get it. Also, that German dish they are making is probably something from the 1800s that is no longer made in Germany. Diaspora communities all over the world also serve as storehouses of long lost traditions.
50% Irish and 100% American? Quick maths, and they're 150% Irish-American ;)
@@kirancourt Well, a lot of dishes from the 1800s all still around here, while getting modified a little. We did not turn over our whole cuisine in the last decades ;) It's hard to tell without a specific example but there are some things which are not typically done in cooking in Germany and that's a way someone could tell that a dish is not genuine.
@@kirancourt That doesn't explain why Canada and Australia are not like the US.
@nriamond8010 Google "German-American dishes" and you will find many dishes that Germans don't know or at least I as an Austrian have never heard about. And some dishes with peanut butter that are supposed to be German are definitely not German.
Hi!! Your videos are always very interesting!! As an Italian born and raised in Italy that is working abroad at the moment, I've always found this curious. I get where they, for example Italian-Americans, come from as I also have some distant relatives that moved to the US years before I was born and I have never met. I am also a linguist so I find interesting the way language and dialects change and adapt when they get in touch with English in the US. At the same time, I feel like there are some annoying groups of people from the US that claim their traditions as "the real ones" or the "right way to pronounce things" and when you try to explain that those things haven't happened since their families left, they get mad. Or they tell a story and paint a picture of a country that doesn't exist anymore and when you tell them what's actually going on, they get mad. It's mostly the entitlement that's annoying.
As a German who emigrated to the United States in 1954, I never identified myself as German during my first 30 years here. Instead, I would simply say that I'm from Europe. At the time, anti-German sentiment was still quite strong. I assimilated quickly, working to eliminate any trace of my accent. Occasionally, I even adopted a Texas accent to mask any remaining hints of my German roots.
Did you ever visit any of the German speaking communities in central Texas?
@@realAlexChoi Yes, many of them over the years New Braunfels and Fredericksburg, Boerne, Pflugerville, and Walburg in
the hill country. Muenster in North Texas about 80 miles from my home. Of course, Lückenbach is famous for
the country song.
America seems to put more pressure to assimilate then the uk my family moved to the uk from Japan and Italy people still commented on something about the war to them but they never felt pressured enough to put on a accent
In Poland we joke that American Polish people are more polish than Poles themselves
a very honest joke, actually; after 40 years of communism and the period beyond, it actually might sound like a true quote
@@dernochjungenoergler I wouldn't say so. I think the joke means that American Polish act like caricatures
European perspective so I don't know if this is fair or not, but I think the reason we find it annoying is because, as far as we can see, lots of Americans love to shout loudly about their Irish, German, Italian heritage, yet the only thing they know about the culture is the Americanised stereotypes. Add to that the tendency towards anti immigration politics… 🤷♂️
Most Americans Don't mind limited amount of legal immigration who can contribute to The society
@@hasinabegum1038We have a policy/bill on paper now, to solve the situation, with the Senate, most of the House, and the president. But, Donald Trump + Mike Johnson are blocking it, because they want a divisive issue to run against in the presidential election in 2024.
But, what else is new from right wing reactionaries?
Culturally, one's ancestral heritage still informs individual family culture in America. For example, an American family of British heritage in general acts more reserved than an American family of Italian heritage. Beloved dishes frequently cooked will be different. "Heritage" has a lot of facets.
As far as immigration, there is a political divide on the subject in the US - so there isn't an overall "tendency". The current situation regarding immigration right now, is that our southern border is wide open with no control whatsoever - rightfully causing a lot of alarm.
Europeans don't have "anti-immigration" politics? Lolllllll 😂
I know an Italian-American online who often just claims "I'm Italian" but if you then write something to them in Italian, or even ask in English anything about current affairs in modern Italy, they'll completely draw a blank.
I think the reason why Europeans tend to find these hyphenations annoying (or ridiculous, depending on one's temperament) is the fact that often it comes across as only based in 'blood' like determining your status as 50% English, 20% German, 20 % French and 10% Spanish or something when in fact being a certain nationality is considered to be much more down to the culture that's in your mental make-up. For example, I was born in Germany and have German ancestors - if I emigrated to let's say England, I wouldn't suddenly become English even though I love that country and its culture. I would still identify as a German living abroad - but not because of my genes (which are roughly the same anyway) but because of my cultural upbringing. So the guy who called himself Irish-American but had no idea who St. Patrick was is just... incomprehensible.
I have a question which quite fits with today's video:
When we were taught English at school we learnt about the Pilgrim fathers, the Mayflower etc. and got the general idea that Puritanism was the general philosophy in the US and judging from a lot of cultural phenomena in the US, this still holds true. But meanwhile I got wondering how that exactly came to pass: I mean, there certainly were a group of Puritans who came to America for religious reasons, but the vast majority came there for sheer economical considerations and anyway were Lutherans (from certain German regions) or Catholics altogether (French, Irish, other German regions). So how did it happen that the Puritans were and still are that predominant - I remember Kennedy becoming President was in part so sensational because he was a Catholic.
If I remember my history lessons about this subject correctly, it is because the new immigrants did not arrive as the majority at once. Instead, they always arrived as the minority compared to the already existing "american" idea, simply due to ship sizes and shipping schedules. As soon as they departed the ship,they were essentially told to adapt or at least not let their differences show too much. So new immigrants would always have the impression that "oh, the british puritans-descendants are the majority, so I will adapt as best I can to fit in", even when the absolute numbers would tell a different story.
I mean, the KKK hated blacks as well as they hated the "Papist" Catholics. They would routinely beat up Irish as well if they found them in the South. The concept of "whiteness" is purely cultural and certainly not immutable, Italians weren't considered whites until some decades ago.
Even those blood tests are widely disconnected from reality. It might show Europan %, but all of those were already in the US when they mixed and have been detached from actual Europe for a very long time. I'm Polish, but it's like I would say I'm Asian, cause my ancestor in straight father's line was one of Mongol invaders that invaded Europe in XII century, but decided to actually settle down here.
@@Midaspl Oh yes, you are perfectly right - that's why I said that e.g. my 'German' genes wouldn't differ from those of the average Englishwoman as the latter will have a substantial amount of Angles, Saxons and Franks - so Germanic. Its weird to identify with a culture because of it.
I live in the UK and my mother Irish. I consider myself British English because I have went to school, worked and have lived in England. I have a right to a passport which I may get if I every want to stay for a while in the EU. But I am not going to be a "Plastic Paddy" and pretend to be culturally Irish.
The thing that pisses me off the most about Italo-Americans (I'm an Italian citizen of an autonomous region) is that they come to Italy without considering that the country changed A LOT since their ancestors left. Italians were deeply shaped culturally by the last 80 years and assuming all would be the same as what your grandpa or what you see from visiting Italy twice in your life is deeply arrogant. It's like you assume only the US has progress.
I agree with your last sentence that some Americans seem to think only America has changed/progressed.
How many Americans think us Brits all live in castles, live in large stately homes etc.
Surprisingly we have the Internet, cars, aircraft etc. Just like other European countries. Arguably we have better social conditions, employment rights etc than Americans
@@jjsmallpiece9234Learning about the ignorance of Americans is why I want to learn as much as I can tbh!
Though the fact people think Brits live in castles and not houses like the rest of the world is hilarious IMO.
"Oh let me just open the drawbridge" 😂
@@IceGoddessRukia You want learn about them bc you have a gross obsession.
Learning about European colonialism is just as fascinating. The whole world partakes in that practice.
That's one hell of a generalization. Most folks in the USA can probably assume that 1920s Italy vs 2020s Italy are different just like anywhere else in the world lol
I had an experience that left my jaw on the floor when it came to Americans. I was on a video call with an American as a guy from Eastern Europe and she saw a tv in the background and exclaimed "You have TVs in Russia?!"
And like, she's a second or third generation migrant from Kazakhstan. I want to assure anyone in doubt, they do have TVs in Kazakhstan as well, pretty good ones. The girl's stuck in the 60's or 70's.
If we talk about the Russian-American community, they seem to be stuck in the 90's. To them, they are just remembering and preserving their culture the way they remember it, but in "the mainland", we have moved past that and culture changes faster precisely because it's not treated as a nostalgic memory that people want to preserve
I was not expecting the springfield, IL mention. I love the state fair too, the skylift thingy that goes over the fair is always fun
So interesting and thoughtful presentation. I write this with tears as my father who is in his last days researched our family history back to Europe and developed a wonderful 190 page binder of our family tree and info. I quote him in the preface, " As the family storey unfolds, we can see that despite poverty and adversity, our fore bearers persevered in their quest for a place in the fabrique of humanity, hence ,our generation exists, living in freedom and sufficiency for our material and spiritual needs".
In tribute to my wonderful father, and all who have gone before.
it is a sort of phantom pain in their amputated roots.
best explanation😂
How many Germans have been uprooted during or after WW2? And still we handle this very differently.
Exactly. And people who do not have immigrant backgrounds never seem to get this.
@@petraw9792well, Germany having been the cause of so many millions having to be uprooted is a big reason why Germans handle it differently. Plus, moving 100km away is not the same as being uprooted an ocean away.
@@kirancourt You're off by a decimal point (probably a typo) it's more like 1000km. And nothing left to 'visit' or use for genealogy. Plus an Iron Curtain being more of an obstacle than an ocean.
Point is, that's not a uniquely American experience and for many people - all around the world - far more recent and thorough.
I think the major issue of celebrating the heritage by Americans is not that the Americans feel connected with their heritage.
The problem is actually that Americans think their "German", "Irish" or "Italian" traditions are authentic but in reality they are heavily americanised. Sometimes this correlates with an outdated imagination of how the everyday life of modern day Germany, Ireland or Italy actually is.
EDIT: Wow, I didn't expect to get more than 100 likes for a comment. I haven't had so much likes till now. Thanks!
of course it s! that little bit of country-of-origin tradition running in their families usually dates generations back and has nothing to do with that country today - and then they interpret this family tradition from an American perspective, amalgamate it with stereotypes and kitsch...
yeah... its not a connection to their origins they celebrate... its a myth they made up in their head that they celebrate, while creating a major disconnect to the actual cultures they appropriate in the process
I live in Oldenburg, Lower Saxony, in the north west of Germany. I found on TH-cam videos of Oldenburg, Indiana. They clearly refering of my city (colours, coat of arms), but the traditions they celebrate are bavarian. It's so weird.
