Simon's bike launch reviews have become my go-to coverage for new releases. Even though the videos are long, they don't beat around the bush. Densely packed with useful insights. Keep it up
The only thing this bike is missing is cruise control. A major oversight in my opinion. Once you have throttle by wire the only additional cost is for the buttons. Frankly all bikes with throttle by wire should have cruise control.
@@tonyfitch5064 The wiring is already there if you have throttle by wire. Likewise, if you have brake lights, the wiring is already there for a cutoff.
This is the most comprehensive review I’ve watched so far on this bike. Bravo! This has helped me understand where this bike fits in the category and as a whole what bike characteristics are like. I think that is lost in most professional reviews, at least the videos, in respect to the riders just want to boast how hard they rode the bikes and how they wish it had more this and that. In this review it was focused on what the bikes is about and for that I am grateful!
The best and most objective review that I've seen of the V-Strom. Thanks for being honest and not varnishing over (or just outright not mentioning) the shortcomings.
@@cosmiccharlie8294 Yup, agree. P-Strom makes sense. Suzuki says V stands for Versatile, which it is. But they're fooling no-one if they think we don't know V originally meant V-twin.
I think your ride and bike appraisal sounds pretty unbiased and accurate. I love the sound of what this bike is about. I would love to own one but can't bring myself to part with my current 2018 V-Strom 650XT. I just love it. Did you ride another of the test bikes to check if the vibration is also in them or just your test bike? Keep up the good work.
If the old DL650 is anything to go by, I think you'll find that 20 litre tank is good for a lot more miles than quoted here. I'd expect fuel consumption to be similar, 60+/- mpg, so with real world riding a full tank will be good for 200 miles and a good whack of change.
I really like the 800DE, I think I want to buy one for the ‘24 model year but I also want cruise control, hopefully they offer it as an option or the aftermarket steps up and provides. It’ll either be the 800DE or an Africa Twin (Non-DCT) for my next bike.
@@mac001texas I made a trip out to So-Cal recently and sat on an Africa twin and didn’t absolutely love it, we’ll see how the 800 feels to me before I make the decision.
Well, cruise control wasn’t needed for me on my test ride! I loved the power delivery, size, weight, seat comfort, suspension travel and damping, grip, balance and turn in compared to my Vstrom 650, it was miles better. I got a good deal for my part exchange, and rode home the black colour DE the same day. Not an impulse buy, but one informed by your detailed review (and others too of course!) It’s a wonderful bike, and I’m so happy to own this. 🙏👍 thanks for your great detailed review. 😀🙏
In this class for me the Moto Guzzi V85TT is the winner (I have the Centenario). I cannot understand that it is the only one with shaft drive, a decisive point for me for travel bikes. I also like the uncluttered air-cooled engine. Handling really is great (I can compare it to my BMW 1200 GS, both air-cooled and liquid-cooled, and my Ducati Multistrada 900), brakes are solid, seat and suspension firm but comfortable, tubeless spoked wheels, wet weight 229 kg, 23 litre fuel tank and 550 km range. With 76 hp it is a bit down on power, but for me still enough to have fun on the back roads. I never get on the highway anyway.
MG doesn't have a good support network. It's nothing you'd want to ride from AK to the tip of Chile. Else, I tend to agree. I love air cooled horizontal cylinders. I'll accept oil cooling, but I really dislike water cooling. And electronics. God, the more I learn about electronics, the more I hate motorcycles for having them. I wish to hell I could get a BMW 850 without electronics. They are a total turn-off for me. It's like an entire level of crap layered over every component on a bike. Wires everywhere, to everything, trading rider control for computer control+controllers+sensors.
@@chadkline4268 Indeed, I wouldn't take the V85TT in the outback either, I would take the Japanese competition for that. But here in Europe 99% of the adventure bike riders never really go on serious adventures, they just use them as comfortable travel bikes and hardly ever leave the paved roads. I own many different bikes and only one of them is liquid cooled (Triumph Bonneville) and all have minimal electronics (I recently traded the liquid cooled GS for the latest airhead (like it so much better) and sold the Multistrada). I don't understand why BMW stopped making the 850, big mistake.
Nice review. I'm more interested in the GSX8S tbh but I do like this bike too. Although a group test is definitely in order as in isolation most bikes feel great these days. I"m also not sure the price is as big a deal as some make out as while it's not a typical Suzuki budget price, it's not a typical Suzuki budget bike either. Plus Suzuki will definitely discount it. As for the weight, it's at least partially justifiable imo as you get higher spec suspension, a removable subframe & a 20 litre tank so there are reasons it's heavier & it depends if those features justify the price & weight enough to any potential buyers I guess.
Lighter bikes have been snapping frames after a couple years on the market. I think Suzuki choice of a beefer frame with the removable subframe deserves some respect from the spec sheet warriors.
@@jonasbaine3538 yamaha will get it figured out I'm sure. I understand that the motor is a stressed member but man that motor does wiggle a bit once that tube snaps. Hondas non detachable subframe is so so silly on an adventure bike.
I guess that the last all new motorcycle was GSX-R 1000 released in 2001, which was introduced later than the Hayabusa in 1998. Never the less, what a great comeback for Suzuki with GSX 8S and the new V-Strom and thanks for this comprehensive and honest review.
Love your launch reviews m8! Thank you, i am from Greece, Suzuki V Strom sells a lot here that is why we were picked for the 1050 launch, but it had to be during the worse weather of the last 12 months! This new one? Seems very good, but its not "V". Weird that they went with that name, but its very recognizable.
Good review and looking forward to a test ride but I think the Transalp will win for me. Weight, power and styling mainly. I would have to change that massive exhaust as well and I have never bothered on any previous bike.
All valid points, can't argue. I still think the V-Strom is probably intended to be a bit more useful off-road than the Transalp, but agree the Honda looks better, weighs less and has a fitter motor.
Depends on the Transalp suspenders. That this Vstrom, despite the looks (21 inch...), has suspenders which do not dive for China on the first little whiff of brake, is a big deal. The Tenere does (at least for us not so light guys..). As does the Africa Twin come to think of it, despite that one having plenty high quality suspension, so it has a lot to do with priorities. Honda seem to be on a bender to appeal to "younger" riders with most of their newer, less expensive bikes. "Younger" tending to mean "lighter." Resulting in suspenders which can be less ideal for us who have spent a few more years at the feeding trough. Wonder how long before Suzuki releases a non-DE version with 19s? With a seat height in the 830 range, more road-focused tires and suspenders and a narrower bar, that could be very interesting if gravel riding is less of a concern. Not that the 1050 isn't already a nice road bike. I'd just prefer something 20 millimetre lower and a bit lighter, if I could keep similarly high quality suspenders. What sounds like an almost trials bike like ability of the engine to chug down real, real low, is a big bonus everywhere. Especially off-road, but also in very tricky on-road and city/parking situations.
As a '19 DL650 owner, I'd probably have one of these over the T7. The only let downs for me being no cruise control and tubed tyres... I do reeeeeeeaaallllllly want Suzuki to reinvent the DRZ400E and SM for the UK market though.
@@williamrae9954 Every bike review has hundreds of people whining about no cruise control etc. Just an excuse not to buy something other wise solid. Life is too short to wait for a bike that doesn’t exist.
So tubed tyres chain drive and NO centre stand. Still when you're stuck with a flat and no way of fixing it you can look at the pretty screen. Why no centre stand for forks sake??
Yeah, it's just plain rude if you ask me. At some point in the past it went from being standard on almost everything to suddenly being a £250 accessory. From Suzuki's point of view, I suppose it would add another kilo or two to the kerb weight...
Even with a centre stand you've got to carry tyre levers and a tube with you. Who wants to be removing tyres at the side of the road when you could just be plugging a tubeless tyre in minutes.
@@writestuffmedia Don't forget useless mudguards that they now put on all bikes which protect nothing, both front and rear. Every bike I've ever bought I've always insisted on a main stand at no extra cost to me, or I walk away. Never failed yet. Maybe the bike magazines could start being more vocal with these things, and people should just walk away if their asked to pay more for things like "Comfort seats". I doubt if you bought a Rolls Royce, and opened the door to find 4 deck chairs there, and the dealer said " oh yes you can buy decent chairs at considerably more cost ", that that would be acceptable to the potential buyer. We shouldn't just accept this as the norm.
