I thought you might want to know. Aluminium corrosion increases dramatically when it comes in contact with titanium, zirconium etc. Would consider adding plenty of lube or some sealant to avoid bate metal to metal contact of those aluminium screws with your titanium frame.
I bought a chinese made titanium frame in 2009 made by a make named Tor. I couldn't find anything out about them since buying the frame. I've been riding this frame ever since, we've traveled over 28 countries together and the bike remains beautiful. Sadly last year I was hit by a car and it now has a dent but the geometry remains perfect. When/if I ever earnt a decent wage I would get a bike just like this one you're showing, its fantastic for just about everything.
Hi , I just got a gravel ti frame made from Waltly last week . Is better that you know exactly what you want so that they understand you well, anyway no worries if you are not that technical, they will be happy to give suggestion and advise to suit your need . Amy ( the sweet girl whom I booked my order from ) is very patient and a great person to deal with! Prices that I paid for the frame & carbon fork , including shipment to Singapore is US$1030. IT IS THE CHEAPEST PRICE I EVER PAID FOR A TOP QUALITY CUSTOMISED TITANIUM FRAME ! Thanks to China Cycling for a great video!
hi , i came across your comment , im from singapore actually intrested to buy the frame also , hows the payment to them? and did you get pay gst when receiving it here? thanks
@@natasaragih1546 Hi Nata, I contacted them and 50% deposit are paid thru Alibaba.com ,which I have an account with them before.You can open up an account with Alibaba.com.And fyi, my frame is still in production and hopefully I will be able to received them in mid. oct . I yet to know whether I will be paying gst for that !
Keep in mind that engraved head tube, logos and anodising are added extras. Plus shipping has gone up due to less flights for the cheaper EMS shipping option. Barring that, I've just approved my drawings and started fabrication for a couple more Waltly frames. Can't fault their quality, customer service and quick turnaround. 😁
how did it go for you? really want to order one but not 100% sure. I have found several people who said they bought one and a few that did review / write ups when they got the bike bit cant find a single long term review (not even a year latter)
@MrRay645 i've made of couple more now (another gravel and a hardtail) and still faultless after several years with daily commutes, offroad, bikepacking overseas etc. You just have to know how to read CAD drawings thoroughly and know your bike designs/geos well after riding many types. If you're not thorough, it's all on you as they will weld exactly what's on the drawing as they are not bike designers
My understanding is that the "legendary ride feel of titanium" has more to do with the tube choice and wall thickness in specific spots (butting). I have a 90's titanium Kona MTB and am going to be getting a Litespeed titanium gravel bike in a few weeks. I am interested to see if I can feel a difference. Some will say that the reason the Waltly is so cheap is because you're not getting the thoughtful design that leads to that magic carpet ride that is described about the material. I will say, if you have the knowledge to design your frame with all that special magic built into it and tell Waltly exactly what you want, I'm sure you can get close. In the end, I think the main selling points of the material are longevity of the material, no paint or corrosion to worry about and the aesthetics. Thank you for making this video and good on you for going through that process. Cheers!
According to one Sheldon Brown’s article (Upgrading Older Road Bicycles), before 1970, road bikes (especially European) were designed to be more springy, particularly the front forks. The front forks will have gradually thinner walls as the fork diameters reduce toward the bottom. But all this changed when road bikes became popular with American baby boomers during early 1970’s. Fearing lawsuits from “casual” riders, road bikes started to be over designed and become stiffer.
@@CycOp And now with disc brakes, with flat legged forks built for stiffness and not bend under braking forces, this has got to next level. Tho' as they say in car industry - there's no replacement for displacement - super stiff alu frame on 2" Apples runs like on pillows. If I want something or someone to bend under me....it doesn't have to be frame)
I agree. I had a 1998 Litespeed Vortex that weighed 1280 grams with relatively small diameter tubing all over and 1" fork steerer and it had the Titanium flexy springy feel (which I like, as I raced on Vitus 979 Carbone 3 in the 80's). I got a Waltly done with a big tapered headtube, a fat 42mm downtube and much higher cross-section (not double-butted) tubing all over. It weighs 1650 grams with ISP and it rides much more like a modern stiff carbon frame than that Ti flying carpet ride (which is not good or bad but very different).
great video. How did the bike hold up? Dont think I have seen it in another of your videos since this one. Thinking of having them make me a monster cross or drop bar MTB type thing for loaded bike trips.
Titanium frames can feel very different from one another. Try a Seven or Moots and you will see what I'm talking about. I've had 4 different ti road bikes and each one was considerably different than the other in ride quality. Tube profiles and thicknesses/lengths make a big difference.
