Just my opinion, but I think there’s an enormous difference between altering and restoring. Yet people seem to be using them like synonyms. Like anything, probably comes down to how you define them. Great video, guys! ❤
Great conversation Mike and Chris! One comment that I was hoping to hear from one of you (and that I also forgot to make in my video) regarding “grading is a scam” is that to me there is no difference between submitting a card to a grading company and getting an “expert’s” opinion on the condition of a card and an ungraded card for sale at a show where the seller has it listed as one grade, you might think it’s a different grade, and inviting a third party “expert” to come over and give their opinion and both buyer and seller agreeing to that person’s assessment. In other words, grading the condition of a card, whether in a slab or not is very subjective. The only difference is that in the end, one card ends up getting put in a holder and the other gets put in a binder. So to me the question of grading only comes down to whether you want your cards in a protective slab or not. No scam there.
This is a good point. To play devils advocate and make the only counter point to your statement I could think of is that the dealer and buyer have an inherent bias and motive to state their grade opinion. In an ideal world the grading company would be the neutral party. Speaking in ideals but to your point I agree we are putting too much emphasis on the “expert” opinion. In the end it’s the evil we have to love with I guess since we’ve headed down this path. Just my two cents
@@Insidethepark24 Agreed. The buyer and seller have opposite interests in viewing the grade of a card. So that's where that third opinion can be useful. You're right about the "expert" part of it too. Just because someone trains you for a couple of months on how to grade a card doesn't make you an "expert". But it might be better than nothing.
As Dr. Beckett said on his podcast after the Mathis trimming video , if an old card looks too good to be true, it's unnatural. I believe this is true for many of the graded high-end cards we see spotlighted for past & future auctions. Grab any 1, 5, 10, 20, etc.. year old auction catalog (or PSA SMR mag). It's pretty obvious which cards have been cleaned or not (look at white areas / borders on the card’s front ). In my “opinion”, I honestly think 70% of the really nice looking Nr-Mt to Mint (or better) conditioned pre-1959 cards have been cleaned. This has been a 3-4 decades old issue. Just more people are doing it now (& probably ruining some nice cards)
Mike, Chris and even TWO brief cameos from Jeremy 😂 - all time great episode guys. As far as the altering - panty hose (or dryer sheet) seem ok to use to remove wax stains IMO.
I agree, if you rub a card with a paper towel or something like that, just to remove wax, the card isn't "altered". Otherwise you'd have to call cards with scratches "altered".
Amazing how different opinions can be about this. My opinion would be that trimming is not allowed ever - even if it is your card. It will not be your card forever and there is no definitive way to mark it trimmed for the next person. No adding of ink, paper or anything to the card is allowed. Other than that I see no problem soaking a card to get dirt off or get a crease out. No problem using a tool to get a bent corner back out (but remember - nothing can be added- no glue). No problem with using panty hose to get gum off.
I agree mostly with your acceptance of altering, but in any case they’re my cards now and I can do whatever I want with them (draw a mustache on Mantle). It may be unfortunate for someone who gets my cards after I’m gone and I’d never do it now (I did as a kid 😒), but saying should not be allowed is too much for me. It should not be allowed for someone actively selling cards though.
The 1st card I ever had graded was my '71 Munson. Looked like an 8 to my untrained eye when comparing to others I saw on ebay. PSA deemed it a 6. Cracked it and sent it to SGC and it came back a.... 6. As Mike said, you can crack and resubmit and get several different grades. I have always agreed with General Mangini that grading is a scam. Sadly, it's a necessary evil for several reasons. Excellent topic.
There should be no obligation to disclose previous grades. The grader is responsible for determining any card condition / authenticity/ altered or not, etc
Another awesome video Mike and Chris. Always love when you guys pick each other’s brains on topics we all care about. Thanks so much. And have fun this weekend! Enjoy yourself… And I’m not talking about the Cowboys lol
The points you made about grading and the fact that collectors/dealers put so much credence in the random number on the flip are the very reasons I transitioned from cards to memorabilia. Waaaay too much importance is put on a random 3rd party’s opinion and it soured me on card collecting for good.