I have recently contacted both Triumph and BMW on the subject of shaft drive on any of the bikes smaller than 1200cc and got the same answer from both - not a chance! ☹️
Actually BMW started the segment when they introduced the R80G/S in 1980. It just took a long time before the other manufacturers caught up with the idea.
Yamaha xtz750 was the first parallel twin in this type of bike in 1988 (ish)......If there's a British bike owner on here they will say it was a Triumph in the 50s or some such !
The F850 is a far better bike than the spec sheet shows and a surprisingly good value, especially compared to this bike. Its also a 5 year old design, BMW is well positioned to retake the class if they want now that everyone has released thier middleweight bikes with an F850 redesign.
And useful drive at sub-1200 rpm, is a real boon. Walking pace may not sound all that exciting, but adv riding on larger bikes is mostly about fairly easy terrain. Except for that one or two 50-500 meter sections which are almost impassable, but which you have to get past to get back on better surface again. If you're a sponsored KTM rider with a support van and video crew, you can no doubt just jump it. But for the rest of us, reliable drive at paddle speed, can mean getting across in a controlled manner, vs risking banging up either bike, bones or both. DCT on the Atwin is a different "solution" to that issue. But this is less overdone and over engineered. Less Honda, more Suzuki. I just know someone at Suzuki have nerded out in nasty, slippery, soft, wet bogs around Mount Fuji, on a bike too tall and heavy to make sense there, in order to make sure this works right in the real world.
Suzuki makes really nice bikes - I love mine - but I can't stop thinking about a road slanted ADV with tubed rims. I just doesn't make sense in 2023. I'd be interested in seeing this with a tubeless 19/17 combo.
I think Suzuki looked at the market rivals - Tenere, Transalp etc - and they all have tubed rims. So there might be a bit of that. Also, I think tubeless come with a cost implication and certain design choices in terms of other chassis components (could be wrong). So, I wasn't surprised.
@@writestuffmedia One thing about all dirtbikes, is they are all tubed tires, and they run without getting flats ever. If you watch the terrain, you can actually see glass, and dangerous areas. Some areas like construction sites, buildings, and entrances to construction sites, and glass in parking lots, things like that are easy to avoid once you start planning to avoid dangerous sharp objects. Rocks and the terrain won't blow out your tire, unless you're a crazy insane rider. The other thing is, tubed wheels look a heck of a lot nicer. Tubed spoked wheels are stunningly beautiful. I think you can get a can of fix-a-flat and just use that. Or pressurized Slime. I have aired up an entire tubed tire with "Fix-a-Flat" areosol, and it worked to fix a punctured tubed tire.
Without going into details, definitely this bike it is the best on midweight segment. If i have to make choice, without the doubt would be this Suzuki, and the second would be the Aprilia tuareg 660.
On the subject of vibration, some people are more sensitive to it than others. I notice a fair amount of buzzing from the 890. Others swear there's none. It's not nice at all day at 4,500 rpm.
@@fcalin21 Yeah on the 890 adventure. It's buzzy at over 4,000 rpm. Some don't really notice it or care, but it's quite high-frequency which I seem sensitive to. I was just using it as an example to point out that while the reviewer of Suzuki 800DE says he found the vibrations were a bit much, others might find it perfectly fine.
Engine vibration at specific speeds and RPM's and GEAR RATIOS are critically important, more important than any other thing. The number #1 reason people get fatigued and get rid of their motorcycle is from it having too short of gearing, and too much engine vibration at certain highway speeds. Vibration ruins a trip. The bad gear ratios are why there is so much vibration, which is completely unnecessary, because all bikes should *but don't* have a super tall overdrive gear.
Solid bike. In many ways. Reminds me of the old xtz750. Better bike than the 1050, for me. Comparison test on same roads will be interesting. Good work. Safe, happy travels 👍
comparing it with my trusty '19 dl 650, there's smth off visually. They lowered the tank, the front is shorter because of the parallel twin but that tail hangs more, it's longer. Putting these all togheter, I really don't like how it looks from the side. Maybe with a taller screen? I don't know .... On the tehnical side though, seems to be a peach minus that, again subjective, 230 kilos of weight. I remember the "old", as in 2019 v strom 1000 (non XT) was 233.
A few things surprised my, the range doesn't seem that far for a 800 touring bike, and they are still using tubed tires on spoked wheels, infact why have spoked wheels on a touring bike ?
I think the tank range is pretty good - certainly better than the T7 and Tuareg 660, and probably a bit better than the Transalp. It has spoked wheels because it's a styling choice - as with its rivals. And I suppose you could use the argument that wire wheels are more suitable off-road because they won't fail under severe impact. I definitely prefer the look of wire wheels on an adventure bike. The traditional argument for using tubes with spokes is if the rim gets a ding off-road, the tyre doesn't deflate. But there's also the fact that tubeless spoked rims cost more. But I agree, I think all adventure bikes should be tubeless - I would say it's far more likely the rider will get a puncture on the road and wish they were tubeless than ding a rim off-road and be glad they had tubes.
@@writestuffmedia Tubeless spoked rims, are heavier and stiffer than traditionally laced rims. In many ways they defeat all purposes of tubeless rims, other than looks. Also, tubeless tires are hard to get on and off any rim. Even more so very stiff, unyielding rims. On traditional laced rims, you can run more traditional offroad tires if you are going on a trip warranting them. And have a better shot at removing them and replacing the tube if you flat. At least if you have experience with doing so from dirt bikes. Which I suppose you should have, before taking 250kg bikes off road. Since even this DE VStrom is still mainly a road focused bike, I still can't help thinking the decision in favour of tubed, is clouded by 80km/h speed limits in Japan. Lower speeds biases less in favour of tubeless. You don't want to blow a tubed tire, while storming down the Autobahn on the way to the Alps.
Thanks for the review from snowy, cold Canada. Love to see this engine with another 10-15 hp and cruise control. Rode a KTM 1290 Adv and it was a rocket!
Got stranded twice last year with punctures; one was a first ride out on a (new to me) V11 Guzzi so hadn’t yet put the tyre plug kit under the seat. Recovery gaffed me off saying we’ll see you tomorrow…Had to abandon the bike and get a lift home on the pillion of 40 year old Z650. If I was solo riding I would’ve been shafted. WTF are Suzuki thinking? This is a road bike which could have been a decent tourer. Not many road riders have the skills or interest in taking wheels off at the roadside. Put some tubeless wheels on the thing! Oh and add cruise and a centre stand while your at it..
Since emotion can more than just sway the bike, How does it sound? No reviewer I've seen has done an exhaust clip, but I've heard similar to the L twin, but not quite. Sounds is the only thing stopping me from getting a versys
Japanese are known to be smart, practical, well thought. You wouldn’t expect them to do anything substantial (like introducing a whole new platform) for no particular reason. Having said that, I completely don’t understand the following: 1) Some 230kg in that bike! Holy moly! Is it a Chinese bike? No. Is it Africa Twin? No. Then WHY?? 2) OK it’s road oriented. Then why would the windshield be of a hard enduro size? Did they steal it from Beemer Gosling 310? 3) Spoked but tubed wheels? 17 rear but 21 front? What?? 4) No cruise control? For that money? Seriously? 5) Bigger displacement, pull from lower rpms - good stuff. But how come the vibrations? Finally, the look of this bike: if you cut the profile into stripes - then every particular one will look nice… before you glue them together (((
Doesnt the T700 experienced issues with the air box at the rear of the bike?? I've read that the location was a design flaw which has been corrected with the World Raid...has Suzuki followed the same route re location???
Engine vibration is one of those things that bother me. Twin balance shafts and tingle through the pegs sounds like they are trying to cover up an engineering issue.
Good point, and I completely overlooked it in the newness of everything. I'm meeting the Suzuki engineers again soon on the GSX-8S launch, so I'll ask them!
I must say that it's a bit annoying that all of the journals who was invited to the launch and spoke to the 50 engineers no one asked about why the bike doesn't have cruise control, or at least asked them to add it in a future model.
