Puff-Puff Scene: when one or many characters take beverages / recreational products in order to feel some kind of way ie. "That 70s Show" or "Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas" *I'm really trying not to say words that TH-cam would punish me for
DRUGS TITS AND CARCASSES! Couldn't get to half your video through all that self-censorship. And you're really monotonous about it, at least don't stop to point at it every time.
I was gonna say that too, sometimes guy is in bed staring at the ceiling, the alarm goes off he gets out of bed in a gloomy mood, cut to shower or brushing teeth looking in the mirror.
Guy in bed staring at the ceiling, the alarm goes off he gets out of bed in a gloomy mood, cut to him in the shower or brushing teeth looking in the mirror. There's usually a cat or a dog in the house, sometimes a girlfriend who cannot be bothered with him.
I've been in film school 3 years now and been involved in many different projects. Here's what I've learned how to avoid "student film" look. - Invest sound. Immersive SFX increases production quality. - Cut the shit and go to business. Every shot has a meaning. Don't waste time on something that doesn't affect the story. - Establishment of nuances and execution makes the audience feel good when they catch neat details. - show, don't tell. No need to tell the audience what is going on. - Shooting environment, how and why it carries the story, what aspects glue the attention.
mostly agree. recognized the imperfect translations (but I'm not even that good at my first language). not sure I agree with focusing on nuances and shooting environment/location since I'm a proponent of characters driving story and actors' performances dictating what stays in the edit. fully agree on getting to business and not wasting time on things that don't affect the story. cheers. a lot to process there
@@AMattBlackFilter Thank you for your response! Allow me to correct myself. I meant by establishing nuances and details within the story, for an example, the main character makes a promise (small or big), which is then on executed. Comedy gag is a bit like a establishment/execution. The first time the audience get the joke and later on it can be shaped by how it's delivered, like with an unexpected twist. Of course, characters drive the story forward. An interesting story can be told even in a blank space. When it comes to environment and sets, very often a larger budget of required but with ''student budget'' film creators are forced with cheap yet creative decisions (like recycling materials). By paying attention to space of the character, foreground and background props, film's production design increases.
yeah. i'm a big fan of setups and payoffs. the idea of a character making a promise and then that coming back to them later is interesting - i like that
I don't get why short films become a vehicle for self-indulgence. Hands sticking out of a window of a moving car, women staring up into the sky with their eyes closed, inserting mundane grooming scenes when the characters should be pushing the narrative forward.
this is such an amazing video, simply for the fact that, it feels like you aren’t talking down on these like most other people do. you’re talking to us, addressing it, giving solutions and it made me so happy. simply for the fact that i’ve been kind of doubting myself lately and this video just made me realise, i should just make it and get better. these student cliches that apply to me i will just only grow out of. as a young filmmaker (18, based in the uk) who’s trying to stay as active as possible before i start my film course in september.. this video just felt so great to watch. so thank you, im going to go straight to my script right now and edit it!
Ending with “it was all a dream” can be great. Especially if it’s slightly ambiguous eg Inception, In Bruges, Once Upon A Time In America, Atlanta, 7 Psychopaths
The worst cliche for me is in police drama when one of the detectives has an “epiphany” and says sometimes the effect of: “We’ve been looking at this the wrong way” number two also in police drama: “You’re getting to close to the case” yawn.
I heard a quote along the lines of "there are two types of shor films: short films and short films that are too long". If you need 40 minutes to tell a story, i don't think you went into the thinking process of "less is more". Personally i think the shorter a short film is, the more impressed i am with the storytelling and overall prodcution.
2:52 Gotta disagree. Filmmaking, any art, is just expressing what you find interesting. You can’t change what you would have done because you’re afraid other people won’t like it. And besides, if something is interesting to you, there will be people in the world who also find it interesting.
But i think it is important to show the 'mundane' subject in question, through a lense that makes it more interesting and puts a spin to it. As if you're looking through someone else's (the director's) eye. Why would people go to the movie theater if the things onscreen arent' different from the things offscreen?
I really respect that you don't beat around the bush. You fill the 10 minutes with valuable information and I completely agree (even though in the past I've been guilty of relying on like all of these cliches hahaha).
Woah, did this finally start to take off? I remember watching this around when it came out, and being confused that you didn't have more subscribers / this video didn't have more views. Glad to see it getting the attention it deserves, man!
When movie start with a narrators 'My name is Jose and I'm in a medical school or someshit for 3 years now' My brain is completely turn off, it just mean you can't tell an actual story, period.
Pretty comprehensive list, and I agree on all points. Your honorable mention, bad audio, is in my experience what makes most student-, indie or short films unwatchable. Funny that, planning with audio in mind, you can avoid a lot of the other cliches you mention. Cutting back on dialog makes you less reliant on good sound, frees up camerawork as most tiny productions will only have one camera, with probably a local mic. Even if a boom somehow finds it's way into production, it's probably not gonna be marked. With dialog cut, you're also less reliant on good acting, hell, even less reliant on a good writer altogether. The only thing I thought to add is, shooting with an incomplete script, or even worse, making it up along the way. Most newcomers I'd reckon just wanna "get to the fun stuff", rather than spend significant time writing.
Really good points - IDK how I missed 'shooting an unfinished/evolving script' - I've walked off films bc I either discovered they were way off script or that they never finished the script to begin with
One way to make getting ready interesting: watch the opening sequence of The Devil Wears Prada. The scene is used to show the contrast between our main character and people who are apart of the world she’s about to join.
