Live Stream through a Matrix | Full Scene Setup
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 มี.ค. 2021
- Recently, I was inspired by a MxU video and redid my entire board scene to run on a matrix. This was a great option and I really enjoyed the workflow... except one crucial element that I discuss in the video.
Matrix Routing to USB for Live Stream
• X32 Live Stream Using ...
thank you i am setting up a wing console and i know it isnt the same but the idea of setting up a matrix this was is pretty smart definitely implementing this to my set up
On the Wing you can do this pretty easily using one of the four Main outputs. It is similar to a Matrix in its concept and allows for a quick setup. I just picked up a Wing and will begin making videos in a few weeks about my learnings.
I use quite a similar setup, but we have a Presonus SLIII 32SC (the one with 16+1 channel faders), and Presonus has a really nice way to implement aux/matrix-mixes.
On the left side are all the "flex-mixes" which can be either aux/matrix/subgroup(bus), so they are accessible with one button press. And in that layer the "main" will be correspondent for the flexmix-main, in this example the main of the matrix-mix. Although it is possible to lock the "main" to the "main-mix" for security. And in these matrices are really every channel/bus/main/fx/tape... that are on the board, there are like 4 pages of them. So if you really need to access the PC-return, then you just switch the page and there it is (switching the page is painfull though, it doesnt remember which page you were on, so you need to switch to page 4 everytime you want to change PC-return, only aux/subgroup can be customised)
Dont know if it is possible on a x32, but the setup is really clean
And you can change the headphone-output on Presonus to every aux/matrix-bus, maybe that is also possible on x32
Gah finally! This makes so much sense now.
I’m glad I could help you unlock the code.
Thanks for the mixing tips - you have really helped us at our church. Especially like the pastors mic gain adding in. We use an X32 Compact and enjoy it. Also using USB from Aux to Stream with the Professional Limiter as you suggested previously. Love it. Bless you!
Scott Miller
Lake Pointe Bible Church, Plymouth, MI
That's awesome. Thanks for the encouragement and feedback. Let me know if you have any other challenges you are looking to overcome or need help learning about other topics.
Hi . Your videos have been very valuable in propelling me from rank amateur to corporal newbie !! Thx for the clarity . One question . Why would you use a matrix instead of solely routing through a stereo bus for the final output to the stream. That is, can I not rely simply on the separate mix I have created to the stereo bus ( let’s say 13 and 14) with all of the instruments, vocals and reverb .
You certainly can, and that is a similar setup I have gone back to using. The benefit to the Matrix is that you have the ability to start with your house mix which (in theory) is a solid starting foundation. The great thing about this stuff is there are so many ways to accomplish a single goal.
Your training has really helped me get a better understanding of the X32 console and strategies to routing and mixing. We are also using Propresenter and NDI. We use Vmix for our streaming. Question: if you bring your audio across on NDI (which works great) into your stream computer, how do you get your audio into the console? Computer audio out? USB? Vmix / OBS have the ability to synch the video / audio. But would there be delay differences between audio coming through the console (band, speaker) and audio coming through NDI (PP videos)?
I send audio from Pro7 across NDI for the livestream. For the house, I send from the same Pro7 laptop out the headphone jack and into the back of the console (AUX In 5/6). This keeps them separate and allows OBS to have set levels for our videos and then the soundboard livestream audio goes to our video switcher which then sends Audio/video into OBS. I hope that helps.
Doc you mentioned how to turn certain things up. Do you need to raise everything in the bus to lower the volume of something in the regular matrix mix or is there a way to lower the volume separately
This is the challenge when using a Matrix. You would effectively need to turn everything else up (within reason). I personally use a Post Fader MixBUS to have complete control of the mix and it will still follow your house mix so it is easy for a single sound tech to handle. This video here walks through my approach. th-cam.com/video/pMnaiuC55RY/w-d-xo.html
Would love to see the guys from MxU mixing live with a x32, and not use 20x times more expensive gear... I have another approach to this, as all my matrix are fully used by mains, balcony and side fillers. As Bus takes only inputs, i still want to use LR as main source for live and add on top if needed. So decided to output a LR copy to aux and back in another aux using patch cables. This way i can have LR as an input. Maybe helps you go around your issue.
thanks for the idea. I've found a happy medium of this matrix setup and my original AUX Bus setup. I get to put it into action tomorrow morning for the first time and I'm super excited.
