"I don't deserve protection" - Beliefs often held by scapegoated children of narcissistic parents
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 ม.ค. 2021
- Today's video discusses how scapegoated children come to conclude that they do not deserve protection due to how none is offered in their family. This belief is adaptive in sparing the child the agony of hoping for protection and instead being met with more cruelty. Tactics for recovery from this belief are offered. The main theme is to select relationships that defy this belief and limit relationships that comply with it.
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And when the other children in the family have to turn down their empathy for the scapegoated child, another narcissist is created, or two.
Exactly! It is making of a narcissist. That’s exactly what happened with my sister...
The golden child
@@anabellee1225 I understand that too.
2 terrible parents.
5 children. 1 dead never talked about.
2 now dead bc of addiction n one to murder via a malignant narc. Also never spoken about.
Then Me ...the scapegoat, barely surviving a 21 yr marriage 2 a malignant.
N one very cold callous older sister alive who's utterly identical to my abusive mother.
@@anabellee1225 is she the golden child? They create golden children lifetime supply because they figure the scapegoat will venture away for their own survival.
Hadn’t thought about it that way…another Narcissist is “born”. My sister. She was the golden child. I now see, that she is still the golden one…thinking she deserves to remain on the pedestal. She does have a lofty sense of entitlement and is not sensitive to others. She treated me, as she was taught when we were girls…sadly, it has affected our relationship as women in an adverse manner. I’m in relationship with her sparingly and with boundaries she can’t stand.
“Can’t get anyone to register what’s happening as wrong” - this is the biggest frustration when it’s blatantly obvious that it’s wrong.
Yes. Dealing with empathy impaired people. No one seems to compute they're witnessing and participating in abuse. Smh
But it’s not their viewpoint that matters. It’s yours that matters.
They could completely unaffected by the situation if they were at the receiving end of that treatment but you are not experiencing indifference.
Honour yourself and stop seeking validation for your experience from others. Trust the pain you’re feeling and stand up for yourself assertively. Take yourself to safety.
"To appeal for mercy and be met with outrage."
When I cried or begged, my mother would mock me. She'd mirror my face to me and felt disgusted by me being in pain. I used to hold my breath and try as hard as I could not to cry. It was considered a form of weakness and to her I was pathetic in those moments. I can't even find words to describe the torture I felt in those moments. Abandoned is a soft word to describe it.
I’m so sorry! My mum told me when I was around 17 how as a baby I was crying and her friend stood there laughing at me until I stopped, she seemed proud of herself with that same mocking tone. No one should have this experience! 💗
@@milkandblue Sending a virtual hug. I can totally understand what you meant yes, there is that cruel mockery aspect...so hard to resolve that trauma within oneself. It was shocking. You deserved to be loved and cherished.
@@CorinneIsIn sending hugs to you too! 🥰 and yes it’s incomprehensible, so hard to explain to those who haven’t experienced it, I hope you have support or are able to support yourself in healing, wishing you all the love and lightness 💖🙏🏼
My mother would say "stop crying or I'll give you a reason to cry" (which meant she was going to hit me)...
I also understand how it feels to be mocked and scoffed at for crying. I totally understand the fear to hold your breath and try not cry otherwise suffer more invalidation. I also get how intolerable and painful it feels and how simply saying that you feel “abandoned” doesn’t seem to do it justice. The fact that our genuine pain is grounds for ridicule is actually disgusting. I’m so sorry that you had to endure that!
I didn't even know it was a normal thing for a child to be protected. I definitely wished for it, but it seemed kind of like wishing for a fairy godmother or something else out of a fairy tale. It was a nice thing to think about but it wasn't a real thing that happened to real people.
Yes!! So much so.
Yes it generally just a dead end for the scapegoat when they are seeking any validation.
When my mother died in my late twenties, and the most anger I felt about all that had happened was when family member and family friends would apologize to me for not protecting or standing up for me as a child. I didn’t know that so many people saw the abuse, but would not do anything to stop it. I distanced myself from each and everyone one of them. In essence , they played an active part in the abuse.
Yes, they did.
This video is gold. Your content is gold. Thank you so very much for what you do. It's so healing and empowering.
My mother did not scream or yell. Her weapon was ostracizing and the silent treatment. When I was a child she could go days not acknowledging my existence. One really hot day she was clearing the table. There was a jug of cream on the table and I told her I would put it in the fridge so it wouldn't go bad and I did so. She stopped what she was doing, went to the fridge, retrieved the jug and put it back on the table. She stood there staring at it for about 10 seconds, then picked it up, and placed it back into the fridge, where I had put it moments earlier. It's really difficult to remain sane when you are brought up in this environment.....
I feel you. My mom gave me the silent treatment for days also, then was enmeshing when she needed me. She later told me that she couldn't understand how my father and I would be fine and joking around a while after fighting. The thing was I was reacting to his unreasonable emotional abuse and getting along and laughing at his jokes after was the only way I could get him to let up on his contempt for me.
3:43 A narcissistic parent murders child's soul.
And the child survives provided she/he doesn't become a narcissist...
I did . Survive this murder but not until 60
And a half years old . I married male version 1988 Male version of my mother . I can’t say I had a days peace until my mother died last month and I left my husband this month.
screw them I'm so angry
@@novastariha8043 Good for you! I hope your mother at least left you some money to make your life more comfortable. I'm 54 and have to believe the best is yet to come. We didn't have the internet, back in the day... But NOW WE KNOW! Wishing you the most happiness in the future.
@@novastariha8043 I can relate.
A whole family of enablers, grandparents, aunts & uncles, it’s very painful to become aware.
It’s an insane and at times terrifying unfolding for sure 😂
How many people have family members who treat them as the scapegoated child? It took me decades to figure this out. And yes, I'm tired. I looked out the window one day and said "This is a hero's journey. Don't lose your own 'shine'. It's in there". Then I found a good therapist. Not ashamed to admit I need help getting out of the web. GOOD LUCK everyone!
I am noticing more and more.
I remember this from my childhood. Crying when slapped was a sign of guilt, not crying was defiance.
F”d up shit rrr err grr
I’m sorry that was your childhood...
Too many of us but know it’s at least illegal F just F
@@MariaNI-yf1bz me too and the next verbal bashing was more harsh as well
Enduring the onslaught until they wore themselves out.. Parents were like a large children having a violent tantrum, and made just as much sense.