But I think it's human to want to know, where we come from, to have a non material heritage, so they take their "germaness" and pair it with their knowlege of Germany. So they wear Lederhosen and Dirndl at their "Freudenfest" and go to a catholic church at sunday. (Oldenburg, Germany is protestant since 16th century)
@@kilsestoffel3690I call it the "disneyfication of culture". Your anecdote is a prime example of the disconnect and observed detachment of Americans (of german roots) with the actual and "lived/experienced" culture we Germans living in this land have. Whenever I’m in the USA for a holiday, whatever they claim as "German", I see as vaguely Bavarian with a touch of American-ness added to it (in case of food, the extra large portions of food and the weird combinations) Also, an American I know of no german roots thought that "Wienerschnitzel" is a type of sausage. 😅 all because of their exposure to supposed german culture.
I agree. It seems more like a fantasy heritage than a real one.
I love your perspective on how Americans can cherish their roots and traditions, and share them together. Food is one of the things I think of first as well, because I like to eat and I'm continually amazed at what different cultures have accomplished with what was available to them.
What people from other countries miss about Americans is not that we are all claiming to be Polish or Thai, or whatever. It is more a shorthand for referring to that part of our personal culture. The "German" dishes I cook are the ones brought over from Southern Germany by my great grandmother. I'm well aware that the rest of the world wasn't sealed away in a time capsule and that German culture and cuisine have moved on. But it is more convenient to call them "German" dishes than " early 20th century Baden dishes."
Also, Europeans especially need to understand how many of our family members were "othered" for their ethnicity. Until they somehow "earned" a place at the White table, Italians were swarthy criminals, Slavs were stupid, and Germans couldn't be trusted. Hell, German Lutherans discriminated against German Catholics and vise versa.
Americans inherited the British class system and, contrary to our Declaration of Independence, we really like it. We even invented race so we could own other people. So categorizing each other and sorting each other into a hierarchy is kind of our cultural contribution to the world. You're welcome?
I'm from Austria and also find genealogy interesting. I can see the appeal for people who moved a long way away: one of my ancestors moved from rural Bavaria to Vienna, where he married a Czech woman. I could trace their journeys through their birth and marriage certificates, but I'd really like to know what made them leave their home towns.
I also traced a few branches of my family that emigrated to America in the 1800s, and looked at the towns where they eventually settled on Google street view. What's really interesting is that they ended up in areas with a similar overall look as the part of Austria that they left behind... The ones from a mountainous area settled near some high hills, the ones from flat grassland settled in flat grassland. I'm sure that helped them feel more at home in the new world.
Thanks for the video! I do appreciate the depth you go into. In the UK, and possibly eksewhere, its common for people with immigrant ancestry to say they are "a quarter Irish" or "half German" etc.
I had an Italian grandmother, so I used to consider myself "quater Italian" - but I became uncomfortable with this as I got older. No one alive in my family speaks Italian. Even my mum and her brothers never learned Italian from their mother. The only active vestiges of Italian heritage left is the fact that we were mostly raised Catholic, and we love our spaghetti bolnenause and get into very technical conversations about the right way to make it!
To my mind, a Somali refugee who has been living in Italy for years-decades and speaks italian, etc, has a far greater claim at being Italian than we ever will.
It is "Spaghetti Bolognese". Just to spare you future embarassment :)
They have Somali heritage and you have Italian heritage. You can have Italian nationality but no Italian blood. With the world being so global now moving to another country does not remove your ethnicity. People have different views on the topic but if you live in a country with multiple ethnicities you are more aware of your roots. I'm Australian but my Irish heritage is very important to me and a big factor in my identify.
@@jackieblue1267ethnicitie is something very personal and to be part of an ethnicitie means to have a very deep understanding of the culture, at least speaking the language well. You can't reach that understanding of a culture without having lived there for quite some time.
@@Andreas-pj6np A diaspora population is still connected to their ancestral home. They can also be very beneficial to a country. You can have a very deep ancestry in a country and feel a love for that country which is visceral. I had a relative that went to the US when she was young and when she came back to Ireland she used to kiss the ground. I think that sort of connection is not something people should dismiss.
@@jackieblue1267that's true, but that makes someone (for a example) an "american with irish heritage" and not "an Irishman/woman".
I must be considered a bloody mess.
Swiss, chinese, italian, german, swedish, british and irish.
And I then get told of by a yank in Atlanta who defines himself as irish and he has a grudge against me for my very british accent.
The real irish barman stopped that.
I live in Ticino, Switzerland.
lol.. ya sounds very US American 😁
and Switzerland(Sweiz) and Sweden(Swede) r mixed up by US American by alarming frequency, im Swedish btw...
@@Patrik6920 Switzerland and Sweden have never been confused among Americans. Never never. Another forced false stereotype to put on us.
Brits don’t know what Atlanta is 😂😂
@@wtfdidijustwatch1017 ofc not sweetie, ofc not .. 😁
@@wtfdidijustwatch1017 Atlanta is where this coffeinated soda comes from, isn't it? *knows her Billy Wilder movies*
The thing I've heard a lot over the years and that really frosts me is "my mother is half Cherokee". It's always Cherokee, never any other tribe, and those people wouldn't know a rain dance from an adulthood ceremony.
chuck norris is 1/8 cherokee because he ate one a while ago.
maybe these guys did something similar ^^
True, I used to think I was too when I was a kid but then I found out it was really Taino.
I wouldn’t consider myself Native though. I just know my grandfather was very closely related to the Native Americans.
Mine is quechua and yanomami 🤝
That's because the Cherokee open up to white settlers at the time they even had slaves so yeah that person is technically Cherokee it's not their fault they can't control the other part of them unless you believe that stupid blood Quantum 😒
@@heroic9631Taino is Native though. They were some of the first people to ever make contact with the Europeans when they sailed here.
I have a correction, as a European: what bothers us is not that Americans claim to be Italian, irish, German or whatever. Is that 90% of them say, for example, "I'm Irish" while knowing ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about Ireland or whatever beside some trite and massively outdated cultural stereotypes. If/when they have an actual connection, or desire to form said connection with the actual place and not Hollywood's idea of it, it's be lovely.
Americans don't love their heritage, because save for few exceptions they don't know about it and, more importantly, they don't care to learn about it. That's what irritates people who are still on this side of the pond.
To me it often feels very gross and exoticising. Like my culture just exists as a fun fact for them to share at parties, I guess.
The audience on this channel is becoming more and more international, great! And respectful interaction.❤
I have a problem when Irish Americans claim that Irish people who arent white or whos parents came from eastern europe arent Irish. How dare people who have never set foot here tell people who were born and raised here that they arent Irish enough because of weird American genetic theories that europe threw out 70 years ago.
And if you are saying Irishness is just a gene thats what you are saying. But if you are just into genealogy that's harmless enough.
This is really stupid. I've never seen that situation live but every time I see comments under anything about migrants, LGBT etc on X or FB, good number of profiles are Americans that are claiming Irish roots. I'm always laughing at them because my children are more Irish then any of them will ever be.
Right, imagine a person with 100% English ancestry born and raised in China claiming they are Chinese. They'll never be Chinese, just born and raised there, know the language and culture, but never be considered Chinese. If a German Shepherd is born in Japan it's still a German Shepherd, the same way if an Akita Inu is born in Germany, it's still an Akita Inu. @@kingofcelts
@@kingofceltsYour second paragraph is beyond belief.
This!!! Ditto with Scotland - if your home is Scotland then you're a Scot, whether you and ten generations back were all born and raised here or if you just rocked up a year ago with no relations whatsoever and decided to stay. My man Adil at my local pharmacy who did just that is more Scottish than someone who can trace all their ancestors to here but has never even visited.
@@kingofcelts Ethnonationalist detected. Away and get in the sea with that shite. And why, pray tell, are Poles and other Eastern Europeans more "acceptable" to you? Gee I wonder...
Excellent video as always. Got my brain rolling. Sorry for the poor editing on this, but just some rando thoughts on your video. Family history. My maternal grandmother was born in Hungary and fled war-ravaged Europe as a child in 1919. She married another Hungarian Immigrant so my mother was raised speaking Hungarian. I spoke some while growing up. Now my Great Grandmother was very proud earning her American citizenship and would buy a new dress to vote in each presidential election. The love for democracy and America is strong on my mother’s side. It was only further strengthened when her cousin fled the Hungarian revolution in 1956. However, they retained a strong sense of being “Magyar”. We celebrated Halottak Napja (think of a memorial day for those who had passed, much like the Mexican Day of the Dead), ate halászlé at Christmas time (not may favorite) enjoyed Palacsinta (My favorite) and Hortobágyi Palacsinta (almost like enchiladas). Being born and raised in Los Angeles, I have always joked that Hungarian food is the Mexican food of Europe.
My mother’s side of the Family fought in Both World Wars for Hungary, but when the generation that grew up in the US, all my uncles served in the U.S. Military. My Cousin and I served in the U.S. Army (27 years for me). My family strongly supports “being American”, while retaining traditions that are as much as family as it is culture. But like Germany, Mexico, etc, our culture contributes to what constitutes American culture today.
I’ve been traveling, working in Germany for over 25 years. I have lived the last 7 here in Germany and even own a house here. 25 years ago, I was constantly made aware of my Ausländer’ness (not fremde, or gaast). Today, it is not a big deal. And made an effort to assimilate as much as possible. I am tied into the local community, have many German friends, working on my Pfälzisch Dialekte etc., but I am always the “American/amerikanisch”.
There are many multi-generational ethnicities in Germany who are always labeled as the country of ancestors’ origins. There is no hyphenation here, I would argue for “tribal” reasons. edition.cnn.com/2024/02/28/opinions/black-germans-racism-black-history-month-apraku/index.html. It is only recently that Germany is addressing that problem with their laws. One of the first things I get asked by Germans (and Europeans) is what is my family background. They are curious as well. Having said all that, and the Germans aware of their own history, my “otherness” is really no big deal.
Germany is not Europe. Experiences I have had in other countries; in Hungary, I tell them I am American but mother was full-blooded, they would then tell me that I am “Magyar”. When I was working the 100th Commemoration of WWI with the French. I was in a conversation with the mayor of Verdun and he asked my background. I told him that I had paternal great-grandmother from Verdun. He then told me, “Bienvenue chez vous, vous êtes assez français pour nous/welcome home, you are French enough for us”. Not the same for Germany, even though my family fought on the same side….
Freiburg is a college town. It is not North East Germany, which, well, you know. Freiburg, as well as the major cities in the west have a more tolerant attitude. In the country, the fondness towards outsiders does fall off bit. But that is in every country.
America has a similar population as the Canadiens, we call them Cajuns. They have a related history to the Canadiens. For Canada and Australia, maybe being under Mother England played a part.
U.S. The Melting Pot is not assimilation. The analogy is solid if you allow the understanding of melting things together brings the component parts into something new and better. Amalgamate maybe a better term. Amalgamate the good stuff from whence you came into the American Culture. You must melt (alloy) iron and carbon (and tungsten, manganese, etc.) to make steel.
