Maybe the scientist of that time didn't know about the earth orbit is in elleptical path and this also could be the reason for the change in interval of time for stars circular rotation and jupiters moon rotation period. Which means why we thought light to be travelling still has no base for it.
@@AbhayKumar-um8vl It demod that light IS traveling, and that was possible w/o great accuracies. Lol, we dont today depend upon 18th century observation to determine whether or not light is traveling. The discrepancy was that in the 17th century they didnt have a very accurate figure for our distance from the sun. Btw, earths orbit is VERY circular. The minor axis is only about 1/7000ths shorter than the major. That fact makes so the earth varies (in distance from the sun) by only about 3.3%
You will be surprised that combined with Newton-Laplace formula for a wave speed in any medium, it solves gravity - no more GR needed. Read 2-page chapter 92 in "Time Matters, 9th edition": gravity (acceleration g) is directly related to time dilation D (and nothing else) g = -(0.5c²/D²)' ≈ c²×D' ~ ∇D - formula from that book back-cover.
they do that so your brain is distracted by irritating music so their garbage enter your memory by passing your critical sensors which discriminate between some thing useful and their crap.Ferydoon Shirazi. MG1
Thanks for the wonderful video, and a huge thanks for not ruining it with crappy background music. I don't know why some people are compelled to add annoying background music throughout their videos. I always let content creators know that I didn't watch their vid because of an added soundtrack. It's constructive criticism, not bichin.
Just letting you know I am currently working on a follow up to this video with more recent experiments on determining the speed of the light. Stay tuned
Worth mentioning : XVIIth century judge Fermat (of famous math conjecture fame) had the intuition that light takes the shortest route in TIME between A and B. This implies a finite speed. From this principle, Descartes and Snell independantly derived the law of refraction, fundamental to lens design.
My high school physics teacher explained Foucault's method to me in 1983, and it was my first experience of finding out that something that seemed unknowable to mere mortals like me was actually a simple matter to explain and understand. I had that same experience again as an undergrad when I asked my biology prof how we knew about transmembrane cell proteins. (The amount we seemed to know about molecular cell structure baffled me.) In about one minute he explained freeze-fracturing to me. It was so simple! So I went into research. I think people might be surprised how much they can understand if they just have the confidence to ask, and if they ask someone who is good at explaining things. Kids, ask your teachers how we know the things they are teaching! (But don't be a snot about it... that won't help.)
@@ptgr12 People who have dedicated their lives to studying this stuff over the past few centuries, and who know a lot more about it than you do, overwhelmingly disagree that it's all incorrect. Odd are that there's something about this that you don't understand. That's the most likely explanation for your outlier opinion. You could be right, of course, but I think it's exceedingly unlikely.
Jesus Christ. You believe it? Isn’t that the one with the beam travelling 8 kms before electricity was even a thing? Did you hear that? Process it? It’s like you’re all brain dead.
@@ptgr12 Common sense is never common (varies by cultural & personal differences), and it is not useful as evidence. So far the only case you've made is that your brain worked this out in a certain way that makes sense to you, but no one else. But you're 100% right. Science doesn't work that way. Maybe science isn't your thing?
Hi Paul, thanks for another fantastic video! I think there is a slight error in your explanation of Romer's data... the apparent period should depend on the relative velocity of Jupiter/Io and Earth, not upon their distances (as suggested at 3:05). This would mean the apparent period is larger when earth is moving from J to K, and smaller from F to G. Consider: if Earth were *stationary* at K, the apparent period would = true period, despite light taking longer to travel a greater distance. It seems analogous to the Doppler effect: when source and observer are moving apart, the apparent f decreases (hence apparent T increases)
@@PhysicsHigh This part of your explanation bothered me too. I'm not sure if the changing relative velocities between earth and Jupiter were enough to account for a large enough time difference - it's not difficult to do the math and check what that time difference would be, so I could be wrong. But a simpler interpretation of the story doesn't require this: If we assume Roemer established the approximate period over several measurements taken while Earth and Jupiter were closer to each other, all he had to do was mark his calender at equal intervals into the future (with each interval being the period he observed) and then look at Jupiter when those times came. So if for example the measured period was 45 hours, he'd mark his calender at 45 hours in the future, 90 hours in the future, 135 hours etc. for several months ahead. If he came back and checked he'd discover that for the near future his predictions were reasonably accurate, but later in the year they were several minutes too early. Similarly if he started out determining the period when Earth and Jupiter were far apart and then marked his calender at equal intervals he'd find that after a few months those predictions were too late. This seems to me like a reasonable interpretation of what happened, based on the familiar points of the story. Edit: also @14:55 please correct your units. The first number should be in m/s.
Excellent presentation! Easily one of the best I've seen on the subject. I'm just a hack layman on physics, but I do relish videos like this. Thanks a million!
Thank you for great video. We learned about the early scientists at school, and I was amazed, and still am, at the intellect and the determination of Rømer, Bradley and Fizeau, and many others, using basic astronomical equipment etc. I mean, if I'm correct, Fizeau's mirror was five and a half miles away, and he was using something like an oil lamp or a candle. I know there was not a lot of light pollution in thise days, but still!
My first thought was about the attempt to measure the “aether” by Michaelson and Morley. I also thought of the slit experiment which shows that light behaves like both a wave and a particle. That always fascinates me.
It's appreciated that this is a history/basic concept video , yet an introduction to the measurement being relative to Earth normal space with time dilation would be appropriate.
4 ปีที่แล้ว +8
Good watch after videos about the Maxwell's equations and his realisation that light is but an electromagnetic wave.
Except the speed of light c is really the average speed over a round-trip journey, and we cannot be certain that the speed is the same in both directions.
The real reason is as fallows. As the Earth and Jupiter move in their orbits there are periods when the distance between them becomes smaller, they are closing to each other, and there are periods where the distance becomes larger and larger. In both situations you see Io starts an eclipse and measures the time when it is visible again. In the first situation the light had to travel a shorter distance that in the second situation, so the eclipse is "shorter" than when the planets are moving away from each other. So the important factor is the relative movement between Earth and Jupiter.