Believe me, if a car fell on me my family would not have lifted a finger to help. It would have been an inconvenience that they couldn't use the car then, or that I would have wrecked it. It never mattered if I was bleeding or broken, going to the hospital was an inconvenience that was not an option.
This is your most triggering video ever! I was happy all morning and currently a mess :)
A narcissist cannot be reasoned with. I was a scapegoat for mine.
I have always felt that the 'indifference towards your suffering' whilst simultaneously telling you that you are loved to be something I have never been able to comes to terms with.
Same, the cruelty of people telling you that they care and you should open up, then being indifferent or cold when you do is heartbreaking!
Ugh, I get it. My ex was telling me I was loved when I was trying to break it off with him. He always told me he loved me, as do my parents and as did my friend that I finally figured out was toxic. Saying that they loved us was something that made it okay for them to treat us badly, it was conditional and it was implied that we should feel grateful that they they love us despite us being unlovable.
Cognitive dissonance IS a ruminating bitch. It's our brains way of trying to reconcile the bullsht
@@goldieh7121 it's NOT love. Just a word they throw out of their lips. There is nothing real about it when spoken...just a word they use to manipulate us to get us to believe.
My sib sis does this after every dry and fake phone call.
The sibs are brainwashed themselves.
The big difference I think is, we as Scapegoats have AWAKENED. We SEE it.
They are still asleep in *their* world and continue to function believing their bullshit ways of feeling and thinking are based on truth...it is not.
Edited: that's why it NEVER changes...They remain the same..it is so important to realize they will never change unless, by some miracle reason..they wake up.
But don't count on it.
It why any interaction needs to be aborted, needs to be avoided...
You will not convince them.
You are better off talking to the wall. The wall won't trash you in response.
Yes. They contribute and participate in your suffering and then say I love you what's wrong.
This series about beliefs held by the scapegoated child has been extremely valuable and enlightening to me. Your explanations have helped me unlock insights about myself and my childhood that make me less confused about the cognitive dissonance that resulted from me being characterized in this way. Thank you - I so look forward to the next video!
Yes! Me too. Thank you for these! I turn 50 this year and all of these messages have been running in the background all my life. The most helpful thing I learned from you is that the fact that they’re there isn’t proof that I’m flawed and broken, but rather it was necessary for me to adopt these beliefs to survive. It’s like a weight lifted off my shoulders when I heard that! Thank you! 🙌🏻
I stopped showing any tears or sadness or hurt when I realized that my being hurt (physically or emotionally) or sad brought my mother and siblings great glee. They laugh and get very happy if they see that I am unhappy. It took me decades to finally see this and realize what was happening, but over time I learned to hide all emotions (if I was ever happy, they became angry and sniping). Unfortunately, I'm still unable to show any emotions to anyone.
Jesus, youtube's commercial placement is horrific. I'm going to stop watching TH-cam soon if they can't learn to place ads better.
I'm really having trouble lately with flashbacks to my family yelling at me "what right have you to be happy". I was born happy and exuberant, even through the abuse, but they eventually just wore it down, and then narc partners finished me off. I want to be that happy positive strong young woman. I used to not be able to sleep (as a child) as I was worried about something happening, such as fire, and I would be blamed.
So much of the abuse is invisible. Behind closed doors. No one believes or helps. it is enough that you survive. This therapist understands this topic thoroughly.
Yes, my mother would never allow anyone any sympathy but her. She always had a worse, more sad, abused, depressed, whatever state to one-up anyone. If you lost your young cat tragically ( as happened to me), it was worse for her when she put down her 20 year old cat who was ill, 15 years ago. Her pain was worse(!) In fact, I should "be ashamed of myself" for crying, as it brought up her memories of her cat 15 yrs ago.
That is so unsupportive of your mum. I think it’s mean.
46-years old and sober for the first time since I was 14 years old and trying to piece my life together, only now looking back at the long story of childhood trauma and damage that got me here..
❤💯❤💯❤
Keep going, don’t give up, you’re valuable
My therapist gaslit me. She shamed me.
She didn't get it. She also suggested Family Therapy.
This was so spot on and validating.
Family therapy doesn't work
It's a beautiful dream but not realistic
That's really bad. I've had a few like that. Some therapists would be more useful working behind the counters at fast food restaurants.
@@raven4090 facts.
It's a scam
My counselor triggers me but other days is nice
My mother absolutely gets off when her children suffer. Pharmacist denied my meds when I was in major pain and couldn’t walk. Pharmacist made fun of me and mom laughed . Shyt. A pit bull off leash ran up and started barking at me. My mother was laughing and talking in baby voice to the dog. My brother is killing himself with alcoholism now and my mother is enabling. She was the “good” parent of the two
What a tragic setup for a regret filled life of wondering how things might have been or depression or anger or any mix. It sets up a mindset of living in the past which, as we know , is a place to revisit sometimes but not a place to park. I have lived much of my life in that broken down old bandwagon with my biological family and generations past. Our eyes are in front of our heads, not in back. In track and the race called life, you look over your shoulder, you fall behind. Working on looking outward and upward
This is so well said. I so relate. It made my day to absorb these words & pictures. As the youngest & scapegoat, but able to see woundedness, i ended up feeling sad for everyone around me & later became by default, plus innate grief for them, the family caregiver. That segment of my life is almost complete, now i am trying to heal from surreal exhaustion & grief, & live the life God gave me, in the love of wildlife, creeks & mountains, katydids & spring peeper music, starry nights & talking to God. When i get my wind back & enough grounded stamina (& Americans decide to help each other thwart covid crisis rather than fight one another & prolong shutdowns), i hope to volunteer sing old tunes in care facilities, which are full of old wounded souls needing the love a child needs. Much joyful healing to be done on earth, in our brief years here!
You can do both. Look forward - but with the understanding of the past. You have to understand the past, what shaped your worldview, in order to move forward in a healthy way.
@@lizafield9002 sad for everyone else is a sign that one does not really register or understand what happened. I don't feel " sad" for any participants. We all know what we are doing. My siblings knew. So they benefitted from my abuse. I have compassion for myself. That means I look at some of the poor choices I made when I was younger were , in large part, because I was taught I was not worthy. I understand. Once I knew that I made better choices. My siblings participated in my abuse ...they were adults.
