I was confused by the smaller L3 cache, too, but they seem to have compensated by increasing the L2 cache by 4x. I naively thought that might be an improvement...
Well.. I am far from an expert, but how I understand it is that L3 is shared among cores, while L1/L2 are per core. So, either the same data must be copied across all L2 caches or the slow mesh bus will be used to retrieve data from other core's L2.
@@DJ_DopamineXeon W are not designed for data centers. If you realize W stands for workstation. It's taking the position of previous E3 and E5-1xxx. I think the small cache is just because Intel want to cut cost on workstation users. Because workstation users are mostly using the GPU for performance and the ECC memory for reliability. They probably don't plan to game. (Until we people buy used 😂)
Great video ! At this point I think the cheap route is only one: am4 … I just bought a b450/3600x/32gb 3200 for under 200€ and it smokes my x99 combo I had (for half the consumes also) . In a future I will be able to install even a much more powerful cpu if needed …
It's crazy that where I live ( Brazil ) these lga 2066 workstations cost about 1200$ dollars. Anything above x58 is really expensive, to the point of a new amd or intel pc being cheaper
I've been waiting for somebody to test a 21**B CPU in one of these for months (I can't find any reliable info for the p520s online)! I could barely believe my eyes seeing the title!
@@Miyconst Even the title was enough for me to click immediately. A p520 is the only workstation that is available for me to get for gaming and learning IT in practice on a budget(here in Bulgaria the used workstation market is dryer than sahara), and I've been on the fence on getting it, as it's a bit overpriced, but still ok value. You are the reason I got excited for xeons in the first place a couple of months ago, so seeing this video from you exactly feels like a message, even if a bit of a sour one.
@@Technerd207 Здрасти :) Добре, че и мен ме е хванала нещо "крастата", че да задълбавам да гледам видея за xeon-и и работни станции. Верно тук са доста по-скъпи нещата. От къде търсиш/намираш оферти? ОЛХ? Kак се държи p520?
@@bobododo5580 Само ОЛХ гледам, като купуваш от един човек а не фирма поне можеш да преговаряш. Всички продават p520ки, hp z4 g4 и dell t5820ки двойно по-скъпо от използвано b550 дъно с ryzen 5800, направо е ужас. Имам едно lga2011-v3 дъно от Америка което дойде мъртво по роднини и спрямо цените тук 80те лева които изгубих са си нищожни.
Wonderful video as always. It’s true that x299 isn’t worth it right now, but I feel like it’ll become the new x99 considering these tested CPUs are some of the worst in the lineup with small cache sizes. Soon there will be better w Xeon’s on the used market like the e3/e5 xeons. Those will come with larger core counts, cache, and clock speeds. Right now it’s more of a waiting game for this platform!
thx for the informative video miy,. Are you planning of making a video about the i7/i9 x series (x299 chipset) in the future? obviously they are still pricey,
I'm honestly loving my P520 ThinkStation. It came with xeon W-2135 6C/12T, 64GB ddr4 2666, 512GB NVME SSD (upgraded to 1TB) & a cute little GTX 745 (replaced with my GTX 1060 6GB card.) The only complaint I have is it hangs on boot screen (Lenovo logo) for nearly 2 minutes before it boots into windows & I'm not entirely sure why. Massive upgrade from my case swapped Dell Optiplex 7010 i7 3770 4C/8T, 32GB of DDR3 (I forget what freq the Ram is running @)
I think the CPUs that were used are some of the worst in that family (W-21xx) for gaming. I would bet that some of the the W-21xx and W-22xx processors are better at gaming than the turbo unlocked E5-2697 V3. W-2133 and W-2150B core clocks are simply too slow. The w-2135 (six cores) and W-2145 (8 cores) both have turbo core clocks that top out at 4.5ghz and will run at 4.4 and 4.3 ghz (respectively) on all threads. That is a big boost over the W-2133(six cores) and w-2150B(ten cores) top turbo clock speeds of 3.9ghz and 4.5ghz and on all cores both top out at 3.8ghz. Additionally, I am not sure if the memory latency is more of an issue than that of running in dual channel than quad channel. I am going to throw my 3080 ti in a w-2145 p520 and see how it performs in some of these games.
I was going to post this but you beat me to it as you stated the test is borked as the set up is holding back the system for gaming use as most gamers will go for the W-2135 as a budget CPU with a boost clock of 4.5ghz and run a set of RAM 2666 in Quad Channel then the outcome would have been completely different.
@@celtshaun1427 Xeon W-2135 is a pathetic 6-Core CPU with just 8.25 MB L3 cache, some extra MHz and quad memory channel won't save it, unfortunately, but if you have results to prove me wrong - I am more than happy to change my opinion.