In an episode of the television series Bonanza ("Look to the Stars", broadcast March 18, 1962), Ben Cartwright (Lorne Greene) helps the 16-year-old Michelson (portrayed by 25-year-old Douglas Lambert (1936-1986)) obtain an appointment to the U.S. Naval Academy, despite the opposition of the bigoted town schoolteacher (played by William Schallert). Bonanza was set in and around Virginia City, Nevada, where Michelson lived with his parents prior to leaving for the Naval Academy. In a voice-over at the end of the episode, Greene mentions Michelson's 1907 Nobel Prize. I remember this one. A cowboy show with physics!
The speed of light was a theoretical thing in those days. Nothing to do with everyday life. Now, the speed of light is factored into z lot of technology we use every day.
8:17 what "light source" is he shining 8.6km and back in 1851 to bounce off a mirror and still be fine enough to measure thru the tooth of a cog? Nothing adds up about the details of the Fizeau experiment.
This video is such a good explanation that you appreciate the genius of the scientists who study nature and become more aware of our universe. Now if we could have an explanation of quantum entanglement and quantum measurement like this, that would be brilliant. But the finest minds are still pondering what quantum mechanics means.
2:53 How did that affect the period? It would affect when they occurred in some absolute clock but not the period*. In fact the idea was to create such an absolute clock independent of earth's rotation for navigational purposes. Finding the speed of te light was a side effect. * now of course there has to be a tiny effect on the period but it is way way too small to detect. It is like if a clock is one second too fast a day you cannot detect it during a minute, but wait 30 days and you will detect it as the minute changes at a different time.
The explanation in the video misses the mark. To an observer on earth it is the time BETWEEN eclipses that changes. The duration of each eclipse remains constant, as you and Galileo made clear.
@@colt4667 Right, What kind of time instrument could record a speed of 186,000 per second at a distance of 8,630 meters...? That would be in the 1,000ths of a second a if not 10,000ths or 100,000ths.... I don't believe anything...! LOL
It astounds me that back in the horse-and-cart days, before steam engines, before electricity, when timepieces were mechanical, that there were people with imagination so bold that they would set about to determine the speed of light.
I have a couple of questions: how did fizeau determine the rotating speed of his wheel and how did he maintain a constant speed without an electric motor?
Excellent video, thank you, I now have a better understanding of the history. An interesting consequence of a finite speed of light; as demonstrated by Olaf Romer, the observed orbital period of Io slows down while Earth moves away from Jupiter (i.e. from L to K in the diagram at approximately 3 minutes in). It is interesting because, in an expanding universe, distant galaxies are apparently moving away with a recessional velocity dependent on the distance from the observer. Therefore the further away the galaxy the slower the observed rotational velocity relative to its actual rotational velocity. At the Hubble Sphere (HS), the galaxies should appear stationary. Galaxies beyond the HS should appear to rotate in reverse time order; if the recessional velocity is a real movement. I conclude that the movement is fictitious and that the redshift-to-distance relationship is due to a cosmological dilation of relative clock time over absolute time whose rate of change is inversely proportionate to one another. This produces a scalar model where time and distance change interdependently, keeping the speed of light and other constants of nature constant as the universe evolves. I would love to discuss this with someone better qualified as it may explain the nature of dark energy, and dark matter, and why we are seeing the most distant galaxies with the JWST that appear too mature for our current theories.
This is fascinating. Have no idea if all is true or accurate...but really curious who is giving this a thumbs down...but more importantly...why? Is the info not good? Do they not like this guy? His presentation? What? I've never thought of this question before...but find this a great place for me to start.
Curiously, if you take the speed of light at 299,792,458 m/s and perform gematria on the number triplets the result equals 1. 2+9+9=20, 2+0=2. 7+9+2=18, 1+8=9. 4+5+8=17, 1+7=8. 2+9+8=19, 1+9=10, 1+0=1. If we perform gematria on the whole number the result is magic number 9. Add 9 for the whole number and 1 for the triplets and we get 10 which adds back to one. Don't know what any of this means but there is music in that number.
I love this video. I imagine the series is very interesting. Thank you for doing this. I have a question about Romer's experiment. I'm pretty sure that the difference in time was about 35 seconds, but NOT longer at K and F than at L and G. Rather, L and K were about the same and F and G were about the same; however, L and K were about 35 seconds longer than F and G. This would be because on the F and G side the Earth was speeding TOWARD Jupiter while on the L and K side Earth was speeding AWAY from Jupiter. The 45-hour orbit allowed the Earth to cover about 2 degrees of the Earth's orbit, which is a significant distance--requiring about 17 seconds of time for light to travel. So on the F and G side the 45 hours is 17 seconds shorter; on the L and K side the 45 hours is 17 seconds longer.
14:54:..... this align so much with the speed of light (events) that Maxwell could state light was a form o electromagnetic wave! To me, in this resides the greatness of this video! Thanks!!
The celestial and planetary experiments don't appear to factor in the movement of our solar system through space (~500k mph), or the motion of the stars either. With those factors taken into consideration, the actual distances involved would be different, greater or perhaps less, depending on the relative direction of travel.
About a year ago, I saw a TH-cam video saying that because of the new way of measuring the Speed of Light, we wouldn't know if it changed. Can we detect any change?
2:33 Hi, Please if you have a minute: why around H, Jupiter would get in the way? Doesn't its natural satellite end up on one side or the other of the orbit where it is visible again?
Why wasn't physics as interesting as this when I was at school?, or maybe a better way to put it is, why were the physics teachers I had at school, so crap?
Yes. I have already quite a few videos for module 7. See the playlist, but there is more in development too. Make sure you are subscribed and click the bell. Thanks for the encouragement and share with your peers
Has anyone measured the 1 way TOF for light? Also, how does relativity play into it and... in the 2 way TOF, is the return speed the same as the send speed? Essentially , how do we Actually know if the speed remains constant between send and return?