@@MJ-wrty That's true & a much deserved triumph of hope & life & bigness, over small mindedness & strife. Very inspiring.
This is life changing information, thank you!!! Here's something though: I was not protected or defended as a child, I could never defend myself as an adult until a recent breakthrough in therapy, but I am fiercely protective of others in vulnerable positions. I really noticed this when my nieces were born. Curious, eh?
Yes! Me too. Well, I’m hoping for a break through. I totally get what you are saying about staunchly defending others who are vulnerable, it’s as if you can see vulnerability and hurt which others miss, are insensitive to. Jay said something recently about turning the boatloads of compassion for others and directing it to ourselves. I wonder if the urge to protect others and not ourselves can fit into that paradigm? For a long time i thought all my compassion for others would be reciprocated…didn’t happen. Now that I think about it, I secretly hope someone will protect me, finally stop the injustice.
Wow, after hours and months of researching this and recognizing my sibling as narcissistic, this is the first video that totally explained why I felt how I did, why I stayed in the relationship, and why I couldn’t understand why no one thought I was worth defending. No empathy whatsoever for my feelings, efforts, or plight. Totally sucked the life out of me trying to be small so I wasn’t noticed, trying to meet everyone’s needs so they would be happy, and still receiving the wrath of Khan no matter what I did to be supportive, understanding, useful, and helpful even while not one of my needs was being met, I was totally devalued and invalidated, and there was no reciprocation. Shocking eye-opener. Thanks for helping me understand my own behavior in response to the impossible toxic family dynamic.
I can sooo relate...
@@KasiaZosia04723 I have learned so much from a ton of TH-cam videos on narcissism and also somatic experiencing. Boundaries seem to be one of the most critical tools and skills that I had lacked to get out of the abuse and to begin my healing journey. I was so often told that I was a narcissist for wanting to not be abused, that I have questioned myself for decades - was it my fault. Now I see that all the giving and conforming came from me and I have never received any understanding or kindness in return.
I just read a journal entry I wrote about 1.5 years ago in which I was so utterly confused by one of my relationships with one of my narcissistic family members with whom I was suddenly put in a position of caring for after years of not getting along with them and having essentially very little connection with. I remember clearly how the doctor told me that I had to take care of that person and protect them from being taken advantage of. OMG! Looking back, I remember how in that moment I was trying to physically and mentally make myself so utterly small and invisible in the exam room so as not to elicit blame and rage from my family member later. And, I remember absolutely all the behaviors that I was writing about in my journal about which I was so confused as to why I was blamed for everything even when I had nothing to do with most of it and how forlorn I was that I was always being misunderstood or berated or screamed at in high pitched rages. My other family members were guilting me into not understanding that person's health conditions and forgiving them. I now see with absolute certainty that it was all completely due to a very narcissistic personality, not the health issues. I knew at the time that those behaviors had always been there, and that any health problems were just more excuse to unleash them more often. But, I didn't understand them and regularly tried to modify my behavior so as not to get hell unleashed on me.
Now, all the pieces have fallen into place. No more confusion. Period. I have set extremely strong boundaries and only allow that person and another one to contact me via email - and ignore any emails outside the times I've set - though they repeatedly tried to violate my boundaries. Every time I engage any more than a strictly yes/no response, I get blamed for something. I even heard that I was blamed recently for something that wasn't even wrong - and they had just not given someone the right information. The ONLY reason I remain connected at all is to pay their bills as their POA in order to keep another family member happy because I am their executor. But, most days I question the sanity of that, too. Still, my situation is better. Someday soon, I will cut the ties all together and go no contact.
I hope you are finding a way out of your toxic relationships and a way to set healthy boundaries.
I'm so sorry for you cuz I feel the same way due 60 years and now it feels too late...I just want to die now
@@MrsAnson7777
We are similar in age. It is NOT too late. I understand your feeling of wanting to die because I've felt that, too. But, I also know that every single day is new. I think that what is important is to find ways to set boundaries. The more we can learn about healthy boundaries and how to set them in a healthy way, the stronger and more optimistic we can feel.
Also, I think it helps to find one single thing each day that makes us feel like we are doing something for ourselves, something that builds a skill or talent or helps us prepare for a different future for ourselves.
And, for our mental and physical health, I think it is vital to find a way, every day, to connect with a healthy person.
I think, too, that we need to just live in the now and enjoy some small thing, even if it is just a moment watching the antics of a wild bird, practicing an instrument for a few minutes, standing on the grass with bare feet, walking in the rain, or whatever.
Finally, if we can do some form of exercise every day, it can keep us going. A walk can help with mental health, especially if we are intentional and use the time to scan the horizon, letting our eyes move from side to side looking at what is around us and connecting with nature.
It is NOT too late. Keep a schedule. Build skills. Make connections. Live in the now. Plan for the future. We can do this.
I have been able to maintain my boundaries very well. But, I needed to be reminded of the effects of being scapegoated. Thank you for bringing me back to this video.
@@free2beme773 👋 Good morning,I can say I know how you feel.sp many say that but I am even older than you and it continues now to my Adult Son and his family { blamers} I feel like giving up at ×'s,have a good day
"Quit crying or I'll give you something to cry about". hHere are tons of videos out there telling the scapegoats how to change themselves so they won't be bullied. They use the rationale that you can't change another person, you can only change yourself.....so the bully goes on unfettered and it is up to the victim to jump through hoops to try to figure out what to do to 'change themselves' to stop the bullying. Most recommend either becoming a bigger bully yourself, or befriending the bully. I do not thin either of these alternatives in any way deters a bully. Leaving is the only thing at our disposal but I am so tired of running away......
I feel this entirely! Even if you change they find something else to blame it on! I’m tired of running too.
Exactly!
I thought me jumping higher , running faster being perfect would 🛑 the rage the wrath the sadistic behavior...
Never did that happen until death and no contact order.
Funny, I won a high point athletic trophy in high school. My family utterly did not care. So, yes, literally, no matter how high you jump or fast you run, not good enough.
@@Chahlie oh that’s funny !!! Seriously!!
You Did !!!!! But not funny really of course!! You still have that trophy I hope
And Give yourself the credit you ought to have had by proud parents !!!!
@@Chahlie ugh ugh ugh !!!!
