Gold will not dissolve in pure sulfuric acid. You need some sort of coordinating ligand (like chloride, bromide, iodide, cyanide, thiosulfate) in solution to keep gold in solution: otherwise the gold will reduce itself back to metal immediately.
@@sreetips Check this old video out " Nitric Acid(1962) " watch?v=wpa7aMUtSI0 Minute: 13:20 I quote: "That is the temperature, play a major role of which reaction predominates." I recommend watching the entire video.
I’ve dissolved traces of gold in boiling nitric acid. But I’ve never seen gold go into solution with sulfuric acid at any strength. But I’ve never tried it.
This is actually a fascinating experiment which demonstrates how gold nuggets and flakes can form in hydrothermal vents and quartz deposits, which are usually very acidic and full of sulfides and sulfates. The super-critical acid water dissolves the gold transiently, and it then nucleates around forming crystals quickly, building up on itself into lumps.
iam doing experiment at rock suppsoedly contain gold by dissolving them at 30% h2so4 when greenish things sulfate appear(fe 2 i assume) i add h202 then yellow murky things appear i think i will achieve fe 3 state but no matter how many peroxide it was and full steering at hot temp, it always revert into clear greenish things again, i theorized somehow gold fe 2 ion prevent gold from being oxidized thus precipitated it what do you think?
What you made here is known in chemistry as piranha solution. This is very dangerous to do as a casual experiment. The sulfuric acid is an extremely strong dehydrating agent. The H2O2 becomes a very strong oxidizer in the presence of H2SO4. This allows the mixture to provide a free oxygen that can disrupt C-C surface bonds, forming a carbonyl group. This activity causes significant disruption in the surrounding bonds. That’s why even though it didn’t harm the inorganic gold, it could easily destroy any organic matter. Also, if your H2O2 concentration is too high, the mixture can become explosive. Please be careful when mixing sulphuric acid with oxidizers unless you’re confident in your knowledge.
@@chrisweatherley9587 True, especially with organics that have been burnt on after a distillation! Still, a very dangerous chemical when made accidentally.
@@themyceliumnetwork The rate of thermal decomposition increases. I don’t know if in solution with H2SO4, it decomposes to a safer mixture, or if the free oxygen release would sustain the reactivity of the solution. But, this solution when mixed tends to be exothermic enough to bring the reaction to 120C. Either way, you don’t want to heat H2SO4 to 140C. At that temperature, it would be able to dehydrate organics very easily.
@2:50 what you produce there with the H2SO4 and H2O2 is "Piranha solution" and it is supposed to attack primarily organic compounds. But you could use liquid chlorine, bromine or iodine to dissolve gold. would be interesting to see.
The mixture essentially does what nitric does on its own, but yes should work if chlorine is present, even just the gas as with nitric. Question is, how do you need to modify the drop to have that part go... SMB for example.. don't think that's gonna work... But I've been wrong before. Not that there wouldn't be another way... The gold isn't exactly itching to hold on to anything 🤣
I really enjoy watching watching the wins and the fails. I wouldn't call this a fail, but a transformation of gold from powder to nuggets. Thanks for sharing!
it's really not. sometimes teach is really the useless one. take this guy for example, he doesn't know the most essential parts of the video (just like not being able to detect gold in the result) and he still makes videos.. "education" people like you are the reason why we don't have good things.
H2SO4 + H2O2 produces Caro's acid when mixed cold. If you boil it it will decompose immediately. If there is any H2O2 or Caro's acid left over it will immediately oxidise your stannous or Fe(II) gold detecting reagents.
Isn't Caro's made with chlorosulfuric acid? I'm not a chemist so forgive me if I am being silly. I'm thinking the chlorine, which is not in Caro's itself, is some sort of key here.
@@ut000bs The standard laboratory method for producing Caro's acid is slowly adding H2SO4 into H2O2 in specific proportions while monitoring the temperature, because it will get pretty warm. I guess using chlorosulphonic acid would produce caro's acid, too, plus some HCl. I assume that caro's acid is strong enough to further oxidise some of the HCl, e.g. into chlorine. Not entirely sure.
@@kirahund6711 I greatly appreciate your reply. From what I can see H2O2 + ClSO2OH gives you H2SO5 + HCl which is what you said. I bow to you since you obviously know more than I. I will keep reading. Thank you so much.
With normal gold drops via reduction with smb... Its the sulfur dioxide gas dissolved in solution doing the reducing.... H2so4 is essentially so2 oxydized and hydrolyzed.... Any gold you managed to dissolve would immediately be reduced back out in this setup just as the so2 generated by smb in say an AR drop precipitates and drops the gold
Caro's acid (also known as piranha solution) which is what you made isn't stable at high temps. I don't think it will dissolve gold regardless. It's great at dissolving anything organic though. Well it dissolves it, oxidizes it to carbon, and then oxidizes the carbon into CO2 at which point the solution goes clear again. It's sometimes used to clean gunk out of lab glassware. Needless to say, don't get it on you. It actually does what most people think acids do when it gets on your skin.
This experiment might not have been a complete failure. Now, if you get gold nanoparticles in suspension that you can't filter out, put the solution on the hot plate with strong stirring and boil it dry. Maybe the tiny particles will cold weld together as the solution evaporates...?
That was a good experiment. Even if it didn't result in the manner you wanted. Always learning! Just like a game of chess. It's when you lose that you learn from your mistakes.
