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I used them once. As it was dark outside I had no clue why we were in a 'waiting room' after the boarding gate ticket check. Needless to say that I was even more confused when the 'waiting room' started moving 😅
I seen them in a Hollywood movie, don't remener what movie it was. I think it was one of the airport movies. I thought it was some kind of Hollywood ficktion untill I a few years later learned that they actually exist.
One of the Die Hard sequels was supposed to be set at Dulles Airport. I think they shot most of it at LAX but spliced in clips of these mobile lounges to make it look authentic.
I rode one at JFK too, when the plane blew out 2 tires on landing. They stopped the plane on the runway and got us off with these. This was in the late 90s.
@@PhilLesh69 Sort of relevant: LAX has remote gates... but they take passengers on a regular bus, and then they either climb stairs or use a jet bridge from a small lounge (you can see them on a satellite map view at the west end of the airport). And it's the second Die Hard movie that is set at Dulles (and conveniently forgets about the existence of BWI, National Airport, and just about all other airports within 500 miles such as Philly and Pittsburgh, not to mention some Air Force bases)
I actually work at the Montreal airport and have for over 15 years. One of the main reason why Montreal uses these, is because the airport is right in the city and can barely expand. The PTVs are a good way for the airport to have more planes and passengers without actually having to build more. There's actually a plane parking where the PTVs go to and get the passengers back in the terminal. Another thing to consider is speed and space. While a plane is at a gate, it needs to be plugged for electricity and oftentimes the plane will be cleaned, refueled and more all while taking a lot of space at the terminal. The PTVs at montreal have 4 gate (show in the video) and they take the same amount of space of what 1 regular gate would. Montreal airport being so weirdly made and needed much space, this helps a lot to save space. By the way tom, you should do an episode during the winter on the snow equipement the airport has. Montreal airport is unique in the weather it has during the winter and oftentimes other airports come visit to see the equipment and methods they use. It's quite a sight to behold!
@@abdullahalam2088 Each city has some interesting aspects to it. Edmonton is very dry and so cold; Vancouver is so mild and wet; but Montréal is intense all over the place.
In Barcelona Airport they have some of these buses and they uses them to lift handycapped people to the plane (when they are not connected to the terminal finger)
Big props to them for acquiring the blueprints and manufacturing rights, they really doubled down on being able to supply these things for decades to come
The airport management must realize that these PTVs are required for the operation to be sustainable, so it took such extreme measures to ensure an uninterrupted supply. As we see in the video, the work is done by AccessAir, not the airport itself.
As a life long, frequent user of Dulles, it surprises me to hear that other passengers don't like the mobile lounges. I still get excited every time I ride in one!
Singular thing I enjoy about the arms is that after 4 hours sitting in the plane, even if I get to stand up once or twice, I get all kinds of... stiff. I need to move to pump the fluids around the body for a bit, before getting stuck on passport control or baggage claim or whatever, so I enjoy the short walk. However I would definitely be OK with waiting inside the mobile lounge as opposed to getting out and into the bus, really, and then walking from there to the baggage claim - it's the same thing.
Yes, my reaction was that these have been used at Dulles forever. Which shows how old and outdated Dulles is. They’re one of the worst aspects of flying through Dulles.
I have mobility problems and often use a wheelchair when out and about, and when I last flew, I was taken to and from the planes in a much smaller version of one of these. It really was a godsend, meaning no stairs, lounge to plane service without worrying about which gate to be at and so on. It would be so good if these larger ones had become the norm, as they would benefit everyone, not just disabled people like myself.
@@Isaac-eh6uu airports notoriously suck for people with physical disabilities, so anything that can make things easier for them is worth implementing
A close cousin of these are in use for helping passengers with mobility issues board planes, at least in Reykjavik. My husband and I were there this past summer, and there were a lot of planes using the remote-boarding strategy. My husband was recovering from a broken foot, so we were flagged for mobility assistance. They loaded about eight of us onto a very small version of one of these that docked at one of the doors that wasn't being used for the main loading, and we were able to get off and on the plane without needing to navigate stairs.
They retrofitted a cargo transport to provide that service for Bill Clinton when he was briefly in a wheelchair during an official visit at CPH airport . CPH doesn't have mobile passenger launches and services all VIP flights from an old terminal building on the opposite side of the airport than civilians (because that location is easily secured with military teams) .
That would have made my recent Euro sojourn so much easier. At almost every airport I travelled within Europe, I was on that plane that docked remotely… with a mobility issue.
Hi Tom. The transfer vehicle you rode was originally deployed at Montreal's now defunct Mirabel Airport (CYMX). The main passenger terminal was designed with these in mind and skybridges were only added later. Pilots used to nickname the vehicles "submarines" because the roof pillars resembled conning towers.
Montreal Mirabel was an excellent and horrible airport at the same time due to these. For boarding, they were quite good as you could get a lot of people from the terminal to every door of the aircraft. For deplaning, they were problematic as they would empty out directly into the passport control hall which could not process inbound passengers fast enough. I spent many an hour sitting on these things just waiting for a door to open up only to have them form part of the queue to go though passport control.
If this thing used to be at Mirabel and is now at Montreal and that means at one point in time, one glorious afternoon, somebody was asked to drive a passenger transfer vehicle down the freeway that must have been a glorious day for the lucky driver
Scott's ability to get behind the curtains and get an insider look at how many things work in our world is astounding. I wonder how many times he gets denied despite his vast connections....
His videos offer their subjects plenty of good and extremely cheap publicity, and he almost always tells positive stories. I'd be surprised if many people turn him down.
From what I see and read, it appears the responsible parties contact Tom more often than not. I recall Tom saying that anyone doing so must have the authority to invite him onto the site to observe and record the operation. With over 6 million subscribers, I imagine the channel is big enough that it's self-sustaining in that regard. Now he's on the non-schedule schedule, there won't be as many but hopefully we'll see him again before long.
As a frequent Dulles airport user, the main problem with these lounges is that you often have to wait 16 to 30 minutes for them to show up after your long flight.
Do you think replacing them by ordinary buses can fix the problem? Definitely not. So, it's just the matter of if your airline includes airbridge fee in your ticket price or not.
@@dutchman7623 placing an aircraft right to the terminal can cost much higher than you think. Do you know that during the COVID airlines still were paying millions of USD to the airports to secure their slots even though the flights were suspended?
As someone who lives near Dulles airport, I thought these looked familiar! I don’t think Dulles uses these to directly board planes anymore, but they are still in use to transport people between some airport terminals. The docking functionality is used to align directly with the external terminal doors on both ends of the trip so that you can board and disembark the transport vehicle without stepping outside.
I had a flight into Dulles about a year ago that had an issue with the jet bridge. They pulled up a mobile lounge to the right side door and we just disembarked into that. It drove us back to the main terminal directly. Definitely handy for situations like that.
Dulles is my airport. I haven't used them to board, but when I come back on an international flight, they put one on each end of the plane and take us to the international terminal.
@@m0ondoggy Oh cool! I don’t think I’ve ever flown internationally back to Dulles, but it’s cool to hear they still use them to disembark flights sometimes.
The cynic in me says that making people walk through large pedestrian terminals means they can go past lots of shops, and that makes more money for the airport, and so that will also have influenced the choice to have skybridges as well.
That's definitely an indirect influence here. The desire to include more shopping inflated the size of terminals, which made jetbridges a more viable option even as the planes continued to get bigger. That, combined with the higher simplicity and lower cost of jetbridges, led to PTVs being a very niche solution.
All they need is a few vending machines and they could also include a thing called "Sky Bridge Mall" where they try and sell you expensive pens, perfumes and luggage scales.
@@bungee7503considering Heathrow takes a cut of every sale if your shop doesn't make profit they will turf you out. Bizarrely busses are faster than air bridges and that's why Ryan and easy jet always use them.
As a VA native that’s been to Dulles a fair share of times, the “mobile lounges” are generally hated because it means more sitting and waiting to get to another terminal (they don’t go directly to planes). They’re phasing them out now that they have a subway to travel between terminals. Not sure if it’s actually faster but certainly feels like less waiting.
Exactly, if they actually took you to board the plane, that would be awesome. But as shuttles between terminals, they suck… The metro they put in is so much nicer
You know, I was thinking "I've been to Dulles several times and don't recall these" but now that you mention you don't actually board planes on them I think I can recall them. I wish I'd boarded planes from them though.
Reminds me of the story where people complained about waiting around for baggage in an airport, and so they just swapped the baggage carousel so they had to walk further. Complaints dropped since they were walking instead of sitting around.
Because of how the international terminal is designed, they’re stuck with them as there’s no secure corridor for Arrivals to Customs. The amount of money that would have to be spent on correcting that could build a new terminal, which is what they’re doing now. A new terminal is being built in former cargo apron, and then the United C and D gate Terminal will be rebuilt, and then the international A and B gate Terminal will be rebuilt. It’ll take the rest of this century for that to happen lmao but it’s talked about.
I rode one of the Dulles ones! They were using it as an inter-terminal transport, driving passengers between the three non-contiguous terminals. At the same airport, I've also traveled between terminals on an antique but normal bus, and a subway tram. I always got a kick out of the fact that they used three different vehicles to move passengers between different parts of the airport, and had no idea until now that what I was riding in was one of Saarinen's mobile lounges. In Dulles's defense, they have a unique need for lots and lots of motorized passenger _transit_ between terminals.