Bike frame material etc is miles below placebo effect. Tires, spokes lacings, handlebars flex seat flexible bring way more significant deflection ability than flexibility that comes from the frame. We did a fun experiment with different bike frames that we padded and wrapped from road frames from 80s through MTB bikes from 90s and then modern road frames from 2004. Tested on rather rough road an a bit of a packed forest trail we only managed to gather 32 bikes and 15 participants and aside from one old MTB frame the results for ride comfort were all over the place. I wouldn't put much into gospels about frame flex (aside from top level pros and their bottom bracket abuse) or vibration dampening of frames unless you go to dangerous extremes of weight savings or crazy geometries. Head tube angle is the most sensitive parameter you can alter to change ride characteristics. As for the rest focus on contact points with the body and the terrain that's where flex and vibration damping is orders of magnitude bigger than frame materials.
@@ChinaCycling Cheers! Really wanted to stay up to be there for the video launch but it's too late here, down under. Regardless, looking forward to your next video!
Bought one a year ago and was largely satisfied with the product except the satin finish. Ended up spending 30 hours on sanding the frame down to a mirror finish. Extremely satisfied ;D
Legend! Love to see people getting the same experiences as me. I actually have anxiety about recommending things on here and then people spending their hard earned cash and it being trash. So, every comment like this helps my anxiety.
I will most likely make my next frame purchase with Waltly Custom frames. A TI frame for less than 1K U.S. ? I visited a bike shop 10 yrs. ago and fell in love with a SEVEN TI frame. The price was for $2,700 U.S. & the shop owner wanted it out of his shop for an even $2,000 but 2 grand for just frame alone 10 yrs ago was too steep for me. But this company I admire what they do. Thanks again @China Cycling.
Dwayne, Seven frames are on a completely different level. They do extensive butting of their tubes and design the frame for rider weight and bike load. Though the material used is the same, there are many factors that go into what makes the bike and how it feels. I wish I could find a brand new Seven for that price. You missed a steal of a deal.
Fantastic video Joe! I love the way you went into detail on how you came up with the geometry and design process. I’m also keen on hearing about the group set choice...
Nice one! I actually had pretty much the same requirements except for the mounts (want to force myself to travel light), I also thought the grail was the best choice. But I went and bought the full Grail CF SL and have zero regrets. I run 38c slicks which suits my 99% commuting/city and 1% gravel I do, plan to take it all over Japan very soon.
I think I still prefer carbon as a material for bikes. But, custom is really nice. Get everything set-up just as you like it. If an off-the-shelf bike fits you perfectly, then it's also a good option. Oh, and of course cost is an issue. (and if it's not, you're lucky.)
Looks like a badass apocalypse rig, I'm happy that you're so happy with it! Do you have any details on their full suspension MTB frames, they have no examples on their site? I'm a year or two out on a new bike but at these prices it would be rad to get a custom frame built up.
Don't be so low-key in the comments, brah! For the record everyone; this is the guy who actually got me into road bikes and riding. No this guy, no China Cycling. To answer your question, I wasn't really paying attention to MTB stuff when I was there. But when you're ready to buy carbon or titanium; just hit me up bro.
@@ChinaCycling lol, you flatter me! I'm sure I'm sure you can drop me with ease now. I will hit you up tho when it's time for a new bike. It will be interesting to see what China has to offer. It seems most of the "cheap carbon" Chinese mountain bike frames I've found are a few years behind in geometry. I am sure there are some Chinese companies making frames with proper modern geometry, I'm just looking in the wrong places.
Could you recommend some Chinese trustable carbon brands for a seatpost and an aero handlebars (40 mm) preferably available through AliExpress? Thanks in advance and keep up with these great videos!
Good question. There's lots of 'good' cheap stuff, but it is also sometimes a roll of the dice. (See Trace Velo's latest video) I think seatposts are a lot less likely to fail just because of the way the forces are loaded into them, and it's essentially a straight tube - very hard to mess up. But a handlebar definitely requires something stronger. I have a review of 'The One' on my channel which I got along with very well. I'm currently using the 'Zero' from Winspace; it's not cheap, but it's ridiculously strong.
You have a wonderful and laconic presentation style that's down to earth and easy to follow. You make great unique content - keep it up. I also saw the Mark Ferguson video and hope they've fixed their issues. Currently deliberating between a Curve GXR or a Waltly custom.
Hey Joe, I'm curious why you didn't go with Hi-light titanium bikes, they are the OEM of Van Nicholas and official distributor. Was it also because Waltly was much closer to you distance wise?
I met the hi-light guys and gals at the Shanghai bike show last year. Seem like good people, and have been doing custom titanium frames for a very, very long time. I hear nothing but good things about their quality. I also heard good things about Waltly too though, and when I saw they were just down the road; it sealed the deal. It was also in a very intense COVID period, so being so local was a huge boost. Zero regrets choosing Waltly, but I'd also love to check out Hi-light (or Hanglun as the factory is known.)
