Yup, i'll agree with that. XC falcon is pre-handling improvements (known as "XC and a half" from memory) model. From what I can remember that ad caused controversy as it was an "overt" (using the competitors names) comparison ad of the type not usually screened in Australia at that time.
Ford responded with an add where they punted an XC falcon through a slalom using their top 6 racing drivers instead of witches hats, inluding Alan Moffat, John Goss, Colin Bond, Murray Carter, Dick Johnson and Ron Dickson.
You can see they flicked the steering with all the others and feathered it with the Holden. All Holden really did was turn a woeful handling HX into a competently enough handling HZ. The real revelation was the CM Valiant where it went from a poor handling CL boat without the optional sway bar, to a very competent handling CM with sway bar as standard. The last few months of CL production also came with this handling package from Chrysler Australia. Motoring critics were reportedly astounded at the transformation. Rumour was that Chrysler Australia shipped a CL Valiant to Chrysler headquarters in the U.S to help improve the handling and they left it untouched saying it was the best handling large Chrysler they had ever driven!!
James French And then Ford updated their suspension system on the XC too. Alan Moffat, Colin Bond? and others were used as witches hats in a similar style commercial. The Chrysler Valiant was only 12 months away from death by that time. But having said that, if you can find a road worthy HZ, they handle like an HQ should’ve right from the start. Can’t think of his name, but the boss of GM-H prior to Peter Hanneburger? wanted understeer to be the handling characteristic for all Holden models to slow the drivers down. Scare the shit out of them in other words.
At least the HQ and HJ didn't have horribly emission strangled engines. Poor HX got it the worst with both the horrid handling and ADR -27A emissions engines. The previous Holden boss was brought out from Cadillac in the U.S and wanted the HQ range to ride like a Caddy. Soft spring rates with no thought to handling. Understeering pig that Australians still bought in droves. Our market has always been slim pickings compared to what is available overseas. Good little sheep we are.
The CL valiant did have a sway bar as standard in all models but it was 22 mms diameter with 5.5 inch steel rims ; the later CL and CM models had a 24mm diameter sway bar on 6 inch wheels and revised rear leaf springs which helped it's handling somewhat
My 78 CL 4.0 litre sedan which missed the handling revisions slated for the CM by a free months, handled quite decently (but with sloppy steering) with an LPG tank from a retired taxi fitted to it in the boot, but one night it let go it's rear end in a downpour when I pushed it too hard around a right hand bend and nearly hit a tree when I over corrected after heading for oncoming cars. That loss of control was a terrible feeling. I was so used to the grip the weight of the tank afforded it and pushed my luck too far. That car got better fuel mileage on gas doing 110 screaming away than sitting on 80.
Good point - and GMH had the nerve to sell the compromised design for six years...but Aussies lapped it up! This RTS system was subsequently eclipsed by Valiant's updated CL handling pack and the 1978 XC.
To anybody who drove an HQ/J/X series, it really was 'chalk and cheese, to paraphrase Sir Jack Brabham. HZ series was so much better it wasn't funny, and yes,RTS was ready for HQ in '71. Head engineer at the time, George Roberts, simply overruled everyone. Great days, RTS was the beginning of Oz car's real improvement. Thanks for the upload 😁👍
Very controversial for the day, as slagging off the competition just wasn't done back then. Mitsibishi made it a habit in the 80s, and everyone's been doing it since
@AshtrayI Ever seen a Cortina 6 that's been thrashed a bit? As that crossmember was never designed to handle the torque of a 200 or 250 6, they hanve a tendency to fracture the chassis rail. If the rust didn't get 'em, often the engine will
Mates dad had 4.1 gl Te wagon auto……ac company car…….towed overloaded Cavan plenty of trips…….. First auto 80,000km………second auto 163000 km………sold at 230,000 km 5 yo. With a new water pump. Front brakes every 20,000 km heavy duty,
Had I been old enough to buy a brand new TE Cortina back in the day, I would have taken the Ghia with 2 litre four and a four speed manual.......the more safer option for that size car. I prefer good handling and changing gears myself.
@@noelgibson5956 It was an odd combo.Europe/UK made do with 1.6's and 2.0's fours which is all it needed.basically it took them till the Meteor and the Telstar/TX5 range come the eighties to realize a six was not needed at Ford Australia in this class just a well made four.of course come 1991-1995 Ford would return via Mazda with a V6 in that class of car but that's another story.