Actually you can dissolve gold dust in battery acid. I have been doing by it for a couple months now. I also use hydrogen peroxide with it. Not sure why your experiment didn't work. But it works for me.
What also dissolves gold, is the mixture H2O2 and HCl. In principle you are creating the same chlorine radicals tha dissolve the gold, as in aqua regia.
I've always had problems with stannous tests in high peroxide solutions. Always come back inconclusive until I got them much more concentrated. Caused me alot of issues for some time.
We use mixture of H2O2 and conc sulfuric acid to drop gold (and other precious metals) from cyanide baths. So conc sulfuric acid + H2O2 heated to almost the boiling point of sulfuric acid does not dissolve the gold.
You’re welcome and thank you for sharing. I would not have guessed it would coalesce in that manner. It resembles what would come out of an amalgam retort, of course we know it’s very pure and it shows. Spectacular glow.
Hi, it is possible to dissolve it with H2SO4 + HNO3. But only if the temperature is high enough. The precipitation works then by adding water. This is being used to dissolve gold when its mixed with silver (carat gold). For carat gold you use the inquartation process as we all know. By using above described method you don't have to do this. Since aqua regia isn't working well with carat gold, this is an additional method besides the inquartation. One important thing. As soon as you add HCL to this method, the precipitation of the dissolved gold won't work anymore by adding water, which is logic as you create aqua regia by doing so..... H2So4 + H2o2 won't dissolve AU, but there is another thing which you can do by that. You can dissolve carbon. (epoxy, plastic...) => IC chips. This is better than just H2So4 alone.
I know that some processes are counter intuitive. Such as inquarting: adding silver to remove all the silver from the karat gold. But the method you speak of, there is already water present in both acids. So adding water to precipitate the gold doesn’t make any sense to me. None of the professional refiners on the forum ever once made reference to such a method. Unless this is something new - or a hoax.
@@sreetips I haven't done it either. I use the inquartation method. I came to this by research after having realized that some of my gold dissolves when H2So4 and Nitric are present without and traces of Cloride. So I started to search WHY and found some articles about it. Maybe one day I will try and share my results with you.
Thank you for run running this experiment. Interestingly what you demonstrated was a potentially useful purification method. That hot piranha solution will dissolve many of the contaminants and leave behind gold and not that many other materials.
Hydrogen peroxide with a few drops of the acid is what (theoretically) reacts with gold because the acid makes the peroxide a much stronger oxidiser. The other reason this was done the wrong way round is that you should never add water to concentrated sulphuric acid. You should add the acid to water (and your peroxide solution is mostly water) I'm glad you were very carefull.
Hey, Sreetips.....I was watching a few chemistry vids from both NileRed and Tom from Extractions and Ire and both of them have independantly said the same thing about the use of Piranha Solution that i need to pass onto you as a big safety tip....when making a batch use either 3 or 4 parts concentrated sulfuric to 1 part of concentrated peroxide...DO NOT LET the peroxide ions exceed the acid ions in the mixture or the resulting liquid can become EXPLOSIVE....so if using it in future,,,,let the reaction completely die down in the container before making any more or adding any additions
Can you use this piranha solution on your filter papers instead of burning them? Or would the sulfuric acid cause a compound you don't want with the precious metals?
Well streetips though that experiment was a bust it is a learning curve I won't be doing that myself when I get more into this but thanks for the results.
It's a FAIL cause it didn't turn into liquid ....I say it was SUCCESS cause you just took gold powder and turned it back into a solid gold without using fire....now would that work with any amount and Is that method cheaper than the gas and torch to heat it back into solid gold ..
@@sreetips can you do a video on cold press or try .....I'm sure everyone just likes watching you work with gold so any video is never a waste of time ....
You just started with the 2nd charge of h2o2 and I'm wondering if something important is missing that does what the chlorine does in the normal aqua regia reaction. Forgive me since I'm writing as you go. Dammit, Jim. I'm a physicist, not a chemist. 🤣 🖖 Don't feel bad, Sr. I failed in the experiment, too. We gained wisdom though. Later Edit: after reading a bit perhaps heating it was a bad idea? I have found h2so4 + h2o2 makes Caro's acid which is destroyed by heat? I also find Caro's acid is explosive. Well, now I find Caro's is not made with sulfuric acid. It is made with chlorosulfuric acid. There is that chlorine again. Hm… 🤯Caro's is h2so5 so where does the chlorine go and what would it do to the gold powder?
Great experiment! I just tried this reagent for removing carbon and other organics from a soil sample prior to extracting and detecting gold. I am trying to see if bacteria are consuming molecular gold and accumulating it in soil.
@@sreetips I'm synthesizing and using a reagent BSOPD that has almost the same sensitivity as ICP mass Spec. I read somewhere that Bacillus bacteria seem to be more prevalent when found near gold deposits.
This makes me curious about gold chemistry beyond refining. I never heard about gold sulfate, but I know gold oxide, nitrate and chloride do exist. And there is our beloved chloroauric acid.
Not a fail, it is a result, H2SO4 does not disolve gold, even in presence of oxidizer. could be used in some cleaning or extraction process. I think it is used in so called wet ashing, disolving IC chips in concentrated sulfuric acid. BTW, compacts gold powder... :-)
Well, at least you tried! Prob the Prana acid H2SO5 broke down and thus you could not dissolve the gold. Sulfuric acid alone cannot dissolve gold so if it was breaking down prob the sol of Prana was degrading.
