+Scott Nahler Of course they think that root beer is vile. The spoon heads drink hot fish juice, and the most popular drink for the ferengi is slug-o-cola "the slimiest cola in the universe'".
Small point with you mentioning the Trail of Tears. It was not an exclusively Cherokee horror. I am of Choctaw descent and we, among other tribes, were also forced on that death march. I have no idea why most people are only aware of the one tribe.
biblegirl. Because the Cherokee so badly bungled their own removal. Chief John Ross (voted out by Chief Ridge's faction) had fought removal in court for years BUT when he lost insisted on outfitting the trail with supplies HE procured from colleagues with large federal funds. He was late, underpurchased, overpaid and pocketed the money. Then when the Army said no more stalling, the expedition was a mess. The Ridge Faction of the Cherokee got to Arkansas/OK with much more ease, as did the Pushmataha Choctaw, the Chickasaw and even the McIntosh factions of the Creek. It is only three states over and not through desert. A much easier trek than The Oregon Trail. Oh BTW, the Ross faction murdered the Ridge faction after they got to The Nations. Gang style assassinations at their homes and businesses. A history often overlooked in the details or misreported in Whig newspapers that hated Martin van Buren and wanted to beat him in the next election. Statistics of deaths are way overstated. It was a very sad affair, and I wish the nations had stayed in the SE and become part of the modern states. Oddly, the Whig papers did not over-report removals of the Miami, Shawnee and Black Hawk from Ohio/IN/IL which was quite similar, or the New England and PN/SNY exterminations of the late colonial era. Fake news, exaggerations and partisan press is NOTHING NEW. Unfortunately it often gets into history books. I am Cherokee but details are more factual than emotional narratives and oil paintings.
There are lots of people who share opinions on scifi and Star Trek, but few who seem to capture what matters and what people feel and think about it. Thank you for standing out and up to do such a wonderful job. I eagerly await every one of these and watch avidly.
Star Trek TNG dealt with issue of forcing natives off their land in the last season, but at least the Federation didn't hurt them. It was a brilliant lead-up to DS9. Much as I love TNG, I think it was too idealistic at times. DS9 get down to the nitty-gritty of politics and how it's not always black and white. Even the Bajorans were forced to, at times, be authoritarian like their former occupiers.
Marcus Bierman It is an excellent show that's more politics heavy than TNG with a lot more morally grey areas. I'd recommend re-watching TNG though as some aspects of DS9 are set up in TNG, such as the conflict between the Cardasians and the Federation. There's also a cross-over episode that's really good.
+Son of Tiamat Yeah, I would say that "Next Generation" had that issue. I remember hearing somewhere that some of the writers often clashed with Roddenberry because they kept trying to be more realistic with that stuff he he kept nixing it. In fact, according to them, he didn't even want the main characters having any kind of real disagreements with each other or even debating things. They were supposed to all be perfect and always agree with each other and anytime someone tried putting some internal conflict into the scripts he wouldn't let them. I think those elements started to show up more after he passed. I always felt that one episode they did with the alien bugs or whatever taking people over and who had infiltrated the higher positions in the Federation sort of went nowhere and really should've been given more time. It's like they go in and phaser a few possessed people and the really awful stop motion bugs inside them and it was over. It really seems to me that some writer could come in and do a really cool series where the Federation has been compromised and a team of resisters (branded as criminals) trying to stop them. Something like that could really shake up the TV side of things (and the original timeline version, while the new movies operate in the new timeline).
+Marcus Bierman From what I remember, if you liked "Babylon Five" you would like it. They were kind of similar in that they were both set on a space station and, as the series unfolds, a major war breaks out and the rest of the series is about that.
Thank you guys for this channel. It is one of the smartest and enternanning way to talk about sci-fi and pop culture i've seen on TH-cam so far. Keep it up!
Such a us centric interpretation. I don't think the federation represents the USA at all. It's closer to an idealistic UN. Heck it's completely anti capitalism so the USA is the very last country Id think of.
it's not supposed to represent the US as it is. it is supposed to represent the US as it would be if the US was still governed by it's founding ideals. as the video made quite clear, the federation is what the US would be if the US had not been worn down into what it is today by decades of regrettable decisions, greed, prejudice, etc
Like the Union of Republics proposed by Immanuel Kant, I agree. Except that the U.S. is the strength of the U.N. It is also not anti-capitalist, it is post-capital because things can be made so efficiently. Communism will never develop the technology that Capitalism has without drafting off of Capitalism. Every other "state" actor that he mentioned are future possible members of the Federation.
Your first argument is that the Federation and the US are both based on a respect for science. With as estimated 50% of Americans disbelieving in evolution, that simply doesn't hold. The US is one of the world's most religious societies at present (certainly compared to western Europe and the more advanced economies of Asia). In contrast Star Trek avoids religious story lines and you don't get any sense that politics in the Federation is affected by religious conservatism.
Media like Star Trek gives us distance from ourselves. With distance comes objectivity. In the moment you maybe hard pressed to see the answer, stepping back, it is obvious. Star Trek is just a lens to view the world. If you like the mirror, it is a distorted or dirty mirror. The creators have a clear view, set of values, & desired results. Some of them are good, some not, & some are off base. Reflect on the media you take in, the people you meet, & the ideas expressed. I like parts of the Romulans, Vulcans, Klingons, Bajorans, & the Dominion. Not a single one if these cultures is one I would want to be a part of, but I still admire certain parts of all.
+Trekspertise I like your videos but if I may be perfectly honest, I think the Federation more resembles the European Union rather than the United States. Awesome video though :).
I think of _The Drumhead_ anytime someone is judging a person by their physical attributes or attempting to take away rights to gain temporary freedom. I wonder if it was an accident that _Half A Life_ came right after it, though. While one deals with how we judge and individual from what we know about a society, the other deals with how we judge a society from what we know of a single individual. It was always a controversial episode for me, though, because I don't agree that we should allow a society or a culture hold regressive beliefs, but forcefully changing those beliefs is often counterproductive. Your clip from Real Time with Bill Maher pairs very well with it. Both Maher and Harris reflect Lwaxana Troy's criticism of the violation of human rights within another culture while wishing to support social change. Affleck, on the other hand, represents a riggid and literal translation of the prime directive.
Recently I watched the DS9 two-parter Homefront/Paradise Lost. The parallels between those episodes twenty years ago and today are staggering. Fear of what you can't control, mistrust between people, plans to reduce civil rights for our own security, increased military and security. Amazing.
+Trekspertise +Astimus Prime This would fit your interpretation perfectly. DS9 is a way better analogy for the US. Feds&Bajorans= Reps&Dems Space Station=regular country with regular problems (Borders, crime, civil unrest, religious zealots, clashing of social norms, terrorists and the looming threat of invasion by weird future AsiRussia) Wormhole=Panama Dominion=weird future Russia that is now asia too (Jemhadar are essentially Samurai, druggy, druggy samurai) Cardassians= ? not a clue
Agree and disagree. My tendency is to think that the various species and interstellar states were written to externalize and caricaturize different aspects of humanity, rather than just the United States. Certainly the Federation represents the ultimate realization of American values (i.e., secular democracy, individual liberty, etc.), but we can see other, historic cultural institutions expressed in other species, such as the former Soviet Union in Cardassian society, ancient Greece in Vulcan society, Vikings in Klingon society, and so on and so forth.
+Ryan MacFarlane I feel that way, too. I've never viewed Star Trek from the American perspective, because I'm from Europe. The ideals of the Federation aren't exclusively American, because the Americn ideals stem from earlier ideas. It has always felt like a more general mirror of human society to me. Admittedly, I've started getting into Start Trek with TNG, though. The Kirk era may have felt different. The Trek universe certainly evolved over time and may have adopted a broader scope. I'd call that an achievement.
+Naum Rusomarov Well, considering the "American Revolution" happened before the French Revolution, I'd say it's more complicated than that. It's more that they both stemmed from the same sources.
The Federation is probably an analog to the mostly federalized states that the US is composed of simply by virtue of Star Trek being written by Americans. That doesn't mean the values the US is founded on are exclusively American, but the analog to America was probably intentional and accurately represented in this video.
I, too, want to pitch in with the commenters who say that the Federation is nothing like the USA, never was, and never was meant to be. First of all, I want to discount the Borg in any analogy. I claim that they would never have been thinkable as antagonists when Gene Roddenberry was still alive. They were introduced shortly after his death. Personally I don't find anything objectionable about the Borg. Even in ST:VOY it is to my mind the crew of the Voyager who act like stereotypical villains towards the Borg. While Roddenberry wrote some episodes warning of letting computers control society, the Borg don't do that. Roddenberry saw technology as empowering humanity, which was not typical for that time, or even for today, and that is exactly how the Borg are using technology. With that out of the way: The Federation is not a mirror of America in any way. It is rather an alternative to Americanism. Before 1945, the Humanist ideals of Star Trek would have been considered un-American, and you may remember that there used to be a committee dedicated to routing such. Even today you will find American patriots who criticize or make fun of diversity as an ideology, for one. If diversity is considered an American ideal today, you can thank Gene Roddenberry for that. I don't see that it is. To elaborate: Many of us who are not from America thought we were looking at unabashed American propaganda when we first saw the episode The Omega Glory. The Yangs are unmistakeably meant to mirror the USA. In the end, however, Kirk tells Cloud William, and thus America, that the rights that are granted in the American constitution are meant to be universal, and should not be reserved to a minority. In particular, Roddenberry chastises the USA for not acting according to their professed ideals towards the Communists. Despite the elaborate waving of the Stars And Stripes flag, it is upon closer inspection the opposite of American propaganda. Finally, I must remind you that the universal declaration of human rights from 1944 does not encapsulate Western ideals at all. Indeed, the formulation of the first article - using the word humans rather than men - was insisted upon by the representatives of Nepal. While Star Trek is very much Humanist in its philosophy and ideals, and recognizes human rights for humans and non-human aliens alike, in this it is very much not Western, or American, as the USA are notorious for ignoring human rights.