How do you add reverb to the livestream? Everytime i adjust it adjust the main house mix. I followed your other "How to livestream with Matrix" video. Thanks.
So, if you are using a Matrix setup it becomes a bit more difficult depending on tour exact workflow for getting signals to the matrix. I personally would recommend a MixBUS approach so you have complete control. Regardless, this video has a section that discusses sending FX only to the live stream. There is a quick link in the description of the video to help you find it. th-cam.com/video/pMnaiuC55RY/w-d-xo.html
I love this setup! Sending the FOH mix into a matrix and adding a bus to fine tune. My question tho is this. Because we send the FOH mix to the matrix, when we move input faders on the front of house mix does that effect the matrix inputs?
Yes, A Matrix is the quickest way to get a mix sent to your stream and it will be impacted when you make fader changes for your front of house. If you turn a vocal up or down, that change will be heard in your stream as well. This video also discusses using a Post Fader MixBUS to supplement your stream mix and while this is a good setup, I prefer just using the Post Fader MixBUS approach and not a Matrix. This video here is the way I run my live stream on a weekly basis and it just removes one step from what youa re doing now with the Matrix. th-cam.com/video/pMnaiuC55RY/w-d-xo.html
Cool ! Right now I use the post fader mixbus . Still not where I want it to be but I’m going to keep at it
The best thing you can do is grab multitracks of your group and spend some time off hours to refine EQ, Comp and the FX to get where you want. Keep going and try to make small steps on a consistent basis.
I’m new to this board and your videos have been extremely helpful! Is there a way to control just the Matrix “Stream Mix” from a laptop and leave live FOH/musician monitors to the actual console?
A Matrix is a quick way to get a mix going to a stream, but it doesn’t provide the custom nature of having a mix for the house a different mix for your stream. I prefer running a Post Fader MixBUS pair for my stream. This is beneficial when you only have one sound tech and they have to manage both FOH and stream mixes. I discuss the setup in this video here. th-cam.com/video/pMnaiuC55RY/w-d-xo.html
If you have a second sound tech, you would do the same setup, but make the BUS a Pre-Fader setup so your FOH mix doesn’t impact your stream at all.
@@AllamHouse Thanks for the reply! There will be a second tech just for the stream, but that tech aims to mix the stream from an iPad or laptop. Is this possible?
Yes, having a second sound tech dedicated to the stream is a great way to go. You will want your Stereo MixBUS setup in a PreFader configuration and that person can mix remotely from an iPad or a laptop... or even a phone using the M32-Q app since it is designed to adjust MisBUSes.
What about using something like Voicemeeter on your computer, split out the Propresenter audio, one to NDI, the other to audio jacks, so that one is in time, the other delayed? Just a thought.
Thanks for the suggestion, I’ll look into it. We have been happily running a Post Fader MixBUS setup for a while now and been very happy with our results, but it never hurts to learn/try new things.
question :
I'm using ... drums a keyboard and a guitar and 3 mics.
How do I make the drumss... only heard in the transmission and not in the meeting room (because it makes too much noise)
Pd: I am using the bus configuration
Since you are using the MixBUS approach for your stream, you can check out this video. Around minute 18:00, I discuss FX being sent only to your stream. The same concept and buttons will apply for your drums. The description has quick links.
th-cam.com/video/pMnaiuC55RY/w-d-xo.html
Thank you for the help. I have the Livestream setup through the matrix into OBS for Facebook. My issue is I don't have complete control of the audio. I can fader all the way up or down and the volume doesn't change in the stream mix. This is for a single vocal for example. Where am I going wrong?