I had to just bite the bullet and get a specialized gravel bike here in Chengdu. Trying to build all on my own was a bit pricey... I'm loving it and getting out in west is gooood
I'm currently waiting on my Waltly frame myself as of now, I am curious of what BB you went with and how do you like the Lun wheelset you are using on your frame as well as what is the weight of those? I am interested in getting those for my Litespeed Watia frame
Congrats on a great video and sharing the build process. Following your first video on this, I did reach out to Amy and looking fwd to working with her on a design. We are at the middle stages of design and few things you mentioned (like tapered vs non tapered head tube) was a good point. Bikecad also a great tip. Thank you sir.
Great video. Being excited about part 2 for a while. Bike looks great. Would have loved a bit more of a build video. Maybe in part 3. They will be my next frame.
Really love this build and video. What a great breakdown. Curious, is this a design you are willing to share? If we wanted to get something similar built.
Thank you for the video. I only wish, you'd show the welds a little better. A also wonder if Waltly does weld smoothing or fillet brazing instead of TIG welding. And if there's a premium for anodising, and if so, how much.
I just saw this video yesterday and I’ve practically ordered the same bike from Middlemen Seller TIRIS on Alibaba a couple weeks ago! Down to the Straight head tube for non tapered fork AND PURPLE external headset and post clamp! I’m currently trying to find out what my Titanium Anodising options are. My frame will be more of a ALL Road frame than a Gravel bike (700cX30 with Double chainring)
Hey Joe, great content! do you have internal routing in the right chainstay? I am ordering at Waltly these days and we are discussing the details. Do you have any experience / recommendations about internal or external routing at the chainstays?
Hi. Really appreciate your videos, but Waltly is apparently out-of-commission! Their sales address auto-reply says something like "Try us back in a few months," but I wonder if supply chain/materials/labor issues have doomed them. Any insights/thoughts?!? Thx.
I also ordered the frame from Waltley. And as I managed to make sure, they can weld well, but they don’t understand anything about geometry. I did 430mm.
@@hensemzp1 it is really nice that you can choose what you like. I like shorter CS like on the OPEN. But even the Open is 420. 415 is really pushing boundaries
Lots of the Chinese carbon brands also don't understand bikes / geometry. For many of them it's just a product like a washing machine or a badminton racket. There are definitely some brands that understand it though, there are Chinese Carbon brands that are sponsoring UCI teams, developing with their feedback, etc. But... with custom Titanium; the customer is the boss. :D
Hey man, just noticed that you’re using the Sensah SRX pro group set. What are your impressions about it? I’m thinking on building a bike with the same group set
New sub to your channel here, just discovered your videos today. I was told to avoid cheap Chinese TI frames because TI is very difficult to weld and there's stories of welds failing as a result. I don't know much about it honestly but I'm not sure if I buy an expensive frame if I'm paying for quality welds or because it's a well known brand name. In this video you seem to be happy with their work but does Waltly offer a warranty on their frames?
Valid points. I'm not allowed to say which brands' frames I saw being made when I was there, but let's just say if their factory had a quality problem some big brands we all know would be taking a huge hit. There is a warranty, but the details of which escape me. I'm sure they can offer more info there.
Great video, content, visuals, audio, clarity, & tutorials. I didn't hear or see if you actually test rode the " Canyon " bike you used for a reference. Im looking forward to more content & definitely subscribing.
I'm planning to create a new bike brand where the designs are based on all season all surface riding... The best I could come up with for now was Titanium bike 700c with Cyclocross Geometry, with short travel mountain bike forks, and a 2x setup, hard air suspension 30mm travel seat post, and max tires width 50mm. Both suspensions lockable and adjustable. How close am I? Any tips? Can you help out with the prototype builds? P.S. Your build is an inspiration btw, damn!
eeeyyy finally! good to hear the bike worked out great for you! Might just go for a frame, once I build up my budget winspace dream build, I'll have a spare bike, so might as well move those 6700 ulte components to a commuter/city riding bike? hmmm. to go full custom or not hmmm.
Do you have a list of all the parts for your gravel bike ie handlebars, stem, wheels etc?. I am interested in building a budget gravel bike since i mainly ride on the roads and have a Ti road bike already.
Is the derailleur hanger Ti too? I’d worry that it’s too strong to bend in a crash. Would be nice if they offered aluminum hanger. Also, do they offer butted tubing as an upgrade to reduce frame weight?