Brakes are fine - no radial calipers is a funny choice these days - not sure if it's a cost thing or they just thought radials on a 21in front are overkill. Luggage is the now standard choice of ally boxes (looks like the same Givi kit everyone else uses) or plastic cases. Ally boxes need a pannier rail/frame and topbox plate as well, and the plastic cases also need a rail to locate in.
"And then after a few years Aprillia came in with the 660 and jumped into the same class/category, and Honda are about to with the TransAlp...all parallel twins" Did you completely forget about the KTM 790 Adventure? Weird how journos just keep forgetting/ignoring the 790 (and latter 890 adventure). Even though it's in the same class and in the UK sold extremely well. Even the price was good vs the T700 just £1,000 at certain times.
I will never not automatically think the 790/890 isn't a V-twin - for some reason it's in my head and I can't get it out. But you're absolutely right - I think I mentioned the 'new/old' 790 Adv, but yeah, should've included it more. I'm riding one in a few months and I can't wait to see how it compares to the original.
Yeah, but still based on previous models - the GSX-R post 1997 was one long line of evolution, I reckon, each new generation building on the previous. But it's open for discussion :-)
Just curious, going a little larger how would you compare this to the Triumph Tiger 850? It’s gotten pretty good reviews for comfort, protection, and has a more street oriented 19” front wheel. Lot of ‘22 models still available so OOD price might be similar.
Interesting comparison. I've put some miles on the Tiger 850 and before I rode it I was a bit snooty about it because it seemed like a down-spec Tiger 900... but it felt like a great bike in its own right. Compared to the 800DE: same price if you add quickshifter & handguards to the spec, same performance, same tank size... +s: much lighter, lower seat, better wind protection & adjustable screen, more secure roadholding (19in front), engine character better suited to pure road riding at speed (they both vibe a bit tbh), probably has the edge on comfort overall but... -s: seat not as comfy, less sophisticated electronics, cast wheels not spoked (if that matters to you), much less off-road capability - less ground clearance, less suspension travel, etc - lower quality suspension with less adjustability... It's actually tough to call. My gut feeling - if they were both parked outside and I had to ride 500 miles... I'd take the Tiger every time because it actually has a screen.
Yes, and it's very good too. Really transparent, never missed a gear, and even lets you half use the clutch as well. Very, very smooth - probably the best quickshifter I've used on any bike.
Enjoyable review lovely scenery, Not very keen on the way the market is now going. Twin cylinder engines too many from all the manufacturers out of Japan, Not a cheap bike, it's got a couple of extras, but suzuki motocyes use to be a little cheaper than other bikes,
Nice bike but this will likely mainly be bought by riders looking for a mid range versatile comfy tourer so why no road oriented wheel and tyre options? Surely should be on 19"/18" wheels with tubeless tyres. Bigger screen, centre stand, and an option of cruise would be helpful too.
Suzuki postfixed this DE........ There will almost certainly be a more road oriented non-DE coming down the pipe, once stocks of existing 650s are thinner. Dealers have mainly been asking for an answer to Teneres. The 650 is still a viable road oriented bike.
In Thailand price diff between versy 650 and vstrom 800 is $4000 USD. Now while the offroad capabilities of the suzuki are way better, really not sure if it's actually worth the price difference for someone who does 80/20. Also prefer the tubless tyres on the versys which also has a larger gas tank and is slightly lighter.
Much love for you Simon, However i would be pleased if Bike Social would send a more off road guy to do the 21" launches :-) Which I would watch your review of the 8s.... We all know how much you love off-road it's obvious.
Yeah, I think what I'm trying to do as add some sort of context - I actually think I'm probably around the level of an average trail rider; to my mind, that's a relevant perspective.
@@writestuffmedia understood completely.... Just like the balance of that bike is right down the middle of the segment, We would really love to hear more the off road "relevancy" as well. Please don't take that wrong. the off road capability off the segment is the excitement.
Been thrice a ‘Strom owner, great practical bike. As for the name, I’d drop the “V” and call it the Suzuki Décent; reflects it honorable pragmatic heritage + an accent aigu for hubris.
Looks like premium suspension , BUT , if Suzuki are aiming more for the " on road " segment of the ADV market , why no cruise control ,heated grips, tubeless tyres , tall adjustable screen or centre stand ? All better features [ IMHO ] than a quickshifter . " Close but - No cigar for Suzuki " Your view of the Honda TransAlp will be very interesting !
Natural cruising speed at 70mph a bit slow? I got to say that seems a bit unfair to say, as 70mph is probably quite a bit over the speed limit of twisted roads (not highways unless you're in Norway), so one would think that a comfortable cruising speed should be around the top legal speed limit most places for their markets. I May be wrong, id love to be corrected.
Of course, apologies, you're right. I was speaking from my own experience in the UK, where 80mph on the clocks usually is around 72-74mph in real speed, which is what the police see on their calibrated speedos. So over here, if you hold 80mph on the clocks on a motorway, that's a reasonable cruising speed (because it's showing up to 8mph more than you're actually doing) - obviously it's inversely exponential, so in a 60mph limit you can do around 64mph because that will be near 60mph real speed, and so on. In a 30 limit, the difference is a few mph, so you do 30mph on the clocks because that's near enough to 30mph in real speed.
Does it really have more comfy seat that the 1050 !! That shocked me and let me think again before buying the 1050 will cost me 12,400 ! I wanted it for long road distance . So the seat comfy is a key for me . Do you think the African twin is better for my purpose ?
I doubt it. You'd miss the 'more' bit. But I think if you were looking to downsize from a GS to something more manageable, I'd be looking at Tiger 900, or maybe see who the Transalp turns out - you'd miss that sense of 'class' you get with a BM, I reckon. Tbh, the fact BMW haven't updated the F850GS in ages is a mystery. I wonder why they haven't?
@@writestuffmedia I ran an 850gs for a couple of years and have had 1150 and 1200gs's. Currently with a Crosstourer but replacement knees (both sides) is making me re-evaluate, hence thinking lighter and more manageable alternatives.
Makes me wonder if it's the regulatory equipment that's inducing the vibration. Exhaust or intake, and/or emissions tuning that's causing this vibration issue. Mechanical setup is very important to quell vibes, but it looks like it HAS that. I know, because I used to own a FZ1 from 2011. I bought it new as a former year leftover. It produced quite a lot of unpleasant buzz in the tank, grips, and pegs. I got a full Yoshi system, put a higher flow filter in, removed the airbox snorkel, got an ECU flash to de-restrict everything, and loaded a quality developed fuel map. I swear, at least 70% of the felt vibrations the bike had produced formerly, VANISHED. Wouldn't doubt that this buzz you're feeling is due to regulation compliance, which I would suspect comes AFTER the engine design has been completed.
although the new Honda Hornet 750 is strictly not in this category, from the reviews I've seen and read it does 90% of what these bikes do, with 91bhp, TFT, and at only 7K has to be considered
Yeah, but that 10% is off-road, which is the point I guess. The Transalp is effectively a Hornet on long legs with adventure styling - and it's still £1100 cheaper than the V-Strom (and £2k+ more than the Hornet).
Actually, pretty similar. Engine character is slightly different - the 800 GS is a 360° crank and uses a 'dummy' conrod running below the crank to balance primary vibration. It's about the same state of tune too - 80-ish bhp. The Suzuki suspension is way more sophisticated than the BMW's, which is pretty soft as I recall. And the Suzuki is more comfortable over distance (apart from the screen - as I remember, the GS isn't brilliant, and a BMW touring screen makes it worse). The 800DE has much more sophisticated electronics too, if you like that stuff. I *think* the BM is more tidily put together than the Suzuki (in terms of design and neatness) - and I've seen some bikes modified to look really, really tough in a way I don't think the Suzuki necessarily ever could.
It's much better off-road because suspension, ground clearance, 21in front, riding position, engine tune and performance etc On the road it's closer... I'd say (if it matters to you) the DE has better suspension (again), seat, performance, electronics... where it's not as good is wind protection (the screen is tiny) and, ultimately, you'll get better pure road rubber for the 19in front.
Definitely would have bought the 800DE but, not having cruise control which all new mid class adventure bikes have, made my decision to look more at the Tiger 900.