But 🤔 hmm curious with both youZ2 trophy 🏆 gals…..it occurred to me that
My NARC mom would have Loved living vicariously through a Trophy 🏆 kind of kid !!!??! Haha to which I was Quite opposite 🙃
Thank you for being a voice of safe harbor
So well put :)
I cried watching this, I feel so seen in a way I never have before. You get it.
I totally relate with you. (hug)
Same, same 😢 The validation is real 😭 Finally someone gets it!
So did I.
Awesome Jay - thank you. This explains why I wouldn't even protect myself like a regular adult
I know what its like to be further pathologized by my therapist and the mental health system in general. Its too dangerous for me to be involved in ever again.
Same. I mean. There’s just zero access for me as far as EMDR. My NDIS got rejected bc the ‘Victorian era’ mental health in NSW have 3 boxes to tick to get any assistance. CPTSD is beyond their understanding…that system pathologised my issues from abuse. Trauma. Abandonment. For 30 yrs. Misdiagnosed. Pharmaceuticals prescribed that were detrimental. Never gonna even look sideways at those inefficient and ignorant time wasters.
Healing on my own terms! Lots of self-medication…..🥴
They tell you that you’re being manipulative when you cry or question why they are being so abusive. It’s a really sad dynamic because it teaches the other children, the siblings to hate you because what else could they think when they see you being hit and yelled at. They believe you must be bad, so bad that their parent can’t even control their temper. This is a crime. It’s child abuse. I pray someday it will be punishable by law.
My dad did this. It makes me so angry when I think about it. He really in his mind still thinks I deserved it. I have only just recently grasped just how sick sick sick this man was and still is.
@@Itsmeyoualreadykno I’m really sorry. I know what you went through and are still going through. No contact is the key to healing into being safe if that’s possible for you to do.
@@thirstonhowellthebird yes I have been no contact for almost 2 years. I really am just now coming to understand what I actually went through. I was the only person in the house that had the nerve to speak out about something being wrong but boy did I pay. Healing prayers to you ❤️ as well
@@Itsmeyoualreadykno Good for you! I went no contact in 2018 and even still it’s really hard on many days to understand exactly what they did to me so I can completely relate to your words. I was good to them and was a quiet passive person in the midst of all their alcoholism and rage because that’s what I had to be to try to hold it all together for them. They even would say I was the glue that kept the family together and then would turn around and do the most horrible things from projection to the smear campaign to purposely destroying my relationships with people. I’ll never understand it, and there will always be that pain that betrayal leaves behind. I get it believe me. I totally understand. Grateful the mind will only let you process bits and pieces at a time because I think if you were to process 100% of what they did to you and how they treated you that maybe we might break. I don’t know though.
@@thirstonhowellthebird very hard to quiet the mind some days. Sometimes all you hear are the awful things they tried to make us believe we were. Weird. It made me feel for so many years that I was crazy. But how come the rest of the world viewed me in a totally different way? He would get close to me and get me to trust him. I would confide in him. He would turn on me and I would be told that I deserved problems. He tried to commit me to mental institutions for wanting to talk on the phone and desiring a social life and friends as a teen. He told my whole family I was out of control and crazy. Whew. The last straw was him trying to have my children put in foster homes. He's a dangerous sick vile man. I moved me and my children far far away. He did all this to me and my children why? Only because I was never fooled by him. I have always seen him for exactly who he is. I am on this journey. Even I did not realize the depths of just how evil. He wanted to take away my will to LIVE. Things have gotten NOTHING BUT BETTER for me now that I have no contact. Isn't that something? I'm learning a lot but I'm dealing with realizing JUSTTT how sick and evil he is. Nothing changes. Nothing.
I never thought of it as feeling like I didn't deserve protection, but I can see that it's likely the very reason I usually don't ask for help when I'm struggling or even think to ask for help from others... I usually don't want to burden them with my "whining" as my mother used to call it, or to manipulate them for sympathy, as my mother also used to call it. I do believe in therapy, but with friends and family, there's a disconnect. I can talk with a couple of my friends, but I never fully open up b/c it is still so ingrained in me that I'm not allowed to feel the way I feel... I also worry about being viewed as ridiculous, which is something else my mother used to tell me when I was in distress (usually while also laughing at me). As a child, if I ever got angry with my mother, it resulted in physical abuse. I used to get bare-bottom spanked all the time... my pants would get ripped down, I'd get shoved onto the bed, and she would full force whale on my bare buttocks. Honestly, it felt like my mother hated me most of the time. I was definitely her favorite dumping ground... and well into adulthood. I'm now 52 and I just simply can't have any type of relationship with her. She just never really stops... and she's either doing stuff to me directly or she's talking negatively about me behind my back, projecting all of her own crap onto me. I don't even know who I can trust in the family and so I don't bother going for family functions. My mother nearly always has something nasty to say about someone, and with me having been her main target all my life, I can only imagine the lies she's said about me over the years.
As a scapegoat in recovery, your niche videos on the internal struggles and reality’s are paramount to my healing journey. Cannot thank you enough for sharing your wisdom so eloquently.
I thought what I was told about myself was true, I wouldn’t have told anyone because I thought I deserved it. That’s why I’ve put up with partner after partner telling me how awful I am.
I take it this is part of the “not deserving protection”. The constant attacks on my character my whole life.
Omg I'm so glad I found your videos. I've struggled forever trying to get clarity about not only my cultish "narcissistic family" but their tricky dynamics that led me to try to survive decades of adult life without boundaries or connection or self worth. Your detail is like a life jacket. Thank you.
My mother yelled and screamed at everyone. Nobody felt safe and nobody felt good about themselves. My eldest sister was the scapegoat, but she tried to have the golden child (my brother), me (the ignored child), and my other sister (the popular child), all committed to a mental health facility because we were all crazy. If we are crazy, it's because of her! I believe that she wanted us to look crazy, so she didn't have to see it in herself. My father would tell her that he was going to have her locked up with the rest of her mentally ill family.
I am so incredibly glad you have started this channel. This is THE most helpful thing I have come upon on TH-cam aimed to help the very specific struggles of the scapegoat. THANK YOU. I have done much subconscious reprogramming work and this has very much helped shine light and depth on beliefs to make sure to stamp out. Thank you algorithm for landing me here. You are helping my healing journey.
Thanks, Jay. Going through these beliefs is very helpful. Again you have nailed it. My first reaction was, "You mean, protection existed??!!" let alone contemplating one's deservedness or not. Narc people are cruel beyond description & love to garner others like them including institutional and societal narcs as well.