Well, I kinda disagree with the dialogue cliche. One of the best ways to save on budget is if you have your characters interact & engage with each other in a single location. And there have been many great films, even feature length films where all characters do is talk. Films like Clerks, My Dinner with Andre, The Fifth Seal. Some of the greatest indie films were films that utilized this concept, notably films from Jim Jarmusch like Night on Earth. I think centering your story around this sort of dialogue driven narrative isn't so bad. Unless you mean when films that have a lot of dialogue that don't develop into anything, then yeah, I would say that is a mistake.
Also completely disagree with the 'incomprehensible' cliche. The term "incomprehensible" is incredibly subjective. I'd argue that the very first filmmaking projects you make should be tools to showcase the most radical sides of you as an artist. You say that "TV Shows aren't incomprehensible", well, yeah, that's because TV Shows usually have millions of dollars and teams of producers behind them, they can't really afford to take huge creative liberties because of those reasons. The great advantage of working with low-budget or an independent budget is that you get to do whatever you want! You have full creative control both during shooting and in the editing room of whatever vision you'd like to express. (obviously, as long as your vision is within budget. You can't make Interstellar or anything.) If you're a talented person, somebody who clearly has the potential to influence the art of film down the road, then you should show it in your first projects! These abstract, incomprehensible ideas should be encouraged. I mean, look at the first short films from the greatest directors working today. Scorsese's or Christopher Nolan's first short films could probably be categorized as weird and artsy, but it paved their style in a unique way.
To your point on dialogue: I agree and especially as a major focus when crafting a short film since dialogue is cheap. I meant 'too much dialogue' more in your latter example where the audience gets lost/loses the plot because dialogue is being used instead of telling a story that is inherently visual -- otherwise it'd be better done as a play or a written fiction -- so I think we're more or less in agreement there. When I addressed 'incomprehensible' I think I may have been too vague. 'Incomprehensible' isn't the same as 'abstract' or even 'weird and artsy' and I'd argue both Scorsese and Nolan are full-on masters of taking artistic movies and making them still easy to comprehend because of their focus on clarity and precision. Recutting "Memento" into chronological order would make for a pretty simple and straightforward story because if Nolan had written a more complex story and then tried to cut it the way he did with "Memento" I'd argue it'd almost certainly become incomprehensible -- and based on his meticulous nature I'm sure he experimented with that before deciding on "Memento" (or probably "Following"). My point was: it's easy to trick yourself (and your team) into thinking a film is edgy or boundary-pushing where it's actually incomprehensible and the easiest way to regain perspective is to show it to a bunch of people who don't have a stake in you or the project in order to get more objective feedback. *also: abstract films are fun but there much harder to sell producers on because they don't tend to prove your team can tell a story and producers are almost always looking for stories because there's just a far smaller market for abstract ideas vs conventional narratives Cheers on the conversation
@@AMattBlackFilter Sure and I definitely agree that pragmatically & strategically it's a much better decision to go for a more conventional narrative over something abstract, but I don't think that should apply for new artists, especially very young artists. It's the same principle of - don't let your child in preschool learn anatomy rules for drawing, let them draw however way they want and develop whatever weird and abstract style they like, when they grow up as more refined artists (assuming they're still drawing) they'll learn all the proper drawing principles necessary and ALSO incorporate the style that they've establed at a very young age. This is largely how artists grow to have unique visions. So if you're making a short film I believe it is your prerogative to shoot for those abstract ideas. If it turns out to be incomprehensible, then too bad. You couldn't do it. These abstract short-films are a great way to tell if the writer/director has a vision or not. It either works brilliantly, or it falls apart. There's no in-between, unlike a more conventional traditional narrative, where you can rely on screenwriting rules and advice from your lecturers. If you can't really get your authentic idea to work, then maybe directing isn't for you. But you are absolutely right that sometimes directors can get pretty stuck-up with their abstract ideas (I think the film Mr Nobody is a good example of this). And you're also right about usually the problem being lack of communication from the writers/directors to the rest of the staff, lack of test screenings etc. But my point is you're not supposed to be the director that could make a mistake like that in the first place. Ultimately it's a much better career choice to be as radical and crazy and ambitious as an artist, ASSUMING you have the talent to back it up. A director that has made a name for himself in festivals & certain film circles with their ambitious & out-of-the-norm short films I think has a much bigger chance to have full creative control from studios later down his career. Alternatively, if he's taken the conventional route, sure, he might have a few gigs directing some projects, but he's much less likely to make a name for himself, and most likely he'd be percieved as somebody replacable for studios. Thank you for this video regardless, I think the rest of your points are all pretty spot on. I checked out some of your other videos and I really appreciate the straight-forward explainations. It's a breath of fresh air in this TH-cam film industry bubble.
Fair enough. I'm definitely of the mindset that short films are a tool for learning fundamentals and waiting to experiment once the filmmaker has a better understanding of all the tools (because making any film is extremely hard) but I do agree with your perspective that creators have a responsibility to experiment and explore and, to your implication, I do agree that many of the biggest directors' earliest works are more experimental (and often better/more personal) where once they have money and responsibilities there's a lot more restrictions on what they can do creatively (usually). Thanks for the convo. I hope my earlier note didn't come off as aggressive or defensive and I appreciate that you came here to discuss. Cheers!
And then you have Japanese novels/manga/anime like the Monogatari series where almost the entire narrative is carried by long conversations. It’s a nice break from “guy solves all his problems by shooting things.”