The Cortina 6 could be made to handle well. Add extra caster, stiffer sway bar at front and negative rather than positive camber. Only genuine issue was lack of traction at the back. Cortinas in Europe also got a 2.3V6, and South Africa also got the Essex 3.0 V6.
The Datsun 240K was quite bad too - you could see it progress to roll oversteer and I did not like the look of how the rear axle was loading up. It was lifting its inside front too.
@@saxongreen78 The six cylinder Cortina's were a shocker for sure when it came to handling. The Torana's had some pretty big understeer problems too until RTS. The six cylinder Centura could be a handfull too, but it had so much grunt you could apply the power and get out of the nose heavy understeer pretty easily.
Ford were quite upset with this advert...as the driver is far more accurate in his driving of the Kingswood,,,whereas he "throws" the others in...upsetting the composure of the cars...except the Kingy.
Funny thing is that the XC ad in response to this ad, proved Brocky was delibartly unsettling the other makes and if Allan Moffat had been at the wheel of the XC it would've been a faster result than 92km/h. CAMS had been arguing with Moffat about the eligibility of his Mustang since day dot and had he not made friends within CAMS he would've been denied the right to race not just the Legendary Mustang but many of his other cars. A point proven with the Rx-7 when CAMS changed it's governing members.
Brendan Muscat i can vaguely remember the XC ad, did Ford put a Kingswood and Torana put through the same test in their version driven by Moffat? I was around 11 at the time so my memory is hazy, hazey? Hay zee? Jesus.....😂
@brendanmuscat867 Bzzzt! Nope, wrong! I'm pretty sure the professional driver in this advert was actually John Leffler, who was a well known talent in open wheelers. Leffler was chosen in part because he had no affiliations (or sponsorship) with any manufacturer, and thus could be credibly claimed as 'independent' with no bias or loyalty to pursue. I recall there were runs filmed of some off the opposing cars which showed more extreme and dramatic results, but these were not shown in the final advert as they were adjudged to be too extreme.
Of course it was. Those cars were notorious. There is a man who lives not too far from me who had a TE Cortina; 4 cylinder, Ghia, in white with a grey vinyl roof. Was quite a classy looking machine dare I say. Anyhow, I don't know him, but I suspect that it gave him a big scare at some stage or other because all of his subsequent cars have been FWD Hondas; an original CRX, an Accord, two Integras, and two Civics.
@@brettonwoods9856 It was that bad to the Point Ford Australia had no option but to switch to sourcing the second generation Mazda 626 come the 1980s as a replacement.a well built and decent handling 4 is all was needed which is what they got belatedly with Telstar.I knew a girl who I went to primary school with whose parents during that time had a TF Cortina I am not sure if it was a 4 or a 6 they replaced it with a second generation TX5 as of the nineties.
Test was done on the city bound lanes of the the (then unopened) Eastern Freeway in Melbourne.
Yup, i'll agree with that. XC falcon is pre-handling improvements (known as "XC and a half" from memory) model. From what I can remember that ad caused controversy as it was an "overt" (using the competitors names) comparison ad of the type not usually screened in Australia at that time.
Nice one. Wonder if tyre pressures were equal on all cars.
The HZ with RTS out handles all of them , iv driven the big 3 at the time,
The cars of my childhood, good times
Ford responded with an add where they punted an XC falcon through a slalom using their top 6 racing drivers instead of witches hats, inluding Alan Moffat, John Goss, Colin Bond, Murray Carter, Dick Johnson and Ron Dickson.
Yeah, but watch that ad closely, and you'll see that the 'race drivers' were actually cardboard cut-outs :D
You can see they flicked the steering with all the others and feathered it with the Holden. All Holden really did was turn a woeful handling HX into a competently enough handling HZ.
The real revelation was the CM Valiant where it went from a poor handling CL boat without the optional sway bar, to a very competent handling CM with sway bar as standard. The last few months of CL production also came with this handling package from Chrysler Australia. Motoring critics were reportedly astounded at the transformation.
Rumour was that Chrysler Australia shipped a CL Valiant to Chrysler headquarters in the U.S to help improve the handling and they left it untouched saying it was the best handling large Chrysler they had ever driven!!
