It's been very Honda-heavy around the MCM garage as we completed the task of finishing someone else's project. This episode we're bringing back turbos, all wheel drive, ethanol and many other things back via one of our most beloved projects, Supergramps! It's the wagon that keeps on delivering the goods year after year. It's over 5 years since we first kicked off the build and we know many of you found MCM through that series. If that's you, we want to say a big thank you for sticking around and being a part of this weird and wondering stuff we spend a lot of our time doing. It's easy for the worlds of cars, mods, meets and even youtube to get very serious, tribal and competitive... so this is a reminder of why we do what we do, we take a cheap old Subaru, learn, collaborate, modify and test over years with one constant - a massive grin from ear to ear while we push this car (and our other cars) to it's limits! also... We made this Hoodie and we really like it: mightycarmods.com/products/retro-speed-hoodie
thank you so much for that honda build y'all, i had an ek i did alot of work on quite a few years ago. Y'all brought my love back for hondas (and ek's) more than I've ever had before, and I could like re-live my build. Love all that you guys do!!!
Hey Marty - I was the M3 guy who let you past! Great to chat with you and Moog - you guys are absolute legends! I couldn’t believe how fast SG goes on track - respect!! And the lap time you did is amazing 🤙
Marty, Have a look at the airflows within your engine bay. I suspect that as you still have an open TMIC scoop and you have no undertray the air in the engine bay and there fore behind the radiator/Intercooler and is a mess of turbulent air at speed and you are probably getting positive air pressures where you should be getting lower pressures. An oem or diy flat undertray, sealing in the sides of the radiator to create more of a duct to keep the high pressure air in front of the radiator and sealing up the TMIC scoop might inprove your cooling at the track.
@@mightycarmods Would be stoked to see you try this. Even the under tray makes a big difference in cooling at the track in my experience. It would be great content for an episode to experiment with airflow mods and the benefits.
@@mightycarmods I made myself a flat undertray on my Evo X and it works perfectly. It took me a good minute, but it's a very good thing to make for a car you want to track. 2-3mm aluminium sheet should work just fine and won't add too much weight, though I made it from galvanized steel and added roughly 20kg in the front.
I really like when a channel will bring back a "finished" car and do something with it whether it's modify it just a little further or taking it out on a track. It's so nice to see a well known car make a return, I'm so glad you guys don't fall victim to the "it's finished so it can't be shown again" mentality.
What’s Marty’s success rate on track days where he says out loud “the car is doing {x} but I’m just gonna send it for this last lap” only to find out that last lap hurt the car?
@@waty0usay1 Meh, most will be fine when pushed. The problem is that you need to measure the engine time in hours and maintain them properly. Just changing the oil every time it's been pushed isn't enough.
Not a single bolt on super gramps has even been even slightly turned by me, personally, and yet I'm oddly proud of his performance and solidity on the street and track... Well done, Marty
@@papapetad Not far off. Standard EJ25T Liberty GT Wagon weighs 1,555kg. With a EZ36T it should be weighing in the ballpark of 1,635kg. F80 BMW M3s weighs 1,621kg. SuperGramps made 477bhp - (291bhp/per tonne) F80 BMW M3s make 425bhp - (262bhp/per tonne) This is assuming that the M3 is stock. If there's some light modifications done to it, it would probably be slightly more powerful than SuperGramps.
@@shona5512 Wow that is thorough 👍I think that power figure for SP is atw, isn't it? That means considerably more at the crank as well. It was ripping through the gears, even taking into account short-shifting.
@@papapetad That figure was with drivetrain loss taken into consideration. SuperGramps made bang on 400hp at the wheels. So with an AWD, manual car it should be making (give or take) 477hp at the crank. Either way, it's giving the BMW a real run for its money, even more impressive of the M3 has supporting mods.
Supergramps was my favorite build series and just really the best thing I’ve ever watched on YT so happy to see him get some love here. The collaboration really made it memorable!
Y'see, this is why Colin McRae's famous 'win it or bin it' driving style worked with the Subaru. He knew it was a case of getting to the end of the stage as fast as humanly possible before his engine found a way to eat itself
YES! 4th gen winning! I recently autocrossed my outback xt (converted to legacy suspension) and it is such a blast on track. Super simple setup, larger rear sway, 255 section tires (RE71R), that's it chassis wise. Mine only makes 250 wheel but I was still able to run right between a (probably underdriven) z06 and a 997 911 Cab. I can't imagine how awesome it'd be with an EZ.
It's great to see Super Gramps again. Earlier iterations inspired modification of my 05 Outback XT, which my sons friends called the Dad Mobile. Modified with a short throw 5 speed shifter, air intake, up-pipe, down-pipe, cat back exhaust, stiffer shocks, stiffer anti-sway bars, performance/street rotors & pads, over sized rims & a modest dyno-tune putting 250 HP to the pavement;) Thanks guys.
GAGAGAGAGAGAGA this is wonderful! PRANK! IT is terrible! I looked in the mirror and saw something UNPRETTY: my face. GAGAGAGAG! But I am happy agayn because I have TWO HOT GIRLFRIENDS and I make cool YT v*deos with them! Good evening, love and peace, dear carl
I'm guessing oil slosh in the corners made it to the breathers in the valve cover, a lot of boxer engines seem to have this issue if their sump isn't well baffled. If SG's engine is still stock then I'm guessing the sump is pretty basic considering it's an SUV engine.
When the car sits still when it’s hot, the pads keep some heat in the discs so the disc cools at different speed, creating two different sizes of metal within the size and thus warping it. Roll the car back and forth just a little to move the disc past the pad a couple of time to help it cool evenly. I went from a set of rotors a race meet to never changing them again. Dream result.
I'll remember that! Another quickie is to keep the engine running for a bit to cool the oil down, otherwise hot oil will, for the sake of explaining it quickly, simply slip off bearings, journals & seals, effectively drying them while theyre still too warm, which will heat them up shrink them, then possibly loosen them up, could cause spinning bearings. And in addition, next time you start engine, journals are empty, so wears them out even more, AND "wears out" the oil too because it wasnt cooled before shutdown, in such a way that it effectively starts the sludge process.
