I still have a brand new gen 2 head in the box that I bought for my Darton Sleeved 3S build back in 2004. One day I’ll get around to putting it all together and be able to use it.
Think of all the turbulence in the 2nd gen head with the TVIS and intake ports! No wonder they won't have low end or top end power. Also add the CT26 turbo (90s turbo technology), and that original cast exhaust manifold. They tried to suppress turbo lag and that is nice, but there is still a lot of room to improve. You can also see how the gen 4 3SGTE is a culmination of all the lessons learned. The 4th gen is really how they should have shipped since 1990... :)
Hi Brandon my dad and I are huge fans of your work. I remember the first time at Atco.raceway. My dad was the guy taking the photos he still has a lot of those photos. Awesome video
Hey Javier, thank you for being a loyal fan. We hope to be back to Atco once we have our new car finished and revisit everyone up there. Lots of new stuff coming soon
My gen3 3s-ge was awesome. 170BHP in the Scottish highlands with a t-top. Could have done with the turbo to pass caravans and motorhomes in the summer tho. It was a somewhat frustrating car. It could corner so much quicker than everything on the road but as soon it got to a straight they'd all speed up to just under the speed limit. The MR2 didn't really have to the torque to pass uphill safely unless there was a good straight. My Z4 is much more capable but less fun being front engined. Luv and Peace.
That Gen2 head looks great. I also have converted to shimless buckets for my setup. For the head, technically, it is a Yamaha designed head...not Toyota. Also, a big difference between Gen2 and Gen3 is the EGR. I eliminated my EGR and now have smog pass issues here in CA. Finding an EGR bracket is tough.
Subscribed as well. Great information. 3S die hard over here. Running Gens 2-4 in various Celica Alltracs. Underestimated the Gen 1 due to misinformation. Keep up the great work, Brandon!! 👊🏾
Definitely subscribed for the 3S content. I've got three of them on hand; two Gen1s(my 58K ST165 and a spare drivetrain for it) and one Gen2(my SW20). Sounds like I don't have to swap if I don't want to. :)
Subscribed... You made me wanna stick 3s... No more k swap plans... I believe these engines are underrated... even the top secret supra used the 3s in it at one point to beat the skyline...
I used 3sgte in 3 and my current daily driver for the past 16 years. 2 3rd gens and a 2nd gen. I want to push the envelope a bit, 98+ concrete coolant passages camry block, was curious about variations in head design.
Brandon can you re edit the video of the starlet on the dyno and add voice over talking about the car like you did on this video. I saw it was uploaded 6 years ago so I am sure there are not much that is top secret any more. I would like to know the setup engine size stock or stroker its internals exhaust manifold intake manifold turbo size waste gate blow off. ecu transmission any other controllers for trans or boost rear end tire size maybe you can add build photos while narrating it . Since its powered by the 3s. Thanks. Happy holidays
Weve been porting them for about 20 years, we flowed them many years ago but theres so many variables in customer applications that numbers can be thrown off so easily!
great comparison , i run a gen 4 with BC springs , what you recon max boost (68mm comp ) i could run with a rpm limit of 9k , ive ran 40 psi but didnt seem a lot better than 35 but i did find my TB was loose after lol which may explain that
@@psiracing im leaning towards an air leak , while im still T3 its a 1.05 ar hotside , i think once the bore is at over 2 bar the leak is probably the path of less resistance . will see next year now ive fixed the leak :) lol
@@richardprydden2851 definitely possible, when in doubt pressure check the system. I've seen areas leak that I would of promised didnt leak and were leaking! Goodluck!
Mr. Alvarez how are you? Is Kiko Cesar son. I'm building a Hyundai tiburon motor and I wanted to port the head. To see what's the damage and if you'll do it for me!!!!
i have a gen2 3sgte mr2.. i have to buy new cams, i have shims ON bucket. Whats the best setup you recommend? i have big turbo, supporting mods, etc. Im thinking stage 3 camshafts from BC but i have to change to shimless buckets. Problem is, i live overseas. So adjusting and ordering is a problem. What do you reccomend
Woudl like to see some gen4 3sgte stuff as that is popular. Street ported, what kind of gains are available from a mild port to that head, the differences from gen2 and 3 to the gen4. Thanks
Interested to see your opinion on the gen 4 head! Also could you grind the bottle neck down at all? Seems like there's still a fair bit of material there
We have done a few gen 4 cylinder heads, when you refer to gen 4 do you mean caldina or Beams black? We have experimented with the bottle on a non usable head and there isnt much room before you get into trouble.
