Alex Hirsch Explains Dipper's Character Flaw
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 ต.ค. 2024
- Season 2 Commentary highlights are a go! The box set came out almost 4 years ago and I'm only NOW getting to uploading the highlights. Eh, here we go.
In this first one, Alex talks about Dipper's biggest flaw as a character and how originally it was going to be tackled in a much different way in the commentary for Scary-oke.
Frequently asked Questions
Q: What is this?
A: Back in 2018, Gravity Falls finally got a box set release. Among many things, all 40 episodes got commentaries for them in which Alex Hirsch talks about the episode, discusses things he liked and disliked about it, reveals hidden moments, struggles and lost stories from the production of the series.
Q: Where can I watch the full thing?
A: You can buy the box set from Shout Factory or on Amazon. Sadly, due to region lock, the box set is only available in Canada…oh, and…you know…the United States too. Unless you have a region free DVD or Blu-ray player, you’re out of luck.
Q: Why are you uploading these?
A: Due to that region lock, many fans can’t watch these, and they contain many interesting stories that I feel more fans need to hear. Thus, I’m uploading them. Not everything of course, but lot of the more interesting stuff. Oh, and also because I’m out of ideas for new videos, lmao.
Q: Why can’t I hear the characters voices in the episodes?
A: These are the commentary versions of the episodes. You’re not supposed to clearly hear the in episode talk. The main focus is what the commentators have to say. Think of it as a podcast.
Q: Why am I reading this FAQ?
A: Either you’re really bored, or I referred you to it because you left a comment asking a question I answered above, and I'm not in the mood to answer it because I'm tired of answering the same questions over and over again. Hey, I'm a human too. And so was Mabel, so shut up, Mabel hater!
I do not own Gravity Falls. All rights go to Disney Television Animation and Shout Factory.
#GravityFalls
#ScaryOke
#AlexHirsch
DISCLAIMER!
The target audience of videos on the That GF FAN TH-cam channel are, and always have been for ages 13 and over. Videos on this channel may contain coarse language and/or content suited for an older audience. As of 2020, all future videos on this channel are made with an audience in mind that is 13 and older. - บันเทิง
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 82 วันนี้!! คู่เอก | ยอดไอคิว vs อับดัลลาห์](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/hSsyTl_9bqs/mqdefault.jpg)
gravity falls really captured the feeling of being a middle schooler, especially the desire to be wanted to be taken seriously as shown with dipper.
I remember trying to grow a moustache at that age for that reason. It looked so bad in retrospect I looked ridiculous.
“the desire to be wanted”
Stop you’re giving me an anuerysm
Dipper wants to grow up too fast while Mabel does not want to grow up at all. It's such a great way to create a dynamic, funny, and touching sibling relationship.
The most unique thing about GF is the sibling relationship between Dipper and Mabel and the reason why it's done so well is because Alex understands that relationship
Too true! And I especially appreciate that from having lots of siblings myself it’s good to see that stand point! Like almost ever other show they always are an only child 😆
@@violetcupcake I'd argue that thanks to this show, most Disney TV Animation shows afterwards feature some sort of sibling bond, whether it be birth siblings like Molly and Darryl or Cricket and Tilly, or makeshift ones, like Anne and Sprig or Luz and- a good amount of other characters.
It’s really not done all that well. Mabel is straight up abusive to Dipper at times and this is never really acknowledged.
@littlemoth4956 Not really. She acts like a sister. Sure, she teases him, but she never purposely goes too far. She acts like the 12 years old that she is. Of course, she is going to be immature.
Gravity Falls really captures the feeling of being that age especially the way it shows the two sides of the story Dipper is the type of middle schooler who just wants too grow up and Mabel is the type of middle schooler who loves childhood and being a kid it's so well written i love how it all builds up overtime and in the end both twins learn something Dipper learns to value childhood and Mabel learns you do have to grow up but you don't have to do it too fast or alone
Yeah they both learned
This is why it's so annoying when people say that Mabel took away Dipper's happiness or whatever. Was she a little selfish? Yes. But Dipper not going to work with Ford at such a young age was a _good_ thing for him. He would have skipped high school and locked himself up in a basement with no friends, just for the sake of some research. He would have skipped over his childhood entirely. Mabel was a flawed character but she was a foil to Dipper for a reason. While Dipper was there to keep her grounded and not let her do anything reckless, Mabel was there to show Dipper that it's okay to goof around and act like a child, because that's what he is.
Not to mention that Mabel never actually forced Dipper to give up Ford's apprenticeship. Dipper did that on his own because he decided that his sister was more important to him than going on adventures with his Grunkle Ford.
@@kacieboskey8358 Exactly. She even apologizes and tells him that he can still choose to stay with Ford. It's just that Dipper realized by then that it wasn't a good option.
She is really a good sister to Dipper
That was well said.