Two bits of advice I was given at my first track day with a car club. 1) Cooldown laps are a thing. Don't race back to the pits, cruise back at a casual pace and your engine oil, coolant and brakes will thank you for it. 2) Don't set your parking brake once in the pits, it can cause hot spots, warping or even cause the pads/shoes to stick. Pit's are usually flat so leaving the car in gear after shutdown will keep it still, also wheel chocks are cheap.
Gramps is a wagon, and will have more mass at the rear axle, and it will tend to have the rear end break free first. Not much you can do to about it. If you want to try to figure it out, read Fredrick Puhn’s book “How to Make Your Car Handle”. It is one of the best basic manuals on handling ever written. It has just the minimum amount of math, and does a very good explanation of the basic physics vehicle handling, and explains things like ounce and roll steer, and how to get rid of them.
When Marty said in the intro that we're talking about broken subarus, I had to clear my schedule cause I thought this video was going to be 5 hours oong
Glad I'm not the only one who is having car trouble this week. Monday i blew the stock transmission oil cooler line, so changed that to a braided line. Tuesday my radiator had a crack down the side and was leaking everywhere so replaced the radiator, Wednesday I was overheating with no leaks, worked out the thermostat was stuck closed so replaced that. Friday car started sounding rough as guts but no overheating or anything, soon as I turned the car off the coolant overflow tube was like a pressure washer, worked out the where the stem vent hose from the radiator connects to the expansion tank was clogged giving me an increasing amount of air build up in the system, also took the air intake off to give the filter a clean and had a heap on oily gunk on the throttle body and filter. And to top it all off, once that was all sorted I go to jump in the car, only to see I got a flat tyre that has a screw in it 😔.. didn't know whether to laugh or cry.
@@NoWr2Run it was an absolute nightmare of a week, spent hours calling around for parts in stock, borrowing other peoples cars so I could pick up said parts and the coolant and oil that was just everywhere and on everything that it should be. Although it should be alright now, I just have a gut feeling that something else is gonna eff up on it.
Marty, of you're still using the stock single row radiator, that's really hurting you. The plastic endtanks are also prone to cracking and leaking. There are cheap full aluminum 2-row and 3-row radiators on eBay that will substantially improve your cooling! Of course, there are more expensive brand name versions as well.
If you need to pull some heat out of the engine quickly, try cranking up the heater in the cabin. It makes it a bit uncomfortable on the inside, but it might save the engine a bit of stress, as it's pulling extra heat from the core to heat the cabin. Well, that's how it works on my 50 year old car, not so sure with these new fangled contraptions :)
@@mattobrien2584 I’d say before, simply because I remember Craig Baird said to them when he was driving the lotus to rev match, which I noticed Marty didn’t do. I could be wrong but that’s my guess
Great to see another post. Just watched the supergramps build again this week and watching the mini one now but keen to see it back. Keep the work up boys
To win the race first you must finish the race, building engines for big power on a dyno or a hot lap is not difficult, witness the F1 teams back in the turbo days building one engine for qualifying and then another to use in the race, making an engine last reliably when hammered is where the difficulty ramps up.
A few ''fun'' facts about brakes, first off a drilled rotor is not good for track use, as the holes a basically removing thermal mass and are prone to causing cracks. Slotted isn't really needed either, but usually gives you increased initial bite and can be helpful if they get wet as steam wont get trapped between pad and the rotor. Secondly you should be keeping an eye on those paint marks, as that is heat sensitive paint and will get burnt at different temps. This is a really helpful feature to choosing the correct pads, as they have a temperature operating range. So for example a more street performance pad will be best from 200-500 c and still have decent street functionality and still survive hot laps on track, but a real track pad will feel like a wet noodle from cold and have a optimum temp from 400-700c, this will be able to survive and perform for heaps of laps at a time, but will need some warming up. Cooling, if you don't want to get a bigger radiator, some propper ducting will help heaps. A combined front splitter and undertray and a hood that is properly vented, meaning lets air out not in :D Is going to make that rad work heaps better. Also some ''cad'' to make sure that air is forced trough the rad and don't get to escape around it is a big thing too. You can also increase the boiling point by increasing the cap pressure so if it gets hot it can keep the coolant as a liquid and not turn into steam and stop cooling.
we have stuff in the states called water wetter. if you do track days with bikes you have to drain all the ethylene glycol coolant out of the bike and use water wetter instead. helps drop running temps by a few degrees and can use with coolant or without.
bl/bp(4th generation Legacy) was such a fun and underrated car. It's too bad Subaru went a different direction with the Legacy after that generation and now they're discontinued. It should have been the Subaru version of KIA Stinger way before the Stinger.
I own a ford, and i've been told that they make some oil on the air side of the turbo to stop wear. Ford and Subaru both use Garrett turbos. Try lifting your filter over the level of the turbo if poss. That may help.
A couple of things I would check into is seeing about building an insulating heat shield/box for your intake, getting a turbo blanket and also seeing about finding somewhere you can get cooler air ducted into your intake charge. Just some things I picked up running a QR25DE at the track last year after bolting a turbo to it and running an open pod filter like yourself.
A decent disc and pad combo in the rear on Subarus helps the brakes overall immensely. It takes a lot of stress off the front. I had CL6 pads and decent discs on my JDM SpecC with standard rear discs and pads. I ended up getting fade with RBF600 fluid. Upgraded the rears to DBA T3 discs and Pagid RST3 pads and no fade all day, and front brake temps were a lot lower. The previous trackday I put so much heat in the front, my Brembos went from Gold, to Brown to midnight purple and cooked the dust seals inside.