Xeon are made for intensive working tasks, not for gaming. For example, AutoCAD, Cinema4D or Solid Works take advantage of increased L2 cache from 256KB to 1MB. Cinebench show about +30% with W 14core at 2,5GHz from my E5-2690v4 (14c at 2,6GHz)
Great info. Validating my experience, even a 10400 is slower in games than th 2697v3. The only CPU's That I've teested that are faster are a 5600 and 5700x in gaming.
The price for these workstations in Europe seems a lot higher than they are in the US. At 400 Euro, the P520 is pretty bad value for most users compared to putting together a budget build with a recent generation desktop chip. However, such a machine can be found for 1/2 the price on eBay in the US. There is a p520 with a W-2135 and 900w PSU though no ram, storage or GT710 for $125 ($180 for a unit with 32gb ram), for example. At that price, it's at least arguably worth getting to pair with a $100-$300 GPU for a budget gaming PC. I've also seen local sellers (of Precision 5820) in Los Angeles with lower price also.
Just curious, why do you disable hyperthreading on the v3? Will disabled hyperthreading improve clock speeds especially with turbo boost fully unlocked?? Or is there some other reason for disabling?
Skylake across the board was honestly a joke desktop/server wise, so no surprises here. Mobile it was a bit better power consumption wise, but performance still went nowhere vs haswell.
Thanks for all these info. I watched for LGA 2066 a while ago and wasn't able to find any deals. Seems it really came down in price now. Will you do more testing once all 4 RAM channels are loaded? I can't wait to see those numbers.
You do not understand anything. This machine is a monster in games, editing, and hard work. It has a frequency in one core that reaches 4.5 GHz, and if you upgrade the processor it will reach 4.8. Really, you do not understand anything and you advise and mislead others to return to LGA. 2011
2066 was a shame, i think they made different versions of the actual silicon with different core count maybe the LCC could be better, but sure games are now designed with more cache in mind
Thanks for doing the exploration. I was recently chatting with you about this, and X99 comes down to price/vs/performance. With mem, cpu and mobo combinations that are good value - it remains a value game or work system. My humble opinion here is that post covid, the other platform costs - like AM4 have not at all returned to pre-covid pricing, and because of this actual gap - this is why X99 lives! If AM4 budget mobos returned to their £40 price - then it would be rough for X99. But we seem far from that. Anyway - Do appreciate your investigation on these!
@@Miyconst I see zero comparable options of any kits - mem + cpu + mobo. So my point is - until that gap closes up - there is big daylight between the platforms... This is not to say people should go buy X99. Its just having that budget option - IMHO is rather nice compared to the loony tunes pricing of the covid era.
@@Miyconst Agreed. We upgraded my daughter's rig from X79 to AMD Ryzen 7 5800X with a Strix B550A Gaming MB. The MB was purchased used in a local auction and cost me US$80 ( mint, with box and all accessories). The 2x16GB Trident Z Royal 3600 DDR4...another $80 in the same local auction site. The CPU I bought new...$160. Kept the same case, CPU cooler, RTX 2080S and 650W Gold PSU. IMO, it's a damn performant platform, for that amount of money. She gifted the HuananZhi X79 Deluxe + E5-4627v2 (8 core, 3.6 GHz turbo, no HT) + 4x8GB DDR3 1833 + GTX 1080 + 1TB NVME (that I had extra) + a 4 pipe Snowman cooler lying around + extra 825W Bronze PSU (used) + vertical test bench (extra, used) to her best friend in desperate need of an upgrade (DELL w/2nd gen i7 (4C/8T) + 1TB HDD + 8GB RAM + GTX 1050 + 375W PSU). I suppose I could've sold the X79 rig used for at least $300...but she had gone on a summer camping trip at that friend's camp for 2 weeks...seemed like the correct thing to do. I built the rig for them this weekend over a few hours...to walk them through a PC build.
@@jb678901 that's a gigantic upgrade, I hope your daughter enjoys it, and very nice gesture to gift the other parts to the ones in need, I still remember myself traying to find some scrap PC parts as a teenager.
So, I think there's a bit of a double issue here. yes lga 2066 xeons didn't up the cache in most cases, but the B variants which are for apple seem to have reduced cache compared to their non B variants. the only apple B variant that seems to be identical to the regular variant is the W-2191B which retains all of its cache. you might redo this testing with a w-2145 or w-2155, I'd be interested in the difference.
The consumer variants of these chips aren't any better. I had an i7-7900X (marked as i9) for a short while, and it was by far the most frustrating experience I'd had in almost 20 years. It wouldn't even work properly on default settings, as the Turbo Boost wasn't working as intended, and any tweaks to the turbo ratios resulted in either instability or overheating. For some stupid reason, it required you to specify *which* cores to boost, instead of the standard *how many* cores. For example, if you set Core 0 to boost to 45x, only Core 0 will do so, not cores 1~9, but games and programs won't always automatically run on Core 0. If you allow multiple cores to boost, they will do so at the same time and overheat or crash.
