What's up with the "TAR BABY"? | Problems with Disney's Song of the South | Before Splash Mountain
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 พ.ค. 2023
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I grew up with Splash Mountain but I'm truly excited for a change! Today's video is part of a series discussing Brer Rabbit, Song of the South, America Sings, Splash Mountain, and Tiana's Bayou Adventure. I think it's fun that one of Disney's most problematic properties will be replaced by something more timely and relevant. My goal will be to discuss the evolution of the attraction honestly and respectfully.
Of course, there is far more info than I could fit in one video. So below you'll discover some resources that might be valuable for anyone looking to research the topic further:
Anansi the Spider and the Gum Baby | African Folktale
www.raceandhistory.com/histori...
"Why "Tar Baby" Is Such a Sticky Phrase" | TIME Magazine
content.time.com/time/nation/...
Song of the South and why you'll never see it on Disney+ by Shawn Rosell
• Song of the South and ...
Disney During World War II | Disney Editions Deluxe
www.amazon.com/Disney-During-...
produced by Brandon Specht
Music by Kevin MacLeod
incompetech.com/music
#BrerRabbit #SongoftheSouth #splashmountain
another great video! when i saw your first one about brer rabbits origins i was blown away with how much you got correct! its upsetting how much misinformation is spread about these stories and i am glad you are presenting the truth in this series. its great to see my ancestors stories respected, thank you so much.
Hey! Thank you so much! I've experienced so much conflicting commentary coming from those on either side of the "debate". While researching Song of the South, it appears most of the truth tends to land somewhere in the middle.
I’m personally really sad to see these characters leave Splash Mountain.
I'll miss the characters for sure.
My first encounter with the Brer Trio would have to be from watching the Disney Sing-A-Long videos and the Read-Along book about the Tar Baby. Upon hearing that the Tar Baby story had some controversy itself, I was generally surprised that they made a read-along book let alone do a read-along book of any of the animated segments. I do think that a fully animated movie would have been the better choice, but it is understandable as to why they didn't do that, I still cannot help but imagine what that would have been like. I am not sure if I ever had gone on any of the Splash Mountain rides, but I do remember hanging around the outside of the Magic Kingdom version when I traveled there with my family a long time ago and saw the statue outside the ride. I had no idea that in about a decade, it would get changed to Tiana's Magical Bayou.
I think that my interest in these characters in the more recent years would have to be from checking out a Banjo-Kazooie rom-hack somebody has been working on who made one of the levels be based around Splash Mountain. It would be great to see the Brer Trio back in action in a future project.
I have never heard about the Bango Kazooie rom-hack!
I barely knew anything about song of the south other than that there was a lot of controversy surrounding it. Recently I visited New Orleans and I was very curious about the African influences on Louisiana. I picked up a book recounting Creole folktales, of which included stories featuring Compair Lapin (Brother Rabbit) and Compair Bouki (Brother Hyena, translation gets a bit jumbled because America-Born people who’d hear the stories wouldn’t know what a hyena was)
I realized the characters/some story elements had some similarities to the ones on Disneyland ride, and it made me curious about the subject of the film
Very good! From what I've discovered, the characters (like Brer Rabbit) have little to do with any controversy, especially their original versions. Those are essentially folktales with a lesson or moral.
When I was a kid Uncle Remus would put me to bed . Good wisdom ! Like don’t pick a fight with someone for a flipped reason. No need to be offended easily. There are those people who are not out for your benefit. Keep your wits about you when dealing with them.
Words to live by
I read that the animated sequences of Song of the South are not nearly as controversial as their live action counterparts.
I 110% agree.
I first encountered the characters on a tape & book of Brer Rabbit & the Tar Baby from Disney.
For my entire life I've wanted to see the full segment. I've watched several bits and pieces, but have never had the conscience to watch it all the way through.
But twenty or thirty years of curiosity is getting the better of me; especially since for all of the other Disney tapes & books I managed to see the full movies before my double digits. (I am now in my thirties.)
It’s online somewhere. I forget where I watched it. I’m comfortable saying the few animation segments are visual outstanding, but all the live action.. well it’s not terribly entertaining IMO. Worth satisfying your curiosity tho
I want to say I had one of those read along books with a 45 of song of the south 🤔
Thats cool! I never acquired that one.
Love the video. Very interesting. Have to admit I still have questions about how and why (and how much) Brer Rabbit and Tar Baby are controversial. My mom read me Brer Rabbit and Tar Baby books from the library when I was little. I thought of them as just old stories. I didnʻt associate them with Disney characters or Song of the South until I was an adult. I still am not sure how the story characters in themselves are racist. As soon as I saw Song of the South as an adult, I knew PARTS of the movie were highly problematic, but I still donʻt understand why Tar Baby is. And honestly, not sure how Uncle Remus in that section of the movie is, either.