On Teddy Roosevelt, I would that in the context of his time, he was concerned about the rising influence of Communism and Socialism especially from those immigrants coming from Central and Eastern Europe. I know that his position, in time and context, may seem strident, but I would assume that taking the full melting pot analogy and recognizing the contributions of other cultures in the formation and continual development of the American Culture, he might have altered his stance. Heck it was the Dutch that gave us Wall “De Waal Straat” street. “Right, President Roosevelt?”
this is a fascinating essay, thank you! consider writing an own blog ;)
@@dernochjungenoergler Thank you for the encouraging words. I have resolved to write and blog more this year. 😀
What a great video! Thank you so much for explaining it! I was always wondering why people identify themselves as e.g. “Polish” or “Italian” if they are “American”, but it makes a lot of sense now :) I’ve noticed that some Canadians love doing the same analogy and also in some South American countries you can often hear people self identifying with the culture of their ancestors, especially Italian. I feel like we’re more proud of our cultural heritage when we live outside of Europe and that translates to later generations. Greetings!
Fascinating topic, fantastically prepared. Thanks Ashton!
Yeah, I am Italian born and bred and when I hear one of them say "I am Italian", I cringe. Especially when they think some things are 100% typical and instead they are known only by them (like Alfredo pasta, it does not exist here). Thank you for shedding some light and thank you for your videos. They are really well done and you are very very well spoken!
Zio, io sono sardo, immaginati quanto parlano con me e non capiscono nè da dove vengo, nè perchè le nostre tradizioni sono un po' diverse. Come se poi la Repubblica Italiana non avesse tipo 30 lingue all'interno ed una diversità antropologica gigantesca.
Don't be mad because pizza is better in the USA than Italy. Italy still has better pasta for now (even though they took that from Asia).
@@thisiswilsonTotal nonsense. Pasta was known even to the Romans. Chinese pasta has nothing to do with Italian pasta. Neapolitan pizza is the best in the world and it's not the general Italian pizza but the specific one from the city where pizza was invented. Domino's had to shut down in Italy because they were losing money. Mcdonald's and Burger King are still open in Italy because they offer something that Italians like to eat occasionally. American pizza chains instead are not competitive in Italy.
@thisiswilson You have never been to Italy. An Italian wouldn't lay a finger on your disgusting chemical food ingredients. You don't know what a tomato tastes like. In Italy the food is more important than the church. Keep your plastic food and I'm not even Italian, I am german but don't mess with the food of our Italian friends. Italy is from Südtirol to Sicilia the country with the best food every region has a lot of specialtys you never even heard about. Greetings to all real Italians out there.
@@zaqwsx23 People seem to thing that things can't be 'invented'/'discovered' independently, in fact there are things that have been forgotten/lost and then rediscovered many times over in different places throughout history.
The sign for Blomberg at 8:57 into the video really grabbed my attention, since one of my immigrant great grandfathers came from Blomberg, but it's the one in the former Lippe (NRWF). I see that yours in in Niedersachsen. I've had the good fortune to visit "my" Blomberg twice, and even see the house my great grandfather lived in before he came to the US. My father knew almost no details of his German heritage, so I think my great grandfather would be amazed at what I've been able to discover (back to the 1600s). Love your videos.
Blomberg is a lovely town. Do you know it has a webcam showing the Marktplatz? A great opportunity to observe every day life like the farmer's market (Friday morning) - I was there a few days ago. On the 1st Friday of the month they have a small event with information to special topics in the booths there, last Friday it was "Health" and I helped a friend.
As a naturalized immigrant to the US, I was always puzzled when meeting people telling me that they are "also" German, i.e. some ancestors came to the US in the 1800s. They frequently encouraged me to join one of the many German clubs in the area where I live. I feel I have nothing in common with the folks in those clubs, who usually don't speak the language and are culturally stuck in the 50s, preserving an idealized way of life that may have existed before I was born. Also: Germany has many different local traditions and what is celebrated in the US as being German is usually Bavarian. Coming from the North, I don't relate to that. Ask an emigrant from New England to identify with cowboys as being quintessential American. So, yes, I am German-American in that I hold dual citizenship and have deep connection to both places. My children, although they have dual citizenship, do not identify as German-American. They speak very little German and only know Germany from vacation.
I have ancestry from the areas shared by Scandinavia and northern Germany, and this bothered me a lot. I think a lot of it is the result of the sheer number of immigrants that came from that greater region, including the Sudetenland, basically determining the culture that others would meld into in areas of the US.
One of the most important causes is the US Census & the way immigrants were treated. First, you have the problem of "one drop" of African blood classified a person as a Negro. Second, from 1850 to 1890, Irish and any central or southern European immigrant were listed as Non-White, only a half step above blacks. Third, from 1880 to about 1960 anyone with Irish, eastern or southern European heritage, no matter how many generations removed was treated as a second-class citizen at best. Therefore, it became VERY important for "good" immigrants like Germans, to remember and emphasize their heritage, while "bad" immigrants could never be allowed to forget theirs. As late as the 1979, the US media regularly made fun of "bad" immigrant heritage - Google "Polack or Wop Jokes". In response most Americans became super attached to their ethnic roots, celebrated their heritage, and made sure that their children & grand children would NEVER forget their ethnic roots.
@@gregorybiestek3431 Yes. Even though German ancestry is pretty prevalent, a lot of people in Europe may not be aware that Germans got targeted pretty harshly during WWI, which led to German-Americans on one hand clinging to the ethnic identity in private life and cultural things, but also very readily altering names, changing the types of businesses they engaged in, and such to avoid being boycotted by Anglo-Americans.
it existed long before I was born... but I embrace it anyway. The modern world is a cancer.
My parents came to Germany from Turkey, a few years before I was born in 1976.
There is even a slight possibility that my mother's parents were of Armenian heritage making them crypto-Armenians. Because of the genocide in 1915, where 1,5 million Armenians got killed (today, there are 2,8 million Armenians living in Armenia, which, if you think about the massive losses, makes this genocide once more indescribably devastating), many people fled to the mountains, converted and erased their history. Nobody really speaks about this topic.
Although I am not very fond of the concept of national borders, it does haunt me that my mother and we may never really knew and will know our real ancestry, that this trauma epigenetically was buried deeply in so many lives. Although there is nothing proven, I feel a weird sense of closeness to Armenians.
I do think that we have a strong inner urge to know our roots and history that is ingrained in our subconscious, and because nobody in the US, except for the Native Americans, has his or her roots on that continent, it may be a uniting aspect that leads to this expression. And I also think this is a result of documentation and education, that migration (not seeking asylum because of war for example) isn't just a thing that happens somehow randomly, because of several reasons like harsh weather or declining food sources - for the last centuries people decided consciously to try a new life in a certain country they already heard of or where ancestors moved to. So this also forms a kind of identity, if you know where your great grandmother came from and what kind of different and tough life she must have had to leave her country. It's the tales, that used to be passed on to the children verbally and got washed-out by the time, but today can be read and researched.
To me you are honestly one of the best TH-camrs.. Thank you for always making me think.
I believe the wanting to "know the roots" is a cultural thing. One that even harms society as a whole because it produces a "we and them".
Genetic tells us that we are all one species with some adaptations to regions where our ancestores stayed for a while. Like skin colour changed where there the sun wasn't strong enough for Vit-D-production.
But (I think) we are a product of our upbringing. We are what our parents and the culture around us make us.
@@Chara_Lar, I agree just up to a certain point.
The moment we started to settle down about 12000 years ago during the agricultural revolution, and we were no nomads anymore, we invented the concept of heritage. Because it was important to leave the inheritance to the ones that came after you, this concept of the own roots became a vital point of tribal growth and building societies. I could write about the world before that, but that is another topic, that would take too much time.
It's way more complex than just the upbringing, the ego-consciousness doesn't just work in the present, it understands the future and therefore the past. We understand, that, because we or our ancestors did something certain or came from a certain place, we today are living the way we are - apart from constructed nationalities.
Our parents are the product of their parents, their parents are the product of their parents - and there we have epigenetics kicking in. We carry the trauma of 2 or 3 generations before us without even knowing it consciously. And if you look at ancient cultures, this is not a modern concept, tales of ancestors have always been around, and the yearning for identities is nothing new. What is new is the concept of so-called "races" (which in fact doesn't exist, because we are one single race, the human race) and the rating of humans based on their or their ancestral past. The weird and often death bringing idea of people being better than others based on their belief system or skin colour. The territorial craziness that is called national border.
nations have a right to homelands, whether or not you like that is irrelevant
Your comment is the only one I've seen so far that explains why their heritage is so important to Americans. I don't think most Europeans who have never moved out of their countries can understand how important the connection to one's own roots is. I am Norwegian, and have always lived in Norway, but I can still understand it. My family is originally Sami. The Sami's are the indigenous people of Northern Scandinavia, Finland and the Cola Peninsula in Russia. Due to the Norwegian state's attempt to wipe out Sami language and culture, I grew up without knowing/understanding that I actually was Sami. All my grandparents could speak Sami. Even my father could speak the language, but when I asked why, the answer was that it was useful to learn the language of people who lived in the same county.
Because parts of the Sami people were nomadic reindeer herders, it was difficult to subsume them. Therefore, the language and culture survived in parts of Norway. The policy that was pursued was a typical divide-and-rule culture, where it was possible to pit different Sami groups against each other. It was very devastating, and I had to be close to 40 years before it dawned on me that Sami was actually the mother tongue not only of all my grandparents, but also of my own father. Then I aready had moved south and married a Norwegian.
I had always felt that there was something missing in my life. I had all the material goods in place, but even though I embraced my own Norwegianness, the attachment to the Norwegian was something that came from outside. My culture was not properly Norwegian, and I could sense it. Norway's northernmost university has referred to my home village as the largest Sea Sami community, but when I was growing up I only knew of one Sami, and he came from the core Sami areas inland, where the reindeer-herding Sami lived in the winter, and where Sami language and culture were natural.
Discovering and acknowledging that I was actually Sami was very important to me. Missing pieces in life's puzzle fell into place. Even if some Sami's who have always known that they were Sami do not completely agree with me that I am Sami, I knew that I actually was. I didn't have the language, but I had grown up in a redefined Sami culture, in my own home area where my family had lived as far back as we knew - probably very far back. I understand how important it is for Americans to know their own roots. Our genetic and ethnic heritage helps to shape who we are, and if we do not know this heritage we are not whole as people.
It is possible Norwegians in general are more open to Americans embracing their Norwegian heritage than other Europeans, because most Norwegians are very proud to be Norwegian, and traditionally we have been proud that Americans still in our time embrace the country and culture their ancestors emigrated from.
I warmly welcome them to Norway, even though I am ethnically Sami. It was not my choice to become Norwegian, and it was not their choice to become Americans. When their ancestors left, they did so out of necessity, and the longing for their homeland and family (which they would never see again) must have been immense.