New v-strom in opinion is a fail. Vstrom owners (with some light offroad ambitions) were always complaining about suspension travel, clearance, wheel size and weight. Majority people were expecting that new one will get lighter, closer to 200 kg (like mentioned competitors) because if suzuki is claiming that bike is now more offroad capable, in my opinion they just shooted themself to the leg with more heavy bike. I have v-strom but next bike will be different brand because of the overweight.
Great to see another Suzuki but this should never be a replacement of the Vstrom 650. Suzuki needs to keep producing the basic affordable vstrom 650 at 6k to compete with Royal Enfield who are selling bucket loads of bikes. I like the 800 but don't be silly Suzuki, most people like a bare knuckle bike that they can customize.
So simon now that you had the chance to test both the suzuki and the honda what is more better in terms of low rpm from 2000 to 4000 ? And what engine sounds better?
Absolutely no question, the Honda sounds better. By an absolute mile. And I think - not riding them back-to-back, so could be wrong! - but I think the Suzuki is a bit lower-geared and has a slightly fitter bottom end.
Long stroke engine, so more torque, and hp lower in rev range, better for off road riding. Single cylinder engines put power down low in the rev range. Twins can do both high and low rev power if they are tuned right. Now suzuki and Yamaha should make sm models with these twin engines😎
Have Suzuki recreated the F800 with this? Slightly vibey engine, 800cc, decent suspension and brakes, not to mention similar weight. The F800 is gone, but lots of good low mileage examples out there for half the dosh. Hmm?
5-6 kg is fuel, as Simon pointed out. And the sofa Suzuki put on the VStrom can't be light. Bolt on subframes are in and of themselves a good but heavier, and in addition aren't usually specced unless the manufacturer cares about their strength and carrying capacity. If you intend to ride farther, while carrying more luggage and/or perhaps a passenger, that's all weight well spent. If you mainly want a dualsport with a twin, it's not.
Well Simon.. which one do you prefer as a daily commuter and as a 2 up traveller. This V-Strom or the Moto Guzzi v85tt? 😉 Know you fell in love with with the Guzzi.
Perhaps they should have called it the Suzuki Sweden with that color scheme ... I sense that the vibrations bother Simon more than he lets on, but he feels he can't express it under the circumstances.
Oooo no, there's no-one holding a gun to my head (or shoving cash in my suitcase) - it's just it's really hard to make a judgement in isolation. I felt vibes on the Tiger 900 and mentioned it in the launch video a couple of years ago, but it hasn;t turned out to be a problem for most owners, I don't think. And I remember the fuss about the BMW S1000XR when it was launched - I noticed them, but didn't think it was a big deal. Then some customers started returning the bike, they were that bad! So it's a personal thing, I think. So I said what I thought - I can feel them, they don't annoy me greatly but I think I would look at gearing the bike up if I owned one, probably (maybe after a few thousand miles). But it might not even be a problem for many, if any, owners.
It's a parallel 800cc twin, you're going to get the vibes of a parallel 800cc twin. Weight has pluses and minuses. Same old comments. I'd like to hear about component/maintenance/repair accessibility. And design+component reliability. And electronics reporting+interfaces. I'd like more knowledge + intelligence in reviews, and less feelings about sound+appearance. You really can't trust anything about performance anymore until a bike has been dyno tuned. They are all suboptimally detuned for emissions, so it seems. So, a good review, today, ought to include a before+after dyno tune to reflect real world performance.
I agree, but it's impossible on a launch - it's usually a day riding around, half of which is spent posing for cameras. The 800DE was unusual in that it was two days, but there's no scope for digging into the depths of durability and dyno testing. It's a rigid timetable of events. In fact it's very rarely possible anywhere these days because most 'tests' are conducted in a day - in videos or in magazines.
@@writestuffmedia yes. I just wish reviews were more ownership+maintenance oriented. I can learn more from a test ride than I can from most reviews. They don't help me to learn the ownership/maintenance/repair experience, and that is most important to me in a bike review.
I have to say having all these riding modes, quickshifter etc without cruise control seems backwards. I'd take cruise control over all of those things. That's what would push me towards a Tuareg over the PStrom.
Simon's bike launch reviews have become my go-to coverage for new releases. Even though the videos are long, they don't beat around the bush. Densely packed with useful insights. Keep it up
Comprehensive review, bench mark for a new bike launch. Great to see so many middleweight adventure bikes , strong contender from Suzuki 👍
The only thing this bike is missing is cruise control. A major oversight in my opinion. Once you have throttle by wire the only additional cost is for the buttons. Frankly all bikes with throttle by wire should have cruise control.
You also need the wiring and mechanism to cut it off to the brake(s) Not as dead simple as just a button.
@@tonyfitch5064 The wiring is already there if you have throttle by wire. Likewise, if you have brake lights, the wiring is already there for a cutoff.
Yes, they missed the ball on that one. Otherwise, I'd be considering this for my next purchase.
If it had cruise control, they'd sell half ad many 1050s, if they're lucky
@@PisgahGravelProject If you don’t canibalize your own product someone else will.
Excellent, Simon! As always, way back to the day of Performance Bikes!
Very quality presentantions on this channel! One of the best.
This is the most comprehensive review I’ve watched so far on this bike. Bravo! This has helped me understand where this bike fits in the category and as a whole what bike characteristics are like. I think that is lost in most professional reviews, at least the videos, in respect to the riders just want to boast how hard they rode the bikes and how they wish it had more this and that. In this review it was focused on what the bikes is about and for that I am grateful!
I think this is the best review until now!! Thank you!
The best and most objective review that I've seen of the V-Strom. Thanks for being honest and not varnishing over (or just outright not mentioning) the shortcomings.
V Strom? How about PT Strom?
I try hard to call it as see & feel it, so thank you 🙏
@@cosmiccharlie8294 Yup, agree. P-Strom makes sense. Suzuki says V stands for Versatile, which it is. But they're fooling no-one if they think we don't know V originally meant V-twin.
or a U strom
Love your rambling, Simon! Great, in depth review! Thank you.
Thanks man, appreciate it. I'll try and be more upbeat on the next one too 🤣🙌
I think your ride and bike appraisal sounds pretty unbiased and accurate. I love the sound of what this bike is about.
I would love to own one but can't bring myself to part with my current 2018 V-Strom 650XT. I just love it.
Did you ride another of the test bikes to check if the vibration is also in them or just your test bike?
Keep up the good work.
6:50 Finally someone that goes trying bikes and knows his things on engines!! Bravo!
This is an exciting and thorough review: nicely done. Can't wait to take this bike for a test ride myself in California - whenever that will be...!
If the old DL650 is anything to go by, I think you'll find that 20 litre tank is good for a lot more miles than quoted here. I'd expect fuel consumption to be similar, 60+/- mpg, so with real world riding a full tank will be good for 200 miles and a good whack of change.
I really like the 800DE, I think I want to buy one for the ‘24 model year but I also want cruise control, hopefully they offer it as an option or the aftermarket steps up and provides.
It’ll either be the 800DE or an Africa Twin (Non-DCT) for my next bike.
The Africa twin is the same weight with more power and more electronic features like cruise control. Not even a contest.
@@mac001texas I made a trip out to So-Cal recently and sat on an Africa twin and didn’t absolutely love it, we’ll see how the 800 feels to me before I make the decision.
@@Jake-ug2mf if you had issues with the seat, theres always aftermarket comfort seats
@@mac001texas a lot more money though isn't it so you certainly pay for it
One is 13k the other aprox 21k. How you want to compare only by the weight?
Well, cruise control wasn’t needed for me on my test ride! I loved the power delivery, size, weight, seat comfort, suspension travel and damping, grip, balance and turn in compared to my Vstrom 650, it was miles better. I got a good deal for my part exchange, and rode home the black colour DE the same day.
Not an impulse buy, but one informed by your detailed review (and others too of course!)
It’s a wonderful bike, and I’m so happy to own this.