Great video! For what it's worth, regarding the ink that PSA will put on autographed items, according to the PSA FAQ: "When an item is certified with documentation (not encapsulation), we will apply our invisible, synthetic, DNA-laced ink to the item, in conjunction with our tamper-evident label and matching Certificate of Authenticity (COA) or Letter of Authenticity (LOA)." If I understand this correctly, the ink is NOT applied to slabbed items, but to loose items accompanied by a COA or LOA.
CGC/Comics are having a rough time right now. But "pressing" old comics is 100% accepted in that hobby and is a service offered by the leading grader CGC (who's suffering through a very costly slab failure currently). Grading is what it is. It's an amazingly fallible process. But we are collector's simply either choose to accept grading for what it is (and certain grading companies in particular) until we simply no longer care to.
In comics, dealers will often say " CPR Candidate" meaning Crack Press and Resubmit Candidate. Bc Pressing amd cleaning is so prevalent. I would guess that 99% of non-ultra modern comics are pressed and Cleaned prior to grading. And the only time a book isn't, is when the costs doesn't work.
Good show today! I had a DiMaggio ball a guy claimed his dad got it signed in person. Turned out to be an Operation Ballpark Signature. I wrote Operation Ballpark on the ball and gave it away. Chris was right about the Wild West before grading companies. My disappointment with the Dallas Show, is it's only 6 times a year. I could go every weekend. There are not enough shows in the Metroplex. I just never know what I'm going to find unexpectedly. I'm out hunting at least one day every weekend, for many years.
I unsuspectingly bought a few Operation Bullpen items too. The forgeries made by that crew are still floating around in abundance, especially fake Mantle and DiMaggio signatures.
I cracked and re sent one time and ended up getting a 10 and ended up moving the card, but i had worked on it polished it and used a microfiber and openly disclosed it. They still didn't mind and went through with the deal so I think most people don't care until its vintage about restoration grading companies won't be able to tell what's been restored or what's original to the card
The main advantage with buying vintage graded cards is that you weed out all the fakes / reprints. It’s almost impossible to buy raw vintage cards on eBay because of all the scammers .
I like the finger rule and a good wipe down, especially on the chromies. Otherwise, just leave it alone. Some of these flaws are what gives each card their unique personality and that's OK
Hot topic for sure. I find it quite intriguing that the accepted policy changes between mediums. For instance. As is often noted, comics are regularly cleaned and pressed and that is fully acknowledged and accepted. Coins, on the other hand, are considered ruined if they are cleaned, even though they may “look” nicer all polished up, an old luster and patina is widely thought as being better. When you get to fine art, the “greats” are regularly cleaned, and even restored by museums. Old autographed baseballs were often lacquered to protect the signature. Personally, I’m ok with restoring to what the item was like when originally created, but not adding to or removing from, eg pressing and cutting edges or corners. I look forward to Dave bluejacket66 and John Mangini having their debate on this.
I collected as a boy 1957-1962 mostly. I sorted cards by teams and if someone got traded I moved them to the new team. I noticed some cards that Topps had airbrushed the logos off the traded player’s hat. I had a permanent ink pen (pre-Sharpie but same type ink) and I’d dab it on the traded player’s hat logo myself (for dark hats). Now I look at those cards and wish I hadn’t done that. 😔 I’ve tried acetone and it sort of works but also takes off card printed ink if I’m too aggressive. These are my cards and I’m never selling them, but my kids mights when I’m gone. Thankfully, these were mostly “commons”. All I have to say is good thing Mantle, Mays and Aaron were not traded. 😅
I pulled an 87 FleerJordan Sticker out of a pack at Burbank Sportscards in 1991. Sent it to PSA years later, and it came back 'Trimmed'. Sent it off to another Grading company and it came back a 7. You never know....
Just because you buy a slabed card doesn't mean it's real or not trimmed they make fake slabs to .Dan the card man did a video on how easy it is to crack slabs open and glue them back
You admit you likely have cards that were altered or trimmed not caught by graders in your collection, but you're unwilling to buy an Authentic Altered graded card with strong eye appeal?