It is natural that their descendants several generations later, when they have the opportunity, will travel back to familiarize themselves with the land their ancestors came from. That they refer to themselves as X% Norwegian, German or Greek we should take as a compliment instead of being offended that they do so. This is nothing to be offended by. It is an honor, and is done out of love for the land their ancestors migrated from. By visiting the country, most of them will also very likely realize that they are more American than anything else, but it is also possible that they will finally realize why they themselves stand out from what is typical for Americans.
But You are German, regardless where Your ancistors came from. Germany is middle europe, people have always came from the north, the south, the east or the west. And as an industrial nation, people were coming here for a long time. More or less, there is not any explicit German identity, despite of the language ... and who will live, work and love with us will be somekind of German soon.
Thank you for another great video. For me as a German it is highly interesting to learn how Americans identify themselves. Americans (like Canadians and Australians) are in a very special situation, as the vast majority of them descend from immigrants. This comes with downsides and upsides. A downside might be that it´s more difficult to find a common, not too abstract aspect of identification. The upside is that Americans are less restrained from a longer history and have more options for identification. Furthermore I think that variety (be it ethnical, cultural etc.) is a big strength to build a promising future. This cultural variety is one reason why I love your country and its people so much. I hope many Americans can embrace it. As German I am a little bit proud that many Americans have German roots and that the German immigrants and their children together with other nationalities built such a great country.
I want to point out here that migration happened also within the European continent even before the great wars. It’s such an American belief to think Europeans are “purebred French” or German, etc. So many wars forced people to move or for example the Hugenottes who fled from France to Germany because of religious persecution. Not to forget that borders have changed over time several times.
@@steviea.7825 One of the most important causes is the US Census & the way immigrants were treated. First, you have the problem of "one drop" of African blood classified a person as a Negro. Second, from 1850 to 1890, Irish and any central or southern European immigrant were listed as Non-White, only a half step above blacks. Third, from 1880 to about 1960 anyone with Irish, eastern or southern European heritage, no matter how many generations removed was treated as a second-class citizen at best. Therefore, it became VERY important for "good" immigrants like Germans, to remember and emphasize their heritage, while "bad" immigrants could never be allowed to forget theirs. As late as the 1979, the US media regularly made fun of "bad" immigrant heritage - Google "Polack or Wop Jokes". In response most Americans became super attached to their ethnic roots, celebrated their heritage, and made sure that their children & grand children would NEVER forget their ethnic roots.
Maybe we Europeans should claim our Visigoth, Frankish, Ostrogoth, Alan, Saxon, Angle, Vandal, Burgundian, etc etc ancestry.
Russia claims that they are ‘Rus’
You do lol Spaniards claim Visigothic heritage and history for example
@@ShutUpBubi please. Anglo-muricans claim to be "modern Rome" more than any real Mediterranean does.
Yeah why not?
I suppose one might view that as being a big Quixotic
I grew up in a rural corner of the county of Norfolk back when all telephones were beige and Sandwich Spread was still a thing. I always wanted to come from somewhere more exotic but it turns out my family arrived in the British Isles on the first Thursday after the ice retreated, and decided to stay.
When I was a boy, my mum would drag me to Hingham church every Sunday to sing in the choir (Philip Larkin was right about parents you know). Now, Hingham is very small (pop. 2,500), and yet every Summer, Americans would travel thousands of miles to visit the village and surrounding countryside. Back then a good few of these visitors were still old airman from the Eighth Air Force, come to remember those things that need remembering, and gently instruct young boys on the precise meaning of the phrase 'the last full measure of devotion'. For the rest, they were here because their families had come from Hingham, and not just their families but the families of some notable figures, most notably the great grandfather of Abraham Lincoln (see above re: devotion).
Back then it seemed awfully strange that people would want to travel half a planet to stand in a churchyard in the backend of Norfolk, but I think I understand them better now. I come from this place, and part of it is forever lodged in me, right down deep. I was born in the old N&N, I live a stones throw from Carrow Road, and when I shuffle off, whoever's left will probably scatter my ashes up at Horsham St Faiths along with my parents. It's good to come from somewhere, however humble it may be, and to know that the roots of who you are go deep, even if they are half a world away.
If I were in America and I told somebody, "I am german", and he responded, "oh, I'm german, too", only to find out they do not speak german, know very little about the country and have one pair of german great-grandparents I would feel annoyed. To be german means something to me, it is a culture and a heritage and a way of living. My ancestors down to the 7th generation all lived in south-eastern Bavaria, I even know the exact farm where the first person of my name lived.
I loved to see the videos about your search for your ancestors in northern Germany. I can see why it is important to connect to your roots, especially if you come from a country of immigrants. However, being german means something else, it means not to jaywalk, it means to be straightforward, it means to do things right the first time.
I'm glad you feel at home that much as to apply for german citizenship. My heartfelt welcome.
No offense but being German is literally just a piece of paper in modern day Germany so pls stop the glorification of your shit culture
But if you move abroad, would you allow your grandchilds call themselve germans, just because of their descent, not knowing anything else about Germany.
I think you would. You would be proud on it.
@@holger_p I would be embarassed, if they would call themselves SOLELY "German" - that shows no respect to the effort and influence of the country they and their parents were raised in. Something like "German-American" would be acceptable from my perspective (or in "German heritage" in later generations).
@@lisad.9957 That's correct, and the other way around.
But if they define their language in a way "german" means "German-American" then everything is fine ;-)
The other people are called "German, from Germany". A more complicated expression, but since it's less often topic while talking, it's OK to take the longer form for the rare need.
Americans are allowed to define the meaning of their language.
They also always say "Berlin, Germany" to not get mixed with "Berlin , New Hempshire". Just "Berlin" is probably meaningless without context - to Americans.
@@holger_p Yes, there are different semantics used when an American describes themselves as "German" in comparison to a native German. And the acknowledge of this fact on BOTH sides would probably solves most discussions. So Americans also have to be more mindful of their wording and its implications when talking to non-Americans - especially on the internet where everyone speaks international English (not American English) and they are in the minority. And non-Americans have to be a little bit more chill when an Americans calls themselves "Italian" etc. as long as Americans don't claim to a part of that country's contemporary society or customs.
An interesting post. I think it also has something to do with age. I am German and will be 50 this year. For about two years I have been interested in visiting places from my childhood or early adulthood (place of residence, secondary school, barracks from my military days). I think this is for similar reasons as the fascination with his origins. Finding roots, combined with the desire to bring these roots closer to my son (17 years old) and give him an idea of who I am, where I come from and maybe also explain a little why I am the way I am. I can absolutely understand people in the US and the "obsession" with their heritage.
it's definitely cool to be interested in your roots and express that. not that it can't get weird. it definitely does get weird sometimes. but weird does not mean bad.
identity can be weird sometimes.
as long as as there is no attempt to feel superior because of some connection to a certain nationality or race everything is fine.
you do such a wonderful job! We all have different stories and depending on the enviroment you grew, your family’s history etc.. you may have your reasons to have an afinity towards your ancestors and where they came from. Keep up the good work :)
Proudly claiming their foreign ancestry who came to the States often before there was such a thing as regulated, legal immigration and then turn around and hating on "those illegals". These mental gymnastics always stun me...
If you spin that further the first (european) settlers were all illegal immigrants. The Native Americans wouldn't have given them legal documents 🙂.
“My ancestors came here LEGALLY!”
Translation: Jumped from a ship(quite often paid for by immigration agent/agency) and signed their name in a book… sometimes got a plot of land as welcome gift!
To make things worse, they idealize a country which their ancestors fled because life there wasn't good enough.
Let’s not forget that what lies beneath all these mental gymnastics is pure, unabashed racism. White undocumented Europeans = brave settlers; brown Central Americans crossing the border = illegals requiring immediate deportation.
The idea of "nationalism" plays a huge part in identity politics.
I am fine with "German-American", but not "German" if you are not.
I think this is just a quirk of language. If you said you were German-American I might assume you were a German immigrant to the US. In an American context, it's clear that they are talking about their ancestry. Many people from Central and South America, for example, dislike the use of the word "American" just meaning someone from the US, but that's just the word we have in English for now! It's not meant to cause offense
"German American" quite literally means an American who is German
@@shaunsteele6926 Like African American is in fact African? Nonsense.
@@PeterSlazy yes, they are in fact African if they are black
American tourist in Germany: I‘m 35% German
We Germans: 🙄🤦🏻♂️
it would be a good start if they would at least learn how to pronounce their first name properly. 😅
You speak not for me, I`m german, too.
@@WolfF2022Leute wie du sind der Grund warum Amerikaner so einen Scheiß wie "Die Deutschen waren nicht so schlimm im 2ten Weltkrieg." oder ähnliches sagen und sich dann als "Deutsch" identifizieren.
No WE appreciaze it ...
@@marvin2678 No
You did a beautiful job talking about that subject. As a German being quite familiar with US culture I love the connection that you are making with this video. By that you are showing that everyone on this planet has the need to get in touch with their ancestry. Why? Because it’s important to get in touch with your own identity in order to have fun engaging with it and that of others. It’s human.
American identity concepts are strongly influenced by Victorian age creationism, even for people who aren't creationists. The implicit assumption is that people are somehow unchanging entities over time. It's why people complain if Cleopatra is not portrayed by an Egyptian actress, completely ignoring (a) her Greek origins and (b) that gene drift and migration mean that modern Egyptians have little to do with ancient Egyptians.
Like all false beliefs, this is inherently dangerous. In this case because Victorian age creationism is not linked to hideous racism by chance. If there is no change and no spectrum, us vs. them happens automatically.
Thank you for this! I had hoped the darker underlying idea of the "my DNA says I'm 0.5% Icelandic!" craze would be discussed in the video, so I am happy to see it brought up in the comments. Not to mention, the DNA tests you can take for heritage are pretty scammy, which should not be a surprise considering how European borders shifted over centuries and how intertwined Europeans were with people from the Middle East, western Asia, and North Africa throughout history (e.g. Roman Empire, Crusades, Islamic Conquest of Iberian Peninsula, Genghis Khan, Silk Route, just to name a few buzz words).
The bit about modern Egyptians having "little to do with ancient Egyptians" is wrong and it's important to point that out because this kind of misinformation has been used to falsify history.
Genetic studies done on ancient mummies show a surprisingly high degree of genetic relation to the modern inhabitants of Egypt.
Americans have little to no nuance regarding genetics and general migration that happened ever since the dawn of humankind.
YOur comment was the better.
@@Diluculi1 Thank you, too!