@@ChinaCycling thats great 👍 I know you're busy with Winspace and bike show content! I've made my design, I'm going to be contacting waltly in the next few weeks to get mine made :)
On your last video you mentioned you would have a discount program with Waltly, but details were pending. I didn't hear that mentioned here. Did they come through with a discount code for your followers? Great video.
The last thing I talked about was you find Amy and tell her Joe from China Cycling sent you. The actual specifics of the discount I'm not sure because custom is a bit more complicated than off-the-shelf stuff.
This is what i need. I want to order gravel bike but the cost of Ti bike usa made is ridiculous. Also the building time is just crazy up to 6-22 months for some bike
Except their dropouts are to big for Paragon's sliding inserts. They also messed up on where they installed the ports for the brake hose, after multiple communications with them. Decent bike, but just beware it won't be perfect.
The Mao cup sips the stamina off of any landlords in the vicinity of the cup, and puts it inside the next cup of coffee 😂. But the craftsmanship on that bike frame is impressive, if the titanium quality can back it up.
I thought you might want to know. Aluminium corrosion increases dramatically when it comes in contact with titanium, zirconium etc. Would consider adding plenty of lube or some sealant to avoid bate metal to metal contact of those aluminium screws with your titanium frame.
I bought a chinese made titanium frame in 2009 made by a make named Tor. I couldn't find anything out about them since buying the frame.
I've been riding this frame ever since, we've traveled over 28 countries together and the bike remains beautiful. Sadly last year I was hit by a car and it now has a dent but the geometry remains perfect.
When/if I ever earnt a decent wage I would get a bike just like this one you're showing, its fantastic for just about everything.
Hi , I just got a gravel ti frame made from Waltly last week . Is better that you know exactly what you want so that they understand you well, anyway no worries if you are not that technical, they will be happy to give suggestion and advise to suit your need . Amy ( the sweet girl whom I booked my order from ) is very patient and a great person to deal with! Prices that I paid for the frame & carbon fork , including shipment to Singapore is US$1030. IT IS THE CHEAPEST PRICE I EVER PAID FOR A TOP QUALITY CUSTOMISED TITANIUM FRAME ! Thanks to China Cycling for a great video!
That's great news. I love a good success story. Enjoy your bike!
hi , i came across your comment , im from singapore actually intrested to buy the frame also , hows the payment to them? and did you get pay gst when receiving it here? thanks
@@natasaragih1546 Hi Nata, I contacted them and 50% deposit are paid thru Alibaba.com ,which I have an account with them before.You can open up an account with Alibaba.com.And fyi, my frame is still in production and hopefully I will be able to received them in mid. oct . I yet to know whether I will be paying gst for that !
Strange I was just quoted $1000 dollars for frame and carbon fork, without shipping to Vietnam, with shipping $1200...
@@yuingswee2103 hi thanks for the reply , did you get the frame already?
Hi. I got a gravel and an XC mtb by Waltly. Loved them both. I want to echo Amy's patience & friendliness as well.
Keep in mind that engraved head tube, logos and anodising are added extras. Plus shipping has gone up due to less flights for the cheaper EMS shipping option. Barring that, I've just approved my drawings and started fabrication for a couple more Waltly frames. Can't fault their quality, customer service and quick turnaround. 😁
Good tip! The logos, etc are all pretty cheap. EMS prices are slowly coming back down, but delivery times are definitely longer than pre-COVID.
I hope you win against these greedy robber barons of the bicycle industry.
how did it go for you? really want to order one but not 100% sure. I have found several people who said they bought one and a few that did review / write ups when they got the bike bit cant find a single long term review (not even a year latter)
@MrRay645 i've made of couple more now (another gravel and a hardtail) and still faultless after several years with daily commutes, offroad, bikepacking overseas etc.
You just have to know how to read CAD drawings thoroughly and know your bike designs/geos well after riding many types.
If you're not thorough, it's all on you as they will weld exactly what's on the drawing as they are not bike designers
My understanding is that the "legendary ride feel of titanium" has more to do with the tube choice and wall thickness in specific spots (butting). I have a 90's titanium Kona MTB and am going to be getting a Litespeed titanium gravel bike in a few weeks. I am interested to see if I can feel a difference. Some will say that the reason the Waltly is so cheap is because you're not getting the thoughtful design that leads to that magic carpet ride that is described about the material. I will say, if you have the knowledge to design your frame with all that special magic built into it and tell Waltly exactly what you want, I'm sure you can get close. In the end, I think the main selling points of the material are longevity of the material, no paint or corrosion to worry about and the aesthetics. Thank you for making this video and good on you for going through that process. Cheers!
