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The poor cruiser DeRuyter was so hampered in her design and equipment by stringent budget limitations (only seven 5.9" guns, limited AA, and no torpedoes) that she was no match for comparable ships in almost any other navy.
That's what you get, when you have poor leadership. But most info in this video is incorrect and incomplete. He let alot of info out. Don't forget who is nr 2 behind the us, in sinking tonnage Japanese vessels. And it saddens me that most of the time the dutch terrible twins hnlms flores and hnlms soemba get ghosted. They got the nickname for a reason, and managed to fire 900 shots devided over 3 guns in 4 hours. And although he was correct aboute queen wilhelmina, but she didn't want to leave the country, it was under force of military command that she sailed for the uk. While the political leader ship was long gone before the germans even crossed the border. And then I'm not even talking about the royal dutch marines at maasbruggen, and the national reserve at the kazematten at the afsluitdijk. And how the dutch ground based aa and yes the fokker d21 stood up to the german luftwaffe. All subjects that never get talked about. It was all about weak and poor leadership, from the dutch parlement. They refused to invest in the military forces. That's why the netherlands fell so quickly. And karel doorman was a rear admiral under hig admiral conrad helfrig called a ship a day hellfrich. Now why is that?
@@Scar_tisseu-86all of the stuff you mention gets talked about plenty, for and by those who are interested. But the same can be said about other small countries that were fighting in WW2: all have their share of heroes, heroism and incredible (military) feats, just as the big fighting powers. The Netherlands would have fallen, just as the Dutch East Indies, even if all the plans undertaken during the second half of the 30s would have been realized. Against Germany and Japan we simply were no match. More importantly, our neutrality also meant our views on warfare and our doctrines were outdated or on the brink of becoming so; we lacked the knowledge gained by those fighting in WW1 (and other conflicts), and because of our neutrality we also had many issues gaining contracts for advanced items, parts and weapon systems other nations simply did not want to share. The Dutch ordered and paid for medium bombers from the Germans that never were delivered. Same thing for B-25s ordered to replace/prop up the bomber fleet in Indonesia; not delivered on time due to other nations paying more and being deemed more important by the US government. About those 3 battlecruisers: their design had been coming together since the late 20s. However, Dutch naval engineering and shipbuilding was not able to produce capital ships; the guns, armor, engines and certain design elements (layout of weapon systems, citadel design), as well as the (license production rights of) ammunition for the main guns all had to be gained from foreign sources- it was not surprising that none of the major powers were inclined to share their own knowledge to a neutral nation with such a strategic geographical position without strategic benefits for them. As it was, the battlecruisers as ordered in 1938, were not even completely finished in their design. The order was merely put up as to be able to show the Dutch Navy the government was serious in this regard, as not postpone the idea once more, and for propaganda purposes to other major powers- with the hope that ordering those ships might help finalise at least some parts of the deals needed to be able to really build them. As it is, I sincerely doubt any of the ships would have been realized before 1945, if at all. In fact, even the order for battlecruisers instead of full battleships already shows the Dutch Navy, government and industrial complex realized they would not be able to produce those even more intricate ships. With the downfall of battleships in Taranto, Pearl Harbour and the bombing of the 2 British BBs during the Battle of Singapore, it is highly doubtful the Dutch BCs would have had any significant impact on the war, except from becoming very inefficient, large coffins on the bottom of the sea. It is even worse, the Dutch East Indies Air Force had the foresight to invest in a large fleet of bombers, as to offset the lacking naval warfare capacity. However, whereas the bombers ordered in the early thirties were the most modern to be found anywhere on the planet, by 1938 they were already hopelessly outdated- and of almost zero value when the Japanese attacked in 41/42.
In deze situatie zitten we nu weer( voorspelde dit zelf al)allemaal arrogantie uit de 70er jaren. Nu snel opschalen, en luisteren naar diegene die er iets van af weten. De militair ,niet de politici 😢.