When they built the tram/subway system, one of the terminals was supposed to be temporary, as they were going to build a new one. So, they did not put a tram stop there, as why bother when it's going to be torn down soon anyway? Fast forward over a decade and the new one isn't built, and the 'temporary' one is still being used, and can only be accessed via bus or these 'People Movers'@@WingsTM
I think adding traffic to the tarmac was probably a consideration too. Add this to the baggage, fuel and maintenance vehicles driving around it could make things a bit more complicated to organise (not to mention adding another point of failure) which I'm sure was a consideration at large hub airports
It would eliminate the need for those extremely heavy pushback vehicles, though, and the problems they introduce (flight crews needing to request a pushback and wait for that to happen, the potential for hitting stuff with the plane as they're pushing them out, and the complexities of returning to a gate if the plane has to wait after being pushed back) so it might just be a wash.
These could potentially reduce traffic. Often i've left a terminal to get onto a bus, to go to the plan to get up some stairs. These remove the need to have the stairs potentially.
remember that planes have to sit around currently if theres nowhere to dock. if the little cars went to go pick people up you wouldnt have queues of planes trying to unload at the same time.
The entire Dulles airport feels like a monument to 60's Era techno-optimism and what became of it in practice. And no one who goes there frequently leaves without an opinion of these big "You thought you were there, but you're not yet" trucks.
I had to suffer the PTVs at Dulles back in the 1990s and I think they were just using them to unload passengers from the gates due to a lack of capacity. So if your flight was later than its ETA, off you and all the other passengers would go onto the PTV to await the arrival of your flight somewhere way out on the tarmac.
The look and feel of it reminds me of Thunderbirds or Captain Scarlet and the Mysterons. (And the way it was originally designed around having as many docking sequences as possible contributed to that!) But the newer peripheral terminals where you usually actually access the plane don't have the same vibe.
@@vulpo Exactly. One of the reasons for choosing buses was that their use reduced the terminal size and therefore cost very substantially. Dulles goes into meltdown quite frequently as the terminal starts to fill precisely because it is so small, so the buses are used to relieve the overcrowding.
Do they still use them there? Haven’t been in Dulles for months but only remember these being used in 2019 when the airline I fly with had to park in a remote stand while there were some jobs being done in the airport. Haven’t used it since and never seen anywhere else in the world. Not even in Dulles actually.
Tom Scott sightings are now becoming something of a rare pokemon in my life. I walked passed him outside my workplace when I lived in london. Then a few days ago saw "someone who looked just like him" walking down saint-catherine here in Montreal, and here we are getting a video from him in Montreal. Probably see you in another few years, Tom :D
I rode these often at Dulles when I used to travel for work. They're mostly gone now. Like a lot of others, I was never really a fan. I think it was mostly because you were getting off a cramped metal tube and were shoved directly into a cramped metal box right away. When disembarking the plane there was this feeling that you'd be able to decompress, but that feeling would fade once you got on the people mover. To hear that they were called "mobile lounges" is a riot. More like a city bus with an open floor plan!
As someone who grew up flying out of IAD (and still do occasionally) I’m very happy to see they exist elsewhere. I remember being a kid and thinking they were the coolest thing ever. Unfortunately I only got to experience them as a people mover between terminals
That’s all they do at Dulles, they don’t take you directly to the plane. So it’s just one more opportunity to wait in line and an extra boarding/de-boarding step 😕
Man, I really do enjoy how Tom narrates these videos. It takes a truly talented individual to be able to captivate people no matter what the topic is, but Tom does it every time.
@moonrazk To you, they might all be interesting topics by themselves, but for me, not so much. If it wasn't for Tom I'd probably not watch a video on a ferry boat that's hand pulled to the other side. Or that bridge with the super cheap crossings. Sure some of the topics speak for themselves, but with Tom narrating any topic is enjoyable to watch.
I love when Tom admits he isn't allowed to do something like he does at the end of this video. Just a small reminder that while he is incredibly blessed to go see all these great things, sometimes there are small security reasons that keep him a little more relatable.
I'd hazard a guess it's less to do with security (C'mon...He's airside! 😉) and more to do with the very different training you'd need to be able to drive one of those safely. The vertical lifting part isn't so much the issue (I guess they can only do this once parked/secured) but the *huge* blind spots on these must take the expression « _Angles Morts_ » to a whole new ~ahem~ level! 🧑🦯🚌😇
@@dieseldragon6756 Since I very much doubt he has an airside driving licence, especially for whichever category this vehicle falls into, it's probably got to do with with airside safety more than security.
@@dieseldragon6756 the biggest problem is the airport itself. You cannot just drive around, you have to get clearance and watchout for any traffic/obstacle etc. If it was somewhere else, like abandoned factory, they would likely let him drive.
Thank you for mentioning Dulles. I had flown in there twenty years ago and rode the mobile lounge and couldn't remember for the life of me which airport it was. Tanks again!!!
Unfortunately I think they're being phased out since there's a new train that goes between terminals. They are super fun though, especially going up and down
I've flown out of Montreal and have experienced these mobile lounges. For me, the main drawback was that it took significantly longer to get to and from the terminal to the plane. I'm glad that I didn't have any connecting flights when I had to use these.
We got them from the Mirabel airport north of Montreal that was supposed to become Canada's international port of entry. That never panned out for many reasons (highways and train connections were not built, plane range let them reach Toronto direct, Trudeau/Dorval airport ended up being able to scale up), but the PTVs remain.
Ah Mirabel, you'd arrive, exit the plane onto the bus, exit the bus into the terminal, the carousel for you luggage was right in front of you, bags took 5 minutes, exit the baggage claim through customs onto the bus for YUL, taxi home.
@@thijsjuffermans9402I imagine this being preferable for countries where the weather is sufficiently garbage that walking outside for a bit from the airplane to the bus would leave you cold, wet, covered in snow or all at once
Nah smaller airport don't have the need or budget for this. Like they said in the video those are best used as overspill management on bigger airports on busy days. Smaller airport either are tarmac boarding or smaller terminals.
Seems like this could also make boarding more efficient. Half the passangers on one, half on the other and board the mobile lounge by zones so you could distribute them from front to back. Idk just thinking of further applications.
It kind of make sense. The mobile lounge can move while the plane is still being cleaned and really just dock the very last second. Also boarding should be a lot faster not limited by neither tickeing nore stairs
In Washington DC I was very surprised when I saw one of these rolling up to the plane. I didn't know anything like this even existed and seeing it roll around the tarmac made me think the sleep deprivation was getting to me.
They don't roll up to the plane in DC. You go through a jetway into the terminal, and then board the moving lounge from the terminal. It's terribly obnoxious.
At IAD they have been in use since the airport opened, and they are still used both for transport between terminals and for international arrivals. And a lot more than 8.
@@raisschultz420It was seriously annoying. I had a connection in IAD and after deplaning I walked as fast as I could, only to be directed into one of these... and told we wouldn't be moving until everyone else joined us. So I sat there looking at my watch while all the people who stopped to go to the washroom slowly finished, caught up and crammed inside. If it was direct plane to terminal, it wouldn't have been so bad since at least everyone would board at the same time.
I've used these at Dulles and have found them frustrating. We load (usually over load) and wait, luggage jammed cheek to jowl, standing on top of each other, like in a subway car while the thing loads fully, then carefully disengages from the terminal and rolls to... an island terminal in the center of the tarmac, where we once again wait as people slowly debark, half the people dragging feet as they try to figure out where they are. I've also ridden them almost empty, which was a dream, but that's the rarity.
I had no idea these weren't common around the world! I love your ability to take something from my own backyard that I either took for granted (like this one) or had no idea about (like the 20m diving platform) and make it fascinating.
The original concept was closer to having the mobile lounge be the waiting area where you sit for your gate now. I rode them a few times back in the 80&90s when Dulles still still docked them onto the planes. I was always in the 1% that liked the tour ride through the airport. Dulles still uses them to take passengers between the main terminal and the D gates and to the international arrivals terminal.
Seems like we could greatly reduce aircraft taxiing time, and simplify the overall design of an airport into a bus/shuttle station/building, an aircraft parking lot + fuel depot near the runway, plus a fleet of these shuttles between the two. Make em autonomous+electric to boot.
@@FlynBeeVRYes! And with low cost airlines now being so conscious of maximising flight time versus taxi and block time, this would really help both the airlines and the pax.
@@FlynBeeVR IMO they can even make the "bus" as trailer to the staircase thingy reducing the complexity of the whole thing, on second thought they should fix it at the plane height and let the lower part of the car for luggage, simplifying check-in/out process
I rode one just recently at Washington Dulles International Airport. Those Plane Mates seemed coming straight from the 1970's. Even the interior odor was fitting...
It's actually the case in Montréal. There was a bad political decision to transfer international flights from Mirabel to Dorval. Mirabel was built outside the city for international flights with space to expand while Dorval is in the city and was built for local flights with very little space to expand.
@@fcormierMirabel used these too even though that was a larger airport, it is likely these are the ones from Maribel and moved over to Trudeau because they look exactly the same just with a refit.
Whaaaaaaat!? When you started the video, I instantly recognized the surrounding buildings and trees. I work at YUL, and it would've been amazing to meet you. I hope you enjoyed your stay!
My home airport, Washington Dulles, has these and they genuinely are the coolest thing to ride on! Even got to take a tour of their maintenance operation and see how they worked internally.