It's such a shame you live so far away. I'd lead you my dual P-8124. You'd have a lot of fun with that system. Prices for that CPU is relatively cheap. Motherboard would be difficult to acquire.
LGA 3647 isn`t impressive either. Gold 6138 loses to 2699v3 (Turbo Unlock). 7551p has same single core performance as 2670v3 but offers 2.49x better performance in multi core. Maybe we get Epyc gen 1 mobos next year.
I am getting p520 with W2135 or E5-2640V4 with 64gb ram I need only for work editing autocad No GAMING can I buy which cpu is better for me ,please guide me
CAD and 3D softwares (AutoCAD, Solid Works, Cinema4D...) generally take benefits of large amount of L2 cache. Xeon W have less L3 cache but 4x more L2 (1MB instead 256KB for previous v3/v4 Xeon). Single core are mainly important, except for rendering. In Cinebench 24, 2.5GHz 14c Xeon W are about 30% faster than my E5-2690v4 (2,6GHz 14c) in MC test and 40~45% in SC test
I would think the 690W PSU is way to weak for the 7900xt as the 900W seemed to be too weak for my 3080ti as I was having some issues with system crashes under heavy load(this was only with gaming and when I was running 2 P100s or 2 V100s and a low end quadro with the 900W psu I had no issues but I was limiting the power/watts and with machine learning there is less intense spikes in power draw.) I upgraded to the 1,000W PSU and the crashes went away with the 3080ti. Two other things. Who is getting these HIGH end GPUs and playing at 1080p? At 1440, 3k (wide 1440) and 4k I doubt there is as much of a bottleneck.
Yes, Dell and HP workstations are just as locked as Lenovo. The W-22XX Xeons are better, but the prices are still ridiculous, so I see no reason to bother.
For photo and video editing, do you recommend a Xeon W machine over a second hand Ryzen 3000 build around the same price? Really not sure which way to go...
Не совсем понятно что ты считаешь "ужасной производительностью памяти". 2 канала против 4ех. Если 2297в3 оставить в 2ух канале, он будет точно так же показывать 30-35 на чтение/запись/копирование. Все остальное - дело в таймингах Скорость кэша тоже возрасла. Л2 кэша на каждое ядро стало по 1 мб, вместо 256кб. А вот л3 - да, стало меньше и он стал сильно медленней.
Hello @Miyconst ! I'm currently checking those workstation as I would like to build a all in one NAS. I would run an expansion card with 4 3.0 nvme slots, a 10G network card on the x8 slot and an intel arc A380 on the last x16. I'm just afraid of the idle power draw of the X299 systems despite being the server/workstation equivalent of kaby-lake. Did you got some time to test the power draw at idle of your systems and especially the P520 compared to X99/X79 ?
I did the idle power consumption measures and it was around 50 watt just like X99 but I am afraid it will be significantly higher in your case. A380 and the extra controllers may pull additional 50 watts at idle.
@@Miyconst ok maybe I will just keep doing my encoding on CPU then. The A380 was for hardware accelerating AV1 encoding. I would still need a truck load or RAM (or dedicate a whole SATA ssd for swap) if I do it with ffmpeg I guess so maybe I should get a Fujitsu W570 small workstation as I already have a spare Xeon e3 1645 v6. Put a 10G card on top and a 4 NVME card on the main x16 slot. Those Fujitsu systems seems to be renown for their low power consumption and ECC UDIMM support if equiped with xeon CPU. I checked X99 for the amount of PCIE lanes available.
Hi, big fan of your video. Please review X299 MB especially C9X299-RPGF along with i9-9xxx & i9-10xxx X series CPU. These item price dropped this days on aliexpress.
Dear Sir, i am unable to post any link here somehow. In Mobile ALX apps, please search "X299 motherboard" and you will find the supermicro model which i said.
Thanks for providing us the numbers, Miyconst. With a proper and tweaked BIOS a better showing might be possible still, but the numbers so far for Skylake-W are indeed disappointing. As I am still quite happy with my 2696V3, I wonder how long we need to wait to get a spiritual successor to the X99 platform. I thought Sapphire Rapids-EP would be compatible again with their workstation platform, but as that CPU line was also quite a bit of a disaster, I wonder when Intel takes the workstation/entry server market seriously again (and if we powerusers could profit from these platforms further down the road again).
Most likely there won't be anything like that in the near future. The desktop platforms are already overloaded with lots of cores and the big Xeons / EPYCs are server giants that make little sense for a regular consumer.
Threadripper (if emough people adopt it and in 4 or so years there is a ton on the market)...or does it need to be an Intel to be a spiritual successor.