@@corvavw6447 Where should the money come from? Housing? Schooling? Increased taxes? removing HRA? downsizing WW? Downgrading AOW? Making healthcare even more expensive?
The Dutch Navy was no match for the Japanese Navy, not just in numbers. Don't know how the Dutch expected to police an empire so far from home with such a small fleet, especially with the large Japanese navy near by.
Like a lot of allied countries at the time, they expected the next war to be strictly contained to the European continent at most. Asia was the quiet part of the world where empires would be maintained in relative peace from European affairs. Allied nations also had the expectation that if a war broke out and spilled into Asia, the British, American, or even the French fleet would have a strong enough presence to safeguard Dutch interest.
The reason why the netherlands surrendered to the germans, was that the germans committed a absolute waarcrime when they bombed rotterdam.This was no militairy target, and they only did it to cause many civilian casualties .Only then did the dutch surrender, knowing that the germans would go on with these horrible acts of cruelty. The dutch army although poorly armed, fought very brave and did achieve lots of casualties among the german invaders!!!!
Indeed. And not to forget The Netherlands were attacked without a declaration of war by the Germans which is also a grave violation of the Convention of Geneva (so a warcrime). When the Japanese did the same thing to the Americans at Pearl Harbour The US was furiuous but fortunate to be strong enough to be able to get a revenge.
The Germans couldn’t win on the ground in Rotterdam because it’s the home of the Dutch navy seals ( Korps mariniers ) That’s why they decided to bomb Rotterdam from the sky . 😢
Karel Doorman wasn't the "Dutch High Commander", he was a task group commander (named "Combined Striking Force", composed of Dutch, British, Australian and American ships). The Dutch High Commander in that area (commandant der Zeemacht in Nederlands-Indië / Commander ABDACOM-Fleet) was Conrad Helfrich.
Actually it always has been since the late 1700’s. Too few, poorly designed and poorly led. Doorman being in charge was a death sentence to all under his command…. Including American ships. Battle of Java Sea should never had happened… allied ships should have been dispersed and more judiciously used.
People say this and that but don’t realize that the Dutch country it self is one of the smallest countries in the world but still got the biggest company in the world and don’t forget , they battled for 80 years against France and to make it even better those guys dit it also against England the wordt doesn’t know how much the world got to Thank about a tiny small nation that putted THEMSELF on the map learn the history it’s David against everyone.
I can´t understand the choice of vids. I mean, Nelson, Ark Royal and the other British capital ships were not involved in the battle scenarios of the ABDA at all.
for some reasons the Dutch navy has always been on the back foot, probably more confused than Hitler & Mussolini combined . . . the same Dutch navy back in the 1840s - 1890s was a tour-de-force not to be underestimated . . . by 1940s the Royal Netherlands Navy was literally unrecognizable, no longer what it used to be once . . . a figment of it's former self . . .
that was when both the yanks and the tommies BAILED OUT on the East Indies both on heavy equipment (b17s flown away) and on military and political will (both Brits and Yanks were NOT prepared to invest in defenses on Java Island...imagine the 100.000 british troops CAUGHT in Singapore..and what they COULD do in Java ?!?).Dutch were left to their own devices..MUCH LIKE IN 1940 !! That is the gratitude you get for declaring war on Japan BEFORE the yanks and brits ...for sending dutch planes over to defend malaya ..for sending out those dutch submarines (britain : NONE!) that have ACTUALLY WORKING TORPEDOS (idiot yanks)...and MacArthur sending not ONE marine to liberate a foothold on Java...
Four days thats all it took them? They thought they could take The Netherlands in one day so it took them some more. The Netherlands than only surrendered because Rotterdam was bombed otherwise it would have taken them a lot longer
Dutch lost it all but were the only navy to get japanese compensation post war. Didnt or couldnt put up much of a fight. A dependent naval force like poles and french. Japan wanted to expand in indian ocean to link with germans in middle east . But never did due to U.S. keeping them occupied in austrailia.
