I agree with other commenters, your face cuts are too shallow. Secondly, this is a poor example of a barber chair because you had cleanly cut 80% of the back cut, and due to a very shallow face cut there was too much vertical compression on the hinge as you neared it so the tree split vertically. A true barber chair which has the potential to kill usually results from an extreme forward leaning tree or the middle of the tree is dead and hollow. As you cut into the back there is extreme vertical compression on the front and releasing tension on the back suddenly splits the tree and kicks the back (cut) wood backwards towards the fellers face. A barber chair is instantaneous, not a slow action which happened to you. Your tree split due to insufficient face cut on a falling tree with too much intact hinge. I recommend you not cut your face cut using the 80% wide estimate but make your face cut at least 1/3 deep into the tree. Even your plunge cut second tree had a shallow face cut as a humboldt should slide down the face notch and “launch” the falling tree forward away from the stump. Yours simply fell without sliding and rolled off to one side at the end…an indication of your face cut being too shallow. You left zero hinge on your second (plunged) tree so it simply fell in whatever direction weight and wind decided. You lucked out was all. I do agree with you that a plunge cut is the way to prevent/minimize barber chairing but plunging is an “advanced” technique. I recommend you better master basic techniques more. We all start from the beginning but felling trees is quite dangerous so it pays to start with the slower methods like a good face cut followed by a back cut, advance to stopping before she goes over and wedge it over, then move to advanced techniques like plunging. When a tree starts to go stop cutting and immediately move away in a 45 degree direction. Trees buck, slide, roll, and branches start flying so move off and then look up once she starts to go. Stay safe and blessed. Thank you for sharing.
@mw3gamer23 I read it. It was a well-worded and thought-out reply to the video. His comment was helpful to me, as it confirmed what I thought watching the video as a fairly novice tree feller. The level of detail, to me showed it wasn't some Monday morning QB comment, but someone with enough experience to make such a comment.🤷🏻♂️
I have watched this video and read the comments and i agree the reason for the barberchair is because of the shallow knotch. If you look closely, this tree was splayed at the base and that is where he knotched. That knotch may have worked if it would have been one foot higher on the tree. Thanks for putting this video out. Much for all of us to learn from.
Put your face cut about a foot off of the ground. Then on the west coast here we use a Humboldt undercut. Because your bar is long enough to go straight across the tree cut off both sides perpendicular to the face cut thickness of your bar. Then cut the back cut about 2 in above the face cut this will allow you a good hinge for the tree. The Humboldt undercut will allow the log to slide off of the stump.
beech is a very notorious wood for splitting....and it sucks to work with it as a board. It cracks and culls even if the tree was grow straight....and I saw where and how he made that notch....needed to be higher and trim that base at least......he is lucky that didn't roll off the split...a whack-back and his head gets removed off his shoulders
@@josephcernansky1794 low notch on that could easily have worked, if the notch was deeper... it's the notch depth that matters more than the height. Cutting low into the flare exaserbates the problem with the shallow notch because the flare is so much wider to cut through, so the back cut ends up much further past center than it would have been if he had made the same notch depth higher.. if that makes sense...
Didn't cut far enough in the tree on the front cut, should cut almost half of the tree's thickness. The notch was not enough angle where you didn't cut far enough in the tree on the front cut, my opinion.
No, he doesn't understand his mistake. He is way to incompetent to be doing this. This weekend warrior bs is gonna get someone killed. Don't congratulate this man like he's an expert, has something to teach or isn't a complete fool. He completely misidentified the mistake. This video made my blood boil.
I've been cutting for 30 years and in the first few years I did many things that were nearly fatal mistakes. If we had youtube back then it would have saved me a lot of dangerous lessons. Videos like this can literally save lives.
Lot of folk would not want to deal with the critical comments. By sharing this you may have saved someone (like me) from making the same mistakes. A man should learn from his mistakes, a wise man can learn from someone else's mistake and an honest man will let others learn from his mistakes. Thanks for posting.
It barber-chaired because the notch is way too small. Should be 2 times that deep and to further help you can cut in an inch on either side of the face cut before you back cut.
Agreed. UK practice on hardwoods (deciduous) is the notch should be 1/3 to half the diameter, giving you a nice, long hinge. Wedges not needed and stand to the side when releasing, not striaght behind. Over here it is common to cut down at around 45 degrees to leave a 'dog's tooth' when releasing- a bit more protection against the butt base shooting back. Your escape route is away at about 45 degrees to the intended direction of fell. Nice to see you felling low down, but when doing so, it's best to take the toes (buttresses) off to make a circular butt before placing felling cuts.
May thoughts exactly, do a proper birds mouth cut 1/3 of the diameter into the trunk then you probably would not need to bore cut it. Just do a standard back cut and you'd be surprised how easy it is.
Thank you for showing the stump as that always tells the story. I see three things that can contribute to the likely hood of a tree to BC and why that tree did. Notch,Hinge, and saw cutting speed. With notch depth , the shallower the depth the slower the tree starts to come over because the farther the hinge is away from the center of gravity of the tree. That is just physics. The back side of the hinge on high side of tree is not parallel with front side and wider than low side. The fine dust tells me that the teeth are not sharp or the rakers are too high. During the back cut the faster a saw cuts the less likely a tree will BC. That doesn't mean that the sawyer needs to hurry, take your time and think and think some more because what is in front of you can kill or severely injure. I see most comments harp on the notch, there are many schools of thought on how deep a notch should be and when to cut shallow or deep notch which I am not going to go there. The fact is, do something different you will get a different result. Now I'm not trying to tell you what or how to cut a tree, I'm just reading the stump with my experience falling trees, I do know when falling the sawyer wants as many stars to come into alignment as possible because the stakes are too high if they don't and there isn't any do-overs! Another safety tip, Look Up ! Then Look Up some more and listen, the tree will talk to you, sound at times can be quicker than sight. I wish you all the best! And Be Safe!!!
I was dispatched to a fatal accident just yesterday. A man was falling a large pine when it barber chaired right into his chest killing him instantly. I kept thinking the whole way home that it didn't have to happen. It was close to other trees and got caught up in another trees branches about a 40 degree angle and just kicked back violently.
I'm literally 3 minutes into your video. And what I'm seeing is. Improper undercut for this tree. And your saw is spine cringing dull. Every tree is different. Hope you boys learn a bit more before the woods slap you one. Be safe, keep learning. And Geez Loose! Had to edit this comment. Your son standing there next to a tree falling/ barber chairing. Is a sure recipe for getting killed. Please don't do that.
I agree, he stood way to close. He usually doesn't do that, but I think he got distracted by what was happening with the tree and stopped at the worst possible time. I had a talk with him about that right after it came down.
@@foresthomestead Glad you had a talk with him. Fortunately, that tree wasn't under extreme stress. Often a barber chair with just explode faster than you can blink. Once you hear that TEARING sound. RUN! 45 degrees back and away. Preferably up hill. One of the biggest problem with cutting wit a saw that's not sharp. Is while falling. The saw can't keep up with the trees movement. Which will cause a barber chair. It other problem is. The operator will tend to push the saw thinking it will cut faster. It won't, and if something goes wrong. Having all that force pushing your saw. Sets you up to just stumbling into the problem. Just like a dull knife. A full saw causes the most injuries. Hey, keep at it, work smart not hard.