James French And then Ford updated their suspension system on the XC too. Alan Moffat, Colin Bond? and others were used as witches hats in a similar style commercial.
The Chrysler Valiant was only 12 months away from death by that time.
But having said that, if you can find a road worthy HZ, they handle like an HQ should’ve right from the start.
Can’t think of his name, but the boss of GM-H prior to Peter Hanneburger? wanted understeer to be the handling characteristic for all Holden models to slow the drivers down. Scare the shit out of them in other words.
I once owned an HJ...the handling was disgusting.
At least the HQ and HJ didn't have horribly emission strangled engines.
Poor HX got it the worst with both the horrid handling and ADR -27A emissions engines.
The previous Holden boss was brought out from Cadillac in the U.S and wanted the HQ range to ride like a Caddy. Soft spring rates with no thought to handling. Understeering pig that Australians still bought in droves. Our market has always been slim pickings compared to what is available overseas. Good little sheep we are.
The CL valiant did have a sway bar as standard in all models but it was 22 mms diameter with 5.5 inch steel rims ; the later CL and CM models had a 24mm diameter sway bar on 6 inch wheels and revised rear leaf springs which helped it's handling somewhat
My 78 CL 4.0 litre sedan which missed the handling revisions slated for the CM by a free months, handled quite decently (but with sloppy steering) with an LPG tank from a retired taxi fitted to it in the boot, but one night it let go it's rear end in a downpour when I pushed it too hard around a right hand bend and nearly hit a tree when I over corrected after heading for oncoming cars. That loss of control was a terrible feeling. I was so used to the grip the weight of the tank afforded it and pushed my luck too far.
That car got better fuel mileage on gas doing 110 screaming away than sitting on 80.
Here's a Holden that could finally handle well. Better late than never.
They actually had RTS ready for HQ but it got canned, badges were straight out of US parts bin ( as wete a lot of parts)
Good point - and GMH had the nerve to sell the compromised design for six years...but Aussies lapped it up! This RTS system was subsequently eclipsed by Valiant's updated CL handling pack and the 1978 XC.
You sure steel radials RTS were in 1971?
True.They knew at the time this ad was made VB was a year away and only decided to get everything right towards the end.
@@franzchong5889 My RTS HZ was built in 1977 so at least 2 years from any Dunnydore release.
Not sure steel radials were around for .1970 HQ
Not the Kingswood!
To anybody who drove an HQ/J/X series, it really was 'chalk and cheese, to paraphrase Sir Jack Brabham.
HZ series was so much better it wasn't funny, and yes,RTS was ready for HQ in '71.
Head engineer at the time, George Roberts, simply overruled everyone.
Great days, RTS was the beginning of Oz car's real improvement.
Thanks for the upload 😁👍
Push button radio? Now i've seen EVERYTHING!
Yeh Kingswoods handled real good..
The Datsun 240K was just as Good, and also had independent rear suspension.
A superb engine in those too.
I also loved the Toyota Corona MkII.
Very controversial for the day, as slagging off the competition just wasn't done back then. Mitsibishi made it a habit in the 80s, and everyone's been doing it since
@AshtrayI Ever seen a Cortina 6 that's been thrashed a bit? As that crossmember was never designed to handle the torque of a 200 or 250 6, they hanve a tendency to fracture the chassis rail. If the rust didn't get 'em, often the engine will
Mates dad had 4.1 gl Te wagon auto……ac company car…….towed overloaded Cavan plenty of trips……..
First auto 80,000km………second auto 163000 km………sold at 230,000 km 5 yo.
With a new water pump.
Front brakes every 20,000 km heavy duty,
Had I been old enough to buy a brand new TE Cortina back in the day, I would have taken the Ghia with 2 litre four and a four speed manual.......the more safer option for that size car. I prefer good handling and changing gears myself.
@@noelgibson5956 It was an odd combo.Europe/UK made do with 1.6's and 2.0's fours which is all it needed.basically it took them till the Meteor and the Telstar/TX5 range come the eighties to realize a six was not needed at Ford Australia in this class just a well made four.of course come 1991-1995 Ford would return via Mazda with a V6 in that class of car but that's another story.
The Cortina 6 could be made to handle well. Add extra caster, stiffer sway bar at front and negative rather than positive camber. Only genuine issue was lack of traction at the back.