The celestial and planetary experiments don't appear to factor in the movement of our solar system through space (~500k mph), or the motion of the stars either. With those factors taken into consideration, the distances would be greater.
Michelson spent much of his career measuring the speed of light. In 1927 he measured the speed by sending a beam from Mount Wilson in California to Mount San Antonio, 35 km away, and back. The result was accurate to just over 1 part in 100,000
Excellent video, thank you! I have a question : James’ method demonstrates the speed of light is relative to earth’s motion. If every two years or two turns, the angle will be twice. If the reference frame is on earth, the light speed c, will be a function of the speed of earth. Why we think the speed of the light is considered as constant regardless of reference frame?
How does different positions of earths orbit produce different periods for io? Although light takes longer to travel, this will just delay when we first see the moon (start of period) and when it finishes its orbit (end of period). But won’t the duration of the period itself remain constant ?
Erick + You are right. A lot of YT videos give the same reasoning that this one, but there are videos where they give the correct reasoning. As the Earth and Jupiter move in their orbits there are periods when the distance between them becomes smaller, they are closing to each other, and there are periods where the distance becomes larger and larger. In both situations you see Io starts an eclipse and measures the time when it is visible again. In the first situation the light had to travel a shorter distance that in the second situation, so the eclipse is "shorter" than when the planets are moving away each other. So the important factor is the relative movement between Earth and Jupiter.
I kinda understand and get how mechanical waves move forward but how does light or any electromagnetic wave move? Or what does make it move and with that kind of velocity? All from that I’m just blown away with this universe🤯 WOW
It moves because a change in the electric field causes a change in the magnetic field, that change in the magnetic field then causes a change in the electric field and so on. The rate of change of of the electric field is determined by the universal constant the permittivity of free space, and the rate of change of the magnetic field is determined by the universal constant the permeability of free space, together they determine the speed at which light travels. No one knows why free space has these values, it just does.
Great video. But what happens if it turns out that light travels at different speeds coming back from the mirror to that going towards the mirror? These measurements assume that the speed is constant in both directions, and measures the average speed!?
Major issue I have with topic. Does the light travel that fast or is it the speed of illumination that travels that fast. Light must have a certain value of power, strength or intensity. Does this mean the speed of light is variable, but the speed of illumination is the same. Speed of lght using planets is not scientific. Is the universe not expanding? How do they have exact distance to planets?
When I watch this program I understand the great minds and brain power that these individuals possess. These are truly remarkable individuals and they were working from the foundation that was laying down thousands and thousands of years ago by their ancestors. And when I say Foundation I mean genetically.
Nice video... thanks for your effort... I did not know the period of IO was so short... ~45h Nevertheless the period observed should be the same... if the observer are closer... or distant from Jupiter... I can only see how this values would be of a perceptible magnitude... if there was a significant distance difference between the start and the end of the observation of a IO period (not only ~45min) The ~80º arc or Earth orbit you mention between points in Ole Romer diagram is done in roughly 3 months,,, About: c=2L/t of Fizeau t=2L/c of Foucault Could you please elaborate on why 'c' was chosen for the name?
@MichaelKingsfordGray Accelerate comes from the Latin word 'accelerarre' which is derived from the Latin words 'ad' (meaining 'towards') and 'celere' (meaning 'swift'), so the literal meaning is 'to move towards swiftness'.
at 3:10 there is a glitch in the argument? because the measured orbit time is independent of the distance - it depends on the speed of earth relative to jupiter. therefore it appears shorter between F and G, longer between L and K
and delay in second experiment is also because earth is having elleptical path . so it would take longer time in one part of orbit and small amount of time in other part of orbit which seems as delay of light reaching
Ponder this: let's say you have a lever with a distance of 8 light minutes in length (about the distance from Earth to the Sun). The opposite end of you pivots. If you move (assuming inertia is overtaked) the lever for 10 seconds. The wave is 10×c ≈ length traveling light speed to the pivotal point?
@@schmetterling4477 l did some research on this. I think your right. The distance from the sun on average is 94,343,000 miles. The speed of sound through iron is 767.269 miles per hour. With a wave length about 32 miles, it will take about 14 years for the movement to complete. Hahaha
Hi sir. For this dot point in our syllabus, how much maths do we need to know? Or do we just need to understand the concept? I will wait for you reply Thanks Sir
I am not the exam committee so I can’t guarantee everything but my decades experience tells me, no you’re very unlikely to get a maths question on this this outcome (we don’t refers to them as dot points anymore). What I would say is that you should be familiar with a number of historical examples of light speed determination. Also you should be able to discuss how science works - the prediction of light as a wave with a finite speed and the experiments that validate that model, and how each experiment, with increasing precision leads to increasing accuracy. Note how I use the terms. Hope that clarifies. You ask a good question that deserves a longer answer.
For his experiment, Michelson built a hollow tube about a meter in diameter and about a mile long in what is now Irvine, California. It's part of the history of Southern California.
Sometimes nothing make sense. Went to see photon matter interaction, i couldn't understand so many terms. It seemed interesting tho. Wikipedia pages are sometimes very confusing. Which book should i start with for quantum mechanics, any idea? I am familiar with basic quantum theory and calculus.
Thank you for the video. However, I'd like to share some important fact at 14:45 if I may. James Clerk Maxwell wasn't calculating the speed of light. He was calculating the speed of how the 'elecrto-magnetic' force is propagating throughout space according to his new-born theory. It was only after he came up with the result and compared it to what was already known, and this way, he become the first man on planet Earth to realise and undarstand that light is 'just' electro-magnetic force. It must have been an important day in his life.
Fizeau needed the RPS of the toothed wheel to calculate the speed of light. If the wheel were turning at 12.6 RPS that's 756 RPM. How was he able to measure the RPS in 1851? Any inaccuracy would be a huge source of error.