+ThatPsychGuy Please take this the wrong way. DS9: Captain Sisko was more develop then people realize, my friends debated on how his father a restaurant owner was a Christian. ( I'm Agnostic)
This is probably the best video I have ever seen. I'm working to become a Social Studies (Civics, preferably) Teacher, and this is a great tool to explore many topics. Thank you.
Probably. The Klingons and Cardassians seemed to be the same people more or less in the Mirror Universe. The only species that seems to be different is Humanity.
*Nerd mode engaged* The people of the mirror universe do not know about the Bajoran wormhole and therefore have not yet traveled to they're version of the Gamma Quadrant. What I'm suggesting is that if they were to find their version of the worm hole and meet the mirror version of the Dominion.
+Ryan Staton If you like that, then you'll be happy to know that I am building a massive, absolutely massive cosmological map of the Star Trek multiverse. It'll track every known universe we know about, as well as all the little interdimensional nooks and crannies we've gotten wind of over the years. The centerpiece of the map? It will feature a unified theory of time travel in the Star Trek multiverse...it makes the whole map work. It's going to be huge.
+Trekspertise Does it bother you that the Beta Quadrant isn't mentioned more in ST? Klingon and Romulan Empires lie mostly in that quadrant, at least according to Star Charts, yet they are usually treated as Alpha Quadrant powers. It's like calling Russia a European country when most of their territory lies in Asia. I suppose I'm overthinking it. I don't think it's mentioned much, if ever, in Voyager, but with all the jumps and leaps they made, they should have been well into the Beta Quadrant by the series finale.
better mirror 1 EU = federation 2 USA = Klingon empire 3 USSR/russia = Romulan empire 1 an 2 are allied 1 is by far more multi cultural than 2, 1 was actually born after much fighting between its current members, just like the federation, 2 only conquered territory after territory until it reached the pacific ocean, just like the klingons. eventually, a common enemy draw 1 and 2 together aka NATO aka the federation/klingon alliance.
I'm surprised you didn't mention how the Borg's goal of asimilation reflects the USA's ideas of "assimilating" new cultures into one unified whole; you know the "If you're gonna live here you gotta learn English" types
Those in the comments triggered that the Federation is compared to the United States, I have a question: do you even know what the word "idealized" means? The _entire point_ of the video is that the United States _isn't_ like the Federation, that the Federation is fantasy version of the United States the writers use to look at aspects of society from a distant objective perspective. Did you guys even watch the video or did you just see the US flag in the thumbnail, downvote, and proceed directly to the comments to make your edgy comparisons to the Romulans or Borg instead?
I wouldnt say that the comparison is exactly accurate but isnt exactly wrong either. In my belief, The comparison is too broad or general. America is the symbol for all these the federation adheres to but the federation is more of a visualization of the progressive ideals. Im a patriotic red blooded american and I would trout my countries name with pride, but the federation as I see it, is the fantasy that the writers used to express their own progressive views and the viewers, i.e us, who share similar views. The basis of science fiction is fantasy and the fantasy here isnt just the american dream ( which in star trek it wouldnt be) but the successful application of progressive ideas to an ideal state.
Graphic The federation is not like the US the federation is communist in idealistic form. There is no money. And the quote "the needs of the many out way the needs of the few." The US is about the needs of yhe few. The 1 percent has all the money of the world. And the US uses it power and military might to guarantee that they keep the status quo.
To me, the Federation looks more like an idealized version of the European Union. Some points: - Like the Federation, the EU consists of former mortal enemies (Vulcans-Andorians; France-Germany) - The idea of abolishing poverty and not striving to gain more money but to acquire more knowledge also sounds more like Europe than the mainly arch-capitalist USA (you even say that the Federation looks a bit socialist, and Socialism is far more widespread and influential in Europe) - the message of Picard's speeches seems to be more directly influenced by Patrick Stewart's long support of the British Labour Party and its still distinctively European left-wing ideals (sidenote: all in all the USA look for me as less progressive than Europe) - some of the Alien cultures also seem to be taken rather from Europe's past (e. g. the Bajoran religion is clearly a past version of the Catholic Church in Europe; the Cardassians really look like 19th century Russia or Germany etc.)
The EU ain't multicultural. European cultures are either being destroyed or merged into one abomination of a culture. People forget that Europe is a ethnically and culturally diverse continent because of the European Union...
@@Garry_Combine Are you serious? You're basically stating that Spanish, Hungarians, Turks, Germans, Greeks, Samis, Albanians, Basques, Gypsies, Russians etc. are all the same and/or were brought about by the EU...
No, thats the opposite of what I said. I know, and love the fact, that Europe and Europeans are so diverse. The EU support political correctness, which from what I have seen is a culture killer. Just look at my home, the United Kingdom for that. Besides the Federation of Planets is clearly the United Nations.
@@Garry_Combine Well, the Federation shares similarities and differences with both the EU and the UN. For example the Federation, like the EU, have a set of requirements for it's members to follow (that they are actually held to) and it facilitates trade. It's more like the UN in regards to the galactic version of "human" rights and the fact that it conducts similar military operations. I don't really think it can be compared to the US in any meaningful way, at least when looking on how it's organised! How is the EU pushing some kind of "PC-agenda"? Sure some of it's governments are, but the EU itself doesn't have much to say there. And how is EU killing culture in Europe when it has lots of programs to support and preserve culture? My grampa gets money from EU to keep animals at a "fäbod", which is a seasonal dwelling in the forest used by the people in my home province Dalecaria in Sweden.
Exactly. I was looking for that, too, when I first saw the video and caption. Thought this would be a more thorough analysis, illuminating different models and perspectives (fictional and real), not just a video mainly about the correlations to the United States. Misleading title.
The United States is moving into the direction of the Dominion. We've been like the Romulans since 9/11. The Soviet Union was alot like the ROmulan Empire -paranoid.
Hats off to whomever wrote the narration. Specifically, the ending. The message I got was: it isn't perfect, there are things about society we don't like and must change. And there is no easy or one right answer. Excellent writing if you can show such a level of objectivity (like how the romulan way of life isn't something we would want, but was never shown as "bad," just the facts.) and after all that, put in your own message at the end without it being ham-fisted, shoved down our throats. Thats something trek can be accused of on more the one occasion. Or.... I'm thinking too hard about it. lol Either way, Great video. I just wish you people where a little faster at getting the next one out.
+Kleavers Well, it's really apples and oranges. Movies are expected to be bigger and have more excitement, especially genre pictures. Think of all the sci-fi/fantasy movies that get clocked for just being characters standing around talking. For the price of a ticket people except at least some action. TV gets to be smaller and more quiet and they have the time (with multiple episodes) to really dig in and explore an issue. While, the episode of the "Star Trek" series that deal with human issues dressed up in sci-fi clothing, work for the show they wouldn't really work very well on the big screen. That's why we need both and with two separate timelines to work in now, they can both run at the same time without having to worry about confusion or being connected in anyway.
Chris McWilliams Star Trek has always worked beter on the small screen though. Though there are gems like II and VI. But they're a different kind of Star Trek. Though VI had some political stuff as well.
Kleavers Yeah, I would say it works best when it's an allegory about some important issue going on in the real world right now and that tends to work best on TV. If it were on right now I could see them doing a good story that was an allegory for terrorism and anti Muslim feeling (with groups urging to not judge everyone the same and others wanting to go after all of whatever the fictional version is and so forth). It could actually be a really good story in the right hands.
Kleavers I don't know. Is there any social injustice in the "Star Trek" world left for even them to complain about? I mean without turning into a comedy. I think they would probably have to create a new alien species and have a group that is against them and a group that is way overboard in being for them or something. I'm sure they could come up with something. It would probably have to be outside the Federation though, maybe a on a world being considered for joining the Federation or something.
I wouldn't call the Bajorans a POSITIVE view of religion. Sure they have positive aspects, but they are quick to resort to terrorism even after the Cardassian withdrawal, used to have a rigid cast system that they only abandoned in order to more effectively commit terrorism, have politicians that create murderous cults around them like Winn, and many others. It's actually one of the things I like about DS9. It isn't as cut and dry as the rest of trek.
+RRW Yes, DS9 was all about the grey areas in life, especially as we got into the Klingon and Dominion Wars. I think the one that stands out the most for me is "In the Pale Moonlight". That's where we see that the Utopia, isn't. It's a dream they still have, but will never achieve, because they still need grey men in the shadows with long knives.
Eric Staples That's like saying you can't judge the Romulans because they only show military officers. Those were the ones the writers CHOSE to show to give an impression of the culture that species has. Also, Shakkar isn't really mentally ill.
Eric Staples Not IRL, but sci Fi writers need to worldbuild with as few characters as possible, meaning that you CAN judge a fictional culture by the few interactions shown in the series.