A matrix is a mix of buses so your mix will be determined by those other mixes and offers less control. I prefer using a MixBUS setup for my live stream so I have more control. If you have two sound techs for each event you can go with a Pre-Fader setup or if you are like me with only one sound tech we run a Post Fader setup. These two videos can guide you through the process.
1) MixBUS setup and routing: th-cam.com/video/Vx4HjArTeZI/w-d-xo.html
2) Refine your stream mix: th-cam.com/video/pMnaiuC55RY/w-d-xo.html
Thank you. We usually have the person running the stream mixing the stream. I'll look at the videos.
So you can't send individual channels as supplement into the Matrix mix? I used presonus mixer before and I was able to do that. I just what to make sure I'm not missing something here. Thanks for the reply.
I cover this in a quick 1 minute video below, but the short version is a MixBUS is a mix of inputs and a Matrix is a mix of MixBUSs. In this video you watched I start with a feed from my main bus and then supplement with a MixBUS as needed.
th-cam.com/video/I_9KeueWL-0/w-d-xo.html
@@AllamHouse Thanks for a fast replay. I was just wondering since on Presonus mixers you can send any input to a Matrix mix. Looks like X32/M32 needs to get with the program :) Do you know if the new Wing mixer has this ability?
I is m curious about the Presonus to know what the actual setup looks like to know if it is a true matrix. By definition (on consoles in general) a matrix is a bus of buses. I know Presonus offers their flex-mix setup, but that is unique to them and maybe that is what you are talking about. I’m pretty sure the Wing and all other consoles will function the same as the X32 in terms of matrix design. Depending on what you are trying to accomplish there are some unique setups you can do on the X32, but it comes down to what you are trying to accomplish.
@@AllamHouse Yes, that is correct. Presonus refers to them as flex mixes. I got Midas M32 live now so your videos are awesome. I like how you got your mixer setup. Thanks for all your help and for providing good videos with lots of detailed information.
Hey looking back at this video I just wanted to ask you if a couple of things would have worked in your scenario… I appreciate all your interaction & feedback.
1.) Would you have been able to turn down the fader all the way down on the stream matrix to not have the computer audio copy come through the stream and then bring the fader back up once the video was done playing and you switched back to your in house cameras? Or perhaps even mute the matrix just while the video was playing?
2.) Since you decided the main mix as being a bus, it got me thinking… is there any way to isolate the main mix bus within a matrix via a fader or does the fader on the far right of the board always just control the entire mix level no matter what page (whether it’s inputs, bus, etc) you’re on? I ask because I was trying to think of ways to use the ‘send on fader’ for the main mix and the subsequent changes not actually affecting the house. Have no clue if that’s possible but I’m curious lol.
3.) Another big assumption, but assuming you had an available bus… how easy/quick is it to take the main mix bus that you had for the house and copy it to a new aux bus, so you could then isolate that bus and the input channels in it, to inevitably mute the computer input in that bus and not have it play through the stream matrix but still play through the house?
I really hope that made sense lol. Once again appreciate all your content and feedback!
I love how you are pulling this apart snd trying to find solutions.
1) Yes I could have done a work around for sure, but so personally only mix once a month at my church so I needed a solution that is easy to train people and less moving parts is always better.
2) In a matrix setup like I built, any changes to the house mix will be heard in the livestream. There are ways to create two separate mixes, but that would typically use a pre-fader MixBUS for your stream.
3).your thoughts here are actually how we managed our stream before and after this matrix experiment. We use a Post Fader MixBUS pair for our stream. I actually cover the entire build in this video here in case you are curious. th-cam.com/video/pMnaiuC55RY/w-d-xo.html
@@AllamHouse yes! thanks for your response and I am definitely interested in watching that video!
Hi, I am pretty new with digital mixers, please I have a question, where do I plug my xlr cable that feed the camera with sound behind the console.
Please note I have done everything you discussed 8n your video, but there was no sounds in my camera
Are you using a MixBUS or a Matrix for your stream?