Wow, that's awful from the 2066 CPU. I wonder how the i9 chips fares in games instead since Intel did increase L3 cache on those (7980XE has almost 25MB also just like 6950X), but the mesh topology definitely hurts performance no matter how you see it and it also increases heat\power consumption significantly. I was interested in upgrading to X299 since im currently on X99 with a 5960X and I want to remain on HEDT, but the performance uplift in games for example is just not there and most importantly the prices\availability of LGA 2066 in my local market is horrific where even those awful Kaby Lake X chips carry a significant premium and are more expensive than even a 5820K or 5960X. The only cool thing about these chips is AVX512 IMO, they dont have much else going for them whether it be price or performance.
I have no clue why you insist on staying with HEDT instead of moving on with the modern desktop options that offer better everything (except the number of PCI-E lanes).
@@Miyconst Oh I know it doesnt make a lot of sense, but i've been on HEDT for so long that now it kinda feels wrong switching for a regular consumer platform. Love the quad channel DDR4, the huge amount of PCIe lanes, etc. On top of that my system has no problem with any of the workloads that im currently throwing at it so there's not a lot of incentive in upgrading to AM5\LGA1700 just yet though I am starting to consider the idea since there's really nothing better than X99 in this space (X299\X399 are sidegrades at best) while 6900K\6950X are still too expensive and the performance improvements are pretty negligible due to Broadwell E's low IPC improvement and terrible OC headroom. I will probably upgrade my GPU first before going for an entirely different platform though, as while my 980Ti is a pretty good GPU it is starting to struggle in some games at 1080p ultrawide, and I will also need to upgrade my monitor as well since it's only 75Hz so upgrading gets pretty complicated in the end.
Are there any chinese x99 motherboards with 2 fully pinned and functional x16 PCIe slots? Does it bifurcate to x8/x8 or is it 2 full x16 slots? If not what about one with a full x16 and an full x8 slot? I am thinking about getting an intel 4tb ssd card that has 8x connector (2 separate 2tb drives on one card). Any cheap am4 boards that have this setup (pcie 3.0 x16 for second slot would be fine)?
I really hope 2066 prices get close to 2011-3 prices, and we have a new used xeon boom
I was confused by the smaller L3 cache, too, but they seem to have compensated by increasing the L2 cache by 4x. I naively thought that might be an improvement...
Well.. I am far from an expert, but how I understand it is that L3 is shared among cores, while L1/L2 are per core. So, either the same data must be copied across all L2 caches or the slow mesh bus will be used to retrieve data from other core's L2.
It probably made sense for use in the Data Center environment (somehow) at the time.
@@DJ_DopamineXeon W are not designed for data centers. If you realize W stands for workstation. It's taking the position of previous E3 and E5-1xxx.
I think the small cache is just because Intel want to cut cost on workstation users. Because workstation users are mostly using the GPU for performance and the ECC memory for reliability. They probably don't plan to game. (Until we people buy used 😂)
A rare sighting.. 2 of my favorite tech TH-camrs spotted in the wild that some call "the comments section" lol
Collab basically confirmed, they are gonna fight the ruzzians together
Great video ! At this point I think the cheap route is only one: am4 … I just bought a b450/3600x/32gb 3200 for under 200€ and it smokes my x99 combo I had (for half the consumes also) . In a future I will be able to install even a much more powerful cpu if needed …
Very true. If you have rich second hand market then AM4 is the way to go.
It's crazy that where I live ( Brazil ) these lga 2066 workstations cost about 1200$ dollars. Anything above x58 is really expensive, to the point of a new amd or intel pc being cheaper
That's hard to explain.. why would someone want these old workstations instead of the new alternatives?
@@Miyconst supply and demand - greed by the resellers?
@@gzcwnk but the resellers are supposed to be the first who wants to get rid of the old stock, or so I would assume..
same. my place selling lga2066 2nd hand same price as full price of amd and intel (CPU+mobo+RAM)
Brazil is an awkward market traditionally
I've been waiting for somebody to test a 21**B CPU in one of these for months (I can't find any reliable info for the p520s online)! I could barely believe my eyes seeing the title!
Now you have an entire video, not just a title.
@@Miyconst Even the title was enough for me to click immediately. A p520 is the only workstation that is available for me to get for gaming and learning IT in practice on a budget(here in Bulgaria the used workstation market is dryer than sahara), and I've been on the fence on getting it, as it's a bit overpriced, but still ok value. You are the reason I got excited for xeons in the first place a couple of months ago, so seeing this video from you exactly feels like a message, even if a bit of a sour one.