Regarding the Brakes, you may want to look into cooling for the brakes. You can upgrade the rotors and the pads all you want, but if there is no air to cool them, you will cook them again. Maybe it's possible to route some piping from the front to the brakes. Love the trackdays, keep it up
The water pump and all associated coolant lines are sump level so are FULLY submerged in the sump oil so they have a cooling ability that NO OTHER ENGINE is capable of..I live my gen1 h6 na conversion..6 EJ engines in 4 years and haven't touched it since h6 went in ..
I just want to honestly state that I think your channel is one of the most entertaining channels on the tubes. If I see a new vid, I know I am going to have a good time. Keep it up bros.
internet expert here: that oil catch can is undersized for that engine. Especially the lines to and from it. Check the diameter of the OEM lines and use that as a minimum, especially if your modded lines are longer. Otherwise you will get overpressure and it will find its way out through places you don't want it to.
To improve cooling you want water, not "coolant". The glycol/ water mix is needed for anti-freeze, but are less good at conducting heat. Put in water with a little rust inhibitor. Supergramps...full cage, 4 buckets. Supergramps track taxi 👌
I have the European Spec Legacy, sedan, 2007(facelift) and it has similar characteristics with this one. Front bumper doesn't align properly, power steering pump is noisy as hell, it's prone to overheat if I thrash it, but I never will because mine is the EJ204, 165 hp, 2.0 NA so not a track car, rather a nice comfy daily. I'm a big Subaru fan and will always have a Subaru of my own and one of the reasons I love MCM is the Subaru content. Kudos to you!
@@sam_ausz3281 been hangin for months.. all talk no action.. they finish the civic.. and go play and break the subie. I bet the next series will be super gramps again.. maybe it should just go... "IN THE BIN!"
@@sam_ausz3281 you will probably be waiting a while. its not a Subaru, a 200sx or a glorified Golf. at least the constant stream of Japanese kei cars were a change from the same old stuff over and over again. i still watch the channel, but its gone from an actual DIY mods channel to 'look what we can do with free top of the line engine management systems, a few experts making it work, free dyno time and a few bolt on bits that make the car less comfortable, throw out the speedo (wrong tyre sizes) and less practical as you cant go anywhere without a ton of filling stations on the way! and then bang on about electric cars being the future, and how they must fit a cat even to a track only car.....
EZ36 engine wont blow up, its not an EJ25 xd, rear axle shafts might snap from turbo H6 torque after some time, unless you had that replaced with something stronger.
Marty, I am so envious of you! That generation of Outback/Legacy/Liberty is my dream car. Honestly. I owned one with a ( factory ) turbo. Unfortunately I bought an abused car and she broke on me in less than a month, long before I could modify her. Couldn't afford to fix it, had to sell. Still makes me sad five years later.
The reason why SuperGramps is tail happy is the R180 rear diff you guys put in. Mine has the same diff and does the same thing, the R160 diff you could also get with the 6 speed doesn't do it, I don't think the R160 was an LSD like the R180 is.
I doubt you warped those discs. If you weren't already using a pad that was designed for track it's probably more likely to be pad material transfer onto the face of the disc, or uneven pad wear that's causing the shuddering. Brakes that big should cope absolutely fine on track with the right pads, right brake fluid and if needed a bit of ducting to aid brake cooling.
through tuning can you make the car under or over steer. it looked like and feels like you're having some on power over steer so you can do 3 different things that all will change the handling. first thing is softer swaybars in the back or stiffer swaybars in the front. softer means that you load the tires better and you get more grip but too soft gets wobbly and not fun to drive. second thing you can dowhich if you have adjustable springs and dampers is by decreasing the spring rate in the back. same thing here, softer means more grip with the added benefit of squatting under acceleration which improves traction to an extent. third thing you can do is something I played around with on my track day car before it went to the scrap yard (I hit a moose but my rollcage did save me from being hurt) and that is toe in out back. by having 0.1 or 0.2 degrees of extra toe in out back do you give the car an artificial wheelbase that is longer than the real life wheelbase. but it also helps the responsiveness on turn in. so you get a more stable car that is faster to react on turn in but you get more time from the instant when you start to slide to when you are so sideways that you can't save it any more
Hey Marty! Not sure what the rules are in regards to scrutineering, but you might want to check out a mod we used to use back in the day. It's a water-methonol system, which uses those tiny little garden irrigation sprayers to spray water-methonal mix onto the radiator or intercooler. Admittedly only ever seen it used on intercoolers, but worth a look at for the gramps (if allowable). 🤔🤷♂️ Great to see you on the track mate. Thanks for sharing your super sprint experience with us 🤙
Always make Shure ur brake return springs are present on the pads and even go to the trouble of making stronger ones .as a mechanic I can't tell u how often I see these missing ..they help stop that warping of the disc by creating a gap for heat to disappear when not in use rather than staying in contact and smoking ...u guys should try the water sprayer brake upgrade .it's basic and works gives 50%+ more brake ability ..u run timer relays to ajust the water sprayers in the hubs and no water EVER even reaches the track ..and u don't have to spend to much on brakes for minimal gains like usual ..
Im surprised you didnt put a koyo radiator or other full aluminum radiator. What about the reverse cooling mod? Id like to see your experience with the mod and actual cooling benefits. And yes catch cans for heads and crank case breathers
*paused at 2 seconds* I've been subscribed for a while now, and I've had my share of laughs watching your content, but I can definitely say that the absolute hardest and longest I've laughed is this moment where the video opens up and Moog is wearing a "I love driving honda" shirt! Thanks for the chuckles blokes! (I'm American, I dont even know if I used that right!)
Hondas are great, to bad the honda culture is the most toxic in the car community. Iv seen gangbanger idiots shoot other idiots over whos 3,000$ hondas better
Yes, Super Gramps is back. Hope he'll be ok 🤞🏻 I'm no expert but would waterless coolant help with your overheating problems? Evans do a performance range
I still remember watching the episodes of y'all building Super Gramps and that EZ36 is an absolute beast and sounds AMAZING through that turbo and exhaust. It sounds TOTALLY different with the external camera. My boosted J32A2 in my CG1 Accord doesn't sound that good through a GTS3582 turbo and an Invidia single in dual muffler exhaust.
