Rear wheel drive, light weight, decent power 240hp, naturally aspirated boxer engine lowering the centre of gravity, focus on handling and agility. I was hoping for a bit different design in this new facelifted version, but overall... great car, we need more manufacturers going in that direction of "affordable" sports cars focused on driving experience. This and Yaris GR been definitely most interesting 'sports' cars of few recent years.
S2’s are appreciating at a crazy rate. I think will be a car that is more exclusive and more desirable in a decade. I’m sure you’ll look back and say, “damn glad I kept it!”
you can't really say what any investment will do in 10 years. If people could we'll all be billionaires. Cars have done well given mass liquidity and financing. But so has almost every 'investment' in recent years. But as rates rise then you will see some of these bubbles start popping. And also owning a car for investment is very different than buying a car for driving. You can't drive investment cars. It will sit in your garage until auction house. If you want to invest in cars to make big profit, there are much better investments out there than cars. Cars aren't liquid, are niche, have lots of taxes (depending on where you live), have high costs to maintain (especially as they get older and parts get rarer), hard to transport (to most costly to access larger market, be it for buyer or seller) and many things.
@@PyroBlonde7777 You make it sound like the BRZ is not an actual sports car. It is. But I agree that a fair comparison needs to have the BRZ modified at the same level as the S2000.
The new generation of BRZ is growing on me, still love the old ones headlights and taillights. That blue color is super nice. Edit, I really like the gran turismo window decal on the S2000, it's a nice touch.
Great video Albo, informative and fun to watch. Both the S2000 and new GR86/BRZ are great in different ways. But LETS NOT FORGET, the S2000 costed more brand new than the GR86/BRZ costs, after you do inflation adjustment from 1999 to 2021. 2009 Mazda MX-5 costed $21k and the 2009 S2000 costed about $35k. The S2000 was priced towards a Porsche Boxster, and the BRZ/86s cost similarly to a Mazda MX-5 Miata Roadster, so thats a big difference in price. So if the S2000 didn't have the incredible engine that revs to 9000rpm or have such a great gear shift feel, that would be a terrible thing. Objectively speaking, the BRZ/GR86 will have better torsional rigidity and the steering feel is better, more torquey engine+aerodynamic and it will be much easier to use on a regular basis as its more practical (and has to meet current safety regulations and emissions regulations, unlike what Honda faced in the late 90s). Regardless, both the S2000 and Toyobarus are great cars in different aspects.
@@maiy8786 Because the S2000s steering feel isn't known to be particularly great - its one of the first sportscars to use electric power steering. The BRZ/86s have been having one of the best steering feels for an electric power steering. You would need to spend Porsche Cayman/Lotus levels of money to get better steering from a RWD coupe.
@@maiy8786 Yes correct, I'm definitely not going to say that the 86/BRZ has better steering feel than the hydraulic power steering you get from a Lotus or a McLaren or a Porsche 997 GT3 RS, but just speaking for electric power steering, its not bad at all.
That's so awesome that the Japanese police decided to help you. I had the exact same thing happen to my G37. I found the matching car with matching traded paint and scratch height that parks in my same apartment parking lot. American police said it wasn't enough evidence and wouldn't help me lol. This was my door, fender, and wheel as well.
It's interesting Albo was talking about forever cars. The BRZ and S2000 share similar characteristics just with the BRZ complying with newer standards and regulations. I think that new BRZ will be a forever car...but for the younger generation as it will be the last of a dying breed.
my 2013 frs is my forever car! 2700lbs~, 396whp, manual, has Advan TCiii wheels, hks coilovers and soooo many more mods but I kept it simple and clean. I love it, I've owned it for 8 years now with 80k miles it will be mine even after I'm too old to get out of it lmao
@@AJBAF how did you push the first gen to 300+whp without force induction. If you force induced, how did you keep it beblow 2800lbs. Something doesn't add up. Unless you mod it with carbon fiber parts, as well as stripping the interior to compensate the turbo/supercharger and intercooler weight.
@@VinRZ I have a jdl turbo kit gtx2860r flex fuel. On e85 is 396whp. I have a carbon fiber rear trunk, removed spare, jack racing seat. It’s a high 2700 I can’t remember the numbers from when I corner balanced it. I have a 2.5in down pipe one resonator in front pipe single exit cat back with a muffler that way less than half stock muffler. Pretty much every aftermarket item I’ve purchased I made it a thing to be lighter than stock. Except shift knob, tires, and the turbo kit of course.
For me, it's either pay a crazy amount for a used car that's almost 20 years old, or pay $28-32K USD for a brand new car with modern features. While I think the S still has the better engine, not sure if I wanna pay these prices anymore. If I'm collecting/babying the car, the S is a no-brainer. If tracking, I'd rather get a used 86/BRZ.
The BRZ is good for what it is. A sports car that is biased for the street in a way that will appeal to the widest possible audience. The S2000 was built for a specific driver. One unafraid to spin it past 6000 and experience the sound of unbridled v-TEC. I love the more connected older cars from the mid 80's to the 90's. Technology and safety are the order of the day now and sometimes it takes away from the driving experience. Its hard to find a modern reasonably priced car that doesn't feel like an appliance. That's why you should keep the S2000 and complete the journey that you started with it.
I want that hks kit man, please get it and do a full on installation series, ecu, injectors, pump, ap2 retainers and all.. want my arvou s2000 lol Glad you are sticking with your S, I won’t let mine go ever.. love the channel man.. cheers from Denver, Colorado
S2K was my dream car for a long time. The older they get the more maintenance the S2Ks will require. I don't like doing all the little things on cars like I used to when I was a bit younger. All newer cars have a less raw feel from factory because most people attribute that quieter sound to "quality". You can do things like installing stiffer motor/trans mounts, suspension, IHE, etc to increase the raw feel of these new cars. Some of those raw feel mods will be the first few things I do to my new GR86 when I can get my hands on one. I think once you see how these cars feel after a few mods it will likely change how you feel about them. The aero alone makes a huge improvement on these cars vs older vehicles.
@@ALBO Good point about the older cars having a raw feel. The direct and mechanical feeling. It's like you can feel the soul of the car. New cars, maybe faster and smarter, but everything is electronically controlled. I feel the slight initial disconnectedness of the electronics, the accelerator, steering ..... I would rather take the older, slower car which has a soul. A car that i can be excited about. I want to kick myself almost everyday for selling my 2nd gen R56 Mini Cooper S when i moved country.