Light has a constant speed in vacuum of space, and a different constant speed in water etc. So, a light coming from a car standing still is same speed as light from a car that is moving, because also in the atmosphere lightspeed is a constant?
What powers light...I mean if I switch on a torch that light shoots out at 186.000 miles per second..something pushes light at that speed...so what is it?????...just wondering
Thats the frequency needed to block the returning light. During the experiment, they started out with a low frequency so that the light has time to return through the gaps. As the frequency increases, the returning light gets more and more flickering, and eventually at 12,6 Hz there is no returning light getting through the gaps....I think.
The "and then he calculated the frequency" bit is disappointing, frequency of what? How? How did they know when the light was passing through the gap but hitting a tooth? How did they know when light just hit the tooth outbound?
Why do we pretend the speed of light is a constant when even in a vacuum in the best conditions we have access to the actual number calculated varies drastically?
One problem here is that the metric system was adopted during the French Revolution. Since the correct speed of light was not know then the definition of a meter must have been different than today.
This is an inaccurate description of Roemer’s method. The starting time of the eclipse occurs earlier than expected as Earth is moving towards Jupiter and later than expected as Earth is moving away. He relied on long-term observations to get the mean time accurately, which is necessary to show the pattern.
You are correct sir. Between points L and K, the Earth is moving away from Jupiter. Between points F and G the Earth is moving toward Jupiter. The discrepancies are caused by the Earth being either further away from Jupiter, or closer to Jupiter, at the second (end) observation of Io's orbital cycle, than it was at the first (start) observation, depending on whether the Earth is between points L and K, or between points F and G at the time of the observations. I suspect that the "High School Physics Explained" doesn't fully understand the concept.
Thank you for this video, the observation on its inaccuracy & the ensuing correction. Having just listened to an overview of this experiment I chose this video to learn more & found myself questioning what I thought I'd learnt. My faith in my initial understanding & that of teachers & youtube commentators has been restored.
So the hippolyte gear test worked by testing frequencies of moving the cog until the light passed theough the cog but did not come back. How did he confirm this though?
I’m sorry but the first explanation about Ole Romer’s observations are a little bit misleading: even when observing from really far the period would me almost the same. But adding up these intervals would seem a bit late comparing to observations when earth is moving away and a bit early when approaching again.
Just a note to say thank you! This was a great video. Have subscribed. Keep up the excellent work!.
Thanks Daniel
Maybe the scientist of that time didn't know about the earth orbit is in elleptical path and this also could be the reason for the change in interval of time for stars circular rotation and jupiters moon rotation period.
Which means why we thought light to be travelling still has no base for it.
@@PhysicsHigh llllllĺĺllllĺllllll2
@@AbhayKumar-um8vl It demod that light IS traveling, and that was possible w/o great accuracies.
Lol, we dont today depend upon 18th century observation to determine whether or not light is traveling.
The discrepancy was that in the 17th century they didnt have a very accurate figure for our distance from the sun.
Btw, earths orbit is VERY circular. The minor axis is only about 1/7000ths shorter than the major. That fact makes so the earth varies (in distance from the sun) by only about 3.3%
You will be surprised that combined with Newton-Laplace formula for a wave speed in any medium, it solves gravity - no more GR needed. Read 2-page chapter 92 in "Time Matters, 9th edition": gravity (acceleration g) is directly related to time dilation D (and nothing else) g = -(0.5c²/D²)' ≈ c²×D' ~ ∇D - formula from that book back-cover.
Thanks for not disturbing your interesting story with background music.
they do that so your brain is distracted by irritating music so their garbage enter your memory by passing your critical sensors which discriminate between some thing useful and their crap.Ferydoon Shirazi. MG1
Amen...!
@@primemagithat's not why we do it tho 😅
The music is added to combine it all together and hide for example background noise.
@@MrSorbiasIt makes videos impossible to endure - such a shame when the content is otherwise good. (Dot)
Thanks for the wonderful video, and a huge thanks for not ruining it with crappy background music.
I don't know why some people are compelled to add annoying background music throughout their videos.
I always let content creators know that I didn't watch their vid because of an added soundtrack. It's constructive criticism, not bichin.
Just letting you know I am currently working on a follow up to this video with more recent experiments on determining the speed of the light. Stay tuned
Both follow up videos have now been released. Check the descriptions or end screens
Great! I'll do that. Thank you. Best Regards Dan.
Well, whoever built the great pyramids of gezza, knew the exact speed of light.
And also the meter.
Timestamps for each speed of light experiment
Ole Romer 1:04
James Bradly 5:12
Hippolyte Fizeau 7:53
Leon Focault 12:15
Vedas said first
Thanks
A fabulously clear explanation of how Roemer calculated the speed of light! Worth it for that alone! Ty
Worth mentioning : XVIIth century judge Fermat (of famous math conjecture fame) had the intuition that light takes the shortest route in TIME between A and B. This implies a finite speed. From this principle, Descartes and Snell independantly derived the law of refraction, fundamental to lens design.
My high school physics teacher explained Foucault's method to me in 1983, and it was my first experience of finding out that something that seemed unknowable to mere mortals like me was actually a simple matter to explain and understand. I had that same experience again as an undergrad when I asked my biology prof how we knew about transmembrane cell proteins. (The amount we seemed to know about molecular cell structure baffled me.) In about one minute he explained freeze-fracturing to me. It was so simple! So I went into research.
I think people might be surprised how much they can understand if they just have the confidence to ask, and if they ask someone who is good at explaining things. Kids, ask your teachers how we know the things they are teaching! (But don't be a snot about it... that won't help.)
It’s all incorrect knowledge, and should be retracted. Roemer would never witness a delay in anything, because he was using a telescope.
@@ptgr12 People who have dedicated their lives to studying this stuff over the past few centuries, and who know a lot more about it than you do, overwhelmingly disagree that it's all incorrect. Odd are that there's something about this that you don't understand. That's the most likely explanation for your outlier opinion. You could be right, of course, but I think it's exceedingly unlikely.