I suggest looking at a 3 row aluminum radiator from ebay. I'm sure they make one that'll fit SuperGramps. Side note - Subwoofer mounted on the desk makes the racing scene feel like you're in the car. Fun stuff!
YEWW!! I've been waiting for this for a long time! Supergramps has to be one of my favourite youtube builds. Its built cleanly and for the driver, not for the 'clout' that most youtubers base their views off. Keep it up! i'll definetly be watching future episodes
I recently got a legacy wagon and man even for being a stock 2.5, its an absolute shout to drive. This makes me SO EXCITED to see super gramps return as its my dream spec legacy wagon.
@mighty car mods just a little suggestions.. share experience on track day, you need to adjust your tire camber at least frt -2.5 min and rear -1.5 degree. Then toe out frt and rear tires.. you will feel way better on handling and improve your lap time. Since you car will have full grip on tire instead of from middle to outer section.. just sharing what I learn from pro racer driver... 😊
@@phuzz00 I would 100% watch this. Especially if they did some minor mods to it like some tires and a little bit of suspension modification.... Cuz it won't have to slow down for the corners.
Get those heel-toe downshifts going. Once you get the hang of it, it really helps with not unsettling the car while downshifting. It seems like a small thing, but once you do it you'll see how much a difference it makes with confidence in the car.
![GT-R Powered 240Z [Dyno Disaster]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/844PvOyhv0g/mqdefault.jpg)
![GT-R Powered 240Z [Dyno Disaster]](/img/tr.png)
It's been very Honda-heavy around the MCM garage as we completed the task of finishing someone else's project. This episode we're bringing back turbos, all wheel drive, ethanol and many other things back via one of our most beloved projects, Supergramps! It's the wagon that keeps on delivering the goods year after year. It's over 5 years since we first kicked off the build and we know many of you found MCM through that series. If that's you, we want to say a big thank you for sticking around and being a part of this weird and wondering stuff we spend a lot of our time doing. It's easy for the worlds of cars, mods, meets and even youtube to get very serious, tribal and competitive... so this is a reminder of why we do what we do, we take a cheap old Subaru, learn, collaborate, modify and test over years with one constant - a massive grin from ear to ear while we push this car (and our other cars) to it's limits!
also... We made this Hoodie and we really like it: mightycarmods.com/products/retro-speed-hoodie
IN THE BIN!!
Toite
thank you so much for that honda build y'all, i had an ek i did alot of work on quite a few years ago. Y'all brought my love back for hondas (and ek's) more than I've ever had before, and I could like re-live my build. Love all that you guys do!!!
V8 M3 is the best potential track MONSTER youz have got boys 👍
Was so sad when Gramps got the soaking of death, but in the long run definitely worth it! Supergramps is legendary.
Hey Marty - I was the M3 guy who let you past! Great to chat with you and Moog - you guys are absolute legends! I couldn’t believe how fast SG goes on track - respect!! And the lap time you did is amazing 🤙
Marty, Have a look at the airflows within your engine bay. I suspect that as you still have an open TMIC scoop and you have no undertray the air in the engine bay and there fore behind the radiator/Intercooler and is a mess of turbulent air at speed and you are probably getting positive air pressures where you should be getting lower pressures. An oem or diy flat undertray, sealing in the sides of the radiator to create more of a duct to keep the high pressure air in front of the radiator and sealing up the TMIC scoop might inprove your cooling at the track.
Yep you’re definitely on to something there I reckon! All things we will investigate.
@@mightycarmods Would be stoked to see you try this. Even the under tray makes a big difference in cooling at the track in my experience. It would be great content for an episode to experiment with airflow mods and the benefits.
Imagine if they made something Aero af? That would be sick
@@mightycarmods I made myself a flat undertray on my Evo X and it works perfectly. It took me a good minute, but it's a very good thing to make for a car you want to track. 2-3mm aluminium sheet should work just fine and won't add too much weight, though I made it from galvanized steel and added roughly 20kg in the front.
@@mightycarmods Turning the stock intake around can help.
I really like when a channel will bring back a "finished" car and do something with it whether it's modify it just a little further or taking it out on a track. It's so nice to see a well known car make a return, I'm so glad you guys don't fall victim to the "it's finished so it can't be shown again" mentality.
What’s Marty’s success rate on track days where he says out loud “the car is doing {x} but I’m just gonna send it for this last lap” only to find out that last lap hurt the car?
60% of the time it happens every time.
The decision to send it *makes* it the last lap
They buy scrap cars with broken engines and then "repair" them, obviously these cars are going to break if you push them.
@@waty0usay1 Meh, most will be fine when pushed. The problem is that you need to measure the engine time in hours and maintain them properly. Just changing the oil every time it's been pushed isn't enough.
I bet it didn't hurt anything, probably his pcv setup routed to his intake is where the oil is coming from.
Not a single bolt on super gramps has even been even slightly turned by me, personally, and yet I'm oddly proud of his performance and solidity on the street and track... Well done, Marty
Bet you the guy in the M3 never thought he'd be overtaken by Japanese oil tanker.
It probably weighs the same as the subie. New bimmers are absolute pigs.
@@papapetad Not far off. Standard EJ25T Liberty GT Wagon weighs 1,555kg. With a EZ36T it should be weighing in the ballpark of 1,635kg.
F80 BMW M3s weighs 1,621kg.
SuperGramps made 477bhp - (291bhp/per tonne)
F80 BMW M3s make 425bhp - (262bhp/per tonne)
This is assuming that the M3 is stock. If there's some light modifications done to it, it would probably be slightly more powerful than SuperGramps.
@@shona5512 Wow that is thorough 👍I think that power figure for SP is atw, isn't it? That means considerably more at the crank as well. It was ripping through the gears, even taking into account short-shifting.