🙏👍 thanks for your great detailed review. 😀🙏
dude the part about the engine balancing mechanics was the most interesting part dont stress
In this class for me the Moto Guzzi V85TT is the winner (I have the Centenario). I cannot understand that it is the only one with shaft drive, a decisive point for me for travel bikes. I also like the uncluttered air-cooled engine. Handling really is great (I can compare it to my BMW 1200 GS, both air-cooled and liquid-cooled, and my Ducati Multistrada 900), brakes are solid, seat and suspension firm but comfortable, tubeless spoked wheels, wet weight 229 kg, 23 litre fuel tank and 550 km range. With 76 hp it is a bit down on power, but for me still enough to have fun on the back roads. I never get on the highway anyway.
MG doesn't have a good support network. It's nothing you'd want to ride from AK to the tip of Chile. Else, I tend to agree. I love air cooled horizontal cylinders. I'll accept oil cooling, but I really dislike water cooling. And electronics. God, the more I learn about electronics, the more I hate motorcycles for having them. I wish to hell I could get a BMW 850 without electronics. They are a total turn-off for me. It's like an entire level of crap layered over every component on a bike. Wires everywhere, to everything, trading rider control for computer control+controllers+sensors.
@@chadkline4268 Indeed, I wouldn't take the V85TT in the outback either, I would take the Japanese competition for that. But here in Europe 99% of the adventure bike riders never really go on serious adventures, they just use them as comfortable travel bikes and hardly ever leave the paved roads. I own many different bikes and only one of them is liquid cooled (Triumph Bonneville) and all have minimal electronics (I recently traded the liquid cooled GS for the latest airhead (like it so much better) and sold the Multistrada). I don't understand why BMW stopped making the 850, big mistake.
V85 is too slow....Are you sure?
@@jal1797 nobody said that 🤔🙂
Thanks Simon. Great job. Good info. God bless. Happy trails.
Nice review. I'm more interested in the GSX8S tbh but I do like this bike too. Although a group test is definitely in order as in isolation most bikes feel great these days. I"m also not sure the price is as big a deal as some make out as while it's not a typical Suzuki budget price, it's not a typical Suzuki budget bike either. Plus Suzuki will definitely discount it. As for the weight, it's at least partially justifiable imo as you get higher spec suspension, a removable subframe & a 20 litre tank so there are reasons it's heavier & it depends if those features justify the price & weight enough to any potential buyers I guess.
Thanks! We'll be on the GSX-8S launch in early April so do look out for that review.
@@bennettsbikesocial Ah great, thanks & will do. I couldn't find the launch date anywhere so that's good to know.
@@bennettsbikesocial that's an exciting one.
Lighter bikes have been snapping frames after a couple years on the market. I think Suzuki choice of a beefer frame with the removable subframe deserves some respect from the spec sheet warriors.
Which bikes are snapping frames?
Quite a statement to make. Which bikes are breaking frames?
@@jonasbaine3538 th-cam.com/video/3pVVydoAws8/w-d-xo.html
@@jonasbaine3538 yamaha will get it figured out I'm sure. I understand that the motor is a stressed member but man that motor does wiggle a bit once that tube snaps. Hondas non detachable subframe is so so silly on an adventure bike.
I've not seen any reports of frames breaking.
I guess that the last all new motorcycle was GSX-R 1000 released in 2001, which was introduced later than the Hayabusa in 1998. Never the less, what a great comeback for Suzuki with GSX 8S and the new V-Strom and thanks for this comprehensive and honest review.
Love your launch reviews m8! Thank you, i am from Greece, Suzuki V Strom sells a lot here that is why we were picked for the 1050 launch, but it had to be during the worse weather of the last 12 months! This new one? Seems very good, but its not "V". Weird that they went with that name, but its very recognizable.
Supposedly the "v" is for versatile. And "P-Strom" just doesn't sound right, does it?
Sat on one at the Xcel show. Really comfortable, unlike all the other bikes at the show.
Yes, the seat is superb.
I have that same bike and it has no vibration at all.
Good review and looking forward to a test ride but I think the Transalp will win for me. Weight, power and styling mainly. I would have to change that massive exhaust as well and I have never bothered on any previous bike.
All valid points, can't argue. I still think the V-Strom is probably intended to be a bit more useful off-road than the Transalp, but agree the Honda looks better, weighs less and has a fitter motor.
Wondering if the huge exhaust is where the extra 30kg comes from ?
Depends on the Transalp suspenders. That this Vstrom, despite the looks (21 inch...), has suspenders which do not dive for China on the first little whiff of brake, is a big deal. The Tenere does (at least for us not so light guys..). As does the Africa Twin come to think of it, despite that one having plenty high quality suspension, so it has a lot to do with priorities.
Honda seem to be on a bender to appeal to "younger" riders with most of their newer, less expensive bikes. "Younger" tending to mean "lighter." Resulting in suspenders which can be less ideal for us who have spent a few more years at the feeding trough.
Wonder how long before Suzuki releases a non-DE version with 19s? With a seat height in the 830 range, more road-focused tires and suspenders and a narrower bar, that could be very interesting if gravel riding is less of a concern. Not that the 1050 isn't already a nice road bike. I'd just prefer something 20 millimetre lower and a bit lighter, if I could keep similarly high quality suspenders.
What sounds like an almost trials bike like ability of the engine to chug down real, real low, is a big bonus everywhere. Especially off-road, but also in very tricky on-road and city/parking situations.
I think it looks nice but why no option for tubeless or cruise? Why do manufacturers keep denying us those two things?
As a '19 DL650 owner, I'd probably have one of these over the T7. The only let downs for me being no cruise control and tubed tyres...
I do reeeeeeeaaallllllly want Suzuki to reinvent the DRZ400E and SM for the UK market though.
I think it's not impossible to change to tubeless
Aaaand here we go again.... Bart Factory for tubeless tyres, McCruise will sort the other shortly...go spunk an extra £5k on a Ducati
@@williamrae9954 Every bike review has hundreds of people whining about no cruise control etc. Just an excuse not to buy something other wise solid. Life is too short to wait for a bike that doesn’t exist.
@@jimperry4420 If it was built to their spec,they'd moan it was too expensive...it's a mid-range bike,built to a budget!
@@williamrae9954 Just like the Drz, which I have. Six speeds and fuel injection would put it around 10k. Imagine the bitching then! 😂
So tubed tyres chain drive and NO centre stand. Still when you're stuck with a flat and no way of fixing it you can look at the pretty screen. Why no centre stand for forks sake??
Yeah, it's just plain rude if you ask me. At some point in the past it went from being standard on almost everything to suddenly being a £250 accessory. From Suzuki's point of view, I suppose it would add another kilo or two to the kerb weight...
Even with a centre stand you've got to carry tyre levers and a tube with you. Who wants to be removing tyres at the side of the road when you could just be plugging a tubeless tyre in minutes.
Spec sheet warriors are already upset about its weight and price.
@@writestuffmedia Don't forget useless mudguards that they now put on all bikes which protect nothing, both front and rear. Every bike I've ever bought I've always insisted on a main stand at no extra cost to me, or I walk away. Never failed yet. Maybe the bike magazines could start being more vocal with these things, and people should just walk away if their asked to pay more for things like "Comfort seats". I doubt if you bought a Rolls Royce, and opened the door to find 4 deck chairs there, and the dealer said " oh yes you can buy decent chairs at considerably more cost ", that that would be acceptable to the potential buyer. We shouldn't just accept this as the norm.
I have recently contacted both Triumph and BMW on the subject of shaft drive on any of the bikes smaller than 1200cc and got the same answer from both - not a chance! ☹️
BMW started this segment with the F800GS back in 08. Brilliant bike and then they cocked it up with the F850. Can't wait for the Transalp test.
Actually BMW started the segment when they introduced the R80G/S in 1980. It just took a long time before the other manufacturers caught up with the idea.
The R80GS was a boxer motor. I'm referring to the parallel twin
Yamaha xtz750 was the first parallel twin in this type of bike in 1988 (ish)......If there's a British bike owner on here they will say it was a Triumph in the 50s or some such !
The F850 is a far better bike than the spec sheet shows and a surprisingly good value, especially compared to this bike.
Its also a 5 year old design, BMW is well positioned to retake the class if they want now that everyone has released thier middleweight bikes with an F850 redesign.