Don't forget to commemorate the men killed and wounded on the USS LIBERTY attacked by Israel June 8, 1967 in a deliberate attack by fighter jets and torpedo boats. The Gallant Liberty refused to die. Thanks HH for all your hard work.
What's that got to do with it? Although I do agree that it was scandalous how they got away with attacking a US ship no matter what intelligence it might be collecting. Wouldn't dare do that again?
And the Dutch Navy fleet is still nothing. In this day and age, if war were to come, the Netherlands would not be able to defend itself properly at sea
The Dutch were completely unable to defend their colonies or even their home country. What LOSERS! After WWII, liberal American policy was to accept the Marxist condemnation of "colonialism, and this resulted in more than a hundred "independent" countries, of which few can defend themselves against neighboring predators. That has left the American World Empire and the US Navy as the DeFacto policemen of the world, a job at which the United States is overextended and can only be maintained ---sort of--- by enormous amounts of debt by the United States. It's not sustainable and the American World Empire is going to break up under that strain before too long.
My dude, The Dutch Empire was bigger than the whole US before the USA even existed..... Some of your first cities were built by Dutchmen. Why do you think New Amsterdam is called that?
What about Pearl harbour bro, You have to think further, do you really believe USA's biggest naval base was so unguarded that hundreds of planes can just fly in ans bomb with no warning, just like israel and Palestina now, Israël have the best high tech border defence force in the world, and yet some arabs with toyota hilux just drive hundreds of kilometers into cities.. i dont know but that complete war really pops up some question marks
@@Xzeria01 There certainly was an era of real Dutch power in the world, but not in the XXth century when Dutch power could not defend the home country let alone it's colonies The United States is suffering from acute imperial overstretch these days. It's a very common problem for imperial powers.
@@SeattlePioneer The Chinese are becoming an imperial power as well, they too will suffer the same fate, as they have stuck their noses in Africa, south Central Asia and have plans of going into Mexico (if not there already) and South and Central America (just look at the "fishing fleet" near the Galapago Islands).
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Terrible narration, almost robotic - some interesting information, but a lot of irrelevant photos and video.
7:03 where does that weird translation come from? “onderzeeboot” simply is the Dutch word for submarine, nothing else!
The voice is so droning it's hard to listen to.
AI
Maybe he understood 'over zee boot' 🤣
Right? Onderzeeboot literally means under sea boat, aka, submarine. Nothing about home. Not sure where he got that from.
You forget to mention the terrible twins the Flores and the Soemba both present at the coast of Italy and Normandie
That flat monotonous robot voice was just too much for me to finish the video.
Say something in a constructive fashion or go back to AI generated and narrated videos.
The poor cruiser DeRuyter was so hampered in her design and equipment by stringent budget limitations (only seven 5.9" guns, limited AA, and no torpedoes) that she was no match for comparable ships in almost any other navy.
At least she looked good 😂
That's what you get, when you have poor leadership. But most info in this video is incorrect and incomplete. He let alot of info out. Don't forget who is nr 2 behind the us, in sinking tonnage Japanese vessels. And it saddens me that most of the time the dutch terrible twins hnlms flores and hnlms soemba get ghosted. They got the nickname for a reason, and managed to fire 900 shots devided over 3 guns in 4 hours. And although he was correct aboute queen wilhelmina, but she didn't want to leave the country, it was under force of military command that she sailed for the uk. While the political leader ship was long gone before the germans even crossed the border. And then I'm not even talking about the royal dutch marines at maasbruggen, and the national reserve at the kazematten at the afsluitdijk. And how the dutch ground based aa and yes the fokker d21 stood up to the german luftwaffe. All subjects that never get talked about. It was all about weak and poor leadership, from the dutch parlement. They refused to invest in the military forces. That's why the netherlands fell so quickly. And karel doorman was a rear admiral under hig admiral conrad helfrig called a ship a day hellfrich. Now why is that?
@@Scar_tisseu-86all of the stuff you mention gets talked about plenty, for and by those who are interested. But the same can be said about other small countries that were fighting in WW2: all have their share of heroes, heroism and incredible (military) feats, just as the big fighting powers.