Never trust a guy with a bunch of new equipment and looks unsure of himself. This was a good video of what not to do in both cases. Bad technique, shallow face cut and back cut below the hinge are two not only rookie mistakes but dangerous. Maybe instead of making TH-cam videos you should watch a few first.
And always or most of the time have a escaping route 45 degree angle away from the three When I see it to BC I was saying to myself move away 45 degrees fast. The comments before me are very learning from Thank you for taking the time to to explain
What everyone should be commenting on is standing there watching the tree split. When the tree starts to go down run in the opposite direction. When a tree splits like that it can kill you
I heartily agree. I had a talk with my son after the tree was down about this. In the video it looks like he was closer than he was, he was a little over 10' away. Still not nearly enough even if the tree didn't barber chair. One thing I would disagree with, in your statement, is "run in the opposite direction" you should run at a 45-degree angle away from the tree, never get directly behind it. I know what you meant but I don't want other viewers to think it's OK to get behind the direction of fall.
Absolutely right. I was sitting here with my jaw dragging the table, incredulous that the guy just stood there. He was lucky he didn't get speared by a large splinter, or outright impaled. Unbelievable. I hope no one emulates the techniques used in this video (I mean the shallow cutting, cutting inside the mushroomed base of the tree, etc.).
You left a triangle shaped piece of holding wood in the that first tree. The bar wasn't parallel with your notch. Triangles don't make a very good hinge.
Face cut is waaay too shallow. Should have used a humboldt face (1/3 at chest ht dia) to save wood instead of using a vastly improper cut. Spend more time getting falling experience and less shopping for logger trinkets
As others have already commented your face cut is way to shallow, looks like you just squared off the base of the trunk and allowed the weight of the branches to pull the tree over.
If you want to learn how to drop trees, watch Buck'n Billy's channel. Thanks for the video, there is some good info on here, and some mistakes which people can learn from, please be safe.
The undercut is way to small and in your case to low, the tree flares at the base so you have to cut some of the flares and after that put you undercut in. The notch in the back cut is more for heavy leaning trees. We have mostly beech and some oak where I'm from and people die from barber chairs if you're not careful. Always look up and if it starts to barberchair run. Better safe than sorry
Yeah, he doesn't know what he is doing. He is going to get himself or someone else killed. This video made my blood boil and it was his jackass narration that really put it over the top for me. He's a weekend warrior pretending to be an expert. He is in no position to give advice
That’s technically not a barber chair. That is just the tree splitting from improper cutting. If the tree really barber chaired this guy would have been killed. To anybody watching, please don’t think that what you saw in this video is a true barber chair and become complacent. Look up other videos of barber chairing and the cause/prevention.
He cut way too low and his face cut was way too shallow. His face was only around 10%. You can cut low like that but you need to go deeper. If he was higher on his face cut about a foot or 14" or so and made his face the same size it still would have barber chaired. No use of wedges. You have wedges on your belt. Use them. You don't need to plunge cut. You just need to face it properly and use your wedges. You guys are going to get hurt by simply not following the basic guidelines of tree felling. 30% hinge no more than 35% depending on the lean.
You didn't put a notch in it. It's not the tree, it's the guy on the saw. This is not correct. You had the gear, not the knowledge. Glad it all worked out.
I love those father-son operations. My dad was a logger in South Tyrol (Italy) but he passed when I was 6. I am jeaulous on all young men who still got a dad, even I am old now myself
Hate to Monday morning but first off the chain is so dull this is painful. Make your gunning cut 1/3 of the tree to 1/2 unless heavy lean. And get off the ground be able to escape your stump you are not gaining much bord feet with 6 inches.
Second tree really shows the canopy these beech trees create. Awesome trees. Cut em while you can! The beech leaf disease is wiping them out. If you dont harvest them, they'll go to waste.
Sidenote.. once the tree starts to go, hit the exit. If you see the tree start to barber chair, hit the exit 10 times faster. Don't stay and chase the cut or take pictures
It's a tough deal putting yourself out there, this was a great informative video as to some of the dangers of felling. Perhaps it has kept some from trying it themselves and calling a professional.
The issue was that notch not deep enough and to wide that guarantees a barber chair cutting like that 1/3 in 30 to 70 degrees depending keep up the practice and you will improve I’d recommend that you not post online until your seasoned
Also appeared from my little phone screen on the side he was cutting right before the barber chair he cut the holding wood on the hinge ... I do agree it wasn't quite deep enough...
I have to say I disagree about the suggestion to not post the video. These videos inspire learning and are extremely valuable for that reason. It takes guts to post this, but the tradeoff is that many people in the felling community can discuss safety in a way where we can all learn to be as safe as we can be.
For the sake of saving 6", if it was me, I'd have worked standing up and had cut a seriously wide wedge to begin with. The more lumber you want, the more risky you work is, is how I see it. I only cut firewood so this matters very little to me.
He just stood there watching it split.. mist guys you see with a barber chair run like hell and ask questions later.. holy shoot dude. Get the hell away
The barber chair occurred because he did not make his felling notch deep enough, which should have been approximately 1/3 of the diameter of the tree, or at a steep enough angle, and he also made his back cut too slow.
That tree was safe to cut- about 18 inches higher... with a 1/3rd front cut instead of 1/5th. Even without the title and audio I could have told you that tree was destined to barber chair with that cut, and I'm hardly an expert. He did NOT do everything right- He did everything wrong.
This was hard to watch. I would fire that guy. Took forever to do it totally wrong. Almost got his dull ass saw stuck and didn't even get out of the danger zone when the tree started to barber. F. Notice his brand new everything.
You learn from your mistakes, fortunately this ended ok BUT being a retired arborist I’ve UNFORTUNATELY heard a couple HORROR stories where a good man lost his life😔this job is NO JOKE, PLEASE be CAREFUL 🙏👍✌️
Not an expert by any means but been cutting about 40 years Anything with size that was of fairly straight grain oak beech we had a small 1/4 chain and wrapped it about a foot or so above the cut it saved out a$$ a few times
thanks for sharing this. A good reminder that tree felling can be unpredictable (we can read them wrong). When I watched, I thought the notch was not deep enough and may have prevented the barber chair. Never shortcut on basics - make a decent notch even if believe all is good. Like the narrator said a plunge would have held it.
Also it looked like you were putting your face cut into the buttress roots rather than the trunk. Unless tree was to be sold for lumber (not sure why in this case) you should put your notch higher.
If that's his only sin, then he's a lot better than many pros I have worked with. Granted the face cut was a bit too shallow, but that usually isn't an issue. The bore cutting as shown on the other tree would have fixed it too.
I have never seen someone take so long to cut a notch. Yeah, when you're cutting a tree with a hard lean, you want to make the front cut as deep into the trunk as possible so when you make the back cut, the the tree snaps off the trunk and then falls. Also he's taking far too much time to make the back cut. And when that tree started to split, he should have been running for the next county, not standing there watching it.
Be careful. This kind of advice leads to the unintentional effect of a cripple cut, which isn't a good idea most of the time (but in rare cases is ok when you have immobile obstacles preventing a safe back cut and you know how to control the effects). Leaners often do require shallow cuts as long as they're still deep enough to be past the depth of the stump flare.