Cortinas in Europe also got a 2.3V6, and South Africa also got the Essex 3.0 V6.
The only car that looked real bad was the Cortina. The Valiant would have been the fastest through the test though I bet.
The Datsun 240K was quite bad too - you could see it progress to roll oversteer and I did not like the look of how the rear axle was loading up. It was lifting its inside front too.
The Cortina was deadly...seen more than one meet its demise wrapped sideways around a pole.
@@saxongreen78 The six cylinder Cortina's were a shocker for sure when it came to handling. The Torana's had some pretty big understeer problems too until RTS. The six cylinder Centura could be a handfull too, but it had so much grunt you could apply the power and get out of the nose heavy understeer pretty easily.
@@area51isreal71 ahh memories, I loved my centura, 4 speed 245 got them at the lights all the time.
@@time2kickarse Damn good cars. Heaps of grunt and interior room and boot space that made the Torana and Cortina look silly.
Top gear OZ - ditch the boring Proton sandwich maker and have a Cortina 6 wagon. Ratings would blitz!
TE, TF Cortina's were a well sorted car unlike previous models. Especially the six cylinder versions.
Classic kingwood 1️⃣🇦🇺💯⭐️💣
That much is easy to spot eh, not surprised to hear Ford got upset..
I drove the cortina as a rental.
Ford were quite upset with this advert...as the driver is far more accurate in his driving of the Kingswood,,,whereas he "throws" the others in...upsetting the composure of the cars...except the Kingy.
billoddiea You’ve only got to look at the driver’s hands on the wheel, he flings the Falcon and Cortina into those corners
...furthermore, the Valiant actually looked like it was having fun - just like on _Bluey_ or _Homicide!_
Funny thing is that the XC ad in response to this ad, proved Brocky was delibartly unsettling the other makes and if Allan Moffat had been at the wheel of the XC it would've been a faster result than 92km/h. CAMS had been arguing with Moffat about the eligibility of his Mustang since day dot and had he not made friends within CAMS he would've been denied the right to race not just the Legendary Mustang but many of his other cars. A point proven with the Rx-7 when CAMS changed it's governing members.
Brendan Muscat i can vaguely remember the XC ad, did Ford put a Kingswood and Torana put through the same test in their version driven by Moffat?
I was around 11 at the time so my memory is hazy, hazey? Hay zee?
Jesus.....😂
@brendanmuscat867
Bzzzt! Nope, wrong!
I'm pretty sure the professional driver in this advert was actually John Leffler, who was a well known talent in open wheelers.
Leffler was chosen in part because he had no affiliations (or sponsorship) with any manufacturer, and thus could be credibly claimed as 'independent' with no bias or loyalty to pursue. I recall there were runs filmed of some off the opposing cars which showed more extreme and dramatic results, but these were not shown in the final advert as they were adjudged to be too extreme.
All cars would eventually keep up, but I don't remember such thing being important before?
Cool - looked familiarish...bridge angle looks Belford Road?
Now let's see the Kingwood..
Let's see the Kingswood again..
And let's see the Kingswood again..
lol repeating..
I reckon one more time wouldve been good..
Yeah the woody
"Drive a real change for a change"?
Fire that copywriter!
At the time probably the best Isuzu made.
Ha ha that's some deceptive advertising right there
Your not wrong there crumpets
The Cortina Six is yucky - not a particularly agile machine with a 4cyl, woeful with that big 6cyl lump.
Of course it was. Those cars were notorious. There is a man who lives not too far from me who had a TE Cortina; 4 cylinder, Ghia, in white with a grey vinyl roof. Was quite a classy looking machine dare I say. Anyhow, I don't know him, but I suspect that it gave him a big scare at some stage or other because all of his subsequent cars have been FWD Hondas; an original CRX, an Accord, two Integras, and two Civics.
@@brettonwoods9856 It was that bad to the Point Ford Australia had no option but to switch to sourcing the second generation Mazda 626 come the 1980s as a replacement.a well built and decent handling 4 is all was needed which is what they got belatedly with Telstar.I knew a girl who I went to primary school with whose parents during that time had a TF Cortina I am not sure if it was a 4 or a 6 they replaced it with a second generation TX5 as of the nineties.