Thank you for your insight. Its a relief to be validated. Its so great to listen to someone who truly gets it. I fired 12 therapists who didn't get it, but thought they did. That was disgusting. I've been with my current therapist, number 13, for 4 years now. She says I'm relentless in my search for healing. Its a compliment. She doesnt have the insight and understanding of the scapegoat that you do, but she has enough empathy so we can work well enough together.
today reading a college journal at 19 years old... tells so much at such a young age . as well i was a mother at 16... because i thought i woul d be dead soon if i didnt create a life so i had someone who loved and needed me. I am 64 and have at least 50 to 100 honest journals that could be several books. I wish I could be seen and heard . I find the journals more interesting than my books right now.
I never deserved protection and was kidnapped 3 times and am still alive . somehow someway.
I hope you can contact me. My dogs and only a couple friendls are in my life. I built my house with cash in hawaii and live alone growing food and hiking. Still reading and with great pain. looking up. as i know i am specialthank you jay!
It’s crazy because hearing other stories can feel so traumatizing just to hear because this was so real for me & is still going on as an adult blacksheep
My father would always find little things I didn't do or didn't do right to start abusing me and when I saw that no matter what I do he's gonna yell I just stopped doing anything thinking well if I was going to be yelled at I might as well chill and deserve it. I wasn't chill tho but at least I wasn't used in that way. It's just now that I understand what was going on.
Me too. I gave up.
Exactly. When the mother sides with the son in law after he beats her daughter because they have sexual tension..
Well, No..you do not feel protected.
I hope you are out of those relationships and are safe now. 💕
@@blueshoes915 I appreciate your thoughtfulness.💕 I've been single for awhile after my sister took him in. My mother died a horrible death last month. The down side of projecting your issues on the scapegoat is that your BS eventually catches up with you. And I'm living the dream in Santa Fe. I'm using the modest inheritance for projects.
@@redmoondesignbeth9119 At least your narc mom never disinherited you. My narc mom did, and kept what should have come to me from my dad's estate as well.
@@l.5832 Not everyone should be a parent. 😳🤨
@@l.5832 I expect my mother to do the same. My dad left it all with her like he always did. Abuse and all.
How come this isn't addressed by counselor's in general? I gave up on counseling. What you speak of is on point. I'd like to confront my parents, my brother and sisters, but usually that isn't wise and will make things worse. My hearing loss is their excuse for why they can do what they do.
Thank you. Luckily, when I was growing up my father wasn’t as much of an enabler as he is now. I kind of always felt like I was his favorite. I was the only daughter in the middle of two brothers. My mother is more of a covert narcissist than an overt narcissist. But after almost 45 years of abuse from my mother, my father has become more of an enabler and now that I have gone NC with my mother, he has also become an abuser. It’s heartbreaking as I always felt loved by my dad at least but now my whole immediate family is against me and I am more of a scapegoat than ever. It was horrible growing up in that family and now that I see everything clearly, it’s almost unbearable to talk to my younger brother and my father. The only one who is more accepting of my NC is my older brother. He doesn’t really mention it and we just hang out like normal most of the time. It’s still hard for me to trust him as he was awful to me growing up but now I know why he was that way and was so angry. He still doesn’t think it’s abuse but he is very annoyed and mad about their behavior.
Videos like these are so helpful. I have grown a lot in the past couple years since I figured out my mother is a narcissist but it still means so much to hear someone talk about and explain this who really gets it and is a professional. Thank you! 💕
:o
Even if you cut them off entirely, they will continue to use *that* as a reason to scapegoat you. It never ends. There is no end with them, but you can recover without them changing, without the relationship dynamic changing.
I have similar experiences. When I was a child I felt that my father loved me and even protected me. He wasn't perfect, though. I understand it more and more now with time. He was passive aggressive and avoided conflict. He could be mean and cold towards my mother who was a fragile/covert narcissist. But, I think that my mother was even jealous of the attention that my father gave me.. My mother despised me. Especially when I made some mistakes at the age of 9. She never forgave me and reminded me of the mistakes I made even when I was already adult: "You ruined your life back then." She died almost five years ago. I felt sad but I also felt relieved. She wasn't entirely bad, anyhow. She showed some affection, too. But, it only makes things more complicated and messed up in my head. I think that's a major reason why I ended up in a relationship with a male malignant narcissist who physically abused me. I was in that relationship for almost three years and I've been free for almost nine months, now. My father has started to act in a meaner and crueler manner towards me just recently. I was a scapegoat and a black sheep in our family because my mother decided so. Now, my father just continues that heritage. I think he has some problems in his personal life and now he just pushes me down to feel better about himself. Which is sad and pathetic.. I keep realizing and remembering things also from my childhood in new ways all the time.. I understand that my father has had strong narcissistic tendencies, as well. I just try to keep our relationship as healthy as it can be. I have to constantly defend myself and keep myself strong when I'm with him. He's not entirely bad, either. He is just really cruel, mean and harsh towards me, right now.. He doesn't understand what has happened to me and he expects me to be strong and perfect. I should be all sorts of things.. He makes me feel that I'm never good enough. And that I will never be.
@@annehynynen8153 Anne i just went thru this phase with my father, as his & my mom's caregiver. 2 kinds of dementia between them. She became sweeter but pitiful & naturally scared, he was angry & self absorbed. I became the default spouse & source of love to both, in a metaphoric way, as my empathy devoid dad never loved his wife or anyone, but pitifully needed love.
With age, all their latent childhood & ancestral injuries emerged, i began to perceive, & i had to process these. It became too much. You can get really sick as the family toxic waste processor. So i made hard & painful grievous decisions. Mama spent her last 10 months in care facility that soon locked down & precluded my visits. She did not understand, sank into despair & died alone in her room during shutdown last fall. My dad didnt get it, became deranged, confused & raging. He thought i was her. The 2 brothers finally stepped in to help & my dad is in a facility now, also currently in a no-visit, room confined quarantine that is depressing & eroding his vitality. I can't avoid great sadness for him. He won't last the year, then this anguishing phase of my family's life will be done.
But i have no real kinship with the older brothers, their brains were formed in early days using my gullible self for sport, dupery & scapegoat, & they were affected by our parents' injuries as well. By now, condescension is habitual. We have no genuine love, but at least are civil.