I have no issues with someone removing tape residue, gum, etc. and my not being made aware it. Even soaking out creases is OK. I hold the line on trimming and coloring.
Interesting video - always pick up good advice from you both. As far as things like the Satchel Paige autographed letter, that isn't real. I would create a document and place it in my trust so that when the collection is dispersed, it will be documented that it's not a real autograph, and it won't go out "into the wild".
I ran into an instance today where a card didn’t go through the ebay authentication process because it had the word “Set” in it. Complete sets don’t go through the process so I would be warned about cards that say “Set break”
Will not solve this is But I would really like for PSA to tell you the date a card was graded. Beckett does this. At least you know from what certain era the graded card came from these tools to restore them, ahem forge up cards was not available or Not As Available. The grading companies need to come up with an accepted history Provenance of a graded card. All the established grading companies would have to accept some established method of this Provenance. I'm not expecting this anytime soon. I think the Sportscard Hobbyists have to force something more from the grading companies to take better policing action on these card Forgeries because that's what they are essentially. On autographs also. Establish some hot line for people to report when they discover restored forged card & auto's.
Good video - would be against the UV ink on my cards. I guess an autographed card is already marked with the autograph so it is different in my mind. Great video and lots of food for thought. Of course we own altered cards that were not caught - I do care - but don't worry about it. However, if BODA found a card of mine I would want to be made whole by PSA and would want to buy a different card. Why not write "fake do not sell" on your fakes?
I believe that pre-Ultra Modern cards that are above low grade should potentially be looked over by a team of three to draw a conclusion. Especially for HOF rookies. Chris' Koufax story is ridiculous.
There are many collectors who have a better eye than many professional graders. So yeah. A PSA 8 card is only an opinion of one grader on that particular day. Not questioning a grade is for those collectors who have a bad eye and who have no clue how to see the imperfections in cards.
Everyone’s definition of ‘altered’ is a bit different. If there was a pencil mark on the white border of a card, wouldn’t it be tempting to erase it? Or would one consider that altered? I would be totally fine with that.
I believe cleaning a card is ok. Trimming is not. Using humidity is ok to bring life back into the card. Caretakers of fine Art 🎨 pieces clean the dust off old paintings and use humidifier to bring life back to painting and not maje it as brittle. I believe the same should be done to vintage cards. What's the difference?
Are you guys telling me that the humiliation of having to ask my wife to borrow her pantyhose was all for naught and that I've been wrong to remove wax residue from card fronts?
eBay’s feedback program is completely worthless. Forgers and rip-off artists abound with 99% or better feedback. That was not stellar advice for newbies.
Chris is the best, so unassuming and self effacing but commands attention. A paradox. WS would be rated higer if they got rid of wildcards and interleague play and had a five game CS. They should just authenticate a card and not grade it--"buy the card, not the grade." Its not just an opinion---the grade dictates the value.
There are more scammer buyers than scammer sellers. Buyers do that damaged or broken item scam. They also do that wrong item arrived scam. They return some crap to you and eBay always takes their side. Sellers are better people than buyers.
But i feel like this is the main takeaway here---we're altering cards to get a better grade!! Period. Getting one over on the grader to get a higher grade to immediately sell the card. These yahoo's that are altering cards are just trying to cheat the system. SUBJECTIVE GRADING IS ALL WE HAVE. AND WE'RE HAPPY WITH THAT???????
No “disclosure “ necessary or required. A card “is” what it is based on it’s current grade. It may have been graded a dozen different times through multiple grading companies. Grading has ruined the hobby. We are all complicit so we are suffering the consequences.