Nicely done Simon, enjoyable and informative....should be a great road bike 👍🙂
"it's a bit industry..." I love that sort of detail. Nerd yes, but like to know a bit about the company/process behind this stuff
And love the review. Quite like the bike
Peak power at 8,500 rpm and peak torque at 6,800 rpm sounds perfect for this application. I think Suzuki hit the nail on the head with this engine.
F800gs made 85hp at 7,750rpm and 61 ftlb at 5,750rpm I think bmw did better 15 years ago
@@chrishart8548 That's funny, I did not mention BMW in my comment.
@@rafaellastracom6411 couldn't think of another suzuki 800cc I could compare it with.
And useful drive at sub-1200 rpm, is a real boon. Walking pace may not sound all that exciting, but adv riding on larger bikes is mostly about fairly easy terrain. Except for that one or two 50-500 meter sections which are almost impassable, but which you have to get past to get back on better surface again. If you're a sponsored KTM rider with a support van and video crew, you can no doubt just jump it. But for the rest of us, reliable drive at paddle speed, can mean getting across in a controlled manner, vs risking banging up either bike, bones or both.
DCT on the Atwin is a different "solution" to that issue. But this is less overdone and over engineered. Less Honda, more Suzuki. I just know someone at Suzuki have nerded out in nasty, slippery, soft, wet bogs around Mount Fuji, on a bike too tall and heavy to make sense there, in order to make sure this works right in the real world.
@@chrishart8548 if only it passed Euro 5.
Suzuki makes really nice bikes - I love mine - but I can't stop thinking about a road slanted ADV with tubed rims. I just doesn't make sense in 2023. I'd be interested in seeing this with a tubeless 19/17 combo.
I think Suzuki looked at the market rivals - Tenere, Transalp etc - and they all have tubed rims. So there might be a bit of that. Also, I think tubeless come with a cost implication and certain design choices in terms of other chassis components (could be wrong). So, I wasn't surprised.
@@writestuffmedia One thing about all dirtbikes, is they are all tubed tires, and they run without getting flats ever. If you watch the terrain, you can actually see glass, and dangerous areas. Some areas like construction sites, buildings, and entrances to construction sites, and glass in parking lots, things like that are easy to avoid once you start planning to avoid dangerous sharp objects. Rocks and the terrain won't blow out your tire, unless you're a crazy insane rider. The other thing is, tubed wheels look a heck of a lot nicer. Tubed spoked wheels are stunningly beautiful. I think you can get a can of fix-a-flat and just use that. Or pressurized Slime. I have aired up an entire tubed tire with "Fix-a-Flat" areosol, and it worked to fix a punctured tubed tire.
Without going into details, definitely this bike it is the best on midweight segment.
If i have to make choice, without the doubt would be this Suzuki, and the second would be the Aprilia tuareg 660.
On the subject of vibration, some people are more sensitive to it than others. I notice a fair amount of buzzing from the 890. Others swear there's none. It's not nice at all day at 4,500 rpm.
" It's not nice at all day at 4,500 rpm." It vibrates too much at 4500 rpm? Can you clarify?
@@fcalin21 Yeah on the 890 adventure. It's buzzy at over 4,000 rpm. Some don't really notice it or care, but it's quite high-frequency which I seem sensitive to. I was just using it as an example to point out that while the reviewer of Suzuki 800DE says he found the vibrations were a bit much, others might find it perfectly fine.
@@defylifeadventure Thank you for your effort. You are not the only reviewer who found annoying the vibrations in KTM890 .
Whether a bike is good depends on your riding. I'm an old guy who likes a Sunday ride on back roads. I think this would do nicely.
Engine vibration at specific speeds and RPM's and GEAR RATIOS are critically important, more important than any other thing. The number #1 reason people get fatigued and get rid of their motorcycle is from it having too short of gearing, and too much engine vibration at certain highway speeds. Vibration ruins a trip. The bad gear ratios are why there is so much vibration, which is completely unnecessary, because all bikes should *but don't* have a super tall overdrive gear.
Solid bike. In many ways.
Reminds me of the old xtz750.
Better bike than the 1050, for me.
Comparison test on same roads will be interesting.
Good work.
Safe, happy travels 👍
Great review, excellent sound quality too 👍🏻 never been a fan of Suzuki so I would have to look at the TransAlp
comparing it with my trusty '19 dl 650, there's smth off visually. They lowered the tank, the front is shorter because of the parallel twin but that tail hangs more, it's longer. Putting these all togheter, I really don't like how it looks from the side. Maybe with a taller screen? I don't know .... On the tehnical side though, seems to be a peach minus that, again subjective, 230 kilos of weight. I remember the "old", as in 2019 v strom 1000 (non XT) was 233.
A few things surprised my, the range doesn't seem that far for a 800 touring bike, and they are still using tubed tires on spoked wheels, infact why have spoked wheels on a touring bike ?
I think the tank range is pretty good - certainly better than the T7 and Tuareg 660, and probably a bit better than the Transalp.
It has spoked wheels because it's a styling choice - as with its rivals. And I suppose you could use the argument that wire wheels are more suitable off-road because they won't fail under severe impact. I definitely prefer the look of wire wheels on an adventure bike.
The traditional argument for using tubes with spokes is if the rim gets a ding off-road, the tyre doesn't deflate. But there's also the fact that tubeless spoked rims cost more.
But I agree, I think all adventure bikes should be tubeless - I would say it's far more likely the rider will get a puncture on the road and wish they were tubeless than ding a rim off-road and be glad they had tubes.
@@writestuffmedia Tubeless spoked rims, are heavier and stiffer than traditionally laced rims. In many ways they defeat all purposes of tubeless rims, other than looks. Also, tubeless tires are hard to get on and off any rim. Even more so very stiff, unyielding rims. On traditional laced rims, you can run more traditional offroad tires if you are going on a trip warranting them. And have a better shot at removing them and replacing the tube if you flat. At least if you have experience with doing so from dirt bikes. Which I suppose you should have, before taking 250kg bikes off road.
Since even this DE VStrom is still mainly a road focused bike, I still can't help thinking the decision in favour of tubed, is clouded by 80km/h speed limits in Japan. Lower speeds biases less in favour of tubeless. You don't want to blow a tubed tire, while storming down the Autobahn on the way to the Alps.
Thanks for the review from snowy, cold Canada. Love to see this engine with another 10-15 hp and cruise control. Rode a KTM 1290 Adv and it was a rocket!
Maybe a 1050 ? Its an 800 for A REASON.
@@thinkof100 Once the tuners get on it, the 800 will have the response Suzuki knew it had but may have been limited by Emissions/noise regulations
Got stranded twice last year with punctures; one was a first ride out on a (new to me) V11 Guzzi so hadn’t yet put the tyre plug kit under the seat. Recovery gaffed me off saying we’ll see you tomorrow…Had to abandon the bike and get a lift home on the pillion of 40 year old Z650. If I was solo riding I would’ve been shafted. WTF are Suzuki thinking? This is a road bike which could have been a decent tourer. Not many road riders have the skills or interest in taking wheels off at the roadside. Put some tubeless wheels on the thing! Oh and add cruise and a centre stand while your at it..
You don't know how to take a motorcycle wheel off?
Since emotion can more than just sway the bike,
How does it sound? No reviewer I've seen has done an exhaust clip, but I've heard similar to the L twin, but not quite.
Sounds is the only thing stopping me from getting a versys
Japanese are known to be smart, practical, well thought. You wouldn’t expect them to do anything substantial (like introducing a whole new platform) for no particular reason.
Having said that, I completely don’t understand the following:
1) Some 230kg in that bike! Holy moly! Is it a Chinese bike? No. Is it Africa Twin? No. Then WHY??
2) OK it’s road oriented. Then why would the windshield be of a hard enduro size? Did they steal it from Beemer Gosling 310?
3) Spoked but tubed wheels? 17 rear but 21 front? What??
4) No cruise control? For that money? Seriously?
5) Bigger displacement, pull from lower rpms - good stuff. But how come the vibrations?