@@Technerd207 Здрасти :) Добре, че и мен ме е хванала нещо "крастата", че да задълбавам да гледам видея за xeon-и и работни станции. Верно тук са доста по-скъпи нещата. От къде търсиш/намираш оферти? ОЛХ? Kак се държи p520?
@@bobododo5580 Само ОЛХ гледам, като купуваш от един човек а не фирма поне можеш да преговаряш. Всички продават p520ки, hp z4 g4 и dell t5820ки двойно по-скъпо от използвано b550 дъно с ryzen 5800, направо е ужас. Имам едно lga2011-v3 дъно от Америка което дойде мъртво по роднини и спрямо цените тук 80те лева които изгубих са си нищожни.
Wonderful video as always. It’s true that x299 isn’t worth it right now, but I feel like it’ll become the new x99 considering these tested CPUs are some of the worst in the lineup with small cache sizes. Soon there will be better w Xeon’s on the used market like the e3/e5 xeons. Those will come with larger core counts, cache, and clock speeds. Right now it’s more of a waiting game for this platform!
thx for the informative video miy,. Are you planning of making a video about the i7/i9 x series (x299 chipset) in the future? obviously they are still pricey,
Yes, if the prices go down and availability goes up, I will do more X299 videos.
I'm hoping to unlock the xeon 2690v4!
Yeah.. it's just a hopeless hope.
So x99 still superior, its even funny, how Intel managed to make worse cpu's than predessesor
It would be funny if it would not be so sad.
happen also with 11gen from 10th
which one is better??
xeon e5 2680 v4 or xeon w2135??
E5-2680 V4.
@@Miyconst thx 😍
I'm shocked 😮
Nice to see you around! Yeah, the X299 / C422 platform is really pathetic and looks more like a desperate and greedy move from Intel.
@@Miyconstunless you have a 10980xe which is quite ok at gaming
I'm honestly loving my P520 ThinkStation. It came with xeon W-2135 6C/12T, 64GB ddr4 2666, 512GB NVME SSD (upgraded to 1TB) & a cute little GTX 745 (replaced with my GTX 1060 6GB card.) The only complaint I have is it hangs on boot screen (Lenovo logo) for nearly 2 minutes before it boots into windows & I'm not entirely sure why. Massive upgrade from my case swapped Dell Optiplex 7010 i7 3770 4C/8T, 32GB of DDR3 (I forget what freq the Ram is running @)
Man... long live x99, still a beast of a platform, how intel dropped the ball this hard?
It's a combination of greed and incompetence.
Lenovo P520 is a steal around and under 200$, in my country they are currently priced around >350$ so no go, for now. ;)
Very true, once the price goes down, it will be a steal-deal for video editing machines, not for gaming..
I think the CPUs that were used are some of the worst in that family (W-21xx) for gaming. I would bet that some of the the W-21xx and W-22xx processors are better at gaming than the turbo unlocked E5-2697 V3. W-2133 and W-2150B core clocks are simply too slow. The w-2135 (six cores) and W-2145 (8 cores) both have turbo core clocks that top out at 4.5ghz and will run at 4.4 and 4.3 ghz (respectively) on all threads. That is a big boost over the W-2133(six cores) and w-2150B(ten cores) top turbo clock speeds of 3.9ghz and 4.5ghz and on all cores both top out at 3.8ghz. Additionally, I am not sure if the memory latency is more of an issue than that of running in dual channel than quad channel. I am going to throw my 3080 ti in a w-2145 p520 and see how it performs in some of these games.
Please share some results if you end up testing W-2145.
I was going to post this but you beat me to it as you stated the test is borked as the set up is holding back the system for gaming use as most gamers will go for the W-2135 as a budget CPU with a boost clock of 4.5ghz and run a set of RAM 2666 in Quad Channel then the outcome would have been completely different.
@@celtshaun1427 Xeon W-2135 is a pathetic 6-Core CPU with just 8.25 MB L3 cache, some extra MHz and quad memory channel won't save it, unfortunately, but if you have results to prove me wrong - I am more than happy to change my opinion.
Any follow up on this, would lile to know results for the w-2145
Xeon are made for intensive working tasks, not for gaming. For example, AutoCAD, Cinema4D or Solid Works take advantage of increased L2 cache from 256KB to 1MB. Cinebench show about +30% with W 14core at 2,5GHz from my E5-2690v4 (14c at 2,6GHz)
This is the first truly useful review of this machine for enthusiast use that I’ve seen. Great job and thank you.
You just saved me money. I was starting to consider buying a few of the Skylake generation Xeons to play with. They seem like real stinkers.
These Xeons are good at specific workloads, for example if you need AVX-512, for regular consumer / gamer, it's a waste.
Great info. Validating my experience, even a 10400 is slower in games than th 2697v3. The only CPU's That I've teested that are faster are a 5600 and 5700x in gaming.