Vintage cars, furniture, comics & other collectables are RESTORED! Why not cards? Topps & Fleer didn't give a damn about their blades being sharpened and their card sheets going in straight, etc. They certainly didnt care about colation! So.......altering a card is definately immoral. Restoring a card in response to the manufacturer not giving a crap.......is ALL GOOD. I began collecting in '66. Nothing Old School about this. In fact a very good argument can be made that Topps has altered thebcard by having crap print run, roller marks, and fish eye ink dots! Where the heck is their responsibility and accountability? Grading cards is another scam if scams. Ppl inspect a card to the minutia level that we will not see. Card trading is about the traders inspecting the cards and determining its value. So.....you made a mention of ppl writing about grading being a scam......well when you pay for a service and either are disgusted or you feel it has to be cracked and sent back.....WOW! what a great racket that is. I'm in the wrong business. Expert? Expert's opinion? Really? How much time do they spend on each card? Fight with the wife? Coffee sucked that day? Can t pay bills because the grader isn't meeting his grading metrics......bwahahahahahahaha Lawd Spare Us! 😂🎉😢😮 No mmmm Grading haters are tired of getting ripped off sir! Your generalities are convenient for your argument without any sources or proof. We all know who sends in ancard and with how much volume get bumps in grading. Opinions are like......yeah you know......everyone has one. Complete BS.
Thanks for having me on. Super fun as always! Can't wait to be in the belly of the beast.
You bet! Thanks Chris. Always a good time!!
Always a great episode when you combine Mike + Chris
Just my opinion, but I think there’s an enormous difference between altering and restoring. Yet people seem to be using them like synonyms. Like anything, probably comes down to how you define them. Great video, guys! ❤
Great conversation Mike and Chris! One comment that I was hoping to hear from one of you (and that I also forgot to make in my video) regarding “grading is a scam” is that to me there is no difference between submitting a card to a grading company and getting an “expert’s” opinion on the condition of a card and an ungraded card for sale at a show where the seller has it listed as one grade, you might think it’s a different grade, and inviting a third party “expert” to come over and give their opinion and both buyer and seller agreeing to that person’s assessment. In other words, grading the condition of a card, whether in a slab or not is very subjective. The only difference is that in the end, one card ends up getting put in a holder and the other gets put in a binder. So to me the question of grading only comes down to whether you want your cards in a protective slab or not. No scam there.
This is a good point. To play devils advocate and make the only counter point to your statement I could think of is that the dealer and buyer have an inherent bias and motive to state their grade opinion. In an ideal world the grading company would be the neutral party. Speaking in ideals but to your point I agree we are putting too much emphasis on the “expert” opinion. In the end it’s the evil we have to love with I guess since we’ve headed down this path. Just my two cents
@@Insidethepark24 Agreed. The buyer and seller have opposite interests in viewing the grade of a card. So that's where that third opinion can be useful. You're right about the "expert" part of it too. Just because someone trains you for a couple of months on how to grade a card doesn't make you an "expert". But it might be better than nothing.
As Dr. Beckett said on his podcast after the Mathis trimming video , if an old card looks too good to be true, it's unnatural. I believe this is true for many of the graded high-end cards we see spotlighted for past & future auctions.
Grab any 1, 5, 10, 20, etc.. year old auction catalog (or PSA SMR mag). It's pretty obvious which cards have been cleaned or not (look at white areas / borders on the card’s front ). In my “opinion”, I honestly think 70% of the really nice looking Nr-Mt to Mint (or better) conditioned pre-1959 cards have been cleaned. This has been a 3-4 decades old issue. Just more people are doing it now (& probably ruining some nice cards)
Mike, Chris and even TWO brief cameos from Jeremy 😂 - all time great episode guys. As far as the altering - panty hose (or dryer sheet) seem ok to use to remove wax stains IMO.
At least with the dryer sheet the cards will smell amazing!!
I agree, if you rub a card with a paper towel or something like that, just to remove wax, the card isn't "altered". Otherwise you'd have to call cards with scratches "altered".
My two favorite card guys in one show. Today is a good day.
The core of me was screaming the day PSA “grading” was announced. 😂😢
Amazing how different opinions can be about this. My opinion would be that trimming is not allowed ever - even if it is your card. It will not be your card forever and there is no definitive way to mark it trimmed for the next person. No adding of ink, paper or anything to the card is allowed. Other than that I see no problem soaking a card to get dirt off or get a crease out. No problem using a tool to get a bent corner back out (but remember - nothing can be added- no glue). No problem with using panty hose to get gum off.