Between this duality of "wanting to grow up" and "not wanting to grow up," Bill Cypher exists in both.
He grew up away from his own home dimension, even destroying it with everyone he could ever once love out of sheer boredom, and he didn't grow up because every single thing he did was beyond immature and selfish.
He's the darkest extremes of Dipper's and Mabel's goals.
I feel like, Dipper giving up on the internship with Ford would have been more impactful, if they actually gave a proper moment to show why Ford is a bad role model *after* Dipper accepts.
Interestingly enough, there had been a plan to show that but it got cut. Alex explains it here: th-cam.com/video/-KqdO5fmwFE/w-d-xo.html
I actually think it's more impact full without that. Ford WOULD be good for Dipper, but he chooses not to go with that, because it's no longer what he wants.
@@lukeroberson2115 Except there's no evidence for that, the only thing that changed between Dipper wanting the apprenticeship and him turning it down, was Mabel being a brat and refusing to leave Mabel-land, and saying he wasn't going to stay was the only real way to convince her.
@@Lyrikle Immediately after they leave Mabletown Mable says to Dipper that he doesn’t actually need to not take the internship for her and he can do what he wants and she understands, then Dipper himself says he realised it’s really not what he wants, to be a 13 year old stuck in a basement all the time and being an adult already. Mabletown was important for Dipper and Mable character both as a mid ground, as Dipper realises he needs to slow down and Mable realises she needs to go a bit faster and they come to a good mid ground they both want. People never mention about the guilt that afterwards she tells him not to not take it because of her and the reason Dipper doesn’t do it is because he doesn’t want to, not just because of Mable. And why would dipper parents let their thirteen year old son move out in the first place for more than a summer it was dumb of Ford to not even consider Dippers parents.
@@reesepettigrew3626 Yes, and there's no build up to that, he goes from being psyched about it to being dismissive of it with no actual show of the reasoning and consideration that would lead him to that conclusion, the *only* thing shown counter to his position was the impact it would have on Mabel, and realistically, him telling her that he wouldn't want to be "stuck in a basement all the time" is no more than platitudes considering how much field work Ford obviously did and Dipper knew about.
Dipper wants to grow up faster and no one bats an eye.
Mabel holds on to her childhood and EVERYONE LOSES THEIR MINDS!
Dipper sacrifice count: The Time Traveler’s Pig, Little Dipper, The Deep End, Sock Opera (beginning), Abaconings
Mabel sacrifice count: Carpet Diem, Sock Opera (end)
Compromise count: Escape from Reality
Dipper is over twice as likely to give up what he wants as Mabel.
Edit: Got an episode’s name wrong
*SOCIETY*
@@Joseph_Drew_III In Mabel's defense, she did let Dipper be taller at the end, but he ultimately kept things the same since they reconciled and after he realizes that he's had the advantage over things like games he let her have this. Also in Abaconings she's also trying to deal with the same problem Dipper has with Waddles and that they'll lose that connection. Time Traveler's Pig, Dipper was already kinda cheating with time travel and he isn't really forced to go back and more like he willingly does so after seeing Mabel devastated. And plus he needs to learn that this wasn't really to get Wendy, or even to get Wendy.
I don't wanna sound like I'm like a Mabel fanboy, but a lot of his sacrifices are not entirely for Mabel, but to grow better himself too
She literally caused “the end of the world” it wasn’t just her trying to hold onto childhood memories..
@@ivyproductions7097 I'm gonna sound more like a Mabel fanboy unintentionally but in her defense, Dipper and more importantly Ford should have disclosed to Mabel about the rift.
Although I do imagine she might still do it even if she knew what the rift was. Suffice to say they should have been honest to her as well.
I know Dipper already had his character arc, but it's not like a character is restricted to one arc in their lifetime. Dipper didn't end the summer perfect with nowhere to grow. I would love to see a show where young adult Dipper returns to Gravity Falls to solve some final mystery.
@@MichaelHaneline it’s hard to make a beloved character go through a new character arc. The image of that character as he was will forever be stuck in the minds of the viewers and changing that status quo might rub a lot of them the wrong way. It’s like when Naruto came back as a father in boruto along with all the challenges that it brought forth. People deemed the character arc bad just because it clashed with their view of the character even though the new struggles he was facing were completely coherent for him. He grew up without a father so he didn’t know how to be one. If Dipper comes back with a half assed character arc or even a good one, there’s a high chance people are gonna have a negative opinion of it.
I like that Mabel and Dipper represent both sides
Mabel wants to never grow up while Dipper wants to grow up too fast
And in the end they came to the conclusion that both ends aren't great
This gives me more appreciation for the epilogue scene that's at the end of the Journal 3 tie-in book.
... So *this* is why I related to Dipper on a spiritual level. Darn.