I have another video "Who is Brer Rabbit?" that may help shed some light on those original stories. As for the Tar Baby, it seems to me the term was hijacked for nefarious purposes (a derogatory meaning) that is now hard to avoid.
My mom said her teacher got them tickets to go see it. She went to a mostly white school in Mississippi. I just looked it up again.
Oh wow
Mules and Men
by Zora Neale Hurston
I encountered these characters when I saw song of the South in the movie theater as a child in the 70s. There also used to be a show called The wonderful world of Disney and they played shorts and clips of the main movies on the weekly show. But I saw all of the Walt Disney movies animated and otherwise in the theater as a child because they re-released them all in the 70s in the theater. As a child and even today I don't understand the racial connotations of it it didn't seem to me like they were mocking black people because black people that I admit didn't talk like that it sounded like country folk to me and it still does. I can see how you can say well tar is black and that may have been what they were going for 80 years ago but racism didn't enter my mind . It's only with the recent exaggeration and pushing of micro aggressions that this is even an issue which is obviously meant to just divide. I really am sick of it and I wish that people would just drop it so it would go away and we can just be all normal people together instead of constantly talkin about it every minute of every day.
That’s awesome!
....i found out my relatives have a genuine copy of this thing. It freaked me out when I saw it, the baby freaked me out and this was only a few weeks ago. It has the vinyl and everything inside it. Ill ask if she will let me have a video of it, its a piece of history and i want to share it.
Oh wow.!
It's amazing that it's racist to use characters that are BLACK folklore tale characters.
Well, so Remus isn't a black folklore character and he's typically the major issue regarding Song of the South. Also the appropriation of Black Folklore can be problematic as well. I put together a video on the Folklore aspect. th-cam.com/video/O7MYk_LPKpQ/w-d-xo.htmlsi=ZOfuVUhEhDf4NSGS Currently working on one about James Bassett/Uncle Remus I hope to have out in 2024.
@@retrospectrum Keep working as he is. Yes, the book was written by a white man, but he went to gather these stories from black people. Those stories were mostly oral so they needed to be written down. It's NOT "appropriation". That's a word people who have an agenda use to make EVERYTHING that they don't like racist. BTW, I read these stories to my daughter every night as bedtime stories. A black father to his daughter, one who had an encyclopedia of black history to study, lived in 40 states, including all the southern ones, and is old enough to remember "white and colored" fountains and having to avoid certain roads and highways when riding with family. .
@@ddc163264 So one of the things that inspired me to start this series was to learn a bit about why there is any controversy in the first place. Admittedly, I enjoyed these characters quite a bit as they appeared in theme parks and will always have a warm place for them in my heart. What I've experienced so far in exploring these stories, learning their history, and just talking to people is that there is probably less debate than people would have you believe. Anecdotally, I haven't experienced anyone who've felt the characters themself (Rabbit, Fox, Bear) are racist. The problematic aspects have always involved Uncle Remus' portrayal and the language used in some of Harris' book. Now as a veteran educator I'm admittedly against book banning and censorship. I'd prefer the text made available, with proper context.
In terms of "Appropriation" there may be semantics in that conversation (which if I'm honest may not be all that important). However, the more interesting conversation may be "Where is the line between Cultural Appropriation and Cultural Exchange?" Certainly, in Harris' case, he took these stories, transcribed them, and made a tidy sum in the process, but Its very possible without him, some of these stories may have been lost. That outcome is definitively bad (IMO).
@@retrospectrum Those stories WOULD have been lost as most of them were oral stories passed down and just like there are whole tribes that can no longer speak their languages because they were oral only, these stories would've fallen on the same sword. Appropriation is a term that has become a hammer for almost everything. I've had native american in my bloodline and even worked for the AICF as a computer consultant. But most tribes saw people who wore some sort of native referenced garb as something to honor them, not degrade them.
Because most people don't name or wear things that they think are bad or doesn't have a power to them. The best symbols, including orals ones inspire and teach.The best stories from around the world usually are those that have a moral, teach a lesson, inspire fortitude or some other positive action. These were the stories he gathered. Yes, he made a tidy sum of money, but I don't hold that against him for doing so and the language was what was being spoken. To say it wasn't is to deny the truth. Gathering stories and profiting from them goes back thousands of years to Socrates and beyond.
@@ddc163264 I’m not sure I understand the connection to the philosopher Socrates. Can you explain that a bit more?
But song of the south in Tiana bayou andventure please i begging you and but song of the south on Disney + for me