I agree mostly with your acceptance of altering, but in any case they’re my cards now and I can do whatever I want with them (draw a mustache on Mantle). It may be unfortunate for someone who gets my cards after I’m gone and I’d never do it now (I did as a kid 😒), but saying should not be allowed is too much for me. It should not be allowed for someone actively selling cards though.
The dynamic duo!
The 1st card I ever had graded was my '71 Munson. Looked like an 8 to my untrained eye when comparing to others I saw on ebay. PSA deemed it a 6. Cracked it and sent it to SGC and it came back a.... 6. As Mike said, you can crack and resubmit and get several different grades. I have always agreed with General Mangini that grading is a scam. Sadly, it's a necessary evil for several reasons. Excellent topic.
There should be no obligation to disclose previous grades. The grader is responsible for determining any card condition / authenticity/ altered or not, etc
Another awesome video Mike and Chris. Always love when you guys pick each other’s brains on topics we all care about. Thanks so much. And have fun this weekend! Enjoy yourself… And I’m not talking about the Cowboys lol
Great conversation
Thanks for the show. 😊
If they put invisible ink on all cards isn’t that altering them? That would prove than the authentication is more important than the damn card.
I believe PSA only uses the fugitive ink for signed items. They might even be using it for bats. But yes, it is indeed altering the item.
Enjoyable discussion, hope Chris can do a tour of your collection and we get a video of it.
The points you made about grading and the fact that collectors/dealers put so much credence in the random number on the flip are the very reasons I transitioned from cards to memorabilia. Waaaay too much importance is put on a random 3rd party’s opinion and it soured me on card collecting for good.
Great content, definitely on board with keeping vintage all natural 👌
Great video! For what it's worth, regarding the ink that PSA will put on autographed items, according to the PSA FAQ: "When an item is certified with documentation (not encapsulation), we will apply our invisible, synthetic, DNA-laced ink to the item, in conjunction with our tamper-evident label and matching Certificate of Authenticity (COA) or Letter of Authenticity (LOA)." If I understand this correctly, the ink is NOT applied to slabbed items, but to loose items accompanied by a COA or LOA.
CGC/Comics are having a rough time right now. But "pressing" old comics is 100% accepted in that hobby and is a service offered by the leading grader CGC (who's suffering through a very costly slab failure currently). Grading is what it is. It's an amazingly fallible process. But we are collector's simply either choose to accept grading for what it is (and certain grading companies in particular) until we simply no longer care to.
Awesome show Thank You
In comics, dealers will often say " CPR Candidate" meaning Crack Press and Resubmit Candidate. Bc Pressing amd cleaning is so prevalent. I would guess that 99% of non-ultra modern comics are pressed and Cleaned prior to grading. And the only time a book isn't, is when the costs doesn't work.
Good show today! I had a DiMaggio ball a guy claimed his dad got it signed in person. Turned out to be an Operation Ballpark Signature. I wrote Operation Ballpark on the ball and gave it away. Chris was right about the Wild West before grading companies. My disappointment with the Dallas Show, is it's only 6 times a year. I could go every weekend. There are not enough shows in the Metroplex. I just never know what I'm going to find unexpectedly. I'm out hunting at least one day every weekend, for many years.
I unsuspectingly bought a few Operation Bullpen items too. The forgeries made by that crew are still floating around in abundance, especially fake Mantle and DiMaggio signatures.
I cracked and re sent one time and ended up getting a 10 and ended up moving the card, but i had worked on it polished it and used a microfiber and openly disclosed it. They still didn't mind and went through with the deal so I think most people don't care until its vintage about restoration grading companies won't be able to tell what's been restored or what's original to the card
The main advantage with buying vintage graded cards is that you weed out all the fakes / reprints. It’s almost impossible to buy raw vintage cards on eBay because of all the scammers .