@@Will-nc7lp It did seem to be cutting slowly for such a strong power head and such a short bar. With good edges, that should have been sinking like butter, even in beech.
Logger here. Here’s how I would approach this species/tree. 1. Face cut is fine. Doesn’t matter how shallow it is provided it gives you enough wood and leverage for your hinge. 2. Cut the ears (bell sides) off. 3. First cut is a bore cut immediately behind the face establishing the hinge dimensional characteristics. 4. Work around the tree starting from lean setting wedges to control tension as you work. A SMALL bore through the face to back is ok depending on what you are trying to get the hinge to do for you. Chasing hardwoods from the back is asking for trouble.
What you are suggesting is pretty close to what I show with the second tree in the video and the point of the the whole posting. It seems a lot of people don't get that. I appreciate your comment. It is nuanced and accurate.
Tree has to have a notch 1/3 of a tree to fell a tree if not tree will fall where ever it wants and will split you have no control over the tree and if you don't have enough hinge wood butt of the log hits another tree and flys back off the stump is leaving no hinge wood you can hold the tree until it hits the ground without splitting it too I do it everyday and pull overhang over houses and and cut trees where I got to be precise falling around houses and everything you have to have enough hinge wood and big enough notch to fall a tree or your destroying someones property hanging trees up or putting yourself in harm's way you have to have a notch 1/3 of the tree your life is more important then not big enough notch
@@jordanwright4014 Grossly oversimplified. Your notch and hinge must be designed for the circumstances and the species of tree. 1/3 is rarely your best bet. Do you also chase every tree from the back praying your saw cuts faster than the tree falls? Good luck to you.
Nope most the trees I got to cut that are heavy lean I pull over the opposite way they are over hanging powerlines you never bore cut you slowly backcut it and pull it you have to have enough hinge wood or the tree will break off sounds like you don't know how to rig or climb any trees either
When my dad and brother would saw down alders, the notches they'd make were much deeper than what I'm seeing here. These notches made me pretty nervous.
Recommend to not show these videos if you're not an experienced and certified faller. Too many other items in this video where you're showing a hazardous technique that people will copy. For example, a faller will not stand in front of the tree when falling it on the last cut; your son was in the line of fire. Please remove this video so no one thinks the mistakes you've identified are accurate. Hire a certified faller, please.
Glad ya'll are safe I'm no pro just a electrician that heats with wood and help family and farmers with tree work ... thank you for sharing and catching hell from all of us I'm glad your boy was OK and you as well ya'll stay safe frosty and free
The fact that you didnt recognize your mistake, means you didnt learn from it, which is more dangerous than the barberchair…you thankfully posted your mistake and it was correctly pointed out that your notch shoukd be 1/3 of the diameter of the tree…that was probably 1/8th
Several other commenters have pointed out that the wedge cut was too shallow and too low. With a tree that stands this erect with no noticeable or significant lean you want at least a cut that is 1/3 the diameter of tree. You can get by with slightly more if there is no wind or excessive unbalance of the upper limbs. The cut should be made about 2-2.5 feet above the ground, leaving the truck for a cut by iteself. A shallow cut as shown is basically no cut. Even a tree with no heavy lean will break out as did this one.
Plus he cut the wedge in the flared out part of the trunk. If you want it that low the tapered part could have been shaved off first then start the wedge. I would give yourselves more training before continuing to fall trees.
Agreed with every word for standard cutting. That's what most of the training says (1/3). That said there are exceptions for various reasons such as rot, felling a log and not a whole tree, making a cripple cut when there's no room for a back cut, dealing with species that have very different sapwood vs. heartwood densities, etc.
I made a video on astrophysics. I hadn’t even heard about astrophysics until last week and that’s when I looked it up on Wikipedia and read half the article, now I’m ready to to make a video to teach people what I know about it.
From other videos on here and from my time as a topper...use the rule of 1/3rds. Wedge cut in 1/3 to leave a good hinge. Then the fall cut and wedges to keep from sticking the saw...
Problem will be solved if you make your notch (as you call it) the undercut should be deeper, like halfway through the tree. In the direction you want it to fall.
I am not an expert on this but from my research this is a fallacy. The best explanation I saw went something like this- A tree likely to barber chair has a lot of tension on the back side compression on the front side (direction it wants to fall). When you cut in the undercut you remove some of the compression wood (which is counterbalancing the force on the back) increasing the tension on the back. The more you cut the more you increase the tension therefore the more likely it is to barber chair. On a tree big enough to plunge cut, the best way to fall it is to cut a smaller undercut, plunge cut leaving a fairly large section of holding wood and a normal hinge, do a release cut and run. If you can find any reputable information that refutes this, please let me know. I really like to learn from these. Without comment like yours I would not have done hours of research. At first just trying to find anything that says an undercut of 80% of the diameter was not enough and then if larger undercuts were recommended for special circumstances. This tree was not a leaner, so I did not treat it as one. If I thought it might be a problem, we would have done a plunge cut. There are other ways to lessen the risk but from everything I have seen a plunge/bore cut is the safest and most effective.
@@foresthomestead While I agree with you, the tree that barberchaired, did so, because the notch was cut in the buttress wood... effectively, the notch wasn’t deep enough, because the flare at the base, negated the depth of the cut and your diameter percentage across the face. You could have either cut off the buttress, or flare of the base and done the exact same notch, or Accounted for the flare of the base and just gone in deeper... simulating the real width of the stem, onto the footprint of the wider base (at the bottom). The flare at the base, needed to be cut off or factored into your calculations in terms of either depth of your notch, or width of your notch across the face. A plunge cut could have been used, but it wouldn’t have been necessary, the main reason being that the tree held on and barberchaired, because the notch was too shallow. Look where it held on... at the notch... at the front... if you had drawn straight lines down the trunk, into the ground, you could see that the flare was gonna be wider than those two lines, so either trim up the base of the tree or account for the flare. Or cut a bit higher, above the flare. He did Swanson cut anyway... the top of his notch, could have been a horizontal cut and the Humboldt cut could have come in from underneath (in the flare) and your calculations of width/diameter percentages would have been fine, without the need for a plunge cut. He just cut too low and didn’t account for the wide base. His notch was too shallow.
@@jeremybartlett1706 You explained it well. The innermost part of the face cut/notch was still too far forward causing the hinge to be compression wood rather than effective hinge wood, evidenced by the fact that the notch/face cut didn't close at all until after the barber chair-ing. There's even a slight (very slight) chance that the bore technique could have made the barber chair kickout faster and more violent when you cut the back strap if you think about it, for this reason. This is in contrast to my last comment on this because I didn't think about it that way before.
@@happycamper6352 Thanks... yeah but the guy says it wasn't a leaner... so it shouldn't have required plunge cutting, based on the geometry of the tree (it wasn't already leaning). As I said in my previous comment, drawing imaginary lines on either side of the trunk, to the ground, would illustrate the wide flared base... this guy cut into the flare and trunk, 80% of the width/diameter of the trunk *above* ...not what he was actually cutting into... the flared buttress wood... so he didn't cut deep enough and then wedged it over... creating the tension and compression of a leaning tree... which barberchaired like crazy... he should have tickled his undercut in that scenario, instead of hammering on the wedges... or just done it right from the start... all this talk of plunge cuts is fine, yes, he could have salvaged it with a plunge cut... but the flared buttress wood is what threw him off and is the lesson here imo. I'm not arguing with you, thank you for the kind comment, i just hope that people learn why he was confused as to why his notch wasn't correct, instead of going off on plunge cut tangeants...