The Netherlands would have fallen, just as the Dutch East Indies, even if all the plans undertaken during the second half of the 30s would have been realized. Against Germany and Japan we simply were no match. More importantly, our neutrality also meant our views on warfare and our doctrines were outdated or on the brink of becoming so; we lacked the knowledge gained by those fighting in WW1 (and other conflicts), and because of our neutrality we also had many issues gaining contracts for advanced items, parts and weapon systems other nations simply did not want to share.
The Dutch ordered and paid for medium bombers from the Germans that never were delivered. Same thing for B-25s ordered to replace/prop up the bomber fleet in Indonesia; not delivered on time due to other nations paying more and being deemed more important by the US government.
About those 3 battlecruisers: their design had been coming together since the late 20s. However, Dutch naval engineering and shipbuilding
was not able to produce capital ships; the guns, armor, engines and certain design elements (layout of weapon systems, citadel design), as well as the (license production rights of) ammunition for the main guns all had to be gained from foreign sources- it was not surprising that none of the major powers were inclined to share their own knowledge to a neutral nation with such a strategic geographical position without strategic benefits for them.
As it was, the battlecruisers as ordered in 1938, were not even completely finished in their design. The order was merely put up as to be able to show the Dutch Navy the government was serious in this regard, as not postpone the idea once more, and for propaganda purposes to other major powers- with the hope that ordering those ships might help finalise at least some parts of the deals needed to be able to really build them. As it is, I sincerely doubt any of the ships would have been realized before 1945, if at all. In fact, even the order for battlecruisers instead of full battleships already shows the Dutch Navy, government and industrial complex realized they would not be able to produce those even more intricate ships. With the downfall of battleships in Taranto, Pearl Harbour and the bombing of the 2 British BBs during the Battle of Singapore, it is highly doubtful the Dutch BCs would have had any significant impact on the war, except from becoming very inefficient, large coffins on the bottom of the sea.
It is even worse, the Dutch East Indies Air Force had the foresight to invest in a large fleet of bombers, as to offset the lacking naval warfare capacity. However, whereas the bombers ordered in the early thirties were the most modern to be found anywhere on the planet, by 1938 they were already hopelessly outdated- and of almost zero value when the Japanese attacked in 41/42.
In deze situatie zitten we nu weer( voorspelde dit zelf al)allemaal arrogantie uit de 70er jaren.
Nu snel opschalen, en luisteren naar diegene die er iets van af weten.
De militair ,niet de politici 😢.
@@corvavw6447 Where should the money come from? Housing? Schooling? Increased taxes? removing HRA? downsizing WW? Downgrading AOW? Making healthcare even more expensive?
Aprox 11:32 ...." Singapore fell to the Japanese", the footage was of German fighter aircraft.
A bit of a mix up?
The Dutch Navy was no match for the Japanese Navy, not just in numbers. Don't know how the Dutch expected to police an empire so far from home with such a small fleet, especially with the large Japanese navy near by.
They did not expect to fight the Japanese..and when you know how small The Netherlands is, there was no way a large navy was an option!
I suspect that 30 submarines and big ammount of minelayers can give some clue how they wanted to defend
Even defeated by the Nazi's and with our government in exile, the Netherlands fought pretty f.. hard.
🇳🇱🇳🇱🇳🇱 💪
Like a lot of allied countries at the time, they expected the next war to be strictly contained to the European continent at most. Asia was the quiet part of the world where empires would be maintained in relative peace from European affairs. Allied nations also had the expectation that if a war broke out and spilled into Asia, the British, American, or even the French fleet would have a strong enough presence to safeguard Dutch interest.
@@devenmacintosh4124 And after the 'great depression' it was not like the Netherlands had money to p*ss away
The commentary is really interesting but the whole story is confused by some irrelevant video with no link to the Dutch navy.