@@AllamHouse wow, i did not expect a swift response, thank bro
I am using Mixbus for the live stream, and I connected my xlr to output 13
So, it sounds like your camera only has one XLR input which will require you to run a mono stream. It’s not ideal, but it is a fine place to start. Now that you built yourself mix on the console (assuming it is on MixBUS 13) you should be able to plug the XLR cable into output 13 on the console and it should work. If it doesn’t, you will want to check your Routing > Out settings to make sure MixBUS 13 is set to go out Local Out 13.
Hello AllamHouse..
I'm using a linked 7/8 bus output via usb for livestream. I'm coming out of bus 7 XLR to a powered monitor to hear the livestream mix. When I replay the livestream service I notice that some channels are at a different volume than I heard in my powered monitor mix. Everything is pre-fader and I have a drum track very low in my 7/8 livestream mix, but the drum loop is very loud when I replay the service. Do I need to come out of 7and 8 xlr output to my monitor or why don't I hear the true mix in my monitor?
Thanks
First place to start is the Routing > Outs area. Make sure your Output 7/8 is getting its signal from Bus 7/8. Also, you can make this tap point Post-Fader so your Bus channel strip (EQ and Comp) are taken into account on this output. Check this for both 7 and 8.
Next thing to check is that you select the Bus 7 and make sure they are linked.
Finally, select Bus 7, hit “sends on fader” and check the mix going into this Bus. You have the ability to adjust the mix independently of the FOH mix since you stated you have the Bus setup as Pre Fader (which is set globally for all inputs by selecting the Bus 7 and hitting Home > Config).
Does anyone know if the 11/12 mixbus in this video should be set to prefader or postfader?
The MixBUS I used in this video should be set to Post Fader.
Sincere question bro, isnt this the same as running from a bus channel for livestream? or is there a benefit in running through a matrix?
On some level it could be very similar, but at the core they are different setups. This short, 1 minute video covers the difference between the two. th-cam.com/users/shortsI_9KeueWL-0?feature=share
Quick question brother , do we have to send matrix to live tream bus ?
There are a couple ways to build a live stream mix (MixBUS and Matrix). Keep in mind that a MixBUS is a mix of inputs and a matrix is a mix of buses (including your main stereo bus. I personally use a Post-Fader MixBUS setup in my venue, but either will work if managed well. th-cam.com/users/shortsI_9KeueWL-0?feature=share
Mmm how can you connect two x32 one for live and another for board cast
Yes, you select a master console and a slave console. Connect CAT5 from AES50B on Master to AES50A on slave console. Select your inputs as AES50A on the slave console. Go into the settings and make sure you clock to the Master console. Also, understand the initial gain is set at the Master console.
I have a stereo subgroup for instruments, one for vocals, one for drums and one for effect returns. I compress the groups and send them to the matrix for livestream. It works. (I don't send the mains into the matrix). Anybody else doing something like this?
Yep, that is the second way of doing it. I mention there are two ways, but only jump into the way I did in my setup. If I had more available groups I would have given this a try, but I ran out so I had to go back to my original plan of attack.
@@AllamHouse is there disadvantages or advantages to doing it this way vs sending the stream out from a mix bus? Most people I watch say there are more options to send from a bus send but I don't see why
@@bradseppala495 Keep in mind that a Matrix is a mix of Buses (not inputs) so you have to have inputs going into Buses that then allow you to add the Bus mix into the Matrix. The quickest way to get a starting mix is to send your FOH mix (which is the LR Bus) into your Matrix and then have a stereo Bus pair that allows you to fine tune the mix by adding other instruments. To me, it is not as streamlined as it could be and is more complicated for volunteers to manage. I prefer running a Post-Fader Bus mix for my stream and just control the mix one time that is going into this mix.
@@AllamHouse yes, I understand that. In a video with churchfront they did what the Szaba commented with all bus sends post fader so your stream mix is following your live mix. (bumping the drums up in the live mix send they since they are louder live). No ind channels go tot he main bus LR or Mono, only the bus sends do. We mix down the drums to a bus send anyway and send that to the FOH. If you are adding bus sends to the matrix with a LR already going to it are you doubling inputs to the final stream mix out?