The price for these workstations in Europe seems a lot higher than they are in the US. At 400 Euro, the P520 is pretty bad value for most users compared to putting together a budget build with a recent generation desktop chip.
However, such a machine can be found for 1/2 the price on eBay in the US. There is a p520 with a W-2135 and 900w PSU though no ram, storage or GT710 for $125 ($180 for a unit with 32gb ram), for example. At that price, it's at least arguably worth getting to pair with a $100-$300 GPU for a budget gaming PC. I've also seen local sellers (of Precision 5820) in Los Angeles with lower price also.
That's very true, even €400 is too much, but I made myself waste this money for the sake of the video.
Just curious, why do you disable hyperthreading on the v3?
Will disabled hyperthreading improve clock speeds especially with turbo boost fully unlocked??
Or is there some other reason for disabling?
Skylake across the board was honestly a joke desktop/server wise, so no surprises here. Mobile it was a bit better power consumption wise, but performance still went nowhere vs haswell.
Thanks for all these info. I watched for LGA 2066 a while ago and wasn't able to find any deals. Seems it really came down in price now.
Will you do more testing once all 4 RAM channels are loaded? I can't wait to see those numbers.
Yes, I already have the results, just need to record a video.
I like the W chips. At least my W5 2455x.
You do not understand anything. This machine is a monster in games, editing, and hard work. It has a frequency in one core that reaches 4.5 GHz, and if you upgrade the processor it will reach 4.8. Really, you do not understand anything and you advise and mislead others to return to LGA. 2011
😂🤣🙈
This is your technical answer؟
@@Miyconst Search TH-cam for lga 2066 processors and then talk, cpus reach 4.8, with high single core speed, you really don't understand anything
2066 was a shame, i think they made different versions of the actual silicon with different core count maybe the LCC could be better, but sure games are now designed with more cache in mind
LGA 2066 was and is a shame. Intel's greed and incompetence at its finest.
What about w 3175x and series w 22xx? Thx
I didn't test these so I can't say much.
dell 5820 takes xeon w and i9 cpus
True, but only if the chipset is correct. T5820 with X299 works with i7/I-9, T5820 with C422 works with Xeon W.
I heard that HUANANZHI will produce motherboard for LGA 3647.
I have heard lots of things, but with the current china's policy and trade wars with the USA it is gonna be hard.
hh@@Miyconst
Thanks for doing the exploration. I was recently chatting with you about this, and X99 comes down to price/vs/performance. With mem, cpu and mobo combinations that are good value - it remains a value game or work system. My humble opinion here is that post covid, the other platform costs - like AM4 have not at all returned to pre-covid pricing, and because of this actual gap - this is why X99 lives!
If AM4 budget mobos returned to their £40 price - then it would be rough for X99. But we seem far from that.
Anyway - Do appreciate your investigation on these!
Unlike X99, AM4 second hand market is full of quality options with a reasonable price.
@@Miyconst I see zero comparable options of any kits - mem + cpu + mobo.
So my point is - until that gap closes up - there is big daylight between the platforms...
This is not to say people should go buy X99. Its just having that budget option - IMHO is rather nice compared to the loony tunes pricing of the covid era.
@@Miyconst Agreed. We upgraded my daughter's rig from X79 to AMD Ryzen 7 5800X with a Strix B550A Gaming MB. The MB was purchased used in a local auction and cost me US$80 ( mint, with box and all accessories). The 2x16GB Trident Z Royal 3600 DDR4...another $80 in the same local auction site. The CPU I bought new...$160. Kept the same case, CPU cooler, RTX 2080S and 650W Gold PSU. IMO, it's a damn performant platform, for that amount of money.
She gifted the HuananZhi X79 Deluxe + E5-4627v2 (8 core, 3.6 GHz turbo, no HT) + 4x8GB DDR3 1833 + GTX 1080 + 1TB NVME (that I had extra) + a 4 pipe Snowman cooler lying around + extra 825W Bronze PSU (used) + vertical test bench (extra, used) to her best friend in desperate need of an upgrade (DELL w/2nd gen i7 (4C/8T) + 1TB HDD + 8GB RAM + GTX 1050 + 375W PSU).
I suppose I could've sold the X79 rig used for at least $300...but she had gone on a summer camping trip at that friend's camp for 2 weeks...seemed like the correct thing to do. I built the rig for them this weekend over a few hours...to walk them through a PC build.
@@jb678901 that's a gigantic upgrade, I hope your daughter enjoys it, and very nice gesture to gift the other parts to the ones in need, I still remember myself traying to find some scrap PC parts as a teenager.
@@Miyconst She definitely enjoys and appreciates the visible upgrade...as does her best friend.