Are you able to cast a gold trinket or some such? I know your sight is about getting the most out of recovering gold or silver from metals. Just wondering
I’ve got a small but beautiful 10g bar of gold from a previous refining. I need to mount it on a chain then offer it for sale on my eBay site - thanks for reminding me.
Try a piranha solution using nitric acid in replacement of sulphuric acid. I've made this cocktail before for funzies. I'm still alive so it never blew up luckily 😂 Nitric and peroxide! Sounds dangerous... Likely is dangerous... But it eats the hell out of a hotdog 😂
This is the only video I could find on this experiment. It proves some of the information on the internet false. My only question now is, can I add h202 to the sulperic acid to speed up the process of parting my inquarted gold from silver and base metals?
Peroxide decomposes rapidly so maybe you're not getting a high enough concentration adding it at that rate just don't confuse that with I said you should do it faster LOL you're the man with all the experience but these crazy thoughts just pop into my head and then leak out as oversharing XD I guess you could call it something like an internal dialogue leakage
Sir, what you consider a failure has still a bright side since you end up with nice & tight gold chunks which are much easier to smelt (no more gold powder blowing away upon igniting your torch) and I am still wondering if the newly obtained product is in a METALLIC state and non colloidal form. In such case congratulations for this Unexpected Discovery ! Please perform an electric current conduction test as final proof and to be on the safe side (a long time subscriber)
Are those beakers rated for...so much heat? Do they break often, from the heat? I ask this because im always afraid one will explode on me. Doing my best to use PPE but it is always a constant concern for me.
I think your idea is plausible. But, your procedure may be incorrect. When you add 30% h2o2 to acid, your essentialy adding water to acid. Which will create a lot of heat, decomposing the h2o2 before it can react. Additionally, for your stannous test, You might get better results by testing an h2so4/h2o2 mixture. A possible control test to determine if stannous chloride will detect gold in solution would be to react ag(cl3) with h2s to make gold sulfide. Add the sulfide to your mix, then test the solution with stannous. You might get a result by chilling your reagents, then premixing before adding gold or heat
Another educational experience. Thx for sharing the experiment. Currently digging and collecting a pile of e-waste to try a recovery. Going to see what I can collect and recover from free sources at the end of the summer.
I did X-ray film once. It was messy, time consuming, and the yield was low so I’ll probably never do it again. But it is a way to get silver for your stack.
Could you do a recovery with sultrier acid and hcl, this is a aqua Regia also but I’m having trouble finding process online and was hoping you would take a stab at it?
so this gives out the gold sulfate, the piranha solution, piranha should be boom boomy solution, you are able to directly electroplate gold from that solution, so aqua regia is not required, for refining gold, direct oxidation dissolving of gold with piranha acid, usually hydrogen peroxide oxidation happens only in acidic conditions, possibly other mild acids would also work with h2o2. did you measure the liquid you added. not conclusive evidence. microscopic amounts of etching (like with KOH) would count as dissolving.
what do you think makes gold pieces attach to each other, if no dissolving reaction happened (gold should not react is the assumption), yep they got surface level glued. it will dissolve as fine nano particle powder.
I mean if the dissolving is slow, you might be able to leave stuff dissolving over longer time, like days or weeks, and h2so4/h2o2 would be easier to obtain, I mean in that way you could do direct electro-reforming, maybe electric+h2so4+h2o2 direct electro-oxidation-plating reforming would be even better process@@sreetips
just make sure that the electro-oxidation liquid has, say, znso4 as the base, so it will be the first to be always electroplated out, and the gold as bulk last@@sreetips
From what I understand , a fail is still a win , because you know more than you did before . Win win chicken dinner lol . Thanks Sreetips that was very informative and fun to watch . I leaned something today as well . See you soon my friend . Cheers
I’m in the spring time of my senility. I had already tried this in another video and forgot about it. But still a beneficial reminder - not to try it again in the future. If you see me doing it in a future video then it’s probably time for sreetips to retire from refining,
Not a fail, just proved it would not work to put Au into solution. But it worked in collecting fine gold powder off beakers to a recoverable chunk. Cool. I have some storage jars that I know are covered in fine gold dust that I can not just get off them with out AR and dropping the gold again. Hummm...
This had me wondering something....1) Piranha Solution...will not put gold in solution......2.....Piranha solution will eat organic matter.....3....incinerating your filter papers for trace metals produces lots of organic matter (ash).....maybe this liquid could be utilized whenever you have to find metal throughout lots of ash
The hardware store sulfuric acid has an inhibitor in it that is carbon based, this is designed to prevent dissolving pipes. Adding the hydrogen peroxide creates piranha solution, which in turn attacks the inhibitor in the sulfuric acid. Essentially, you are turning the concentrated sulfuric acid to a high percentage of sulfuric acid, and with the added heat, you are boiling off the water byproduct while carbon dioxide is released. Add enough hydrogen peroxide, and you will eventually get piranha solution, not add enough and you will just increase the sulfuric acid concentration. For your carpet video, after turning it to ash, putting it in the piranha would get rid of the carbon based ash and leave your gold behind. Piranha solution isn’t supposed to dissolve gold. Edit, now that I’ve finished the video, I see you realized this and now I shall eat my hat.
@sreetips alright man just injured and going through a divorce. Found a cool hobby I like. But when the kids told the ex wife man it was a shaming parade against me. Anyways man thanks for what you do it really is helping fill my time.