While I generally liked your take on this subject, I thought you ignored a few very fundamental differences between the US and the Federation. The United States of America is a melting pot type of culture, where the Federation is very much a mosaic culture. Multiculturalism is central to the Federation's ethos, evidenced by the adoption of the Prime Directive which always values and protects new civilization's distinct cultures. The United States also is also a militaristic culture, and glorifies military service and prowess. The Federation is decidedly not militaristic, as evidenced by the fact that it's only armed branched of the Federation's government (Starfleet) is not considered a military force. This attitude is especially emphasized in the Next Generation series, where any use of force is treated as either an a failure of a mission or an unavoidable and highly undesirable action. The Federation uses Starfleet as an exploratory service, with the secondary function as a peacekeeping force. The Federation had no starships that were considered warships (until the USS Defiant) and always preferred diplomacy and multilateral cooperation to deal with conflicts. While looking at the Federation as an idealized version of the USA is entertaining, perhaps a more realistic comparison would be with one of the Nordic countries or maybe Canada.
A very good video. I find it interesting at 2:56 that you mention periods of American history where the "nation was at odds with it's values of liberty and equality" along with showing a photo of John Quincy Adams. He, of course, was one of the exceptions to the rule regarding prevailing political opinion on racial equality during the first half of the 19th century; a perspective he shared with his parents John and Abigail Adams. He was one of the most outspoken advocates for the abolition of slavery and for free debate in the US House of Representatives through the 1830's and 40's. I can think of no statesman of his time that better exemplifies the struggle of American ideals against a short-sighted majority, than John Quincy Adams.
I fell in love with Trek for exactly the reason you explain here. In the same regard, I'm also a proponent of a global federalist system that bridges the divide between national federation and the interstellar state portrayed in Trek.
Romulans = North Korea Borg = anyone who constantly stays on their phones all day Cardassians and ferengi = America Federation = Canada Vulcans = philosophy. Just philosophy.
No its the Soviet Union. The Federation is based on Marxist principles. Common ownership of the means of production. Also Gene Roddenberry was a Maoist so the Socialist representation of the Federation, added to the Imperial, Capitalist and federal systems of Klingon, Romulans and Ferengi are clearly intentional. Ever noticed that during the Temperal Cold war story line, Lenin was assassinated before the Russian revolution and this throws of the federations entire history.
I don't think that the Federation has much of anything to do with US civilization. An American writer first imagined this science fiction society but the connection ends there. America is great with making films, television, popular music, creative fiction, etc. and this star trek universe is apart of that. Never been anything like the Federation as it is depicted in any real human civilization. Not even close. We in the so-called modern world are savage ignorant impoverished brutes compared to the Federation citizens, and this includes us in America. I mean, we don't even have a functional universal healthcare system.
Thank you =) If you like this, then you should check out my personal channel, which can be accessed through this video: th-cam.com/video/1z6jkkvRvVQ/w-d-xo.html
Dude... You're wrong on quite literally all accounts. The Federation is (and was intentionally written) as an analogy to the UN (United Nations) America isn't exactly big on equality or science at all. Instead it's about uplifting yourself on the backs of minorities or just straight up poor people and full of right wing religious zealously... So yeah, as an american, OF COURSE you would think they're talking about you. Who else would they talk about, there's only like 5 other countries on the planet, right? Just as god made the earth, america first! And not every race in Star Trek is referencing some contrived chapter of your history or facet of you national consciousness. Star Trek was always intended to be a reflection on the human condition. (No need to spell it all out again - Borg/Individualism, Ferengi/rich vs. humane, Klingons/strength vs intellect, and so on...) [That's why the Andorians are so fascinating and dull and annoying at the same time - they're us] So please, PLEASE, take your starspangled banner and go home! You're a dinosaur and nobody loves you, well...nobody outside the US. The only way forward is together and not trough zionism or imperialism, AND CERTAINLY NOT THROUGH PATRIOTISM to anyone but planet earth and the human race.
+Chris Legan Hey man, you can have your own opinion on the guy's video (in fact some of your thoughts i share) but there is no reason for a personal attack. (a very un-Star Trek thing to do) The video is this man's interpretation of Star Trek. Just because you don't agree with it, or don't like it doesn't mean you have to go after the guy who made it.
+Chris Legan The Federation was indeed written as an analogy to the United Nation, but Star Trek is a show written by and for Americans. Star Trek represents an American worldview so thoroughly and so completely that the two cannot be separated. And the most important point to note is that the Americans writing Star Trek have written the Federation to be an idealized version of themselves. The real America is, of course, far more complicated and richer in scope. That being said, there is always room for more than one interpretation and you are welcome to refute this interpretation in any way you'd like. That is the spirit of this channel. Just please do it without vile or emotionally charged language.
+TheMaskedMetalist You're right, but when people take an idea that has nothing to do with national politics and turn int into their personal political platform, I tend to overreact. Especially when making obviously and objectively false claims.
+Trekspertise Not really an interpretation when the facts have been stated by the writers themselves... But sure, this is what you choose to believe. Like the US have chosen to believe that aluminium is pronounced aloominum. After being told you're wrong for decades by everyone else and refuting it with "But we say it like that"; you eventually changed the spelling to aluminum. You're the ONLY country on this planet doing that. So yeah, I literally can not argue with you claiming that Star Trek is about the US, because it makes no sense for me to do so. Have fun on planet 'murica.
I mean America. This is, of course, just one way to "read" Star Trek. There are all kinds of ways to interpret the source material. However, it must be said that Star Trek is an American show created by an American, written overwhelmingly by American writers for an American audience, conspicuously hires predominantly American actors (of the major crews, only 5 were British citizens) and discusses social issues relevant to American society such as the inclusion and exclusion of American minorities.
Disagree that Star Trek's audience is overwhelmingly American: it is known, enjoyed and debated throughout the world (I'm in Scotland); indeed, the TNG episode The High Ground was banned by the BBC on the show's first and second UK broadcasts, as it suggested that armed resistance would be instrumental in uniting Ireland in the future. This was quite contentious over here, as it was the height of the "troubles". The America-centricity of Star Trek up to and including the fact that aliens almost all have American accents is something I've found a little troubling, but you are right that aspects of modern society reflected in Star Trek's future are primarily American society. An International crew in the Original was protrayed by American or canadian actors, whereas TNG was a bit more diverse, at least in casting, with an Englishman playing a Frenchman, and an English woman playing a Betazoid.
+Trekspertise Actually I also think it is rather the UN or Europe. I think Rodenberry did not take America as model especially when he had characters like Sulu or Chekov, who have to work under Kirk and that while the threat of a nuclear war was real. It is a question about international cooperation. I think Rodenberry really ment international partnership
I believe the Federation represents the West. America, UK, Europe... It is a continuation of our greater civilisation, it holds and perpetuates our ideals. Democracy, scientific thought, exploration and an accepting community are all western inventions.
I feel like Star Trek VI would have been a perfect example of the Federation facing both internal and external challenges to their values. The deescalation of hostilities between 2 cultures that have hated each other their entire lives, and who have both left their mark on the other in scaring ways. Kirks reaction to Spocks statement "they are dying". The efforts individuals from all sides placed into keeping deep seated division and hatred in place in the face of the prospect of peace demonstrates an excellent example of direct challenges to Federation values from both within and without
Point 2 about the value Americans place on scientific advancement... not really accurate. I wish it was, but most Americans are still stuck in the dark ages of religion. Hands up if your country is in the west and fight to have Creationism taught in schools.
+whyphy Well, that dynamic certainly exists. But, the majority of America acknowledges science and innovation as a good in our society, even if that majority has little to no political power to express their opinions.
+Trekspertise Tell that to the Trump... Or the Bush... Or the anti-gay activists... Or the creationism parents and subsequently your school system. Or to the friendly abortion clinic in your neighborhood. (don't have one? I wonder why...) Shall I go on?
No, I meant I've had the disappointment of seeing the numbers for how many actually believe in evolution over science. It was about a year ago, so I couldn't tell you were that came from, now. But I don't simply say this to 'rip' on the US. I was shocked
+whyphy It's worth mentioning that those Americans might hate science, but can't do without it's fruits. I'd say that's what he's referring to here, after all, who in America DOESN'T eagerly await the release of the next iPhone? The new car? Who here turns away new military technologies that keep American troops safe? But yeah, our refusal to accept that metaphors exist is just sad. As far back as 214 AD, Christians were arguing that the entirety of Genesis was simply a metaphor. Why can't we just accept that idea?
I don't often share videos like this, but you examine the political atmosphere of Star Trek in a fascinating way, while only scratching the surface of what all Star Trek has said as far as society. You could do an entire Documentary on this subject.
Currently a lot of people both inside and outside the US have a very badly warped view of what the US is and does in the world. This is because of the combination of the power the US wields in the world, which makes it too big to easily regard with impartiality, and the fact that the US professes to stand for certain ideals without being absolutely 100% perfect at all times at living up to them. When a nation or an individual is striving for a high goal and trying to meet a high standard, that's when they are most open to criticism. No one expects China to stand up for the little guy, but the US gets blasted every single time it doesn't -- because of the ideals we have stated are ours, that we try with the normal success rate of any human society (guaranteed, above all else, to be less than 100%) to live up to.
hagamapama China never tried to be the world policeman or claim to be the greatest country ever. China doesn't have a gun to the heads of every other nation on the planet.
people keep saying all this stuff about it not being based on the US. But every episode involving earth is in the US. The federation hq and starfleet academy are both in the US. and the ships are USS ships which is a US naval vessel. And all the main characters are american.