So, I think there's a bit of a double issue here. yes lga 2066 xeons didn't up the cache in most cases, but the B variants which are for apple seem to have reduced cache compared to their non B variants. the only apple B variant that seems to be identical to the regular variant is the W-2191B which retains all of its cache. you might redo this testing with a w-2145 or w-2155, I'd be interested in the difference.
The consumer variants of these chips aren't any better.
I had an i7-7900X (marked as i9) for a short while, and it was by far the most frustrating experience I'd had in almost 20 years. It wouldn't even work properly on default settings, as the Turbo Boost wasn't working as intended, and any tweaks to the turbo ratios resulted in either instability or overheating. For some stupid reason, it required you to specify *which* cores to boost, instead of the standard *how many* cores. For example, if you set Core 0 to boost to 45x, only Core 0 will do so, not cores 1~9, but games and programs won't always automatically run on Core 0. If you allow multiple cores to boost, they will do so at the same time and overheat or crash.
Yeah, X299 was/is a pathetic disaster.
It's such a shame you live so far away. I'd lead you my dual P-8124. You'd have a lot of fun with that system. Prices for that CPU is relatively cheap. Motherboard would be difficult to acquire.
Yeah, some of the LGA 3647 Xeons are very attractive in price, but the motherboards are way too expensive.
LGA 3647 isn`t impressive either. Gold 6138 loses to 2699v3 (Turbo Unlock). 7551p has same single core performance as 2670v3 but offers 2.49x better performance in multi core. Maybe we get Epyc gen 1 mobos next year.
Unfortunately, EPYC gen 1 is just as pathetic in games..
I am getting p520 with W2135 or E5-2640V4 with 64gb ram I need only for work editing autocad No GAMING can I buy which cpu is better for me ,please guide me
CAD and 3D softwares (AutoCAD, Solid Works, Cinema4D...) generally take benefits of large amount of L2 cache. Xeon W have less L3 cache but 4x more L2 (1MB instead 256KB for previous v3/v4 Xeon). Single core are mainly important, except for rendering. In Cinebench 24, 2.5GHz 14c Xeon W are about 30% faster than my E5-2690v4 (2,6GHz 14c) in MC test and 40~45% in SC test
I would think the 690W PSU is way to weak for the 7900xt as the 900W seemed to be too weak for my 3080ti as I was having some issues with system crashes under heavy load(this was only with gaming and when I was running 2 P100s or 2 V100s and a low end quadro with the 900W psu I had no issues but I was limiting the power/watts and with machine learning there is less intense spikes in power draw.) I upgraded to the 1,000W PSU and the crashes went away with the 3080ti. Two other things. Who is getting these HIGH end GPUs and playing at 1080p? At 1440, 3k (wide 1440) and 4k I doubt there is as much of a bottleneck.
690 Watt is indeed too weak for an RX 7900XT, I tested with an external PSU attached to the GPU.
Side note: Your kitty cat makes it look like your PC is smoking when I paused the video. Them CPU Temps must be outrageous. :D
It's just a PC equipped with one meowbyte. 😸
Is that the same wuth hp z4 g4
And dell t 5820
Does they also have closed bios
And what about w2265
It has higher cash
Dies it has the same problem??
Yes, Dell and HP workstations are just as locked as Lenovo. The W-22XX Xeons are better, but the prices are still ridiculous, so I see no reason to bother.
For photo and video editing, do you recommend a Xeon W machine over a second hand Ryzen 3000 build around the same price? Really not sure which way to go...
I don't. Xeon W over Ryzen 3000 makes sense only if you need lots of RAM and/or PCI-E lanes.
Не совсем понятно что ты считаешь "ужасной производительностью памяти".
2 канала против 4ех. Если 2297в3 оставить в 2ух канале, он будет точно так же показывать 30-35 на чтение/запись/копирование. Все остальное - дело в таймингах
Скорость кэша тоже возрасла. Л2 кэша на каждое ядро стало по 1 мб, вместо 256кб. А вот л3 - да, стало меньше и он стал сильно медленней.
This was excellent. I was wondering about the 2066/3467 chips since they've come down in price.
LGA 3647 is also interesting, but motherboards are even harder to acquire.
Hello @Miyconst ! I'm currently checking those workstation as I would like to build a all in one NAS. I would run an expansion card with 4 3.0 nvme slots, a 10G network card on the x8 slot and an intel arc A380 on the last x16. I'm just afraid of the idle power draw of the X299 systems despite being the server/workstation equivalent of kaby-lake. Did you got some time to test the power draw at idle of your systems and especially the P520 compared to X99/X79 ?
I did the idle power consumption measures and it was around 50 watt just like X99 but I am afraid it will be significantly higher in your case. A380 and the extra controllers may pull additional 50 watts at idle.