Jesus Christ. You believe it? Isn’t that the one with the beam travelling 8 kms before electricity was even a thing? Did you hear that? Process it? It’s like you’re all brain dead.
@@beenaplumber8379 I am right. 100%, and all it takes is a little common sense, which is something lacking everywhere. Obviously.
@@ptgr12 Common sense is never common (varies by cultural & personal differences), and it is not useful as evidence. So far the only case you've made is that your brain worked this out in a certain way that makes sense to you, but no one else. But you're 100% right. Science doesn't work that way. Maybe science isn't your thing?
Wow. At age 65, I am suddenly a high school student studying a subject that teenaged-me dismissed as boring. Thanks for that!
This is amazing! This video definitely deserves more views! Thank you.
Hi Paul, thanks for another fantastic video! I think there is a slight error in your explanation of Romer's data... the apparent period should depend on the relative velocity of Jupiter/Io and Earth, not upon their distances (as suggested at 3:05). This would mean the apparent period is larger when earth is moving from J to K, and smaller from F to G. Consider: if Earth were *stationary* at K, the apparent period would = true period, despite light taking longer to travel a greater distance. It seems analogous to the Doppler effect: when source and observer are moving apart, the apparent f decreases (hence apparent T increases)
Thanks Alex. I stand corrected.
@@PhysicsHigh This part of your explanation bothered me too.
I'm not sure if the changing relative velocities between earth and Jupiter were enough to account for a large enough time difference - it's not difficult to do the math and check what that time difference would be, so I could be wrong.
But a simpler interpretation of the story doesn't require this: If we assume Roemer established the approximate period over several measurements taken while Earth and Jupiter were closer to each other, all he had to do was mark his calender at equal intervals into the future (with each interval being the period he observed) and then look at Jupiter when those times came.
So if for example the measured period was 45 hours, he'd mark his calender at 45 hours in the future, 90 hours in the future, 135 hours etc. for several months ahead.
If he came back and checked he'd discover that for the near future his predictions were reasonably accurate, but later in the year they were several minutes too early.
Similarly if he started out determining the period when Earth and Jupiter were far apart and then marked his calender at equal intervals he'd find that after a few months those predictions were too late.
This seems to me like a reasonable interpretation of what happened, based on the familiar points of the story.
Edit: also @14:55 please correct your units. The first number should be in m/s.
...and I am working on a fix.
Here is my correction: th-cam.com/video/TAIlswch5d0/w-d-xo.html
THANK YOU SO MUCH I WAS SO CONFUSED AS TO HOW HIS EXPLANATION WOULD HAVE WORKED
This video deserves more attention. You guys really helped me with my uni report on thr measurment of light speed
This is an amazing channel
Thanks
Excellent presentation! Easily one of the best I've seen on the subject. I'm just a hack layman on physics, but I do relish videos like this. Thanks a million!
That’s great feedback. Thanks. I do hope you share.
Thank you for great video. We learned about the early scientists at school, and I was amazed, and still am, at the intellect and the determination of Rømer, Bradley and Fizeau, and many others, using basic astronomical equipment etc. I mean, if I'm correct, Fizeau's mirror was five and a half miles away, and he was using something like an oil lamp or a candle. I know there was not a lot of light pollution in thise days, but still!
My first thought was about the attempt to measure the “aether” by Michaelson and Morley. I also thought of the slit experiment which shows that light behaves like both a wave and a particle. That always fascinates me.
It's appreciated that this is a history/basic concept video , yet an introduction to the measurement being relative to Earth normal space with time dilation would be appropriate.
Good watch after videos about the Maxwell's equations and his realisation that light is but an electromagnetic wave.
Except the speed of light c is really the average speed over a round-trip journey, and we cannot be certain that the speed is the same in both directions.
Excellent! A bit closer to understanding the speed of light! Thank you!. Absolutely fantastic! Thank you so much. Keep them coming..
jUST CONTENT!!!! nO ADS??? I have GOT to support you good sir.!!
The real reason is as fallows. As the Earth and Jupiter move in their orbits there are periods when the distance between them becomes smaller, they are closing to each other, and there are periods where the distance becomes larger and larger. In both situations you see Io starts an eclipse and measures the time when it is visible again. In the first situation the light had to travel a shorter distance that in the second situation, so the eclipse is "shorter" than when the planets are moving away from each other. So the important factor is the relative movement between Earth and Jupiter.
Exactly right
Such a fundamental mistake seriously reduces the credibility of the video.
Excellent video. Subscribed!
In an episode of the television series Bonanza ("Look to the Stars", broadcast March 18, 1962), Ben Cartwright (Lorne Greene) helps the 16-year-old Michelson (portrayed by 25-year-old Douglas Lambert (1936-1986)) obtain an appointment to the U.S. Naval Academy, despite the opposition of the bigoted town schoolteacher (played by William Schallert). Bonanza was set in and around Virginia City, Nevada, where Michelson lived with his parents prior to leaving for the Naval Academy. In a voice-over at the end of the episode, Greene mentions Michelson's 1907 Nobel Prize.
I remember this one. A cowboy show with physics!
The speed of light was a theoretical thing in those days. Nothing to do with everyday life. Now, the speed of light is factored into z lot of technology we use every day.
@@daleeasternbrat816 I know that!
How does being further away from IO make the period appear longer? Wouldn't the start of the period be delayed just as much as the end of the period?
Exactly right
Did you see my errata?
8:17 what "light source" is he shining 8.6km and back in 1851 to bounce off a mirror and still be fine enough to measure thru the tooth of a cog? Nothing adds up about the details of the Fizeau experiment.
excellent video, thank you for investing your time and effort on this. I am sure that with time this will become a very popular channel.
Thanks. Hope so
This video is such a good explanation that you appreciate the genius of the scientists who study nature and become more aware of our universe. Now if we could have an explanation of quantum entanglement and quantum measurement like this, that would be brilliant. But the finest minds are still pondering what quantum mechanics means.