😂😂😂 Dang it. I have a tooth brushing scene in one of my shorts. But it is a nice little reveal-shot, soooooo.... maybe I did not completely fucked up my career, right? 😅
There was a group of teenagers doing short films where I live and they had a pretty good start, but then they decided it's time to start making 30 min+ movies. It was mostly talking, showing nothing important and trying to make a high-budget film without the... budget. They disbanded pretty soon after.
a lot of this feels opinionated more than actually true, i think people have different styles and if they’re amazing with camera flairs or a long conversation of a film then that’s how they do it, it can be done wrong but absolutely shouldn’t be written off
This is great! The only ones I personally disagree with are the specialty camera shot and the incomprehensible story. I feel if as long as it makes the audience “feel” what you’re saying, you’re getting it right. But I can see how they can be considered tropes. Overall- great video and a lot of knowledge. Also love how real you are!
(Supposed to be) a professional hitman racking the slide of Glock right before the job. (NOBODY carries Glock with empty chamber.) On top of that, it's a big close up shot, clearly showing the internals when the ejection port is opened. Telling the world that it's an airsoft, and no research had been done.
totally agree. actors need to be treated differently than others onset for a bunch of reasons but the big one I always go back to is that their job is their emotions whereas a crew-member's emotions don't tend to show up in the footage
Me watching this when I have bang bang shoot shoot, narration, flashbacks, and tons of dialogue. But I'm different and edgy, basically a writing god. Yeah, I,ll just write something else 😬
6:45 a good example of the brushing teeth one is Stranger than fiction w Will Ferrell, I don't wanna spoil it besides the fact that the mundane becomes different. great movieeeee
i kinda disagree with the bad sfx/vfx? I don't think cheap has to mean bad. I did Killer Carnival for Goatstories which was a low budget student film and I think it's cool how much we leaned on the practical effects :)
fair enough. definitely bad vfx is worse than bad special fx. i feel like YT has really upped the minimum acceptable standard of vfx which is both good and bad for filmmakers
Super emotional guttural breakup scenes or confrontations about cheating. Feels like I am watching actors, not a story. It's exactly like what you said about death being the center.
Although I'm not a filmmaker, this video was very interesting. I could think of examples for almost every item on his list. Nice work! I have a small addition. I wish filmmakers would stop adding pointless scenes of men urinating. Those scenes are stuck into sooooo many movies, and they usually have ZERO to contribute to the story. They usually just distract from the scene. One notable exception is from "Crocodile Dundee 2." Dundee sneaks up on a DEA agent (Stephen Root, aka "stapler guy") who is urinating in a public restroom. Dundee holds a knife up to the agent's throat, and then up to his genitals, to get important information from him. (No genitals were actually shown because the audience had an imagination.) After Dundee leaves, the agent looks down as he zips up his pants and says very quietly, "How ya doin', buddy?" Such a great scene from 1988 that still stands out in my memory.
Really nice video with good tips thank you. One thing I pointed out: TH-cam would not punish you for saying number #5 wrong but I understand why for the puff-puff example
that's fine, make 3 more cliche films, 7 more cliche films, just don't expect them to be any all that interesting because you're treading overdone grounds, they are just your way of learning and trying out things before you actually make your next project that isn't a "5 minute cliche aesthetic getting ready film", but maybe a narrative 19 minute film instead
There are some good thoughts here but are we seriously not allowed to say “Swords and Sandals” anymore???? Am I just an old man? What the hell is a puff puff scene?
How to avoid cliches: Figure out your motivation for making a movie. Boring films are created to fulfill shallow needs such as fame, money, and approval. Interesting films are created because the director has something they need to say, and film is the best medium to express it. If the director, cast, and editors understand and believe in the vision and that vision comes from an authentic place, cliches will naturally fall to the side.
From what I know about TH-cam rules, your channel isn't eligible for monetization yet, so you don't have to worry about saying the "bad" words because it won't affect you at all.
This video was good but it would have been a lot better without tip toeing around the actual subject matter for half of the points. I get it, youtube or whatever but like cmon. Just say knives. Or guns. Or sex. It's like people saying "unalive" on tiktok.
Liked all your points except #1, what’s the problem with a young filmmaker wanting to shoot an action scene? Didn’t like how you said it made you “uncomfortable”seeing a set attempting one and saying it’s like playing with toys is rather condescending. Are short films just reserved for every genre except action? When you’re making an action movie whether it be a short or a feature, the action is just as important as the dialogue and the story setup for the action. I could understand if you said don’t attempt action that is out of your ability (whether it be for safety or cost reasons) but to just say that wanting to do an action scene is lazy is an extremely misguided thought in my opinion.
not 'action scenes.' Items/props that require an armorer (words that I can't say because they definitely have those words flagged as inappropriate) action scenes are great as long as they advance the plot / introduce new escalations to the larger story
Toothbrush can work. Instead of starting with a husband drinking coffee in the kitchen in the morning, talking to his wife...he starts in bed@tge alarm...wife in the shower...cut to Toothbrush and mirror...then coffee in the kitchen.
i didnt understand the thrird of what you said becouse of this “youtube ll punish me thing”. I dont think it will and you can safely say anything and people ll understand your video
I disagree on #6, because fancy stuff can make yor film look so much better. I dont have the budget or the resources but if I had them, I would definitely use them. Why not? I also disagree on #4. You can do great things using death as a narrative tool. Maybe not even sadness but a look to human violence. Whats wrong with using Death? Idk about #4. I kinda agree there. #3 could work if done well, but I guess I agree. #2 could be good if you catch the audience, but you have to avoid being cheesy. #1...I gueeeess you could say its a cliche, but it could be good to start as a practice.