While it didn't really exist at the time the original series was written (compared to it's modern form, anyway), I would argue the best modern analogy for the Federation is the European union. There are shared rules, freedom of movement, basic concepts of universal rights, a sort of unified economic system, yet the individual countries in it still nominally have their own sovereignty, laws, rules and institutions. OK, so the EU has a bunch of problems the Federation does not, and especially in economic terms doesn't really compare, but it seems like a pretty decent analogy for what the federation is. Even the requirements for a country joining the EU have parallels with the things a society has to achieve to be considered for federation membership. And membership of the EU is voluntary, and stems from a political decision of a country to apply to join. The US by contrast doesn't seem to have a clear way of adding more states to itself, individual states have considerably less autonomy and remaining identity than EU member states, and so on. The EU is the most logical real-world parallel to the federation, NOT the considerably more monolithic United States...
I am actually taking a class on Star trek at Uni right now [which is pretty awesome]. We discussed this week that the Klingons in the original series were conceived to represent the Soviet Union. In the original series the federation, as you say serves as a mirror image of the U.S but also sometimes of Nato in some episodes. The Romulans were conceived to represent other communist powers, such as China, that might have been 'bad' but were not viewed as 'evil' as the Klingons for example. I can suggest some good reading if you want me to.
Great video. I agree with you on most points, with the possible exception of the "idealized history" argument. People often forget that Star Trek is a post-apocalyptic setting, at least where Earth is involved. Yes the Federation represents an idealized future, but it came about as a response to horrific events like the Eugenics Wars, the Bell Riots and World War III. Even after its formation the Federation has had to grapple with policies others find questionable, such as the controversial Prime Directive and the existence of Section 31.
+kain91939 Most likely a reflection (lol) of the aspects of modern society that the Federation does not touch upon, e.g. our predilections to violence, cynicism, selfishness and exploitation. While the Federation represents an idealized future to strive towards, the Terran Empire serves as a stark warning for what may happen if humanity decides to follow its baser instincts.
I think the Terran Empire of the mirror universe is the more likely outcome of what human exploration and colonization of space would be. We are a species that seems to be predisposed to violence and cynicism especially when we perceive an outsider to be a threat. The beginning of the mirror episode on Enterprise where Cochran shoots the Vulcan and pillages their ship is much more likely then a peaceful first contact given human nature.
Very good analysis as always. Someone once mentionned to me that the Borg is a representation of the USSR/communist ideology, with a "collective" society put to the extreme, struggling with a Federation who is individualistic.
Id like to suggest a couple of videos, could you do some alternate trek history? Like explore what would happen in for say the klingon empire successfully beat, and occupied the federation. Or how if the Borg conquered earth what would the galactic repercussions be.
Brilliant video! I'd love to see this expanded upon to include some other trek races and cultures, and maybe how different Trek races change across the different series'.
That map in the begginning is a little different from the ones I saw in that official trek book. Romulan so small compared to fed, why do they have trouble with them? Same with Cardassians. And what is with that randompatch of fed territory between romulan and klingon not connected to the main fed territory?
I genuinely enjoy your videos, finding them insightful and well-crafted. I do find myself frustrated by a lack of nuance inevitable given limited time and specificity of topic. For example, I would love to see a video on the Bajorans as an example of how TREK treats religion--not least the fact that after years and years of watching DS9 quite literally I have almost no notion of what their religion teaches! What in fact are Bajoran religious beliefs? It is as if all one learned about the Ancient Greek religion was that they worshiped a bunch of gods who were supposed to live atop Mount Olympus, and there was this oracle everyone paid attention to, plus some festivals. That really tells nothing at all. For example, in Greek myth men and women literally were separate creations--and the worship of many gods involving "mystery cults" based on initiation into fundamental insights. In their pantheon the daughter of (essentially) Mother Nature is the wife and Queen of the King of the Dead. Greek myth has monsters, but no demons as we think of them (which has led Disney and others to re-cast figures as if they were the equivalent of Western demons). And so on. Is any of this true of Bajoran belief in the Prophets? I have no idea. Do Bajorans believe in life after death? What form does it take, and why? Compare this to the plethora of information we have about Cardassian or Klingon culture! Okay, un-clicking my soapbox icon now. Keep up the good work!
+David MacDowell Blue I would love to do a few episodes on Religion in Star Trek, or just religion in sci-fi, generally. And we will get to those more detailed topics, trust me. It is just a matter of time and money. The channel seems to be growing quite well, so I see topics like this as a distinct possibility.
Well, to kind of prove your point, I got Star Trek:, The Original Series Complete Episode Box Set for my birthday recently. In one of the episodes, Kirk visiits a planet where the Kongs and the Yangs have been fighting for centuries. At the end of that episode, the Yangs bring out the Stars and Stripes and copies of the Bill of Rights and Constitution, which Kirk reads to the Yangs. So, Rodenberry might well have mirrored American Ideals into his series.
The Federation reflects America is a very realistic interpretation, and can even be extended into the JJ Verse Star Trek movies. They greatly reflect the current American society, where optimism is being eaten away by fear.
Yes quarks root beer metaphor is one of my favs.
+Scott Nahler For all of the things I dislike on these different shows, despite them, it as a franchise is my favorite sci-fi thing.
+Scott Nahler Of course they think that root beer is vile. The spoon heads drink hot fish juice, and the most popular drink for the ferengi is slug-o-cola "the slimiest cola in the universe'".
Scott Nahler 'It's Highly Addictive!'
So true.
That scene may be my favorite in all of Star Trek. The crazy thing is that scene was just added to the episode to help pad out the run time.
TNG Worf is a idealized Klingon, DS9 Worf is a man of two worlds with his own personal opinions of both
Your intro/retrospective videos always engages one's mental processes to jump to high gear. Quality over quantity. Excellent dissemination.
The highest praise - thank you, kind human :)
HazmaT Best place in the know galaxy. USA.
I'm always blown away by both the superb writing and editing, not to mention the incredibly attentive research that goes into these videos.
Thank you very much. We are happy you dig it =)
Small point with you mentioning the Trail of Tears. It was not an exclusively Cherokee horror. I am of Choctaw descent and we, among other tribes, were also forced on that death march. I have no idea why most people are only aware of the one tribe.
This is very true. Thanks for pointing that out.
biblegirl. Because the Cherokee so badly bungled their own removal. Chief John Ross (voted out by Chief Ridge's faction) had fought removal in court for years BUT when he lost insisted on outfitting the trail with supplies HE procured from colleagues with large federal funds. He was late, underpurchased, overpaid and pocketed the money. Then when the Army said no more stalling, the expedition was a mess.
The Ridge Faction of the Cherokee got to Arkansas/OK with much more ease, as did the Pushmataha Choctaw, the Chickasaw and even the McIntosh factions of the Creek. It is only three states over and not through desert. A much easier trek than The Oregon Trail. Oh BTW, the Ross faction murdered the Ridge faction after they got to The Nations. Gang style assassinations at their homes and businesses.
A history often overlooked in the details or misreported in Whig newspapers that hated Martin van Buren and wanted to beat him in the next election. Statistics of deaths are way overstated. It was a very sad affair, and I wish the nations had stayed in the SE and become part of the modern states.
Oddly, the Whig papers did not over-report removals of the Miami, Shawnee and Black Hawk from Ohio/IN/IL which was quite similar, or the New England and PN/SNY exterminations of the late colonial era.
Fake news, exaggerations and partisan press is NOTHING NEW. Unfortunately it often gets into history books. I am Cherokee but details are more factual than emotional narratives and oil paintings.
There are lots of people who share opinions on scifi and Star Trek, but few who seem to capture what matters and what people feel and think about it. Thank you for standing out and up to do such a wonderful job. I eagerly await every one of these and watch avidly.
Star Trek TNG dealt with issue of forcing natives off their land in the last season, but at least the Federation didn't hurt them. It was a brilliant lead-up to DS9. Much as I love TNG, I think it was too idealistic at times. DS9 get down to the nitty-gritty of politics and how it's not always black and white. Even the Bajorans were forced to, at times, be authoritarian like their former occupiers.
+Son of Tiamat I have never watch DS9, but it has always sounded like a show I would really like.
Marcus Bierman It is an excellent show that's more politics heavy than TNG with a lot more morally grey areas. I'd recommend re-watching TNG though as some aspects of DS9 are set up in TNG, such as the conflict between the Cardasians and the Federation. There's also a cross-over episode that's really good.
+Son of Tiamat Yeah, I would say that "Next Generation" had that issue. I remember hearing somewhere that some of the writers often clashed with Roddenberry because they kept trying to be more realistic with that stuff he he kept nixing it.
In fact, according to them, he didn't even want the main characters having any kind of real disagreements with each other or even debating things. They were supposed to all be perfect and always agree with each other and anytime someone tried putting some internal conflict into the scripts he wouldn't let them. I think those elements started to show up more after he passed.
I always felt that one episode they did with the alien bugs or whatever taking people over and who had infiltrated the higher positions in the Federation sort of went nowhere and really should've been given more time. It's like they go in and phaser a few possessed people and the really awful stop motion bugs inside them and it was over.
It really seems to me that some writer could come in and do a really cool series where the Federation has been compromised and a team of resisters (branded as criminals) trying to stop them. Something like that could really shake up the TV side of things (and the original timeline version, while the new movies operate in the new timeline).
+Marcus Bierman From what I remember, if you liked "Babylon Five" you would like it. They were kind of similar in that they were both set on a space station and, as the series unfolds, a major war breaks out and the rest of the series is about that.