Finally, the look of this bike: if you cut the profile into stripes - then every particular one will look nice… before you glue them together (((
Doesnt the T700 experienced issues with the air box at the rear of the bike?? I've read that the location was a design flaw which has been corrected with the World Raid...has Suzuki followed the same route re location???
my xtz 750 is front airbox and tank 26 litre no problem for space...
Excellent review. Absolutely spot on
Engine vibration is one of those things that bother me. Twin balance shafts and tingle through the pegs sounds like they are trying to cover up an engineering issue.
A great balanced review.
I think the 800de will be my adv bike. Seems like a great road oriented adv.
So here is my question, are we going to see a price drop on the 650?
six fiddy ?
Usually when you have a 21 inch front you have also an 18 inch rear not a 17.
Why what’s up with that?
Good point, and I completely overlooked it in the newness of everything. I'm meeting the Suzuki engineers again soon on the GSX-8S launch, so I'll ask them!
I must say that it's a bit annoying that all of the journals who was invited to the launch and spoke to the 50 engineers no one asked about why the bike doesn't have cruise control, or at least asked them to add it in a future model.
Loved the review and yes what about the brakes, also the luggage?thanks Simon
Brakes are fine - no radial calipers is a funny choice these days - not sure if it's a cost thing or they just thought radials on a 21in front are overkill.
Luggage is the now standard choice of ally boxes (looks like the same Givi kit everyone else uses) or plastic cases. Ally boxes need a pannier rail/frame and topbox plate as well, and the plastic cases also need a rail to locate in.
Didn't you read the tiny note on the lower left corner about the brakes...
Ho, maybe it was on purpose...
@@nelsonsilva6842 Oops
"And then after a few years Aprillia came in with the 660 and jumped into the same class/category, and Honda are about to with the TransAlp...all parallel twins" Did you completely forget about the KTM 790 Adventure? Weird how journos just keep forgetting/ignoring the 790 (and latter 890 adventure). Even though it's in the same class and in the UK sold extremely well. Even the price was good vs the T700 just £1,000 at certain times.
I will never not automatically think the 790/890 isn't a V-twin - for some reason it's in my head and I can't get it out.
But you're absolutely right - I think I mentioned the 'new/old' 790 Adv, but yeah, should've included it more. I'm riding one in a few months and I can't wait to see how it compares to the original.
2006 gsxr600/750 received completely new engines and frames for that year :)
Still, it's a very long time ago
Yeah, but still based on previous models - the GSX-R post 1997 was one long line of evolution, I reckon, each new generation building on the previous. But it's open for discussion :-)
Brilliant review!!! As if I had ridden it! Thank you!
You’re most welcome, and thank you for the comment!
The F850GS is not in the same class with this one?
Mi piacerebbe sapere se il motore scalda le gambe, grazie.
Just curious, going a little larger how would you compare this to the Triumph Tiger 850? It’s gotten pretty good reviews for comfort, protection, and has a more street oriented 19” front wheel. Lot of ‘22 models still available so OOD price might be similar.
Interesting comparison. I've put some miles on the Tiger 850 and before I rode it I was a bit snooty about it because it seemed like a down-spec Tiger 900... but it felt like a great bike in its own right. Compared to the 800DE: same price if you add quickshifter & handguards to the spec, same performance, same tank size...
+s: much lighter, lower seat, better wind protection & adjustable screen, more secure roadholding (19in front), engine character better suited to pure road riding at speed (they both vibe a bit tbh), probably has the edge on comfort overall but...
-s: seat not as comfy, less sophisticated electronics, cast wheels not spoked (if that matters to you), much less off-road capability - less ground clearance, less suspension travel, etc - lower quality suspension with less adjustability...
It's actually tough to call. My gut feeling - if they were both parked outside and I had to ride 500 miles... I'd take the Tiger every time because it actually has a screen.
My problem with triumph is quality control, and how they treat customers. I expected to be real good but it's actually the opposite.
Really good looking bike. It has everything a reasonable rider might need. Does the quick shifter work up and down?
Yes, and it's very good too. Really transparent, never missed a gear, and even lets you half use the clutch as well. Very, very smooth - probably the best quickshifter I've used on any bike.
yeah but how does it pair up against a dr650 tho???
Now *there's* a good off-road banger... love the DR.
Enjoyable review lovely scenery,
Not very keen on the way the market is now going. Twin cylinder engines too many from all the manufacturers out of Japan,
Not a cheap bike, it's got a couple of extras, but suzuki motocyes use to be a little cheaper than other bikes,
Was thinking of taking some teeth off the rear sprocket, maybe five off making it a 45 teeth instead of 50 what do you all think?
Nice bike but this will likely mainly be bought by riders looking for a mid range versatile comfy tourer so why no road oriented wheel and tyre options? Surely should be on 19"/18" wheels with tubeless tyres. Bigger screen, centre stand, and an option of cruise would be helpful too.
Suzuki postfixed this DE........ There will almost certainly be a more road oriented non-DE coming down the pipe, once stocks of existing 650s are thinner. Dealers have mainly been asking for an answer to Teneres. The 650 is still a viable road oriented bike.
Amazing sound inside your helmet. It blocks all the external sound 🏆
Ah, an incredible plug-on called Crumplepop. It's like magic.
In Thailand price diff between versy 650 and vstrom 800 is $4000 USD. Now while the offroad capabilities of the suzuki are way better, really not sure if it's actually worth the price difference for someone who does 80/20. Also prefer the tubless tyres on the versys which also has a larger gas tank and is slightly lighter.
A bike that everyone forgets is in the class is the cfmoto 800mt, good bike but only time will tell how long it will hold up.
Much love for you Simon, However i would be pleased if Bike Social would send a more off road guy to do the 21" launches :-) Which I would watch your review of the 8s.... We all know how much you love off-road it's obvious.
Yeah, I think what I'm trying to do as add some sort of context - I actually think I'm probably around the level of an average trail rider; to my mind, that's a relevant perspective.
@@writestuffmedia understood completely.... Just like the balance of that bike is right down the middle of the segment, We would really love to hear more the off road "relevancy" as well. Please don't take that wrong. the off road capability off the segment is the excitement.
Did you mention the vibes ?
Damn, knew I forgot something.
@@writestuffmedia You’re a good sport !
Wish you could query the team why they didn't add cruise control as an standard/optional in the electronics package since its ride by wire.
Suzuki needs your friends to buy the 1050s that they used to develop the electronics for this bike first.
@@TheCdubbleyoo My friends all buy KTM/Honda
Been thrice a ‘Strom owner, great practical bike. As for the name, I’d drop the “V” and call it the Suzuki Décent; reflects it honorable pragmatic heritage + an accent aigu for hubris.
Looks like premium suspension , BUT , if Suzuki are aiming more for the " on road " segment of the ADV market , why no cruise control ,heated grips, tubeless tyres , tall adjustable screen or centre stand ?
All better features [ IMHO ] than a quickshifter . " Close but - No cigar for Suzuki "
Your view of the Honda TransAlp will be very interesting !
Natural cruising speed at 70mph a bit slow? I got to say that seems a bit unfair to say, as 70mph is probably quite a bit over the speed limit of twisted roads (not highways unless you're in Norway), so one would think that a comfortable cruising speed should be around the top legal speed limit most places for their markets.
I May be wrong, id love to be corrected.
Of course, apologies, you're right. I was speaking from my own experience in the UK, where 80mph on the clocks usually is around 72-74mph in real speed, which is what the police see on their calibrated speedos. So over here, if you hold 80mph on the clocks on a motorway, that's a reasonable cruising speed (because it's showing up to 8mph more than you're actually doing) - obviously it's inversely exponential, so in a 60mph limit you can do around 64mph because that will be near 60mph real speed, and so on. In a 30 limit, the difference is a few mph, so you do 30mph on the clocks because that's near enough to 30mph in real speed.
Does it really have more comfy seat that the 1050 !! That shocked me and let me think again before buying the 1050 will cost me 12,400 !
I wanted it for long road distance . So the seat comfy is a key for me .
Do you think the African twin is better for my purpose ?
Hi, Fab review! Did you realise heat from the engine especially at the right leg? I did so…
Cheers,
Jan
Using the 'less is more mantra', would you consider it as your only bike as in, a GS replacement?