@@papapetad That figure was with drivetrain loss taken into consideration. SuperGramps made bang on 400hp at the wheels. So with an AWD, manual car it should be making (give or take) 477hp at the crank. Either way, it's giving the BMW a real run for its money, even more impressive of the M3 has supporting mods.
The M3 is an oil tanker as well.......
Supergramps was my favorite build series and just really the best thing I’ve ever watched on YT so happy to see him get some love here. The collaboration really made it memorable!
Y'see, this is why Colin McRae's famous 'win it or bin it' driving style worked with the Subaru. He knew it was a case of getting to the end of the stage as fast as humanly possible before his engine found a way to eat itself
YES! 4th gen winning! I recently autocrossed my outback xt (converted to legacy suspension) and it is such a blast on track. Super simple setup, larger rear sway, 255 section tires (RE71R), that's it chassis wise. Mine only makes 250 wheel but I was still able to run right between a (probably underdriven) z06 and a 997 911 Cab. I can't imagine how awesome it'd be with an EZ.
The return of Supergramps, today is a good day!
Marty: "All wheel drifting, no biggie"
Nobody: *EUROBEAT INTENSIFIES*
"This M3 is pretty quick" instantly overtaken by a large ship
He let me past :P
@@mightycarmods did he really marty 😅
He saw you coming and got scared
You mean *b o a t*
Crazy that Marty caught him that fast too, those M3’s aren’t slow
It's great to see Super Gramps again. Earlier iterations inspired modification of my 05 Outback XT, which my sons friends called the Dad Mobile. Modified with a short throw 5 speed shifter, air intake, up-pipe, down-pipe, cat back exhaust, stiffer shocks, stiffer anti-sway bars, performance/street rotors & pads, over sized rims & a modest dyno-tune putting 250 HP to the pavement;)
Thanks guys.
'anyone who says their modified car is finished, is an idiot' 😂 never has a truer word been spoken!
GAGAGAGAGAGAGA this is wonderful! PRANK! IT is terrible! I looked in the mirror and saw something UNPRETTY: my face. GAGAGAGAG! But I am happy agayn because I have TWO HOT GIRLFRIENDS and I make cool YT v*deos with them! Good evening, love and peace, dear carl
Lol what
My car was finished once. It had all the accidental mods, never to be driven again.
@@AxxLAfriku mate we are talking about cars not carl
It’s never finished. Ever.
Marty: I’m gonna be cautious I don’t want to hurt the car
Also Marty: the coolant is rising up but let’s send it anyways, we got to make a good time.
This is the number 1 internal battle I have with myself ALL the time when on the track
@@mightycarmods No plan survives first contact with the enemy.
always good to see you boys doing what you do, whether you love it all the time or not 😏
we do love it all the time, or we wouldn't post :P
@@mightycarmods fair play, gotta be some frustrating parts of the job though, that’s what makes it a job
@@mightycarmods Does Rake love it though?
You know moog secretly loves the civic hatch👀🔥
Waiting for the next episode to find out what was causing the oil leak. Hopefully nothing serious. 🤘
I'm guessing oil slosh in the corners made it to the breathers in the valve cover, a lot of boxer engines seem to have this issue if their sump isn't well baffled. If SG's engine is still stock then I'm guessing the sump is pretty basic considering it's an SUV engine.
You know it's a quick car when your worried an M3 and Lotus will slow your lap down 😂
The m3 driver was a total legend, I went and spoke to him afterwards to thank him for helping me get a clean lap. He was doing 1:47’s from memory
@@mightycarmods awesome, nothing worse than someone who doesn't understand when to let someone through, loved the video guys 👌👌
@@mightycarmods nice to see gramps out tho
When the car sits still when it’s hot, the pads keep some heat in the discs so the disc cools at different speed, creating two different sizes of metal within the size and thus warping it. Roll the car back and forth just a little to move the disc past the pad a couple of time to help it cool evenly. I went from a set of rotors a race meet to never changing them again. Dream result.
I'll remember that!
Another quickie is to keep the engine running for a bit to cool the oil down, otherwise hot oil will, for the sake of explaining it quickly, simply slip off bearings, journals & seals, effectively drying them while theyre still too warm, which will heat them up shrink them, then possibly loosen them up, could cause spinning bearings.
And in addition, next time you start engine, journals are empty, so wears them out even more, AND "wears out" the oil too because it wasnt cooled before shutdown, in such a way that it effectively starts the sludge process.
Two great tips , thanks
Two bits of advice I was given at my first track day with a car club.
1) Cooldown laps are a thing. Don't race back to the pits, cruise back at a casual pace and your engine oil, coolant and brakes will thank you for it.
2) Don't set your parking brake once in the pits, it can cause hot spots, warping or even cause the pads/shoes to stick. Pit's are usually flat so leaving the car in gear after shutdown will keep it still, also wheel chocks are cheap.
Did anyone hear Marty says “danger to manifold” during flat out. Lol
Danger to head gasket, lol!
Gramps is a wagon, and will have more mass at the rear axle, and it will tend to have the rear end break free first. Not much you can do to about it. If you want to try to figure it out, read Fredrick Puhn’s book “How to Make Your Car Handle”. It is one of the best basic manuals on handling ever written. It has just the minimum amount of math, and does a very good explanation of the basic physics vehicle handling, and explains things like ounce and roll steer, and how to get rid of them.
I think it's more of an overall design thing in this case, I had a 4th gen sedan and it too was tail happy
Gramps couldn't hold his liquids after seeing those times XD
Gramps needs a diaper after Marty sent it...
I had an 08 LGT Spec.B but it got totaled a few months back. This video made me so happy and brought back some great memories.
When Marty said in the intro that we're talking about broken subarus, I had to clear my schedule cause I thought this video was going to be 5 hours oong
Hahaha
Glad I'm not the only one who is having car trouble this week.
Monday i blew the stock transmission oil cooler line, so changed that to a braided line.