As you noted correctly, Dulles International Airport in Herndon, Virginia still has and uses these. I love the historic pic you used at 2:13, which shows them at the back of the airport. Essentially you would check in, walk across to the right one and be driven to your plane. Now when you walk into Dulles airport, you can still see the back area where those were meant to dock for all customers. As the airport has since expanded to a gate system, most people proceeded downstairs into tunnels for security check. To occasionally exit a plane, or to be taken to gate D, passengers will still be boarded onto them.
Many years ago I arrived at Dulles one evening, and no gate was available, so we deplaned via the mobile lounges. Went straight to the terminal. I always liked them.
This would have saved me so much of a panic years ago if they had them at Heathrow. I flew Manchester > Heathrow and then changed there to a flight to San Francisco. They didn't send enough buses to disembark everyone at Heathrow and with the flight already being delayed me and this poor much older lady had to run between terminals 1 and 5 to try desperately to make our connection. We made it, but our luggage didn't and I had to wait hours at the other end for my luggage to finally be put on the next flight and shipped to my hotel. I was only 19 and flying by myself, so it was very, very stressful.
Ah you made the classic mistake of flying through heathrow! Nah but in all seriousness it’s sad how poorly heathrow is managed, especially the ground operations.
I noticed them at mirabel and Dorval airport in Montreal since I was a kid and always wanted to see more about these machines, I love their design with the two hips on the roof! Thank you for coming to town to give us that inside view! Merci!
As mentioned, Dulles Airport (IAD), outside DC, USA, uses these too, they’ve had it for a very long time. They are kind of fun. Some don’t even use a screw drive to lift up/down.
Interesting! I always assumed the 'lumps on top' were to make them look more like planes, and be easier to spot from the tower. I've only ever seen them at IAD, i had no idea other airports were using them too! The mobile lounges at IAD are one of my earliest memories of air travel.
Those PTV are fund memory of travelling here in Qc for me. They were mainly used in Mirabel Airport (Now only a freight airport) build in the 70s but was significantly easier to travel vs Trudeau airport! I really appreciate all your recent videos in our "Belle Province" ! cheers
Those are called Transbordeurs locally. They where used at the Mirabel airport terminal, which was build on the design of using them exclusively to board planes and used them for easily 20 years. Jetbridges where later added. When the airport passenger terminal was closed down a lot of them ended just sitting on the tarmac for years. Some where moved back to the YUL (trudeau airport) as extra.
Many big airports actually do have at least some smaller version of these buses. They are called ambulifts. They are used for passengers with reduced mobility (e.g., in wheelchairs) if the boarding process requires passengers to use stairs (whether at the gate or at the aircraft). Those unable to handle the stairs can be transported by such a bus and boarded into the aircraft from the other side. Source: been there, done that :)
I live about 5 miles from Dulles Airport. As Dulles built additional midfield terminals, the lounges were used to transport passengers between the main and midfield terminals. I've gone for many a ride in them. Today, a subway system connects the terminals, although the lounges are still used occasionally when necessary.
I have used the ones at Dulles several times. They are typically used to bring arriving international passengers to the Immigration and Customs area. They still transport passengers between the terminals but mostly now that is done with the underground train.
Dulles have them in Washington too ! Ridiculous things … the biggest fail. More walking and queuing! Somewhere else to board … so you get to board twice ! 🤦♂️
That was absolutely fascinating! As someone with mobility "difficulties" (to say the least), they'd be a godsend to me. As it is, having heard from others who have been treated like cattle (they are sure some staff have cattle prods), I'm not planning on flying again.
The one time I ever flew into Taupo airport in New Zealand, about 15 years ago, they just unfolded the stairs off the plane, and were like "okay everyone out you get". And then unloaded everyones bags into a trailer and were like "ok go get them". This all happened at the end of the runway and from there I was to just walk a few steps to the carpark and go on my way - nothing blocking strangers from driving onto the runway if they really wanted to.
They have these at Heathrow Airport! Scissor version for people with reduced mobility, certainly helpful in the nasty rain. Capped at 15mph apparently when I was in it.
I will say, even though it just connects two concourses, the shuttle system that docks to the building at IAD is very cool. It just drives through the ramp area and docks to the building. Like a little room on wheels.
You brought back my memory of using those at Dulles in the 60s or 70s. Until recently they were still used to get from terminal to terminal there ... until they put in the train.
THANK YOU TOM! You finally answered a question I have failed to find an answer for. I had seen the "big lumps", I called the "Sails", at Dullas. I noticed that some had them and some didn't. Now I know what they are and why some have them and some don't.
I haven’t fact checked this, but if I’m not mistaken, the ones at YUL were inaugurated at the then-new Montreal Mirabel (YMX) airport and they broke down on their maiden voyage with several heads of state on board. It was an omen of YMX’s fate…
It was actually at the Olympics of '76: Mirabel only opened less than a year before and indeed one of those PVTs broke down with a few important deligation members on board. As a result, the opening ceremony was delayed, as they needed those people that were stuck.
Used one once at Dorval airport, I always thought they were taken from mirabel after they shut it down since they have an old look to them, nice to hear the story behind it.
I was on one of those in the DC airport when I came back from Europe back in 2015. I've seen them at lots of planes and I remember as a kid being at the St. Louis Airport with my parents and watching one of these things board as a 6 year old I remember waving to the lady in the driver seat and her being unexpected by it and laughing and waving back at me. This video is awesome because it explained those big vertical stabilizer looking things that I've seen them all with. That was cool, I never thought too much about these vehicles outside of seeing them.
Très intéressant! - Montreal is my home airport. In fact, I will be picking up family there this afternoon. Very cool! I didn't know how unique these "PTVs" were until now. Thank you!
There's an airport by me that the terminal is all one, small building (and at the time, had no AC). There was a single store with nothing to drink (because it was so hot, they had sold out). When it's time to board, you walked straight out onto the tarmac and went up a ramp into the plane.
Montreal used to have a second airport - Mirabel. It was built in the 70's. It had no gates at the terminal. All passengers were loaded onto Plane-Mates and taken to the plane. Mirabel did not last long. Obviously, there was a lot of technology sitting around doing nothing. Dorval the existing airport does not really have room for new terminals. Therefore, having an external boarding system works fine.
I like the idea for bigger airports so you don’t have to walk for ages to get where you want, it would be very handy to just have a single hallway with all the gates. It could also simplify and shrink all the taxiways if all the planes didn’t have to drive all over the airport to get to their gate.
It would not shrink taxiways and apron space because the plane still takes up the same space while parked as it does with a jet bridge. But some space might be saved by not needing to extend the terminal all the way to every gate.
I've been on one, it must have been Washington Dulles. I still think about it sometimes! It blew my tiny mind. I absolutely loved it, a departure lounge that detaches itself from the terminal and floats you over to the airplane. The stuff of sci-fi dreams!
I love that tarmac isn't really an aviation term but it's slowly worked its way just as any other term to be silently accepted as a way to refer to the taxiway and ramp.
Imagine such moving rooms might include passport control, customs control, duty free shops, rent car offices, etc. It's like a mini airport, where you can theoretically do all the usual airport stuff while commuting to the terminal, and the terminal itself might transform to the single exit door.
I always thought it would be cool if a plane could have it's seats on tracks like a roller coaster. You could board in the lounge at your leisure, then the train of seats would be driven into the plane as soon as it was ready, with all It could be modular so you could choose your own seat if you needed extra legroom and the seating arrangement would be built automatically for each flight, cleaning gets done elsewhere.
I had a similar thought, but where the cabins are essentially interchangeable capsules. So you'd take your actual seat at the gate, complete with overhead loading, then the whole thing would be lifted into the chassis of the plane, and locked in place. Another system to go wrong, sure, but also allows for problems to be dealt with in isolation. Problem with the cabin? Move everyone to a new one. Problem with the plane / chassis? Same solution. Obviously late-stage capitalism means leveraging every asset to the hilt, so there would be no spares unless you increase penalties for delays / cancellations to the point where it's the economically preferable option.
I was on one of these years ago. After raising the compartment, the driver moved forward and bumped the terminal building. All of us standing were knocked down. Luckily the compartment was very crowded, so we ended up just sort of laying on each other. It was funny to see the reaction of the people in the terminal when they opened the door and we literally spilled out.
That doesn’t surprise me. Those things have literally killed people before. Also, the door opens wide enough that you could literally slip through and fall onto the tarmac. I once noticed that and had to be careful where I step
As somehow who grew up outside Washington D.C. and frequently flew out of Dulles, I had no idea these were so uncommon. I was also a kid and had no real concept of the inconvenience they can cause for commuters, I was usually going on an annual vacation, so I always loved them.
Haha! I remember when I was a child we used to board these in the now cargo-only Mirabel Airport. These were nice and are still, and maybe it would save some fuel for large planes having to taxi up to the gate instead of staying near the appron. I guess we'll see if they make a comeback later.
Hi Tom, nice to see that you’re back in Quebec looking at some of the interesting things we have here. In the 70s Montreal had a second airport up at Mirabel and it to use the same type of bus transport to and from the airplanes. So when I saw the thumbnail I am mediately thought back to what we had at the other airport. Mike from Montreal. PS I’m going to miss your videos when you stop at the end of the year. And I do like your emails. Everyone should subscribe as there’s always something interesting in them.