Chris McWilliams I haven't seen Babylon 5 either. :(
Thank you guys for this channel. It is one of the smartest and enternanning way to talk about sci-fi and pop culture i've seen on TH-cam so far. Keep it up!
+François Joly Thank you! Hang around, it'll get better =)
Such a us centric interpretation. I don't think the federation represents the USA at all. It's closer to an idealistic UN. Heck it's completely anti capitalism so the USA is the very last country Id think of.
it's not supposed to represent the US as it is. it is supposed to represent the US as it would be if the US was still governed by it's founding ideals.
as the video made quite clear, the federation is what the US would be if the US had not been worn down into what it is today by decades of regrettable decisions, greed, prejudice, etc
Ty Guy I think it's meant to repersent an ideal union of many nations tbh
***** meh, probably. the US of course isn't the only nation to hold these ideals, so that is probably correct.
the UN is basically an arm of the US empire, though.
Like the Union of Republics proposed by Immanuel Kant, I agree. Except that the U.S. is the strength of the U.N. It is also not anti-capitalist, it is post-capital because things can be made so efficiently. Communism will never develop the technology that Capitalism has without drafting off of Capitalism. Every other "state" actor that he mentioned are future possible members of the Federation.
My Fave Character Garak always cracks me up. "It's Vile!"
Its insidious!
Your first argument is that the Federation and the US are both based on a respect for science. With as estimated 50% of Americans disbelieving in evolution, that simply doesn't hold. The US is one of the world's most religious societies at present (certainly compared to western Europe and the more advanced economies of Asia). In contrast Star Trek avoids religious story lines and you don't get any sense that politics in the Federation is affected by religious conservatism.
Media like Star Trek gives us distance from ourselves. With distance comes objectivity. In the moment you maybe hard pressed to see the answer, stepping back, it is obvious.
Star Trek is just a lens to view the world. If you like the mirror, it is a distorted or dirty mirror. The creators have a clear view, set of values, & desired results. Some of them are good, some not, & some are off base.
Reflect on the media you take in, the people you meet, & the ideas expressed. I like parts of the Romulans, Vulcans, Klingons, Bajorans, & the Dominion. Not a single one if these cultures is one I would want to be a part of, but I still admire certain parts of all.
+mackdmara Well said.
I always enjoy all the thought you put into your videos.
+kotykcat Thank you very much =)
+Trekspertise I like your videos but if I may be perfectly honest, I think the Federation more resembles the European Union rather than the United States.
Awesome video though :).
I think of _The Drumhead_ anytime someone is judging a person by their physical attributes or attempting to take away rights to gain temporary freedom. I wonder if it was an accident that _Half A Life_ came right after it, though. While one deals with how we judge and individual from what we know about a society, the other deals with how we judge a society from what we know of a single individual.
It was always a controversial episode for me, though, because I don't agree that we should allow a society or a culture hold regressive beliefs, but forcefully changing those beliefs is often counterproductive. Your clip from Real Time with Bill Maher pairs very well with it. Both Maher and Harris reflect Lwaxana Troy's criticism of the violation of human rights within another culture while wishing to support social change. Affleck, on the other hand, represents a riggid and literal translation of the prime directive.
+Lutranereis It is as relevant now as it ever was, which is all the more saddening.
Recently I watched the DS9 two-parter Homefront/Paradise Lost. The parallels between those episodes twenty years ago and today are staggering. Fear of what you can't control, mistrust between people, plans to reduce civil rights for our own security, increased military and security. Amazing.
+AshtimusPrime Very much on point, as is the DS9 two-parter concerning The Bell Riots.
+Trekspertise
+Astimus Prime
This would fit your interpretation perfectly. DS9 is a way better analogy for the US.
Feds&Bajorans= Reps&Dems
Space Station=regular country with regular problems (Borders, crime, civil unrest, religious zealots, clashing of social norms, terrorists and the looming threat of invasion by weird future AsiRussia)
Wormhole=Panama
Dominion=weird future Russia that is now asia too (Jemhadar are essentially Samurai, druggy, druggy samurai)
Cardassians= ? not a clue
Glad your videos are getting more views! You clearly put loads of work into each episode.
+Ausphexx One Thank you! We hope 2016 will be our year =)
Agree and disagree. My tendency is to think that the various species and interstellar states were written to externalize and caricaturize different aspects of humanity, rather than just the United States. Certainly the Federation represents the ultimate realization of American values (i.e., secular democracy, individual liberty, etc.), but we can see other, historic cultural institutions expressed in other species, such as the former Soviet Union in Cardassian society, ancient Greece in Vulcan society, Vikings in Klingon society, and so on and so forth.
+Ryan MacFarlane I feel that way, too. I've never viewed Star Trek from the American perspective, because I'm from Europe. The ideals of the Federation aren't exclusively American, because the Americn ideals stem from earlier ideas. It has always felt like a more general mirror of human society to me.
Admittedly, I've started getting into Start Trek with TNG, though. The Kirk era may have felt different. The Trek universe certainly evolved over time and may have adopted a broader scope. I'd call that an achievement.
+Naum Rusomarov Well, considering the "American Revolution" happened before the French Revolution, I'd say it's more complicated than that. It's more that they both stemmed from the same sources.
The Federation is probably an analog to the mostly federalized states that the US is composed of simply by virtue of Star Trek being written by Americans. That doesn't mean the values the US is founded on are exclusively American, but the analog to America was probably intentional and accurately represented in this video.
The creative ways that Star Trek tries to handle these subjects is a strength of the franchise. Keeps me open to checking out each new series
I, too, want to pitch in with the commenters who say that the Federation is nothing like the USA, never was, and never was meant to be.
First of all, I want to discount the Borg in any analogy. I claim that they would never have been thinkable as antagonists when Gene Roddenberry was still alive. They were introduced shortly after his death. Personally I don't find anything objectionable about the Borg. Even in ST:VOY it is to my mind the crew of the Voyager who act like stereotypical villains towards the Borg. While Roddenberry wrote some episodes warning of letting computers control society, the Borg don't do that. Roddenberry saw technology as empowering humanity, which was not typical for that time, or even for today, and that is exactly how the Borg are using technology. With that out of the way:
The Federation is not a mirror of America in any way. It is rather an alternative to Americanism. Before 1945, the Humanist ideals of Star Trek would have been considered un-American, and you may remember that there used to be a committee dedicated to routing such. Even today you will find American patriots who criticize or make fun of diversity as an ideology, for one. If diversity is considered an American ideal today, you can thank Gene Roddenberry for that. I don't see that it is.
To elaborate: Many of us who are not from America thought we were looking at unabashed American propaganda when we first saw the episode The Omega Glory. The Yangs are unmistakeably meant to mirror the USA. In the end, however, Kirk tells Cloud William, and thus America, that the rights that are granted in the American constitution are meant to be universal, and should not be reserved to a minority. In particular, Roddenberry chastises the USA for not acting according to their professed ideals towards the Communists. Despite the elaborate waving of the Stars And Stripes flag, it is upon closer inspection the opposite of American propaganda.
Finally, I must remind you that the universal declaration of human rights from 1944 does not encapsulate Western ideals at all. Indeed, the formulation of the first article - using the word humans rather than men - was insisted upon by the representatives of Nepal. While Star Trek is very much Humanist in its philosophy and ideals, and recognizes human rights for humans and non-human aliens alike, in this it is very much not Western, or American, as the USA are notorious for ignoring human rights.
tldr
Read it all. Well said that human! :p
This video is essentially what I love about Star Trek, in addition to the psychological and sociological aspects. Great video.
+ThatPsychGuy Please take this the wrong way. DS9: Captain Sisko was more develop then people realize, my friends debated on how his father a restaurant owner was a Christian. ( I'm Agnostic)
You are getting better and better! Really love your videos ;)
This is probably the best video I have ever seen. I'm working to become a Social Studies (Civics, preferably) Teacher, and this is a great tool to explore many topics. Thank you.
side note, id really like to see the Borg in the Mirror Universe, Would they still be bad guys?
Chris McGrane - That's an interesting point...
Probably. The Klingons and Cardassians seemed to be the same people more or less in the Mirror Universe.
The only species that seems to be different is Humanity.
Seeing Red I'd rather see the mirror Dominion... Wouldn't they just be a copy of the Federation?
The Poet Of Fall I don't think there is a Dominion. Just the Klingon-Cardassian Alliance.
*Nerd mode engaged* The people of the mirror universe do not know about the Bajoran wormhole and therefore have not yet traveled to they're version of the Gamma Quadrant. What I'm suggesting is that if they were to find their version of the worm hole and meet the mirror version of the Dominion.
@Trekspertise Where did you get this fine galactic map from 1:00?
+Sascha Germer (Brightwave) I rebuilt it from this: static.tumblr.com/9vpcbie/GpTng4j7i/startrekstarchart.jpg
+Sascha Germer (Brightwave) You can look at my map in a little more detail here: trekspertise.tumblr.com/image/136752871020
+Trekspertise I dorkgasmed when I saw this.
+Ryan Staton If you like that, then you'll be happy to know that I am building a massive, absolutely massive cosmological map of the Star Trek multiverse. It'll track every known universe we know about, as well as all the little interdimensional nooks and crannies we've gotten wind of over the years. The centerpiece of the map? It will feature a unified theory of time travel in the Star Trek multiverse...it makes the whole map work.
It's going to be huge.