I'd say this dynamic is "normal" in our weird culture, riddled with generations of injuries, but we can help our species heal by seeing EVERYONE as family, every race & nationality, etc. The meanest among humans are the most wounded possibly. At any rate, I'm giving myself the freedom to try no more for any personal familial repairs, but giving my life now to serve and love the whole, & heal within. May you find deserved detachment & freedom, sister! Your post did me much good.
I never necessarily thought I didn't deserve it, I just didn't know it was AVAILABLE to me. I've always been conditioned to believe that's charity and have almost felt like if I accepted it I was throwing a pity party.
Every time I hear someone recount that old "mama lion protecting her cubs" myth, or the proverbial account of a mother lifting a car to save her child, I can't help but roll my eyes. It should be true, but my experience was the total opposite. Not only did my mother do nothing to protect me - even in circumstances where it would have been easy for her - she usually couldn't wait to throw me under the bus. Her attitude was always "I didn't get that, so why should you?"
Jay Reid, can't thank you enough for these.
My mother sided with my abusive I x husband. I am a survivor of domestic violence, and my own mom betrayed me and wasn’t a source of support and help for me. Oh well.
So sorry for what you went through! I wasn't physically abused, but my mom would rationalize me staying with an emotionally abusive husband by agreeing with my ex that I needed him to keep me motivated. Then, when I started to feel he was becoming more volatile as I started speaking up, she thought I should stay with him long enough so I would move back to our home town. So glad I didn't, because he took out a life insurance policy on me without me knowing before I left for good
Because my father provided no protection against my mother’s irrational rages, I taught my little sister a series of hand signals so I could silently convey to her the degree of danger in our home. The signals began at the top of my head, for the best, then progressed downward to my feet, the worst. One Saturday my mother’s rage was so extreme that I imagined she was capable of murder. I hid behind the living room curtain, waiting for my sister to come home from playing with her friend. When I saw her skipping down the street, I got her attention, then because there was no signal appropriate for the degree of danger, I jumped over my hand. She immediately turned and ran back to her friend. The remainder of that day was so horrible, I have blotted it out of my memory. The sense that I was not worthy of protection continued when I began to date, when my utter lack of personal boundaries made me oblivious to danger. It is utterly amazing to me now that I was never raped or murdered. If I had met Ted Bundy then, I’m sure I would have been one of his victims.
Wow!! This guy is good
I think I had this belief by telling myself that I deserve the traumas and not being protected from harm in order to build my character. So when I got really sick with an illness I thought it was good for me to be in terror and pain and fever because it was morally good to endure suffering and trauma. 'I'm good for not protecting myself or receiving protection' I thought. 'It creates a strong character to destroy the ego and be completely submissive to the forces of fate' and 'by submitting to trauma and not wishing it stopped is being a good person, being humble' and 'I do good when I go through trauma without complaint, asking for mercy or help is weak, selfish and needy' is another which I think is part of this 'I do not deserve protection' for me. Thank you very much again Jay.
Thank you, yet again, for being the affirming voice that speaks about the experiences that i had no one to safely express to ❣️
You describe this soooo well...
“Target it”
I have not found a therapist like you yet.
In fact they have made it worse in the past.
You give me new hope to look for help.
My biological mom used to warn me: “don’t tell your brothers / sisters I’ve bought you this gift”
I wished I had realised that was her way of telling me they were bullying her for being nice to me. Or was it? Everything is often so ambiguous and fraught with secrecy with these type of people...
6:55 that is straight up what my step dad repeated to me a lot when I was a child after doing chores. Wow these videos are really helping people like us thank you.
wow this one really hits home 🥺😢
Why do think the enabler does that? You’re right it’s an odd response to not protect your own child. Is it because it lets them off the hook of the N parent? But they don’t want to admit they are afraid?
Because they are crappy, selfish people.
This is SO true....I am awakening and I would love to see things change...
but I don't know if we are there.
People who did not live this have NO idea what is going on out there..
But
THANK GOD THIS MAN HAS BEEN ABLE TO BEGIN TO GET THE TRUTH OUT...
AMAZING THERAPIST...
I always heard, “You brought this on yourself “, and, “You’re crying? I’ll give you something to cry about!”
And when you try to reach out to an adult, and they don’t believe you, or not care, or say, “of course they love, you, they’re your parents “.
I never felt safe.
This carries over into my adulthood as a feeling of it’s just me against the world, with no allies or advocates who have my back.
Very good video addressing this issue. The last bit you said home to me about the lack up upliftment in their company, when you wonder what they really think of you and reactions to your opinions etc as if you are weird etc. This was what I experienced with my sibling. It seems he learned this from our mother's treatment of me. A while back I decided I can't take this same sort of treatment so I went no contact.
The GC brother would tell me I was weird, then the other 2 brothers... One malignant, the other a lost child, with the Narcissistic Satan's Spawn egg donor egging them on. This happened every single morning at breakfast, and then one day, I didn't say a word. I learned to become invisible.
Your intuition on the untreated mental illnesses which create abusers is so invaluable that these behaviors, events & effects you describe are/can be easily documented & returned to coherently in their universal consistency, especially in being more aware of our legal rights (!!).
As you are aware, some former abusers/criminal abusers become trusted valuable members of society over time & with better tech/treatments some are 'cured'. Some former abusers are able to maintain working on mental health so that they are able to self-document that they are no longer breaking their own rules & laws. Unforgivingly, unrelentingly, manipulating & breaking ones own rules & laws (& repeatedly- as a lifestyle, as 'work'!!) is generally '*the *standard' for those with untreated brain disorders that create abusers & criminal abusers.
I'd like to know a bit about recovery
Another spot on video describing what happened to me as a child. As a child I seemed to know that how my parents treated me wasn't right, but I couldn't look to anyone else to prove I was right. Even now, my parents are beloved by extended family, and would never understand. Even my older brother, who I generally get along with now, said he experienced his childhood differently than I did. In trying to make sense of it, he told me that maybe I experienced it differently than him because I was more stubborn and misbehaved more. When I called him out for saying I deserved it more than he did, he denied that he meant it that way. But, what else would he mean by saying that?
Stubborn was always thrown at me too, anytime I didn’t “let” them abuse me.
@@milkandblue Yes, and beware anyone now that calls us stubborn, defiant or judgemental for just expressing a different opinion or perspective than theirs, or for not doing something they think we should do, or for not behaving the way they think we should behave.