Also not living in Japan or US completely change the perspective on things. I've sold my Turbo manual supra just because I couldn't afford to maintain and modify it anymore. With this insanely high spike in prices of parts and the car itself, crashing o tracking an old car has become impossibile for normal people, at least here in Europe for sure. When a brand new gr86 cost exactly the same price as a 150k km s2000 that require thousand of € in maintainence to be properly used on track there's not much choice. And I'm telling you, selling the supra after 10 Years of ownership has been so devastating i still dream about having it.
@@NahBra_EUC 1996 jdm right hand drive rsp blue. It's was something I had to do, I'm not the collector kind of guy and a used 2jz is like 10k€ right now, it's just crazy. I miss it though, 10 years are a lot of memories do deal with
my 2013 frs is my forever car! 2700lbs~, 396whp, manual, has Advan TCiii wheels, hks coilovers and soooo many more mods but I kept it simple and clean. I love it, I've owned it for 8 years now with 80k miles it will be mine even after I'm too old to get out of it lmao
I would definitely rather have the AP1 S2000 because it's like having a 401K plan while you are having fun driving it around 😉 My friend bought one AP1 2002 54k miles for $9,500 in 2015 and just sold it to an old fella with 112k miles on it for $23,800 cash... what a great return and now my friend misses that S2K so much 😢 I think he wished he kept it, he acts like a girl broke up with him.... I have learned that if you have a forever car that you better keep it and I'm sorry to say BRZ owners but it is not a forever car like the Formula 1 Honda S2000.
I have a 21 Crosstrek XV sport that looks exactly like that XV In the showroom. Same color. Slightly different trim. I’ve dreamed of an S2000 for years, but I’m not paying for a used S for what I can get for a new ND2 Miata or a BRZ.
The GR86 seems to have better dynamics than the BRZ. The suspension setup makes a difference when it comes to dynamics. S2K is still great, and I still would love to own one. However, I’d rather own the GR86 since changing the headers, intake manifold, a tune, and removing the fake engine noise would make the car sound a lot better. Not to mention, the chassis is miles better than the S2K.
You know it’s the same exact engine because Subaru made the engine for the gr86 and the brz. It’s literally the same car just different badge. I’d rather have the Subaru with a warranty so if there are any issues the dealership would truly know what they are doing.
@@AgentK1939 Toyota has complementary maintenance here in the US and Subaru doesn’t. And there’s also a complementary membership for NASA for all the drivers to learn how to drive their car at the limit. Comparing the two, the GR86 is more tail happy and more willing to trail brake at the limit from the factory based on how DK was able to push it.
S2000 will forever be a classic and an icon, however, the new GR86 or BRZ is a better car. BRZ is easier to drive, easier to launch, more forgiving, more seating room, you can fit 2 small Japanese persons in the back if needed, quicker and easier to mod for more power, comes with hardtop, newer with warranty, more features, and lastly cheaper. We all should be happy that Toyota and Subaru are still making these, and maybe, just maybe ticked Honda off bad enough they might think about bringing back the S2000 :)
Depends what you mean by better. Some people prefer the more raw experience with the s2000. Brz is more practical (then again it still is a coupe with really small back seats). S2000 punches more power stock with a more reliable engine. But the brz can get drop in turbos (assuming the boxer engine won’t blow up). And at least with me, I could care less about newer features and care more for driver experience. But everyone has their opinion.
I find it insulting comparing a brz to an S2000. Aside from the fact value is going up like hell. Not everything is about speed. The driving experience on the S2000 is just INSANE, always puts a smile on my face. Plus it looks so goddamn sexy even after 20 years!!
i love your s2k content. i just bought an ap1 a few months ago with only 40k miles. I've already put 3k on it and feel bad that im stacking miles on it, but i love the car so much and i hate to see it sit.
i bought one in february with 50k Kilometer (31k miles) and put around 6k Km on it (almost 4k miles) :D i had that feeling too but then, those cars are to be driven and they are usually very reliable if taken car of so i'm gonna put a lot of miles on them in the future ;D
S2000 owner here, this is the exact video I have been waiting for since BRZ 2.0 dropped. Thanks ALBO dude for this content, it is actually helpful for real world decisions. Cheers!
Your welcome dude! Also if it’s any help, I absolutely love the vibe and look and performance/feel of the new GR86 and would get that instead of a BRZ, but that’s just my tastes!
Wow, Japanese Police are nice enough to come and check out such minor issue about damaged cars. In my country they don't give a damn about a guy which did hit and run on me at the busy traffic! Good to see your car being fixed :) Whether it is the new GRZ86 or GT4, they will never give the same feel as the 90s or early 2000s jdm cars. Back then I bought the FT86 (stock) and drove it daily. I have to admit that new sports cars have good balance, grip and good interior electronics which make the ride very comfortable. But they don't have the raw and rough feel like the old jdm cars. When I jump back to my s-chassis car, I feel much more excited and sometimes making me feel tougher too lmao. Really, old jdm cars gives me true feeling of every inch of the road and bumps and just the engine noise itself is so good. Unfortunately, old jdm cars don't have all the modern electronics and comfortable interior. I used to drive the s-chassis daily and it can make me really tired in long run. You know stiff suspension and loud noise can exhaust you out. My solution to this was making the s-chassis a weekend car and it became much more enjoyable. Glad you you are keeping the s2000. You will never regret it. I think when you upgrade the power of s2000, whether turbo, supercharger or even na power, you would love it even more. Hope to see more mods to s2k :)
I feel the same about our 2015 Forester XT. It’s quick, comfy, and a really great family car but it is a bit soul less still. Nothing compares to the SG era. I would love to pick up a new 86 some time. Your channel has me looking at s2ks more than ever, but for the price they are going for in the states, I think I’d rather have the 86.
I'd probably keep the S2k till it dies, but that's me. I'm the kinda guy that keeps a car for a long time. That's my plan with the WRX Hatch that I have, not many new cars excite me (that I can' afford anyway..lol)
Honda needs to bring back the S2000 and they only need to make it lighter with better handling. They don’t need to change the exterior as it has a timeless look. They can use the same engine with improvements and they will get buying them up.