+Trekspertise Does it bother you that the Beta Quadrant isn't mentioned more in ST? Klingon and Romulan Empires lie mostly in that quadrant, at least according to Star Charts, yet they are usually treated as Alpha Quadrant powers. It's like calling Russia a European country when most of their territory lies in Asia. I suppose I'm overthinking it.
I don't think it's mentioned much, if ever, in Voyager, but with all the jumps and leaps they made, they should have been well into the Beta Quadrant by the series finale.
better mirror
1 EU = federation
2 USA = Klingon empire
3 USSR/russia = Romulan empire
1 an 2 are allied
1 is by far more multi cultural than 2, 1 was actually born after much fighting between its current members, just like the federation, 2 only conquered territory after territory until it reached the pacific ocean, just like the klingons. eventually, a common enemy draw 1 and 2 together aka NATO aka the federation/klingon alliance.
THANK YOU. I was thinking this the entire time i watched this video :D
TheArrogantOne I will say that the Ussr is the Borg.
The udssr is the borg and the klingons. Russia has beautiful operas.
One of the things I love about Trekspertise is how it makes me look at Star Trek in ways I never thought before.
That's exactly what we love to hear.
Star trek embodied the values of the enlightenment. Something the US may have done in the past but does not now.
The "Enlightenment" is a mistake that can never admit it is one.
Damn! Why does this channel have so few view counts!
Amazing video man! Really enjoyed it.
+DtoTheE Thanks! Yea, the word will get out, I assume =)
CBS should hire +Trekspertise to consult on the new TV series (heck movies too.)
Awesome video, your assessment is always well executed.
Trekspertise The perfect contract employee! I hope the producers are watching, I really do.
+Trekspertise huh that's funny. I eat only cheese
This thing that you're doing in this video, is precisely why I love Star Trek
I'm surprised you didn't mention how the Borg's goal of asimilation reflects the USA's ideas of "assimilating" new cultures into one unified whole; you know the "If you're gonna live here you gotta learn English" types
Fantastic video. You can tell lots of time, care and attention goes into your work. Thank you for the entertainment!
+Jordan H Indeed, thank you. And we are working on ways to make it all better, too.
Those in the comments triggered that the Federation is compared to the United States, I have a question: do you even know what the word "idealized" means? The _entire point_ of the video is that the United States _isn't_ like the Federation, that the Federation is fantasy version of the United States the writers use to look at aspects of society from a distant objective perspective.
Did you guys even watch the video or did you just see the US flag in the thumbnail, downvote, and proceed directly to the comments to make your edgy comparisons to the Romulans or Borg instead?
+Graphic Yes to all of this.
I wouldnt say that the comparison is exactly accurate but isnt exactly wrong either. In my belief, The comparison is too broad or general. America is the symbol for all these the federation adheres to but the federation is more of a visualization of the progressive ideals. Im a patriotic red blooded american and I would trout my countries name with pride, but the federation as I see it, is the fantasy that the writers used to express their own progressive views and the viewers, i.e us, who share similar views. The basis of science fiction is fantasy and the fantasy here isnt just the american dream ( which in star trek it wouldnt be) but the successful application of progressive ideas to an ideal state.
Graphic The federation is not like the US the federation is communist in idealistic form. There is no money. And the quote "the needs of the many out way the needs of the few." The US is about the needs of yhe few. The 1 percent has all the money of the world. And the US uses it power and military might to guarantee that they keep the status quo.
Really enjoy these. Could you do a video on the Mirror Universe at some point?
To me, the Federation looks more like an idealized version of the European Union.
Some points:
- Like the Federation, the EU consists of former mortal enemies (Vulcans-Andorians; France-Germany)
- The idea of abolishing poverty and not striving to gain more money but to acquire more knowledge also sounds more like Europe than the mainly arch-capitalist USA (you even say that the Federation looks a bit socialist, and Socialism is far more widespread and influential in Europe)
- the message of Picard's speeches seems to be more directly influenced by Patrick Stewart's long support of the British Labour Party and its still distinctively European left-wing ideals (sidenote: all in all the USA look for me as less progressive than Europe)
- some of the Alien cultures also seem to be taken rather from Europe's past (e. g. the Bajoran religion is clearly a past version of the Catholic Church in Europe; the Cardassians really look like 19th century Russia or Germany etc.)
Not the case.
The Federation isn't a state in itself which is the total opposite of the eu.
The EU ain't multicultural. European cultures are either being destroyed or merged into one abomination of a culture. People forget that Europe is a ethnically and culturally diverse continent because of the European Union...
@@Garry_Combine Are you serious? You're basically stating that Spanish, Hungarians, Turks, Germans, Greeks, Samis, Albanians, Basques, Gypsies, Russians etc. are all the same and/or were brought about by the EU...
No, thats the opposite of what I said. I know, and love the fact, that Europe and Europeans are so diverse. The EU support political correctness, which from what I have seen is a culture killer. Just look at my home, the United Kingdom for that. Besides the Federation of Planets is clearly the United Nations.
@@Garry_Combine Well, the Federation shares similarities and differences with both the EU and the UN. For example the Federation, like the EU, have a set of requirements for it's members to follow (that they are actually held to) and it facilitates trade. It's more like the UN in regards to the galactic version of "human" rights and the fact that it conducts similar military operations. I don't really think it can be compared to the US in any meaningful way, at least when looking on how it's organised! How is the EU pushing some kind of "PC-agenda"? Sure some of it's governments are, but the EU itself doesn't have much to say there. And how is EU killing culture in Europe when it has lots of programs to support and preserve culture? My grampa gets money from EU to keep animals at a "fäbod", which is a seasonal dwelling in the forest used by the people in my home province Dalecaria in Sweden.
Just wanted to say I am a huge fan of Star Trek and I love your channel so much. Thanks so much for the videos
+Chris Mengeu Absolutely! Thank you for watching. Got a new episode dropping soon :)
And they didn't include the actual mirror of the Federation, the Dominion? Tsk tsk.
Exactly. I was looking for that, too, when I first saw the video and caption. Thought this would be a more thorough analysis, illuminating different models and perspectives (fictional and real), not just a video mainly about the correlations to the United States. Misleading title.
The United States is moving into the direction of the Dominion. We've been like the Romulans since 9/11. The Soviet Union was alot like the ROmulan Empire -paranoid.
or you know THE ACTUAL MIRROR UNIVERSE???
Hats off to whomever wrote the narration. Specifically, the ending. The message I got was: it isn't perfect, there are things about society we don't like and must change. And there is no easy or one right answer. Excellent writing if you can show such a level of objectivity (like how the romulan way of life isn't something we would want, but was never shown as "bad," just the facts.) and after all that, put in your own message at the end without it being ham-fisted, shoved down our throats. Thats something trek can be accused of on more the one occasion.
Or.... I'm thinking too hard about it. lol Either way, Great video. I just wish you people where a little faster at getting the next one out.
+Matt Nope Thank you. A mighty endorsement, indeed.
I wish we were faster, too. For that, we would need to hire a few more folks.
This is why the series beat the movies in narrative quality. Great stuff as always!
+Kleavers Well, it's really apples and oranges. Movies are expected to be bigger and have more excitement, especially genre pictures.
Think of all the sci-fi/fantasy movies that get clocked for just being characters standing around talking. For the price of a ticket people except at least some action.
TV gets to be smaller and more quiet and they have the time (with multiple episodes) to really dig in and explore an issue.
While, the episode of the "Star Trek" series that deal with human issues dressed up in sci-fi clothing, work for the show they wouldn't really work very well on the big screen.
That's why we need both and with two separate timelines to work in now, they can both run at the same time without having to worry about confusion or being connected in anyway.
Chris McWilliams Star Trek has always worked beter on the small screen though. Though there are gems like II and VI. But they're a different kind of Star Trek. Though VI had some political stuff as well.
Kleavers Yeah, I would say it works best when it's an allegory about some important issue going on in the real world right now and that tends to work best on TV.
If it were on right now I could see them doing a good story that was an allegory for terrorism and anti Muslim feeling (with groups urging to not judge everyone the same and others wanting to go after all of whatever the fictional version is and so forth).
It could actually be a really good story in the right hands.
Chris McWilliams I wonder how Star Trek would handle the SJW stuff going on now.
Kleavers I don't know. Is there any social injustice in the "Star Trek" world left for even them to complain about? I mean without turning into a comedy.
I think they would probably have to create a new alien species and have a group that is against them and a group that is way overboard in being for them or something.
I'm sure they could come up with something. It would probably have to be outside the Federation though, maybe a on a world being considered for joining the Federation or something.
Holy, holy holy of all that is holy. You do stellar work. Everytime. Everything. You are appreciated!
I wouldn't call the Bajorans a POSITIVE view of religion. Sure they have positive aspects, but they are quick to resort to terrorism even after the Cardassian withdrawal, used to have a rigid cast system that they only abandoned in order to more effectively commit terrorism, have politicians that create murderous cults around them like Winn, and many others.
It's actually one of the things I like about DS9. It isn't as cut and dry as the rest of trek.
+RRW Yes, DS9 was all about the grey areas in life, especially as we got into the Klingon and Dominion Wars. I think the one that stands out the most for me is "In the Pale Moonlight". That's where we see that the Utopia, isn't. It's a dream they still have, but will never achieve, because they still need grey men in the shadows with long knives.
+RRW You can't judge their entire people based off of a few who were still terrorists after the Cardassian withdrawal. Those few were mentally ill.
Eric Staples That's like saying you can't judge the Romulans because they only show military officers. Those were the ones the writers CHOSE to show to give an impression of the culture that species has. Also, Shakkar isn't really mentally ill.