I thought the "typical" way cut the initial notch is opposite to what we see here. In other words, the level cut (parallel to the ground, perpendicular to direction of fall) on the top, and the angle come up from the bottom to meet the level cut. I am not a feller (a fella yes, and don't play a feller on YT), but I have seen others (Buckin' Billy Ray Smith).
No, the reason it Barber chaired is your face cut was way to small . It should have been around 1/3 the diameter of the tree. Absolutely no need for a plunge cut.
A question; he is a professional specialist as far as we can see but... I would have looked deeper into the fall cut, I was surprised that it was so shallow... The tree was healthy and in an upright posture and nothing suggested the problem occurred. What can you tell me about it?
Most of the comments I get are about the size of the face cut. To me the primary reason for a face cut is to establish a hinge. The hinge is to direct the fall of the tree in the direction you desire. Sometimes, with a perfectly balanced tree or one with a slight back lean a deep face cut may help change the balance to the direction you want. This was not the case in this situation. This tree wanted to go in the direction desired, in fact it wanted to go that way too much. The length to the hinge cut was about 80% of the diameter of the tree, plenty long enough to direct the fall. The rule of thumb for face cut depth is in 30% or the diameter OR a hinge 80% of the diameter of the tree. There are reasons to go shallower or deeper than the rule of thumb. Although this tree is pretty straight up, we failed to see that the upper branches where much heavier on one side of the tree. This put a lot of stress on the base of the tree causing the barber chair. I believe the size of the face cut had little to do with the barber chair, the tree species (beech) and the extra top weight to the side are the main culprits. If we had plunge cut it to begin with this would not have happened. There are other methods to prevent a barber chair but I prefer the plunge cut. There are several other things we could have done better as well but if we had plunge cut all of those other things would not have mattered. That was the whole point of the video.
That plunge cut was ridiculously shallow, thus the barber chair. How much experience does the feller have? By how new his chaps, hardhat, and equipment appear to be, as well as how clean his clothing is, probably not too much. That Weaver logging belt looks like it's seeing its first time in the forest.
With Mistakes come experience, with experience comes confidence and speed. You we're very lucky that day no one was hurt. Live another day to cut another tree. With that being said Good job young man
What they said his wedge must get deeper especially beech and cut off the wind spurs so his bar can make a single cut I hate cutting beech even with my harvester stuff it splits terrible and he need to lean up that 395 thing was driving me crazy four stroking
Open Face Bore cut will deplete the barber chair factor 99% of the time and allows a lot longer falling delay for a faster and safer escape for the faller.
I dropped a lot of trees in my sawing days but I never heard of a plunge cut until I started watching TH-cam. I had heard of a barber chair but didn't know what it was. P.S. that isn't much of a notch in this video. Is that a beech tree?
I'm @ 1:45 and can tell you 100% the incoming barber chair is entirely the fault of the operator. Gunning cut in the root crown, waaaaaaay too shallow, saw dull af (from what I'm used to anyway) ... It's so cringe I don't think I can continue. He started checking his gunning sights and the bar wasn't even fully in the trunk! While beech is a species prone to barber chair, it's standing straight up! And it's not even frozen in the depths of winter!!!!! Oh, and dude is also cutting on the low side. Sometimes, that's unavoidable. Not here! Outside of good safety gear, I haven't seen a single thing correct yet. I congratulate you for recognizing that a bore does help prevent bc's, but there is soooooo much more wrong in this video. Yeah, no, I'm out.
I am far from expert in tree felling. But even to me it seems that as it comes down you are still in the killing zone. Especially the barber chair. Given the unpredictable nature i would think you should get going in any direction other than where you are.
Basically, and I mean no offense truly, but you don't really know what you're doing here. You have just enough knowledge to be dangerous, literally. Do some more research and be careful out there!
Notch should of been deeper, a larger saw will save you from having to double cut your back cut. Obviously bore cutting can alleviate some issues when there is pressure on the wood.
Power head was big enough to handle a longer bar, but that usually isn't a problem as we use bars that are too short often with no problems. There are a few techniques that allow short bars to be safe, and the best tutorials I have found in video form on TH-cam are from the BC Falling Standard series from British Columbia. An even better resource is the book "To Fell a Tree" by Jeff Jepson.
Forest homestead, check out the book “professional timber falling, A procedural approach” by D. Douglas Dent. This is mandatory reading for many forestry programs for the US forest service., safety programs for the likes of Weyerhaeuser, crowne Zellerbauch etc. a wealth of knowledge
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I agree with other commenters, your face cuts are too shallow. Secondly, this is a poor example of a barber chair because you had cleanly cut 80% of the back cut, and due to a very shallow face cut there was too much vertical compression on the hinge as you neared it so the tree split vertically. A true barber chair which has the potential to kill usually results from an extreme forward leaning tree or the middle of the tree is dead and hollow. As you cut into the back there is extreme vertical compression on the front and releasing tension on the back suddenly splits the tree and kicks the back (cut) wood backwards towards the fellers face. A barber chair is instantaneous, not a slow action which happened to you. Your tree split due to insufficient face cut on a falling tree with too much intact hinge. I recommend you not cut your face cut using the 80% wide estimate but make your face cut at least 1/3 deep into the tree. Even your plunge cut second tree had a shallow face cut as a humboldt should slide down the face notch and “launch” the falling tree forward away from the stump. Yours simply fell without sliding and rolled off to one side at the end…an indication of your face cut being too shallow. You left zero hinge on your second (plunged) tree so it simply fell in whatever direction weight and wind decided. You lucked out was all. I do agree with you that a plunge cut is the way to prevent/minimize barber chairing but plunging is an “advanced” technique. I recommend you better master basic techniques more. We all start from the beginning but felling trees is quite dangerous so it pays to start with the slower methods like a good face cut followed by a back cut, advance to stopping before she goes over and wedge it over, then move to advanced techniques like plunging. When a tree starts to go stop cutting and immediately move away in a 45 degree direction. Trees buck, slide, roll, and branches start flying so move off and then look up once she starts to go. Stay safe and blessed. Thank you for sharing.
Dude nobody's reading your essay 😆
@mw3gamer23 I read it. It was a well-worded and thought-out reply to the video. His comment was helpful to me, as it confirmed what I thought watching the video as a fairly novice tree feller. The level of detail, to me showed it wasn't some Monday morning QB comment, but someone with enough experience to make such a comment.🤷🏻♂️
@@cat192 I also read it. Good info for a Novice (myself) on what to look for and stay safe.
@@mw3gamer23 correction* nobody that has the attention span of a mouse and half the brain of one. I hope you don't own a chainsaw
Thank you for taking the time to give your input. Quite valuable
I have watched this video and read the comments and i agree the reason for the barberchair is because of the shallow knotch. If you look closely, this tree was splayed at the base and that is where he knotched. That knotch may have worked if it would have been one foot higher on the tree.