I really enjoyed this video! I’m definitely excited for the new 86 platform, and I’m looking forward to test driving one! Also, what air freshener do you have in the S2000? I love the visual aesthetic of it!
coming from a big turbo kit on my S2000 back to NA I really forgot how enjoyable the car is with stock power. The SC kit would be great but only if it was 6-8psi so it just enhances what the S2000 already offers.
As an owner of a 2019 BRZ I gotta say if I would have to choose between new BRZ and a S2K... I would go for the S2K. The linear design on it just makes it look way more like a true JDM car. The wave-like lines on the BRZ on its sides just distort the silhouette of the car and make it look worse imo Hyped to see what's gonna be in stock with the potential HKS collab in the future!
Viotrix You have to factor in that it is the pedestrian safety and other crash standards which determine a car's design. If Honda brought back the S2000 in 2021, I guarantee you, it won't have such a low slung bonnet.
@T R Then you're a neanderthal for comparing a car designed in the 90s to a car designed 22 years later, when Honda had much looser regulations and budget constraints to Toyota/Subaru. Ever thought about using your brain?
@T R You're one of those dumbasses who doesn't know anything about inflation adjustment either. The BRZ/GR86 is at a similar price range as the Mazda MX-5. The S2000 in 2000 costed $15K+ more than the MX-5 in 2000. So there's no excuse that there's more money Honda had to develop their pricier car than how much Toyota & Subaru had with their 86/BRZ and Mazda's MX-5.
S2000 will probably be more of a sports car but the brz is much more practical for daily driving and the fact that it drives extremely well (from what others say) I would definitely choose it.
If you already own an S2000, then the S2000 is a much better option than the BRZ/GR86/FRS. But if you doesn't, then the little Toyobaru is basically a modern S2000 that's going to be as valuable as the real one in the near future as it is now. Go get it before it's too late.
Your s2k top goes down so much faster than my 986 boxster lol I have the urge to buy one of the last first gen 86 and a brand new one and just shove them into a barn for 20 years.
You mention you don’t think the brz is a forever car but it’s one of few cars that had to stop production cause they couldn’t keep up with orders (at least in America) and that’s saying something.
Not sure if this is a fair comparison, let's assume we get one s2k for 20kusd, plus all the mods that you put on the s2k to modernize it. I have a feeling that it will be well over the stock price for the brz. Should be a stock vs stock, or modified vs modified. As well as the fact that you remove personal bias with your own built car. However, I do own a second gen brz, without driving the s2k, id say that the brz gives me great amount of joy when im driving it around. But one I do want to get my hands on a s2k
Your car is very beautiful, definitely prefer it to the new BRZ. I picked up an ITR over summer and I love it, but the S2000 looks another step up. I wonder how difficult it would be to get an older BRZ and make it more raw?
MT driver for 17 yrs; it's always almost funny culture shock when I need to get an AT rental car for whatever. The first panic is either the clutch or the stick LOL. xD I have an '01 Forester. Maybe I'll upgrade to yours next.
I think they can be both forever cars. I owned a 2012 BRZ and 2002 AP1 s2000. Bought the s2000 used and the BRZ new. Still owned both. They are both good cars and feels very similar. S2000 has a nice bonus because of its appreciating value. And the 9k redline and VTEC changeover never gets old. For new buyers lusting for an s2000 but wants a new car, just get GR86/BRZ or MX5 or RF. In manual transmission. You'll get pretty much the same experience with a little difference in flavor.
I recently started listening to your podcast at work,and Im interested in the guests you have on but it's hard to listen to while you make dinner in the background and God knows what else
Wish I could live in Japan I love the Japanese culture and I love your s2k I was able to buy a celica gt4 imported from Japan with 60k miles and I love it.
Albo I enjoy watching your video and is true what you say I have a friend that owns and S2000 I drove it one day and I was amazed how fast it was and pull whenever I floor the car amazing car not for me consider I too big for it but hopefully I will get a 370z soon
Well, one is better at this and one is better at that. Do you like this or that more? Is this more important to you than that, or is that more important? Where do you do most of your driving ...below 5k rpm or above 5k rpm? Do you prefer a convertible? This or that, you can't go wrong... but, which one fits your life/likes better?
I have always liked the S2000 and would probably enjoy driving one. But honestly the cars go for so much that I'd be getting into the price range of a few cars I'd rather have. A really low mile S2000 will sell for around 32-37k. At that point I can get a mint Dodge Viper GTS. To each their own.
Stock for Stock new BRZ/GR86 will have better performance than S2000. I have the S2000 and modified 2013 previous gen 86. Unmodified 86: feels about the same with S2000 performance-wise. 86 has better steering and handling, better seating position, lower center of gravity. S2000 has better engine and shifter modified 86(E85 and suspension mods): more usable power than S2000, more torque, better handling, better steering, better seating position, lower center of gravity. So if new stock GR86/BRZ is similar in performance as modified GT86, then it undoubtedly perform better than a stock S2000
Damn I’ve bought my new car in 2004 and now it’s only worth 2000. You live and you learn about buying new cars and is it worth it at the moment. Once you have it then you’ll be like I’ve should have not purchased a new car.
At 11:40 when you said you feel like it’s not overdone, it is. That massive rear wing definitely ruins the timeless design. Also those giant tyres.. Otherwise it really is a timeless design. Hard to believe it’s 20yrs old and still looks like a neat recent design. Subtle upgrades are fine but when you start mods galore I think it just ruins the essence of any car. Love the GT sticker though 😂 Please remove that rear wing. Great content keep it up 👍
Subarus were always quirky but never felt cheap. The latest lineup feel like they're old just sitting in the dealership. That newer Forester Albo showed looks terrible imo.
Im under 30 (I’m 20), I don’t have a good job atm because college just started, however I have over $20k saved up. Love the 86 look. I just don’t know if I should lease a new 86 lol
What you do is continue to save your money another year or two and pick up a used 86 for much less than brand new. Also, car prices are crazy inflated right now due to supply chain issues. It's a bad time to buy a car (finance wise) if you don't need one.