Having read about Mirabel, I'm still surprised they never bit the bullet and moved _all_ Montreal flights to it. Instead, they kept domestic and US flights at the old airport, and anyone connecting between them had to take a long bus ride between airports. ...Which kinda killed Montreal's overseas traffic, as passengers and airlines alike found it easier to connect through Toronto instead. Not all of that traffic came back after Montreal gave up and let overseas flights into the old airport again.
My clearest memory of the Dulles mobile lounges was a particular trip where I was running a bit late, and in my haste got the gate number for my flight wrong. I realized it just after the mobile lounge I though I was supposed to ride to the gate had started underway. It was a rough few minutes as the lounge slowly made it's way across the tarmac. Luckily, all it meant was I had to run a bit further to get to the right part of the terminal, but for a while, I was wishing those would go just a bit faster.
I've ridden them many times at Washington Dulles, but in my experience, the Dulles ones don't go directly to planes - just between the main terminal and remote concourses. Autonomous trains have replaced most of the routes (and plans are in place to complete that conversion), and I'm glad for it - the trains are much simpler and faster.
As a native of Washington, DC, I'm very familiar with the PTVs at Dulles International Airport (IAD) - which is actually in Virginia. You essentially disembark your plane into a hub, then walk 50-100 feet to a PTV and wait until it is full or about 10 minutes have passed, get driven to the main terminal where you walk another 100 feet to your assigned baggage carousel for your luggage that takes about 10-20 minutes to arrive. Contrast that with Los Angeles Airport (LAX), where you have to walk half a mile or more to reach your gate or pick up your luggage, and the planes are always having to wait for place to disembark, sometimes for an hour or more.
Love when I depart and arrive in those small regional airports - there are no buses, no sky ramp or other exotic boarding contraptions. As Tom says toward the end of the video, we all like to move under our own motive power, and I'm no exception. The doors of the terminal open directly on the apron, and we walk maybe 100 metres to reach the aircraft directly. But this is becoming increasingly rare. Thank you Mr. Scott for the highlight of these unique vehicles used at Montreal airport. Greetings, Anthony
I LOOOVE riding those “people movers” whenever I return to DC. It’s such a quirky little part of my returns to the USA and I’ve never seen them anywhere else. I joked with friends that I’d steal one and travel the world with it. Can you imagine speeding on these on the autobahn in Germany 😅😅😅
That reminds me of the stop over in Madrid. I came from South-America (I think Santiago) and had to take a plane to Belgium. The plane from Santiago parked at the very end of the tarmac. We were taken with a bus to the terminal, the arrivals for intercontinental flights, where we had to walk a long way to the terminal to the departures European flights. At the exit was a bus waiting, which brought us to the plane... parked just next to the one we had left a few hours before.
LOVE the animation by Ray and Charles Eames!! huge fan of their work!! (if you're interested, their Powers of Ten short film - or films, since there are two versions - are fantastic!)
As an airside driver at Heathrow transporting cabin/cockpit crews from the aircraft to the hotels, I've only seen something similar for disabled passengers operated by Wilson James, although remote stands are only used due to technical aircraft, they still use regular buses to transport passengers from a remote stand to the terminal hub
The most frustrating thing about these not being the norm is that this would make dealing with larger planes simply a matter of allocating them more space on the tarmac. This is important because longer wings mean more efficient aircraft, but aircraft are limited by having to fit airport gates.
They must also fit runways, taxi-ways, de-icing stands, and oh, yes, hangars. Even if you can fit one super-jumbo, their wings may clip the wings of another plane on the parallel taxiway; turning might also be problematic. Like the two-ox rule for cars, you need a really great economic reason to break compatibility with Olde Ways. Even if you took advantage of folding wing-tips, you still have to be able to get a plane from the air to a hangar in the case where the tips won't fold.
The adoption of Passenger Transport Vehicles (PTVs) at airports might gain traction due to advancements in automation, which could increase reliability and simplify airport construction and usage. Furthermore, in situations where a gate is inoperable, PTVs offer flexibility by efficiently transporting passengers to alternate locations without the need for extensive infrastructure modifications, potentially enhancing operational continuity and efficiency.
I knew I had been on one of these! During the family trip in the summer of 1979. We started at Dulles, wound our way to Nova Scotia, then back to Virginia, and left via Dulles.
This week's pinned-comment plug is for my podcast! There are interesting questions and even more interesting answers for free every week: search 'Lateral' wherever you get your podcasts, or visit lateralcast.com
cool
cool
I still want full video versions of lateral.
Hey Tom! What happened to your "taking a break" vid?
Thank you Scott (Im an avgeek)
I used them once. As it was dark outside I had no clue why we were in a 'waiting room' after the boarding gate ticket check. Needless to say that I was even more confused when the 'waiting room' started moving 😅
Ha that must've been so cool, getting off a plane into a waiting room where you can see out of and it STARTS MOVING!
😂 that's hilarious. I'd love to experience that sometime
Everybody gangsta 'till the waiting room becomes a moving room.
My experience was via TWA and it hardly had windows and it was dark due to the nighttime
The waiting room was done waiting around
I rode one of these at JFK in 1987. I borderline thought I had imagined the whole thing, so thanks for confirming this was indeed real.
You can finally rest after 36 years of wonder and confusion 😄
I seen them in a Hollywood movie, don't remener what movie it was. I think it was one of the airport movies.
I thought it was some kind of Hollywood ficktion untill I a few years later learned that they actually exist.
One of the Die Hard sequels was supposed to be set at Dulles Airport. I think they shot most of it at LAX but spliced in clips of these mobile lounges to make it look authentic.
I rode one at JFK too, when the plane blew out 2 tires on landing. They stopped the plane on the runway and got us off with these. This was in the late 90s.
@@PhilLesh69 Sort of relevant: LAX has remote gates... but they take passengers on a regular bus, and then they either climb stairs or use a jet bridge from a small lounge (you can see them on a satellite map view at the west end of the airport).
And it's the second Die Hard movie that is set at Dulles (and conveniently forgets about the existence of BWI, National Airport, and just about all other airports within 500 miles such as Philly and Pittsburgh, not to mention some Air Force bases)
I actually work at the Montreal airport and have for over 15 years. One of the main reason why Montreal uses these, is because the airport is right in the city and can barely expand. The PTVs are a good way for the airport to have more planes and passengers without actually having to build more. There's actually a plane parking where the PTVs go to and get the passengers back in the terminal.
Another thing to consider is speed and space. While a plane is at a gate, it needs to be plugged for electricity and oftentimes the plane will be cleaned, refueled and more all while taking a lot of space at the terminal. The PTVs at montreal have 4 gate (show in the video) and they take the same amount of space of what 1 regular gate would. Montreal airport being so weirdly made and needed much space, this helps a lot to save space.
By the way tom, you should do an episode during the winter on the snow equipement the airport has. Montreal airport is unique in the weather it has during the winter and oftentimes other airports come visit to see the equipment and methods they use. It's quite a sight to behold!
The winter snow management in any of the big cities in Canada would make a good video tbh. It's quite amazing how efficiently is done.
@@abdullahalam2088 Each city has some interesting aspects to it. Edmonton is very dry and so cold; Vancouver is so mild and wet; but Montréal is intense all over the place.
In Barcelona Airport they have some of these buses and they uses them to lift handycapped people to the plane (when they are not connected to the terminal finger)
Got like 999, guess it's maxed out now :p
Montreal airport is too small when it comes to picking up passengers outside with your car, or dropping them off. It’s like wow
Big props to them for acquiring the blueprints and manufacturing rights, they really doubled down on being able to supply these things for decades to come
Unlike at Washington, where the cost of repairing or replacing the mobile lounges is prohibitive.
The airport management must realize that these PTVs are required for the operation to be sustainable, so it took such extreme measures to ensure an uninterrupted supply. As we see in the video, the work is done by AccessAir, not the airport itself.
As a life long, frequent user of Dulles, it surprises me to hear that other passengers don't like the mobile lounges. I still get excited every time I ride in one!
Singular thing I enjoy about the arms is that after 4 hours sitting in the plane, even if I get to stand up once or twice, I get all kinds of... stiff. I need to move to pump the fluids around the body for a bit, before getting stuck on passport control or baggage claim or whatever, so I enjoy the short walk.
However I would definitely be OK with waiting inside the mobile lounge as opposed to getting out and into the bus, really, and then walking from there to the baggage claim - it's the same thing.
Yes, my reaction was that these have been used at Dulles forever. Which shows how old and outdated Dulles is. They’re one of the worst aspects of flying through Dulles.
According to Grey they’re the worst things ever. Calls em the AT-AT
I grew up in Reston, so if we flew it was out of Dulles. I thought mobile lounges were normal haha
I have mobility problems and often use a wheelchair when out and about, and when I last flew, I was taken to and from the planes in a much smaller version of one of these. It really was a godsend, meaning no stairs, lounge to plane service without worrying about which gate to be at and so on. It would be so good if these larger ones had become the norm, as they would benefit everyone, not just disabled people like myself.
Thanks for sharing!
wouldn't really be helpful to non disabled passengers except for the cases where it is replacing a bus maybe. But not when replacing an air bridge.
Agreed, I once flew with a disabled relative in a smaller version too and it was infinitely more comfortable for them. Shame that option is so rare
Seems like it would only benefit disabled people.
