Special shout out to my members David Huber and Swifto_Scythe. They have had early access to this video, and will get early access to next week’s video in a few days
What I like about the Judge is that if the two sides of Two-Face are different sides of the same coin, then the Judge can be considered the coin itself. He's the mix of Good and Bad Harvey, combining Good Harvey's desire for justice with Bad Harvey's violence and brutality. In fact, it is very possible that if Harvey hadn't pushed all of his anger, frustration, and negativity into "Big Bad Harvey", then Harvey Dent would have ended up becoming something similar to the Judge. In a way, it is possible that the final "Guilty" scene is the Two-Face persona giving in to the Judge persona, which is why when we next see him in the animated series, Two-Face is genuinely trying to become a better person. He's still clearly struggling with his anger, but he's also making genuine effort towards self-improvement.
my headcanon is that Harvey lost his two-headed coin (which isn't the first time in the series, but it strangely always ends up returning), so after a crisis he ends up creating a new personality just to suppress the lack of it.
I really like how the Judge was presented as separate entity. He was so opposite that when tried kill Harvey Dent/Two face we only get hint who actually was... Since only Harry Dent/Two face would know about emergency escape route in his Apartment.
The judge appears in one episode. It's a shame they made Two-Face never spotlight in Justice League and just a cameo and a small cameo by Bruce Timm in Fatal Five.
Well, there was that Bat-embargo going on because of The Batman cartoon and the Dark Knight Trilogy. Apparently the higher ups thought the audience didn’t have enough brain cells to think that alternate iterations of characters could coexist at the same time. Then again, this was long before the great multiverse milking.
At least in Fatal Five, they confirmed Two-Face will be straightened up and has been turning over a new leaf himself. So he may go back to a normal Harvey again. As for him running for mayor again? That will be harder 😅
Two Face suffers from a problem most villians have: no matter how complex or sympathetic their motives are, you have to constantly work to keep them from just becoming another bank robber with a theme. Two-Face is the most interesting as a pseudo-vigilante trying to dismantle the organized crime that scarred him and that he couldn’t stop as DA. But most times he’s just another organized criminal with a number schtick. It’s most clear when they have villain team ups and he’s with actual mass murderers like the Joker, and the penguin who actively works with Rupert Thawn, the reason he is Two-Face.
I don't care for Nolan's take on Batman overall, but making Two-Face a Punisher-esque anti-villain who exclusively targets criminals was an inspired idea.
I think Two Face works best if he was a Anti-Hero character. A person who controls and organize crime in order to reduce the damage they deal to Gotham itself. Imagine he worked like a Yakuza boss. Making so that all of his subordinates are always in line. They don't brazenly attack anyone, just specific targets "in the game"
Having finally started reading the tie in comics, it’s great to see more stories delving into Harvey’s psychological issues and even retroactively adding back in the stronger abusive father backstory. But it does kind of suck that we didn’t get more of this in the show itself. I feel like Harvey only had a handful of episodes post his origin that just didn’t have him default to a regular mobster/supervillain with a gimmick.
I love Judgement Day. It was a fantastic episode, with a strong noir theme and a compelling mystery. The reveal that Harvey was the Judge took me by surprise. And the final scene at Arkham was chilling. I could not believe that was the final episode of the series. It was very depressing. Gotham Adventures 12 was a good sequel to judgement day, as it shows how fractured Harvey's mind has become. The scene were Harvey talks to Batman while in a fiddle position was sad. No matter what he does, Harvey will still be haunted by his demons. If they made an audio story version of Gotham Adventures 12, I bet they would have gotten Richard Moll back to reprise his role as Two-Face, and he would have killed it.
The Judge bothers me, because I think Two-Face always works better as a vigilante rather than him using giant comedy crime props or basically acting like a gangster. The Judge is what Two-Face SHOULD be in my eyes. I can suspend my disbelief for a lot of things, but the hardest thing for me to accept that is a former DA could ever slot himself into the criminal underworld or that anyone would ever work for the guy. A lot of Two-Face's origin stories go in this direction - and then other writers come in and he's pulling zany schemes like he's The Joker or something. Loeb/Sale's vision for the character pitches him more as a brutal, humorless zealot, and it's always coloured my perception of what a good Two-Face should be like.
Dude if you worry about things being bloody "realistic " in a comic about a man who dress as a flying rodent to punch people, you ate not going to enjoy superhero comics in general! Harvey is a ex da so his knowledge of the law makes him a dangerous foe in the underworld.
I don't think their argument is realism, more consistency in characterization, that, a DA, even a criminally insane one, wouldn't just suddenly become a straight-up mobster, or that the people he persecuted when he was (relatively more) sane would ever trust him enough to work under him. Two-Face is the result of Harvey's perception of injustices against him, so it's bizarre for him to become a villain who lacks that sense of justice.@@zemox2534
@@thesuckysix4242 THANK YOU! It's not about 'realism' whatsoever. But that I just cannot believe that the criminal element would work for a DA. I think Harv would have folks working for him, people who genuinely believed in his politics for instance. But him acting like Al Capone? Being friends with other criminals? Playing cards with The Joker? I'm sorry, but no. No, it just doesn't work. And I hate how for every great interpretation of Two-Face, you've got to wade through a sea of garbage where he's trying to steal diamonds or running a protection racket or God knows what else.
@@louthegiantcookieYou can't accept an ex da turning into a crime lord, but you can accept a traumatised man dressing up as a bat and fighting criminals who look like clowns, wear question marks on their cloths and giant clay monsters? You might as well not read or watch any Two-Face story for the rest of your life.
Why do I feel The Judge, Lock-up and Rumor would be a good group together. Vigilantes going way to far to bring Gotham villains their brand of "Justice".
@@michaelandreipalon359 Sorry for the late reply. I think he be a good edition to the comics. Rumor has potential to be in someone’s rogue’s gallery. Though he would have to be more than a rumour… I’ll get my coat.
That’s a common misconception. Batman Adventures 22 elaborates further on how the disfigurement shattered Harvey Dent’s mind and left a new personality, Two-Face, who was neither Harvey or Big Bad Harv.
Honestly, the best way to experience this villain, is to actually see Judgement Day for yourself. The imposing voice, the cinematography, the musical score and the mix of brutal strikes and spectre like movement all give the Judge a presence that makes you wish he had more than just this episode.
3:55 I suppose by technicality, The Judge could be considered the 4th Alter…but I counterpoint that with the fact that Two-Face is the result of Big Bad Harv and Harvey’s collective psyches fusing together. They both have the same voice, the same personalities, the same propensity for violent outbursts, the same mean streak etc. Moon Knight is a good example of what I mean here. He’s a guy with 3 Alters: Mark Specter, Stephen Grant and Jake Lockley. Each have their own unique strengths, weaknesses and similarities to one another. But when all 3 are combined, they give birth to a 4th Alter: Moon Knight.
The Gray Ghost! I'm so glad they let Adam West play the character straight while still paying homage to the silly series that helped revitalize Batman. It would have been easy to play that character for pure laughs but instead we got a dramatic performance with weight and relatability. Also, I named my cat after him. 'The Gray Ghost Himself, Simon Trent' or Simon for short. He was originally named Megatron, but my family pestered me about it to no end 😅
The Judge could honestly work well as a ultimate climax for a long Harvey character arc. The two sides united and him whole again, but his mind and view on the world jaded from everything that happened to him.