@sreetips bro man I was adding smb to my hcl and hydrogen peroxide mix and waiting and watching. Should of been paying more attention and accidentally added light blue Gatorade. Chatgpt was like wow what an exciting unexpected turn. So now I'm like well this is one for the history books lol.
When I seen the title I said ah hell no please don't tell me this works I had a strange thing happen to me over the weekend I was processing some gold corner bga chips and was all done with reaction I had some Salfides and some black sand from river sluicing that contained some gold so I dumped it in thinking the Excess nitric would consume whatever gold was in the sand I walked away for a little I came back and I saw my solution looked like Brown mud I proceeded to filter it and tried to drop the gold With SMB But I couldn't get anything to drop it was like my gold vanished So I got to thinking maybe my gold was in that sludge that I filtered So I took the filter and the sludge and redissolved it And sure enough by adding the black sand Somehow ferrous sulfate was created In the 1st reaction Which caused all my gold to drop out a solution
10:16 add table salt (non-iodized)... Sulfuric acid and sodium chloride react to make hydrochloric acid and we already know that'll put in solution with that much of that concentration of hydrogen peroxide 😂😂
I think that’s pretty cool to show even if a bust. If you have a nitrate salt like magnesium nitrate or sodium nitrate. It would be fun to see if you could get gold to go into solution of sulfuric acid and a nitrate salt. Even try a lower dilution of sulfuric acid at around 30% with a salt to simulate using battery acid instead of drain cleaner.
Gold will not dissolve in pure sulfuric acid. You need some sort of coordinating ligand (like chloride, bromide, iodide, cyanide, thiosulfate) in solution to keep gold in solution: otherwise the gold will reduce itself back to metal immediately.
It does dissolve but it has to be boiled in fuming sulfuric acid, below 98% wont work
Hellraiser3331 is right "It does dissolve but it has to be boiled in fuming sulfuric acid, below 98% wont work"
I had no idea
@@sreetips
Check this old video out " Nitric Acid(1962) "
watch?v=wpa7aMUtSI0
Minute: 13:20
I quote: "That is the temperature, play a major role of which reaction predominates."
I recommend watching the entire video.
I’ve dissolved traces of gold in boiling nitric acid. But I’ve never seen gold go into solution with sulfuric acid at any strength. But I’ve never tried it.
This is actually a fascinating experiment which demonstrates how gold nuggets and flakes can form in hydrothermal vents and quartz deposits, which are usually very acidic and full of sulfides and sulfates. The super-critical acid water dissolves the gold transiently, and it then nucleates around forming crystals quickly, building up on itself into lumps.
iam doing experiment at rock suppsoedly contain gold by dissolving them at 30% h2so4
when greenish things sulfate appear(fe 2 i assume) i add h202 then yellow murky things appear i think i will achieve fe 3 state but no matter how many peroxide it was and full steering at hot temp, it always revert into clear greenish things again, i theorized somehow gold fe 2 ion prevent gold from being oxidized thus precipitated it what do you think?
@dogodogo5891 I don’t have any experience with processing ore/rock.
You made Peroxymonosulfuric acid. It will dissolve all organic material. I’m glad you wore all the proper safety equipment while making this acid.
What you made here is known in chemistry as piranha solution. This is very dangerous to do as a casual experiment. The sulfuric acid is an extremely strong dehydrating agent. The H2O2 becomes a very strong oxidizer in the presence of H2SO4. This allows the mixture to provide a free oxygen that can disrupt C-C surface bonds, forming a carbonyl group. This activity causes significant disruption in the surrounding bonds. That’s why even though it didn’t harm the inorganic gold, it could easily destroy any organic matter. Also, if your H2O2 concentration is too high, the mixture can become explosive. Please be careful when mixing sulphuric acid with oxidizers unless you’re confident in your knowledge.
what happens to the H2O2 when heated above 140F inside or outside the sulfuric acid.
its also really good at cleaning stubborn glassware deposits
@@chrisweatherley9587 True, especially with organics that have been burnt on after a distillation! Still, a very dangerous chemical when made accidentally.
@@themyceliumnetwork The rate of thermal decomposition increases. I don’t know if in solution with H2SO4, it decomposes to a safer mixture, or if the free oxygen release would sustain the reactivity of the solution. But, this solution when mixed tends to be exothermic enough to bring the reaction to 120C. Either way, you don’t want to heat H2SO4 to 140C. At that temperature, it would be able to dehydrate organics very easily.
@2:50 what you produce there with the H2SO4 and H2O2 is "Piranha solution" and it is supposed to attack primarily organic compounds. But you could use liquid chlorine, bromine or iodine to dissolve gold. would be interesting to see.
When watching the video till the end I saw, that you came to the same conclusion...
The mixture essentially does what nitric does on its own, but yes should work if chlorine is present, even just the gas as with nitric.
Question is, how do you need to modify the drop to have that part go... SMB for example.. don't think that's gonna work... But I've been wrong before.
Not that there wouldn't be another way... The gold isn't exactly itching to hold on to anything 🤣
Very interesting. I've heard about high purity gold "cold welding". This was cool to actually see it happen.
I really enjoy watching watching the wins and the fails. I wouldn't call this a fail, but a transformation of gold from powder to nuggets. Thanks for sharing!
You are my North star 🌟 Godfather of desolving & purified gold so thank you from young brother from Saudi Arabia 🇸🇦 🙏 ❤️
Thank you!