@@Isaac-eh6uu airports notoriously suck for people with physical disabilities, so anything that can make things easier for them is worth implementing
A close cousin of these are in use for helping passengers with mobility issues board planes, at least in Reykjavik. My husband and I were there this past summer, and there were a lot of planes using the remote-boarding strategy. My husband was recovering from a broken foot, so we were flagged for mobility assistance. They loaded about eight of us onto a very small version of one of these that docked at one of the doors that wasn't being used for the main loading, and we were able to get off and on the plane without needing to navigate stairs.
Yes, they have- or had- one at Aarhus airport a few years ago, also for passengers with mobility issues. Appeared to work well.
They retrofitted a cargo transport to provide that service for Bill Clinton when he was briefly in a wheelchair during an official visit at CPH airport . CPH doesn't have mobile passenger launches and services all VIP flights from an old terminal building on the opposite side of the airport than civilians (because that location is easily secured with military teams) .
That would have made my recent Euro sojourn so much easier. At almost every airport I travelled within Europe, I was on that plane that docked remotely… with a mobility issue.
I was just thinking it would have been nice to have one when we boarded at a remote stand at KEF.
Hi Tom. The transfer vehicle you rode was originally deployed at Montreal's now defunct Mirabel Airport (CYMX). The main passenger terminal was designed with these in mind and skybridges were only added later. Pilots used to nickname the vehicles "submarines" because the roof pillars resembled conning towers.
I was wondering when someone would mention Mirabel...
Yup, I rode them when flying out of Mirabel. Rode them a few times in Dorval too.
Montreal Mirabel was an excellent and horrible airport at the same time due to these. For boarding, they were quite good as you could get a lot of people from the terminal to every door of the aircraft. For deplaning, they were problematic as they would empty out directly into the passport control hall which could not process inbound passengers fast enough. I spent many an hour sitting on these things just waiting for a door to open up only to have them form part of the queue to go though passport control.
Huh. I would've gone for something more surface navy. Because the masts look like ship's masts.
If this thing used to be at Mirabel and is now at Montreal
and that means at one point in time, one glorious afternoon, somebody was asked to drive a passenger transfer vehicle down the freeway
that must have been a glorious day for the lucky driver
Scott's ability to get behind the curtains and get an insider look at how many things work in our world is astounding. I wonder how many times he gets denied despite his vast connections....
His videos offer their subjects plenty of good and extremely cheap publicity, and he almost always tells positive stories. I'd be surprised if many people turn him down.
From what I see and read, it appears the responsible parties contact Tom more often than not. I recall Tom saying that anyone doing so must have the authority to invite him onto the site to observe and record the operation.
With over 6 million subscribers, I imagine the channel is big enough that it's self-sustaining in that regard. Now he's on the non-schedule schedule, there won't be as many but hopefully we'll see him again before long.
As a frequent Dulles airport user, the main problem with these lounges is that you often have to wait 16 to 30 minutes for them to show up after your long flight.
Do you think replacing them by ordinary buses can fix the problem? Definitely not. So, it's just the matter of if your airline includes airbridge fee in your ticket price or not.
@@Dondriver12345 Airbridge fee? Pilot fee? Stuart fee? Tax? Tips?
Off course everything should be included! Delivery well and alive.
@@dutchman7623 placing an aircraft right to the terminal can cost much higher than you think. Do you know that during the COVID airlines still were paying millions of USD to the airports to secure their slots even though the flights were suspended?
That's not a problem with the lounges per se but how the airport chooses to operate them.
@@Dondriver12345 - They have largely been replaced by an underground train, at Dulles.
As someone who lives near Dulles airport, I thought these looked familiar! I don’t think Dulles uses these to directly board planes anymore, but they are still in use to transport people between some airport terminals. The docking functionality is used to align directly with the external terminal doors on both ends of the trip so that you can board and disembark the transport vehicle without stepping outside.
I had a flight into Dulles about a year ago that had an issue with the jet bridge. They pulled up a mobile lounge to the right side door and we just disembarked into that. It drove us back to the main terminal directly. Definitely handy for situations like that.
It reminds me of Airport 1975 movie, until he mentions the inspiration comes from Dulles
Dulles is my airport. I haven't used them to board, but when I come back on an international flight, they put one on each end of the plane and take us to the international terminal.
@@m0ondoggy Oh cool! I don’t think I’ve ever flown internationally back to Dulles, but it’s cool to hear they still use them to disembark flights sometimes.
@@m0ondoggysame here! I've flown international into Dulles several times and can confirm these still see some use!
Gonna miss your videos Tom! Thank you so much for everything you have given us over the last 10 years, truly amazing!
Is he quitting
@@abzy2470 He will stop uploading consistently on mondays soon
Anyone know how many videos are left until the break?
@@nh808 I think until the end of this year? so that would be 8 more
@@rajkushwaha4107So is he quiting?
The cynic in me says that making people walk through large pedestrian terminals means they can go past lots of shops, and that makes more money for the airport, and so that will also have influenced the choice to have skybridges as well.
A common observation is that Heathrow is a shopping centre with a runway attached.
That's definitely an indirect influence here. The desire to include more shopping inflated the size of terminals, which made jetbridges a more viable option even as the planes continued to get bigger. That, combined with the higher simplicity and lower cost of jetbridges, led to PTVs being a very niche solution.
All they need is a few vending machines and they could also include a thing called "Sky Bridge Mall" where they try and sell you expensive pens, perfumes and luggage scales.
@@bungee7503considering Heathrow takes a cut of every sale if your shop doesn't make profit they will turf you out. Bizarrely busses are faster than air bridges and that's why Ryan and easy jet always use them.
On arrival, even on those with a bus ride you still have to walk past a few shops after baggage claim, so it would be the same with one of these
As a VA native that’s been to Dulles a fair share of times, the “mobile lounges” are generally hated because it means more sitting and waiting to get to another terminal (they don’t go directly to planes). They’re phasing them out now that they have a subway to travel between terminals. Not sure if it’s actually faster but certainly feels like less waiting.
Exactly, if they actually took you to board the plane, that would be awesome. But as shuttles between terminals, they suck… The metro they put in is so much nicer
You know, I was thinking "I've been to Dulles several times and don't recall these" but now that you mention you don't actually board planes on them I think I can recall them. I wish I'd boarded planes from them though.
Reminds me of the story where people complained about waiting around for baggage in an airport, and so they just swapped the baggage carousel so they had to walk further.
Complaints dropped since they were walking instead of sitting around.
Because of how the international terminal is designed, they’re stuck with them as there’s no secure corridor for Arrivals to Customs. The amount of money that would have to be spent on correcting that could build a new terminal, which is what they’re doing now. A new terminal is being built in former cargo apron, and then the United C and D gate Terminal will be rebuilt, and then the international A and B gate Terminal will be rebuilt. It’ll take the rest of this century for that to happen lmao but it’s talked about.
I rode one of the Dulles ones! They were using it as an inter-terminal transport, driving passengers between the three non-contiguous terminals. At the same airport, I've also traveled between terminals on an antique but normal bus, and a subway tram. I always got a kick out of the fact that they used three different vehicles to move passengers between different parts of the airport, and had no idea until now that what I was riding in was one of Saarinen's mobile lounges. In Dulles's defense, they have a unique need for lots and lots of motorized passenger _transit_ between terminals.
why does dulles have three disconnected terminals?
When they built the tram/subway system, one of the terminals was supposed to be temporary, as they were going to build a new one. So, they did not put a tram stop there, as why bother when it's going to be torn down soon anyway? Fast forward over a decade and the new one isn't built, and the 'temporary' one is still being used, and can only be accessed via bus or these 'People Movers'@@WingsTM
I think adding traffic to the tarmac was probably a consideration too. Add this to the baggage, fuel and maintenance vehicles driving around it could make things a bit more complicated to organise (not to mention adding another point of failure) which I'm sure was a consideration at large hub airports
It would eliminate the need for those extremely heavy pushback vehicles, though, and the problems they introduce (flight crews needing to request a pushback and wait for that to happen, the potential for hitting stuff with the plane as they're pushing them out, and the complexities of returning to a gate if the plane has to wait after being pushed back) so it might just be a wash.
These could potentially reduce traffic.
Often i've left a terminal to get onto a bus, to go to the plan to get up some stairs.
These remove the need to have the stairs potentially.
remember that planes have to sit around currently if theres nowhere to dock. if the little cars went to go pick people up you wouldnt have queues of planes trying to unload at the same time.
But this wouldn't replace gates, just the buses that already have all those issues.
Well yes, they would be a point of failure, but jet bridges can fail too. And they do!
The entire Dulles airport feels like a monument to 60's Era techno-optimism and what became of it in practice. And no one who goes there frequently leaves without an opinion of these big "You thought you were there, but you're not yet" trucks.
I had to suffer the PTVs at Dulles back in the 1990s and I think they were just using them to unload passengers from the gates due to a lack of capacity. So if your flight was later than its ETA, off you and all the other passengers would go onto the PTV to await the arrival of your flight somewhere way out on the tarmac.
The look and feel of it reminds me of Thunderbirds or Captain Scarlet and the Mysterons. (And the way it was originally designed around having as many docking sequences as possible contributed to that!) But the newer peripheral terminals where you usually actually access the plane don't have the same vibe.
@@vulpo Exactly. One of the reasons for choosing buses was that their use reduced the terminal size and therefore cost very substantially. Dulles goes into meltdown quite frequently as the terminal starts to fill precisely because it is so small, so the buses are used to relieve the overcrowding.