I found these on Amazon Prime in 2010, and as a teenager whose only exposure to Batman was the Lego games and the 60’s version, I watched most of this show religiously. The judge always felt like an eerie non-finale, like it was setting up something to come that never materialized. It felt so jarring that such an impactful new character would be introduced and never seen again… but then the creeper felt that way too, so I wasn’t too surprised when you mentioned in another video that he was supposed to be far more involved in the new show. I still look back at this episode with a prickly feeling of dread.
Hence why Serum Lake treats "Holiday Knights" as the true TNBA finale. The Creeper does return in Justice League Unlimited, albeit without a spotlight ep and also unvoiced.
Maybe two face can be cloned and collectively, they can be called "The Jury" - that way Harvey gets to preside over all aspects of the judicial system.
While not the best depiction, I feel like it was still interesting how the TNBA writers came closer to an actual depiction of Dissociative Identity Disorder via the Judge personality developing as a persecuter, where as Big Bad Harv was a protector who became a persecuter before things got twisted so much with the new Two-Face personality that Harvey needed a new persecuter to essentially try to protect himself from being his own worst enemy. It's not ideal, but much closer to the complicated nature of that disorder and depicted with a degree of sympathy not every writer could pull off. Also my man Harvey might as well be a Disney villain with how often he falls from heights.
@@cosmicspacething3474 I was going off of a few things I've heard and read. Bear in mind, I'm neither a psychiatrist nor psychologist. I know that it often occurs for people who who have suffered severe trauma such as physical abuse. There is dissociation involved with the mind trying to cope/distance from the trauma. Personalities can form as protective elements for the mind, though some can be harmful in how they interact with other personalities or other people. Often times, people aren't aware of the switch between personalities and don't recall how they did something or ended up somewhere. It can also be they end up surprised/confused when someone mentions things they said that they don't recall saying. It sounds a bit like what can happen when people sleepwalk, except they're a bit more aware in certain ways. Like I said, this is just a general overview of some aspects of the disorder I've read about, I don't pretend to be an expert and obviously the writers of BTAS and TNBA weren't either. They wrote what was most interesting to them as far as storytelling and sometimes that can result in more verisimilitude than expected. If you're here to pick a fight because I've said something incorrect regarding the disorder or think I'm here to play armchair psychologist, then I'm not interested in continuing this conversation. Correct me if I said something wrong and move on.
@@cosmicspacething3474 Okay, I apologize. Sometimes it's hard to tell intent through typing. I was just a little worried about people picking dumb internet fights and I've had a bad week. I had no intention of taking it out on you. Again, sorry
It should be noted that people suffering from Dissociative Identity Disorder experience their dissociative states to protect themselves and as an stress-coping mechanism. It is commonly accepted that DDI suffers do experience new dissociations because effectively their brains have “learned” dissociation is an effective coping strategy. Harvey Dent fractures when he needs to do something he’s not mentally capable of, because creating a new person inside himself is easier than forcing himself to do it.
It sort of reminds me of Anakin Skywalker and Darth Vader; where while Darth Vader is shown to be the dominant personality, Anakin is still in there, trying to fight to regain control despite Vader saying that he "killed" him.
(I thought it was cancelled before it even began) but I would’ve liked to see their take on the eraser. Cause a villain meant for getting rid of evidence is a really great concept
I think the Judge knew he and two face shared the same body, he wanted to punish both Two Face and himself because even though everything he had done was for Justice, he couldn’t get over the fact that he had gone outside the law to do so, and he wouldn’t allow anyone, even himself, to get away with such an act.
Great video, as always. I've finally watched everything and caught up! I disagree about Two-Face being 3 personalities before The Judge. I always thought Big Bad Harv WAS Two-Face. Big Bad Harv simply took over after the accident.
You’re not alone that assessment, however in Batman Adventures 22 a psychologist states that Harvey’s mind was shattered when he saw his disfigured face for the first time, and it resulted in a new personality being formed that was neither Harvey Dent or Big Bad Harv. Note that Two-Face’s voice is slightly different to Big Bad Harv’s - it’s a subtle difference, but once heard I find it hard to ignore
I'd heard that, but before I had interpreted Two-Face as a sort of compromise between the two. That the coin was to decide which man got his way in the moment. But this is why Two-Face is such a great character - the tiniest detail in his identity can have tremendous implications. With even just a little thought, a fascinating character begins writing itself for you. Two faces; endless possibilities.
I’m a new subscriber and I’ve been watching a bunch of your videos these past few days. They’re very well done. Something interesting I never thought about before seeing this video, but I’m guessing the J Carrol Corcoran character is a nod to actor J Carrol Naish, who played Dr. Daka in the 1940s Batman serial. That performance and series has its issues by today’s standards for sure, but the names are too similar for it to be a coincidence. Anyway, love your videos. It’s been great revisiting some of the BTAS stuff I used to love as a kid.
Man this split personality thing is really complicated because it says that you get it from trauma but here is that Harvey was holding on to anger so long because of a misunderstanding but I do wonder where and how he got the judge costume from and how did he get up the bridge so fast and seemed to very good at taking down someone twice his size that being Croc because he was a wrestler and Batman trained his life to master his sense and where did he trained in Law School? I guess you have seen Gotham tv series where someone did the same thing in final scene? Which episode are going to use on Christmas, Christmas with the Joker or Holiday Knights? I thought an idea for that Harvey Dent would be split out of both Two Face and the Judge by some new friends from high places (taking inspiration from the 90’s Hulk cartoon where Banner and Hulk are separated from each other) and where Two Face is a blue Hulk like monster in a justice league episode
Dcau Harvey had military background training as he was in the air force which could explain him knowing how to scrap and how to use guns. Maybe he used those magnets he has to help climb his way up. Harvey probably bought the suit online as it's just a robe and wig so all he needed to do was glue the wig on a black mask and he's done.
The Judge was such an amazing and interesting character as the idea of Harvey Dent creating a 3rd persona to fight crime was a unique especially as he already had a Jekyll Vs Hyde spilt personality going on anyway, it was definitely something the show should have explored more if TNBA continued because it truly showed how far into the dark side gone Batman's friend had truly gone
A perennial favorite of mine, "Beware the Gray Ghost". Not even The Fairly OddParents' Catman and that Kim Possible ep featuring a Batman-esque Adam West character can surpass it in terms of pathos.
IMO Judgement Day was the only time TNBA Two Face felt like BTAS Two Face. They took a lot of his depth from BTAS away like his friendship with Bruce, Harvey's struggle with his other personality, him sometimes being more vigilante than villain and so on and made TNBA Harvey just a gangster.