Really depends how involved in the build you would want to get. Would definitely recommend a good rod and piston. Crank can handle whatever you want to throw at it
Do you guys have much if any experience with Gen 4 heads (Caldina GTT) and where the best performance gains are. Good build info and upgrade parts on these is hard to come by.
@@psiracing Looking for information on rebuilding an gen 4, if its similar enough to a gen 3 that most of this information is transferable and applies to a gen 4. Ive heard the gen 4 also has from thinner rods so this is one of the places to start when looking to rebuilding and improve.
@@absolutemag from what I've heard the gen 4 does have weaker rods, not sure why Toyota did that. Gen 2 and gen 3 had a beast of a connecting rod. We can get you a BC Rod which is a great upgrade and you can use your 3s crankshaft
My build is a 2.2L with CP 87mm piston Carillo rods and a 3rd gen head. Pistons are 11.5 Compression ratio. The question is what cams You recommend for this combination boosted high compression?
Hey Irving, unfortunately we dont recommend a high compression setup, reduces your reliability drastically. A nice .400 lift cam and about 272 duration is a great start! Any help you need you may email as well psiracing@aol.com
Hello, hard to determine. So much of that is based on tuning, you have to be careful I say after 350, piston is the weak link! Crank and rods are very strong!
Any advice on building a reliable 250-300hp all motor Redtop 3sge Beams? Have you guys done a Redtop 3sge? Is it attainable without breaking the bank? What parts are out there? Much appreciated.
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I still have a brand new gen 2 head in the box that I bought for my Darton Sleeved 3S build back in 2004. One day I’ll get around to putting it all together and be able to use it.
That's awesome! Amazing how nice they look, I have never seen one until this one we just did!
Think of all the turbulence in the 2nd gen head with the TVIS and intake ports! No wonder they won't have low end or top end power. Also add the CT26 turbo (90s turbo technology), and that original cast exhaust manifold. They tried to suppress turbo lag and that is nice, but there is still a lot of room to improve. You can also see how the gen 4 3SGTE is a culmination of all the lessons learned. The 4th gen is really how they should have shipped since 1990... :)
Correct, biggest drawback was that Ct turbo, those things were terrible
Hi Brandon my dad and I are huge fans of your work. I remember the first time at Atco.raceway. My dad was the guy taking the photos he still has a lot of those photos. Awesome video
Hey Javier, thank you for being a loyal fan. We hope to be back to Atco once we have our new car finished and revisit everyone up there. Lots of new stuff coming soon
My gen3 3s-ge was awesome. 170BHP in the Scottish highlands with a t-top.
Could have done with the turbo to pass caravans and motorhomes in the summer tho.
It was a somewhat frustrating car. It could corner so much quicker than everything on the road but as soon it got to a straight they'd all speed up to just under the speed limit. The MR2 didn't really have to the torque to pass uphill safely unless there was a good straight.
My Z4 is much more capable but less fun being front engined.
Luv and Peace.
Appreciate that! Turbo would of definitely given that edge needed in the straight!
I just got my gen 3 and I’m a complete 3S noob… I’ll be in touch for some pointers!! Great video!
hahahhaa no problem, we are here always.
That Gen2 head looks great. I also have converted to shimless buckets for my setup. For the head, technically, it is a Yamaha designed head...not Toyota. Also, a big difference between Gen2 and Gen3 is the EGR. I eliminated my EGR and now have smog pass issues here in CA. Finding an EGR bracket is tough.
Gen 2 heads are great heads, unfortunately u live in the strictest states for smog control.
@@RustBucketConnoisseur Hey sorry just seen this, Do you have the heads??
3S content? Subscribed.
I’ve got three of those engines myself.
1990 MR2 Turbo
1994 Celica GT4 WRC
Appreciate it, Best engines, lots of new content coming 2021
Subscribed as well. Great information. 3S die hard over here. Running Gens 2-4 in various Celica Alltracs. Underestimated the Gen 1 due to misinformation. Keep up the great work, Brandon!! 👊🏾
Thank you, yea most have no clue about gen 1
I’m going to do a 3sgte 4gen swap on my 7th 2002 gen celica gts, if only you were my Mechanic
Anyway we can help just let us know!