@@michaelvl494 yeah I’m going to have to wait regardless because I’ve seen some posts about the new brz getting their prices increased by $15,000 due to “shortages”
To be fair, the S2000s were more expensive cars when brand new, almost Porsche Boxster levels of price, whereas the BRZs and 86s are priced like Mazda MX-5 miatas
Had an AP2. The steering feel is just not good. Couldn't get past it. Bit of flex in the chassis as well. Definitely preferred my modded '13 FRS. Waiting on a '22 BRZ. The Honda is much better built and bespoke. Definitely a more special car but just not as much fun to drive at and over the limit imo.
Both the S2000 and new GR86/BRZ are good in different ways. The S2000 may have the more rev-happy engine and a better gear shift feel, but it costed more brand new than these GR86/BRZs cost, when you factor in the adjustment from inflation
@@smilepermile8165 totally agree. It has the better engine and gearbox. and shares no parts with anything else. Lucky to be able to choose both and still not break the bank but as time goes on S2000s values will only get higher I'd imagine. Can't go wrong either way.
Funny I prefer my BRZ gearbox over my AP1, throws are consistent as can be. The only preference of my AP1 is the motor. Maybe this new model will cure this for me with what seems a proper powerband? We shall see
im thinking of buying a 2023 Z but whenever i see the new brz or gr86 makes me think that a it would be better than the Z(minus the power) then this video came up, i forgotten bout the s2000 but maaaaaaaaan i still want an s2000 PS: rumours say that the manual 2023 Z wont have an LSD out of the factory, like wait, hold up
Hey Al, The S2K is indeed a legend. Even it’s parts are legendary. There are AE86’s wearing the S2K’s engine. Can’t really compare the BRZ or GT86 to the S2K, I also feel bad for every other non-exotic you drive after the S2K, it sets the bar a little too high. 😂 However… I feel that you would have had a better experience with the BRZ if SUBARU had let you drive a manual transmission. I’ve had several opportunities to drive the BRZ and GT86, each time, the automatics were basically garbage on wheels (I really feel bad for anyone who bought an AUTO… As per DJ Khalid, “congratulations, You just played yourself”), when compared to the manuals - which felt, like you say, “raw”. It really draws me back to the feeling of 90’s eras cars. Toyota once threw a test drive event a few years back at Woodbine mall here in Toronto, and I drove the GT86 manual - the ride along tester let me turn off all the driving aids and push it a little like I used to with my older cars - and aside from the torque dip at higher revs, I loved it. Vivichan set the benchmark for me when it comes to small light, nimble and high revving cars, and the GT86 exceeded that benchmark (which is cool, because the GT86 and BRZ are built in the factory where Subaru once built the VIVIO, and other Kei cars). The test drive reminded me a little of that time you let me drive your Miata, where I pushed it a little too much like I do with AWD cars and felt the rear end step out 🤩 in dry like Subarus do in snow 😂. I hope you get the opportunity to drive a manual BRZ or GT86, I feel the automatic may have unfairly tarnished, or given you a bad first impression/opinion of the BRZ. Loved the video buddy, Take care - Your friend.
Subaru should come out with a STI option on the BRZ with a turbo and thick sway bars. It'd probably need a revamped cooling system; upgraded intercooler, radiator, radiator fans ect.
I cant believe you had so much attention from the police for a scratch. In the UK if we had cctv of a car deliberately and repeatedly smashing your car, the police would do nothing, zero.. If you pesster them to death and get them to come out, they would still do nothing!
Rear wheel drive, light weight, decent power 240hp, naturally aspirated boxer engine lowering the centre of gravity, focus on handling and agility. I was hoping for a bit different design in this new facelifted version, but overall... great car, we need more manufacturers going in that direction of "affordable" sports cars focused on driving experience. This and Yaris GR been definitely most interesting 'sports' cars of few recent years.
The s2k is not lightweight. The brz is not lightweight.
@@tabryis Standards have changed. pretty much anything under 3000 lbs is lightweight lol its not common for most cars to be under 3k nowadays
240 hp? I thought it had 228
@@tabryis uh yes they are, at less than 2900lb, find me a 2800lb 230hp sportscar for less than 30k, go ahead.
@@KillaZamii Yup, Kowalski got it wrong, 240hp is the s2000.
S2’s are appreciating at a crazy rate. I think will be a car that is more exclusive and more desirable in a decade. I’m sure you’ll look back and say, “damn glad I kept it!”
you can't really say what any investment will do in 10 years. If people could we'll all be billionaires. Cars have done well given mass liquidity and financing. But so has almost every 'investment' in recent years. But as rates rise then you will see some of these bubbles start popping. And also owning a car for investment is very different than buying a car for driving. You can't drive investment cars. It will sit in your garage until auction house. If you want to invest in cars to make big profit, there are much better investments out there than cars. Cars aren't liquid, are niche, have lots of taxes (depending on where you live), have high costs to maintain (especially as they get older and parts get rarer), hard to transport (to most costly to access larger market, be it for buyer or seller) and many things.
Its the shifting, the engine bay noise and the exhaust of most of these JDM cars that makes it unforgettable and enjoyable.
It's not very fair to compare a stock, automatic BRZ to a fully modded S2K.
It makes no sense to compare a sport coupe with a rear seat to an actual sports car like the S2000.
My thoughts exactly, should compare stock S2K
@@PyroBlonde7777 You make it sound like the BRZ is not an actual sports car. It is. But I agree that a fair comparison needs to have the BRZ modified at the same level as the S2000.
@@PyroBlonde7777 Honda stan
@@TheChannel1978 lmao
The new generation of BRZ is growing on me, still love the old ones headlights and taillights. That blue color is super nice.
Edit, I really like the gran turismo window decal on the S2000, it's a nice touch.
I like it to, I had a gran turismo banner on my FR-S windshield. But it was a solid black banner with white lettering
Great video Albo, informative and fun to watch. Both the S2000 and new GR86/BRZ are great in different ways. But LETS NOT FORGET, the S2000 costed more brand new than the GR86/BRZ costs, after you do inflation adjustment from 1999 to 2021. 2009 Mazda MX-5 costed $21k and the 2009 S2000 costed about $35k. The S2000 was priced towards a Porsche Boxster, and the BRZ/86s cost similarly to a Mazda MX-5 Miata Roadster, so thats a big difference in price. So if the S2000 didn't have the incredible engine that revs to 9000rpm or have such a great gear shift feel, that would be a terrible thing. Objectively speaking, the BRZ/GR86 will have better torsional rigidity and the steering feel is better, more torquey engine+aerodynamic and it will be much easier to use on a regular basis as its more practical (and has to meet current safety regulations and emissions regulations, unlike what Honda faced in the late 90s). Regardless, both the S2000 and Toyobarus are great cars in different aspects.