Tuesday my radiator had a crack down the side and was leaking everywhere so replaced the radiator, Wednesday I was overheating with no leaks, worked out the thermostat was stuck closed so replaced that.
Friday car started sounding rough as guts but no overheating or anything, soon as I turned the car off the coolant overflow tube was like a pressure washer, worked out the where the stem vent hose from the radiator connects to the expansion tank was clogged giving me an increasing amount of air build up in the system, also took the air intake off to give the filter a clean and had a heap on oily gunk on the throttle body and filter.
And to top it all off, once that was all sorted I go to jump in the car, only to see I got a flat tyre that has a screw in it 😔.. didn't know whether to laugh or cry.
DAMN SIR, WHAT A F'KN WEEK.
@@NoWr2Run it was an absolute nightmare of a week, spent hours calling around for parts in stock, borrowing other peoples cars so I could pick up said parts and the coolant and oil that was just everywhere and on everything that it should be.
Although it should be alright now, I just have a gut feeling that something else is gonna eff up on it.
SUPERGRAMPS FRIK YES!!!Hands down my fav build .
Edit:Old gramps is faster than i remembered.
Right? I thought its only an amazing drag car, but its a super decent track car as well xD
Marty, of you're still using the stock single row radiator, that's really hurting you. The plastic endtanks are also prone to cracking and leaking. There are cheap full aluminum 2-row and 3-row radiators on eBay that will substantially improve your cooling! Of course, there are more expensive brand name versions as well.
Marty's laughter after that over steer was just everything i needed to hear this morning haha
If you need to pull some heat out of the engine quickly, try cranking up the heater in the cabin. It makes it a bit uncomfortable on the inside, but it might save the engine a bit of stress, as it's pulling extra heat from the core to heat the cabin. Well, that's how it works on my 50 year old car, not so sure with these new fangled contraptions :)
11:00 that cheeky BMW-Wheel in the back... they are teasing again :D
That's all I've seen in this episode: BMW bottle cap wheel in the background.... I must be biased
Did you catch martin asking for a ride home in moogs lotus? either this was recorded before they sold the lotus or moog got another
And I think I seen the e30 in the pit garage at one point as well
@@mattobrien2584 I’d say before, simply because I remember Craig Baird said to them when he was driving the lotus to rev match, which I noticed Marty didn’t do. I could be wrong but that’s my guess
@@jordanwilliams1627 me too. Not sur it was MCM's one but it looked like
I love the pit this is going to turn into. New internals, new everything else around it! 600HP Super Gramps!
Looking forward to it :)
Great to see another post. Just watched the supergramps build again this week and watching the mini one now but keen to see it back. Keep the work up boys
Honestly, Supergramps is probably my favorite Mighty Car. It’s fast, it’s practical, and it seems so liveable. Just a great fast daily.
Imagine the internal monologue of the guy in the lotus getting chopped by the grocery getter while on a racetrack.
He's probably still lapping while Marty has his engine in bits.
@@popuptoaster u mad bro haha
True... but the lotus bloke probably drove home
@@popuptoaster Its a lotus, no way unless its on the back of an AA truck
Well we know the driver ended up selling that lotus, so perhaps that speaks to the feelings at that time.
To win the race first you must finish the race, building engines for big power on a dyno or a hot lap is not difficult, witness the F1 teams back in the turbo days building one engine for qualifying and then another to use in the race, making an engine last reliably when hammered is where the difficulty ramps up.
im soooo happy to see supergramps back, ive wanted to see more of it since the series ended
I actually rate the handling on my spec b wagon. I’ve only got the basics but it handles so damn well.
Moog just got owned and he knew it.
Supergramps is such a good build, keen to see it back in the shop getting some love and maybe a couple upgrades
Yeah, like bucket seats :D
A few ''fun'' facts about brakes, first off a drilled rotor is not good for track use, as the holes a basically removing thermal mass and are prone to causing cracks. Slotted isn't really needed either, but usually gives you increased initial bite and can be helpful if they get wet as steam wont get trapped between pad and the rotor.
Secondly you should be keeping an eye on those paint marks, as that is heat sensitive paint and will get burnt at different temps. This is a really helpful feature to choosing the correct pads, as they have a temperature operating range. So for example a more street performance pad will be best from 200-500 c and still have decent street functionality and still survive hot laps on track, but a real track pad will feel like a wet noodle from cold and have a optimum temp from 400-700c, this will be able to survive and perform for heaps of laps at a time, but will need some warming up.
Cooling, if you don't want to get a bigger radiator, some propper ducting will help heaps. A combined front splitter and undertray and a hood that is properly vented, meaning lets air out not in :D Is going to make that rad work heaps better. Also some ''cad'' to make sure that air is forced trough the rad and don't get to escape around it is a big thing too. You can also increase the boiling point by increasing the cap pressure so if it gets hot it can keep the coolant as a liquid and not turn into steam and stop cooling.
Always nice to see some of the OG builds making a reappearance!
we have stuff in the states called water wetter. if you do track days with bikes you have to drain all the ethylene glycol coolant out of the bike and use water wetter instead. helps drop running temps by a few degrees and can use with coolant or without.
Marty: I broke my Subaru it sounded a bit like this *knock knock knock*
Me: my Subaru isn’t supposed to make that noise!?
They all make that noise
That's my favorite comment
bl/bp(4th generation Legacy) was such a fun and underrated car. It's too bad Subaru went a different direction with the Legacy after that generation and now they're discontinued. It should have been the Subaru version of KIA Stinger way before the Stinger.
12:10 Still dropping E30 hints even after we got to see the E30 build.
I own a ford, and i've been told that they make some oil on the air side of the turbo to stop wear. Ford and Subaru both use Garrett turbos. Try lifting your filter over the level of the turbo if poss. That may help.
Martin “oh my god, what’s going on?”
Subie Oni awakens “I have slumbered for a thousand years...”