Do it!
Bro a good illustration in that video keep it up.
Thank you boss!
Hey it’s grizzle, you should do a nice comparison between the red top beams, blacktop and caldina heads. Good content btw
What's up man, there's so many variations there it's pretty crazy! As soon as I have more info I will!
Definitely subscribed for the 3S content. I've got three of them on hand; two Gen1s(my 58K ST165 and a spare drivetrain for it) and one Gen2(my SW20). Sounds like I don't have to swap if I don't want to. :)
Awesome and thank you, more 3s content is gonna explode soon!!
Subscribed... You made me wanna stick 3s... No more k swap plans... I believe these engines are underrated... even the top secret supra used the 3s in it at one point to beat the skyline...
Hey man, definitely no need to Kswap, we are bigtime against that lol! 3S is a unstoppable engine once the oiling system and correct block is used!
Ditch the K swap plans. 😎
@@psiracing which block and head would you consider to be the best combo?
@@mosesarchibaldjr3757 man that's a tricky question as far as cylinder head! Block 5S all the way, honestly all the heads are great!
@@psiracing thanks bro
I used 3sgte in 3 and my current daily driver for the past 16 years. 2 3rd gens and a 2nd gen. I want to push the envelope a bit, 98+ concrete coolant passages camry block, was curious about variations in head design.
5S block is definitely the way to go, we have used a gen 1, gen 2 and gen 3 on the 5s block no issues
@@psiracing is the gen 4 head the best for more streetable higher hp builds?
Brandon can you re edit the video of the starlet on the dyno and add voice over talking about the car like you did on this video. I saw it was uploaded 6 years ago so I am sure there are not much that is top secret any more. I would like to know the setup engine size stock or stroker its internals exhaust manifold intake manifold turbo size waste gate blow off. ecu transmission any other controllers for trans or boost rear end tire size maybe you can add build photos while narrating it . Since its powered by the 3s. Thanks. Happy holidays
Great Idea, will definitely do that!
+1 on this !!
Any flow numbers between a max effort of all 3 generations?
Weve been porting them for about 20 years, we flowed them many years ago but theres so many variables in customer applications that numbers can be thrown off so easily!
Awesome information and content
thanks Brian
great comparison , i run a gen 4 with BC springs , what you recon max boost (68mm comp ) i could run with a rpm limit of 9k , ive ran 40 psi but didnt seem a lot better than 35 but i did find my TB was loose after lol which may explain that
Yea theres alot of variables as to why it didnt feel like it didnt make anymore power. Maybe turbine housing is a bit on the small size!
@@psiracing im leaning towards an air leak , while im still T3 its a 1.05 ar hotside , i think once the bore is at over 2 bar the leak is probably the path of less resistance . will see next year now ive fixed the leak :) lol
@@richardprydden2851 definitely possible, when in doubt pressure check the system. I've seen areas leak that I would of promised didnt leak and were leaking! Goodluck!
Mr. Alvarez how are you? Is Kiko Cesar son. I'm building a Hyundai tiburon motor and I wanted to port the head. To see what's the damage and if you'll do it for me!!!!
Question does IMR to mother can go on a Toyota Corolla SR5
Sorry man, dont understand the question??
Nice comparison!
Can you run shimless lifters on the gen 3?
Yes You can, drop in
i have a gen2 3sgte mr2.. i have to buy new cams, i have shims ON bucket. Whats the best setup you recommend? i have big turbo, supporting mods, etc. Im thinking stage 3 camshafts from BC but i have to change to shimless buckets. Problem is, i live overseas. So adjusting and ordering is a problem. What do you reccomend
Email us and im sure we can help you out! Psiracing@aol.com
@@psiracing will do
Woudl like to see some gen4 3sgte stuff as that is popular. Street ported, what kind of gains are available from a mild port to that head, the differences from gen2 and 3 to the gen4. Thanks
Hey mike, from what I know and seen, gen 4 cylinder, port design is the exact same thing as gen 3? Gen 2 definitely different
@@psiracing from my untrained eye they looked similar, thanks for clarifying.
Interested to see your opinion on the gen 4 head!