@@Miyconst ok maybe I will just keep doing my encoding on CPU then. The A380 was for hardware accelerating AV1 encoding. I would still need a truck load or RAM (or dedicate a whole SATA ssd for swap) if I do it with ffmpeg I guess so maybe I should get a Fujitsu W570 small workstation as I already have a spare Xeon e3 1645 v6. Put a 10G card on top and a 4 NVME card on the main x16 slot. Those Fujitsu systems seems to be renown for their low power consumption and ECC UDIMM support if equiped with xeon CPU. I checked X99 for the amount of PCIE lanes available.
looks like my decision to stick with a z440 and 2680v4 was the correct one for me!
Well.. it depends on what was the other option. 😃
Hi, big fan of your video. Please review X299 MB especially C9X299-RPGF along with i9-9xxx & i9-10xxx X series CPU. These item price dropped this days on aliexpress.
Hi. Do you have any links where these motherboards cost somehow reasonable?
Dear Sir, i am unable to post any link here somehow. In Mobile ALX apps, please search "X299 motherboard" and you will find the supermicro model which i said.
You can post links using my Discord 😀
Love the song at the end with context to video content :) (pidmanula, pidvela)
The song is Їхав козак за Дунай, a very old Ukrainian folk song.
I will probably keep investing in 2011.
Still a good option for ultra low budget builds.
So the chinese boards will move to 2066?
I don't think it will happen any time soon.
Wonder if quad channel ram would make a difference
It would, not big though.
Boa noite,um abraço
👍
Does it take ECC?
It does. It's a workstation.
Thanks for providing us the numbers, Miyconst. With a proper and tweaked BIOS a better showing might be possible still, but the numbers so far for Skylake-W are indeed disappointing. As I am still quite happy with my 2696V3, I wonder how long we need to wait to get a spiritual successor to the X99 platform. I thought Sapphire Rapids-EP would be compatible again with their workstation platform, but as that CPU line was also quite a bit of a disaster, I wonder when Intel takes the workstation/entry server market seriously again (and if we powerusers could profit from these platforms further down the road again).
Most likely there won't be anything like that in the near future. The desktop platforms are already overloaded with lots of cores and the big Xeons / EPYCs are server giants that make little sense for a regular consumer.
Same here. 2696v3 remains a terrific purchase for my needs...not changing anytime soon.
Threadripper (if emough people adopt it and in 4 or so years there is a ton on the market)...or does it need to be an Intel to be a spiritual successor.
these old thinkstations are crazy reliable. currently using one with a gpu and psu upgrade and its great.
Very true, when it comes to the reliability, these are champions for the budget.
Wow, that's awful from the 2066 CPU. I wonder how the i9 chips fares in games instead since Intel did increase L3 cache on those (7980XE has almost 25MB also just like 6950X), but the mesh topology definitely hurts performance no matter how you see it and it also increases heat\power consumption significantly.
I was interested in upgrading to X299 since im currently on X99 with a 5960X and I want to remain on HEDT, but the performance uplift in games for example is just not there and most importantly the prices\availability of LGA 2066 in my local market is horrific where even those awful Kaby Lake X chips carry a significant premium and are more expensive than even a 5820K or 5960X. The only cool thing about these chips is AVX512 IMO, they dont have much else going for them whether it be price or performance.
I have no clue why you insist on staying with HEDT instead of moving on with the modern desktop options that offer better everything (except the number of PCI-E lanes).
@@Miyconst Oh I know it doesnt make a lot of sense, but i've been on HEDT for so long that now it kinda feels wrong switching for a regular consumer platform. Love the quad channel DDR4, the huge amount of PCIe lanes, etc. On top of that my system has no problem with any of the workloads that im currently throwing at it so there's not a lot of incentive in upgrading to AM5\LGA1700 just yet though I am starting to consider the idea since there's really nothing better than X99 in this space (X299\X399 are sidegrades at best) while 6900K\6950X are still too expensive and the performance improvements are pretty negligible due to Broadwell E's low IPC improvement and terrible OC headroom. I will probably upgrade my GPU first before going for an entirely different platform though, as while my 980Ti is a pretty good GPU it is starting to struggle in some games at 1080p ultrawide, and I will also need to upgrade my monitor as well since it's only 75Hz so upgrading gets pretty complicated in the end.
Are there any chinese x99 motherboards with 2 fully pinned and functional x16 PCIe slots? Does it bifurcate to x8/x8 or is it 2 full x16 slots?
If not what about one with a full x16 and an full x8 slot? I am thinking about getting an intel 4tb ssd card that has 8x connector (2 separate 2tb drives on one card).
Any cheap am4 boards that have this setup (pcie 3.0 x16 for second slot would be fine)?
There are many such X99 boards, Huananzhi X99-F8 for example. AM4 doesn't support such configuration because CPU does not have enough PCI-E lanes.