I like the finger rule and a good wipe down, especially on the chromies. Otherwise, just leave it alone. Some of these flaws are what gives each card their unique personality and that's OK
Hot topic for sure. I find it quite intriguing that the accepted policy changes between mediums. For instance. As is often noted, comics are regularly cleaned and pressed and that is fully acknowledged and accepted. Coins, on the other hand, are considered ruined if they are cleaned, even though they may “look” nicer all polished up, an old luster and patina is widely thought as being better. When you get to fine art, the “greats” are regularly cleaned, and even restored by museums. Old autographed baseballs were often lacquered to protect the signature. Personally, I’m ok with restoring to what the item was like when originally created, but not adding to or removing from, eg pressing and cutting edges or corners. I look forward to Dave bluejacket66 and John Mangini having their debate on this.
Maybe I should try Strongsville some day...might be the best shot I have of finding vintage racing, outside of Indianapolis.
And card shows are fun no matter what. LOL
I collected as a boy 1957-1962 mostly. I sorted cards by teams and if someone got traded I moved them to the new team. I noticed some cards that Topps had airbrushed the logos off the traded player’s hat. I had a permanent ink pen (pre-Sharpie but same type ink) and I’d dab it on the traded player’s hat logo myself (for dark hats). Now I look at those cards and wish I hadn’t done that. 😔 I’ve tried acetone and it sort of works but also takes off card printed ink if I’m too aggressive. These are my cards and I’m never selling them, but my kids mights when I’m gone. Thankfully, these were mostly “commons”. All I have to say is good thing Mantle, Mays and Aaron were not traded. 😅
I pulled an 87 FleerJordan Sticker out of a pack at Burbank Sportscards in 1991. Sent it to PSA years later, and it came back 'Trimmed'. Sent it off to another Grading company and it came back a 7. You never know....
Agreed on the finger only fixing a card . More than that is manipulating and decieving .
So, erasing a child’s pencil mark on a card would be considered manipulating and deceiving?
Just because you buy a slabed card doesn't mean it's real or not trimmed they make fake slabs to .Dan the card man did a video on how easy it is to crack slabs open and glue them back
You admit you likely have cards that were altered or trimmed not caught by graders in your collection, but you're unwilling to buy an Authentic Altered graded card with strong eye appeal?
I have no issues with someone removing tape residue, gum, etc. and my not being made aware it. Even soaking out creases is OK. I hold the line on trimming and coloring.
Interesting video - always pick up good advice from you both.
As far as things like the Satchel Paige autographed letter, that isn't real. I would create a document and place it in my trust so that when the collection is dispersed, it will be documented that it's not a real autograph, and it won't go out "into the wild".
The oversized Honus Wagner card is the ultimate altered debate card.
I ran into an instance today where a card didn’t go through the ebay authentication process because it had the word “Set” in it. Complete sets don’t go through the process so I would be warned about cards that say “Set break”
I did not know that. Interesting.
Will not solve this is But I would really like for PSA to tell you the date a card was graded. Beckett does this. At least you know from what certain era the graded card came from these tools to restore them, ahem forge up cards was not available or Not As Available. The grading companies need to come up with an accepted history Provenance of a graded card. All the established grading companies would have to accept some established method of this Provenance. I'm not expecting this anytime soon. I think the Sportscard Hobbyists have to force something more from the grading companies to take better policing action on these card Forgeries because that's what they are essentially. On autographs also. Establish some hot line for people to report when they discover restored forged card & auto's.
Good video - would be against the UV ink on my cards. I guess an autographed card is already marked with the autograph so it is different in my mind. Great video and lots of food for thought. Of course we own altered cards that were not caught - I do care - but don't worry about it. However, if BODA found a card of mine I would want to be made whole by PSA and would want to buy a different card. Why not write "fake do not sell" on your fakes?
I believe that pre-Ultra Modern cards that are above low grade should potentially be looked over by a team of three to draw a conclusion. Especially for HOF rookies. Chris' Koufax story is ridiculous.
30:00 watch this invisible ink end up ruining the cards down the road.
I've had slabbed autos for a long long time and no issues so far.
Art / paintings get restored all the time . Should cards be different?
We get opinions on all sorts of other things in life.. Are we mad when we don't like someone else's opinions 🤔🤷♂️
There are many collectors who have a better eye than many professional graders. So yeah. A PSA 8 card is only an opinion of one grader on that particular day. Not questioning a grade is for those collectors who have a bad eye and who have no clue how to see the imperfections in cards.