@@maiy8786 Because the S2000s steering feel isn't known to be particularly great - its one of the first sportscars to use electric power steering. The BRZ/86s have been having one of the best steering feels for an electric power steering. You would need to spend Porsche Cayman/Lotus levels of money to get better steering from a RWD coupe.
@@maiy8786 Yes correct, I'm definitely not going to say that the 86/BRZ has better steering feel than the hydraulic power steering you get from a Lotus or a McLaren or a Porsche 997 GT3 RS, but just speaking for electric power steering, its not bad at all.
That's so awesome that the Japanese police decided to help you. I had the exact same thing happen to my G37. I found the matching car with matching traded paint and scratch height that parks in my same apartment parking lot. American police said it wasn't enough evidence and wouldn't help me lol. This was my door, fender, and wheel as well.
It's interesting Albo was talking about forever cars. The BRZ and S2000 share similar characteristics just with the BRZ complying with newer standards and regulations. I think that new BRZ will be a forever car...but for the younger generation as it will be the last of a dying breed.
my 2013 frs is my forever car! 2700lbs~, 396whp, manual, has Advan TCiii wheels, hks coilovers and soooo many more mods but I kept it simple and clean. I love it, I've owned it for 8 years now with 80k miles it will be mine even after I'm too old to get out of it lmao
@@AJBAF how did you push the first gen to 300+whp without force induction. If you force induced, how did you keep it beblow 2800lbs. Something doesn't add up. Unless you mod it with carbon fiber parts, as well as stripping the interior to compensate the turbo/supercharger and intercooler weight.
@@VinRZ I have a jdl turbo kit gtx2860r flex fuel. On e85 is 396whp. I have a carbon fiber rear trunk, removed spare, jack racing seat. It’s a high 2700 I can’t remember the numbers from when I corner balanced it. I have a 2.5in down pipe one resonator in front pipe single exit cat back with a muffler that way less than half stock muffler. Pretty much every aftermarket item I’ve purchased I made it a thing to be lighter than stock. Except shift knob, tires, and the turbo kit of course.
For me, it's either pay a crazy amount for a used car that's almost 20 years old, or pay $28-32K USD for a brand new car with modern features. While I think the S still has the better engine, not sure if I wanna pay these prices anymore. If I'm collecting/babying the car, the S is a no-brainer. If tracking, I'd rather get a used 86/BRZ.
The BRZ is good for what it is. A sports car that is biased for the street in a way that will appeal to the widest possible audience. The S2000 was built for a specific driver. One unafraid to spin it past 6000 and experience the sound of unbridled v-TEC. I love the more connected older cars from the mid 80's to the 90's. Technology and safety are the order of the day now and sometimes it takes away from the driving experience. Its hard to find a modern reasonably priced car that doesn't feel like an appliance. That's why you should keep the S2000 and complete the journey that you started with it.
man Albo... that S2000 of yours is so sick. The engine sound is super dope too.
I want that hks kit man, please get it and do a full on installation series, ecu, injectors, pump, ap2 retainers and all.. want my arvou s2000 lol
Glad you are sticking with your S, I won’t let mine go ever.. love the channel man.. cheers from Denver, Colorado
S2K was my dream car for a long time. The older they get the more maintenance the S2Ks will require. I don't like doing all the little things on cars like I used to when I was a bit younger. All newer cars have a less raw feel from factory because most people attribute that quieter sound to "quality". You can do things like installing stiffer motor/trans mounts, suspension, IHE, etc to increase the raw feel of these new cars. Some of those raw feel mods will be the first few things I do to my new GR86 when I can get my hands on one.
I think once you see how these cars feel after a few mods it will likely change how you feel about them. The aero alone makes a huge improvement on these cars vs older vehicles.
Thats’s a great point. I’m sure the new GR86 will be a fantastic car.
@@ALBO Good point about the older cars having a raw feel. The direct and mechanical feeling. It's like you can feel the soul of the car.
New cars, maybe faster and smarter, but everything is electronically controlled. I feel the slight initial disconnectedness of the electronics, the accelerator, steering .....
I would rather take the older, slower car which has a soul. A car that i can be excited about.
I want to kick myself almost everyday for selling my 2nd gen R56 Mini Cooper S when i moved country.
Also not living in Japan or US completely change the perspective on things. I've sold my Turbo manual supra just because I couldn't afford to maintain and modify it anymore. With this insanely high spike in prices of parts and the car itself, crashing o tracking an old car has become impossibile for normal people, at least here in Europe for sure. When a brand new gr86 cost exactly the same price as a 150k km s2000 that require thousand of € in maintainence to be properly used on track there's not much choice. And I'm telling you, selling the supra after 10 Years of ownership has been so devastating i still dream about having it.
@@amuseracing Sorry for your loss. Which color and year did you have?
@@NahBra_EUC 1996 jdm right hand drive rsp blue. It's was something I had to do, I'm not the collector kind of guy and a used 2jz is like 10k€ right now, it's just crazy. I miss it though, 10 years are a lot of memories do deal with
my 2013 frs is my forever car! 2700lbs~, 396whp, manual, has Advan TCiii wheels, hks coilovers and soooo many more mods but I kept it simple and clean. I love it, I've owned it for 8 years now with 80k miles it will be mine even after I'm too old to get out of it lmao
I would definitely rather have the AP1 S2000 because it's like having a 401K plan while you are having fun driving it around 😉 My friend bought one AP1 2002 54k miles for $9,500 in 2015 and just sold it to an old fella with 112k miles on it for $23,800 cash... what a great return and now my friend misses that S2K so much 😢 I think he wished he kept it, he acts like a girl broke up with him.... I have learned that if you have a forever car that you better keep it and I'm sorry to say BRZ owners but it is not a forever car like the Formula 1 Honda S2000.
I have a 21 Crosstrek XV sport that looks exactly like that XV In the showroom. Same color. Slightly different trim.