Maybe because the parents lied and blamed you for creating their bad behavior so they essentially tricked him to thinking you were causing things you did not. I am sorry. He either did not see or did not want to see. You did not deserve the unkind treatment because you were a child!!! I have gotten relief with EMDR. You may try to find a psychologist that specializes in that and understands a NARC family.
@@yeahdallas Thank you 💕. Yes, I think my brother suffers from cognitive dissonance, like a lot of people trying to make sense of their parent's confusing behavior. Good to hear that EMDR worked for you. I will look into that. And, yes, I wouldn't want to waste my time with a therapist that doesn't understand narcissism.
This video has really helped me understand the abuse that was done to me and how it affects my feelings towards myself. I never felt worthy of protection because the people that claimed to love me abused me. I need to start feeling worthy and protecting myself now on because I am worthy of protection. It wasn’t my fault I didn’t deserve what they did. There is nothing wrong with me or any scapegoated child/adult, we were just the ‘punching bag’ for them to take out their insecurities on but no more!
This is so spot on. I often said if anyone had pulled me aside and simply said, 'Your mother is crazy. It's not you.' or something to that effect, it'd have helped living in hell more bearable. I sort of expected everyone else in my family was salvageable except my mother. I was rudely awaken when my brothers treated me like the garbage eater that my mother did me. I disowned them all. It was the best decision I have made EVER in my life. In fact, that act was quite healing and empowering. Totally agree with Jay's 3 pillars of recovery.
You're doing a great work. Thank you so much!🙏😍
Your perspective is exactly what I have been looking for!! Thank you! I have divorced the narcissist and done 2 years of healing of myself but have started looking for ways to help my 3 children!! Thank you Jay!!! I am subscribed so I can hear everything you have to say!
I remember the first time I realized that the narcissist dad would not be stood up to by any of my other family members. Sitting around a big dining table for dinner with the family of eight, younger sister in the high chair. I was probably around almost 4 and my dad served everybody dinner, except for me. Grace was said and everybody started to eat.
I didn't have anything in front of me because my dad had forgotten to serve me. It was customary for him to serve everybody's plate and pass it to them. For some reason, I hadn't ended up with a plate and nobody noticed. I certainly hadn't learned to speak up for myself in this family. I had already learned to be quiet. A tear fell from my eye and my father looked at me and said what are you crying about? I said, "you forgot to give me dinner, Daddy." He even had an extra plate under his plate that he hadn't noticed.
He got mad at me and made me sit in the corner for 10 minutes while everybody ate. I had to sit in the corner because I had teared up, upon having been forgotten, apparently by everybody at the table of eight of us. Obviously my little sister wasn't going to notice. But four siblings, 6 to 14 years older than me and my two parents didn't notice.
When I was sitting in the corner for 10 minutes, I realized that nobody in my family would ever help me from my dad. Not even my mom or oldest brother. It was only a subtle type of abuse, but as the scapegoat, I was learning my role.
I am sad for that little boy!! Send love to you!!!!
@@yeahdallas thanks, girl actually. But I got the physical abuse of one of the boys. The two sisters were Daddy's girls. I wasn't. Because I could see through his narcissistic behavior and he knew it. Partly why he scapegoated me, I believe.
@the real deal Oh my goodness, I do not know why I assumed you were a boy.. My heart is so broken hearing this story! It is not subtle abuse! That is harsh emotional & mental abuse! Unbelievable! I wish someone would have validated your sadness back then, at least in private! Lots of love and hugs to you!
It’s really hard when you finally reach out and call police and the police take the side of the people physically assaulting you. That happened to me & I couldn’t protect myself as a child, & then as an adult, when my children were being physically assaulted by my own in laws, I couldn’t protect them either- because the police I called took the side of my in laws, who called my estranged family to back them up when I was trying to go no contact from those who physically assaulted both myself & my sons. It’s very hard when a gang of people lies together, because they create a false narrative and if they persuade others to believe you are making up that they harmed you, it’s so damaging & dangerous. My husband & I got our family away from the abusers and have therapists now, yet still are trying to get the police to hold both the people who assaulted our sons & assaulted me, along with authorities who took their side, harming us- held accountable. It’s very hard when you finally feel you are worthy of being protected from violence, to have another authority figure come in and help who harmed you, harm you more. I would recommend getting a therapist before you take on the abusers, so you aren’t isolated. We didn’t get that support until after we had been so abused. If I could go back, I would have had a therapist with me before I took on my abusers alone. I would have had a back up and a witness to the abuse who was sane, to help me. I was isolated and physically assaulted into compliance - they use fear to control you. It’s hard if the police side with who harmed you. That compacts the deep feeling on not being worthy enough to be worth being protected from violence. Those who assault you never would tolerate the abuse they dish out happening to them, so you become the one that is not as worthy of being respected. Being the one who is criticized the most and physically abused the most, is to be aware that you not worth as much as others. It’s very hard to shake that old pain of being worthless, yet surrounding yourself with kind people is such a healing force. My own family I have now is a healthy home with kind people that are all mutually respected. You do heal, yet it truly is a hard path to be the black sheep. Getting away from those who try to create a negative narrative that doesn’t fit how you or your own family & close friends see you is of utmost importance in recovering from such pain. Thanks for these great videos. They are very helpful. ✨💖✨
This makes me emotional. It's exactly what happened to me. It still happens even as an adult. I feel emotional for my younger self. I want to hug the 5 year old me. Although I feel sadness. I am so grateful for this insight. Thank you from my heart ♡
Jay I think you must have been in my home when I was a child. This video was my life. Thank you for all you do.
Me too.
I am finding these videos a great resource for understanding family dynamics. Thank you!
I’ve never felt I didn’t deserve protection, safety and love!
Yep. Some parents never earned that honor of being called one.
I was the scapegoat until I left for university. Parent died recently and it was my job to clean out the house to sell. Amongst the parent’s saved papers in one of the “important” drawers was a little note written in my 10 yr old brother’s childish scrawl - “Brontë has the devil in her, Mom. You are right.” This had been archived for over 35 yrs to presumably document their justification for torturing me for so many years. It explained my brother’s treachery our entire lives. If he didn’t go along it would’ve been him. But it was things he did to me more recently that provoked me to cut him off, too. It’s a terrible sorrow as I loved him so much. Fortunately, neither of us have children. I will not take a chance on hurting my child, so a cycle of abuse of at least 100 yrs ends with us.