WOWWWWWW!!!!!!!! This was brilliant !!!!!!!!!!! Thank you. Excellent explanation !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks!!!!
Suggestion. Please put captions. It was kinda hard to hear the names of the scientist you mentioned.
Its simple ele vara#$&*"&eee
Captions are available - you just click the caption icon
click the little "cc" button in the lower right of the video screen.
A simple way to test the speed of light is to try and open the refrigerator door before the light comes on.
It's actually faster because it's cooled. And everyone knows light travels faster in a vacuum cleaner and a refrigerator.
So if I open my fridge I could somehow deduce the exact speed of light? Lol
Or hit the light switch and be in bed before it gets dark.
Get through the road junction before you see the red light.
2:53 How did that affect the period? It would affect when they occurred in some absolute clock but not the period*. In fact the idea was to create such an absolute clock independent of earth's rotation for navigational purposes. Finding the speed of te light was a side effect.
* now of course there has to be a tiny effect on the period but it is way way too small to detect. It is like if a clock is one second too fast a day you cannot detect it during a minute, but wait 30 days and you will detect it as the minute changes at a different time.
The explanation in the video misses the mark. To an observer on earth it is the time BETWEEN eclipses that changes. The duration of each eclipse remains constant, as you and Galileo made clear.
Excellent! A bit closer to understanding the speed of light! Thank you!
How did Fizeau set up a 4,315 meter experiment? what was the light source? what produced the constant rotation of the cog?
Good questions, Nick. And how were the revs per second of the wheel measured with accuracy?
@@colt4667 Right, What kind of time instrument could record a speed of 186,000 per second at a distance of 8,630 meters...?
That would be in the 1,000ths of a second a if not 10,000ths or 100,000ths....
I don't believe anything...! LOL
Excellent! A fine blend of mathematics and ordinary human language. Well done! I quickly subsccribed.
Light-Speed is measured by the around trip a+b=c.
Take away "a" light speed speed will change.
Found a small mistake:
At 14:54
It's 299,792,472 m/s
not km/s.
Otherwise, awesome video! I want to thank you for it!
It astounds me that back in the horse-and-cart days, before steam engines, before electricity, when timepieces were mechanical, that there were people with imagination so bold that they would set about to determine the speed of light.
Our teacher loves to use your videos
Good job. Very nice explanations. You provide the right insight without going into much detail.
I have a couple of questions: how did fizeau determine the rotating speed of his wheel and how did he maintain a constant speed without an electric motor?
It's all Bullsh!t....!
And what was use as a source of light at that time....?
Wonderful content. Thank you very much for great video.
Excellent video, thank you, I now have a better understanding of the history. An interesting consequence of a finite speed of light; as demonstrated by Olaf Romer, the observed orbital period of Io slows down while Earth moves away from Jupiter (i.e. from L to K in the diagram at approximately 3 minutes in). It is interesting because, in an expanding universe, distant galaxies are apparently moving away with a recessional velocity dependent on the distance from the observer. Therefore the further away the galaxy the slower the observed rotational velocity relative to its actual rotational velocity. At the Hubble Sphere (HS), the galaxies should appear stationary. Galaxies beyond the HS should appear to rotate in reverse time order; if the recessional velocity is a real movement. I conclude that the movement is fictitious and that the redshift-to-distance relationship is due to a cosmological dilation of relative clock time over absolute time whose rate of change is inversely proportionate to one another. This produces a scalar model where time and distance change interdependently, keeping the speed of light and other constants of nature constant as the universe evolves. I would love to discuss this with someone better qualified as it may explain the nature of dark energy, and dark matter, and why we are seeing the most distant galaxies with the JWST that appear too mature for our current theories.
Good explanation and genius experimenter
Wonderful. Subscribed immediately
Awesome, thank you!
This is fascinating. Have no idea if all is true or accurate...but really curious who is giving this a thumbs down...but more importantly...why?
Is the info not good? Do they not like this guy? His presentation? What?
I've never thought of this question before...but find this a great place for me to start.
thanks for the support
Curiously, if you take the speed of light at 299,792,458 m/s and perform gematria on the number triplets the result equals 1. 2+9+9=20, 2+0=2. 7+9+2=18, 1+8=9. 4+5+8=17, 1+7=8. 2+9+8=19, 1+9=10, 1+0=1. If we perform gematria on the whole number the result is magic number 9. Add 9 for the whole number and 1 for the triplets and we get 10 which adds back to one. Don't know what any of this means but there is music in that number.
That's meaningless.
I love this video. I imagine the series is very interesting. Thank you for doing this.
I have a question about Romer's experiment. I'm pretty sure that the difference in time was about 35 seconds, but NOT longer at K and F than at L and G. Rather, L and K were about the same and F and G were about the same; however, L and K were about 35 seconds longer than F and G. This would be because on the F and G side the Earth was speeding TOWARD Jupiter while on the L and K side Earth was speeding AWAY from Jupiter. The 45-hour orbit allowed the Earth to cover about 2 degrees of the Earth's orbit, which is a significant distance--requiring about 17 seconds of time for light to travel. So on the F and G side the 45 hours is 17 seconds shorter; on the L and K side the 45 hours is 17 seconds longer.
thanks Howard, you are correct and my error, I am working on a fix
Here is my correction: th-cam.com/video/TAIlswch5d0/w-d-xo.html
14:54:..... this align so much with the speed of light (events) that Maxwell could state light was a form o electromagnetic wave! To me, in this resides the greatness of this video! Thanks!!
The celestial and planetary experiments don't appear to factor in the movement of our solar system through space (~500k mph), or the motion of the stars either. With those factors taken into consideration, the actual distances involved would be different, greater or perhaps less, depending on the relative direction of travel.
About a year ago, I saw a TH-cam video saying that because of the new way of measuring the Speed of Light, we wouldn't know if it changed. Can we detect any change?