I doubt it. You'd miss the 'more' bit. But I think if you were looking to downsize from a GS to something more manageable, I'd be looking at Tiger 900, or maybe see who the Transalp turns out - you'd miss that sense of 'class' you get with a BM, I reckon.
Tbh, the fact BMW haven't updated the F850GS in ages is a mystery. I wonder why they haven't?
@@writestuffmedia I ran an 850gs for a couple of years and have had 1150 and 1200gs's. Currently with a Crosstourer but replacement knees (both sides) is making me re-evaluate, hence thinking lighter and more manageable alternatives.
@@iaincorser7079 I know exactly the kind of bike you're looking for, and I would definitely have a good look at the Transalp.
@@writestuffmedia thanks Simon, I shall do that and check out the Suzuki too.
Makes me wonder if it's the regulatory equipment that's inducing the vibration. Exhaust or intake, and/or emissions tuning that's causing this vibration issue. Mechanical setup is very important to quell vibes, but it looks like it HAS that.
I know, because I used to own a FZ1 from 2011. I bought it new as a former year leftover. It produced quite a lot of unpleasant buzz in the tank, grips, and pegs. I got a full Yoshi system, put a higher flow filter in, removed the airbox snorkel, got an ECU flash to de-restrict everything, and loaded a quality developed fuel map. I swear, at least 70% of the felt vibrations the bike had produced formerly, VANISHED.
Wouldn't doubt that this buzz you're feeling is due to regulation compliance, which I would suspect comes AFTER the engine design has been completed.
although the new Honda Hornet 750 is strictly not in this category, from the reviews I've seen and read it does 90% of what these bikes do, with 91bhp, TFT, and at only 7K has to be considered
Yeah, but that 10% is off-road, which is the point I guess. The Transalp is effectively a Hornet on long legs with adventure styling - and it's still £1100 cheaper than the V-Strom (and £2k+ more than the Hornet).
How does it compare to late model F800 GS?
Actually, pretty similar. Engine character is slightly different - the 800 GS is a 360° crank and uses a 'dummy' conrod running below the crank to balance primary vibration. It's about the same state of tune too - 80-ish bhp. The Suzuki suspension is way more sophisticated than the BMW's, which is pretty soft as I recall. And the Suzuki is more comfortable over distance (apart from the screen - as I remember, the GS isn't brilliant, and a BMW touring screen makes it worse). The 800DE has much more sophisticated electronics too, if you like that stuff.
I *think* the BM is more tidily put together than the Suzuki (in terms of design and neatness) - and I've seen some bikes modified to look really, really tough in a way I don't think the Suzuki necessarily ever could.
I'm kind of a Suzuki fan boy, but i've wanted a Tenere for a while..
It's going to be a tough choice one day.
Is it better than the old Vstrom 650 ? How ?
It's much better off-road because suspension, ground clearance, 21in front, riding position, engine tune and performance etc
On the road it's closer... I'd say (if it matters to you) the DE has better suspension (again), seat, performance, electronics... where it's not as good is wind protection (the screen is tiny) and, ultimately, you'll get better pure road rubber for the 19in front.
Yup l wish they'd put the same effort into updating the wee SV650 could've been brilliant!
Definitely would have bought the 800DE but, not having cruise control which all new mid class adventure bikes have, made my decision to look more at the Tiger 900.
New v-strom in opinion is a fail.
Vstrom owners (with some light offroad ambitions) were always complaining about suspension travel, clearance, wheel size and weight. Majority people were expecting that new one will get lighter, closer to 200 kg (like mentioned competitors) because if suzuki is claiming that bike is now more offroad capable, in my opinion they just shooted themself to the leg with more heavy bike. I have v-strom but next bike will be different brand because of the overweight.
Great to see another Suzuki but this should never be a replacement of the Vstrom 650.
Suzuki needs to keep producing the basic affordable vstrom 650 at 6k to compete with Royal Enfield who are selling bucket loads of bikes.
I like the 800 but don't be silly Suzuki, most people like a bare knuckle bike that they can customize.
So simon now that you had the chance to test both the suzuki and the honda what is more better in terms of low rpm from 2000 to 4000 ? And what engine sounds better?
Absolutely no question, the Honda sounds better. By an absolute mile.
And I think - not riding them back-to-back, so could be wrong! - but I think the Suzuki is a bit lower-geared and has a slightly fitter bottom end.
Is a V Strom without a V twin still actually a V Strom????
It's a P-Strom!
Versatile-Strom.....
Long stroke engine, so more torque, and hp lower in rev range, better for off road riding. Single cylinder engines put power down low in the rev range. Twins can do both high and low rev power if they are tuned right. Now suzuki and Yamaha should make sm models with these twin engines😎
Have Suzuki recreated the F800 with this?
Slightly vibey engine, 800cc, decent suspension and brakes, not to mention similar weight.
The F800 is gone, but lots of good low mileage examples out there for half the dosh.
Hmm?
The Tenere 700 weighs 188kg (414lbs) without fuel and the Suzuki without fuel is 210kg (463lbs). 22kg (50lbs) difference😳🤔
It's a lot of weight I don't care what anyone says.
@@chrishart8548 But I think it will handle onroad better than the Tenere
@YD I think it will too.
5-6 kg is fuel, as Simon pointed out. And the sofa Suzuki put on the VStrom can't be light. Bolt on subframes are in and of themselves a good but heavier, and in addition aren't usually specced unless the manufacturer cares about their strength and carrying capacity.
If you intend to ride farther, while carrying more luggage and/or perhaps a passenger, that's all weight well spent. If you mainly want a dualsport with a twin, it's not.
@@chrishart8548 agree. It's overweight by 20 to 30 kg
Would this be a good bike for a mature adult beginner?
Well Simon.. which one do you prefer as a daily commuter and as a 2 up traveller. This V-Strom or the Moto Guzzi v85tt? 😉
Know you fell in love with with the Guzzi.
Ach, the V85TT is SUCH a good looking bike. Instant classic. I'd have to ride them back to back - I'd definitely rather take the Suzuki off-road tho!
Does the bike have tubeless tyres ?
Engine heat?
Perhaps they should have called it the Suzuki Sweden with that color scheme ... I sense that the vibrations bother Simon more than he lets on, but he feels he can't express it under the circumstances.
Oooo no, there's no-one holding a gun to my head (or shoving cash in my suitcase) - it's just it's really hard to make a judgement in isolation. I felt vibes on the Tiger 900 and mentioned it in the launch video a couple of years ago, but it hasn;t turned out to be a problem for most owners, I don't think.
And I remember the fuss about the BMW S1000XR when it was launched - I noticed them, but didn't think it was a big deal. Then some customers started returning the bike, they were that bad! So it's a personal thing, I think.
So I said what I thought - I can feel them, they don't annoy me greatly but I think I would look at gearing the bike up if I owned one, probably (maybe after a few thousand miles). But it might not even be a problem for many, if any, owners.
It's a parallel 800cc twin, you're going to get the vibes of a parallel 800cc twin. Weight has pluses and minuses. Same old comments. I'd like to hear about component/maintenance/repair accessibility. And design+component reliability. And electronics reporting+interfaces. I'd like more knowledge + intelligence in reviews, and less feelings about sound+appearance. You really can't trust anything about performance anymore until a bike has been dyno tuned. They are all suboptimally detuned for emissions, so it seems. So, a good review, today, ought to include a before+after dyno tune to reflect real world performance.
I agree, but it's impossible on a launch - it's usually a day riding around, half of which is spent posing for cameras. The 800DE was unusual in that it was two days, but there's no scope for digging into the depths of durability and dyno testing. It's a rigid timetable of events.
In fact it's very rarely possible anywhere these days because most 'tests' are conducted in a day - in videos or in magazines.
@@writestuffmedia yes. I just wish reviews were more ownership+maintenance oriented. I can learn more from a test ride than I can from most reviews. They don't help me to learn the ownership/maintenance/repair experience, and that is most important to me in a bike review.
Merci beaucoup l'Ami
I have to say having all these riding modes, quickshifter etc without cruise control seems backwards. I'd take cruise control over all of those things. That's what would push me towards a Tuareg over the PStrom.
I suppose the weight is the big question. Is it closer to 400 than 500?