Everyone’s definition of ‘altered’ is a bit different. If there was a pencil mark on the white border of a card, wouldn’t it be tempting to erase it? Or would one consider that altered? I would be totally fine with that.
I would consider it altered
I believe cleaning a card is ok. Trimming is not. Using humidity is ok to bring life back into the card. Caretakers of fine Art 🎨 pieces clean the dust off old paintings and use humidifier to bring life back to painting and not maje it as brittle. I believe the same should be done to vintage cards. What's the difference?
Edison's expert opinoin was AC current was in no way an acceptable form of electricity. but random psa guy is not to be questioned, lol
Fraud definition: the intentional use of deceit, a trick or some dishonest means to deprive another of his/her/its money, property or a legal right
People who sell custom cards. How are they getting away without the copyrights and licenses?
They shouldn't be but often they are so small of fish that the companies do not go after them.
@@BenchClear yeah true. Probably too small.
I like raw that’s all I buy that’s all I collect. IMO grading is a waste of time and money 💴 😅
Are you guys telling me that the humiliation of having to ask my wife to borrow her pantyhose was all for naught and that I've been wrong to remove wax residue from card fronts?
LOL. You should have been humiliated regardless. Go buy your own pantyhose.
O my God I hate ur sweat shirt @ hat! 😊
You are confusing altering with restoration IMO.
eBay’s feedback program is completely worthless. Forgers and rip-off artists abound with 99% or better feedback. That was not stellar advice for newbies.
Chris is the best, so unassuming and self effacing but commands attention. A paradox. WS would be rated higer if they got rid of wildcards and interleague play and had a five game CS. They should just authenticate a card and not grade it--"buy the card, not the grade." Its not just an opinion---the grade dictates the value.
There are more scammer buyers than scammer sellers. Buyers do that damaged or broken item scam. They also do that wrong item arrived scam. They return some crap to you and eBay always takes their side. Sellers are better people than buyers.
There are definitely some scummy buyers out there. I have encountered that personally and I hate it.
@@BenchClear thanks for acknowledging that! Everyone always craps on sellers but in reality buyers are also a problem
But i feel like this is the main takeaway here---we're altering cards to get a better grade!! Period. Getting one over on the grader to get a higher grade to immediately sell the card. These yahoo's that are altering cards are just trying to cheat the system. SUBJECTIVE GRADING IS ALL WE HAVE. AND WE'RE HAPPY WITH THAT???????
No “disclosure “ necessary or required. A card “is” what it is based on it’s current grade. It may have been graded a dozen different times through multiple grading companies. Grading has ruined the hobby. We are all complicit so we are suffering the consequences.
Vintage cars, furniture, comics & other collectables are RESTORED! Why not cards? Topps & Fleer didn't give a damn about their blades being sharpened and their card sheets going in straight, etc. They certainly didnt care about colation!
So.......altering a card is definately immoral. Restoring a card in response to the manufacturer not giving a crap.......is ALL GOOD.
I began collecting in '66. Nothing Old School about this.
In fact a very good argument can be made that Topps has altered thebcard by having crap print run, roller marks, and fish eye ink dots!
Where the heck is their responsibility and accountability?
Grading cards is another scam if scams. Ppl inspect a card to the minutia level that we will not see.
Card trading is about the traders inspecting the cards and determining its value. So.....you made a mention of ppl writing about grading being a scam......well when you pay for a service and either are disgusted or you feel it has to be cracked and sent back.....WOW! what a great racket that is. I'm in the wrong business.
Expert? Expert's opinion? Really? How much time do they spend on each card? Fight with the wife? Coffee sucked that day? Can t pay bills because the grader isn't meeting his grading metrics......bwahahahahahahaha Lawd Spare Us! 😂🎉😢😮
No mmmm Grading haters are tired of getting ripped off sir! Your generalities are convenient for your argument without any sources or proof.
We all know who sends in ancard and with how much volume get bumps in grading.
Opinions are like......yeah you know......everyone has one.
Complete BS.
Great conversation