No experiments are a bust if you gain knowledge from them. It's how we learn. Keep up the great content!
it's really not. sometimes teach is really the useless one. take this guy for example, he doesn't know the most essential parts of the video (just like not being able to detect gold in the result) and he still makes videos.. "education"
people like you are the reason why we don't have good things.
H2SO4 + H2O2 produces Caro's acid when mixed cold. If you boil it it will decompose immediately.
If there is any H2O2 or Caro's acid left over it will immediately oxidise your stannous or Fe(II) gold detecting reagents.
Isn't Caro's made with chlorosulfuric acid? I'm not a chemist so forgive me if I am being silly. I'm thinking the chlorine, which is not in Caro's itself, is some sort of key here.
Makes sense. Thank you
@@ut000bs
The standard laboratory method for producing Caro's acid is slowly adding H2SO4 into H2O2 in specific proportions while monitoring the temperature, because it will get pretty warm.
I guess using chlorosulphonic acid would produce caro's acid, too, plus some HCl. I assume that caro's acid is strong enough to further oxidise some of the HCl, e.g. into chlorine. Not entirely sure.
@@kirahund6711 I greatly appreciate your reply. From what I can see H2O2 + ClSO2OH gives you H2SO5 + HCl which is what you said. I bow to you since you obviously know more than I. I will keep reading.
Thank you so much.
With normal gold drops via reduction with smb... Its the sulfur dioxide gas dissolved in solution doing the reducing.... H2so4 is essentially so2 oxydized and hydrolyzed.... Any gold you managed to dissolve would immediately be reduced back out in this setup just as the so2 generated by smb in say an AR drop precipitates and drops the gold
I'm stealing the slerpy straw technique, and congratulations on simulating river gold with your sterbar. This was useful to me.
Hey that's a pretty cool way to turn your gold powder into gold nuggets. Successful experiment I'd say sir !
I would be interesting to repeat this with a small amount of silver nitrate added. A trace of silver makes piranha solution a lot more powerful.
You produced 8.5% more GOLD! Not a bust, not a fail!
Got to love miracles.
Thank you for the lesson sir.
I get here from goldrefining forum
For those that don't know what MSDS means this is it. Material Safety Data Sheet.
had to use that book a few times in my working career
it's changed to Safety data sheet. 😎
It’s sds now
What was the cost of materials? Making nuggets that way might take longer than smelting, but probably something you could just 'set and forget'.
This is like a mystery movie.
This was a great video without an ad even though the experiment wasnt sucessful
Caro's acid (also known as piranha solution) which is what you made isn't stable at high temps. I don't think it will dissolve gold regardless. It's great at dissolving anything organic though. Well it dissolves it, oxidizes it to carbon, and then oxidizes the carbon into CO2 at which point the solution goes clear again. It's sometimes used to clean gunk out of lab glassware. Needless to say, don't get it on you. It actually does what most people think acids do when it gets on your skin.
It was hidden from view in the recesses of my mind. I’ve actually tried this before. But total forgot that I had.
Excellent gold show. Thanks!
This experiment might not have been a complete failure. Now, if you get gold nanoparticles in suspension that you can't filter out, put the solution on the hot plate with strong stirring and boil it dry. Maybe the tiny particles will cold weld together as the solution evaporates...?
That was a good experiment. Even if it didn't result in the manner you wanted. Always learning!
Just like a game of chess. It's when you lose that you learn from your mistakes.
Actually you can dissolve gold dust in battery acid. I have been doing by it for a couple months now. I also use hydrogen peroxide with it. Not sure why your experiment didn't work. But it works for me.
I’ve tried several times. Never got it to go in solution.
What also dissolves gold, is the mixture H2O2 and HCl. In principle you are creating the same chlorine radicals tha dissolve the gold, as in aqua regia.
I've always had problems with stannous tests in high peroxide solutions. Always come back inconclusive until I got them much more concentrated. Caused me alot of issues for some time.
Didn't realize what your conclusion was. That's crazy.
We use mixture of H2O2 and conc sulfuric acid to drop gold (and other precious metals) from cyanide baths. So conc sulfuric acid + H2O2 heated to almost the boiling point of sulfuric acid does not dissolve the gold.
I know.
You’re welcome and thank you for sharing. I would not have guessed it would coalesce in that manner. It resembles what would come out of an amalgam retort, of course we know it’s very pure and it shows. Spectacular glow.
Hi, it is possible to dissolve it with H2SO4 + HNO3. But only if the temperature is high enough. The precipitation works then by adding water. This is being used to dissolve gold when its mixed with silver (carat gold). For carat gold you use the inquartation process as we all know. By using above described method you don't have to do this. Since aqua regia isn't working well with carat gold, this is an additional method besides the inquartation.
One important thing. As soon as you add HCL to this method, the precipitation of the dissolved gold won't work anymore by adding water, which is logic as you create aqua regia by doing so.....
H2So4 + H2o2 won't dissolve AU, but there is another thing which you can do by that. You can dissolve carbon. (epoxy, plastic...) => IC chips. This is better than just H2So4 alone.
I know that some processes are counter intuitive. Such as inquarting: adding silver to remove all the silver from the karat gold. But the method you speak of, there is already water present in both acids. So adding water to precipitate the gold doesn’t make any sense to me. None of the professional refiners on the forum ever once made reference to such a method. Unless this is something new - or a hoax.
@@sreetips I haven't done it either. I use the inquartation method. I came to this by research after having realized that some of my gold dissolves when H2So4 and Nitric are present without and traces of Cloride. So I started to search WHY and found some articles about it. Maybe one day I will try and share my results with you.