I think the judge has a really cool concept and design. They definitely deserve to come back. Maybe red hood style where it's someone completely new in the costume. Maybe mix in a bit of the old lore where the judge is. A character that perceives Batman as letting someone close to them die because of his no kill rule
This may not seem relevant to this video specifically, but I kinda wish DC made stories set exclusively in Earth-3, with the Crime Syndicate and their Justice League. I imagine Owlman's version of Two-Face would have originally been a corrupt defense attorney until he ended up getting attacked and horribly scarred by someone seeking justice for the murder of a relative or close friend, who's killer Earth-3 Harvey helped get off death row on a technicality. His scar leaves him not only mentally wounded, but he ends up getting disbarred and his own family abandons him for no longer meeting the standards of excellence and perfection he once did. Betrayed, abandoned, forsaken, and shown the true error of his corrupt ways, Earth-3 Harvey's mind shatters and all that's left is the urge to bring justice to the lawless world. He becomes the very symbol of the law itself. His lair, the Courtroom. His sidekicks, the Jury. His weapon, the Gavel. He becomes *The Judge.*
Honestly JL vs the Fatal Five and Death in the Family where mt favorite bit appearances of Two Faces. Showing a very different side to him than we usually see. From him giving Red Robin Jason a scathing speech about how he basically spat on Batman's legacy to him standing up for and making a small friendship with Starboy.
The weird thing about the Judge is how he's a combat beast who can easily batter Killer Croc when regular Two Face is competent but not particularly exceptional as a fighter.
The Judge is rumored to be in a lost Golden Age comic book coming after Harvey Dent or rather Harvey Kent seemingly reforms and gets his face fixed as you would well know Two-Face reformed in the Golden Age however Harvey still felt guilty for all the things he did so an alternate personality enveloped known as the Judge and he went on to fight for justice and you should know the rest. What I'm saying is he might have appeared in the Golden Age as a lost comic i.e. creepypasta style.
The Judge could have been greatly utilized by Task Force X either as a vigilante or jailer for renegade criminal mercenaries. Judge could have been a true threat to Joker if Harvey's morale had the better of him.
I'd love to see a comic where Two-Face rehabilitates by still having a Coin to flip But it's blank on both sides. So it's like a cigarette patch for him allow himself to flip a coin, but with no result.
I think if the judge doesn’t know he’s also two face, then he does know, he just doesn’t care. Almost like a robot, if they’re guilty, they deserve his wrath no matter how they are
Imagine a What If story where BTAS Batman actually offers Two-Face to be one of his allies. Think Suicide Squad but no neck bombs. I feel like that would definitely be an interesting idea.
I just recently found this channel and I'm so glad I subscribed. 😀 I loved your video about The Judge, including the many references to Batman comics with special emphasis on BGA #12.
In the Batman comics, the character of the Judge has potential to become a standalone character if separated from Two-Face. This idea is similar to the Teen Titans cartoon episode where Red X returns and it's revealed that someone stole Robin's Red X suit and became the new Red X. The Judge could similarly be portrayed as someone who takes on the persona of the Judge after Two-Face's demise.
Nice Joker doddles you've shown after talking about the comic book inspirations I don't like the Janus personality I honestly preferred the Judge who is an anti-hero/anti-villain with no face the true third personality having no face makes sense cuz he's the perfect mixture of Harvey Dent and Two-Face/Big Bad Harvey someone who is an anti-hero or anti-villain depending on your perspective someone who uses Two-Face/Big Bad Harvey's violence and brutality to do justice rather than Janus personality who doesn't do anything for justice and commits crime.
I have to say, it's almost a staple of the series to have tragic villains: Mr. Freeze, Two-Face, Ace, a case could be made to say that Catwoman is a tragic villain, she and batman are so into each other but they can never be together because of her kleptomania, sorta like an alternative version of Romeo & Juliet.
There is an argument to be made with Twoface being in Archam during the fatal 5 movie. I mean, he is still there, meaning he has at least stopped using the revolving door. He also showed signs of trying to correct his actions, and he took Starboy under his wing. I think this shows he is getting better, probably good therapy. As to why he seems to have been there so long, he did do alot of major crimes, he has to have many many years he has to serve. But, again, it looks like he is taking advantage of the help he needs, so the time can only aid in his recovery. I wish real prisons could figure that out.
Im not sure why, but when i think of the Judge personality of Two-Face in BTAS i cant help but think of Azrael, the Sword, the violent vigilante, the choir as he appears, the looming presence. Maybe thats why i enjoyed the episode a lot, i Really like Azrael (when he Is His own thing rather than edgy Batman), but i Understand why a lot of people dont like him. Maybe the Judge is something of an BTAS Azrael, in your Bane video It seems the creators werent that interésted in Bane as "the Man who broke Batman" so i Guess "The Catholic Zealot that usurped Batman" would be even less interesting in their eyes. I may be reaching, but perhaps the Judge its their Azrael, a crazed vigilante willing to kill villians for the sake of a Greater porpouse, in this case being justice instead of God and religión.
Two-Face being given a rigged coin remind me of Arkham Asylum a serious house on serious Earth where are one of the treatments they give him an Arkham Asylum is very similar
I actually disagree about seeing Harvey in Fatal Five as being sad. In the movie, he is shown to have much better control over his anger and even protects Star Boy from the other inmates. If anything, his appearance in the movie is proof that his treatment is working.
The Judge is an AMAZING concept and one I hope gets more mileage in future Batmedia! But also, to me, "Judgement Day" feels like a weird copy-paste of _Mask of the Phantasm._ 1: New vigilante picks off criminals (though this one never gets to kill, because kids show). 2: Corrupt councilman involved (though he works with the vigilante and gets off better than Reeves did) 3: Said vigilante turns out to be someone close to Bruce (only here it's his friend).
Surprised to see Mighty Ducks: The Animated Series here. Still, Spawn and Gargoyles are more better and nostalgic to me. 1:56: Why are such inconsistent colorings a comic book norm back then? I sure heavily sympathize with the Judge more than Lock-Up when it came to their necessary vigilante efforts; even J.C. Corcoran, despite being the true villain of the episode, had a huge point saying that Batman's life-saving actions on villains feels ultimately too lenient and thus pointless. *Batman Beyond proves that point, since Terry McGinnis occasionally not needing to avoid killing sure lead to better results.* Well, will now await the Gray Ghost vid. Hope Adam West is just hanging out with Kevin Conroy at this point up above.
2:35 so not only is he condiming batman for taking justice into his own hands while also doing it himself while also kidnaping a boy he also blames batman for blinding his daughter even tho he was 1 commiting murders and 2 was the one who shot his own daughter Hypocrite barely describes him thays down right delusional
@SerumLake Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't Jason Todd do a similar thing as two face in his long term game in Under the Red Hood; where Jason offers protection to the top 8 but drug dealers to out an out force black mask's hand to work with the joker?