So relate. So helpful to understand my inner child, and truly understanding what she went through.
Hi Jay, thank you. I’ll be sure to watch your other video on the Enabler Parent, but for now I want to mention that my narcissist mother only married my dad because she knew that he was a traumatized person who was highly passive aggressive. Meaning she knew he would collaborate both willingly and ignorantly, and despite himself entirely.
My dad was 20 years older than her and had already cultivated a personality where he was completely helpless to “control” other people, i.e., simply set boundaries and be assertive, and, as such, he was able to continually claim himself a victim. He called this victim hood “humility”, and actively tried installing this “victim personality” in me, while my mother actually victimized me. When it became criminal he (passive aggressively) feigned not to notice and amped up his own victimhood to make himself sound innocent of the crimes, occasionally saying, “no one listens to me here - I can’t speak!” But he’d never spoken up before that! No doubt he *felt* victimized but only after willingly abandoning his role.
He was able to feign not noticing by traveling more and more “on business”. Meanwhile he gave her an excessive amount of money with which to carry out secret criminal activity, and he never questioned her properly. He loved to claim that he was being used for his money and bled dry. My mother made short work of him, and if everyone else she came into contact with. Eventually he divorced her... and very subtly blamed the divorce on me, the scapegoat, saying, “I’m leaving her because of how she treats you.” This, after 22 years of telling me that I must “do what your mother says” because anything else would mean I was “aggressive”. He accused me of being “aggressive” growing up, then occasionally I heard him saying to others that I was “too nice”. This was in regard to my allowing my ex (an abuser) to move into my apartment, meanwhile my dad was encouraging me to marry him.
I’m offering this info because I believe that female narcissists (at least) target potential partners who will contribute to their manipulations of persons. It’s a warning!
On their best day, the narcissists in my family treat me worse than total strangers.
Thank you so much🌻
Dang y’all didn’t know this life was lived by so many others.. I’m so sorry what a bizarre family pattern.
This information has been incredibly freeing, nobody has ever described my life as accurately as this channel.
Phew may the truth set us all free!
All the very best wishes to you your work is healing hearts✌🏻❤️
Another believe is that a received genuine compliment feels strange unnatural for the scapegoat.
Could you talk about Munchausens by proxy? Is that common in narc mothers?
Thank you for this brilliant video. This is exactly what happens to us. We have never felt worthy of protection because our narcisistic parents offers us the opposite of protection. I hated weekends when I was a child and could not wait to go back to school on Monday to get away from home. My narcisistic mother was abusing me and my narcisistic father said nothing and vice versa. Ignoring injustice is allowing it. It is high time to take care of ourselves and our loved ones.
Thank you for an excellent video! Same kind wishes of health and safety to you and yours as well! 👍💜
This whole shit show of a painful dynamic I’ve always called the “the ohhhhhhhh Rebecca awards” and it has actually been validated in this video. This dynamic is going on at work and multiple workplaces in the past, community scapegoating abuse outside of work/family, etc. Thank god I believe I deserve protection and am learning to show my self the compassion and love I truly deserve not what was projected onto me as if I deserve.
Thank you for these videos!
Tragically/comically, as the scapegoat in my family, there was NO escaping because my father was a successful psychoanalyst.To go against his judgement was to be considered mentally ill. At 18, I broke free. Because doing so showed everyone that it could be done, the attacks during visits were relentless.
These videos are helping me to finally sort everything out. I am very grateful for them.
Really like your videos! I was scapegoated as a child and am now am still suffering from it. I feel that I can't find any one in the world who will protect me. I have severe anxiety!
I went on to take kickboxing, boxing and MMA training to alleviate the childhood feeling of being attacked often , it does help !!
Thank you so much! You speak about my childhood. As the oldest with a non-functional alcoholic mother and a Narc father forced to take custody of my younger siblings and I when I was twelve, I felt all these things you are describing. I had taken on the role of the mother to my younger sisters and my Dad blamed me for my mothers problems and used me to deposit his anger. He was a ladies man everywhere else. Five divorces and now on significant other #7 his disdain for me as he enters a demented state (in his eighties) has come out full force. I can no longer hold any delusions that this man might some day love me and be a father to me. I’m done trying to get my siblings to understand! I love them all but I refuse to be hurt by them any longer.
I watch all your videos like a lifeline. Recovery is painful. I loved what you said about narcissism being a type of infection in the natural human programming of parents to protect their children. I sometimes felt as if my parents were possessed, like another species, because their behavior was inhuman and impossible for most people to comprehend.
It is hard to find a therapist who gets it. My last therapist wanted to diagnose me with BPD and told me I shouldn’t allow people into my inner circle since I had a history of abusive relationships. I told her that what I wanted to focus on was feeling less isolated and learning how to make genuine friendship and connection with people. Her lack of understanding just made it more traumatic for me and I broke things off with her. Still haven’t found another therapist. Just struggling with this on my own.
"Better her than me." I was sure that thought was in my mother's mind when my father would vent his narcissistic rage on me. Even though I had that much figured out, I wasn't sure of myself, at all, and felt messed up inside.
My mother and her sister smirked when my cat died because they knew I loved him.
Big validation of how the narc parent blames further when the child tries to communicate that what the parent is doing is hurting the child.
I love your information, I love the delivery, I feel heard, I feel understood and then the add popped up in the middle of all these good feelings and the add was a trailer for a movie and the specific scene was a young woman being murdered by someone stabbing her in the throat with a stilletto heel. Shit, I felt shocked. Who decides what adds go where. Not a criticism this is a genuine concern. And I will continue listening and watching your videos.
So true
When I explained to my Mother in a very rational way how I had protected her, yet she would throw me under the bus. Some time later she said in a very mocking, contemptuous tone (eye rolling, etc...) - "Oh yeah! I was supposed to PROTECT YOU!!" 🤷♀️ Too weird - in fact, downright scary. 😱
Yes making like you are so terrible right? When its them
@@weaselwacker5462 Delusional, contemptuous, and downright evil. She is very convincing to the outside world. Two faces.
Thank you for these videos! So helpful to hear! I wish you were in SoCal as I'm having a hard time finding a therapist who 'gets it'.
Very on time!