Corner Entry: How to Turn-in Like Schumacher
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 ก.พ. 2017
- Corner entry is probably the most difficult part of a turn. Typically, drivers can lose or gain a lot of time at the turn-in point, which is technically complex - in fact Schumacher says it where he found time over his competitors.
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There’s lots of balance required when releasing the brakes as smoothly as possible and beginning to steer into the apex.
It’s easy to unsettle the car and lose a truck-load of lap time and just as easy to not carry enough speed into the turn - finding the balance is difficult.
This Driver’s University tutorial will cover:
- Exactly what is the corner entry phase
- How technique needs to differ for various corners
- Steering and braking to maximise entry speed
- Being conscious of limiting factors
- Common improvements to make
What is the Corner Entry Phase?
As you can see from the diagram (on driver61.com), the corner entry phase is the section of the turn where we begin to steer the car towards the apex or clipping point.
At this point, we’ve already had our vision on the apex for a while, and we’re beginning to release the brakes (if we’re trail braking).
Find my free 25-part in-depth tutorial series (including how to trail brake, understanding weight transfer and tons more): goo.gl/rteGhu
★ 1-2-1 COACHING! Want to be faster on track? Let me teach you the practical side of these tutorials during my 1-2-1, highly-efficient training days: goo.gl/dX4q9H
★ F1 LOVERS! My F1 reaction videos (including my reaction to incidents throughout the season and classic races such as Senna v Prost, Schumacher v Hill and tons more): goo.gl/9EjGB8
★ SIM RACERS! Take a look at my other sim racing videos: goo.gl/DFzvxP - also be sure to watch the Driver's University to improve your technique.
This video is part of a Driver61's "Driver's University" series. Got an aspect of racing you'd like me to explain? Ask in the comments!
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★ Got racing technique questions? Ask in the comments!
★ Say hi on Facebook: ➜ / officialdriver61 - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
When it comes down to REAL racing tips and tutorials, you are absolutely THE MAN, Scott!
I have watched every vid so far and learned a few things that I believe will get me better lap times. Thanks!
No problem! Glad you enjoyed them - please share!
Driver61 sure thing!
Did it!?? Because I'm doing the same in hope of shaving like .5xx off.
Thanks a million, Scott. Love the rundown on maximizing corner performance.
One other problem with abruptly turning in is body roll. We aren't always in rigid suspension open wheel platforms, and when larger bodies are involved the body roll issue is huge
Thanks for watching! Check out the rest of the Driver's Uni series including how to trail brake (bit.ly/2PypIMK)
Find out your driver level by taking our scorecard test: bit.ly/2LmYNBA
ah looks like your links expired mate
So much great info in here.... Thank you!
Thanks Scott for all this information, is really useful
Thank you for these videos, with practice I can tell that I’m going to shave time off my lap times. During an online race I find that I’m usually about mid field, quicker than those behind but just can’t find the extra speed to really challenge those in front. What you said about jumping off the brakes and turning too quickly very much applies to me I believe. I drive quite well, an reasonably fast and consistent but have scratched my head as to where to find more speed/lower lap times to compete for more wins. Thanks Scott your videos are fantastic whether they’re like this one about lowering lap times, looking at old F1 cars or analysing great drivers techniques. 🏁🏎🏆😉👍👍👍
I imagine your lessons can also be applied to SIM racing as well? Thanks for the video mate :)
It is actually the same
hell, I've applied it to my NFS:MW(online)game and it worked. No reason it wouldn't work even better on a SIM race.
Makes great sense. Getting closer to finding perfect edge at Laguna Seca turn 5 and 6. Next I need to work on edge at 10. The rest are money. Will really focus on your theories of front rear weight transfer to grip ratio. Thanks!
Hi Scott, thank you for these amazing tips and tutorials, with sharp commentaries. I know it is a lot of work but having videos as examples of each point would help a lot. I’m sure you may have already been thinking about it, but thought it would be good to say it also as a viewer.
Awesome!!!!! Love that u can find awnsers to questions that are slowing our times down.