Thanks for putting this video out. Much for all of us to learn from.
Put your face cut about a foot off of the ground. Then on the west coast here we use a Humboldt undercut. Because your bar is long enough to go straight across the tree cut off both sides perpendicular to the face cut thickness of your bar. Then cut the back cut about 2 in above the face cut this will allow you a good hinge for the tree. The Humboldt undercut will allow the log to slide off of the stump.
beech is a very notorious wood for splitting....and it sucks to work with it as a board. It cracks and culls even if the tree was grow straight....and I saw where and how he made that notch....needed to be higher and trim that base at least......he is lucky that didn't roll off the split...a whack-back and his head gets removed off his shoulders
notch
@@josephcernansky1794 low notch on that could easily have worked, if the notch was deeper... it's the notch depth that matters more than the height. Cutting low into the flare exaserbates the problem with the shallow notch because the flare is so much wider to cut through, so the back cut ends up much further past center than it would have been if he had made the same notch depth higher.. if that makes sense...
Didn't cut far enough in the tree on the front cut, should cut almost half of the tree's thickness. The notch was not enough angle where you didn't cut far enough in the tree on the front cut, my opinion.
Thank you! Most people won’t show you their mistakes, but mistakes are often the most important lessons!
No, he doesn't understand his mistake. He is way to incompetent to be doing this. This weekend warrior bs is gonna get someone killed.
Don't congratulate this man like he's an expert, has something to teach or isn't a complete fool. He completely misidentified the mistake.
This video made my blood boil.
I've been cutting for 30 years and in the first few years I did many things that were nearly fatal mistakes. If we had youtube back then it would have saved me a lot of dangerous lessons. Videos like this can literally save lives.
only if you learn from them. If you are like the politicians you will never learn!
I have a fails playlist.
Lot of folk would not want to deal with the critical comments. By sharing this you may have saved someone (like me) from making the same mistakes. A man should learn from his mistakes, a wise man can learn from someone else's mistake and an honest man will let others learn from his mistakes. Thanks for posting.
It barber-chaired because the notch is way too small. Should be 2 times that deep and to further help you can cut in an inch on either side of the face cut before you back cut.
Agreed. UK practice on hardwoods (deciduous) is the notch should be 1/3 to half the diameter, giving you a nice, long hinge. Wedges not needed and stand to the side when releasing, not striaght behind. Over here it is common to cut down at around 45 degrees to leave a 'dog's tooth' when releasing- a bit more protection against the butt base shooting back. Your escape route is away at about 45 degrees to the intended direction of fell. Nice to see you felling low down, but when doing so, it's best to take the toes (buttresses) off to make a circular butt before placing felling cuts.
That's what I'm saying!!!
May thoughts exactly, do a proper birds mouth cut 1/3 of the diameter into the trunk then you probably would not need to bore cut it. Just do a standard back cut and you'd be surprised how easy it is.
Agree and he wasted wood with the fiber pull
Thank you for showing the stump as that always tells the story. I see three things that can contribute to the likely hood of a tree to BC and why that tree did. Notch,Hinge, and saw cutting speed. With notch depth , the shallower the depth the slower the tree starts to come over because the farther the hinge is away from the center of gravity of the tree. That is just physics. The back side of the hinge on high side of tree is not parallel with front side and wider than low side. The fine dust tells me that the teeth are not sharp or the rakers are too high. During the back cut the faster a saw cuts the less likely a tree will BC. That doesn't mean that the sawyer needs to hurry, take your time and think and think some more because what is in front of you can kill or severely injure. I see most comments harp on the notch, there are many schools of thought on how deep a notch should be and when to cut shallow or deep notch which I am not going to go there. The fact is, do something different you will get a different result. Now I'm not trying to tell you what or how to cut a tree, I'm just reading the stump with my experience falling trees, I do know when falling the sawyer wants as many stars to come into alignment as possible because the stakes are too high if they don't and there isn't any do-overs! Another safety tip, Look Up ! Then Look Up some more and listen, the tree will talk to you, sound at times can be quicker than sight. I wish you all the best! And Be Safe!!!
I was dispatched to a fatal accident just yesterday. A man was falling a large pine when it barber chaired right into his chest killing him instantly. I kept thinking the whole way home that it didn't have to happen. It was close to other trees and got caught up in another trees branches about a 40 degree angle and just kicked back violently.
Wow, first day on the job?
I'm literally 3 minutes into your video. And what I'm seeing is. Improper undercut for this tree. And your saw is spine cringing dull. Every tree is different. Hope you boys learn a bit more before the woods slap you one. Be safe, keep learning.
And Geez Loose! Had to edit this comment. Your son standing there next to a tree falling/ barber chairing. Is a sure recipe for getting killed. Please don't do that.
I agree, he stood way to close. He usually doesn't do that, but I think he got distracted by what was happening with the tree and stopped at the worst possible time. I had a talk with him about that right after it came down.
@@foresthomestead
Glad you had a talk with him. Fortunately, that tree wasn't under extreme stress. Often a barber chair with just explode faster than you can blink. Once you hear that TEARING sound. RUN! 45 degrees back and away. Preferably up hill.
One of the biggest problem with cutting wit a saw that's not sharp. Is while falling. The saw can't keep up with the trees movement. Which will cause a barber chair. It other problem is. The operator will tend to push the saw thinking it will cut faster. It won't, and if something goes wrong. Having all that force pushing your saw. Sets you up to just stumbling into the problem. Just like a dull knife. A full saw causes the most injuries.
Hey, keep at it, work smart not hard.
Looks like an office guy running a chainsaw.
Never trust a guy with a bunch of new equipment and looks unsure of himself. This was a good video of what not to do in both cases. Bad technique, shallow face cut and back cut below the hinge are two not only rookie mistakes but dangerous. Maybe instead of making TH-cam videos you should watch a few first.
And always or most of the time have a escaping route 45 degree angle away from the three
When I see it to BC I was saying to myself move away 45 degrees fast.
The comments before me are very learning from
Thank you for taking the time to to explain
What everyone should be commenting on is standing there watching the tree split. When the tree starts to go down run in the opposite direction. When a tree splits like that it can kill you
I heartily agree. I had a talk with my son after the tree was down about this. In the video it looks like he was closer than he was, he was a little over 10' away. Still not nearly enough even if the tree didn't barber chair. One thing I would disagree with, in your statement, is "run in the opposite direction" you should run at a 45-degree angle away from the tree, never get directly behind it. I know what you meant but I don't want other viewers to think it's OK to get behind the direction of fall.
Take saw away from him he's going to get seriously hurt
Absolutely right. I was sitting here with my jaw dragging the table, incredulous that the guy just stood there. He was lucky he didn't get speared by a large splinter, or outright impaled. Unbelievable. I hope no one emulates the techniques used in this video (I mean the shallow cutting, cutting inside the mushroomed base of the tree, etc.).
You left a triangle shaped piece of holding wood in the that first tree. The bar wasn't parallel with your notch. Triangles don't make a very good hinge.