Wouldn’t hurt to try it on a small piece of karat gold for an experiment.
Thank you for run running this experiment.
Interestingly what you demonstrated was a potentially useful purification method. That hot piranha solution will dissolve many of the contaminants and leave behind gold and not that many other materials.
Another source of h202 is pool shock oxidizer I believe
I think that it is in the 25-30% range
Interesting to see you using piranha solution
Hydrogen peroxide with a few drops of the acid is what (theoretically) reacts with gold because the acid makes the peroxide a much stronger oxidiser.
The other reason this was done the wrong way round is that you should never add water to concentrated sulphuric acid. You should add the acid to water (and your peroxide solution is mostly water)
I'm glad you were very carefull.
Good rule of thumb
Hey, Sreetips.....I was watching a few chemistry vids from both NileRed and Tom from Extractions and Ire and both of them have independantly said the same thing about the use of Piranha Solution that i need to pass onto you as a big safety tip....when making a batch use either 3 or 4 parts concentrated sulfuric to 1 part of concentrated peroxide...DO NOT LET the peroxide ions exceed the acid ions in the mixture or the resulting liquid can become EXPLOSIVE....so if using it in future,,,,let the reaction completely die down in the container before making any more or adding any additions
Excellent, thank you
Can you use this piranha solution on your filter papers instead of burning them? Or would the sulfuric acid cause a compound you don't want with the precious metals?
Burning (incineration) converts some junk that may cause problems. Then hit it with piranha to dissolve the carbon.
@@sreetips do you have a video doing that ?
I think it did it in the jewelers scrap video series.
can i use HCL instead of sulfuric acid, i think HCL better? can i use SMB for gold 24k ?
Well streetips though that experiment was a bust it is a learning curve I won't be doing that myself when I get more into this but thanks for the results.
It's a FAIL cause it didn't turn into liquid ....I say it was SUCCESS cause you just took gold powder and turned it back into a solid gold without using fire....now would that work with any amount and Is that method cheaper than the gas and torch to heat it back into solid gold ..
High purity gold powder can be cold pressed into a bar - so I’m told.
@@sreetips can you do a video on cold press or try .....I'm sure everyone just likes watching you work with gold so any video is never a waste of time ....
You just started with the 2nd charge of h2o2 and I'm wondering if something important is missing that does what the chlorine does in the normal aqua regia reaction. Forgive me since I'm writing as you go.
Dammit, Jim. I'm a physicist, not a chemist. 🤣 🖖 Don't feel bad, Sr. I failed in the experiment, too. We gained wisdom though.
Later Edit: after reading a bit perhaps heating it was a bad idea? I have found h2so4 + h2o2 makes Caro's acid which is destroyed by heat? I also find Caro's acid is explosive.
Well, now I find Caro's is not made with sulfuric acid. It is made with chlorosulfuric acid. There is that chlorine again. Hm… 🤯Caro's is h2so5 so where does the chlorine go and what would it do to the gold powder?
Go were no man has gone before. I love Star Trek. I love this GOLD stuff better.
Great experiment! I just tried this reagent for removing carbon and other organics from a soil sample prior to extracting and detecting gold. I am trying to see if bacteria are consuming molecular gold and accumulating it in soil.
I’ve heard of organisms that produce gold in their waste. Trying to detect tiny traces of gold isn’t easy.
@@sreetips I'm synthesizing and using a reagent BSOPD that has almost the same sensitivity as ICP mass Spec. I read somewhere that Bacillus bacteria seem to be more prevalent when found near gold deposits.
This makes me curious about gold chemistry beyond refining. I never heard about gold sulfate, but I know gold oxide, nitrate and chloride do exist. And there is our beloved chloroauric acid.
Won't put gold in solution but will make a hot dog (or your finger) disappear... That piranha solution is some nasty shit
My question if you learned something then how was it a failure? You had a idea and turned put false, but that is how we learn from the failures.
Not a fail, it is a result, H2SO4 does not disolve gold, even in presence of oxidizer. could be used in some cleaning or extraction process.
I think it is used in so called wet ashing, disolving IC chips in concentrated sulfuric acid. BTW, compacts gold powder... :-)
It looked a dangerous procedure, which did not work as expected but was worth as a learning experiment.
This kinda stuff is good to know!
Thank you!!
What gets me is the fact that I already tried this during my first stock pot series with negative results. Early signs of a new season in my life.
@@sreetips If you're talking about age and memory, I can relate a little!
Well, at least you tried! Prob the Prana acid H2SO5 broke down and thus you could not dissolve the gold. Sulfuric acid alone cannot dissolve gold so if it was breaking down prob the sol of Prana was degrading.
Are you able to cast a gold trinket or some such? I know your sight is about getting the most out of recovering gold or silver from metals. Just wondering
I’ve got a small but beautiful 10g bar of gold from a previous refining. I need to mount it on a chain then offer it for sale on my eBay site - thanks for reminding me.
Try a piranha solution using nitric acid in replacement of sulphuric acid. I've made this cocktail before for funzies. I'm still alive so it never blew up luckily 😂
Nitric and peroxide! Sounds dangerous... Likely is dangerous... But it eats the hell out of a hotdog 😂
Really interesting experiment, do you think the ~7% contaminants in the sulfuric acid is prohibiting the reactions from taking place?
The contaminant is water.
@@kirahund6711 Do tell?