I always figured Two Face was Dent and Big Bad Harv merging together to create one single identity where neither of the former two personalities are ever truly dominate over the other and is always split 50 50 between good and bad, although for plot convivence it always seems to lean more towards bad than good. Another theory I had: I think the Judge personality emerged when the evil half began to take over completely and in order to compensate for this lack of balance, decided to do a hard turn by becoming uncompromising vigilante and I think this is supported by looking at how Two Face changed between BTAS and the New Adventures. In the former while he was still a hardcore criminal there was sometimes a glimmer of good intentions behind his actions like in Two Face part two where he's trying to take down Rupert Thorn, though granted he's most certainly driven in part by revenge for Thorn ruining his life but you can also read it as him wanting to actually fix Gotham by taking out it's number one crime lord. Then Cut to New adventures where he tries to have Tim Drake killed and holds the city for ransom with toxic gas with no other motivation besides money. The difference is stark and It would also would explain why Batman no longer holds anything back when facing his former friend and just treats him like any of his other rogues because he knows he's too far gone by that point.
The fact that they share the same continuity backs up your point of view. Although I would also say that the writing was pretty different in TNBA. They could get away with more horrific things happening (see Growing Pains, Chemistry, Mad Love etc.) but they were also a bit more diverse in terms of tone (see Beware The Creeper, The Demon Within, Critters)
I also consider all 109 episodes to make up one show, but I'll always associate TNBA with Kids'WB! whereas BTAS and TAoB&R will be more closely connected to Fox Kids and Cartoon Network in my mind as a die-hard DCAU fan.
The Judge is interesting in the sense that he, essentially, breaks the "duality" of Two-Face. We'd say it's a shame we never really got to see the original Harvey Dent attempt to interact with either of them, because that duality element is something that's extremely prevalent in the "one alter side vs other alter side" in plural characters. The Judge does throw a wrench into it, but we're also not allowed to see the three person dynamic come into play. It sorta more swaps out one for the other in the duality aspect? If you were a kid watching this as your first BTAS episode, you'd just assume it was Two-Face and The Judge. It's a funny thing, actually, cause we've found one of the easier ways to avoid a lot of the pitfalls of system depictions in media is the three alter system. Sort of inspired by the Ace Attorney entity Uendo Toneido, a rakugo artist playing traditional 3 character stories. Perhaps because it becomes a "oh they have to learn to share" versus "only one can come out on top" type of story...? Regardless, we think The Judge is an interesting *start* of a character, but it looks like they were somewhat uninterested in exploring him as an entity. For it to be the last episode of the series, is... well, you can probably already guess how we feel it's emblematic of the DCAU's tendency to treat plurality as shock value and not much more. (A couple days ago we found out Lex Luthor started hallucinating talking to Braniac in later Justice League seasons, and most characters look at him like he's crazy. Weeren't the biggest fan ;^^ ) So as a final note, I'd say we actually do like The Judge. He represents what we think Two-Face really should be as a vigilante, and doesn't even need the coin gimmick. (Tbh. Sometimes we wonder if the luck element of two-face is oftentimes conflicting with the alter element). It's just the greater narrative surrounding this character that brings him down a notch. (Seriously, we watched the justice league movie and they say he's in there cause he "thinks he's two people" and not their anger issues, eeurgh...) Also, eeugh, the amount Harvey Dent gets whitewashed in the comics... Hard to swallow that's the same character sometimes.
I always appreciate your insights into plurality, so thanks for sharing. Yes, I too dislike the whitewashing of Two-Face. He’s very clearly African American, or at the very least biracial, in BTAS.
@@SerumLakeI never recall seeing Two-Face depicted as African American in the mainline comics and in terms of BTAS, I have genuinely never gotten the impression in my entire life that Harvey was supposed to be depicted as African American, not that I'd have a problem if he were. I sometimes thought he may be part Hispanic but generally I always got the impression that he was Caucasian. Whitewashing Two-Face is something I genuinely never heard before recently. Again, I'm Greek and I see people with tan skin on a daily basis and so to me it never seemed like anything different. People seem to have gotten the same impression about Lex Luthor in Superman TAS but he was based on Telly Savalas who is Greek and naturally looks like that.
@@supremegroden3021 not in BTAS. Remember that at the time Billy Dee Williams played Harvey Dent in Tim Burton’s films, and the BTAS crew were instructed to follow the Burton films as closely as possible.
@@The_Phantasm yes, you’re right that he was always white in the comics, but he was played by Billy Dee Williams in Tim Burton’s Batman. As you know the BTAS crew was instructed to mirror the Burton films as much as possible.
Special shout out to my members David Huber and Swifto_Scythe. They have had early access to this video, and will get early access to next week’s video in a few days
Scarlet used to mean purple.
What I like about the Judge is that if the two sides of Two-Face are different sides of the same coin, then the Judge can be considered the coin itself. He's the mix of Good and Bad Harvey, combining Good Harvey's desire for justice with Bad Harvey's violence and brutality. In fact, it is very possible that if Harvey hadn't pushed all of his anger, frustration, and negativity into "Big Bad Harvey", then Harvey Dent would have ended up becoming something similar to the Judge.
In a way, it is possible that the final "Guilty" scene is the Two-Face persona giving in to the Judge persona, which is why when we next see him in the animated series, Two-Face is genuinely trying to become a better person. He's still clearly struggling with his anger, but he's also making genuine effort towards self-improvement.
my headcanon is that Harvey lost his two-headed coin (which isn't the first time in the series, but it strangely always ends up returning), so after a crisis he ends up creating a new personality just to suppress the lack of it.
I really like how the Judge was presented as separate entity. He was so opposite that when tried kill Harvey Dent/Two face we only get hint who actually was... Since only Harry Dent/Two face would know about emergency escape route in his Apartment.
Wasn't it because he got Super Lobotomized?
@@misterOrca4 I'm talking about the Fatal Five movie.
The judge appears in one episode. It's a shame they made Two-Face never spotlight in Justice League and just a cameo and a small cameo by Bruce Timm in Fatal Five.
Yeah and along with other bat villains like Penguin, Mad Hatter,Riddler, Killer Croc etc
Well, there was that Bat-embargo going on because of The Batman cartoon and the Dark Knight Trilogy. Apparently the higher ups thought the audience didn’t have enough brain cells to think that alternate iterations of characters could coexist at the same time. Then again, this was long before the great multiverse milking.
@@ajra6143 Ironically that saved the lives of the Batman villains, as they weren't in the LoD in JLU.
At least in Fatal Five, they confirmed Two-Face will be straightened up and has been turning over a new leaf himself. So he may go back to a normal Harvey again. As for him running for mayor again? That will be harder 😅
@NitwitsWorld idk I mean it's suppose to in the USA and well... you know.
The Judge pulling out a sword like it’s in a pistol holster.
Old habits die hard.
Two Face suffers from a problem most villians have: no matter how complex or sympathetic their motives are, you have to constantly work to keep them from just becoming another bank robber with a theme. Two-Face is the most interesting as a pseudo-vigilante trying to dismantle the organized crime that scarred him and that he couldn’t stop as DA. But most times he’s just another organized criminal with a number schtick. It’s most clear when they have villain team ups and he’s with actual mass murderers like the Joker, and the penguin who actively works with Rupert Thawn, the reason he is Two-Face.
I don't care for Nolan's take on Batman overall, but making Two-Face a Punisher-esque anti-villain who exclusively targets criminals was an inspired idea.