Can we please stop using baby terms like “person expiring” “doin it scenes” “puff puff scenes” and such? I know the fear but this is being way overly cautious and muddles the point
Some good points but some unusual terms I found in the vid and what I believe is the translation for other boomers were Expire = dying and doin it = sex puff-puff scenes = bong/joint/weed scene but #1 still need to have a think abut
What's the point of Mumblecore? Is it just lazy script writing? I imagine there is always a risk of the dialogue and "plot", such as it is, fizzling out without telling a story.
This is just bad advice. These all just seem like these are cliches that bother you personally rather than actual, tangible advice. Almost every single one of these has been used to great effect by talented short filmmakers all the time, concepts about expiring, puff use, and shooty slices are in a lot of stories because people find that interesting. And I’ve seen a lot of great short filmmakers say some great stuff with all of them. Im not saying this out of arrogance, because I’ve definitely seen really bad student films use all these. But I think what you are trying to point out is that most of these bad students films are using these cliche’s in substitute of a compelling story rather then in service of one. That’s the real problem, that students lack the confidence or creativity to make a really meaningful or engaging story, and thus use these as crutches. If you want real advice, if you don’t have a story that feels real and exciting, than no amount of fancy camera tricks or smarmy dialogue is gonna cover that up. Remember that each scene should have an arc for the characters, and that scenes are in service of the story. It’s totally cool if you just wanna make a edgy, shooty bang bang kinda short film, just have an actual story to go along with it, and have it be one that gets a reaction out of you and the people around you. But at the end of the day, none of us really have a formula to this. But this advice isn’t gonna help.
@@AMattBlackFilter well it's an adaptation of 'the Egg' and we show the afterlife and a chat with God so it's okay ig? Death plays only a little role in the theme and story
Almost every movie in the GRADUATE film class has sex scenes. Why. It's awkward and I feel like it's so that the director can look at some beans. I haven't seen one film done well.
Puff-Puff Scene: when one or many characters take beverages / recreational products in order to feel some kind of way ie. "That 70s Show" or "Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas"
*I'm really trying not to say words that TH-cam would punish me for
DRUGS TITS AND CARCASSES! Couldn't get to half your video through all that self-censorship. And you're really monotonous about it, at least don't stop to point at it every time.
that was literally my first student film lmfao
You gotta be more descriptive
When the short starts with alarm clock that wakes up the main character.
classic
It's a cliché to even call this a cliché at this point.
@@NostalgiNorden Coming back around to cool!
I was gonna say that too, sometimes guy is in bed staring at the ceiling, the alarm goes off he gets out of bed in a gloomy mood, cut to shower or brushing teeth looking in the mirror.
Ick omg
Guy in bed staring at the ceiling, the alarm goes off he gets out of bed in a gloomy mood, cut to him in the shower or brushing teeth looking in the mirror. There's usually a cat or a dog in the house, sometimes a girlfriend who cannot be bothered with him.
that's a classic
i literally thought this would be #1
The main character is followed by a shadowy figure who is a representation of their anxiety/trauma
"Puff puff", "People expiring", "Doin' it"... Jesus Christ, is TH-cam for 5 years olds now?
I agree it’s insanity. Also, don’t forget “bang bang poke poke” like what the actual fuck?
Bent to TH-cam filter words or taste the consequences of being demonetized.
I've been in film school 3 years now and been involved in many different projects.
Here's what I've learned how to avoid "student film" look.
- Invest sound. Immersive SFX increases production quality.
- Cut the shit and go to business. Every shot has a meaning. Don't waste time on something that doesn't affect the story.
- Establishment of nuances and execution makes the audience feel good when they catch neat details.
- show, don't tell. No need to tell the audience what is going on.
- Shooting environment, how and why it carries the story, what aspects glue the attention.
mostly agree. recognized the imperfect translations (but I'm not even that good at my first language).
not sure I agree with focusing on nuances and shooting environment/location since I'm a proponent of characters driving story and actors' performances dictating what stays in the edit.
fully agree on getting to business and not wasting time on things that don't affect the story.
cheers. a lot to process there
@@AMattBlackFilter Thank you for your response! Allow me to correct myself.
I meant by establishing nuances and details within the story, for an example, the main character makes a promise (small or big), which is then on executed. Comedy gag is a bit like a establishment/execution. The first time the audience get the joke and later on it can be shaped by how it's delivered, like with an unexpected twist.
Of course, characters drive the story forward. An interesting story can be told even in a blank space. When it comes to environment and sets, very often a larger budget of required but with ''student budget'' film creators are forced with cheap yet creative decisions (like recycling materials). By paying attention to space of the character, foreground and background props, film's production design increases.
yeah. i'm a big fan of setups and payoffs. the idea of a character making a promise and then that coming back to them later is interesting - i like that
What the hell happened to TH-cam that you can't say sex or die or any of these other words? What ridiculous level of censorship we've entered.
sexdie
I kn0w r19ht?
@@ernestocaro9802 h4h4, l0l
Yeah, youtube wants to keep advertisers happy so hard
You can say these words. This is just an example of being overly cautious.
I don't get why short films become a vehicle for self-indulgence. Hands sticking out of a window of a moving car, women staring up into the sky with their eyes closed, inserting mundane grooming scenes when the characters should be pushing the narrative forward.
agreed
totally
The “making coffee” sequence at the start of the short drives me nuts.
Unending misery : where the filmmakers decide to make a 'serious ' film by highlighting the hopeless plight of the protagonist, in pursuit of awards.
Maybe too broad for it to be a cliche?