2:33 Hi, Please if you have a minute: why around H, Jupiter would get in the way? Doesn't its natural satellite end up on one side or the other of the orbit where it is visible again?
Considering that the cog was literally handmade, the accuracy was astounding TBH.
His friend was an absolute master.
Why wasn't physics as interesting as this when I was at school?, or maybe a better way to put it is, why were the physics teachers I had at school, so crap?
Thanks sir! Will u be releasing more videos for physics hsc syllabus module 7? Really wish u were my physics teacher at school!!
Yes. I have already quite a few videos for module 7. See the playlist, but there is more in development too. Make sure you are subscribed and click the bell.
Thanks for the encouragement and share with your peers
Has anyone measured the 1 way TOF for light? Also, how does relativity play into it and... in the 2 way TOF, is the return speed the same as the send speed? Essentially , how do we Actually know if the speed remains constant between send and return?
They don't know. All their physics and theories fall apart unless light speed is constant. Which it isn't.
The celestial and planetary experiments don't appear to factor in the movement of our solar system through space (~500k mph), or the motion of the stars either. With those factors taken into consideration, the distances would be greater.
Michelson spent much of his career measuring the speed of light. In 1927 he measured the speed by sending a beam from Mount Wilson in California to Mount San Antonio, 35 km away, and back. The result was accurate to just over 1 part in 100,000
Excellent video, thank you!
I have a question : James’ method demonstrates the speed of light is relative to earth’s motion. If every two years or two turns, the angle will be twice. If the reference frame is on earth, the light speed c, will be a function of the speed of earth. Why we think the speed of the light is considered as constant regardless of reference frame?
The speed of light is same relative to all observers. Of course he could not know it.
What software is being used here? It looks like all of those are object you drag with your mouse and not just animations.
very nice video, I've been getting questions about this and may adapt it for my channel.
How does different positions of earths orbit produce different periods for io? Although light takes longer to travel, this will just delay when we first see the moon (start of period) and when it finishes its orbit (end of period). But won’t the duration of the period itself remain constant ?
Erick + You are right. A lot of YT videos give the same reasoning that this one, but there are videos where they give the correct reasoning. As the Earth and Jupiter move in their orbits there are periods when the distance between them becomes smaller, they are closing to each other, and there are periods where the distance becomes larger and larger. In both situations you see Io starts an eclipse and measures the time when it is visible again. In the first situation the light had to travel a shorter distance that in the second situation, so the eclipse is "shorter" than when the planets are moving away each other. So the important factor is the relative movement between Earth and Jupiter.
@@josenriqueha right yea this does make sense. Thank you
@@erickrajan7401 You're welcome. HighSchoolPhysicsExplained gives this explanation in the link that appears at the end of this one.
Please take a look at Ole Rømer's wiki, if You're not already familiar with this amazing man. I promise You will find it worth Your time.
I kinda understand and get how mechanical waves move forward but how does light or any electromagnetic wave move? Or what does make it move and with that kind of velocity? All from that I’m just blown away with this universe🤯
WOW
It moves because a change in the electric field causes a change in the magnetic field, that change in the magnetic field then causes a change in the electric field and so on. The rate of change of of the electric field is determined by the universal constant the permittivity of free space, and the rate of change of the magnetic field is determined by the universal constant the permeability of free space, together they determine the speed at which light travels. No one knows why free space has these values, it just does.
Seriously though excellent lecture.
Great video. But what happens if it turns out that light travels at different speeds coming back from the mirror to that going towards the mirror? These measurements assume that the speed is constant in both directions, and measures the average speed!?
🤓 have you been watching Derek Muller’s video?
They set it going and after that no one could catch up to it to turn it down. Always been that way, and forever will be.
Major issue I have with topic. Does the light travel that fast or is it the speed of illumination that travels that fast. Light must have a certain value of power, strength or intensity. Does this mean the speed of light is variable, but the speed of illumination is the same. Speed of lght using planets is not scientific. Is the universe not expanding? How do they have exact distance to planets?
Excellent video! Clear and concise.
When I watch this program I understand the great minds and brain power that these individuals possess. These are truly remarkable individuals and they were working from the foundation that was laying down thousands and thousands of years ago by their ancestors. And when I say Foundation I mean genetically.
Did the Fizeau experiment in High School Physics. Could drive you crazy setting it up right. A sneeze and it was ruined.
that would be a challenge. Did you get a credible result?
@@PhysicsHigh not really. It was too difficult to get a stable setup. I'd call the results very "biased" towards merciful interpretation of the facts.
Wow!!really so much informative☺
Nice video... thanks for your effort...
I did not know the period of IO was so short... ~45h
Nevertheless the period observed should be the same...
if the observer are closer... or distant from Jupiter...
I can only see how this values would be of a perceptible magnitude...
if there was a significant distance difference between the start and the end
of the observation of a IO period (not only ~45min)
The ~80º arc or Earth orbit you mention between points
in Ole Romer diagram is done in roughly 3 months,,,
About:
c=2L/t of Fizeau
t=2L/c of Foucault
Could you please elaborate on why 'c' was chosen for the name?
c stands for celeritas, which means swift in Latin .
@@PhysicsHigh Which is also where we get 'acceleration' from, it means an increase in swiftness.
@MichaelKingsfordGray Accelerate comes from the Latin word 'accelerarre' which is derived from the Latin words 'ad' (meaining 'towards') and 'celere' (meaning 'swift'), so the literal meaning is 'to move towards swiftness'.
at 3:10 there is a glitch in the argument? because the measured orbit time is independent of the distance - it depends on the speed of earth relative to jupiter. therefore it appears shorter between F and G, longer between L and K
Did you see my errata?
@@PhysicsHigh no, sorry to bring this up again
and delay in second experiment is also because earth is having elleptical path .
so it would take longer time in one part of orbit and small amount of time in other part of orbit which seems as delay of light reaching
Ponder this: let's say you have a lever with a distance of 8 light minutes in length (about the distance from Earth to the Sun). The opposite end of you pivots. If you move (assuming inertia is overtaked) the lever for 10 seconds. The wave is 10×c ≈ length traveling light speed to the pivotal point?