Do they still use them there? Haven’t been in Dulles for months but only remember these being used in 2019 when the airline I fly with had to park in a remote stand while there were some jobs being done in the airport. Haven’t used it since and never seen anywhere else in the world. Not even in Dulles actually.
@@Press2GetTheCookie It's still in use. I usually find myself in them when arriving on international flights.
Tom Scott sightings are now becoming something of a rare pokemon in my life.
I walked passed him outside my workplace when I lived in london.
Then a few days ago saw "someone who looked just like him" walking down saint-catherine here in Montreal, and here we are getting a video from him in Montreal.
Probably see you in another few years, Tom :D
Always wanted to just spot him somewhere near me but sadly idk if there is anything interesting enough for him near where I live lmao
I choose to believe he was making a collab with Ryan George when he noticed the PTVs.
@@bernier42 now that would be an epic Collab but would be very confusing to have two people without the same face lmao :)
@@toamastarit's in your hands. Surely there is something interesting in your area. You just have to find it and recommend it to Tom.
you seem to do a lot of walking.
I rode these often at Dulles when I used to travel for work. They're mostly gone now. Like a lot of others, I was never really a fan. I think it was mostly because you were getting off a cramped metal tube and were shoved directly into a cramped metal box right away. When disembarking the plane there was this feeling that you'd be able to decompress, but that feeling would fade once you got on the people mover. To hear that they were called "mobile lounges" is a riot. More like a city bus with an open floor plan!
They are mainly used for international flights to transport travelers to customs.
As someone who grew up flying out of IAD (and still do occasionally) I’m very happy to see they exist elsewhere. I remember being a kid and thinking they were the coolest thing ever. Unfortunately I only got to experience them as a people mover between terminals
That’s all they do at Dulles, they don’t take you directly to the plane. So it’s just one more opportunity to wait in line and an extra boarding/de-boarding step 😕
I remember them at Dulles too. If they're not connecting you to the plane then they may as well build an underground connection with autowalk.
@@sandal_thong8631 They have built a metro, but it doesn’t connect all the terminals
Back in my day, we would cling onto the wing of the plane in the middle of a storm and frighten people who looked out the window, like REAL Americans.
Bruh
Some airlines have introduced this as a seating tier below economy class. I heard William Shatner is doing the commercials.
Unless it's William Shatner.
People have it so easy now days. Sad how far we've fallen.
@@Whatwherewhy586 Still not near as far as I used to fall back in my day.
Man, I really do enjoy how Tom narrates these videos. It takes a truly talented individual to be able to captivate people no matter what the topic is, but Tom does it every time.
A bit silly to say "no matter what the topic is", it's not like he's going out of his way to find uninteresting topics.
@moonrazk To you, they might all be interesting topics by themselves, but for me, not so much. If it wasn't for Tom I'd probably not watch a video on a ferry boat that's hand pulled to the other side. Or that bridge with the super cheap crossings. Sure some of the topics speak for themselves, but with Tom narrating any topic is enjoyable to watch.
@@moonrazk Some topics are more interesting than others though... it all depends on your own interests.
I love when Tom admits he isn't allowed to do something like he does at the end of this video. Just a small reminder that while he is incredibly blessed to go see all these great things, sometimes there are small security reasons that keep him a little more relatable.
I'd hazard a guess it's less to do with security (C'mon...He's airside! 😉) and more to do with the very different training you'd need to be able to drive one of those safely. The vertical lifting part isn't so much the issue (I guess they can only do this once parked/secured) but the *huge* blind spots on these must take the expression « _Angles Morts_ » to a whole new ~ahem~ level! 🧑🦯🚌😇
@@dieseldragon6756 Since I very much doubt he has an airside driving licence, especially for whichever category this vehicle falls into, it's probably got to do with with airside safety more than security.
But his TH-cam cred should let him go just about anywhere but military zones.
@@dieseldragon6756 the biggest problem is the airport itself. You cannot just drive around, you have to get clearance and watchout for any traffic/obstacle etc. If it was somewhere else, like abandoned factory, they would likely let him drive.
@@dieseldragon6756 Based upon the vehicle size and capacity, it likely requires a commercial driver license with passenger endorsement.
Thank you for mentioning Dulles. I had flown in there twenty years ago and rode the mobile lounge and couldn't remember for the life of me which airport it was. Tanks again!!!
The wide shot of the 2 PTVs driving across the tarmac are somehow adorable. 1:13
I had the joy of experiencing this at Washington Dulles Airport. It was crowded but still exciting riding a lifted bus
Dulles Airport has a people mover! It's so much fun to take it around the planes waiting to takeoff.
I've ridden one there. I was young; and when you're just starting your journey, it becomes part of the adventure.
Unfortunately I think they're being phased out since there's a new train that goes between terminals. They are super fun though, especially going up and down
Before they were used to go between the concourses, they were used to board planes just like in the video.
i rode one at Dulles in 2020, i think it moved me between terminals
Dulles has trains between a few of its terminals, but these still remain in use for 2 of the terminals
After having Brady and Grey talk about them for so many years on Hello Internet its cool to finally actually get a closeup look 😂
Kkkkk
Does this make Tom a Tim?
I had the same thought! It's the AT-ATs!
Was looking for someone with an HI reference 😁
I miss the podcast 😢
I've flown out of Montreal and have experienced these mobile lounges. For me, the main drawback was that it took significantly longer to get to and from the terminal to the plane. I'm glad that I didn't have any connecting flights when I had to use these.
We got them from the Mirabel airport north of Montreal that was supposed to become Canada's international port of entry. That never panned out for many reasons (highways and train connections were not built, plane range let them reach Toronto direct, Trudeau/Dorval airport ended up being able to scale up), but the PTVs remain.
Ah Mirabel, you'd arrive, exit the plane onto the bus, exit the bus into the terminal, the carousel for you luggage was right in front of you, bags took 5 minutes, exit the baggage claim through customs onto the bus for YUL, taxi home.
That bus looks so cool, I think it really has some niche market in smaller airports around the world
thing is, using a normal bus and a regular staircase is just way cheaper and easyer.
smaller airports don't have remote parking, since there are less planes...it's a problem only large airports have
@@thijsjuffermans9402I imagine this being preferable for countries where the weather is sufficiently garbage that walking outside for a bit from the airplane to the bus would leave you cold, wet, covered in snow or all at once
Nah smaller airport don't have the need or budget for this. Like they said in the video those are best used as overspill management on bigger airports on busy days. Smaller airport either are tarmac boarding or smaller terminals.
Small-medium airports will have buses complementing bridges. Smaller airports will just point you to your plane.
Seems like this could also make boarding more efficient. Half the passangers on one, half on the other and board the mobile lounge by zones so you could distribute them from front to back. Idk just thinking of further applications.
It kind of make sense. The mobile lounge can move while the plane is still being cleaned and really just dock the very last second.
Also boarding should be a lot faster not limited by neither tickeing nore stairs
In Washington DC I was very surprised when I saw one of these rolling up to the plane. I didn't know anything like this even existed and seeing it roll around the tarmac made me think the sleep deprivation was getting to me.
They don't roll up to the plane in DC. You go through a jetway into the terminal, and then board the moving lounge from the terminal. It's terribly obnoxious.
@@raisschultz420originally IAD did have them roll up to the aircraft
At IAD they have been in use since the airport opened, and they are still used both for transport between terminals and for international arrivals. And a lot more than 8.
@@frednbauerBut they do not ever pull directly up to a plane, just to terminals (at least while I’ve been alive)
@@raisschultz420It was seriously annoying. I had a connection in IAD and after deplaning I walked as fast as I could, only to be directed into one of these... and told we wouldn't be moving until everyone else joined us. So I sat there looking at my watch while all the people who stopped to go to the washroom slowly finished, caught up and crammed inside.
If it was direct plane to terminal, it wouldn't have been so bad since at least everyone would board at the same time.
I've used these at Dulles and have found them frustrating. We load (usually over load) and wait, luggage jammed cheek to jowl, standing on top of each other, like in a subway car while the thing loads fully, then carefully disengages from the terminal and rolls to... an island terminal in the center of the tarmac, where we once again wait as people slowly debark, half the people dragging feet as they try to figure out where they are. I've also ridden them almost empty, which was a dream, but that's the rarity.
all while breathing in jet and diesel exhaust. They really suck at IAD
Yes, they’re awful. The metro is so much nicer. If they actually took you to your plane, it would be different
We had these at Dulles (IAD) in Wash DC from the 1960s. They seem cool, but when routinely used they're a pain in the ass.
I had no idea these weren't common around the world! I love your ability to take something from my own backyard that I either took for granted (like this one) or had no idea about (like the 20m diving platform) and make it fascinating.
Of all the people to see on a Tom Scott video, somehow you're one of the most likely
Speedrun plane-boarding when?
Surely if you used these you would have noticed that every destination you visited didn't have them?
@@martrmbn I've flown twice in my life.
Lived here 8 years and have flown nationally and internationally from the Montreal airport and have never seen them.
The original concept was closer to having the mobile lounge be the waiting area where you sit for your gate now. I rode them a few times back in the 80&90s when Dulles still still docked them onto the planes. I was always in the 1% that liked the tour ride through the airport. Dulles still uses them to take passengers between the main terminal and the D gates and to the international arrivals terminal.
Seems like we could greatly reduce aircraft taxiing time, and simplify the overall design of an airport into a bus/shuttle station/building, an aircraft parking lot + fuel depot near the runway, plus a fleet of these shuttles between the two. Make em autonomous+electric to boot.