My favorite short film cliche is when a character mentions "the incident" or things have been different ever since "the incident"
The bad acting and bad sound are not cliches though. They're just bad filmmaking.
mostly agree. i think of sound as an on/off switch for audience acceptance. acting is a whole nother animal
the bad acting is usually because of a lack of direction ngl
this is such an amazing video, simply for the fact that, it feels like you aren’t talking down on these like most other people do. you’re talking to us, addressing it, giving solutions and it made me so happy. simply for the fact that i’ve been kind of doubting myself lately and this video just made me realise, i should just make it and get better. these student cliches that apply to me i will just only grow out of. as a young filmmaker (18, based in the uk) who’s trying to stay as active as possible before i start my film course in september.. this video just felt so great to watch. so thank you, im going to go straight to my script right now and edit it!
right on. glad you liked it. gladder you're making your film
At ANY point of the short film: *Main character suddenly wakes up from a dream
Ending with “it was all a dream” can be great. Especially if it’s slightly ambiguous eg Inception, In Bruges, Once Upon A Time In America, Atlanta, 7 Psychopaths
I love how you’re saying this stuff😂😂 i can hear the frustration of seeing these examples hundreds of times lmaooo
only frustration when filmmakers still do these after they're told these are cliches -- which happens a lot
The worst cliche for me is in police drama when one of the detectives has an “epiphany” and says sometimes the effect of: “We’ve been looking at this the wrong way” number two also in police drama: “You’re getting to close to the case” yawn.
Hand over you (bang bang) and your badge
The I forgot I murdered someone due to drugs or mental illness cliche. I worked as a camera op or gaffer on the film like 6 times in college 😂
oh man. brutal - memento film homage?
@@AMattBlackFilter they were never that deep. 😆
I heard a quote along the lines of "there are two types of shor films: short films and short films that are too long". If you need 40 minutes to tell a story, i don't think you went into the thinking process of "less is more". Personally i think the shorter a short film is, the more impressed i am with the storytelling and overall prodcution.
I think several of these points could also apply to writing short stories or chapters in a book.
totally agree with you
2:52 Gotta disagree. Filmmaking, any art, is just expressing what you find interesting. You can’t change what you would have done because you’re afraid other people won’t like it. And besides, if something is interesting to you, there will be people in the world who also find it interesting.
But i think it is important to show the 'mundane' subject in question, through a lense that makes it more interesting and puts a spin to it. As if you're looking through someone else's (the director's) eye. Why would people go to the movie theater if the things onscreen arent' different from the things offscreen?
@@saaikanaal because it's art
I really respect that you don't beat around the bush. You fill the 10 minutes with valuable information and I completely agree (even though in the past I've been guilty of relying on like all of these cliches hahaha).
And as for nudity, if you're making a micro-budget film and using SAG-AFTRA actors, nudity and sex scenes are strictly forbidden.
Woah, did this finally start to take off? I remember watching this around when it came out, and being confused that you didn't have more subscribers / this video didn't have more views. Glad to see it getting the attention it deserves, man!
ha. ego checked, sir
Or when their sound effects are too obvious. like walking in snow or a car clutch being really unnecessarily loud
Thanks for the video, i wil most definitely be doing all of these
When movie start with a narrators 'My name is Jose and I'm in a medical school or someshit for 3 years now' My brain is completely turn off, it just mean you can't tell an actual story, period.
I mean, he’s literally telling a story. You mean tell it visually?
Pretty comprehensive list, and I agree on all points.
Your honorable mention, bad audio, is in my experience what makes most student-, indie or short films unwatchable.
Funny that, planning with audio in mind, you can avoid a lot of the other cliches you mention. Cutting back on dialog makes you less reliant on good sound, frees up camerawork as most tiny productions will only have one camera, with probably a local mic. Even if a boom somehow finds it's way into production, it's probably not gonna be marked.
With dialog cut, you're also less reliant on good acting, hell, even less reliant on a good writer altogether.
The only thing I thought to add is, shooting with an incomplete script, or even worse, making it up along the way. Most newcomers I'd reckon just wanna "get to the fun stuff", rather than spend significant time writing.
Really good points - IDK how I missed 'shooting an unfinished/evolving script' - I've walked off films bc I either discovered they were way off script or that they never finished the script to begin with
One way to make getting ready interesting: watch the opening sequence of The Devil Wears Prada.
The scene is used to show the contrast between our main character and people who are apart of the world she’s about to join.
“it was all a dream”
Well, I kinda disagree with the dialogue cliche. One of the best ways to save on budget is if you have your characters interact & engage with each other in a single location. And there have been many great films, even feature length films where all characters do is talk. Films like Clerks, My Dinner with Andre, The Fifth Seal. Some of the greatest indie films were films that utilized this concept, notably films from Jim Jarmusch like Night on Earth. I think centering your story around this sort of dialogue driven narrative isn't so bad. Unless you mean when films that have a lot of dialogue that don't develop into anything, then yeah, I would say that is a mistake.
Also completely disagree with the 'incomprehensible' cliche. The term "incomprehensible" is incredibly subjective. I'd argue that the very first filmmaking projects you make should be tools to showcase the most radical sides of you as an artist. You say that "TV Shows aren't incomprehensible", well, yeah, that's because TV Shows usually have millions of dollars and teams of producers behind them, they can't really afford to take huge creative liberties because of those reasons. The great advantage of working with low-budget or an independent budget is that you get to do whatever you want! You have full creative control both during shooting and in the editing room of whatever vision you'd like to express. (obviously, as long as your vision is within budget. You can't make Interstellar or anything.) If you're a talented person, somebody who clearly has the potential to influence the art of film down the road, then you should show it in your first projects! These abstract, incomprehensible ideas should be encouraged. I mean, look at the first short films from the greatest directors working today. Scorsese's or Christopher Nolan's first short films could probably be categorized as weird and artsy, but it paved their style in a unique way.