Displacements propagate in mechanical systems at roughly the speed of sound. They don't travel at the speed of light.
@@schmetterling4477 l did some research on this. I think your right.
The distance from the sun on average is 94,343,000 miles. The speed of sound through iron is 767.269 miles per hour. With a wave length about 32 miles, it will take about 14 years for the movement to complete. Hahaha
@@edwardmartin6052 Sounds about right. ;-)
Does light have an acceleration value before it reaches velocity?
I don't think so. Light speed is constant.
This was extremely interesting... high school science should also include the brilliant ways our ancestors made their discoveries
There is the chapter in 10 standard ncert book . If you study you will know .😅
God.....still boy you don't get enough from Newton's apple????😮😮
Hi sir. For this dot point in our syllabus, how much maths do we need to know? Or do we just need to understand the concept?
I will wait for you reply
Thanks Sir
I am not the exam committee so I can’t guarantee everything but my decades experience tells me, no you’re very unlikely to get a maths question on this this outcome (we don’t refers to them as dot points anymore). What I would say is that you should be familiar with a number of historical examples of light speed determination. Also you should be able to discuss how science works - the prediction of light as a wave with a finite speed and the experiments that validate that model, and how each experiment, with increasing precision leads to increasing accuracy. Note how I use the terms.
Hope that clarifies. You ask a good question that deserves a longer answer.
For his experiment, Michelson built a hollow tube about a meter in diameter and about a mile long in what is now Irvine, California. It's part of the history of Southern California.
The tube (a pipe) was pumped down to a vacuum. Does it still exist?
The angle of the reflection needs to be divided by 2. If a mirror rotates 5 degrees the mirror’s reflection will move 10 degrees.
Sometimes nothing make sense. Went to see photon matter interaction, i couldn't understand so many terms. It seemed interesting tho. Wikipedia pages are sometimes very confusing. Which book should i start with for quantum mechanics, any idea? I am familiar with basic quantum theory and calculus.
Thank you for the video. However, I'd like to share some important fact at 14:45 if I may. James Clerk Maxwell wasn't calculating the speed of light. He was calculating the speed of how the 'elecrto-magnetic' force is propagating throughout space according to his new-born theory. It was only after he came up with the result and compared it to what was already known, and this way, he become the first man on planet Earth to realise and undarstand that light is 'just' electro-magnetic force. It must have been an important day in his life.
Fizeau needed the RPS of the toothed wheel to calculate the speed of light. If the wheel were turning at 12.6 RPS that's 756 RPM. How was he able to measure the RPS in 1851? Any inaccuracy would be a huge source of error.
Light has a constant speed in vacuum of space, and a different constant speed in water etc.
So, a light coming from a car standing still is same speed as light from a car that is moving,
because also in the atmosphere lightspeed is a constant?
Absolutely fantastic! Thank you so much. Keep them coming.
Thank you! Will do!
What powers light...I mean if I switch on a torch that light shoots out at 186.000 miles per second..something pushes light at that speed...so what is it?????...just wondering
Please, why the frequence is 12.6 Hz?
Thats the frequency needed to block the returning light. During the experiment, they started out with a low frequency so that the light has time to return through the gaps. As the frequency increases, the returning light gets more and more flickering, and eventually at 12,6 Hz there is no returning light getting through the gaps....I think.
Nicely done 👍🏻
The "and then he calculated the frequency" bit is disappointing, frequency of what? How? How did they know when the light was passing through the gap but hitting a tooth? How did they know when light just hit the tooth outbound?
really good information which is not available at text books👌
Why do we pretend the speed of light is a constant when even in a vacuum in the best conditions we have access to the actual number calculated varies drastically?
Excellent! Thanks!
This by itself is a serious question that, which or what clock were these scientists using at the time of experiment.
This wasn't taught when I went to high school, and I have always wondered how they measured before modern technology
One problem here is that the metric system was adopted during the French Revolution. Since the correct speed of light was not know then the definition of a meter must have been different than today.
Amazing video. Thank you for this.
Glad you enjoyed it!
This is an inaccurate description of Roemer’s method. The starting time of the eclipse occurs earlier than expected as Earth is moving towards Jupiter and later than expected as Earth is moving away. He relied on long-term observations to get the mean time accurately, which is necessary to show the pattern.
You are correct sir. Between points L and K, the Earth is moving away from Jupiter. Between points F and G the Earth is moving toward Jupiter. The discrepancies are caused by the Earth being either further away from Jupiter, or closer to Jupiter, at the second (end) observation of Io's orbital cycle, than it was at the first (start) observation, depending on whether the Earth is between points L and K, or between points F and G at the time of the observations. I suspect that the "High School Physics Explained" doesn't fully understand the concept.
Error on my part. Is true. Working on a fix as I type Thanks.
Here is my correction: th-cam.com/video/TAIlswch5d0/w-d-xo.html
Thank you for this video, the observation on its inaccuracy & the ensuing correction.
Having just listened to an overview of this experiment I chose this video to learn more & found myself questioning what I thought I'd learnt. My faith in my initial understanding & that of teachers & youtube commentators has been restored.
@@PhysicsHigh And also his name was Ole Rømer and not Olaf. And you ahould not roll on the R's for his last name.
Damn. This really is good, physics is one of the most interesting things in life.
@Creed Follower
**Physics is everything**
@@acmefixer1 pure facts
So the hippolyte gear test worked by testing frequencies of moving the cog until the light passed theough the cog but did not come back. How did he confirm this though?
He looked at it. ;-)
How fast was Focault's mirror spinning?
I’m sorry but the first explanation about Ole Romer’s observations are a little bit misleading: even when observing from really far the period would me almost the same. But adding up these intervals would seem a bit late comparing to observations when earth is moving away and a bit early when approaching again.
Did you see my errata fix? It’s linked in as well as in the description