I thought your analysis was really insightful and definitely provided me with some new perspectives. As a European, it usually just seems odd when Americans so strongly identify with the nationality of a vague historical European ancestor, when they often know nothing about the culture or the language. The only thing that makes them 'Italian/German/Polish' etc is just their bloodline, which feels like a very American thing to focus on. Sure there are people who are still familiar with cultural practises or some might be first or second generation immigrants, then it makes more sense. I myself am Dutch and my family has done quite in depth ancestry research both on the paternal and maternal side. On the paternal side I know our family goes back centuries to the exact region most of my family still lives. On my maternal side, I know there's some German ancestry, but people would declare me crazy if I were to identify as 'Dutch-German' for that reason. Perhaps also because these are neighbouring countries and it's obvious and natural to expect that throughout history people moved all over the continent, so I probably have ancestors from many places if you look back far enough. When Americans say they're 'Irish-American' because one of their white ancestors stepped on a boat multiple centuries ago, it makes that connection seem forced and over the top, which plays into the stereotypes Europeans already tend to have of Americans.
Hello. Thanks for the content on your channel; I have watched some of your videos. In some ways I have a similar situation as you: born in the US but now living in Sweden. However a difference is that I have lived in Sweden ~35 years but only ~25 yrs in the US.....
In Norway and Sweden there are television series (the Norwegian one may have been discontinued) where groups of Americans come to the specific country to compete through a series of challenges towards the ultimate "prize" and premise of the series: getting to meet their "family" on this side of the pond. Since I know the Swedish version better, I will continue with that. The participants in the competitions visit different places in Sweden, experience different aspects of present-day Sweden and learn both about the country today and the 1600-1700-1800s Sweden. But as some of them say, they learn something about themselves through participating in the program. Each participant gets a "Special Day" where they are taken to a location where one of their ancestors lived and they get to open a symbolic little chest which includes a letter that they read out loud talking about their family history. Some get very emotional and cry, others speak about how they recognize their own life and families in the US in the lives of their ancestors that they are finding about (Sweden particularly but the other Nordic countries as well have fantastic records from the 1600s.)
One by one there are eliminations until the grand finale where typically the 3-4 remaining Americans are finalists. The winner gets a family re-union among dozens sometimes almost 100 living distant relatives in Sweden.
The Swedes (I will count myself as one of them despite being born in the US) watching "Allt för Sverige" and the Norwegian watching "Alt for Norge" ... what do they/we get out of this entire program? In the snippets of the casting films when people in the US attempt to become part of the program, we get to see lower and middle class everyday life in the US as the participants introduce themselves and how some of them have, frankly, borderline miserable lives that some Americans have in their day to day life. And some live in huge houses and seem well off but could be on the cusp of bad times if both "breadwinners" suddenly lose their jobs, an all to common risk with Corporate America.
We also get to see the participants "entering" Sweden with all sorts of cultural baggage from their family traditions and myths about Sweden. And slowly at times but sometimes very abruptly they realize that the "Sweden" of say the 1800s that is the foundation of their "Swedish-American" identity ... no longer exists...anymore. Society has moved on but they haven't: they are stuck in an semi-artificial identity that exists nowhere in their "homeland." Sure, a house that their great-great-great whoever lived in may still be standing, there may be letters that descendants in Sweden have kept for generations, letters written in Swedish by "Swedish-Americans" in 1890 or 1920 to relatives in Sweden, kept and cherished by a former generation of Swedes....and that the participants may get to see these...
Other things we get to see (either in the program or on OTHER YT channels e.g.) are examples of "traditions" that Swedish-Americans have kept but are not longer truely Swedish..of today.
www.google.com/get/videoqualityreport/?v=kgwaq9oIbKs
Continued:
These "traditions" look quaint or a bastardization. The quaint could be costumes and food that are now rare or no longer really exists in Europe. For example, *some* Swedish-Americans in Minnesota are really into a bread called "lefse" which essentially no longer exists in Sweden and is truly more or a Norwegian kind of thing the only places in Sweden where there was lefse in the past being largely on the border with Norwegian. My wife, Swedish, had never heard of lefse.... And then, apparently, there are Swedish-Americans who eat peanut butter on Swedish hardbread - usually called "knäckebröd" in Swedish - and to add insult to injury put JAM on top. The Swedes (in 2020s Sweden) just politely smile at this culinary monstrosity and think to themselves "disgusting, uncouth so 'American' of them to ruin a good knäckebröd" since that is definitely not something you put on Scandinavia hard bread.
Another person posted elsewhere as a comment "It is the presumptivenss with which they present their ignorance as fact." and to some extent that really sums it up.
"Type Ashton" if you get this far (and anyone else that has gotten this far) you can look up Allt för Sverige on wikipedia alternatively type Great Swedish Adventure and learn more. The programs are also shown on svtplay.se but you probably have to be in Sweden (IP address) to see them and they can be from time to time unavailable.
Soooo... how should the academic summarize this. Well not "cringe" but sometimes somewhere near that.
By the way, have I said yet that this is a really really good video. Like I mean I think of only seen three of your videos including this one and I can't remember the second one, and this is even better than the one about religion and church tax and all of that. This is really really good. Even if I sounded super defensive before I started watching it :-) I am going to share it with a couple of my friends - maybe even the one named Gordon :-) , definitely the one who spends all her time on ancestry, I wish I had more time to talk to my friend who was born in India. But I don't know what I would ask. Unfortunately those friends are getting to the age where they need to spend time taking care of their elderly parents and they just don't have time for friends. Oh and once upon a time a friend loaned me a book called ethnicity in family therapy. Years later I was wandering through the house of another friend's mother and I saw the book again. She had written a chapter in it. I don't know whether you've ever heard of it. I don't expect that you would have. But I've run into it twice. And it sounds interesting. Even though that's not my field. I think ethnicity is fascinating.
I'm German and I spent an exchange year going to high school in Missouri and living with American host parents. Rural Missouri is full of German-Americans, too.
I think a lot of Americans identify with their old ethnic roots because they have a desire to be part of something that goes back further than their still relatively young country that is the United States. Indications of that are the way that it blows American tourists' minds when they see random towns and buildings here in Germany that have existed for 500 or 1000 years. The U.S. has few things that remotely come close to that, and my take, in the most well meaning way, is that some Americans try to compensate their own short history by identifying with the usually much longer history of their ethnic origin.
I agree with what you have to say about this and would add a hypothesis I have that many of the ancestors that came to the US were trying to preserve their heritage and culture so their kids shared the same with them, who then passed it down, etc. etc. I don't agree with the folks that take it way too far, but sometimes it feels like there are Europeans that are frowning upon something that they essentially created by being proud of their heritage if that makes sense
@@whotyjonesthey were proud of their background then...but the 3rd and 4th and 5th generations are "proud" of something which no longer exists in the country of origin and the way some X-Americans act as another person posting here wrote " It is the presumptiveness with which they present their ignorance as fact." that can really rub some the wrong way.
@@whotyjones Being proud of your heritage is great. Being arrogant and argumentative with a person about THEIR country and culture when you're several generations removed from it is very irritating, to put it mildly. Those people ruin it for the rest of them. So maybe it goes both ways, you don't like people from the US being stereotyped. We don't like it either.
Thank you for this video. I think that is important not only for Americans to findout about their roots. It is important for many Europeans now. After 2 world wars the population here is mixing up quickly. This trend is only fastening today. Knowing about one's ancestry is like having a personal link to history and to mankind as a whole. A person that knows that it has ancestors from many parts of Europe and the world will be much less vulnerable to racial, religious or national hatred than others who think that the place that they share with others is their property.
And the responsability for the fate of mankind will rather grow.
Thank you for content and greetings from Kiel. One world, one people.
Thanks for another great video!
I live in Sicily. And Sicilian Americans and Sicilians cannot be more different! 😂
Most Sicilians immigrated to the USA over 100 years ago so yeah that'd be expected...
1920s Americans vs today couldn't be more different
Im German, my mom fled from Czechoslovakia as a two year old, my dad was Austrian. I don’t get the hyphonation unless you are first generation in the country growing up between different cultures and different languages. I grew up in a very small town in Bavaria and spoke differently than the other kids, they also did mob me because of it. I can mostly speak in Austrian dialect, mostly in Bavarian but usually I speak more high German than my sorroundings. Mom lost her czech as a kid but we have different Christmas traditions, different cookies with special moldes. I did not feel integrated I was more on the outline. I would be that generation growing up between but I wouldn’t hyphonate my heritage. Im just German thats my nationality, thats my language. Im trying to get my Austrian citizenship back. Double citizenship was not possible back then. But in the moment and for the last decades I’m just German.
You don't have german ancestry? If you don't, you should go to austria or your mothers land.
@@user-bd6ln8gp3f why?
@@user-bd6ln8gp3f
Austrian heritage is German heritage...
They were part of the same country for a millennium and Austria was settled by Germans in the early middle ages.
To not count it as such is as ridiculous as not counting Southern heritage as American heritage.
My grandparents immigrated from Germany in 1952, so I'm happy to have grown up with a bit of the culture, language, and traditions (I wish I'd been taught the language more as a kid, though I'm learning now). I think because of this, whenever I see or hear something German, I associate it with my grandparents and it makes me smile, so that's why I'm so into my heritage. Especially because they've since passed, keeping that connection with my German roots feels like keeping them close. ☺
me: Just choosing a random video
you: showing places from my everyday live I never even heard mentioned on the internet
Hmm… this "cringiness" that you mentioned that we Europeans might feel, well, for me it doesn't have to do with any kind of "cultural appropriation" or anything like that - I really don't think, that there's anything wrong with celebrating your own roots - for me it it is more like how detached this cultural heritage necessarily becomes from the respective modern culture.
As a German it is unthinkable for me to think about German culture without the history of the Third Reich, the devision of Germany, reunification and our own struggle to accept that Germany itself has become a country of immigration and has to confront its own racism. When I look at these celebrations of German heritage it looks like a window into a 19th century past, that doesn't exist anymore - and may never have existed in that way. From my nowadays perspective I can't ignore that the nationalist ideology of that era was one starting point for the horrors of 20th century history.
And so it feels difficult to celebrate all of this in an unbiased and carefree way. Perhaps to do just that is an American privilege.
Oh, it’s no privilege, it’s good, old ignorance. We, of the US, easily deceive ourselves of many historical facts and turn them into our perceived fantasies.
I know for my German heritage, it's absolutely a connection to a 19th century past. All of my relatives came over at some point in the 1850s-60s and that's where it ends for me. I feel no connection to 20th or 21st century Germany. I've actually thought, while learning about WWII, that I'm glad they left and we didn't have to suffer through what Germans today had to deal with. Because we're connected to such a distant past, it makes it much easier to feel unconnected to more recent history. It's also why "German" in the US so often looks like cartoon Bavaria- we don't have any real images of where we're actually from- most of us don't even know! So we use stock footage of stereotypical German stuff.