11:39 - That's the Graf Spee on fire after scuttling off Montevideo
Thank you. As a Hearts of Iron IV player who knows nothing about the Dutch Navy I found this guide very useful.👍
Haha good to hear! Appreciate you watching and have a great week :)
i BLOODY HATE COMPUTER GENERRATED VOICES
same
O stands for Onderzeeboot which literly meand underwater boat, or submarine
Appreciate you watching and have a great weekend :)
The reason why the netherlands surrendered to the germans, was that the germans committed a absolute waarcrime when they bombed rotterdam.This was no militairy target, and they only did it to cause many civilian casualties .Only then did the dutch surrender, knowing that the germans would go on with these horrible acts of cruelty. The dutch army although poorly armed, fought very brave and did achieve lots of casualties among the german invaders!!!!
Both sides did that. They'll always claim that there was some military target there but we all know.
Indeed. And not to forget The Netherlands were attacked without a declaration of war by the Germans which is also a grave violation of the Convention of Geneva (so a warcrime). When the Japanese did the same thing to the Americans at Pearl Harbour The US was furiuous but fortunate to be strong enough to be able to get a revenge.
@@doctorandusB normal for them. the US was the only country they actually declared war on.
The Germans couldn’t win on the ground in Rotterdam because it’s the home of the Dutch navy seals ( Korps mariniers ) That’s why they decided to bomb Rotterdam from the sky . 😢
Britain and the dutch destroyed Rotterdam to prevent the Germans from using it as a base, then they rewrote history.
Karel Doorman wasn't the "Dutch High Commander", he was a task group commander (named "Combined Striking Force", composed of Dutch, British, Australian and American ships). The Dutch High Commander in that area (commandant der Zeemacht in Nederlands-Indië / Commander ABDACOM-Fleet) was Conrad Helfrich.
The Dutch boat The Tromp made some famous surprise attacks with Freemantle as base. My father was on Thatcher shop.
Thanks for this great histroy lesson :)
Appreciate you watching and have a great week :)
Plaese make a story about De Tromp .
I will add it to my list! Appreciate you watching and have a great week :)
Maybe a lesson on how Roman numerals work would be helpful?
KIV is not Kai-Ai-Vee, it is K14. And so forth.
dutch navy is no joke
Actually it always has been since the late 1700’s. Too few, poorly designed and poorly led. Doorman being in charge was a death sentence to all under his command…. Including American ships. Battle of Java Sea should never had happened… allied ships should have been dispersed and more judiciously used.
The Dutch navy never was very impressive in size. The Dutch merchant fleet however...
People say this and that but don’t realize that the Dutch country it self is one of the smallest countries in the world but still got the biggest company in the world and don’t forget , they battled for 80 years against France and to make it even better those guys dit it also against England the wordt doesn’t know how much the world got to Thank about a tiny small nation that putted THEMSELF on the map learn the history it’s David against everyone.
I can´t understand the choice of vids. I mean, Nelson, Ark Royal and the other British capital ships were not involved in the battle scenarios of the ABDA at all.
This thing is LOADED with Royal Navy footage. Not worth watching.
You don't like the Royal Navy?
@@wendigo63music55not when the video is called Dutch ships…
for some reasons the Dutch navy has always been on the back foot, probably more confused than Hitler & Mussolini combined . . . the same Dutch navy back in the 1840s - 1890s was a tour-de-force not to be underestimated . . . by 1940s the Royal Netherlands Navy was literally unrecognizable, no longer what it used to be once . . . a figment of it's former self . . .
Appreciate you watching and have a great weekend :)
@@HiddenHistoryYT u have a great weekend as well
A match for IJN Torpedoes ? Capital ships do not always face off aganist each other.
great country
Seemed to be mostly Canadians that got the germans out while the US and British armies were rushing to take Berlin.
Thanks for watching and have a great week :)
Yes, although rather irrelevant to this video
Who came up with this ABDA arrangement? Dutch commander in overall command?
that was when both the yanks and the tommies BAILED OUT on the East Indies both on heavy equipment (b17s flown away) and on military and political will (both Brits and Yanks were NOT prepared to invest in defenses on Java Island...imagine the 100.000 british troops CAUGHT in Singapore..and what they COULD do in Java ?!?).Dutch were left to their own devices..MUCH LIKE IN 1940 !!