To your point on dialogue: I agree and especially as a major focus when crafting a short film since dialogue is cheap. I meant 'too much dialogue' more in your latter example where the audience gets lost/loses the plot because dialogue is being used instead of telling a story that is inherently visual -- otherwise it'd be better done as a play or a written fiction -- so I think we're more or less in agreement there.
When I addressed 'incomprehensible' I think I may have been too vague. 'Incomprehensible' isn't the same as 'abstract' or even 'weird and artsy' and I'd argue both Scorsese and Nolan are full-on masters of taking artistic movies and making them still easy to comprehend because of their focus on clarity and precision. Recutting "Memento" into chronological order would make for a pretty simple and straightforward story because if Nolan had written a more complex story and then tried to cut it the way he did with "Memento" I'd argue it'd almost certainly become incomprehensible -- and based on his meticulous nature I'm sure he experimented with that before deciding on "Memento" (or probably "Following").
My point was: it's easy to trick yourself (and your team) into thinking a film is edgy or boundary-pushing where it's actually incomprehensible and the easiest way to regain perspective is to show it to a bunch of people who don't have a stake in you or the project in order to get more objective feedback.
*also: abstract films are fun but there much harder to sell producers on because they don't tend to prove your team can tell a story and producers are almost always looking for stories because there's just a far smaller market for abstract ideas vs conventional narratives
Cheers on the conversation
@@AMattBlackFilter Sure and I definitely agree that pragmatically & strategically it's a much better decision to go for a more conventional narrative over something abstract, but I don't think that should apply for new artists, especially very young artists. It's the same principle of - don't let your child in preschool learn anatomy rules for drawing, let them draw however way they want and develop whatever weird and abstract style they like, when they grow up as more refined artists (assuming they're still drawing) they'll learn all the proper drawing principles necessary and ALSO incorporate the style that they've establed at a very young age. This is largely how artists grow to have unique visions. So if you're making a short film I believe it is your prerogative to shoot for those abstract ideas. If it turns out to be incomprehensible, then too bad. You couldn't do it. These abstract short-films are a great way to tell if the writer/director has a vision or not. It either works brilliantly, or it falls apart. There's no in-between, unlike a more conventional traditional narrative, where you can rely on screenwriting rules and advice from your lecturers. If you can't really get your authentic idea to work, then maybe directing isn't for you.
But you are absolutely right that sometimes directors can get pretty stuck-up with their abstract ideas (I think the film Mr Nobody is a good example of this). And you're also right about usually the problem being lack of communication from the writers/directors to the rest of the staff, lack of test screenings etc. But my point is you're not supposed to be the director that could make a mistake like that in the first place. Ultimately it's a much better career choice to be as radical and crazy and ambitious as an artist, ASSUMING you have the talent to back it up. A director that has made a name for himself in festivals & certain film circles with their ambitious & out-of-the-norm short films I think has a much bigger chance to have full creative control from studios later down his career. Alternatively, if he's taken the conventional route, sure, he might have a few gigs directing some projects, but he's much less likely to make a name for himself, and most likely he'd be percieved as somebody replacable for studios.
Thank you for this video regardless, I think the rest of your points are all pretty spot on. I checked out some of your other videos and I really appreciate the straight-forward explainations. It's a breath of fresh air in this TH-cam film industry bubble.
Fair enough. I'm definitely of the mindset that short films are a tool for learning fundamentals and waiting to experiment once the filmmaker has a better understanding of all the tools (because making any film is extremely hard) but I do agree with your perspective that creators have a responsibility to experiment and explore and, to your implication, I do agree that many of the biggest directors' earliest works are more experimental (and often better/more personal) where once they have money and responsibilities there's a lot more restrictions on what they can do creatively (usually).
Thanks for the convo. I hope my earlier note didn't come off as aggressive or defensive and I appreciate that you came here to discuss.
Cheers!
And then you have Japanese novels/manga/anime like the Monogatari series where almost the entire narrative is carried by long conversations. It’s a nice break from “guy solves all his problems by shooting things.”
😂😂😂 Dang it. I have a tooth brushing scene in one of my shorts. But it is a nice little reveal-shot, soooooo.... maybe I did not completely fucked up my career, right? 😅
we've all done it
For the uninitiated, what is a "puff puff scene" if it's not a "doing it" scene?
There was a group of teenagers doing short films where I live and they had a pretty good start, but then they decided it's time to start making 30 min+ movies. It was mostly talking, showing nothing important and trying to make a high-budget film without the... budget. They disbanded pretty soon after.
a lot of this feels opinionated more than actually true, i think people have different styles and if they’re amazing with camera flairs or a long conversation of a film then that’s how they do it, it can be done wrong but absolutely shouldn’t be written off
how did i get here, bad audio - all the obvious stuff, is obv true
@@jakemar2326but not cliches so unfitting in this video
TH-cam is gonna punish me if I said this wrong is the worst cliche
This is great! The only ones I personally disagree with are the specialty camera shot and the incomprehensible story. I feel if as long as it makes the audience “feel” what you’re saying, you’re getting it right. But I can see how they can be considered tropes. Overall- great video and a lot of knowledge. Also love how real you are!
right on, and yeah I totally agree with the audience "feel"
Guess for the last one : OMG IT WAS ALL A DREAM FIOU IM ALIVE
Nah too bad for me
(Supposed to be) a professional hitman racking the slide of Glock right before the job.