Recently I started driving the course slow to get certain breaking points etc. I was taking it very easy yet I was pretty much the same time as my ghost.
So I’m thinking I’m losing a ton of time on being slow on corner entry and exit (still mastering no assist). My style is in between the slow down then turn(basic texhnique) and trailbreaking.
I believe my braking point is the same as the basic “slow down then turn.
So I am trailing the brake into corner but still using the breaking point for the easier technique.(when I brake later I tend to lock them n miss my corner.
Hi Scott , Great information Thanks 😊
Excellent video, id like to see a definitive guide to everything apex
Great video! Thanks for the free content!
Hi, thanks for the comment. If you can, please help me out and share the video! Cheers, Scott.
Thanks for the video
Thank you so much. Learnt a ot
1Thanks so much for all this. It's very helpful, even after over 100 races, hillclimbs, sprints and trackdays around the world. Got my UK race licence now. No plans to race but I would like to instruct trackday newbies. Any hints on fast tracking an instructor's licence? Apart from learning the info in your videos!
1:28 alright then, keep your secrets
smooth as possible works in most cases but not all. Sometimes (rarely in a circuit especially with GT cars) you need to sacrifice a bit of entry speed breaking the grip on the tail end to help you rotate the car and position it straight for the exit.
Thank you
THANK YOU for watching!
Go to 500k soon brother.
I imagine Schumacher probably had a lot of pre-load in the front springs to push the front tyres harder into to the track whilst he was modulating the brake pedal on entry (just witness the aggressive turn-in with sparodic snap-oversteer with little steering input on his cars). His cars would have had very good rotation which would have inspired him to take massive speed in on a tighter line. This of course would require a rear-end set-up very close to the limit to try and match the extra grip of the front to give balanced rotation (his rear-ends broke away much more quickly but more freely than anyone else's, with the others having slightly more tyre scrub, including Senna). I believe Nigel Mansell had a similar style which is why he was so fast when the car was too his liking. Only the few with great car control can do this, otherwise they'd all be doing it.
@MrLewisBate Those comments I made were with regard to qualifying. I read somewhere that for the races, Schumacher drove with understeer, although understeer can be just differences in perception (lol). Understeer, in the Alain Prost, Carlos Reutemann school of driving can be very fast so long as the car is always pointing into the corner. A bit complex to explain, but the the front end still has some "push" whilst the rear slides more and is worked harder. I observed this and drove other driver's cars back in the R/C car days, and the really fast, safe cars had this characteristic. Everyone thinks understeer is the characteristic of road cars where you end up understeering off the road as illustrated in text books, but there's no way a racing driver is going to be a race winner if he's comfortable driving a car that's inherently slow. The previous setup I was talking about I believe is within a small window which may explain why Prost and Reutemann were untouchable when the car was right now and again.
Ty
It's funny in a way as you can easily adapt this to normal roads and when you have someone in a fancy BMW or similar and you can see them in the rear mirror cutting corners on a normal road and they're up your backside trying to intimidate you but If you drive in to a bend by braking, steer and accelerate out the bend within the limit of your bit of road and speed, they way we were taught at driving lessons in Sweden, you can easily shake that annoying car off your back. As I live in Scotland for about 18 years my impression is that a lot drive way to fast in to a bend and end up off the road at the end of the bend. as the weight has shifted way to much as you so thoroughly explained. it definitely makes sense in wintry conditions as an unstable car leaves the road.
I use this technique on the A272 in Sussex
Hi scott, i was reviewing these videos, and was wondering what exactly do you mean by driving styles. Do driving styles differ on when people start rotating the car? I have seen quite a few drivers who will have a very small initial input but enough to get them close to the apex, and then they rotate pretty late and pretty hard. Then I've seen some drivers who keep the car close to the track limits for longer and their initial input is pretty smooth, but still significantly more than the former and they rotate a bit earlier. I'd imagine these differences might be used in different corners differently, and if so, where should I use the former and where should I use the latter.