@@reginakeith8187but why is there the feel for a need to illustrate it with more contemporary "stock footage of stereotypical German stuff" that looks "cartoonish Bavarian"?
Why not fill this need with more historically accurate images? They might be a little bit more difficult to find (but certainly not too difficult anymore) but would also be much more relevant to the own history, wouldn't they?
The issue I see, is, that there is no such thing as a cultural definition independent from its point in time. Being unconnected to recent history of a society means being unconnected to that society. And there's the difference between being German and having German heritage. The Holocaust is part of a German identity and as difficult it may be, it still is important. Even for people choosing to live in Germany today and becoming German, whose roots are from somewhere else.
@@patrickhanft I was thinking of things like community celebrations that celebrate German heritage while looking 19th century Bavarian- some of those traditions and celebrations are very old and go back WAY before there was an internet, so things weren't so easily researched. They look now as they've looked for decades. Also, few Americans have a connection to a specific region of Germany- most people don't know where they actually come from other than "Germany". The most prominent imagery available here is Bavarian.
As for being disconnected from recent history- When my ancestors came here from Germany (some north, some south), they were 'othered' into generically German, not Schleswig Holstein, Thuringian or Hessian, which is how they would've thought of themselves. They weren't considered Americans by other Americans. My grandmother was several generations removed from those immigrants but still grew up speaking German and still were seen as German until she started school when she was forced to speak English and 'be American' because to do otherwise was to be considered a traitor- this was during WWI. Many Americans of German descent clung to their German-ness in the most harmless ways possible (food, work ethic, or generic celebrations in their community) and distanced themselves from modern connections because it wasn't safe to do otherwise. Any connection to actual Germany ended when they crossed the ocean.
@@reginakeith8187 Bavarian imagery has to do with two things and isn't restricted to the US only, but exists also within Germany besides strong local patriotism of other regions. 1. The importance of Bavaria increased because of the German division, having most of the German industry re-established there, what later spread world-wide. 2. The relativly strong importance of Bavarian government since 1945, while having US/German military presence in that area, what encouraged celebrating Bavarian traditions.
As a Pennsylvania Dutchman involved in our language and culture preservation, I'd love to highlight a few things:
1.) We had a very unique and distinct melting of cultures and identities from a specific region and different religions and backgrounds that formed into what we call "Pennsylvania Dutch." It is also based on a very specific period of time. The biggest influence is Pfalzisch (pre-French invasion) and we call our language Deitsch because of that, not a "bastardized form of Deutsch." The idea that Dutch was a bastardized form of Deutsch is the popular myth. When our ancestors immigrated, there was no Germany as we would identify it today, it was the Holy Roman Empire. (Swiss populations also arrives, I only mostly know of Amish and Mennonite groups, but I am sure there were non-Anabaptist Swiss immigrants at the same time).
(We don't say Deutsch in our language. Schwetz Deitsch.)
2.) Our language was affected by anti-German sentiments in WW1 and WW2. It caused a massive decline in our culture and language across the board. My relatives born in the 1920s had horror stories. (Imagine being born in the USA in the 1920s, going to school once you are of age in a one room school house, and you only spoke Pennsylvania Dutch because that is still the pervasive language of your area. New laws pass, and your new teacher comes in and beats you bloody and other severe punishments using all different tools just because you never were taught English as a first language; and this was to a German-Dialect speaking Americans in the 1900s, which was light in comparison to other historical events, particular POC & Natives).
3.) We all identify as American, but Pennsylvania Dutch is also viewed as an American culture and American way of life; we don't even call Germany the "fatherland" or "motherland", we call it the "Old Land" or "Other Land", depending.
4.) The biggest one: everyone assumes we are modern American-Stereotyped-German culture; we are not. Our foodways are not represented 100% in places like Hofbrauhaus or your local "Germantown Restaurant/Pub." People assume we are all Amish; we are not. Influence from the tourist industry, the World Wars, and pushing for a homogenous ""American" identity has caused stereotypes that decimated our "authentic" culture and foodways; yet most, if not all Pennsylvania Dutchmen identify proudly as American and adapt. However, I read so much made up stuff, exaggerated "informational pamphlets," or severely watered down versions of the culture so much that I realized two things: most Americans do not know what Pennsylvania Dutch is, even in many parts of Pennsylvania; and if they heard of the Pennsylvania Dutch, they only know the stereotypes and coupled with resources that are not well known or easily accessible to the general public.
5.) FOOD! It is a huge mix of traditional Germanic dishes and cooking styles, but also mixed with local ingredients, other cooking ways, and brand new dishes! Our food has been labeled an American style cuisine, and I think we all agree that it is. It is a Germanic style of cooking that has adapted to the region and called it our own.
Although a long and not well written comment, I hope this perspective is something of interest to anyone else that was curious enough to read the comments! Amazing video, love the topics, and love the different feedback in the comments!☮
Macht's gut
Interesting.
In Switzerland since at least the time of Nazi-Germany 1932 Alemannic dialects (I do not like "Swiss German dialects", they belong to the Alemannic dialects spoken also outside Switzerland) are preferred spoken media language over "Schriftdeutsch", the written language as used in Germany and Austria.
Kind of refusing to be considered "German" by using "own" Alemannic dialects instead of "their" language that is used only for writing.
thank you for a really interesting post! being of German ancestry and living in a non German speaking country with zero German community is a tough challenge in regards of preserving your German consciousness, to be honest; therefore, I have always been fascinated by the Pennsylvania Dutch being able to preserve their culture and most importantly the language, which is apparently rather a seldom accomplishment amongst the German-Americans, I reckon; I remember discovering the heavenly beautiful Dutch songs sung by John Schmid; I'm sorry for my bad English eventually, I'm happy when I could handle my German and the country-of-residence-language ;) btw. do you still speak the original Pennsylvania Dutch language fluently or at least somehow? :D (sorry if you have mentioned it above;) )
I'm from the Netherlands, and I always thought it was exceptionally cringe. Especially since my experience being that those most vocal about being (Irish | German | Italian | Dutch)-American, seemingly tend to know least about those countries (up to being asked if we spoke German in the Netherlands by multiple people). However, the way you explained it, and especially the parts about the melting pot cultural assimilation stuff, and your neighbors at the village of cultures... I get it now. Thank you for teaching me and helping a jaded Dutch bloke grow a bit. 🙂
The question about German in the NL might come from the Pennsylvania Dutch - whose ancestors weren't Dutch, but came from the Palatinate in Germany. "Deutsch" became Dutch and so that confusion started.
Similar to "Hessians" as a term in the US for all the auxiliary troops from the Germanies the British brought over during the revolutionary war. A big part of them were Hessians, but not all of them. My home region, Waldeck-Pyrmont, sent ~2k soldiers, about 3% of its population - it was a poor state and people were the only thing the ruling prince could "export" to get money (and get rid of landless peasants who might have started unrest).
Though over a century later they sent a princess to become queen consort of the NL, which became a much more successful export ;)
Excellent choice to mention the Mormon genealogy site. Altho, I think you should have made quick mention of the fact that the impetus behind the establishment of this archive is not so the LDS church could monetize it by selling its records to Ancestry.
The reason this huge archive was established is because of Mormonism belief and practice of post-death conversion, the controversial idea that members of competing religions could be converted to the Mormon faith after their death.
Also, I am surprised this video is not sponsored by Ancestry or another genealogy site. The tie-in is obvious.
Canadian here, of mixed but mainly Scottish descent, but with a French last name. Thanks for your astute observations on some of the subtle differences between Canadians and Americans on this.
First, one note on your point about French Canadians, which was a really important clarification. The distinguishing feature of French Canadians is that they speak French, whether they are descended from France, Haiti, Algeria or wherever. French Canadians speak French as their mother tongue. Quite different than the over 40 million German Americans. Most French Canadians of French descent (pre-British conquest in 1759) feel little if any connection to France, the way say Italian Americans do.
As for me, mostly Scottish descent, I look Scottish and I know I still use some expressions that are Scottish in origin and my very Canadian accent has even been mistaken for Scottish a couple of times. I also play in a pipe band, kilt and all. But I see that as something that is as much a perpetuation of the Scottish culture and influence in Canada, as Scottish culture itself. The Canadian army has, after all, had highland regiments since pre-Confederation in the early 1800s. I am proud of my heritage, and feel a tug on the heartstrings when in Scotland, but I am Canadian. Not Scottish Canadian. Canadian. I notice the difference in how this plays out at highland games in Canada and the US. The feeling is somehow different. At Canadian games, it is mostly performers/participants in kilts and other highland attire. Some spectators in kilts, but not a lot, and mostly just a kilt with otherwise normal "Canadian" attire. And many spectators are clearly not of Scottish descent, which is awesome! In the US, highland games can look a bit like a Renaissance fair or a cosplay event, since there are often attendees not just in Scottish attire, but dressed in period costumes. Other than military re-enactors, I have never seen that in Canada ... just some random people walking the grounds like they just came off the set of Outlander or Braveheart. There seems to be more emphasis on the Clan villages and ancestry-related focus as well in the US.
So yes, subtle, but I think you are right - it does play out differently in Canada compared to the US.
If a Scot is riding a motorcycle do they wear anything under their kilt?
th-cam.com/video/Jj9STmoRkeA/w-d-xo.html :)
True but there are also Nova Scotian Gaels who still speak Gaelic to an extent
Please watch French Canadian channels and listen to French Canadians radios and you will notice that the content is refering quite a lot to France (since France is their origins and still by far the epicenter of the "Francophonie") and that the language used is French...
That I know of so-called Italian-Americans mostly watch/listen English-speaking TV/radio channels...
Hi Ashton, thank you for the thoughtful video. As a Spanish/German I visited the US many times and I immediately knew, what the common element is: The basic idea of the United States was to build a republic with democratic elements. And many of the "american" ideals are build around that idea, which is independent from genetic roots or faiths. This was at that time completely new and just separate from the genetic origins of their people. So clearly, being an American means firstly heving identified with this idea of statehood and secondly having a genetic ancestry or faith. So - having settled in the US and having identified with this general idea (this is what Roosevelt meant I think) - there is of course plenty of room to celebrate Oktoberfest or sing gospels in Your church.
Well said. You’ve actually hit the spirit of America and what it represents worldwide - spot on! However, the current climate doesn’t necessarily reflect that zeitgeist. We live in hope 🙏🏻 that those ideals and aspirations will once again be remembered and honored. ~ Pax 🕊️
That was NOT the intention of the American founders.
@karlheinzvonkroemann2217 Regardless, that's the mythos we operate on today.
@@zombieboy937 mythos = propaganda
@@zombieboy937 The word "regardless" doesn't apply to stated falsehood about history! It's a made up BS statement.