I’ve dreamed of an S2000 for years, but I’m not paying for a used S for what I can get for a new ND2 Miata or a BRZ.
The GR86 seems to have better dynamics than the BRZ. The suspension setup makes a difference when it comes to dynamics. S2K is still great, and I still would love to own one. However, I’d rather own the GR86 since changing the headers, intake manifold, a tune, and removing the fake engine noise would make the car sound a lot better. Not to mention, the chassis is miles better than the S2K.
You know it’s the same exact engine because Subaru made the engine for the gr86 and the brz. It’s literally the same car just different badge. I’d rather have the Subaru with a warranty so if there are any issues the dealership would truly know what they are doing.
@@AgentK1939 Toyota has complementary maintenance here in the US and Subaru doesn’t. And there’s also a complementary membership for NASA for all the drivers to learn how to drive their car at the limit. Comparing the two, the GR86 is more tail happy and more willing to trail brake at the limit from the factory based on how DK was able to push it.
@@AgentK1939 no dealership knows what they’re doing
S2000 will forever be a classic and an icon, however, the new GR86 or BRZ is a better car. BRZ is easier to drive, easier to launch, more forgiving, more seating room, you can fit 2 small Japanese persons in the back if needed, quicker and easier to mod for more power, comes with hardtop, newer with warranty, more features, and lastly cheaper. We all should be happy that Toyota and Subaru are still making these, and maybe, just maybe ticked Honda off bad enough they might think about bringing back the S2000 :)
Depends what you mean by better. Some people prefer the more raw experience with the s2000. Brz is more practical (then again it still is a coupe with really small back seats). S2000 punches more power stock with a more reliable engine. But the brz can get drop in turbos (assuming the boxer engine won’t blow up). And at least with me, I could care less about newer features and care more for driver experience. But everyone has their opinion.
I find it insulting comparing a brz to an S2000. Aside from the fact value is going up like hell. Not everything is about speed. The driving experience on the S2000 is just INSANE, always puts a smile on my face. Plus it looks so goddamn sexy even after 20 years!!
Purchased the BRZ new in ‘12, have an AP1 as well. What’s insulting?
i love your s2k content. i just bought an ap1 a few months ago with only 40k miles. I've already put 3k on it and feel bad that im stacking miles on it, but i love the car so much and i hate to see it sit.
i bought one in february with 50k Kilometer (31k miles) and put around 6k Km on it (almost 4k miles) :D i had that feeling too but then, those cars are to be driven and they are usually very reliable if taken car of so i'm gonna put a lot of miles on them in the future ;D
Bro you bought a car drive it
How much did it cost you if you don’t mind me asking looking at one with 48k miles right now
S2000 owner here, this is the exact video I have been waiting for since BRZ 2.0 dropped. Thanks ALBO dude for this content, it is actually helpful for real world decisions. Cheers!
Your welcome dude! Also if it’s any help, I absolutely love the vibe and look and performance/feel of the new GR86 and would get that instead of a BRZ, but that’s just my tastes!
Wow, Japanese Police are nice enough to come and check out such minor issue about damaged cars. In my country they don't give a damn about a guy which did hit and run on me at the busy traffic! Good to see your car being fixed :)
Whether it is the new GRZ86 or GT4, they will never give the same feel as the 90s or early 2000s jdm cars. Back then I bought the FT86 (stock) and drove it daily. I have to admit that new sports cars have good balance, grip and good interior electronics which make the ride very comfortable. But they don't have the raw and rough feel like the old jdm cars. When I jump back to my s-chassis car, I feel much more excited and sometimes making me feel tougher too lmao. Really, old jdm cars gives me true feeling of every inch of the road and bumps and just the engine noise itself is so good. Unfortunately, old jdm cars don't have all the modern electronics and comfortable interior. I used to drive the s-chassis daily and it can make me really tired in long run. You know stiff suspension and loud noise can exhaust you out. My solution to this was making the s-chassis a weekend car and it became much more enjoyable.
Glad you you are keeping the s2000. You will never regret it. I think when you upgrade the power of s2000, whether turbo, supercharger or even na power, you would love it even more. Hope to see more mods to s2k :)
I feel the same about our 2015 Forester XT. It’s quick, comfy, and a really great family car but it is a bit soul less still. Nothing compares to the SG era. I would love to pick up a new 86 some time. Your channel has me looking at s2ks more than ever, but for the price they are going for in the states, I think I’d rather have the 86.
I'd probably keep the S2k till it dies, but that's me. I'm the kinda guy that keeps a car for a long time. That's my plan with the WRX Hatch that I have, not many new cars excite me (that I can' afford anyway..lol)
wow just driving there is just heaven
Albo you are right, the Honda is timeless and already is an icon from Japan. The BRZ will just be another civic like car on the road.
Timelesss.. sure. But atleast the BRZs are on the road rather than in someones garage collection like many S2Ks are.
@@fraided88 s2000 is a true sports car , brz is just another Subaru no one cares!!!
@@bige7186 kid, you haven't even driven the 2022 BRZ lol
@Michael Benson just another reliable front drive commuter car that gaps and smokes a brz...
@@smilepermile8165 kid I don’t need to I have an s2000 and a civic si as my daily 🤷🏽♂️
Honda needs to bring back the S2000 and they only need to make it lighter with better handling. They don’t need to change the exterior as it has a timeless look.
They can use the same engine with improvements and they will get buying them up.
I really wish I didn't buy a car last year before the gr86/brz came out because I really want it now... Not too expensive and not too "cheap" feeling
I really enjoyed this video! I’m definitely excited for the new 86 platform, and I’m looking forward to test driving one!
Also, what air freshener do you have in the S2000? I love the visual aesthetic of it!
coming from a big turbo kit on my S2000 back to NA I really forgot how enjoyable the car is with stock power. The SC kit would be great but only if it was 6-8psi so it just enhances what the S2000 already offers.
Even after all this time waking up daily in Japan still feels amazing,i wish i was financially stable to be there now
As an owner of a 2019 BRZ I gotta say if I would have to choose between new BRZ and a S2K... I would go for the S2K.
The linear design on it just makes it look way more like a true JDM car. The wave-like lines on the BRZ on its sides just distort the silhouette of the car and make it look worse imo
Hyped to see what's gonna be in stock with the potential HKS collab in the future!