Face cut is waaay too shallow. Should have used a humboldt face (1/3 at chest ht dia) to save wood instead of using a vastly improper cut. Spend more time getting falling experience and less shopping for logger trinkets
As others have already commented your face cut is way to shallow, looks like you just squared off the base of the trunk and allowed the weight of the branches to pull the tree over.
This is one of those "what not to do" from the start to finish.
If you want to learn how to drop trees, watch Buck'n Billy's channel. Thanks for the video, there is some good info on here, and some mistakes which people can learn from, please be safe.
Yes exactly
When that tree split, shouldn't the guy with the saw move further away?
The undercut is way to small and in your case to low, the tree flares at the base so you have to cut some of the flares and after that put you undercut in. The notch in the back cut is more for heavy leaning trees. We have mostly beech and some oak where I'm from and people die from barber chairs if you're not careful. Always look up and if it starts to barberchair run. Better safe than sorry
Yeah, he doesn't know what he is doing. He is going to get himself or someone else killed. This video made my blood boil and it was his jackass narration that really put it over the top for me.
He's a weekend warrior pretending to be an expert.
He is in no position to give advice
@@tecumsehcristero TH-cam is FULL of these people man. I'm from Australia and everything was so wrong in this video. Wow???
Please learn how to sharpen a chain...when a tree begins to barber chair, drop the saw and run like hell. Don't stand around and watch.
That’s technically not a barber chair. That is just the tree splitting from improper cutting. If the tree really barber chaired this guy would have been killed. To anybody watching, please don’t think that what you saw in this video is a true barber chair and become complacent. Look up other videos of barber chairing and the cause/prevention.
Very dangerous video if anyone tries to copy this. You need help notching a large tree.
He cut way too low and his face cut was way too shallow. His face was only around 10%. You can cut low like that but you need to go deeper. If he was higher on his face cut about a foot or 14" or so and made his face the same size it still would have barber chaired. No use of wedges. You have wedges on your belt. Use them. You don't need to plunge cut. You just need to face it properly and use your wedges.
You guys are going to get hurt by simply not following the basic guidelines of tree felling. 30% hinge no more than 35% depending on the lean.
You didn't put a notch in it. It's not the tree, it's the guy on the saw. This is not correct. You had the gear, not the knowledge. Glad it all worked out.
I agree, face cut was a way too shallow.
That notch he made is about the same as NONE at all.
I love those father-son operations.
My dad was a logger in South Tyrol (Italy) but he passed
when I was 6.
I am jeaulous on all young men who still got a dad,
even I am old now myself
Hate to Monday morning but first off the chain is so dull this is painful. Make your gunning cut 1/3 of the tree to 1/2 unless heavy lean. And get off the ground be able to escape your stump you are not gaining much bord feet with 6 inches.
Maybe they wanted to use the whole tree,,,,,, they don't grow back overnight lol
Second tree really shows the canopy these beech trees create. Awesome trees. Cut em while you can! The beech leaf disease is wiping them out. If you dont harvest them, they'll go to waste.
Sidenote.. once the tree starts to go, hit the exit. If you see the tree start to barber chair, hit the exit 10 times faster. Don't stay and chase the cut or take pictures
It's a tough deal putting yourself out there, this was a great informative video as to some of the dangers of felling. Perhaps it has kept some from trying it themselves and calling a professional.
The issue was that notch not deep enough and to wide that guarantees a barber chair cutting like that 1/3 in 30 to 70 degrees depending keep up the practice and you will improve I’d recommend that you not post online until your seasoned
Also appeared from my little phone screen on the side he was cutting right before the barber chair he cut the holding wood on the hinge ... I do agree it wasn't quite deep enough...
I have to say I disagree about the suggestion to not post the video. These videos inspire learning and are extremely valuable for that reason. It takes guts to post this, but the tradeoff is that many people in the felling community can discuss safety in a way where we can all learn to be as safe as we can be.
For the sake of saving 6", if it was me, I'd have worked standing up and had cut a seriously wide wedge to begin with. The more lumber you want, the more risky you work is, is how I see it. I only cut firewood so this matters very little to me.
How come there not scarfing up?
1/3 face cut, 2/3 back cut. He might as well not even put a face in it. That did absolutely nothing
He just stood there watching it split.. mist guys you see with a barber chair run like hell and ask questions later.. holy shoot dude. Get the hell away
The barber chair occurred because he did not make his felling notch deep enough, which should have been approximately 1/3 of the diameter of the tree, or at a steep enough angle, and he also made his back cut too slow.
3' off the ground, and I doubt he would have had an issue... where the bole is a uniform diameter.
That tree was safe to cut- about 18 inches higher... with a 1/3rd front cut instead of 1/5th. Even without the title and audio I could have told you that tree was destined to barber chair with that cut, and I'm hardly an expert. He did NOT do everything right- He did everything wrong.
This was hard to watch. I would fire that guy. Took forever to do it totally wrong. Almost got his dull ass saw stuck and didn't even get out of the danger zone when the tree started to barber. F. Notice his brand new everything.
How many goes do you need for a directional cut, all the gear and no Idea 😮
You learn from your mistakes, fortunately this ended ok BUT being a retired arborist I’ve UNFORTUNATELY heard a couple HORROR stories where a good man lost his life😔this job is NO JOKE, PLEASE be CAREFUL 🙏👍✌️
Not an expert by any means but been cutting about 40 years
Anything with size that was of fairly straight grain oak beech we had a small 1/4 chain and wrapped it about a foot or so above the cut it saved out a$$ a few times
Your idea of a proper notch is not in agreement with mine. He caused the Barber chair.
thanks for sharing this. A good reminder that tree felling can be unpredictable (we can read them wrong). When I watched, I thought the notch was not deep enough and may have prevented the barber chair. Never shortcut on basics - make a decent notch even if believe all is good. Like the narrator said a plunge would have held it.
Yep, face cut way too shallow. Should be 1/3 of the trees diameter at least. Can be more if tree isn't leaning.
Also it looked like you were putting your face cut into the buttress roots rather than the trunk. Unless tree was to be sold for lumber (not sure why in this case) you should put your notch higher.
People with saws that don't know what there doin,kills many.The guy doesn't even have a sharp saw first problem,good luck to y'all...
If that's his only sin, then he's a lot better than many pros I have worked with. Granted the face cut was a bit too shallow, but that usually isn't an issue. The bore cutting as shown on the other tree would have fixed it too.
I have never seen someone take so long to cut a notch. Yeah, when you're cutting a tree with a hard lean, you want to make the front cut as deep into the trunk as possible so when you make the back cut, the the tree snaps off the trunk and then falls. Also he's taking far too much time to make the back cut. And when that tree started to split, he should have been running for the next county, not standing there watching it.
It is taking too long because the saw is blunt or the rakers need filing.
The chain was duller than a spoon and he was pushing on the saw. Not a pro,. No business making an instructional video.
Chain is way too loose
Be careful. This kind of advice leads to the unintentional effect of a cripple cut, which isn't a good idea most of the time (but in rare cases is ok when you have immobile obstacles preventing a safe back cut and you know how to control the effects). Leaners often do require shallow cuts as long as they're still deep enough to be past the depth of the stump flare.
@@Will-nc7lp It did seem to be cutting slowly for such a strong power head and such a short bar. With good edges, that should have been sinking like butter, even in beech.