Sounds amazing. Great car setup, nice track video, Marty is such a humble chill feller, and another cliff hanger! Quality.
Good to see Super Gramps again!
Perhaps a 52mm alloy radiator and oil cooler next mods (?)
Yeah I reckon that’s the go
the all-wheel slide at around 9:38 or so was majestic. way to ride it out and let it come around. great video!
"And this didn't blow up!"
SuperGramps: *starts leaking oil*
Breathing in oil is the only thing that will keep a Subaru engine from blowing up.
A couple of things I would check into is seeing about building an insulating heat shield/box for your intake, getting a turbo blanket and also seeing about finding somewhere you can get cooler air ducted into your intake charge. Just some things I picked up running a QR25DE at the track last year after bolting a turbo to it and running an open pod filter like yourself.
Love how Marty has a completely different aim with his cars than Moog
A decent disc and pad combo in the rear on Subarus helps the brakes overall immensely. It takes a lot of stress off the front. I had CL6 pads and decent discs on my JDM SpecC with standard rear discs and pads. I ended up getting fade with RBF600 fluid.
Upgraded the rears to DBA T3 discs and Pagid RST3 pads and no fade all day, and front brake temps were a lot lower. The previous trackday I put so much heat in the front, my Brembos went from Gold, to Brown to midnight purple and cooked the dust seals inside.
Love Super Gramps!! Always been a multi-use/utility kind of guy. Hauls people. Hauls stuff. HAULS BUTT!!!
Regarding the Brakes, you may want to look into cooling for the brakes. You can upgrade the rotors and the pads all you want, but if there is no air to cool them, you will cook them again. Maybe it's possible to route some piping from the front to the brakes.
Love the trackdays, keep it up
Moog sneaking in: "You're an idiot, you crash all our drones." Some repressed frustration there.😂
Yeah Moog was going out of his way to kick Marty at that moment. Probably some tensions behind the scenes.
Crashing drones is what Moog gets for never bringing a wallet when going out with Marty. xD
The water pump and all associated coolant lines are sump level so are FULLY submerged in the sump oil so they have a cooling ability that NO OTHER ENGINE is capable of..I live my gen1 h6 na conversion..6 EJ engines in 4 years and haven't touched it since h6 went in ..
That look in Moog's face says he knows..... Oh he knows. Have to respect a friends self control. That's a friend
I just want to honestly state that I think your channel is one of the most entertaining channels on the tubes. If I see a new vid, I know I am going to have a good time. Keep it up bros.
You guys may need to start a MCR ( Mighty car Repairs) youtube channel at this rate!!
internet expert here: that oil catch can is undersized for that engine. Especially the lines to and from it. Check the diameter of the OEM lines and use that as a minimum, especially if your modded lines are longer. Otherwise you will get overpressure and it will find its way out through places you don't want it to.
Love this episode. Feels really good to see and hear driving.
To improve cooling you want water, not "coolant". The glycol/ water mix is needed for anti-freeze, but are less good at conducting heat. Put in water with a little rust inhibitor.
Supergramps...full cage, 4 buckets.
Supergramps track taxi 👌
Now the crazy scientists over here will need to pull an all-nighter to fix those piston rings you fried.
I have the European Spec Legacy, sedan, 2007(facelift) and it has similar characteristics with this one. Front bumper doesn't align properly, power steering pump is noisy as hell, it's prone to overheat if I thrash it, but I never will because mine is the EJ204, 165 hp, 2.0 NA so not a track car, rather a nice comfy daily. I'm a big Subaru fan and will always have a Subaru of my own and one of the reasons I love MCM is the Subaru content. Kudos to you!
So when are you pulling out the old GEMINI out of storage? The drive shaft must have arrived by now...
Also hanging out for the Gemini build!
@@sam_ausz3281 been hangin for months.. all talk no action.. they finish the civic.. and go play and break the subie. I bet the next series will be super gramps again.. maybe it should just go...
"IN THE BIN!"
I think you can blame covid and border closures, this would be a build Al would help on and he did mention he had some builds in the pipeline with MCM
@@BaMenace Gramps in the bin??? Not gonna happen. I reckon the GEMINI has already been sold as a "project car" lol
@@sam_ausz3281 you will probably be waiting a while. its not a Subaru, a 200sx or a glorified Golf. at least the constant stream of Japanese kei cars were a change from the same old stuff over and over again. i still watch the channel, but its gone from an actual DIY mods channel to 'look what we can do with free top of the line engine management systems, a few experts making it work, free dyno time and a few bolt on bits that make the car less comfortable, throw out the speedo (wrong tyre sizes) and less practical as you cant go anywhere without a ton of filling stations on the way! and then bang on about electric cars being the future, and how they must fit a cat even to a track only car.....
EZ36 engine wont blow up, its not an EJ25 xd, rear axle shafts might snap from turbo H6 torque after some time, unless you had that replaced with something stronger.
Moog: "anyone who says their modified cars finished is an idiot anyway" the best project car summary ever
Marty, I am so envious of you! That generation of Outback/Legacy/Liberty is my dream car. Honestly. I owned one with a ( factory ) turbo. Unfortunately I bought an abused car and she broke on me in less than a month, long before I could modify her. Couldn't afford to fix it, had to sell. Still makes me sad five years later.
"You crash drones and break subarus"...me too, Marty. Me too.
Same here... and my Subarus aren't even modified.
The reason why SuperGramps is tail happy is the R180 rear diff you guys put in. Mine has the same diff and does the same thing, the R160 diff you could also get with the 6 speed doesn't do it, I don't think the R160 was an LSD like the R180 is.
The noises supergramps make 🔥🔥💚
Every. Time.
@@mightycarmods it does sound truly awesome
I doubt you warped those discs. If you weren't already using a pad that was designed for track it's probably more likely to be pad material transfer onto the face of the disc, or uneven pad wear that's causing the shuddering. Brakes that big should cope absolutely fine on track with the right pads, right brake fluid and if needed a bit of ducting to aid brake cooling.