Also could you grind the bottle neck down at all? Seems like there's still a fair bit of material there
We have done a few gen 4 cylinder heads, when you refer to gen 4 do you mean caldina or Beams black?
We have experimented with the bottle on a non usable head and there isnt much room before you get into trouble.
3 & 4gen ports velocity is practically the same.
Hey watching your videos i have a 5th gen 3sge altezza engine want to turbo charge it safely for street not no heavy power ..what are my options
Really depends how involved in the build you would want to get. Would definitely recommend a good rod and piston. Crank can handle whatever you want to throw at it
Do you guys have much if any experience with Gen 4 heads (Caldina GTT) and where the best performance gains are. Good build info and upgrade parts on these is hard to come by.
Yes we have built a couple gen 4 caldina heads. What info are you looking for, they're very similar to the gen 3
@@psiracing Looking for information on rebuilding an gen 4, if its similar enough to a gen 3 that most of this information is transferable and applies to a gen 4. Ive heard the gen 4 also has from thinner rods so this is one of the places to start when looking to rebuilding and improve.
@@absolutemag from what I've heard the gen 4 does have weaker rods, not sure why Toyota did that. Gen 2 and gen 3 had a beast of a connecting rod. We can get you a BC Rod which is a great upgrade and you can use your 3s crankshaft
Gen4 Black top BEAMS. Can this 3s share parts with the GEN 2 & 3? If so can your valve springs work in the SXE10 GEN4 head?
When you say black top beams is it from a 3sgte or do you mean 3sge??
@@psiracing 3sge.
My build is a 2.2L with CP 87mm piston Carillo rods and a 3rd gen head. Pistons are 11.5 Compression ratio. The question is what cams You recommend for this combination boosted high compression?
Hey Irving, unfortunately we dont recommend a high compression setup, reduces your reliability drastically. A nice .400 lift cam and about 272 duration is a great start! Any help you need you may email as well psiracing@aol.com
PSI Racing what you means .400 lift ? How much it is in mm ?
@@irvingrivera414 .400 lift would be about 10mm
Can the 3sgte gen4 head work with the 3sge block? If so which one and and disadvantage?
Unfortunately cant answer that, we only use 5s blocks on all of our builds
What grade aluminum alloy is 3sgte cylinder head is it 6061 or 6062 ??
With them being cast you honestly got me. There is many different grades they can use in the casting process
@@psiracing for repairing gap on the exhaust housing portion of the cylinder head can I use 4043 filler rod ??
have you all ever looked at the 3sge head that uses acis induction ,would this be a good candidaate to use in a boost conversion?
Hey Kevin, the 1st gen 3sge head is our favorite, is that the head you are referring to??
2/3rz head porting and re-shimming?
We actually just did one now for a customer in hawaii! I'll put a video together for you as well
How do I get in touch with u guys to build a gen3 head ? I’m from the Caribbean
Have you got any experience with GATO performance full billet intakes yet?
Unfortunately we don't, Gato makes great stuff but we are working on having our own billet parts
bula, great video. love the content. cheers
Thank you very much, lots more to come
What springs are you used on a gen 1 head 3 sge ?
We source them from our supplier
That head btw 🙌🏽🙌🏽
Pretty wicked right!
Have you had any experience with the Beams head
Not much but we do have 1 that we may put into our drag program
How much boost max the 3rd gen manage before internal
Hello, hard to determine. So much of that is based on tuning, you have to be careful I say after 350, piston is the weak link! Crank and rods are very strong!
Any advice on building a reliable 250-300hp all motor Redtop 3sge Beams? Have you guys done a Redtop 3sge? Is it attainable without breaking the bank? What parts are out there? Much appreciated.
We may have done a red top, Hard to confirm what customers sometimes cause of so many different variations.
@@psiracing okay cool. I guess I’ll give you guys a call to get some specifics.
Any difference in gen4 n gen 2 bottom block
Dimensions are the same but I would say the gen 4 block is a bit stronger then gen 2. We dont run any 3s blocks, only 5S
What would be the cost of a fully built gen3 head ?
Lots of variables in pricing, you can email us and we can go over it! Psiracing@aol.com thank you!
Where are you guys based?
What power/boost level do you guys go to 5s blocks?
We have ran 60psi and over 1400hp on a fully cemented block!