RRW The military obviously represents their government. Again, you can't judge a people based on a few who work outside their government.
Eric Staples Not IRL, but sci Fi writers need to worldbuild with as few characters as possible, meaning that you CAN judge a fictional culture by the few interactions shown in the series.
I really enjoy all your videos. Thanks so much for making them!
+Timothy Horning Of course! Many more to come =)
While I generally liked your take on this subject, I thought you ignored a few very fundamental differences between the US and the Federation.
The United States of America is a melting pot type of culture, where the Federation is very much a mosaic culture. Multiculturalism is central to the Federation's ethos, evidenced by the adoption of the Prime Directive which always values and protects new civilization's distinct cultures.
The United States also is also a militaristic culture, and glorifies military service and prowess. The Federation is decidedly not militaristic, as evidenced by the fact that it's only armed branched of the Federation's government (Starfleet) is not considered a military force. This attitude is especially emphasized in the Next Generation series, where any use of force is treated as either an a failure of a mission or an unavoidable and highly undesirable action. The Federation uses Starfleet as an exploratory service, with the secondary function as a peacekeeping force. The Federation had no starships that were considered warships (until the USS Defiant) and always preferred diplomacy and multilateral cooperation to deal with conflicts.
While looking at the Federation as an idealized version of the USA is entertaining, perhaps a more realistic comparison would be with one of the Nordic countries or maybe Canada.
The Federation is more akin to the Confederate States of America but futurized.
A very good video. I find it interesting at 2:56 that you mention periods of American history where the "nation was at odds with it's values of liberty and equality" along with showing a photo of John Quincy Adams. He, of course, was one of the exceptions to the rule regarding prevailing political opinion on racial equality during the first half of the 19th century; a perspective he shared with his parents John and Abigail Adams. He was one of the most outspoken advocates for the abolition of slavery and for free debate in the US House of Representatives through the 1830's and 40's. I can think of no statesman of his time that better exemplifies the struggle of American ideals against a short-sighted majority, than John Quincy Adams.
Good eye! I thought he typified the debate the country was having with itself concerning slavery.
Another awesome and insightful video but personally, I see the Federation as more of the EU.
+Trekkie in New Zealand Kia Ora That's a fair assessment.
I fell in love with Trek for exactly the reason you explain here. In the same regard, I'm also a proponent of a global federalist system that bridges the divide between national federation and the interstellar state portrayed in Trek.
You cannot run away from a global government, unlike either a system of nationstates or a future where interstellar travel is possible.
You forgot The Dominion and The Terran Empire.
I did not. This is not a comprehensive list.
But, in fairness. we will get to the Dominion.
Yeah the American people are not trusting in science
Hi. Liked the video but was wondering if you had a link to the alternate US states map at 3:05 as I didn't see it in the cited page.
Should be available on our Patreon page =)
Romulans = North Korea
Borg = anyone who constantly stays on their phones all day
Cardassians and ferengi = America
Federation = Canada
Vulcans = philosophy. Just philosophy.
The best Star Trek youtube channel!
+Guylanda128 We think so, too.
But, we are biased...
aand subscribed
Welcome aboard =)
Awesome vid. Already looking forward to the next one.
Not America, rather the UN or maybe Europe.
***** No.
No its the Soviet Union. The Federation is based on Marxist principles. Common ownership of the means of production. Also Gene Roddenberry was a Maoist so the Socialist representation of the Federation, added to the Imperial, Capitalist and federal systems of Klingon, Romulans and Ferengi are clearly intentional. Ever noticed that during the Temperal Cold war story line, Lenin was assassinated before the Russian revolution and this throws of the federations entire history.
Bout time someone made this video! Great job!
I don't think that the Federation has much of anything to do with US civilization. An American writer first imagined this science fiction society but the connection ends there. America is great with making films, television, popular music, creative fiction, etc. and this star trek universe is apart of that. Never been anything like the Federation as it is depicted in any real human civilization. Not even close. We in the so-called modern world are savage ignorant impoverished brutes compared to the Federation citizens, and this includes us in America. I mean, we don't even have a functional universal healthcare system.
What a great video. The narrator does an excellent job.
Thank you =)
If you like this, then you should check out my personal channel, which can be accessed through this video: th-cam.com/video/1z6jkkvRvVQ/w-d-xo.html
Dude... You're wrong on quite literally all accounts.
The Federation is (and was intentionally written) as an analogy to the UN (United Nations)
America isn't exactly big on equality or science at all.
Instead it's about uplifting yourself on the backs of minorities or just straight up poor people and full of right wing religious zealously...
So yeah, as an american, OF COURSE you would think they're talking about you. Who else would they talk about, there's only like 5 other countries on the planet, right? Just as god made the earth, america first!
And not every race in Star Trek is referencing some contrived chapter of your history or facet of you national consciousness.
Star Trek was always intended to be a reflection on the human condition.
(No need to spell it all out again - Borg/Individualism, Ferengi/rich vs. humane, Klingons/strength vs intellect, and so on...)
[That's why the Andorians are so fascinating and dull and annoying at the same time - they're us]
So please, PLEASE, take your starspangled banner and go home!
You're a dinosaur and nobody loves you, well...nobody outside the US.
The only way forward is together and not trough zionism or imperialism, AND CERTAINLY NOT THROUGH PATRIOTISM to anyone but planet earth and the human race.
+Chris Legan Hey man, you can have your own opinion on the guy's video (in fact some of your thoughts i share) but there is no reason for a personal attack. (a very un-Star Trek thing to do) The video is this man's interpretation of Star Trek. Just because you don't agree with it, or don't like it doesn't mean you have to go after the guy who made it.
+Chris Legan The Federation was indeed written as an analogy to the United Nation, but Star Trek is a show written by and for Americans. Star Trek represents an American worldview so thoroughly and so completely that the two cannot be separated. And the most important point to note is that the Americans writing Star Trek have written the Federation to be an idealized version of themselves. The real America is, of course, far more complicated and richer in scope.
That being said, there is always room for more than one interpretation and you are welcome to refute this interpretation in any way you'd like. That is the spirit of this channel. Just please do it without vile or emotionally charged language.
+TheMaskedMetalist You're right, but when people take an idea that has nothing to do with national politics and turn int into their personal political platform, I tend to overreact.
Especially when making obviously and objectively false claims.
+Trekspertise Not really an interpretation when the facts have been stated by the writers themselves...
But sure, this is what you choose to believe.
Like the US have chosen to believe that aluminium is pronounced aloominum.
After being told you're wrong for decades by everyone else and refuting it with "But we say it like that"; you eventually changed the spelling to aluminum.
You're the ONLY country on this planet doing that.
So yeah, I literally can not argue with you claiming that Star Trek is about the US, because it makes no sense for me to do so. Have fun on planet 'murica.
+Chris Legan I would love to see some of these writers' comments on the meaning of the Federation. Truly.
Outstanding presentation looking forward to more. Also is there an actual printed document of the prime directive?
Not really? Maybe the newer book "Star Trek Federation: The First 150 years" might have an approximation.
And there is plenty more on the way.
america??? noooope...you mean europe
I mean America.
This is, of course, just one way to "read" Star Trek. There are all kinds of ways to interpret the source material.
However, it must be said that Star Trek is an American show created by an American, written overwhelmingly by American writers for an American audience, conspicuously hires predominantly American actors (of the major crews, only 5 were British citizens) and discusses social issues relevant to American society such as the inclusion and exclusion of American minorities.
Disagree that Star Trek's audience is overwhelmingly American: it is known, enjoyed and debated throughout the world (I'm in Scotland); indeed, the TNG episode The High Ground was banned by the BBC on the show's first and second UK broadcasts, as it suggested that armed resistance would be instrumental in uniting Ireland in the future. This was quite contentious over here, as it was the height of the "troubles". The America-centricity of Star Trek up to and including the fact that aliens almost all have American accents is something I've found a little troubling, but you are right that aspects of modern society reflected in Star Trek's future are primarily American society. An International crew in the Original was protrayed by American or canadian actors, whereas TNG was a bit more diverse, at least in casting, with an Englishman playing a Frenchman, and an English woman playing a Betazoid.
+Trekspertise Actually I also think it is rather the UN or Europe. I think Rodenberry did not take America as model especially when he had characters like Sulu or Chekov, who have to work under Kirk and that while the threat of a nuclear war was real. It is a question about international cooperation. I think Rodenberry really ment international partnership
I believe the Federation represents the West. America, UK, Europe... It is a continuation of our greater civilisation, it holds and perpetuates our ideals. Democracy, scientific thought, exploration and an accepting community are all western inventions.
Actually, I wwould dispute that any of those are "Western inventions".
I feel like Star Trek VI would have been a perfect example of the Federation facing both internal and external challenges to their values. The deescalation of hostilities between 2 cultures that have hated each other their entire lives, and who have both left their mark on the other in scaring ways. Kirks reaction to Spocks statement "they are dying". The efforts individuals from all sides placed into keeping deep seated division and hatred in place in the face of the prospect of peace demonstrates an excellent example of direct challenges to Federation values from both within and without
Point 2 about the value Americans place on scientific advancement... not really accurate. I wish it was, but most Americans are still stuck in the dark ages of religion.
Hands up if your country is in the west and fight to have Creationism taught in schools.
+whyphy Well, that dynamic certainly exists. But, the majority of America acknowledges science and innovation as a good in our society, even if that majority has little to no political power to express their opinions.
+Trekspertise Tell that to the Trump...