According to one Sheldon Brown’s article (Upgrading Older Road Bicycles), before 1970, road bikes (especially European) were designed to be more springy, particularly the front forks. The front forks will have gradually thinner walls as the fork diameters reduce toward the bottom. But all this changed when road bikes became popular with American baby boomers during early 1970’s. Fearing lawsuits from “casual” riders, road bikes started to be over designed and become stiffer.
@@CycOp And now with disc brakes, with flat legged forks built for stiffness and not bend under braking forces, this has got to next level.
Tho' as they say in car industry - there's no replacement for displacement - super stiff alu frame on 2" Apples runs like on pillows. If I want something or someone to bend under me....it doesn't have to be frame)
I agree. I had a 1998 Litespeed Vortex that weighed 1280 grams with relatively small diameter tubing all over and 1" fork steerer and it had the Titanium flexy springy feel (which I like, as I raced on Vitus 979 Carbone 3 in the 80's). I got a Waltly done with a big tapered headtube, a fat 42mm downtube and much higher cross-section (not double-butted) tubing all over. It weighs 1650 grams with ISP and it rides much more like a modern stiff carbon frame than that Ti flying carpet ride (which is not good or bad but very different).
Waltly did a good job!
great video. How did the bike hold up? Dont think I have seen it in another of your videos since this one. Thinking of having them make me a monster cross or drop bar MTB type thing for loaded bike trips.
This is an incredible video. You’ve done Waltly a massive service, I will certainly be ordering a custom frame!
Too good of a service. They are at ma capacity and aren't taking new orders.
Titanium frames can feel very different from one another. Try a Seven or Moots and you will see what I'm talking about. I've had 4 different ti road bikes and each one was considerably different than the other in ride quality. Tube profiles and thicknesses/lengths make a big difference.
The same is true for all materials used in bicycle frames. :)
Bike frame material etc is miles below placebo effect. Tires, spokes lacings, handlebars flex seat flexible bring way more significant deflection ability than flexibility that comes from the frame. We did a fun experiment with different bike frames that we padded and wrapped from road frames from 80s through MTB bikes from 90s and then modern road frames from 2004. Tested on rather rough road an a bit of a packed forest trail we only managed to gather 32 bikes and 15 participants and aside from one old MTB frame the results for ride comfort were all over the place. I wouldn't put much into gospels about frame flex (aside from top level pros and their bottom bracket abuse) or vibration dampening of frames unless you go to dangerous extremes of weight savings or crazy geometries. Head tube angle is the most sensitive parameter you can alter to change ride characteristics.
As for the rest focus on contact points with the body and the terrain that's where flex and vibration damping is orders of magnitude bigger than frame materials.
As always, it’s a joy to watch your video! It’s a good balance between details while not being too technical. Love it!
Awesome, thank you! Glad you enjoy watching.
@@ChinaCycling Cheers! Really wanted to stay up to be there for the video launch but it's too late here, down under. Regardless, looking forward to your next video!
Welcome 🙏 in the titanium family!
Best frame material for cross rides and bad roads in general - plus this shiny glance 👌 🤙
Bought one a year ago and was largely satisfied with the product except the satin finish. Ended up spending 30 hours on sanding the frame down to a mirror finish. Extremely satisfied ;D
Bought a road frame from waltly couple months back and it rides like a dream. Top vids man keep on doing what you're doing 👍
Legend! Love to see people getting the same experiences as me. I actually have anxiety about recommending things on here and then people spending their hard earned cash and it being trash. So, every comment like this helps my anxiety.
@@ChinaCycling hi may i just asking your fb page so i can directly communicate on my order tnx in advance
I will most likely make my next frame purchase with Waltly Custom frames. A TI frame for less than 1K U.S. ? I visited a bike shop 10 yrs. ago and fell in love with a SEVEN TI frame. The price was for $2,700 U.S. & the shop owner wanted it out of his shop for an even $2,000 but 2 grand for just frame alone 10 yrs ago was too steep for me. But this company I admire what they do. Thanks again @China Cycling.
It makes sense. Building a metal frame is a labour intensive process. In China, skilled labour is [relatively] cheap.
Dwayne, Seven frames are on a completely different level. They do extensive butting of their tubes and design the frame for rider weight and bike load. Though the material used is the same, there are many factors that go into what makes the bike and how it feels. I wish I could find a brand new Seven for that price. You missed a steal of a deal.
This is now the second person I've heard speak very highly of them. I Guess I'll be buying one to build a gravel/touring bike.
Fantastic video Joe! I love the way you went into detail on how you came up with the geometry and design process. I’m also keen on hearing about the group set choice...
I'll take about the groupset in part III where I look at the bike overall. I may also do a standalone video on the groupset.
China Cycling I look forward to it 😃 Perhaps you could talk to the folks that did the wheels about doing group sets also.