@@bradseppala495 yes, you would be doubling up which is. It really ideal. If you are running everything through buses then you might be able to run a Matrix for your stream with success. I tend to just use the Buses for convenience and training purposes.
Question 1 . why use 2 mixes your foh mix and stream to send to the matrix
Question 2 . Is your mix bus the stream bus coverted to a matrix ?
Full transparency, I personally use a Post Fader MixBUS for live streaming as it fits my situation best. With that in mind, this video was me trying to make a Matrix work. A Matrix is a mix of buses and usually you start with your FOH stereo Bus. Then you have to augment with additional drums, bass and other items that are naturally loud in the room and not needed in the FOH mix. Hopefully this info helps you understand (and answer your Q1and Q2) that the bus is not a designed mix, but just adding to the FOH mix for your stream.
@@AllamHouse so how much mixes are you using for the stream and just to clear it up you are using a free auxiliary send which is coverted to a matrix then use another free mix bus aka auxiliary send then mix that bus then send it to the matrix to get consistent volume am i correct of the process you are doing
My current setup for streaming every week at my church does NOT use the approach discussed in this video we are commenting on, but instead it uses one Stereo Bus pair (Bus 11/12 linked for stereo). These are setup in a Post Fader configuration since I only have one sound tech managing everything. That mix is built from inputs going to the bus. Everything afterwards is done for controlling the mix at broadcast levels. The BUS pair is shaped with the channel strip and an inserted compressor and then sent to Matrix 1/2 for further shaping and an inserted limiter. The Matrix 1/2 leave the board through XLR outputs and go into my video switcher. I discuss the BUS to Matrix reasoning in this video here, but it’s really just to get more compression and EQ options before leaving the console. th-cam.com/video/9abR8wv4a9c/w-d-xo.htmlsi=ropsOxDtvAPN291M
95-96db in FOH for the music is one way we have children with hearing damage before high school age. If they are near the FOH speakers they are getting music too loud. I just visited a church that was at 98db at the rear of the room, and peaks of 101db. That’s going to be even higher at the front near the FOH speakers. Modern church is unnecessarily loud. 90db peak is a good limit. If the kids want to ruin their hearing for later in life, let’s not have church be the reason. Just my .02
Thanks for the input and concern. We do use a large, historic movie theatre and the dB level is measured 1/3 of the way back in our venue. The further you go back from stage the quicker the levels drop and the back row does measure at 89dB. We offer kids programming in a different building for birth-fifth grade. We are able to hear the congregation singing and we stay away from the ‘concert’ feel. Thanks again. Happy mixing.
Can we do with xr18 also if yes can you make the video
I don’t remember if the X18 air has a Matrix option, but it does have MixBUS options. I have setup a couple churches with a stereo MixBUS live stream setup that is similar to this video here. I do bot have my own board to make a video out of, but I might be able to use the demo mode to make a video.
th-cam.com/video/pMnaiuC55RY/w-d-xo.html
@@AllamHouse thank you we have at church xr 18 how I can make batter ?
The XR18 is not much different than the X32 at it’s core functionality. Build a Post-Fader stereo BUS mix for your stream using 2 Buses (leaves you with 4 others for monitors. Make sure you are using the Comp and EQ on this MixBUS and put the Precision Limiter at the end of the chain as an insert FX.
Hello. I need assistance on this.
I'm happy to help. Feel free to write your needs here in a comment, or you can fill out the contact card on my website to start a conversation with me outside of YT. sound.allamhouse.com
See I told you use the matrix they are easy. LOL you remember this comment I sent to you? Too much work use matrix. Later Dude God bless.
Haha, I remember. I actually had to transfer back to my other scene, but everybody has to find what works decor them.
@@AllamHouse matrix works great.
Berhinger is the worst board to work on. There are much better boards out there.
Thanks for your comment and thoughts.