Saturday lunchtime MCM? Awesome 👌
Saturday evening for us!
Saturday morning! MCM is the most important meal of the day!
@@mightycarmods you guys live in the future. And Americans in the past. Great vid, hope SuperGramps is ok and its just some O-rings!!
through tuning can you make the car under or over steer. it looked like and feels like you're having some on power over steer so you can do 3 different things that all will change the handling.
first thing is softer swaybars in the back or stiffer swaybars in the front. softer means that you load the tires better and you get more grip but too soft gets wobbly and not fun to drive.
second thing you can dowhich if you have adjustable springs and dampers is by decreasing the spring rate in the back. same thing here, softer means more grip with the added benefit of squatting under acceleration which improves traction to an extent.
third thing you can do is something I played around with on my track day car before it went to the scrap yard (I hit a moose but my rollcage did save me from being hurt) and that is toe in out back. by having 0.1 or 0.2 degrees of extra toe in out back do you give the car an artificial wheelbase that is longer than the real life wheelbase. but it also helps the responsiveness on turn in. so you get a more stable car that is faster to react on turn in but you get more time from the instant when you start to slide to when you are so sideways that you can't save it any more
Did Marty say "can I have a lift in your lotus" at the end?
They probably filmed this awhile ago.
'I was chasing your lotus down'
I'd say it was a while ago
Hey Marty! Not sure what the rules are in regards to scrutineering, but you might want to check out a mod we used to use back in the day. It's a water-methonol system, which uses those tiny little garden irrigation sprayers to spray water-methonal mix onto the radiator or intercooler. Admittedly only ever seen it used on intercoolers, but worth a look at for the gramps (if allowable). 🤔🤷♂️
Great to see you on the track mate. Thanks for sharing your super sprint experience with us 🤙
"cool, I'm not coming. Good Luck, have fun, don't blow up your car man" - funny as fook
Always make Shure ur brake return springs are present on the pads and even go to the trouble of making stronger ones .as a mechanic I can't tell u how often I see these missing ..they help stop that warping of the disc by creating a gap for heat to disappear when not in use rather than staying in contact and smoking ...u guys should try the water sprayer brake upgrade .it's basic and works gives 50%+ more brake ability ..u run timer relays to ajust the water sprayers in the hubs and no water EVER even reaches the track ..and u don't have to spend to much on brakes for minimal gains like usual ..
“My cars meant to go fast, your cars meant to blow up”. Best line. Lmao
It's not an EJ25 motor, it wont blow up.
Im surprised you didnt put a koyo radiator or other full aluminum radiator. What about the reverse cooling mod? Id like to see your experience with the mod and actual cooling benefits. And yes catch cans for heads and crank case breathers
*paused at 2 seconds* I've been subscribed for a while now, and I've had my share of laughs watching your content, but I can definitely say that the absolute hardest and longest I've laughed is this moment where the video opens up and Moog is wearing a "I love driving honda" shirt! Thanks for the chuckles blokes! (I'm American, I dont even know if I used that right!)
You used it right. 👌
You can control understeer and over with swau bar. If you are tail happy soften up the rears, or stiffen up the fronts a bit
"I love Driving Honda" - Sure you do. lol
Ha I just spotted the tee. Nice.
Hondas are great, to bad the honda culture is the most toxic in the car community. Iv seen gangbanger idiots shoot other idiots over whos 3,000$ hondas better
But does it fit the Honda? Moog
So happy to see Super Gramps back on the channel! Hope there's more to come! 😊
I'm so happy to see super gramps back.
Yes, Super Gramps is back. Hope he'll be ok 🤞🏻 I'm no expert but would waterless coolant help with your overheating problems? Evans do a performance range
"Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in." -Supergramps, probably.
I still remember watching the episodes of y'all building Super Gramps and that EZ36 is an absolute beast and sounds AMAZING through that turbo and exhaust. It sounds TOTALLY different with the external camera. My boosted J32A2 in my CG1 Accord doesn't sound that good through a GTS3582 turbo and an Invidia single in dual muffler exhaust.
Hi MCM, when will you guys drift the Mira again like 7 years ago?
Stuff that. A GEMINI build has still been promised. Last thing we wanted to see was another episode of ol' super gramps
I suggest looking at a 3 row aluminum radiator from ebay. I'm sure they make one that'll fit SuperGramps. Side note - Subwoofer mounted on the desk makes the racing scene feel like you're in the car. Fun stuff!
it's amazing nsw cops haven't defected it! go team!
YEWW!! I've been waiting for this for a long time! Supergramps has to be one of my favourite youtube builds. Its built cleanly and for the driver, not for the 'clout' that most youtubers base their views off. Keep it up! i'll definetly be watching future episodes
Imagine having a Lotus and being absolutely destroyed by a Subaru Wagon on the track...
That's gotta hurt more than a little bit.
I recently got a legacy wagon and man even for being a stock 2.5, its an absolute shout to drive. This makes me SO EXCITED to see super gramps return as its my dream spec legacy wagon.
"In this episode of Mighty Car Mods we're talkin' broken subarus"
Perfect cause I have a broken Subaru...
@mighty car mods just a little suggestions.. share experience on track day, you need to adjust your tire camber at least frt -2.5 min and rear -1.5 degree. Then toe out frt and rear tires.. you will feel way better on handling and improve your lap time. Since you car will have full grip on tire instead of from middle to outer section.. just sharing what I learn from pro racer driver... 😊
So Marty now has three broken cars.
Guess we just wait for him to break the Mira next.
Then the episode after that he'll take the Kei truck to the track...
@@phuzz00 I would 100% watch this. Especially if they did some minor mods to it like some tires and a little bit of suspension modification.... Cuz it won't have to slow down for the corners.
Get those heel-toe downshifts going. Once you get the hang of it, it really helps with not unsettling the car while downshifting. It seems like a small thing, but once you do it you'll see how much a difference it makes with confidence in the car.