Nice one! I actually had pretty much the same requirements except for the mounts (want to force myself to travel light), I also thought the grail was the best choice. But I went and bought the full Grail CF SL and have zero regrets. I run 38c slicks which suits my 99% commuting/city and 1% gravel I do, plan to take it all over Japan very soon.
I think I still prefer carbon as a material for bikes. But, custom is really nice. Get everything set-up just as you like it. If an off-the-shelf bike fits you perfectly, then it's also a good option. Oh, and of course cost is an issue. (and if it's not, you're lucky.)
I love playing around with BikeCad, so much fun
nice bike and thanks for sharing the info about Waltly.
Looks like a badass apocalypse rig, I'm happy that you're so happy with it! Do you have any details on their full suspension MTB frames, they have no examples on their site? I'm a year or two out on a new bike but at these prices it would be rad to get a custom frame built up.
Don't be so low-key in the comments, brah! For the record everyone; this is the guy who actually got me into road bikes and riding. No this guy, no China Cycling. To answer your question, I wasn't really paying attention to MTB stuff when I was there. But when you're ready to buy carbon or titanium; just hit me up bro.
@@ChinaCycling lol, you flatter me! I'm sure I'm sure you can drop me with ease now. I will hit you up tho when it's time for a new bike. It will be interesting to see what China has to offer. It seems most of the "cheap carbon" Chinese mountain bike frames I've found are a few years behind in geometry. I am sure there are some Chinese companies making frames with proper modern geometry, I'm just looking in the wrong places.
I know what my next bike build is going to be. Just recently relocated to Beijing, so should keep me busy over the winter months!
I love bikeCAD, I designed and built a few bikes with it!
I have many future projects saved in my BikeCAD now. I'd love to learn to weld and make my own frame one day too....
Good to see you have recovered after your accident and up and riding again
Thanks for the well wishes!
Could you recommend some Chinese trustable carbon brands for a seatpost and an aero handlebars (40 mm) preferably available through AliExpress? Thanks in advance and keep up with these great videos!
Good question. There's lots of 'good' cheap stuff, but it is also sometimes a roll of the dice. (See Trace Velo's latest video) I think seatposts are a lot less likely to fail just because of the way the forces are loaded into them, and it's essentially a straight tube - very hard to mess up. But a handlebar definitely requires something stronger. I have a review of 'The One' on my channel which I got along with very well. I'm currently using the 'Zero' from Winspace; it's not cheap, but it's ridiculously strong.
You have a wonderful and laconic presentation style that's down to earth and easy to follow. You make great unique content - keep it up. I also saw the Mark Ferguson video and hope they've fixed their issues. Currently deliberating between a Curve GXR or a Waltly custom.
Could you share your perspective so far of each company?
Hey Joe, I'm curious why you didn't go with Hi-light titanium bikes, they are the OEM of Van Nicholas and official distributor. Was it also because Waltly was much closer to you distance wise?
I met the hi-light guys and gals at the Shanghai bike show last year. Seem like good people, and have been doing custom titanium frames for a very, very long time. I hear nothing but good things about their quality. I also heard good things about Waltly too though, and when I saw they were just down the road; it sealed the deal. It was also in a very intense COVID period, so being so local was a huge boost. Zero regrets choosing Waltly, but I'd also love to check out Hi-light (or Hanglun as the factory is known.)
Sick bike and what a process! It must be totally worth it!
How do these compare to Habanero Ti frames, also made in China? I've had a road bike built around one for 20 years and love it.
I had to just bite the bullet and get a specialized gravel bike here in Chengdu. Trying to build all on my own was a bit pricey... I'm loving it and getting out in west is gooood
When is the part III and final thoughts on how the bike rides and handles?
I'm currently waiting on my Waltly frame myself as of now, I am curious of what BB you went with and how do you like the Lun wheelset you are using on your frame as well as what is the weight of those? I am interested in getting those for my Litespeed Watia frame
Was a Ti fork an option? Also, which Ti alloy is it? I think there are a couple of options.
Congrats on a great video and sharing the build process. Following your first video on this, I did reach out to Amy and looking fwd to working with her on a design. We are at the middle stages of design and few things you mentioned (like tapered vs non tapered head tube) was a good point. Bikecad also a great tip. Thank you sir.
Good luck with it. Any specific questions lemme know.
this video hooked me up. planning to order one soon
1.79kg including the carbon fork? Or just the frame only? Thanks.
I do not know if I have already commented.
Anyway, great videos which are provided here and excellent taste in music 😎💜
Much Love!
Thank you so much for your hard work. I'm a huge fan.
can you please tell me what rear thru axle you've used? i cannot find what i need for my ti frame. please? thank you in advance!!!