@@VendettaProspecting you cant have 100% h2so4 due to it being highly hygroscopic.
@@chrisweatherley9587 usually the highest concentration would be 98%, but you can get it to 100% by disolving SO3 in it.
Not sure
This is the only video I could find on this experiment. It proves some of the information on the internet false. My only question now is, can I add h202 to the sulperic acid to speed up the process of parting my inquarted gold from silver and base metals?
I’ve never tried that. I don’t know.
Peroxide decomposes rapidly so maybe you're not getting a high enough concentration adding it at that rate just don't confuse that with I said you should do it faster LOL you're the man with all the experience but these crazy thoughts just pop into my head and then leak out as oversharing XD
I guess you could call it something like an internal dialogue leakage
Watching here in the Philippines🇵🇭
Sir, what you consider a failure has still a bright side since you end up with nice & tight gold chunks which are much easier to smelt (no more gold powder blowing away upon igniting your torch) and I am still wondering if the newly obtained product is in a METALLIC state and non colloidal form. In such case congratulations for this Unexpected Discovery ! Please perform an electric current conduction test as final proof and to be on the safe side (a long time subscriber)
I added those pieces to another batch and re-refined them
Are those beakers rated for...so much heat? Do they break often, from the heat? I ask this because im always afraid one will explode on me. Doing my best to use PPE but it is always a constant concern for me.
Pyrex or borosilicate glass will take lots of heat
I think your idea is plausible. But, your procedure may be incorrect.
When you add 30% h2o2 to acid, your essentialy adding water to acid. Which will create a lot of heat, decomposing the h2o2 before it can react.
Additionally, for your stannous test, You might get better results by testing an h2so4/h2o2 mixture.
A possible control test to determine if stannous chloride will detect gold in solution would be to react ag(cl3) with h2s to make gold sulfide. Add the sulfide to your mix, then test the solution with stannous.
You might get a result by chilling your reagents, then premixing before adding gold or heat
Piranha cold welds gold
That’s why the pieces will appear smaller
You pour this into a sideways mold and then you see if the flat gold will lay down tighter after nodding up and reducing the electron count 0:39
What about hydrobromic acid (HBr)? I don't know a thing about chemistry, but it sounds good, right? 😅
Another educational experience. Thx for sharing the experiment. Currently digging and collecting a pile of e-waste to try a recovery. Going to see what I can collect and recover from free sources at the end of the summer.
What is the best DIY method to reclaim silver from 1200lbs. of x-ray film from 50s, 60s, and 70s?
Bleach.
He has a vid on that from way back. I think he used bleach to pull the silver oxide off of the film.
Sreetips has a video on this topic.
I did X-ray film once. It was messy, time consuming, and the yield was low so I’ll probably never do it again. But it is a way to get silver for your stack.
I was curious how long you let the stock pot work after the last addition of gold waste solution
At least 2 days. Then I remove the bubbler and let it settle another two before siphoning off the waste liquid to my waste treatment bucket
@@sreetips thanks keep making the great videos
Was there a source that said that this would work , or just an experiment ;)
Thanks again
Yea, a viewer suggested it. I forgot I’d already tried this. I’m in the spring time of my senility.
Could you do a recovery with sultrier acid and hcl, this is a aqua Regia also but I’m having trouble finding process online and was hoping you would take a stab at it?
Sultrier?
My bad I like watching your videos so much I typed to fast: H₂SO₄
Sulphuric acid
Got it
Mr. Sreetips, would you sell that 1.2g you just boiled in the piranha solution? Please let me know.
I’ve already dissolved it, sorry
@@sreetips NP, thank you for replying
Интересно палладий таким методом как себя ведёт?
I know absolutly nothing about chemistry but watching your videos makes me sad i didnt take chemistry back in high school
teach yourself. read. lots. i didnt start until 30yrs... im 50 now and starting to understand haha...
@@chrisweatherley9587 sweet
I took one chemistry class back in high school - got a “D”
@@sreetips doesn't seem like it lol. You make it look interesting
Everyone: Gold is a super-unreactive metal!
Sreetips: Here are 10 billion ways to dissolve gold.
It didn’t work
I need help I'm using nitric substitute from amazon and can't get my gold to drop out.
Sorry, I have no experience with nitric substitute. I don’t what that is.
H202, the sequel to Water
I'd just put that 1.1 gm of partially solid gold into a dish, heat it and add a lil borax and make a solid button out of it, then sell it as such...
so this gives out the gold sulfate, the piranha solution, piranha should be boom boomy solution, you are able to directly electroplate gold from that solution, so aqua regia is not required, for refining gold, direct oxidation dissolving of gold with piranha acid, usually hydrogen peroxide oxidation happens only in acidic conditions, possibly other mild acids would also work with h2o2. did you measure the liquid you added. not conclusive evidence. microscopic amounts of etching (like with KOH) would count as dissolving.
what do you think makes gold pieces attach to each other, if no dissolving reaction happened (gold should not react is the assumption), yep they got surface level glued. it will dissolve as fine nano particle powder.
I don’t know. But it’s safe to conclude that piranha solution does not dissolve the gold.
well if any tiny small amount was dissolved, it would be able to be electroplated and directly observed@@sreetips
I mean if the dissolving is slow, you might be able to leave stuff dissolving over longer time, like days or weeks, and h2so4/h2o2 would be easier to obtain, I mean in that way you could do direct electro-reforming, maybe electric+h2so4+h2o2 direct electro-oxidation-plating reforming would be even better process@@sreetips
just make sure that the electro-oxidation liquid has, say, znso4 as the base, so it will be the first to be always electroplated out, and the gold as bulk last@@sreetips
Hmm prana solution to reduce the gold into a metal. Neat idea.