I know this video is from last year, but while hearing you talking about being smooth with the steering it came to my mind the way Alonso was driving his Renault back when he won his titles. He seemed to be ary agressive with the steering imputs, turning very quickly and waiting for the front to respond. Would be very nice to see some explanaition of what was going there
Thales The illegal "Mass Damper" was sticking his front end to the track. Didn't have much success after they discovered the trick.
I can only speculate what Alonso was doing but it is possible he was 'see sawing' the steering to feel the grip on the front axle more. By doing that and based on the lightness of the steering effort you know how much grip is left. Perhaps this is not the smoothest technique but it does help to feel the grip, some cars that dont' have much steering feel could benefit from it. I've done it in my s2000, it helps. It's something to be careful about though. If you are see sawing without being close to the limit you are going to jerk the car sideways and spin out.
The stiffer the suspension the less it needs to move (transition) to take a set. So the weight can be moved more quickly. The larger the suspension has to move (like in a street car) the more you need to slow your inputs down to not get in front of suspension taking the weight into it.
You can actually move quite quickly with inputs in a kart or formula car. You still need to be smooth, but the movements are quicker. Smooth doesn't mean slow. It means you are controlling the weight transfer.
Can you give tips for karting?
I wonder how much this applies to karting due to the absence of suspension and the high chassis stiffness.
Bruno Burden Less trail braking with a more plateaued brake trace are the biggest differences in karts imo. Without any speed-dependent grip, you don’t have to squeeze off the brake pressure as you do in an aero car to reach the braking limit. Depending on the class, throttle application can also be much earlier in the corner when in a kart.
Bwoahyou are awsome
1:35
Could you go over cornering for front engine, mid and rear cars. In the Sim I drive the 992 GT3 R.
I have my car set up for quick turn-in and tight corners. Right now my toe settings won't allow me to turn in smoothly on long corners. I can flick it around like mad through slaloms and tight hairpins but on the street through a long corner the inside/outside tires will fight each other for grip and swap over/understeer scenarios during the corner. It's actually quite scary to drive on the street but through cones it's so planted and nimble. I can get it to rotate so perfectly that I can hold it right at the limit between grip and drift without much effort at all. But then on long sweepers I have to put in a lot of steering input to hold my line.
My setup 1989 MR2:
Camber: -3 degrees front, -1.5 degrees rear
Toe: 1/8" out front, 1/16" in rear
Caster: 5 degrees
This is on garbage tires (and garbage wheels) but I'm trying to get everything sorted before I put NT-01's on my 14"x7" Team Dynamics Ultralight wheels.
Does this more or less hold for indoor go kart racing ?
Plz tell me am I right..
How I know that I am doing corner right? Assuming that I am doing right on -entry, exit and a middle- of a corner (outside, inside, outside) I like to hear just a little *screaming* from the tires and when thats happen I am happy.
This guy explains racing like someone who read a book and studied like crazy.....but never raced a real car a day in his life. Lol! I'm sorry, I respect your enthusiasm for racing and I think it's good beginner info.
Umm he actually is/was a real race car driver.
To turn like schumacher you just gotta wait for a driver to make a move down your inside, then you turn into them. Easy peasy
im a huge shumacher fan but this made me lmfao
Okay Shingo
Just like Alain Prost
You are a brit 😡
Enjoying watching these videos, keep it up.
As an aside, I race sidecars, which are odd beasts, they behave a bit like an unstable kart when you turn right, but a totally different machine when you turn left. Oh and when you accelerate or brake, they turn too. And that's not even touching on the essential role of the passenger.
Great stuff! There's a little sound glitch around 1:28.
Thanks for the feedback an apologies for the upload issue.
So what's being said there?
""we want to make the car enter the corner as quickly as possible and" + ????? = profit?
Jokes aside, we're missing out on a critical info there.
Thank you for make an in-depth videos, by the way.
I think he said exit
@@Driver61 wat u saying
@@gqh007 yeah "exit as quickly as we can" or something like that
Hi Mr Mansell you got some good content here. I was wondering if your knowledge extends to real racing without that tarmac locking us into a certaing groove and could do a similar style breakdown of dirt oval/rally technics?