Great video and information. Greetings from the Republic of Ireland
This video does a good job of explaining a lot of the nuances, and I applaud that. The only bit I will challenge is that while hyphenated identity is more stereotypically American, it's absolutely part of other countries as well. I myself have met Brazilians who say they're Italians, Canadians who say they're Swedes, Australians who say they're Irish, etc. I am not sure if such identities actually are less common in other settler countries or if they just get less attention for whatever reason.
Personally, I will add that it annoys me when Europeans are mocking about this phenomena. Aside from the fact that the mocking rarely demonstrates any sort of understanding about what drives it or what it entails, it just feels very self-centered. My ancestry, heritage and all that is mine, and while it may be tied to another country I don't live in, it is still about my family story and not the modern face of those countries.
Case in point: if an American calls themselves, say, German, around Germans, then those Germans have every right to challenge that. But if an American calls themselves "German-American" then that's not something a German can challenge. German-Americans are Americans, not Germans, but they are also distinct AS Americans.
As a Norwegian (from Norway), I think it's fine if Americans want to learn about their heritage. I'm happy to talk to Americans who are interested in their Norwegian heritage, and I have (they seem excited to talk to a Norwegian). There was an entire show here in Norway about Americans with Norwegian heritage trying to connect to that heritage and find any family they might have here, called "Alt for Norge" ("All for Norway"). You can even find episodes on TH-cam. Of course, the show got a bit over the top and I'm sure the Americans seemed unusually excited to learn about Norwegian language and culture (there was also money to be won).
I think what annoys me and other Europeans isn't so much the excitement to learn about your heritage or identifying with it, as much as it is claiming you're FROM that place ("I'm Irish", "I'm Italian" etc.) and claiming you're not only FROM there but actually MORE authentically Irish, Italian etc. than actual natives from these countries. No kidding, Europeans have been told by Americans that they are less authentically [insert nationality/ethnicity] than the American. "I'm more Irish than Irish people because of X, Y and Z!" There are many threads devoted to these kind of Americans on the r/ShitAmericansSay subreddit, where they claim to know about their cultural heritage but are wrong because their understanding of thart heritage is uniquely American, like the Norwegian-American who claimed tater tots as a "Norwegian" dish when none of us Norwegians have any familiarity with this dish.
Anyone claiming to be "more authentic" than the current natives is someone who is trying to feed their own ego. How obnoxious! But also please realize that diasporas are storehouses of old ways, foods, words, and traditions that may no longer exist in their country of origin.
You had those dishes several generations ago!
@@koushikdas1992 Tater tots?
I once saw this Facebook page that was about fun Norwegian facts and it mentioned our Easter crime tradition and it was chock full of butthurt Americans proclaiming this to be false because their distant relative was a good church goer and never did this... meanwhile every single actual Norwegian in the comments there just went "yup, this is a thing", but the Americans kept arguing and refused to believe it (one argument was someone knowing someone who had been in Norway for 17th of May and had never heard about this... well duh, completely wrong time of years... lol)
@@mkitten13That is funny! But since Påskekrim only started in 1923 its not surprising that some immigrant communities who arrived to other places before that would not know about it. This is a good example of how immigrant communities preserve the past because they live in it! Haha.
thank you for shedding some light on this, for us europeans, weird topic.
Get over it
It's not weird.
@@Tar.o thank you! it's a stupid attitude, indeed
Hello Ashton ! Thank you for that interesting video.
I think family history is a quite natural way of remembering your roots, your ancestors. For some families that could be quite simple due to staying in one place or at least region for several generations. But I think the history of the last century has changed that situation for many families. WWI and particularly WWII have caused many to leave their original home region and forced them to move to a very different country often with even a different language or dialect at least. Such memory is kept in European families too.
BTW, although wars have been a cause for migration in Europe I know that economic reasons have played and are playing a much bigger part. And there's a lot of history involved. Germany and Germans are a good example for that: they were asked several times in past centuries to come to settle in regions in East Europe: Romania, Hungaria, Russia. Similarly German governments and companies were asking people from Poland, Italy, Portugal, Turkey and many more to come to Germany for working and earning a living.
And even if people are just moving within Germany, it's often a welcome subject to talk about. At least that's what I know and remember of my own family with ancestry in Baden, Austria, different parts of Swabia and even Westfalia.
Possibly that interest for ancestry has been brought to the USA from Europe too. And maybe it's more prevalent in the USA than in Canada and Australia because their history of immigration isn't as diverse as that of the USA due to its earlier formal and actual independence.
By the way, concerning the opposite direction one could draw some attention if not admiration by mentioning an "uncle or aunt in America" some decades ago (and maybe still today).
so your roots are in bloomberg, awesome, i moved to that area 12 years ago. it was nice to see my new home in your video :)
but to the topic at hand, i am playing with amaricans online, and very often when they learn that i am german they say, oh i am german too! at first i became realy annoyed, cause in general those people dont know anything about germany beside lederhosen and oktoberfest nor do they speak the language, but i became more relaxed about it and take it with humor and say something like lets have some beer and brezel :)
On the topic of "French Canadians" and regarding what you say in the video, I don't think I've ever heard anyone say "Canadien Français" in my entire life. In France we only use "Québécois" or "Canadiens", but mostly the former since Canadiens is more general and could nowadays designate the anglophones as well.
As a French person it would be weird to call a Québécois "French". We make a clear distinction between the French language and the nationality when it comes to Canadians. Their French language is also distinctive enough for a native speaker from the French language spoken in France. While the French language is one of the main aspects of the French identity, other cultural norms are also important. Québécois, while having kept some French cultural traits, are clearly not French, and have an obvious North American way of life.
The term ‘’French-Canadian’’ has always confused me like how are they French when they have been Canadians for 400 years? They speak the language natively but that’s about it really
It’s like referring to the descendants of the Plymouth colony as ‘’English-Americans’’ and that identity wouldn’t go well outside the USA or even inside the us
@@Niko-yb9ptWell like you said a vast majority of them had their French ancestors (who originated from the same north-west parts of France) coming to "Nouvelle France" 3 or 4 centuries ago. There were about only 50.000 of them in Canada at the time of the conquest by the Anglos and since then they have multiplied within that "very French" homogeneous population base (same origins, religion, language, geographic space, traditions, etc.), now there are about 8 million of them.
In a sense they are like a preserved time capsule of what France was in the 17th and 18th century, their french language sounding both traditional rural France and "old French"... Their family names sound so "Old France" : Robitaille, Gagnon, Mercier, Dion, Charlebois, etc.
They contrast with the current mixed population of France that includes a vast array of additional more or less "ancient" origins (Breton, Flemish, Alsatian, Italian, Corsican, Basque, Spanish, Portuguese, North-African, African, Polish, German, Lebanon, Vietnamese, etc).
In a sense they are closer to what France was for many centuries (let's say up to the French revolution) than France has been since the 19th century.
It's a nuance probably difficult to grasp for people who are not francophones (especially not French or Canadian).
@@jandron94 I understand but isn’t being of French descent the default in the French speaking provinces of canada?
I mean Canadian anglos of English descent from Toronto don’t refer to themselves as ‘’Englishmen’’ or ‘’English Canadians’’
If an American Francophone from Louisiana identified as a Frenchman he would get shit on in Europe and other continents
@@Niko-yb9pt Canadian "anglos" have probably "broader origins", ie they don't have 100% of their 17th or 18th ancestors coming from Devon, Dorset or Hampshire... They are less homogeneous and more influenced by the US (they speak with a kind "US american" accent and share the same culture)
The Québec insigna is "Fleur de Lys" used in France from 10th to 18th century... in some aspects the Québécois stand closer to "old traditionnal France" (for instance their language and family names sound so much like old rural France). The English-speaking sphere around the world is less centered on England that the Francophone one is on France...
@@Niko-yb9ptPerhaps just a way to express language in a nationality? We have a similar thing in Finland: a Swedish-speaking minority of ethnic Finns, who are called Finn-Swedes ("suomenruotsalainen", which literally means Swede of Finland), even though they are not Swedes. They just speak the language.
Thanks for the astute observations about the American approach to multiculturalism. As a Canadian, I also appreciate you noting that Canada and Australia are similarly nations built by widespread immigration, first from Europe, abd since the 1970's, the rest of the world. However, with all due respect, I beg to differ regarding the hyphenated dimension of national identity. It is equally common in Canada for people to describe themselves by their ancestors country of origin in addition to tge country in which we were born and raised. For example, I refer to myself as Irish-Canadian, abd many others go by the designation of Italian-Canadian, German-Canadian-Ukrainian-Canadian, Polish-Canadian, Dutch-Canadian, etc. . . Also, as someone born in Montreal, Quebec, the heart of French-Canadian, I can assure you that the term "French-Canadian l" is used to indicate the first language of the individual, rather than their ethnic origin, as many Québécois today are immigrants from places like Haiti, Cameroon, Cote D'Ivoire, etc . . .
What about an English Canadian?
@@djs98blue English-Canadjan, as in a Canadian of English ancestry? Or, an English-speaking Canadian? They're two different things?
The "ethnically dubious" expression "Québécois pure laine" refers to the population (~6 million) that kind of traces back all its ancestors to 17th or 18th century "Nouvelle France" ... that is a very cohesive and homogeneous population.
I can understand that some "Montrealers" (anglos whose ancestors arrived more recently) feel estranged from that "old French" population that is still the majority of Quebec (and still masters on their own land).
@@djs98blue What about them?
@jandron94 My Irish, English-speaking ancestors arrived in Momtreal in the 1830's, so mot so recently, lol.
I`m impressed, this video is now online for 10 hours and when i will read all comments it will take the rest of the week till your next video. ;-) Greetings from Hamburg
I find it really charming that we have this melting-pot of a country on our globe, where not only all European cultures are present in one way or another, but even the more exotic countries are (like Asian and African ones). I can see why people would want to know & value their roots, as my own documented family tree goes back to the 14th century and it gives me a feeling of continueing a path bigger than myself as well as honoring the will of my ancestors by leading a live my future offspring can be proud of. It's a beneficial psychological automatism that would work on anybody in my place (so I really couldn't judge someone who calls himself "50% this ethnicity with 20% of that and 10% of another one.."; for I can see where this comes from), and to get a little bit political, I can also see why it's in the interest of some ideologies and movements to cut people's roots. Anyway, great video & thanks!
I am an American. I am bi-racial I have a name that doesn't match my appearance. I've spent the majority of my life explaining "where I'm really from". Those who are like me are forced to identify our ancestral heritages under similar circumstances here. Which in turn, gives one an affection for those heritages. It's like assigning yourself an identity in a place where identities are hard to define. Not everyone comes to the United States under the best circumstances, so attachments to the places where they originally came from are very strong. Very interesting video.
German here. I don't mind people saying they have German ancestry, not at all. I do mind them claiming they are german, sometimes even german-american if they are generations away from the people immigrating and don't really have anything to do with the culture and language anymore.