(NOBODY carries Glock with empty chamber.)
On top of that, it's a big close up shot, clearly showing the internals when the ejection port is opened.
Telling the world that it's an airsoft, and no research had been done.
If you want good acting, give your actors a little time to get 'into the moment', as it were. Don't expect them to just turn up and start 'acting'.
totally agree. actors need to be treated differently than others onset for a bunch of reasons but the big one I always go back to is that their job is their emotions whereas a crew-member's emotions don't tend to show up in the footage
Cool. I don't expect this to be a popular take but for me "emotional experience" (being all a film seems to care about) makes the list.
Really enjoyed this video! Great points and your voice is nice, subbed! :)
right on. thanks
Basically anything Quentin Tarantino does 😂 , got it
honorable mention: feet
W video, you deserve way more views
cheers
Me watching this when I have bang bang shoot shoot, narration, flashbacks, and tons of dialogue. But I'm different and edgy, basically a writing god. Yeah, I,ll just write something else 😬
always gotta get those movies out to make mental room
The toothbrushing and then the spit ugh why
So basically.... Don't be weird or experimental the only time you may have a chance to be
6:45 a good example of the brushing teeth one is Stranger than fiction w Will Ferrell, I don't wanna spoil it besides the fact that the mundane becomes different. great movieeeee
very helpfull. Cheers mate!
glad you liked it
The time a "How did I get here" is actually great is when there's a monologue that's meaningful to the development of the character like megamind.
fair. an exception to every rule. story is king
i kinda disagree with the bad sfx/vfx? I don't think cheap has to mean bad. I did Killer Carnival for Goatstories which was a low budget student film and I think it's cool how much we leaned on the practical effects :)
fair enough. definitely bad vfx is worse than bad special fx. i feel like YT has really upped the minimum acceptable standard of vfx which is both good and bad for filmmakers
@@AMattBlackFilter yeah, i never thought about how youtube´s editing raises a bar for filmmakers, that´s really interesting!
Super emotional guttural breakup scenes or confrontations about cheating. Feels like I am watching actors, not a story. It's exactly like what you said about death being the center.
well said
Although I'm not a filmmaker, this video was very interesting. I could think of examples for almost every item on his list.
Nice work!
I have a small addition. I wish filmmakers would stop adding pointless scenes of men urinating.
Those scenes are stuck into sooooo many movies, and they usually have ZERO to contribute to the story. They usually just distract from the scene.
One notable exception is from "Crocodile Dundee 2."
Dundee sneaks up on a DEA agent (Stephen Root, aka "stapler guy") who is urinating in a public restroom.
Dundee holds a knife up to the agent's throat, and then up to his genitals, to get important information from him.
(No genitals were actually shown because the audience had an imagination.)
After Dundee leaves, the agent looks down as he zips up his pants and says very quietly,
"How ya doin', buddy?"
Such a great scene from 1988 that still stands out in my memory.
I've had to subscribe as I loved this film but I haven't got time to watch till the end as I have to go to work :(.
respect
@@AMattBlackFilter ta chuck. If you ever fancy collaborating just say the word 👍🏽😁
Really nice video with good tips thank you. One thing I pointed out: TH-cam would not punish you for saying number #5 wrong but I understand why for the puff-puff example
i thought the last one was gonna be the wake up scene.
I’m happy that I’ve only given into like 2 of these cliches
You can have all of these clichés if the story is great.
exactly: the exception that proves the rule
if the direction is great...
relying on a popular song to carry the movie
A "puff puff" scene? TH-cam is just youtube kids now.
Oh no my first-ever film has 4 of those cliches
that's fine, make 3 more cliche films, 7 more cliche films, just don't expect them to be any all that interesting because you're treading overdone grounds, they are just your way of learning and trying out things before you actually make your next project that isn't a "5 minute cliche aesthetic getting ready film", but maybe a narrative 19 minute film instead
I'm tired of having to watch people puke and piss.
What is a puff puff scene?
see pinned comment
There are some good thoughts here but are we seriously not allowed to say “Swords and Sandals” anymore???? Am I just an old man? What the hell is a puff puff scene?
see pinned comment
The only film I have ever seen that does endless dialog well is Clerks.
How to avoid cliches: Figure out your motivation for making a movie. Boring films are created to fulfill shallow needs such as fame, money, and approval. Interesting films are created because the director has something they need to say, and film is the best medium to express it. If the director, cast, and editors understand and believe in the vision and that vision comes from an authentic place, cliches will naturally fall to the side.
seen so many "dude with gun in the desert" shorts. enough
ha!
What the hell is a puff puff scene
see pinned comment
From what I know about TH-cam rules, your channel isn't eligible for monetization yet, so you don't have to worry about saying the "bad" words because it won't affect you at all.
got em
This video was good but it would have been a lot better without tip toeing around the actual subject matter for half of the points. I get it, youtube or whatever but like cmon. Just say knives. Or guns. Or sex. It's like people saying "unalive" on tiktok.
Liked all your points except #1, what’s the problem with a young filmmaker wanting to shoot an action scene? Didn’t like how you said it made you “uncomfortable”seeing a set attempting one and saying it’s like playing with toys is rather condescending. Are short films just reserved for every genre except action? When you’re making an action movie whether it be a short or a feature, the action is just as important as the dialogue and the story setup for the action. I could understand if you said don’t attempt action that is out of your ability (whether it be for safety or cost reasons) but to just say that wanting to do an action scene is lazy is an extremely misguided thought in my opinion.
not 'action scenes.' Items/props that require an armorer (words that I can't say because they definitely have those words flagged as inappropriate)
action scenes are great as long as they advance the plot / introduce new escalations to the larger story
Good info, thanks.
right on
WTF is the puff puff scene?