@@FlynBeeVRYes! And with low cost airlines now being so conscious of maximising flight time versus taxi and block time, this would really help both the airlines and the pax.
Imagine the cost of having these things stand around working as waiting areas...
@@FlynBeeVR IMO they can even make the "bus" as trailer to the staircase thingy reducing the complexity of the whole thing, on second thought they should fix it at the plane height and let the lower part of the car for luggage, simplifying check-in/out process
I literally just learned about this yesterday. What a coincidence.
I rode one just recently at Washington Dulles International Airport. Those Plane Mates seemed coming straight from the 1970's. Even the interior odor was fitting...
IAD is a unique airport with designs straight from the 60s or 70s. I love how it feels, but they should definitely consider a major renovation
Something about extremely specific use vehicles just fascinates me, thanks for another informative video.
You should take a look at the giant soviet vehicle that walks very slowly, the ESH 6/45
@@jmiquelmb I live about 20km from one. No joke.
I think an electric variant of these could work well in airports in crowded cities where expansion space is limited
I think these would be critical to allow some airports expansion where sprawling buildings aren't a possibility.
@@TheNiteinjail Thing is, at the end of the day, a bus and a set of stairs does the same job.
It's actually the case in Montréal. There was a bad political decision to transfer international flights from Mirabel to Dorval. Mirabel was built outside the city for international flights with space to expand while Dorval is in the city and was built for local flights with very little space to expand.
@@fcormierMirabel used these too even though that was a larger airport, it is likely these are the ones from Maribel and moved over to Trudeau because they look exactly the same just with a refit.
@@wloffblizz Swap your set of stairs for either a ramp or stairs AND a small elevator, and I can agree.
Whaaaaaaat!? When you started the video, I instantly recognized the surrounding buildings and trees. I work at YUL, and it would've been amazing to meet you.
I hope you enjoyed your stay!
My home airport, Washington Dulles, has these and they genuinely are the coolest thing to ride on! Even got to take a tour of their maintenance operation and see how they worked internally.
I used them once or twice at Montreal's "new" Mirabel airport during its short life as a passenger airport.
As someone who wishes traveling by plane had significantly less walking, I wish we'd gotten these in more places.
yah big same. im a cane user and my dad has a walker; and the incline to get on and off the planes are abslute hell for bolth of us
sometimes the walks are forever, especially when your gate is at the furthest end
More walking means less waiting for your luggage. Not sure if it's true, but Heathrow supposedly did that to reduce passenger complains.
I don't mind the walking, it offsets all the sitting you do otherwise.
That’s why it’s critical for airports to have golf carts for people like you. You are being accommodated and we’re getting our walk, it’s a win win
As you noted correctly, Dulles International Airport in Herndon, Virginia still has and uses these. I love the historic pic you used at 2:13, which shows them at the back of the airport. Essentially you would check in, walk across to the right one and be driven to your plane. Now when you walk into Dulles airport, you can still see the back area where those were meant to dock for all customers. As the airport has since expanded to a gate system, most people proceeded downstairs into tunnels for security check. To occasionally exit a plane, or to be taken to gate D, passengers will still be boarded onto them.
tunnels? what?
The people movers are used at Dulles everyday as they are the only way to get passengers between the main terminal and Concourse D.
You still have to ride them to get to the D Gates since there's no train connection there.
Thank you guys, I took it once before and memory didn't serve... I will make the correction
Many years ago I arrived at Dulles one evening, and no gate was available, so we deplaned via the mobile lounges. Went straight to the terminal. I always liked them.
My father was one of the engineering team members. I remember him going to Dulles get these movers going. Seeing them again brings a spark of life
This would have saved me so much of a panic years ago if they had them at Heathrow. I flew Manchester > Heathrow and then changed there to a flight to San Francisco. They didn't send enough buses to disembark everyone at Heathrow and with the flight already being delayed me and this poor much older lady had to run between terminals 1 and 5 to try desperately to make our connection. We made it, but our luggage didn't and I had to wait hours at the other end for my luggage to finally be put on the next flight and shipped to my hotel. I was only 19 and flying by myself, so it was very, very stressful.
Ah you made the classic mistake of flying through heathrow! Nah but in all seriousness it’s sad how poorly heathrow is managed, especially the ground operations.
man, one makes the most unlikely friends during flights
I noticed them at mirabel and Dorval airport in Montreal since I was a kid and always wanted to see more about these machines, I love their design with the two hips on the roof! Thank you for coming to town to give us that inside view! Merci!
As mentioned, Dulles Airport (IAD), outside DC, USA, uses these too, they’ve had it for a very long time. They are kind of fun. Some don’t even use a screw drive to lift up/down.
Interesting! I always assumed the 'lumps on top' were to make them look more like planes, and be easier to spot from the tower. I've only ever seen them at IAD, i had no idea other airports were using them too! The mobile lounges at IAD are one of my earliest memories of air travel.
Tom Scott never fails to bring out that inner child in me and for that I'm truly grateful
Those PTV are fund memory of travelling here in Qc for me. They were mainly used in Mirabel Airport (Now only a freight airport) build in the 70s but was significantly easier to travel vs Trudeau airport! I really appreciate all your recent videos in our "Belle Province" ! cheers
Mirabel>PET. It's a shame what happened with that airport and everything.
Airport management wants you to walk through 1000 shops before you fly anyway, so why spend the extra to let you leave so easily?
Those are called Transbordeurs locally.
They where used at the Mirabel airport terminal, which was build on the design of using them exclusively to board planes and used them for easily 20 years. Jetbridges where later added.
When the airport passenger terminal was closed down a lot of them ended just sitting on the tarmac for years. Some where moved back to the YUL (trudeau airport) as extra.
You and CGPGrey could solve this problem together.
Then get made fun of by Alan Fisher
The answer is trains. Always trains.
@snowdrop9810 ahem
NORTHFOLK SOUTHERN WHAT'S YOUR FUNCTION-
@snowdrop9810 This is one situation where trains would _not_ make sense. Trains follow tracks, they can't line up perfectly with an aircraft door.
@@kingkoopa64 Hookin' up freight cars and loco-motin'...
Many big airports actually do have at least some smaller version of these buses. They are called ambulifts. They are used for passengers with reduced mobility (e.g., in wheelchairs) if the boarding process requires passengers to use stairs (whether at the gate or at the aircraft). Those unable to handle the stairs can be transported by such a bus and boarded into the aircraft from the other side. Source: been there, done that :)
Likewise, from loading the aircraft. The dispatcher on the loading team has to organise it (at least at my airport).
I live about 5 miles from Dulles Airport. As Dulles built additional midfield terminals, the lounges were used to transport passengers between the main and midfield terminals. I've gone for many a ride in them.
Today, a subway system connects the terminals, although the lounges are still used occasionally when necessary.
I have used the ones at Dulles several times. They are typically used to bring arriving international passengers to the Immigration and Customs area. They still transport passengers between the terminals but mostly now that is done with the underground train.
Dulles have them in Washington too !
Ridiculous things … the biggest fail.
More walking and queuing! Somewhere else to board … so you get to board twice ! 🤦♂️
That was absolutely fascinating! As someone with mobility "difficulties" (to say the least), they'd be a godsend to me. As it is, having heard from others who have been treated like cattle (they are sure some staff have cattle prods), I'm not planning on flying again.
The one time I ever flew into Taupo airport in New Zealand, about 15 years ago, they just unfolded the stairs off the plane, and were like "okay everyone out you get". And then unloaded everyones bags into a trailer and were like "ok go get them". This all happened at the end of the runway and from there I was to just walk a few steps to the carpark and go on my way - nothing blocking strangers from driving onto the runway if they really wanted to.
They have these at Heathrow Airport! Scissor version for people with reduced mobility, certainly helpful in the nasty rain. Capped at 15mph apparently when I was in it.
Been on one of these in Montreal! they are so cool! Hope you enjoyed Montreal Tom!
More moving parts mean more crashes. Fewer moving pieces mean the likihood of a plane being damaged goes down.
I will say, even though it just connects two concourses, the shuttle system that docks to the building at IAD is very cool. It just drives through the ramp area and docks to the building. Like a little room on wheels.
You brought back my memory of using those at Dulles in the 60s or 70s. Until recently they were still used to get from terminal to terminal there ... until they put in the train.
Still used there for international arrivals to get you from the gate to the customs line.
THANK YOU TOM! You finally answered a question I have failed to find an answer for. I had seen the "big lumps", I called the "Sails", at Dullas. I noticed that some had them and some didn't. Now I know what they are and why some have them and some don't.
I haven’t fact checked this, but if I’m not mistaken, the ones at YUL were inaugurated at the then-new Montreal Mirabel (YMX) airport and they broke down on their maiden voyage with several heads of state on board. It was an omen of YMX’s fate…
It was actually at the Olympics of '76: Mirabel only opened less than a year before and indeed one of those PVTs broke down with a few important deligation members on board. As a result, the opening ceremony was delayed, as they needed those people that were stuck.
Used one once at Dorval airport, I always thought they were taken from mirabel after they shut it down since they have an old look to them, nice to hear the story behind it.
I was on one of those in the DC airport when I came back from Europe back in 2015. I've seen them at lots of planes and I remember as a kid being at the St. Louis Airport with my parents and watching one of these things board as a 6 year old I remember waving to the lady in the driver seat and her being unexpected by it and laughing and waving back at me. This video is awesome because it explained those big vertical stabilizer looking things that I've seen them all with. That was cool, I never thought too much about these vehicles outside of seeing them.