New and shiny everything, makes me think someone is a little green 🤔
Logger here. Here’s how I would approach this species/tree.
1. Face cut is fine. Doesn’t matter how shallow it is provided it gives you enough wood and leverage for your hinge.
2. Cut the ears (bell sides) off.
3. First cut is a bore cut immediately behind the face establishing the hinge dimensional characteristics.
4. Work around the tree starting from lean setting wedges to control tension as you work.
A SMALL bore through the face to back is ok depending on what you are trying to get the hinge to do for you.
Chasing hardwoods from the back is asking for trouble.
What you are suggesting is pretty close to what I show with the second tree in the video and the point of the the whole posting. It seems a lot of people don't get that. I appreciate your comment. It is nuanced and accurate.
Tree has to have a notch 1/3 of a tree to fell a tree if not tree will fall where ever it wants and will split you have no control over the tree and if you don't have enough hinge wood butt of the log hits another tree and flys back off the stump is leaving no hinge wood you can hold the tree until it hits the ground without splitting it too I do it everyday and pull overhang over houses and and cut trees where I got to be precise falling around houses and everything you have to have enough hinge wood and big enough notch to fall a tree or your destroying someones property hanging trees up or putting yourself in harm's way you have to have a notch 1/3 of the tree your life is more important then not big enough notch
@@jordanwright4014 Grossly oversimplified. Your notch and hinge must be designed for the circumstances and the species of tree. 1/3 is rarely your best bet. Do you also chase every tree from the back praying your saw cuts faster than the tree falls? Good luck to you.
Nope most the trees I got to cut that are heavy lean I pull over the opposite way they are over hanging powerlines you never bore cut you slowly backcut it and pull it you have to have enough hinge wood or the tree will break off sounds like you don't know how to rig or climb any trees either
Is it just me or is the saw chain dull or what?
Looks like a dull chain spitting sawdust.
When my dad and brother would saw down alders, the notches they'd make were much deeper than what I'm seeing here. These notches made me pretty nervous.
Recommend to not show these videos if you're not an experienced and certified faller. Too many other items in this video where you're showing a hazardous technique that people will copy. For example, a faller will not stand in front of the tree when falling it on the last cut; your son was in the line of fire. Please remove this video so no one thinks the mistakes you've identified are accurate. Hire a certified faller, please.
Glad ya'll are safe I'm no pro just a electrician that heats with wood and help family and farmers with tree work ... thank you for sharing and catching hell from all of us I'm glad your boy was OK and you as well ya'll stay safe frosty and free
Staying frosty is a given. Staying free.... Not so much... lol
Notch sucked bcareful, 30% notch 45°. Higher up from rootshoots, you can clean stump up later
it looks like your chain needs sharpened, i see powder flying, not chips
The fact that you didnt recognize your mistake, means you didnt learn from it, which is more dangerous than the barberchair…you thankfully posted your mistake and it was correctly pointed out that your notch shoukd be 1/3 of the diameter of the tree…that was probably 1/8th
Several other commenters have pointed out that the wedge cut was too shallow and too low. With a tree that stands this erect with no noticeable or significant lean you want at least a cut that is 1/3 the diameter of tree. You can get by with slightly more if there is no wind or excessive unbalance of the upper limbs. The cut should be made about 2-2.5 feet above the ground, leaving the truck for a cut by iteself. A shallow cut as shown is basically no cut. Even a tree with no heavy lean will break out as did this one.
you said at least 1/3 diameter of tree for wedge cut if no significant lean. How does it change if there is a lean?
Great video, I'm glad you didn't get hurt. There is a lot to learn in your line of work. Good luck, and happy felling
Thanks for showing the failure! I have a leaner to cut in the next few days, all this information is very usefull
Do a good bore cut
Never take advice from a guy with a new skull bucket!
The helmet is 20 years old. we just take care of our equipment
The under cut is way to small For that size tree Needs to be 25percent of the size of the tree Get a new saw chain before cutting the tree
Let the pros do it next time
Plus he cut the wedge in the flared out part of the trunk. If you want it that low the tapered part could have been shaved off first then start the wedge. I would give yourselves more training before continuing to fall trees.
Aren't you supposed to do the natch 1/3 of the size of the trunk? they seemed too small.happy nobody was injured and thanks for sharing this video
Agreed with every word for standard cutting. That's what most of the training says (1/3). That said there are exceptions for various reasons such as rot, felling a log and not a whole tree, making a cripple cut when there's no room for a back cut, dealing with species that have very different sapwood vs. heartwood densities, etc.
I made a video on astrophysics. I hadn’t even heard about astrophysics until last week and that’s when I looked it up on Wikipedia and read half the article, now I’m ready to to make a video to teach people what I know about it.
If you're not certain always use the "safe corner" method and plan the escape route, drop saw and teleport away from the tree if it goes south.
Worlds smallest wedge/notch
From other videos on here and from my time as a topper...use the rule of 1/3rds. Wedge cut in 1/3 to leave a good hinge. Then the fall cut and wedges to keep from sticking the saw...
That front notch🙈ever heard of 30%?lucky if he lives long enough to break in that new leather gear
Problem will be solved if you make your notch (as you call it) the undercut should be deeper, like halfway through the tree. In the direction you want it to fall.
I am not an expert on this but from my research this is a fallacy. The best explanation I saw went something like this- A tree likely to barber chair has a lot of tension on the back side compression on the front side (direction it wants to fall). When you cut in the undercut you remove some of the compression wood (which is counterbalancing the force on the back) increasing the tension on the back. The more you cut the more you increase the tension therefore the more likely it is to barber chair. On a tree big enough to plunge cut, the best way to fall it is to cut a smaller undercut, plunge cut leaving a fairly large section of holding wood and a normal hinge, do a release cut and run. If you can find any reputable information that refutes this, please let me know. I really like to learn from these. Without comment like yours I would not have done hours of research. At first just trying to find anything that says an undercut of 80% of the diameter was not enough and then if larger undercuts were recommended for special circumstances. This tree was not a leaner, so I did not treat it as one. If I thought it might be a problem, we would have done a plunge cut. There are other ways to lessen the risk but from everything I have seen a plunge/bore cut is the safest and most effective.
@@foresthomestead While I agree with you, the tree that barberchaired, did so, because the notch was cut in the buttress wood... effectively, the notch wasn’t deep enough, because the flare at the base, negated the depth of the cut and your diameter percentage across the face.
You could have either cut off the buttress, or flare of the base and done the exact same notch, or
Accounted for the flare of the base and just gone in deeper... simulating the real width of the stem, onto the footprint of the wider base (at the bottom).
The flare at the base, needed to be cut off or factored into your calculations in terms of either depth of your notch, or width of your notch across the face.
A plunge cut could have been used, but it wouldn’t have been necessary, the main reason being that the tree held on and barberchaired, because the notch was too shallow. Look where it held on... at the notch... at the front... if you had drawn straight lines down the trunk, into the ground, you could see that the flare was gonna be wider than those two lines, so either trim up the base of the tree or account for the flare. Or cut a bit higher, above the flare.
He did Swanson cut anyway... the top of his notch, could have been a horizontal cut and the Humboldt cut could have come in from underneath (in the flare) and your calculations of width/diameter percentages would have been fine, without the need for a plunge cut.