When do i downshift entering into a corner for a manual trans. Thanks. Your tutorials are great. I am a novice.
you should look into the heel-toe and rev matching techniques
2:35 idk why but theres a loud BLIP and when i first heard it my paranoid brain was like "has someone bugged my bedroom?" 😂
Great video as always. I know exactly how this works in theory. But try to do it properly while under pressure in a race, however, and i end up feeling like this tractor:
🎆🎉✨🎉🎆
🥇🥈🥉👏👏
🏎🏎🏎🏎🏎💨 🏁 🚜 🤦♂️
Can you make how to turn-in like senna?
I recently got into Assetto Corsa, found this channel while looking for ways to improve, and binged on a lot of it but all I have is a keyboard\mouse to control the car.
Obviously this seems to be a huge disadvantage based on your information about weight transfer and grip however I watched another video about Trackmania records being broken by someone using a keyboard to drive since it allowed him to perform certain corners like very aggressive S-chicanes better. I started off by increasing downforce via the front and back wings but now I'm thinking stiffer suspension would be good for me too. Any other good adaptations you can think of? Tire pressure increase?
This is about reality, not computer games!
@@fam.hunger5244 the general principles are transferable, focus on yourself.
Trackmania does not intend to simulate real car physics, and "hacks" like you described work only in that specific game engine and do not translate to simulators in any way.
I am trying to play ACC on a gamepad, and it is still VERY hard to do anything smoothly, inputs don't feel linear at all and there is like "no room" to control it properly
How tough it is to "translate" everything you say to actual driving, I think it requires a level of sensitivity I actually don´t have. Do you think there is any way of training that sensitivity, if it does make any sense? Thanks for your videos, they are great.
atomed2 If you are able to get any sort of telemetry, namely brake throttle & steering traces, that should help immensely. Being able to see where your inputs are at any phase in corner helped me break more than a few bad habits that I didn’t know I had as well as helping solve some tricky problem corners. If you don’t have access to telemetry at the track, I know Assetto Corsa has plenty if you have a sim to work on technique.
How do you find the limit between slowing too much and not breaking the grip threshold?
Followup question: How can you do it consistently?
I was thinking this too. Do you start by going in slower to perfect other areas and then slowly build up over time by getting faster and faster until you find the limit? Any tips? @driver61??
I'm learning english, can anyone add some CC? I love this channel.
There is an auto cc by TH-cam. It looks pretty accurate too. If your on mobile TH-cam it's the 3 dots at the top right then you'll see captions.
01:28 and... WHAT as we can what, I must know now
Accelerate
Can you explain how to produce a tiny amount of oversteer to maximise corner entry angle?
Hi, check out our tutorial on trail braking: driver61.com/uni/trail-braking/ Enjoy!
Tu canal es interesante pero me gustaria que pusieras SUB en ESP. asi tendrias mas subcriptores de habla hispana.. Seria de gran ayuda🤔
Damn if someone could animate this
"How to Turn-in Like Schumacher"
10 years of practice.
simple as that.
but no one ever wants to hear "practice" as an answer, do THEY?!
No
turn in, when you are going fast, you should be turning in pretty fast.
I keep hearing this malarkey about Smooth turn in, and when you watch a race driver, the tun in is FAST. Smooth? not really. turn in speed matches going speed. and late or early apex.
You can turn in fast but the smoothness is all about mid corner and exit. You turn in fast to load up the outside wheels then you keep the steering steady and slowly bleed off to maximise exit speed.
How come I haven’t seen you in real F1????
This "things" destroy NaturalRacing Talent!
Not really. Actually they are a part of natural racing talent. But only the really big ones have that.
you have to have a setup that can turn in quickly
It is all about the driver, setup is only the last 10 %
i know an easier way to turn-in like Schumacher, cut off his hands, make them into gloves, and use them to drive with!
A VERY horny Mr.Dinosaur You do need his feet as well for that. He was a tricky genius with rotating the car on turn in
@@allesklarklaus147 you can downshift while turning to cause rotation..... i think