Great video. Being excited about part 2 for a while. Bike looks great. Would have loved a bit more of a build video. Maybe in part 3. They will be my next frame.
I suppose you have a 44mm straight head tube? With a head tube set like Chris King Inset 7 you can fit the tapered fork
So how's it still holding up? I am a big guy 230lbs with gear I'd be at 260 easy. Will they spec to my weight
Really love this build and video. What a great breakdown. Curious, is this a design you are willing to share? If we wanted to get something similar built.
Can you tell me if the serial number begins with WTL? I picked up an unmarked titanium frame and I am trying to find out what it is.
Thank you for the video. I only wish, you'd show the welds a little better. A also wonder if Waltly does weld smoothing or fillet brazing instead of TIG welding. And if there's a premium for anodising, and if so, how much.
Great suggestion! In part III I'll really show some close-ups
@@ChinaCycling Thanks, mate! 😊
Might be getting one as well. Walty has great pricing.
How much are we looking for complete bike?
I just saw this video yesterday and I’ve practically ordered the same bike from Middlemen Seller TIRIS on Alibaba a couple weeks ago! Down to the Straight head tube for non tapered fork AND PURPLE external headset and post clamp! I’m currently trying to find out what my Titanium Anodising options are. My frame will be more of a ALL Road frame than a Gravel bike (700cX30 with Double chainring)
Hi Allan, just wondering how you went with TIRIS?
Awesome bike! What is your bike size and your height? I am thinking of buying one from them.
Hey Joe, great content! do you have internal routing in the right chainstay? I am ordering at Waltly these days and we are discussing the details. Do you have any experience / recommendations about internal or external routing at the chainstays?
Hi. Really appreciate your videos, but Waltly is apparently out-of-commission! Their sales address auto-reply says something like "Try us back in a few months," but I wonder if supply chain/materials/labor issues have doomed them. Any insights/thoughts?!? Thx.
415mm cs is sick for a gravel bike. Nice work Waltly
I also ordered the frame from Waltley. And as I managed to make sure, they can weld well, but they don’t understand anything about geometry. I did 430mm.
@@hensemzp1 it is really nice that you can choose what you like. I like shorter CS like on the OPEN. But even the Open is 420. 415 is really pushing boundaries
Lots of the Chinese carbon brands also don't understand bikes / geometry. For many of them it's just a product like a washing machine or a badminton racket. There are definitely some brands that understand it though, there are Chinese Carbon brands that are sponsoring UCI teams, developing with their feedback, etc. But... with custom Titanium; the customer is the boss. :D
That is one very fine looking frame indeed.
Hey man, just noticed that you’re using the Sensah SRX pro group set. What are your impressions about it? I’m thinking on building a bike with the same group set
Thanks a lot for sharing your experience. Awesome finished product.
New sub to your channel here, just discovered your videos today. I was told to avoid cheap Chinese TI frames because TI is very difficult to weld and there's stories of welds failing as a result. I don't know much about it honestly but I'm not sure if I buy an expensive frame if I'm paying for quality welds or because it's a well known brand name. In this video you seem to be happy with their work but does Waltly offer a warranty on their frames?
Valid points. I'm not allowed to say which brands' frames I saw being made when I was there, but let's just say if their factory had a quality problem some big brands we all know would be taking a huge hit. There is a warranty, but the details of which escape me. I'm sure they can offer more info there.
@@ChinaCycling Okay, thanks. After watching your other video and Mark Ferguson's I think this is definitely worth looking into.
@@61tree_VR_Gliding...Hi. Did you end up going with Waltly? If so...are you happy with the Quality? Thanks.
I can't find Part III, the full review. Is it online?
Yeah - I see TDF teams are putting in adapters on BB30 frames to run a standard BSA threaded set of bearings!
do they have full internally cable routingin the fork and stem?
What do you think about the quality of the frame? is it good ?
Will be making a video comparing carbon & Ti bikes on comfort and the differences?
thanks for the videos, that a great Ti-frame by Waltly.
Thanks for watching!
Ada buat dgn waltly ke bro?
@@meorrazizul7551 belum, video ini jadi pembanding yang bagus kalau mau build dengan Ti-frame.
@@zkfl09 teringin jugak frame ti ni tp tula harga keras
Very nice project! Waltly did great job.
What is the drawing programm you are used for these project? Thanks.
Great design and build! Do you have a link to your bikecad design? Happy new year!
Great video, content, visuals, audio, clarity, & tutorials. I didn't hear or see
if you actually test rode the " Canyon " bike you used for a reference. Im looking forward to more content & definitely subscribing.