S2K for sure. Keeps it's value better. Also easier and cheaper to fix and maintain.
Viotrix You have to factor in that it is the pedestrian safety and other crash standards which determine a car's design. If Honda brought back the S2000 in 2021, I guarantee you, it won't have such a low slung bonnet.
@T R Then you're a neanderthal for comparing a car designed in the 90s to a car designed 22 years later, when Honda had much looser regulations and budget constraints to Toyota/Subaru. Ever thought about using your brain?
@T R You're one of those dumbasses who doesn't know anything about inflation adjustment either. The BRZ/GR86 is at a similar price range as the Mazda MX-5. The S2000 in 2000 costed $15K+ more than the MX-5 in 2000. So there's no excuse that there's more money Honda had to develop their pricier car than how much Toyota & Subaru had with their 86/BRZ and Mazda's MX-5.
@T R D!çkhead
The s2000 is in a drivers expirence league of its own. Nothing more needs to be said to answer this question.
S2000 will probably be more of a sports car but the brz is much more practical for daily driving and the fact that it drives extremely well (from what others say) I would definitely choose it.
Agree, S2000 is raw, and that might be its shortcoming when you have to drive it everyday, the new BRZ is definitely a better everyday car.
Ooo caught the premier right on time at the "kono bangumi" part.
Fan boy rubbish aside, the new BRZ is a very nice car. Very neat.
If you already own an S2000, then the S2000 is a much better option than the BRZ/GR86/FRS. But if you doesn't, then the little Toyobaru is basically a modern S2000 that's going to be as valuable as the real one in the near future as it is now. Go get it before it's too late.
Your s2k top goes down so much faster than my 986 boxster lol
I have the urge to buy one of the last first gen 86 and a brand new one and just shove them into a barn for 20 years.
Man never get rid of that S2000 you love it so much!
You mention you don’t think the brz is a forever car but it’s one of few cars that had to stop production cause they couldn’t keep up with orders (at least in America) and that’s saying something.
Not sure if this is a fair comparison, let's assume we get one s2k for 20kusd, plus all the mods that you put on the s2k to modernize it. I have a feeling that it will be well over the stock price for the brz.
Should be a stock vs stock, or modified vs modified. As well as the fact that you remove personal bias with your own built car. However, I do own a second gen brz, without driving the s2k, id say that the brz gives me great amount of joy when im driving it around. But one I do want to get my hands on a s2k
JDM BRZ infortainment system definitely looks different and is better and larger than 2022 US BRZ!
Your car is very beautiful, definitely prefer it to the new BRZ. I picked up an ITR over summer and I love it, but the S2000 looks another step up. I wonder how difficult it would be to get an older BRZ and make it more raw?
the s2000 with the under glow looks so sick!
MT driver for 17 yrs; it's always almost funny culture shock when I need to get an AT rental car for whatever. The first panic is either the clutch or the stick LOL. xD I have an '01 Forester. Maybe I'll upgrade to yours next.
its cool how you left the spoiler on but the placement of the wing just doesnt seem right
Under glow is not awesome,! Great video and thank You Albo 😎👍🙌🙏 love the S2000
I think they can be both forever cars. I owned a 2012 BRZ and 2002 AP1 s2000. Bought the s2000 used and the BRZ new. Still owned both. They are both good cars and feels very similar. S2000 has a nice bonus because of its appreciating value. And the 9k redline and VTEC changeover never gets old. For new buyers lusting for an s2000 but wants a new car, just get GR86/BRZ or MX5 or RF. In manual transmission. You'll get pretty much the same experience with a little difference in flavor.
I recently started listening to your podcast at work,and Im interested in the guests you have on but it's hard to listen to while you make dinner in the background and God knows what else
Haha I love it that we both have the same TPMS on our cars
I would get the GR86 over the S2000K just because it would be my only car and I need a certain amount of practicality.
I love that you made a video on the new brz I just ordered one in red (limited trim) and I hope that it’s as fun as it looks!
Congrats! I’m sure you will love it
I like the new 86, but I don't like the stock tail lights. That is an easy fit will all of the aftermarket parts.
20 years old?????? I never knew time flies so fast…….😔😔
Wish I could live in Japan I love the Japanese culture and I love your s2k I was able to buy a celica gt4 imported from Japan with 60k miles and I love it.
I ordered the new BRZ in black. Still waiting for delivery. Should be some time in December.
Albo I enjoy watching your video and is true what you say I have a friend that owns and S2000 I drove it one day and I was amazed how fast it was and pull whenever I floor the car amazing car not for me consider I too big for it but hopefully I will get a 370z soon
Well, one is better at this and one is better at that. Do you like this or that more? Is this more important to you than that, or is that more important? Where do you do most of your driving
...below 5k rpm or above 5k rpm? Do you prefer a convertible? This or that, you can't go wrong... but, which one fits your life/likes better?
Maybe off topic but I wonder what camera you are using especially for the night shots at Daikoku Futo
Great video! love all the insight. Keepem coming:)
LOL! The police in America would hang up the phone on you if you asked them to do this.
I have always liked the S2000 and would probably enjoy driving one. But honestly the cars go for so much that I'd be getting into the price range of a few cars I'd rather have. A really low mile S2000 will sell for around 32-37k. At that point I can get a mint Dodge Viper GTS. To each their own.
After gas guzzling it will cost just as much and still be 10x less reliable.
Stock for Stock new BRZ/GR86 will have better performance than S2000. I have the S2000 and modified 2013 previous gen 86.
Unmodified 86: feels about the same with S2000 performance-wise. 86 has better steering and handling, better seating position, lower center of gravity. S2000 has better engine and shifter
modified 86(E85 and suspension mods): more usable power than S2000, more torque, better handling, better steering, better seating position, lower center of gravity.
So if new stock GR86/BRZ is similar in performance as modified GT86, then it undoubtedly perform better than a stock S2000
The S2000 is great car but I just to tall to comfortably fit in it at 186cm but no problems fitting in the brz.
Could you do a later vid on car insurance in japan as an enthusiast?
Damn I’ve bought my new car in 2004 and now it’s only worth 2000. You live and you learn about buying new cars and is it worth it at the moment. Once you have it then you’ll be like I’ve should have not purchased a new car.