That is the gratitude you get for declaring war on Japan BEFORE the yanks and brits ...for sending dutch planes over to defend malaya ..for sending out those dutch submarines (britain : NONE!) that have ACTUALLY WORKING TORPEDOS (idiot yanks)...and MacArthur sending not ONE marine to liberate a foothold on Java...
Royal Netherlands Navy is the correct term...
Appreciate you watching and have a great week :)
Four days thats all it took them? They thought they could take The Netherlands in one day so it took them some more. The Netherlands than only surrendered because Rotterdam was bombed otherwise it would have taken them a lot longer
lets go!
Dutch lost it all but were the only navy to get japanese compensation post war. Didnt or couldnt put up much of a fight. A dependent naval force like poles and french. Japan wanted to expand in indian ocean to link with germans in middle east . But never did due to U.S. keeping them occupied in austrailia.
Appreciate you watching and have a great weekend :)
Terrible narration ruining an interesting script.
By 6.50 I'd had enough.
Bueller... Bueller... Bueller...
Don't forget to commemorate the men killed and wounded on the USS LIBERTY attacked by Israel June 8, 1967 in a deliberate attack by fighter jets and torpedo boats. The Gallant Liberty refused to die. Thanks HH for all your hard work.
What's that got to do with it? Although I do agree that it was scandalous how they got away with attacking a US ship no matter what intelligence it might be collecting. Wouldn't dare do that again?
@@cathybrind2381 I posted on the anniversary of the attack so people would never forget.
Your last sentence disgusts me.
@@richardschoot6136 you disgust me...
And the Dutch Navy fleet is still nothing. In this day and age, if war were to come, the Netherlands would not be able to defend itself properly at sea
Who would attack NL from the sea?
@@mark_sugar42 Russia
Leave it to the Germans to invade their WW I unsinkable blokade runner.
That navy was sent to the bottom by the mighty Japanese navy.
And Indonesian pirates stole the steel and metal from and desecrated all those Dutch ships sunk that are war graves
("...were war graves...")
The Dutch were completely unable to defend their colonies or even their home country. What LOSERS!
After WWII, liberal American policy was to accept the Marxist condemnation of "colonialism, and this resulted in more than a hundred "independent" countries, of which few can defend themselves against neighboring predators.
That has left the American World Empire and the US Navy as the DeFacto policemen of the world, a job at which the United States is overextended and can only be maintained ---sort of--- by enormous amounts of debt by the United States.
It's not sustainable and the American World Empire is going to break up under that strain before too long.
My dude, The Dutch Empire was bigger than the whole US before the USA even existed.....
Some of your first cities were built by Dutchmen. Why do you think New Amsterdam is called that?
What about Pearl harbour bro,
You have to think further, do you really believe USA's biggest naval base was so unguarded that hundreds of planes can just fly in ans bomb with no warning, just like israel and Palestina now, Israël have the best high tech border defence force in the world, and yet some arabs with toyota hilux just drive hundreds of kilometers into cities..
i dont know but that complete war really pops up some question marks
@@Xzeria01 There certainly was an era of real Dutch power in the world, but not in the XXth century when Dutch power could not defend the home country let alone it's colonies
The United States is suffering from acute imperial overstretch these days.
It's a very common problem for imperial powers.
Yes, the United States was certainly caught with it's pants down 12/7/41!
@@SeattlePioneer The Chinese are becoming an imperial power as well, they too will suffer the same fate, as they have stuck their noses in Africa, south Central Asia and have plans of going into Mexico (if not there already) and South and Central America (just look at the "fishing fleet" near the Galapago Islands).
Those Royal Dutch sailors, man for man, in my opinion, are the best in the world!! Nothing against my fellow American sailors.
Appreciate you watching and have a great weekend :)