Can’t believe this concept has only been used ONCE. It’d be awesome to see other versions of Two Face with another, more dangerous personality
I think Two Face works best if he was a Anti-Hero character. A person who controls and organize crime in order to reduce the damage they deal to Gotham itself. Imagine he worked like a Yakuza boss. Making so that all of his subordinates are always in line. They don't brazenly attack anyone, just specific targets "in the game"
#Agreed
Having finally started reading the tie in comics, it’s great to see more stories delving into Harvey’s psychological issues and even retroactively adding back in the stronger abusive father backstory. But it does kind of suck that we didn’t get more of this in the show itself. I feel like Harvey only had a handful of episodes post his origin that just didn’t have him default to a regular mobster/supervillain with a gimmick.
Batman Gotham Adventures is definitely one of my favorite comic book runs of all time. Enjoy. 😉
I love Judgement Day. It was a fantastic episode, with a strong noir theme and a compelling mystery. The reveal that Harvey was the Judge took me by surprise. And the final scene at Arkham was chilling.
I could not believe that was the final episode of the series. It was very depressing.
Gotham Adventures 12 was a good sequel to judgement day, as it shows how fractured Harvey's mind has become. The scene were Harvey talks to Batman while in a fiddle position was sad. No matter what he does, Harvey will still be haunted by his demons.
If they made an audio story version of Gotham Adventures 12, I bet they would have gotten Richard Moll back to reprise his role as Two-Face, and he would have killed it.
⁰
The Judge bothers me, because I think Two-Face always works better as a vigilante rather than him using giant comedy crime props or basically acting like a gangster. The Judge is what Two-Face SHOULD be in my eyes. I can suspend my disbelief for a lot of things, but the hardest thing for me to accept that is a former DA could ever slot himself into the criminal underworld or that anyone would ever work for the guy. A lot of Two-Face's origin stories go in this direction - and then other writers come in and he's pulling zany schemes like he's The Joker or something. Loeb/Sale's vision for the character pitches him more as a brutal, humorless zealot, and it's always coloured my perception of what a good Two-Face should be like.
Dude if you worry about things being bloody "realistic " in a comic about a man who dress as a flying rodent to punch people, you ate not going to enjoy superhero comics in general! Harvey is a ex da so his knowledge of the law makes him a dangerous foe in the underworld.
I don't think their argument is realism, more consistency in characterization, that, a DA, even a criminally insane one, wouldn't just suddenly become a straight-up mobster, or that the people he persecuted when he was (relatively more) sane would ever trust him enough to work under him. Two-Face is the result of Harvey's perception of injustices against him, so it's bizarre for him to become a villain who lacks that sense of justice.@@zemox2534
@@thesuckysix4242 THANK YOU! It's not about 'realism' whatsoever. But that I just cannot believe that the criminal element would work for a DA. I think Harv would have folks working for him, people who genuinely believed in his politics for instance. But him acting like Al Capone? Being friends with other criminals? Playing cards with The Joker? I'm sorry, but no. No, it just doesn't work. And I hate how for every great interpretation of Two-Face, you've got to wade through a sea of garbage where he's trying to steal diamonds or running a protection racket or God knows what else.
@@louthegiantcookieYou can't accept an ex da turning into a crime lord, but you can accept a traumatised man dressing up as a bat and fighting criminals who look like clowns, wear question marks on their cloths and giant clay monsters? You might as well not read or watch any Two-Face story for the rest of your life.
@@zemox2534 ...why are you being like this? Why are you defaulting to attacking me?
I completely forgot how cool the Judge's design is.
I LOVE The Judge as a concept. I’m surprised they didn’t give him his own henchmen to order around. Could have called them his Jurors.
I'd say bailiffs would be more appropriate. Jurors are the deciders. Bailiffs enforce the Judge's rulings. It's more thematic, see?
@@lordfelidae4505 Good point!
Why do I feel The Judge, Lock-up and Rumor would be a good group together. Vigilantes going way to far to bring Gotham villains their brand of "Justice".
Yeah that would be a good idea like they’re like the Bat family but they’re just doing their own thing
Granted, the DCAU doesn't have Rumor.
@@michaelandreipalon359 Sorry for the late reply. I think he be a good edition to the comics. Rumor has potential to be in someone’s rogue’s gallery. Though he would have to be more than a rumour… I’ll get my coat.
Sound like an interesting story idea.
I don't think Lockup would like any of the Batman Rogues
Rip Richard Moll.
The Tragedy of Harvey Dent will forever remain your greatest legacy.
4:36 I think Two Face is what the Big Bad Harv personality renamed itself after Harvey was scarred.
That’s a common misconception. Batman Adventures 22 elaborates further on how the disfigurement shattered Harvey Dent’s mind and left a new personality, Two-Face, who was neither Harvey or Big Bad Harv.
Honestly, the best way to experience this villain, is to actually see Judgement Day for yourself. The imposing voice, the cinematography, the musical score and the mix of brutal strikes and spectre like movement all give the Judge a presence that makes you wish he had more than just this episode.
3:55 I suppose by technicality, The Judge could be considered the 4th Alter…but I counterpoint that with the fact that Two-Face is the result of Big Bad Harv and Harvey’s collective psyches fusing together. They both have the same voice, the same personalities, the same propensity for violent outbursts, the same mean streak etc.
Moon Knight is a good example of what I mean here. He’s a guy with 3 Alters: Mark Specter, Stephen Grant and Jake Lockley. Each have their own unique strengths, weaknesses and similarities to one another. But when all 3 are combined, they give birth to a 4th Alter: Moon Knight.
The Gray Ghost! I'm so glad they let Adam West play the character straight while still paying homage to the silly series that helped revitalize Batman. It would have been easy to play that character for pure laughs but instead we got a dramatic performance with weight and relatability.
Also, I named my cat after him. 'The Gray Ghost Himself, Simon Trent' or Simon for short. He was originally named Megatron, but my family pestered me about it to no end 😅
The Judge could honestly work well as a ultimate climax for a long Harvey character arc. The two sides united and him whole again, but his mind and view on the world jaded from everything that happened to him.
This was one of my favorite TNBA episodes alongside Never Fear, Holiday Knights and Growing Pains
I found these on Amazon Prime in 2010, and as a teenager whose only exposure to Batman was the Lego games and the 60’s version, I watched most of this show religiously. The judge always felt like an eerie non-finale, like it was setting up something to come that never materialized. It felt so jarring that such an impactful new character would be introduced and never seen again… but then the creeper felt that way too, so I wasn’t too surprised when you mentioned in another video that he was supposed to be far more involved in the new show. I still look back at this episode with a prickly feeling of dread.
Hence why Serum Lake treats "Holiday Knights" as the true TNBA finale.
The Creeper does return in Justice League Unlimited, albeit without a spotlight ep and also unvoiced.
The Judge is a great concept
Maybe two face can be cloned and collectively, they can be called "The Jury" - that way Harvey gets to preside over all aspects of the judicial system.
the most gut wrenching part is just hearing harvey repeat guilty in his cell as he stares blankly at the camera. absolute emptyness
While not the best depiction, I feel like it was still interesting how the TNBA writers came closer to an actual depiction of Dissociative Identity Disorder via the Judge personality developing as a persecuter, where as Big Bad Harv was a protector who became a persecuter before things got twisted so much with the new Two-Face personality that Harvey needed a new persecuter to essentially try to protect himself from being his own worst enemy. It's not ideal, but much closer to the complicated nature of that disorder and depicted with a degree of sympathy not every writer could pull off.