4:15 The new BRZ is nice, but don't think I'd switch from my turbo FRS ( 19:04 It's my forever car )
This video made me appreicate my JZS171
Both cars are cool, but I feel like the S2K has stuck around you so long that I can’t see you in any other car than that Yellow Machine
Also the price on those are rising to like 30k+
At 11:40 when you said you feel like it’s not overdone, it is. That massive rear wing definitely ruins the timeless design. Also those giant tyres.. Otherwise it really is a timeless design. Hard to believe it’s 20yrs old and still looks like a neat recent design. Subtle upgrades are fine but when you start mods galore I think it just ruins the essence of any car. Love the GT sticker though 😂 Please remove that rear wing. Great content keep it up 👍
Subarus were always quirky but never felt cheap. The latest lineup feel like they're old just sitting in the dealership. That newer Forester Albo showed looks terrible imo.
Sweet vid, I might be getting a S2000 this weekend if everything checks out well. What radio do you have installed if you don't mind me asking?
Alpine da7 or ILX-W650
Hey bro, what steering wheel are you running on your S2k? Anybody know?
Hello, Albo! Thank you for ur videos!!! Can u share with us what type of side steps u used ? Wich brand exactly ? Thank you for ur time and attention
Downforce USA!
I would take the BRZ. 2nd gen has a really good powerband..
Your s2000 is still desirable compared to the yellow Porsche you showed on ur other video.
How is the low end torque of the new BRZ compared to the S2000?
Im under 30 (I’m 20), I don’t have a good job atm because college just started, however I have over $20k saved up. Love the 86 look. I just don’t know if I should lease a new 86 lol
What you do is continue to save your money another year or two and pick up a used 86 for much less than brand new. Also, car prices are crazy inflated right now due to supply chain issues. It's a bad time to buy a car (finance wise) if you don't need one.
@@michaelvl494 yeah I’m going to have to wait regardless because I’ve seen some posts about the new brz getting their prices increased by $15,000 due to “shortages”
Where did you purchase your underglow lights ?
You are truly an inspiration brother💯
both great cars but them S2K's are sick
To be fair, the S2000s were more expensive cars when brand new, almost Porsche Boxster levels of price, whereas the BRZs and 86s are priced like Mazda MX-5 miatas
S2k is a real keeper
S2000 is life 🧬 🏎️
was that BRZ stock exhaust??? holy sh*t it was roaring.
He knew he hit dat shit. He knew. 🎃
Had an AP2. The steering feel is just not good. Couldn't get past it. Bit of flex in the chassis as well. Definitely preferred my modded '13 FRS. Waiting on a '22 BRZ. The Honda is much better built and bespoke. Definitely a more special car but just not as much fun to drive at and over the limit imo.
Both the S2000 and new GR86/BRZ are good in different ways. The S2000 may have the more rev-happy engine and a better gear shift feel, but it costed more brand new than these GR86/BRZs cost, when you factor in the adjustment from inflation
@@smilepermile8165 totally agree. It has the better engine and gearbox. and shares no parts with anything else. Lucky to be able to choose both and still not break the bank but as time goes on S2000s values will only get higher I'd imagine. Can't go wrong either way.
@@PBR79 Great points raised, thats exactly right! Happy motoring!
Funny I prefer my BRZ gearbox over my AP1, throws are consistent as can be. The only preference of my AP1 is the motor. Maybe this new model will cure this for me with what seems a proper powerband? We shall see
im thinking of buying a 2023 Z but whenever i see the new brz or gr86 makes me think that a it would be better than the Z(minus the power) then this video came up, i forgotten bout the s2000 but maaaaaaaaan i still want an s2000
PS: rumours say that the manual 2023 Z wont have an LSD out of the factory, like wait, hold up
The higher trim Z will have an LSD.
Awesome stuff!
What wheels are those on your s2k?
Wow the police went full CSI on your car ha ha in Australia police would have been like tuff shit ha ha it's nice that the police did that for you!
underglow is amazing
Hey Al,
The S2K is indeed a legend. Even it’s parts are legendary. There are AE86’s wearing the S2K’s engine. Can’t really compare the BRZ or GT86 to the S2K, I also feel bad for every other non-exotic you drive after the S2K, it sets the bar a little too high. 😂
However… I feel that you would have had a better experience with the BRZ if SUBARU had let you drive a manual transmission.
I’ve had several opportunities to drive the BRZ and GT86, each time, the automatics were basically garbage on wheels (I really feel bad for anyone who bought an AUTO… As per DJ Khalid, “congratulations, You just played yourself”), when compared to the manuals - which felt, like you say, “raw”. It really draws me back to the feeling of 90’s eras cars. Toyota once threw a test drive event a few years back at Woodbine mall here in Toronto, and I drove the GT86 manual - the ride along tester let me turn off all the driving aids and push it a little like I used to with my older cars - and aside from the torque dip at higher revs, I loved it. Vivichan set the benchmark for me when it comes to small light, nimble and high revving cars, and the GT86 exceeded that benchmark (which is cool, because the GT86 and BRZ are built in the factory where Subaru once built the VIVIO, and other Kei cars). The test drive reminded me a little of that time you let me drive your Miata, where I pushed it a little too much like I do with AWD cars and felt the rear end step out 🤩 in dry like Subarus do in snow 😂.
I hope you get the opportunity to drive a manual BRZ or GT86, I feel the automatic may have unfairly tarnished, or given you a bad first impression/opinion of the BRZ.
Loved the video buddy,
Take care
- Your friend.
Subaru should come out with a STI option on the BRZ with a turbo and thick sway bars. It'd probably need a revamped cooling system; upgraded intercooler, radiator, radiator fans ect.
I cant believe you had so much attention from the police for a scratch. In the UK if we had cctv of a car deliberately and repeatedly smashing your car, the police would do nothing, zero.. If you pesster them to death and get them to come out, they would still do nothing!
we need more sayaka! 😄
s2k ftw. don't give it up for a BRZ. don't give it up for a Porsche.
Nothing wrong with a love letter to an S2000
Put as much aftermarket , chip & tune the brz as much as your S2, and make a fair assessment
Its a great car if you are under 30...
Me: Over 40 with the old one and it might be my forever car...
More house music in the videos please 😎
dope what roll cage is that?