He just cut too low and didn’t account for the wide base. His notch was too shallow.
@@jeremybartlett1706 You explained it well. The innermost part of the face cut/notch was still too far forward causing the hinge to be compression wood rather than effective hinge wood, evidenced by the fact that the notch/face cut didn't close at all until after the barber chair-ing. There's even a slight (very slight) chance that the bore technique could have made the barber chair kickout faster and more violent when you cut the back strap if you think about it, for this reason. This is in contrast to my last comment on this because I didn't think about it that way before.
@@happycamper6352 Thanks... yeah but the guy says it wasn't a leaner... so it shouldn't have required plunge cutting, based on the geometry of the tree (it wasn't already leaning).
As I said in my previous comment, drawing imaginary lines on either side of the trunk, to the ground, would illustrate the wide flared base... this guy cut into the flare and trunk, 80% of the width/diameter of the trunk *above* ...not what he was actually cutting into... the flared buttress wood... so he didn't cut deep enough and then wedged it over... creating the tension and compression of a leaning tree... which barberchaired like crazy... he should have tickled his undercut in that scenario, instead of hammering on the wedges... or just done it right from the start... all this talk of plunge cuts is fine, yes, he could have salvaged it with a plunge cut... but the flared buttress wood is what threw him off and is the lesson here imo.
I'm not arguing with you, thank you for the kind comment, i just hope that people learn why he was confused as to why his notch wasn't correct, instead of going off on plunge cut tangeants...
And you're on the downhill side of it too.
I thought the "typical" way cut the initial notch is opposite to what we see here. In other words, the level cut (parallel to the ground, perpendicular to direction of fall) on the top, and the angle come up from the bottom to meet the level cut. I am not a feller (a fella yes, and don't play a feller on YT), but I have seen others (Buckin' Billy Ray Smith).
No, the reason it Barber chaired is your face cut was way to small . It should have been around 1/3 the diameter of the tree. Absolutely no need for a plunge cut.
i never cut such shallow notches, are they as shallow as they look and why?
The chain needs to be sharpned
A question; he is a professional specialist as far as we can see but... I would have looked deeper into the fall cut, I was surprised that it was so shallow...
The tree was healthy and in an upright posture and nothing suggested the problem occurred.
What can you tell me about it?
Most of the comments I get are about the size of the face cut. To me the primary reason for a face cut is to establish a hinge. The hinge is to direct the fall of the tree in the direction you desire. Sometimes, with a perfectly balanced tree or one with a slight back lean a deep face cut may help change the balance to the direction you want. This was not the case in this situation. This tree wanted to go in the direction desired, in fact it wanted to go that way too much. The length to the hinge cut was about 80% of the diameter of the tree, plenty long enough to direct the fall. The rule of thumb for face cut depth is in 30% or the diameter OR a hinge 80% of the diameter of the tree. There are reasons to go shallower or deeper than the rule of thumb.
Although this tree is pretty straight up, we failed to see that the upper branches where much heavier on one side of the tree. This put a lot of stress on the base of the tree causing the barber chair. I believe the size of the face cut had little to do with the barber chair, the tree species (beech) and the extra top weight to the side are the main culprits. If we had plunge cut it to begin with this would not have happened. There are other methods to prevent a barber chair but I prefer the plunge cut. There are several other things we could have done better as well but if we had plunge cut all of those other things would not have mattered. That was the whole point of the video.
That plunge cut was ridiculously shallow, thus the barber chair. How much experience does the feller have? By how new his chaps, hardhat, and equipment appear to be, as well as how clean his clothing is, probably not too much. That Weaver logging belt looks like it's seeing its first time in the forest.
Chain on the saw is blunt or needs the rakers filed down, the sink cut is far too shallow and I would have used a different felling technique.
With Mistakes come experience, with experience comes confidence and speed. You we're very lucky that day no one was hurt. Live another day to cut another tree. With that being said Good job young man
The wedge cut would be too small for a tree 1/4 the size....
What they said his wedge must get deeper especially beech and cut off the wind spurs so his bar can make a single cut I hate cutting beech even with my harvester stuff it splits terrible and he need to lean up that 395 thing was driving me crazy four stroking
Undercut 1/3 of the tree! You shouldn't be showing and telling people how to cut a tree when you don't have a clew!
He has done everything incorrectly
From what I observe on the video , that person attempting to cut the tree , should cut the saw off and put it away before he meets his maker,
How can this guy say he's done everything correctly
Open Face Bore cut will deplete the barber chair factor 99% of the time and allows a lot longer falling delay for a faster and safer escape for the faller.
I cut a deep
Notch unless the tree shows me that’s a bad idea. Deep notch is a safe notch…unless the tree is punky or cracked.
This is completely wrong.
I dropped a lot of trees in my sawing days but I never heard of a plunge cut until I started watching TH-cam. I had heard of a barber chair but didn't know what it was. P.S. that isn't much of a notch in this video. Is that a beech tree?
Way too shallow wedge cut ! Dangerous !
I'm @ 1:45 and can tell you 100% the incoming barber chair is entirely the fault of the operator. Gunning cut in the root crown, waaaaaaay too shallow, saw dull af (from what I'm used to anyway) ... It's so cringe I don't think I can continue. He started checking his gunning sights and the bar wasn't even fully in the trunk!
While beech is a species prone to barber chair, it's standing straight up! And it's not even frozen in the depths of winter!!!!!
Oh, and dude is also cutting on the low side. Sometimes, that's unavoidable. Not here! Outside of good safety gear, I haven't seen a single thing correct yet. I congratulate you for recognizing that a bore does help prevent bc's, but there is soooooo much more wrong in this video.
Yeah, no, I'm out.
I am far from expert in tree felling. But even to me it seems that as it comes down you are still in the killing zone.
Especially the barber chair. Given the unpredictable nature i would think you should get going in any direction other than where you are.
Basically, and I mean no offense truly, but you don't really know what you're doing here. You have just enough knowledge to be dangerous, literally. Do some more research and be careful out there!
Was a nice beach log now just firewood. Sharpen that chain
All gear, no skill.
If you put a heavy strap or chain above the cut, would that prevent a barber chair?
That would help but it is easier to use one of several cutting techniques to eliminate the chances of a barber chair.
@@foresthomestead "...eliminate the chances..." You mean "...reduce the chances..."?
Notch should of been deeper, a larger saw will save you from having to double cut your back cut. Obviously bore cutting can alleviate some issues when there is pressure on the wood.
Power head was big enough to handle a longer bar, but that usually isn't a problem as we use bars that are too short often with no problems. There are a few techniques that allow short bars to be safe, and the best tutorials I have found in video form on TH-cam are from the BC Falling Standard series from British Columbia. An even better resource is the book "To Fell a Tree" by Jeff Jepson.
Forest homestead, check out the book “professional timber falling, A procedural approach” by D. Douglas Dent. This is mandatory reading for many forestry programs for the US forest service., safety programs for the likes of Weyerhaeuser, crowne Zellerbauch etc. a wealth of knowledge
*THIS !!!!*
Cool. But it's better if you cut a bigger cut, because the tree doesn't get damaged when it falls. Otherwise, nice video! best of luck!