Or the Bush...
Or the anti-gay activists...
Or the creationism parents and subsequently your school system.
Or to the friendly abortion clinic in your neighborhood. (don't have one? I wonder why...)
Shall I go on?
No, I meant I've had the disappointment of seeing the numbers for how many actually believe in evolution over science.
It was about a year ago, so I couldn't tell you were that came from, now. But I don't simply say this to 'rip' on the US. I was shocked
for the Americans that know science is accurate due to its results, great. More power to you. It was just sad to see they are a minority.
+whyphy It's worth mentioning that those Americans might hate science, but can't do without it's fruits. I'd say that's what he's referring to here, after all, who in America DOESN'T eagerly await the release of the next iPhone? The new car? Who here turns away new military technologies that keep American troops safe?
But yeah, our refusal to accept that metaphors exist is just sad. As far back as 214 AD, Christians were arguing that the entirety of Genesis was simply a metaphor. Why can't we just accept that idea?
Another enlightening video guys, which (as usual) is thought provoking!
Good job!!!
Thank you very much :)
you lost me the second you stated "it's murricuh!"
no, it's a general ideal of perfect society, shared across time and cultures.
I don't often share videos like this, but you examine the political atmosphere of Star Trek in a fascinating way, while only scratching the surface of what all Star Trek has said as far as society. You could do an entire Documentary on this subject.
Currently the US is exactly the opposite of the federation.
Currently a lot of people both inside and outside the US have a very badly warped view of what the US is and does in the world. This is because of the combination of the power the US wields in the world, which makes it too big to easily regard with impartiality, and the fact that the US professes to stand for certain ideals without being absolutely 100% perfect at all times at living up to them.
When a nation or an individual is striving for a high goal and trying to meet a high standard, that's when they are most open to criticism. No one expects China to stand up for the little guy, but the US gets blasted every single time it doesn't -- because of the ideals we have stated are ours, that we try with the normal success rate of any human society (guaranteed, above all else, to be less than 100%) to live up to.
hagamapama China never tried to be the world policeman or claim to be the greatest country ever. China doesn't have a gun to the heads of every other nation on the planet.
This was quite interesting. Thanks for posting it.
Hey that City at 1:45 is my home city of Birmingham, Alabama COOL! Are from Trekspertise from birmingham as well?
Nice job takin my quote from that clip. Deep Space Nine showed how the federation is a perpetual war machine.
I love the insight man keep up the awesome vids
+Richard Patton Thank you very much! It is a labor of love =)
Love your star trek videos. Very insightful!!
+bbybyrd Thank you! Welcome aboard :)
:D
What is the episode/series with the yellowshirt starfleet guy wandering around?
+nikolavgeorgiev That's Star Trek Voyager and it is an episode called Non Sequiter.
In watching your videos it was nice to see pictures of my hometown, Birmingham integrated in it.
+keontez Of course! Gotta represent :)
people keep saying all this stuff about it not being based on the US. But every episode involving earth is in the US. The federation hq and starfleet academy are both in the US. and the ships are USS ships which is a US naval vessel. And all the main characters are american.
While it didn't really exist at the time the original series was written (compared to it's modern form, anyway), I would argue the best modern analogy for the Federation is the European union.
There are shared rules, freedom of movement, basic concepts of universal rights, a sort of unified economic system, yet the individual countries in it still nominally have their own sovereignty, laws, rules and institutions.
OK, so the EU has a bunch of problems the Federation does not, and especially in economic terms doesn't really compare, but it seems like a pretty decent analogy for what the federation is.
Even the requirements for a country joining the EU have parallels with the things a society has to achieve to be considered for federation membership. And membership of the EU is voluntary, and stems from a political decision of a country to apply to join.
The US by contrast doesn't seem to have a clear way of adding more states to itself, individual states have considerably less autonomy and remaining identity than EU member states, and so on.
The EU is the most logical real-world parallel to the federation, NOT the considerably more monolithic United States...
KuraIthys The EU is less united than the Federation, but the way the EU is envisioned is more similar to the Federation.
Top Notch, excellent work..... This is why I love Star Trek!!
solid episode man.
+Saqwana Thank you =)
You are quite welcome.
I am actually taking a class on Star trek at Uni right now [which is pretty awesome]. We discussed this week that the Klingons in the original series were conceived to represent the Soviet Union. In the original series the federation, as you say serves as a mirror image of the U.S but also sometimes of Nato in some episodes. The Romulans were conceived to represent other communist powers, such as China, that might have been 'bad' but were not viewed as 'evil' as the Klingons for example. I can suggest some good reading if you want me to.
Impressive analysis of the politics of Star Trek.
"what do you think?"
"It's vile!!!"
Very interesting essay.
I chuckled at Quark's last line. He'd come under the spell of oversugared mid-20th c. drinks.
I would love to see more videos similar to the Klingon history but more general analyses like this are great to watch. Keeps it up!
At the current rate, I am doing one "history" video per series. We are in Trekspertise Series 2 right now.
I see "Star Trek" as commentary on what humanity is, what it should be today, and what it could become in the future.
Very interesting video about star trek federation culture and its complexity.
Where did you get that alternative history USA map?
I made it :)
What? NO mention of the Terran Empire?
As always that was a an amazing video.
Love this channel.Subbed.
Great video. I agree with you on most points, with the possible exception of the "idealized history" argument. People often forget that Star Trek is a post-apocalyptic setting, at least where Earth is involved. Yes the Federation represents an idealized future, but it came about as a response to horrific events like the Eugenics Wars, the Bell Riots and World War III. Even after its formation the Federation has had to grapple with policies others find questionable, such as the controversial Prime Directive and the existence of Section 31.
great vid!
thoughts about what the Terran Empire represent compared to America?
+kain91939
Most likely a reflection (lol) of the aspects of modern society that the Federation does not touch upon, e.g. our predilections to violence, cynicism, selfishness and exploitation. While the Federation represents an idealized future to strive towards, the Terran Empire serves as a stark warning for what may happen if humanity decides to follow its baser instincts.
***** well put and i agree.
I think the Terran Empire of the mirror universe is the more likely outcome of what human exploration and colonization of space would be. We are a species that seems to be predisposed to violence and cynicism especially when we perceive an outsider to be a threat. The beginning of the mirror episode on Enterprise where Cochran shoots the Vulcan and pillages their ship is much more likely then a peaceful first contact given human nature.
Very good analysis as always. Someone once mentionned to me that the Borg is a representation of the USSR/communist ideology, with a "collective" society put to the extreme, struggling with a Federation who is individualistic.
Id like to suggest a couple of videos, could you do some alternate trek history? Like explore what would happen in for say the klingon empire successfully beat, and occupied the federation. Or how if the Borg conquered earth what would the galactic repercussions be.
Brilliant video!
I'd love to see this expanded upon to include some other trek races and cultures, and maybe how different Trek races change across the different series'.
Thank you for watching. That is very kind of you to say :)
You are right. This should be expanded. And it is open to various interpretations, too.
That map in the begginning is a little different from the ones I saw in that official trek book. Romulan so small compared to fed, why do they have trouble with them? Same with Cardassians. And what is with that randompatch of fed territory between romulan and klingon not connected to the main fed territory?
The atari style bouncing spaceships graphic was great.
This video is fantastic!!!
+GrandFunker Thank you! I truly appreciate that =) Keep tabs on us...
Trekspertise I will! I've subbed, and already enjoyed several of your vids.
I genuinely enjoy your videos, finding them insightful and well-crafted. I do find myself frustrated by a lack of nuance inevitable given limited time and specificity of topic. For example, I would love to see a video on the Bajorans as an example of how TREK treats religion--not least the fact that after years and years of watching DS9 quite literally I have almost no notion of what their religion teaches! What in fact are Bajoran religious beliefs? It is as if all one learned about the Ancient Greek religion was that they worshiped a bunch of gods who were supposed to live atop Mount Olympus, and there was this oracle everyone paid attention to, plus some festivals. That really tells nothing at all. For example, in Greek myth men and women literally were separate creations--and the worship of many gods involving "mystery cults" based on initiation into fundamental insights. In their pantheon the daughter of (essentially) Mother Nature is the wife and Queen of the King of the Dead. Greek myth has monsters, but no demons as we think of them (which has led Disney and others to re-cast figures as if they were the equivalent of Western demons). And so on. Is any of this true of Bajoran belief in the Prophets? I have no idea. Do Bajorans believe in life after death? What form does it take, and why? Compare this to the plethora of information we have about Cardassian or Klingon culture! Okay, un-clicking my soapbox icon now. Keep up the good work!
+David MacDowell Blue I would love to do a few episodes on Religion in Star Trek, or just religion in sci-fi, generally. And we will get to those more detailed topics, trust me. It is just a matter of time and money. The channel seems to be growing quite well, so I see topics like this as a distinct possibility.
This is one of my favorites of your videos, they are all fantastic, thank you!
Well, to kind of prove your point, I got Star Trek:, The Original Series Complete Episode Box Set for my birthday recently. In one of the episodes, Kirk visiits a planet where the Kongs and the Yangs have been fighting for centuries. At the end of that episode, the Yangs bring out the Stars and Stripes and copies of the Bill of Rights and Constitution, which Kirk reads to the Yangs. So, Rodenberry might well have mirrored American Ideals into his series.
The Federation reflects America is a very realistic interpretation, and can even be extended into the JJ Verse Star Trek movies. They greatly reflect the current American society, where optimism is being eaten away by fear.
good job. much to think about