Also my man Harvey might as well be a Disney villain with how often he falls from heights.
Haha, yes, Two-Face falling isn’t not exactly subtle imagery, but I love it nonetheless
So how does it work more specifically?
@@cosmicspacething3474 I was going off of a few things I've heard and read. Bear in mind, I'm neither a psychiatrist nor psychologist. I know that it often occurs for people who who have suffered severe trauma such as physical abuse. There is dissociation involved with the mind trying to cope/distance from the trauma. Personalities can form as protective elements for the mind, though some can be harmful in how they interact with other personalities or other people. Often times, people aren't aware of the switch between personalities and don't recall how they did something or ended up somewhere. It can also be they end up surprised/confused when someone mentions things they said that they don't recall saying. It sounds a bit like what can happen when people sleepwalk, except they're a bit more aware in certain ways.
Like I said, this is just a general overview of some aspects of the disorder I've read about, I don't pretend to be an expert and obviously the writers of BTAS and TNBA weren't either. They wrote what was most interesting to them as far as storytelling and sometimes that can result in more verisimilitude than expected.
If you're here to pick a fight because I've said something incorrect regarding the disorder or think I'm here to play armchair psychologist, then I'm not interested in continuing this conversation. Correct me if I said something wrong and move on.
@@sarahpace5376 I was just asking, thanks
@@cosmicspacething3474 Okay, I apologize. Sometimes it's hard to tell intent through typing. I was just a little worried about people picking dumb internet fights and I've had a bad week. I had no intention of taking it out on you. Again, sorry
It should be noted that people suffering from Dissociative Identity Disorder experience their dissociative states to protect themselves and as an stress-coping mechanism.
It is commonly accepted that DDI suffers do experience new dissociations because effectively their brains have “learned” dissociation is an effective coping strategy.
Harvey Dent fractures when he needs to do something he’s not mentally capable of, because creating a new person inside himself is easier than forcing himself to do it.
Man hearing about that last comic really makes me wish Two-Face had gotten some follow up in Batman Beyond.
It sort of reminds me of Anakin Skywalker and Darth Vader; where while Darth Vader is shown to be the dominant personality, Anakin is still in there, trying to fight to regain control despite Vader saying that he "killed" him.
i love the judges design
One of the coolest one-shot characters in TNBA. Harvey Dent's psyche is such an interesting place to explore.
i have to say his design while extremely simple is one of my favorites i love it
You can never have enough Two-Face videos
(I thought it was cancelled before it even began) but I would’ve liked to see their take on the eraser. Cause a villain meant for getting rid of evidence is a really great concept
I think the Judge knew he and two face shared the same body, he wanted to punish both Two Face and himself because even though everything he had done was for Justice, he couldn’t get over the fact that he had gone outside the law to do so, and he wouldn’t allow anyone, even himself, to get away with such an act.
Two-Face is my favorite Batman villain and i love the judge
How on earth did I miss this episode?? It sounds amazing! Great video as always!
Great video, as always. I've finally watched everything and caught up! I disagree about Two-Face being 3 personalities before The Judge. I always thought Big Bad Harv WAS Two-Face. Big Bad Harv simply took over after the accident.
You’re not alone that assessment, however in Batman Adventures 22 a psychologist states that Harvey’s mind was shattered when he saw his disfigured face for the first time, and it resulted in a new personality being formed that was neither Harvey Dent or Big Bad Harv. Note that Two-Face’s voice is slightly different to Big Bad Harv’s - it’s a subtle difference, but once heard I find it hard to ignore
I'll read that one again and check it out! Interesting@@SerumLake
I'd heard that, but before I had interpreted Two-Face as a sort of compromise between the two. That the coin was to decide which man got his way in the moment. But this is why Two-Face is such a great character - the tiniest detail in his identity can have tremendous implications. With even just a little thought, a fascinating character begins writing itself for you. Two faces; endless possibilities.
I’m a new subscriber and I’ve been watching a bunch of your videos these past few days. They’re very well done. Something interesting I never thought about before seeing this video, but I’m guessing the J Carrol Corcoran character is a nod to actor J Carrol Naish, who played Dr. Daka in the 1940s Batman serial. That performance and series has its issues by today’s standards for sure, but the names are too similar for it to be a coincidence.
Anyway, love your videos. It’s been great revisiting some of the BTAS stuff I used to love as a kid.
R I p richard moll You are awesome as two-face.
I thought Two-Face was just big bad Harv and Harvey working in tandem. So yeah, the Judge(or Janis) would make three.
Man this split personality thing is really complicated because it says that you get it from trauma but here is that Harvey was holding on to anger so long because of a misunderstanding but I do wonder where and how he got the judge costume from and how did he get up the bridge so fast and seemed to very good at taking down someone twice his size that being Croc because he was a wrestler and Batman trained his life to master his sense and where did he trained in Law School?
I guess you have seen Gotham tv series where someone did the same thing in final scene?
Which episode are going to use on Christmas, Christmas with the Joker or Holiday Knights?
I thought an idea for that Harvey Dent would be split out of both Two Face and the Judge by some new friends from high places (taking inspiration from the 90’s Hulk cartoon where Banner and Hulk are separated from each other) and where Two Face is a blue Hulk like monster in a justice league episode
Dcau Harvey had military background training as he was in the air force which could explain him knowing how to scrap and how to use guns. Maybe he used those magnets he has to help climb his way up.
Harvey probably bought the suit online as it's just a robe and wig so all he needed to do was glue the wig on a black mask and he's done.
Really enjoying your videos, felt I should give something lol
Thank you so much, that’s very kind 🫡
I always thought "over the edge" would be the best choice for tnba’s finale
The Judge was such an amazing and interesting character as the idea of Harvey Dent creating a 3rd persona to fight crime was a unique especially as he already had a Jekyll Vs Hyde spilt personality going on anyway, it was definitely something the show should have explored more if TNBA continued because it truly showed how far into the dark side gone Batman's friend had truly gone
Oh I am so looking forward to the gray ghost. The Legacy character as he was voiced by Adam West.
I hope you enjoy it!
A perennial favorite of mine, "Beware the Gray Ghost". Not even The Fairly OddParents' Catman and that Kim Possible ep featuring a Batman-esque Adam West character can surpass it in terms of pathos.
@@michaelandreipalon359The phrase your looking for is "The Fearless Ferret." I think the character's name was Timmothy North.
@@Dbzmaster159 Many thanks!
IMO Judgement Day was the only time TNBA Two Face felt like BTAS Two Face. They took a lot of his depth from BTAS away like his friendship with Bruce, Harvey's struggle with his other personality, him sometimes being more vigilante than villain and so on and made TNBA Harvey just a gangster.