Who cares? Also, German-Americans have had a huge identity here.
Ashton
Sat on my bike wondering what podcast to listen to… why don’t you port your episodes to become a pod as well. Well some of them you can’t but stuff like this one… yes.
Cheers/Tom in Gävle Sweden
I have a bit to add. My mother was always interested in being of Scottish descent (although really mostly English). Her grandmother was Scottish, an immigrant, and of a small clan called Neish. I've been tracing our genealogy lately, as it is a fun hobby, and tracking back the easier trails (I have some Jones ancestry, not easy). There's a family story of Native American ancestry that the older generations didn't talk about, so very uncertain, although genetically confirmed. For the Scottish ancestry, though, my mother passed along to her children a genetic disorder, a connective tissue disorder called Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome, the hypermobility variation. I asked around, and it turns out that it came from grandmother Neish. Okay, so this is a small family, and I think it would be worthwhile tracking down where this disorder came from, and let the rest of the family know. So I'm in touch with a couple of the Neish genealogists over in Scotland and doing a little detective work. As I'm a retired epidemiologist, this sort of thing is right up my alley.
My other family story is my wife's. She is Korean, a former Peace Corps language teacher, and we married 50 years ago when my term as a Peace Corps volunteer ended. Korea keeps its vital records in something called a 호적, a family register, akin to the old European family bible. Copies are sent to the government bureaus, the the originals are held by the family. When a woman marries, her name is moved from her father's family record over to her husband's. However, my wonderful mother-in-law realized that I came from a benighted country that has no family register, so she recorded me into her family's register, with my wife. At the time, if one married a Korean and was recorded in the family register, one becomes automatically a Korean citizen. It's doubtless more complicated and bureaucratic now, but that's how it worked then. So I guess I'm Korean. On the genealogy end, my wife's family knows their family history back to when they came to Korea from the mainland (there was no China, but that location). Her mother's family came to Korea around 800-900 CE as Confucian missionaries, and her father's family, three brothers, came around 600 CE and joined the Koryo army as high-ranking officers. The records are continuous since then, everyone had surnames, the whole deal. So is she a hyphenated Korean? (joking).
Hold on, I'm getting there. Don't have this app.
Apologies, with a bit of examination that appears to have been a scammer.
I have to say, I disagree with some of your conclusions on this one. As a European, having to deal with Americans telling you they are British / Irish / German / whatever is the default experience, and it just doesn't happen with people from other countries who have had similar levels of immigration. For me, it devalues the experiences and struggles of people who actually are from those countries.
I'm British, but I think that must be especially true for Irish people who have had more than their fair share of struggles. A lot of Irish people I know end up having a strong dislike of Americans in general, because of the attitude "Irish-Americans", many of whom couldn't even locate Ireland on a map.
The vast majority of Americans I encounter over here aren't as educated or eloquent as you, and think of it as all a fun game. For Europeans whose direct families have dealt with generations of struggle, war, terrorism or famine, it can come across as quite insulting.
I feel like a lot of us here in the US are a lot different than what most Europeans may see Americans as. A lot of the people who do such stupid things tend to be looked at as annoying here too. They just tend to be the type to travel more. A lot of the people who can afford to travel over here tend to be quite arrogant.
I find it pretty cringe, to be honest. In my experience as a Pole growing up (bilingual) in America, I met many people claiming to be "Polish" who didn't possess the slightest whiff of Polish language, culture, or historical awareness. Culturally, they were indistinguishable from other white Americans describing their European ancestry. Not only was it absurd to encounter, but it also minimized the cultural differences between us and erased my own experience. What makes it even more cringe is that so many white Americans are so precious about their heritage, and---this video is a case in point---don't seem to reflect on how self-indulgent this practice is when we live in a country alongside Black people who get lumped together as "African-Americans" because they don't have any records of what African nation their ancestors were kidnapped from. This is not to say that white people can't be interested in or proud of their European heritage. But ultimately being 1/16th this or that does not make up for a lack of personality. Because, frankly, that's exactly what nationalism is about: telling people who they are when they can't figure it out for themselves.
Very interesting look at this topic.
I'm Canadian with Slovenian ancestry (all my grandparents were from there and came to Canada in the 50s and 60s). From my experience, it's common for Canadians to just say Irish/Italian/Chinese/etc because most people understand you're referring to your ancestry (it commonly occurs when meeting new people and they ask about your name) and this is what I do when in Canada/US. Going to Europe is different. When I went to Slovenia last year for the first time, I never brought up my ancestry except when it seemed relevant or when asked and I would answer I have ancestry through my grandparents or say the name was Slovenian because just saying you're Slovenian on it's own would imply you have Slovenian citizenship. It's all about knowing who you're talking to and where you are.
I mean it also helps when you still have a connection to your ancestry. I grew up with and still follow a lot of the Slovenian traditions, culture and enjoy/make the food because my grandparents were still with me when I grew up and my parents continued them as well. I know a few very basic sentences and some words in Slovenian (mostly picked up from my grandparents and parents, though also some recently from actually going there last year), but am no where close to being fluent since my parents wanted to make sure I learned French in school growing up and didn't want to overburden me at that age with another language (French is my second language and since I'm from Montreal is very useful).
French-Canadians speak French, yet German-Americans don't speak German.
Actually, not true. German used to be spoken by most German-Americans up until World War 1, and even then, there are places in the U.S where German is still spoken in communities.
No one cares about your one-off 98%+ of "German-Americans" can't even speak a damn word or German. What a joke.
I was born in America to Greek immigrants - brand new immigrants, in fact, I was in my mother’s womb when my parents migrated to America - lived in America for the first 10 years of my life and lived my teenage years in Greece before moving back to America for my senior year of High School. To the Greeks, I am an American, to the Americans, I am a Greek - seriously, I am without a National identity. So, in my case, it’s more of a Greek / American which, I feel, makes me a nomad for life.
Hi. I look forward to your post every week. I’m Norwegian but have lived in every continent. The Norwegian king had a speech on this very topic some years ago. It’s posted on TH-cam as Kongens tale or Kings speech. Enjoy
Insightful and interesting 👍
Glad you enjoyed it
Open up Gisele Bündchen wikipedia page, it clearly states that she is, and I quote: "a 6th generation German-Brazilian". She even had German classes at school because she grew in a former German settlement.
This strong connection is rare.
@@holger_pThat isn’t true. Some Western Europeans are getting ahead of themselves thinking most of the world thinks like them. For most of us, Western Europeans come across as somewhat too philosophical. So should ethnicities like Jews, Roma and Armenians with long histories of diaspora communities be disregarded excepting the ones who managed to remain in their homeland? What about the Patagonian Welsh and the Chipilano Venetians? And the Amish people? And the Cornish who no longer have their own separate country from England? It’s understandable Europeans want to create a sense of unity in the national community of their countries, but you need to be realistic that people do have different ethnic identities. Even if people have lost part of their culture, it’s natural they would still feel part of their heritage ethnicity because of the family connection and their parents would have quite certainly influenced them in their upbringing.
Asking questions like “do you feel more European or French?” really don’t seem to make much sense because you can be both part of the European Union and French at the same time. They’re independent aspects of your identity. It’s like asking “do you feel more a part of your family or the local community?” which actually sounds quite insensitive.
@@sikoyakoy2376 These are young post war heavily propagandized people. They don't understand Americans and they don't even know their own histories. Propaganda works on 80% of people. This is a well known fact.
These are isolated towns where Riograndenser Hunsrückisch, a variant of the Hunsrückisch dialect, is spoken.. Most Brazilians of German ancestry only speak Portuguese.
@@holger_p German-Americans used to have strong connection back home, it was until World War 1 when stuff like that changed.
Hej , I am Canadian living in Danmark for 38 years . I normally say to folk here that I am from Canada but then , many people start speaking English to me ( i do speak English and Danish very well with a slight accent ) so, often, I answer them back in french and tell them that I am " French Canadian " . Maybe I should only use Québecois .
Norwegian here, and funny coincidence but one of the local trainers at the gym me and my parents used to live near had a French Canadian (Canadien) trainer. Is this pure coincidence or are French Canadians particularly prone to travel and llive in the Nordic countries?
...By th way, I met an elderly Italian-American tourist in the train a few years ago ,he was proud of his heritage but , when I started speaking Italian with him , he very soon switched back to English because his Italian was not good enough to support a conversation.
Loved your video, Ashton! I celebrate our family's combined 5 nationalities. My parents were Italian immigrants who went to Montréal and that's where I was born and raised. I met my German husband and moved to a town near Stuttgart 30 yrs ago. I have fun asking my kids, teenagers now, how they see their roots. They say that they are half German and Canadian and they look Southern European because of their Italian grandparents. My siblings married partners from Cuba and Finnland. 😅
Dis-eux que tu viens de la belle province. 😀
I am literally an extension of my grandparents who taught me their background through daily assimilation of their culture and values. There are no (OR)s needed. Just as I can switch languages in the middle of a sentence my cultures are equally mixed. When I visit Ireland, Sweden, and France I immediately and instinctively know where their sensibilities are based. My grandparent's accents and language kick in within a couple weeks and locals can discern which region my family came from in the country.
Interessting video! 😊👍🏻 The TV show «Alt for Norge» (All for Norway) explores this phenomen in an entertaining way. Many clips on TH-cam from that show.
I am Dutch and live in Amsterdam. If I see Americans with Dutch roots on tv, they don't look like people here from the Netherlands. They look like people from the past and often also with very conservative opinions how the Netherlands should be today.
Netherland has right wing govt. today. So, you can call be conservative, as well.
Not yet .@@koushikdas1992
It’s because they stuck to their old ways and passed it down . Lots of religious Dutch communities in North America .
We live in Holland MI, one of the places where the Dutch who emigrated to the US settled in the 1830"s and after. There was a theological division in the Dutch Reformed Church in the Netherlands at that time, liberals vs conservatives. The liberals won and so the conservatives left, and this is one of the places where they settled. The separationist approach to church life was so strong that within years of arriving here, they had another fight and further divided between the "Dutch' and the "More Dutch" along theological lines?
Today Holland is known for our Tulip Time festival with thousands of people coming from all over the country to see this unique place. We actually live on 'Tulip Lane', and buses of sightseers drive by all week during Tulip Time (first week in May).
However, the people here know that choreography of the 'Dutch Dance' that is part of the festival was invented here, The "Dutch" outfits are all designed here based upon some thematic elements from 19th century Netherlands. The wooden shoes are all made locally.
It's actually less about the authentic experience of Dutch immigrants than it is American capitalism at its best - it is the most profitable time of the year.
Love your channel Ashton!
@@koushikdas1992 It has no right wing government today. Right wing party won the election but we are still in the process of forming a new government and till today there is no result of that