Très intéressant! - Montreal is my home airport. In fact, I will be picking up family there this afternoon. Very cool! I didn't know how unique these "PTVs" were until now. Thank you!
There's an airport by me that the terminal is all one, small building (and at the time, had no AC). There was a single store with nothing to drink (because it was so hot, they had sold out). When it's time to board, you walked straight out onto the tarmac and went up a ramp into the plane.
Montreal used to have a second airport - Mirabel. It was built in the 70's. It had no gates at the terminal. All passengers were loaded onto Plane-Mates and taken to the plane. Mirabel did not last long. Obviously, there was a lot of technology sitting around doing nothing. Dorval the existing airport does not really have room for new terminals. Therefore, having an external boarding system works fine.
Excellent video by someone who knows how to find things that we never knew we wanted to know about and present them in such an interesting way.
I like the idea for bigger airports so you don’t have to walk for ages to get where you want, it would be very handy to just have a single hallway with all the gates.
It could also simplify and shrink all the taxiways if all the planes didn’t have to drive all over the airport to get to their gate.
It would not shrink taxiways and apron space because the plane still takes up the same space while parked as it does with a jet bridge. But some space might be saved by not needing to extend the terminal all the way to every gate.
I've been on one, it must have been Washington Dulles. I still think about it sometimes! It blew my tiny mind. I absolutely loved it, a departure lounge that detaches itself from the terminal and floats you over to the airplane. The stuff of sci-fi dreams!
I love that tarmac isn't really an aviation term but it's slowly worked its way just as any other term to be silently accepted as a way to refer to the taxiway and ramp.
In Britain we use the word tarmac to refer to roads as well so it's used in everyday language here
In British (and Commonwealth) English, "tarmac" has been used to refer to what we Americans call the "ramp" or "apron" at airports for decades.
Tarmac is short for tarmacadam from the Scottish inventor as I remember.
Excellent video by someone who knows how to find things that we never knew we wanted to know about and present them in a way that makes
Imagine such moving rooms might include passport control, customs control, duty free shops, rent car offices, etc. It's like a mini airport, where you can theoretically do all the usual airport stuff while commuting to the terminal, and the terminal itself might transform to the single exit door.
I always thought it would be cool if a plane could have it's seats on tracks like a roller coaster. You could board in the lounge at your leisure, then the train of seats would be driven into the plane as soon as it was ready, with all
It could be modular so you could choose your own seat if you needed extra legroom and the seating arrangement would be built automatically for each flight, cleaning gets done elsewhere.
And the aircraft can be that cargo plane military uses
There have been attempts at designing something like this, but the cost of implementing it would be enormous so it never gets done.
I had a similar thought, but where the cabins are essentially interchangeable capsules. So you'd take your actual seat at the gate, complete with overhead loading, then the whole thing would be lifted into the chassis of the plane, and locked in place.
Another system to go wrong, sure, but also allows for problems to be dealt with in isolation. Problem with the cabin? Move everyone to a new one. Problem with the plane / chassis? Same solution.
Obviously late-stage capitalism means leveraging every asset to the hilt, so there would be no spares unless you increase penalties for delays / cancellations to the point where it's the economically preferable option.
The Hello Internet supplemental video we’ve needed for years!
I was on one of these years ago. After raising the compartment, the driver moved forward and bumped the terminal building. All of us standing were knocked down. Luckily the compartment was very crowded, so we ended up just sort of laying on each other. It was funny to see the reaction of the people in the terminal when they opened the door and we literally spilled out.
That doesn’t surprise me. Those things have literally killed people before.
Also, the door opens wide enough that you could literally slip through and fall onto the tarmac. I once noticed that and had to be careful where I step
As somehow who grew up outside Washington D.C. and frequently flew out of Dulles, I had no idea these were so uncommon. I was also a kid and had no real concept of the inconvenience they can cause for commuters, I was usually going on an annual vacation, so I always loved them.
I live near Washington IAD Airport (Dulles) & there are still being used. So cool yet so antique!
Haha! I remember when I was a child we used to board these in the now cargo-only Mirabel Airport. These were nice and are still, and maybe it would save some fuel for large planes having to taxi up to the gate instead of staying near the appron. I guess we'll see if they make a comeback later.
Hi Tom, nice to see that you’re back in Quebec looking at some of the interesting things we have here. In the 70s Montreal had a second airport up at Mirabel and it to use the same type of bus transport to and from the airplanes. So when I saw the thumbnail I am mediately thought back to what we had at the other airport. Mike from Montreal. PS I’m going to miss your videos when you stop at the end of the year. And I do like your emails. Everyone should subscribe as there’s always something interesting in them.
Having read about Mirabel, I'm still surprised they never bit the bullet and moved _all_ Montreal flights to it. Instead, they kept domestic and US flights at the old airport, and anyone connecting between them had to take a long bus ride between airports. ...Which kinda killed Montreal's overseas traffic, as passengers and airlines alike found it easier to connect through Toronto instead.
Not all of that traffic came back after Montreal gave up and let overseas flights into the old airport again.
My clearest memory of the Dulles mobile lounges was a particular trip where I was running a bit late, and in my haste got the gate number for my flight wrong. I realized it just after the mobile lounge I though I was supposed to ride to the gate had started underway. It was a rough few minutes as the lounge slowly made it's way across the tarmac. Luckily, all it meant was I had to run a bit further to get to the right part of the terminal, but for a while, I was wishing those would go just a bit faster.
I've ridden them many times at Washington Dulles, but in my experience, the Dulles ones don't go directly to planes - just between the main terminal and remote concourses. Autonomous trains have replaced most of the routes (and plans are in place to complete that conversion), and I'm glad for it - the trains are much simpler and faster.
As a native of Washington, DC, I'm very familiar with the PTVs at Dulles International Airport (IAD) - which is actually in Virginia. You essentially disembark your plane into a hub, then walk 50-100 feet to a PTV and wait until it is full or about 10 minutes have passed, get driven to the main terminal where you walk another 100 feet to your assigned baggage carousel for your luggage that takes about 10-20 minutes to arrive. Contrast that with Los Angeles Airport (LAX), where you have to walk half a mile or more to reach your gate or pick up your luggage, and the planes are always having to wait for place to disembark, sometimes for an hour or more.
Love when I depart and arrive in those small regional airports - there are no buses, no sky ramp or other exotic boarding contraptions.
As Tom says toward the end of the video, we all like to move under our own motive power, and I'm no exception.
The doors of the terminal open directly on the apron, and we walk maybe 100 metres to reach the aircraft directly.
But this is becoming increasingly rare.
Thank you Mr. Scott for the highlight of these unique vehicles used at Montreal airport.
Greetings,
Anthony
I would make an airport joke but that would just be plane wrong
This one went over my head
BOOOOO
Did you have that joke planned out, or were you just "winging" it?
Man.
Oh my god...
I LOOOVE riding those “people movers” whenever I return to DC. It’s such a quirky little part of my returns to the USA and I’ve never seen them anywhere else. I joked with friends that I’d steal one and travel the world with it. Can you imagine speeding on these on the autobahn in Germany 😅😅😅
so real!! not "mobile lounge" but we always just called them "people movers"... i always loved how silly and to the point that was.
You posted this the same day I landed at Dulles and rode on one of these. Nice.
That reminds me of the stop over in Madrid. I came from South-America (I think Santiago) and had to take a plane to Belgium. The plane from Santiago parked at the very end of the tarmac. We were taken with a bus to the terminal, the arrivals for intercontinental flights, where we had to walk a long way to the terminal to the departures European flights. At the exit was a bus waiting, which brought us to the plane... parked just next to the one we had left a few hours before.
LOVE the animation by Ray and Charles Eames!! huge fan of their work!! (if you're interested, their Powers of Ten short film - or films, since there are two versions - are fantastic!)
As an airside driver at Heathrow transporting cabin/cockpit crews from the aircraft to the hotels, I've only seen something similar for disabled passengers operated by Wilson James, although remote stands are only used due to technical aircraft, they still use regular buses to transport passengers from a remote stand to the terminal hub
I’ve used mini versions for disabled passengers too when travelling with my mum who has mobility needs, quite cool
The most frustrating thing about these not being the norm is that this would make dealing with larger planes simply a matter of allocating them more space on the tarmac. This is important because longer wings mean more efficient aircraft, but aircraft are limited by having to fit airport gates.
They must also fit runways, taxi-ways, de-icing stands, and oh, yes, hangars.
Even if you can fit one super-jumbo, their wings may clip the wings of another plane on the parallel taxiway; turning might also be problematic.
Like the two-ox rule for cars, you need a really great economic reason to break compatibility with Olde Ways.
Even if you took advantage of folding wing-tips, you still have to be able to get a plane from the air to a hangar in the case where the tips won't fold.
The adoption of Passenger Transport Vehicles (PTVs) at airports might gain traction due to advancements in automation, which could increase reliability and simplify airport construction and usage. Furthermore, in situations where a gate is inoperable, PTVs offer flexibility by efficiently transporting passengers to alternate locations without the need for extensive infrastructure modifications, potentially enhancing operational continuity and efficiency.
I knew I had been on one of these! During the family trip in the summer of 1979. We started at Dulles, wound our way to Nova Scotia, then back to Virginia, and left via Dulles.