Excellent video
I think the judge has a really cool concept and design. They definitely deserve to come back. Maybe red hood style where it's someone completely new in the costume. Maybe mix in a bit of the old lore where the judge is. A character that perceives Batman as letting someone close to them die because of his no kill rule
0:41 Is that Post-Crisis Catman? If so, BOOK IT, SELINA!!! SOMEBODY CALL SHER KHAN OR ASLAN OR THE YULE CAT OR SOMETHING!
Love these videos your doing such an amazing job please don't stop what your doing I always look forward to your next video!
This may not seem relevant to this video specifically, but I kinda wish DC made stories set exclusively in Earth-3, with the Crime Syndicate and their Justice League.
I imagine Owlman's version of Two-Face would have originally been a corrupt defense attorney until he ended up getting attacked and horribly scarred by someone seeking justice for the murder of a relative or close friend, who's killer Earth-3 Harvey helped get off death row on a technicality. His scar leaves him not only mentally wounded, but he ends up getting disbarred and his own family abandons him for no longer meeting the standards of excellence and perfection he once did.
Betrayed, abandoned, forsaken, and shown the true error of his corrupt ways, Earth-3 Harvey's mind shatters and all that's left is the urge to bring justice to the lawless world. He becomes the very symbol of the law itself. His lair, the Courtroom. His sidekicks, the Jury. His weapon, the Gavel.
He becomes *The Judge.*
I would like to read this story lol
This is fucking awesome
Honestly JL vs the Fatal Five and Death in the Family where mt favorite bit appearances of Two Faces. Showing a very different side to him than we usually see. From him giving Red Robin Jason a scathing speech about how he basically spat on Batman's legacy to him standing up for and making a small friendship with Starboy.
The weird thing about the Judge is how he's a combat beast who can easily batter Killer Croc when regular Two Face is competent but not particularly exceptional as a fighter.
The Judge is rumored to be in a lost Golden Age comic book coming after Harvey Dent or rather Harvey Kent seemingly reforms and gets his face fixed as you would well know Two-Face reformed in the Golden Age however Harvey still felt guilty for all the things he did so an alternate personality enveloped known as the Judge and he went on to fight for justice and you should know the rest. What I'm saying is he might have appeared in the Golden Age as a lost comic i.e. creepypasta style.
I love the comic book judge’s hypocrisy
The Judge could have been greatly utilized by Task Force X either as a vigilante or jailer for renegade criminal mercenaries.
Judge could have been a true threat to Joker if Harvey's morale had the better of him.
I'd love to see a comic where Two-Face rehabilitates by still having a Coin to flip
But it's blank on both sides.
So it's like a cigarette patch for him allow himself to flip a coin, but with no result.
I think if the judge doesn’t know he’s also two face, then he does know, he just doesn’t care. Almost like a robot, if they’re guilty, they deserve his wrath no matter how they are
Imagine a What If story where BTAS Batman actually offers Two-Face to be one of his allies. Think Suicide Squad but no neck bombs.
I feel like that would definitely be an interesting idea.
Thanks for the Video!
Thanks for watching!
@@SerumLake No Worries!
I just recently found this channel and I'm so glad I subscribed. 😀 I loved your video about The Judge, including the many references to Batman comics with special emphasis on BGA #12.
Welcome aboard 🫡
@@SerumLake Much appreciated. 🙂 My pleasure.
In the Batman comics, the character of the Judge has potential to become a standalone character if separated from Two-Face. This idea is similar to the Teen Titans cartoon episode where Red X returns and it's revealed that someone stole Robin's Red X suit and became the new Red X. The Judge could similarly be portrayed as someone who takes on the persona of the Judge after Two-Face's demise.
I think Two Face is actually just big Bad Harve and Harvey Merged. After he bacame TwoFace BBH never really seemed seperate from Harvey like before.
An adaptation of The Judge also appears in one of the later seasons of the TV show Gotham, this time without ties to Two Face
Judge Dredd without the gun.
But with a Sword, a more Personal Weapon
The Judge: I am the Law
Damn that original Judge story is dark as hell... Poor daughter...
Great video! Unfortunately it reminded me of the time Harvey became One Face in the comics
Nice Joker doddles you've shown after talking about the comic book inspirations I don't like the Janus personality I honestly preferred the Judge who is an anti-hero/anti-villain with no face the true third personality having no face makes sense cuz he's the perfect mixture of Harvey Dent and Two-Face/Big Bad Harvey someone who is an anti-hero or anti-villain depending on your perspective someone who uses Two-Face/Big Bad Harvey's violence and brutality to do justice rather than Janus personality who doesn't do anything for justice and commits crime.
I have to say, it's almost a staple of the series to have tragic villains: Mr. Freeze, Two-Face, Ace, a case could be made to say that Catwoman is a tragic villain, she and batman are so into each other but they can never be together because of her kleptomania, sorta like an alternative version of Romeo & Juliet.
he looks like the ghost of cremas future .
There is an argument to be made with Twoface being in Archam during the fatal 5 movie. I mean, he is still there, meaning he has at least stopped using the revolving door. He also showed signs of trying to correct his actions, and he took Starboy under his wing. I think this shows he is getting better, probably good therapy. As to why he seems to have been there so long, he did do alot of major crimes, he has to have many many years he has to serve. But, again, it looks like he is taking advantage of the help he needs, so the time can only aid in his recovery. I wish real prisons could figure that out.
This episode ALWAYS stuck with me. Even after all these years.
Im not sure why, but when i think of the Judge personality of Two-Face in BTAS i cant help but think of Azrael, the Sword, the violent vigilante, the choir as he appears, the looming presence.
Maybe thats why i enjoyed the episode a lot, i Really like Azrael (when he Is His own thing rather than edgy Batman), but i Understand why a lot of people dont like him.
Maybe the Judge is something of an BTAS Azrael, in your Bane video It seems the creators werent that interésted in Bane as "the Man who broke Batman" so i Guess "The Catholic Zealot that usurped Batman" would be even less interesting in their eyes.
I may be reaching, but perhaps the Judge its their Azrael, a crazed vigilante willing to kill villians for the sake of a Greater porpouse, in this case being justice instead of God and religión.
Probably just coincidence, but Maxie Zeus mistakes Two-Face for Janus (and other inmates for other deities) when he is committed to Arkham in BTAS.
I like the judge cause it feels like it's the final solution that Harvey could come up with, like the judge is Harvey's big red button
Apparently i’ve heard this episode was adapted from a two-part story from shadow of the bat, but they’re some differences.
Two-Face being given a rigged coin remind me of Arkham Asylum a serious house on serious Earth where are one of the treatments they give him an Arkham Asylum is very similar
I actually disagree about seeing Harvey in Fatal Five as being sad. In the movie, he is shown to have much better control over his anger and even protects Star Boy from the other inmates. If anything, his appearance in the movie is proof that his treatment is working.
The Judge is an AMAZING concept and one I hope gets more mileage in future Batmedia!
But also, to me, "Judgement Day" feels like a weird copy-paste of _Mask of the Phantasm._
1: New vigilante picks off criminals (though this one never gets to kill, because kids show).
2: Corrupt councilman involved (though he works with the vigilante and gets off better than Reeves did)
3: Said vigilante turns out to be someone close to Bruce (only here it's his friend).
I judge you guilty of making another great little video.