I'm planning to create a new bike brand where the designs are based on all season all surface riding... The best I could come up with for now was Titanium bike 700c with Cyclocross Geometry, with short travel mountain bike forks, and a 2x setup, hard air suspension 30mm travel seat post, and max tires width 50mm. Both suspensions lockable and adjustable. How close am I? Any tips? Can you help out with the prototype builds?
P.S. Your build is an inspiration btw, damn!
Great video and wow. Price for Titanium frame.....great. Definitely
Got me thinking!! Thanks. And just subscribed.
Can you link the website you use for the geometry calculation. Want to order bike from that company.
Thanks
eeeyyy finally! good to hear the bike worked out great for you! Might just go for a frame, once I build up my budget winspace dream build, I'll have a spare bike, so might as well move those 6700 ulte components to a commuter/city riding bike? hmmm. to go full custom or not hmmm.
Very interesting. One question though. The grail is likely designed for 700x38 or something. Did you alter anything so it is optimized for 700x28c?
How much for off the shelf complete bike and does it have 75 degree seat tube angle as minimum? Thanks
impressive! Might get one too but need to learn more first. Thank you for a very informative video.
Any time line on a follow up video on how the frame is holding up?
Being same height and similar build, your numbers would be very helpful to me who has no idea about bike geometry.
What brand/model are those bikepacking bags? Especially the gas tank (top tube) bag? Thanks!
bike looks amazing, love the steering tube logo!
can you tell me what top tube bag that is? thanks
Do you have a list of all the parts for your gravel bike ie handlebars, stem, wheels etc?. I am interested in building a budget gravel bike since i mainly ride on the roads and have a Ti road bike already.
Is the derailleur hanger Ti too? I’d worry that it’s too strong to bend in a crash. Would be nice if they offered aluminum hanger. Also, do they offer butted tubing as an upgrade to reduce frame weight?
Waltly offers both, ti and alu hanger. In my mtb I use the aluminium one for the reasons you wisely mention. Really happy with my frame btw!
Excellent video!! Thanks for sharing.
how do you like your TI bike now?
What's the name of the company where you found the straight steerer tube forks? What's their website?
It was on Taobao (the equivalent of ebay here in china) but I just looked and that seller has since closed shop.
would anyone know where I can buy those purple bolts and headset? thanks in advance
can you detail the rest of your build, Joe? Sensah 1X? Lun wheels?
Can you post pictures of the welds? Thanks
I can not find the Bikecad app in google app. Pls. Tell me the exact app name
Hi great video again!! What shifters, rear derailer en casette you have on your bike?
It's the Sensah "gravel" groupset. The cassette is a one-piece 9-50T beast, also Chinese...got it for about 115USD.
Cant wait for the next Video 👍👍 aktuell bike is Carbon but i think the next one is titan.
You've got a new fan, Joe! :)
can they make 3d printed lugs?.
That 90° tilt of the head unit :-)
Haha, Yup! A wahoo jammed into a Garmin mount... I lost my pucks when I moved house...
Hey is there a part 3 to this as mentioned in the video? I'd be interested in seeing the long term results!
Cheers!
Coming soon! I ride this bike several times a week. Putting it through it's paces!
@@ChinaCycling thats great 👍 I know you're busy with Winspace and bike show content!
I've made my design, I'm going to be contacting waltly in the next few weeks to get mine made :)
I just contact sumi for custom frame based on moots, they charge me 980 usd, it's too expensive or not?
What are those bottle cages? They look amazing!
Ooh this is great
I can copy crux geo and get the titanium bike of my dreams (really like the crux geo for gravel)
On your last video you mentioned you would have a discount program with Waltly, but details were pending. I didn't hear that mentioned here. Did they come through with a discount code for your followers? Great video.
The last thing I talked about was you find Amy and tell her Joe from China Cycling sent you. The actual specifics of the discount I'm not sure because custom is a bit more complicated than off-the-shelf stuff.
This is what i need. I want to order gravel bike but the cost of Ti bike usa made is ridiculous. Also the building time is just crazy up to 6-22 months for some bike
Huge wait lists these days throughout the whole industry.
Ya this covid make the bicycle industry going crazy.
Are you aware if Waltly do a moots YBB style microsuspension?
Except their dropouts are to big for Paragon's sliding inserts. They also messed up on where they installed the ports for the brake hose, after multiple communications with them. Decent bike, but just beware it won't be perfect.
The Mao cup sips the stamina off of any landlords in the vicinity of the cup, and puts it inside the next cup of coffee 😂.
But the craftsmanship on that bike frame is impressive, if the titanium quality can back it up.
15:24 If you look after it, this frame will be around until it cracks at a weld due to fatigue
Fatigue life is really long so just keep riding and dont worry about it
Sir may I know what is the full specification of your bike?
That’s awesome!