Smoking
see pinned comment
Toothbrush can work. Instead of starting with a husband drinking coffee in the kitchen in the morning, talking to his wife...he starts in bed@tge alarm...wife in the shower...cut to Toothbrush and mirror...then coffee in the kitchen.
Good video. I'll add arty de-saturation or any other weird colour grading to cover for lack of a story.
solid. that one hits close to home
@@AMattBlackFilter Hehe... ;)
I hate how they are all so gloomy and use that yellow font. So cliche
The "getting ready" sequence is, kind of lousy.
unless there's a way to make it the first of something -- but that usually distracts from the story even more than just a cliche version
i didnt understand the thrird of what you said becouse of this “youtube ll punish me thing”. I dont think it will and you can safely say anything and people ll understand your video
thank you justin vernon
This video overall has a negative and strange tone, I don’t think it’s constructive or intelligent in any way
I disagree on #6, because fancy stuff can make yor film look so much better. I dont have the budget or the resources but if I had them, I would definitely use them. Why not?
I also disagree on #4. You can do great things using death as a narrative tool. Maybe not even sadness but a look to human violence. Whats wrong with using Death?
Idk about #4. I kinda agree there.
#3 could work if done well, but I guess I agree.
#2 could be good if you catch the audience, but you have to avoid being cheesy.
#1...I gueeeess you could say its a cliche, but it could be good to start as a practice.
Can we please stop using baby terms like “person expiring” “doin it scenes” “puff puff scenes” and such? I know the fear but this is being way overly cautious and muddles the point
Some good points but some unusual terms I found in the vid and what I believe is the translation for other boomers were Expire = dying and doin it = sex puff-puff scenes = bong/joint/weed scene but #1 still need to have a think abut
just trying to make sure TH-cam doesn't hide the video for using terms they've deemed inappropriate - otherwise I'd have used actual human words
Have absolutely no clue what he meant by bang-bang-poke-poke-whatever-the-fuck.
I think he’s implying the use of weapons. (bang bang=guns, poke poke=knives,swords, etc.)
I thought #1 was going to be the classic *Show. Don't tell.*
You seem like a pessimistic person that just doesn’t like action scenes.
worst advice ever.
Unless you want to make mediocre boring crap.
What's the point of Mumblecore? Is it just lazy script writing? I imagine there is always a risk of the dialogue and "plot", such as it is, fizzling out without telling a story.
It's hard to take advice from a bloke dressed like a surgeon...
it's the shirt right? also cheers on the unearned promotion: most med schools don't scout film majors
You don't trust surgeons?
@@CERTIFIEDBABEWRANGLER I am a surgeon.
This is just bad advice. These all just seem like these are cliches that bother you personally rather than actual, tangible advice.
Almost every single one of these has been used to great effect by talented short filmmakers all the time, concepts about expiring, puff use, and shooty slices are in a lot of stories because people find that interesting. And I’ve seen a lot of great short filmmakers say some great stuff with all of them.
Im not saying this out of arrogance, because I’ve definitely seen really bad student films use all these. But I think what you are trying to point out is that most of these bad students films are using these cliche’s in substitute of a compelling story rather then in service of one.
That’s the real problem, that students lack the confidence or creativity to make a really meaningful or engaging story, and thus use these as crutches.
If you want real advice, if you don’t have a story that feels real and exciting, than no amount of fancy camera tricks or smarmy dialogue is gonna cover that up. Remember that each scene should have an arc for the characters, and that scenes are in service of the story.
It’s totally cool if you just wanna make a edgy, shooty bang bang kinda short film, just have an actual story to go along with it, and have it be one that gets a reaction out of you and the people around you.
But at the end of the day, none of us really have a formula to this. But this advice isn’t gonna help.
Agreed. Best advice is probably not to listen to any of this advice. Nobody knows.
Cutting to black in between scenes...
My sf starts with a death 💀
#5
@@AMattBlackFilter well it's an adaptation of 'the Egg' and we show the afterlife and a chat with God so it's okay ig? Death plays only a little role in the theme and story
But I like playing with toys ....
there is so many movies that everything you do will be cliche in some way. Your task is to make this "cliche" like noone before you
Bro can't say dying, cigarettes, or sex
i meant not just ciggies but yeah them too
what's a puff puff scene? haha
Drugs,my guy
see pinned comment
yes doctor
Almost every movie in the GRADUATE film class has sex scenes. Why. It's awkward and I feel like it's so that the director can look at some beans. I haven't seen one film done well.
oof... is it a sexuality in cinema or something like that? i took a really great slashers course one time that only came up like once every 3 years
WTF is a "puff-puff" scene?
He censored smoking 🚬 I think
When I googled "puff-puff" I got some weird anime stuff lol
see pinned comment
Never had any of things never
so basically shoot something boring and don't ever try anything
if that's what you got from it: you do you
@@AMattBlackFilter, it's a shame that guy missed the point. The film elements outlined have become so trite and reveal a lack of imagination.
wtf is a puff-puff scene
yeah, that might be an american phrase that doesn't make sense elsewhere.
(example: puff, puff, pass)
@@AMattBlackFilter Smokin the devils lettuce, marijuana, weed