SUPER NICE
**mentions Gargoyles and Mighty Ducks**
And now all my childhood favorites are mention in one video.
I’m a bit curious where Harvey learned to use a sword in his Judge persona.
Judge also had a cool theme.
I completely missed out on The Mighty Ducks getting a cartoon adaptation starring actual ducks.
Call me crazy but i would love an entire show about the judge
Just think about this If Bruce told Harvey about He’s Batman there wouldn’t be anything for Robin it would be Batman and The Judge
Probably the best version of an anti-batman ever.
I can’t wait for the Ultimate 2-Hour Two-Face Teir-List video at 500k
I think if you put all of my two-face videos together it may already be 2 hours long...
@@SerumLake While yes this is correct, I would love to see you cover all the Two-Faces (or at least the ones you find interesting)
Surprised to see Mighty Ducks: The Animated Series here. Still, Spawn and Gargoyles are more better and nostalgic to me.
1:56: Why are such inconsistent colorings a comic book norm back then?
I sure heavily sympathize with the Judge more than Lock-Up when it came to their necessary vigilante efforts; even J.C. Corcoran, despite being the true villain of the episode, had a huge point saying that Batman's life-saving actions on villains feels ultimately too lenient and thus pointless. *Batman Beyond proves that point, since Terry McGinnis occasionally not needing to avoid killing sure lead to better results.*
Well, will now await the Gray Ghost vid. Hope Adam West is just hanging out with Kevin Conroy at this point up above.
2:35 so not only is he condiming batman for taking justice into his own hands while also doing it himself while also kidnaping a boy he also blames batman for blinding his daughter even tho he was 1 commiting murders and 2 was the one who shot his own daughter
Hypocrite barely describes him thays down right delusional
Lore of The True Face of Justice? | The Judge | The New Batman Adventures momentum 100
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@SerumLake
Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't Jason Todd do a similar thing as two face in his long term game in Under the Red Hood; where Jason offers protection to the top 8 but drug dealers to out an out force black mask's hand to work with the joker?
Something similar, yes. He allowed the gangs to keep operating so long as they followed his rules. No selling to kids or near schools.
I always figured Two Face was Dent and Big Bad Harv merging together to create one single identity where neither of the former two personalities are ever truly dominate over the other and is always split 50 50 between good and bad, although for plot convivence it always seems to lean more towards bad than good.
Another theory I had: I think the Judge personality emerged when the evil half began to take over completely and in order to compensate for this lack of balance, decided to do a hard turn by becoming uncompromising vigilante and I think this is supported by looking at how Two Face changed between BTAS and the New Adventures. In the former while he was still a hardcore criminal there was sometimes a glimmer of good intentions behind his actions like in Two Face part two where he's trying to take down Rupert Thorn, though granted he's most certainly driven in part by revenge for Thorn ruining his life but you can also read it as him wanting to actually fix Gotham by taking out it's number one crime lord. Then Cut to New adventures where he tries to have Tim Drake killed and holds the city for ransom with toxic gas with no other motivation besides money. The difference is stark and It would also would explain why Batman no longer holds anything back when facing his former friend and just treats him like any of his other rogues because he knows he's too far gone by that point.
The Mighty Ducks has a connection to BTAS? Interesting!
Everything has a connection to Batman in some way or another.
i consider btas, taobr, and tnba to all be one series. because in all honesty the only thing seperating tnba is the change of art style.
The fact that they share the same continuity backs up your point of view. Although I would also say that the writing was pretty different in TNBA.
They could get away with more horrific things happening (see Growing Pains, Chemistry, Mad Love etc.) but they were also a bit more diverse in terms of tone (see Beware The Creeper, The Demon Within, Critters)
I also consider all 109 episodes to make up one show, but I'll always associate TNBA with Kids'WB! whereas BTAS and TAoB&R will be more closely connected to Fox Kids and Cartoon Network in my mind as a die-hard DCAU fan.
The Judge is interesting in the sense that he, essentially, breaks the "duality" of Two-Face. We'd say it's a shame we never really got to see the original Harvey Dent attempt to interact with either of them, because that duality element is something that's extremely prevalent in the "one alter side vs other alter side" in plural characters. The Judge does throw a wrench into it, but we're also not allowed to see the three person dynamic come into play. It sorta more swaps out one for the other in the duality aspect? If you were a kid watching this as your first BTAS episode, you'd just assume it was Two-Face and The Judge.
It's a funny thing, actually, cause we've found one of the easier ways to avoid a lot of the pitfalls of system depictions in media is the three alter system. Sort of inspired by the Ace Attorney entity Uendo Toneido, a rakugo artist playing traditional 3 character stories. Perhaps because it becomes a "oh they have to learn to share" versus "only one can come out on top" type of story...?
Regardless, we think The Judge is an interesting *start* of a character, but it looks like they were somewhat uninterested in exploring him as an entity. For it to be the last episode of the series, is... well, you can probably already guess how we feel it's emblematic of the DCAU's tendency to treat plurality as shock value and not much more. (A couple days ago we found out Lex Luthor started hallucinating talking to Braniac in later Justice League seasons, and most characters look at him like he's crazy. Weeren't the biggest fan ;^^ )
So as a final note, I'd say we actually do like The Judge. He represents what we think Two-Face really should be as a vigilante, and doesn't even need the coin gimmick. (Tbh. Sometimes we wonder if the luck element of two-face is oftentimes conflicting with the alter element). It's just the greater narrative surrounding this character that brings him down a notch. (Seriously, we watched the justice league movie and they say he's in there cause he "thinks he's two people" and not their anger issues, eeurgh...)
Also, eeugh, the amount Harvey Dent gets whitewashed in the comics... Hard to swallow that's the same character sometimes.
I always appreciate your insights into plurality, so thanks for sharing.
Yes, I too dislike the whitewashing of Two-Face. He’s very clearly African American, or at the very least biracial, in BTAS.
@@SerumLakeI never recall seeing Two-Face depicted as African American in the mainline comics and in terms of BTAS, I have genuinely never gotten the impression in my entire life that Harvey was supposed to be depicted as African American, not that I'd have a problem if he were. I sometimes thought he may be part Hispanic but generally I always got the impression that he was Caucasian. Whitewashing Two-Face is something I genuinely never heard before recently. Again, I'm Greek and I see people with tan skin on a daily basis and so to me it never seemed like anything different. People seem to have gotten the same impression about Lex Luthor in Superman TAS but he was based on Telly Savalas who is Greek and naturally looks like that.
@@supremegroden3021 not in BTAS. Remember that at the time Billy Dee Williams played Harvey Dent in Tim Burton’s films, and the BTAS crew were instructed to follow the Burton films as closely as possible.
@@The_Phantasm yes, you’re right that he was always white in the comics, but he was played by Billy Dee Williams in Tim Burton’s Batman. As you know the BTAS crew was instructed to mirror the Burton films as much as possible.
@@SerumLake A few years ago there was a comic set in the Burton universe with a Billy Dee Williams style Two Face.
Definitely a more interesting take and change on a villain like calendar man
Two-Face is not a persona of its own but rather Harvey and Big Bad Harv co-piloting their shared body.