It didn’t work
What if you added iodine to experiment
I don’t know
From what I understand , a fail is still a win , because you know more than you did before . Win win chicken dinner lol . Thanks Sreetips that was very informative and fun to watch . I leaned something today as well . See you soon my friend . Cheers
I’m in the spring time of my senility. I had already tried this in another video and forgot about it. But still a beneficial reminder - not to try it again in the future. If you see me doing it in a future video then it’s probably time for sreetips to retire from refining,
Would salt make a difference?
Possibly
Not a fail, just proved it would not work to put Au into solution.
But it worked in collecting fine gold powder off beakers to a recoverable chunk.
Cool.
I have some storage jars that I know are covered in fine gold dust that I can not just get off them with out AR and dropping the gold again. Hummm...
I’ve used AR to remove stubborn sticking gold deposits on the inside of my beakers
“Local hydroponics store” 😎
Will the sulfuric acid not kill the stannouus chloride?
I don’t know
This had me wondering something....1) Piranha Solution...will not put gold in solution......2.....Piranha solution will eat organic matter.....3....incinerating your filter papers for trace metals produces lots of organic matter (ash).....maybe this liquid could be utilized whenever you have to find metal throughout lots of ash
That’s an excellent idea. I like your thinking process.
Scary stuff there!
Is cotton good for filtering solution
Not for the sulfuric acid, H2O2 solution. It'll dissolve anything organic. For that you want a glass fritted funnel.or fiberglass like he's using.
no.
I’ve never tried cotton filters so I don’t know.
How do I get the cooper out of the gold
I use hot dilute nitric acid boils
Hello Sir. Wery interesting 👍take care Mr sreetips 😊
The hardware store sulfuric acid has an inhibitor in it that is carbon based, this is designed to prevent dissolving pipes. Adding the hydrogen peroxide creates piranha solution, which in turn attacks the inhibitor in the sulfuric acid. Essentially, you are turning the concentrated sulfuric acid to a high percentage of sulfuric acid, and with the added heat, you are boiling off the water byproduct while carbon dioxide is released. Add enough hydrogen peroxide, and you will eventually get piranha solution, not add enough and you will just increase the sulfuric acid concentration. For your carpet video, after turning it to ash, putting it in the piranha would get rid of the carbon based ash and leave your gold behind. Piranha solution isn’t supposed to dissolve gold. Edit, now that I’ve finished the video, I see you realized this and now I shall eat my hat.
I hadn’t thought of using it to process the jewelers carpet
Or some potassium nitrate. To you mixture
I’ve never added potassium nitrate during a refining.
Awesome tahank you very much...
Have any gold still available?
Yes, I’ll get some listed soon
@sreetips alright man just injured and going through a divorce. Found a cool hobby I like. But when the kids told the ex wife man it was a shaming parade against me. Anyways man thanks for what you do it really is helping fill my time.
Sorry to hear that. I’ve never experienced divorce. My first wife was very good to me. And that’s why I’m still married to her.
@@sreetips lucky man
@sreetips bro man I was adding smb to my hcl and hydrogen peroxide mix and waiting and watching. Should of been paying more attention and accidentally added light blue Gatorade. Chatgpt was like wow what an exciting unexpected turn. So now I'm like well this is one for the history books lol.
When I seen the title I said ah hell no please don't tell me this works
I had a strange thing happen to me over the weekend I was processing some gold corner bga chips and was all done with reaction I had some Salfides and some black sand from river sluicing that contained some gold so I dumped it in thinking the Excess nitric would consume whatever gold was in the sand I walked away for a little I came back and I saw my solution looked like Brown mud I proceeded to filter it and tried to drop the gold With SMB But I couldn't get anything to drop it was like my gold vanished So I got to thinking maybe my gold was in that sludge that I filtered So I took the filter and the sludge and redissolved it And sure enough by adding the black sand Somehow ferrous sulfate was created In the 1st reaction Which caused all my gold to drop out a solution
iron sulfate wont drop gold.
Doctor 5star👏
Your gloves are not rated for acid.
I’ve used nitrile gloves for fourteen years
10:16 add table salt (non-iodized)...
Sulfuric acid and sodium chloride react to make hydrochloric acid and we already know that'll put in solution with that much of that concentration of hydrogen peroxide 😂😂
is it baffles me it should have went in solution
why? theres no reason for it to go into solution. adding h2o2 to h2so4 is esentially the same as diluting h2so4.
hey thabks for the vid really useful!
I think that’s pretty cool to show even if a bust. If you have a nitrate salt like magnesium nitrate or sodium nitrate. It would be fun to see if you could get gold to go into solution of sulfuric acid and a nitrate salt. Even try a lower dilution of sulfuric acid at around 30% with a salt to simulate using battery acid instead of drain cleaner.
I thought the gold needed to be mixed silver so it could go into solution. Is that just for nitric?
Yes
Your making piranha solution
Put a hotdog in it.
Yeh I didn't think that would work, but thanks for the video anyways 👍
Don't look like it's less in there 8:36...
I know, the shaped changed but the mass stayed the same.
the title of this video is misleading
I suggest you to change it to (I've tried and it didn't work)
😄😄😁