Bill only said to dipper that "and besides, what has your sister done for you lately?, how many times have you sacrificed for her, huh? and when has she returned the favor?" to manipulate him and how weird a lot of people say that was true which it is not entirely and on the first episode she repayed him by defeating the gnomes and at the end she apologized, she also repayed him when he brought her pig back by humiliating his rival Robbie, after he saved Mermando she told him he did the right thing and repayed Him by helping him further and she called him a hero whether he had the journal or not at the end of s1 ep20, in my point of view that's not toxitiy.
@@duduamrosh that’s true, heck the episode where bill did trick dipper she literally gave up her whole puppet show, just to help her brother
I love how getting a better understanding of Dipper’s journey over the show is helping other people gain a better understanding of Mabel too! IMO, Mabel gets hate because a lot of viewers feel like she was holding Dipper back from his dreams. Alex presents the dilemma in a new light, however, showing that Dipper was at risk of losing everything else in his life that mattered. Just like with Stanley and Ford, there was a very real chance that they would lose each other forever. In the end, both pairs of twins make up and recognize how important their family is.
And yet so many people still defend Dipper to the death. Lady Luck would like to have a word with them, because Alex Hirsch himself dislikes the individuals who find nothing wrong with him.
This is a team that really understands people. Just the way they talk about the characters, it isn't "me-me-me" it's about the actual character decisions
If Dipper's flaw was wanting to grow up fast and be a adult already, then Mabel's is just to never grow up. A summer that never ended.
See Mabel's World.
What is your point?
True that. And we see both give up their flaws for a bit, especially considering the end of the world is upon them, and both have no choice but to beat their flaws to help be a part of the fight against Bill Cipher.
That wording reminds me of dialogue in Doctor Who 'Hell Bent'
'Do you know why we run, Doctor?'
'Because it's fun.'
'Because we know summer can't last forever.'
'Of course it can. Of COURSE it can. You just need to steal a time machine.'
Box set highlights are back!!
Heck yes!!
Interesting I never thought of Dipper’s maturity and determination as a flaw. I realized the whole family is the more important than career them, but I always looked at him rejecting Ford’s offer as a personal sacrifice for Mabel than a benefit for himself.
Determination to succeed is one thing. But growing up too fast isn't the same as maturity. Take it from someone who didn't get a choice...
This is so cool! Thanks for showing us the weaknesses of the characters.
I still dislike the reactions Mabel's arc gets. I don't even remember the things Dipper sacrificed being too big or anything! The internship would've ended up with him skipping childhood entirely and regretting it later along with probably missing his sister anyway. Meanwhile, it's not like Mabel is getting upset about nothing. They've been together for their whole lives and she's upset about the internship. Not to mention they have a whole example of what could happen to them if Dipper did take the internship, that example being Ford and Stan. She made a mistake falling for Bill's tricks, but he manipulated her when she was feeling at her worst.
As for other moments, it would've been way worse for Mabel to leave Waddles than for Dipper to miss out on a chance to impress Wendy. The only kinda bad thing I can think about is the Sock Opera, but the episode also clearly showed that it wasn't very nice what she was doing and she did sacrifice the whole thing in the end. They're literally twelve-year-olds dealing with super confusing paranormal stuff, cut them some slack.
She is really a good sister
I wonder who "the man" Alex was saying his life was being ruined by chasing adulthood.
I think he was talking about Ford, because he did the same thing.
Yeah it was definitely Ford, everything he explained was shown in Journal 3
This makes me remember that scene from season 2 episode 17:
Dipper: *Explains what he wants to do when he gets older*
Ford: If you want to do something, then why stay in the drudgery of school.
Dipper: Trust me i could fast forward the whole thing but its not like i have a choice.
What exactly do you mean?
@@duduamroshI think he’s saying that that scene personifies dippers main character flaw, his need to grow up and mature faster
@@mattkugelman4369 Thanks
you know a character is perfect when such a popular show needs the CREATORS to point out flaws because NO ONE ON SOCIAL MEDIA has anything to complain about 💀
especially crazy bc social media always complains lmao
Gravity Falls also was created at a perfect time tbh, so it has a lot of nostalgia for most people at this point. If Gravity Falls were to be created now people would find something to be mad about, like the love potion episode.
And also, did you note the wars against whether Mabel has a horrible character or not? While the intentions in here are clear, everything was set up such that it looks like Mabel gets what she wants and Dipper does not. Had Gravity Falls released in 2020 or something like that, Mabel discourse would floss every single Gravity Falls content that is not solely a meme that excludes Mabel.
He's not pointing out flaws, he's talking about dipper's character flaw.
A character flaw is an essential part in writing realistic, empathetic characters. If you leave out flaws, you end up writing a Mary Sue.
That was well said. Honestly I can relate to both Dipper and Mabel.
Dipper’s desire to grow up too fast makes him relatable. I used to be like Dipper and wanted to grow up too quickly, but I learned to appreciate childhood.
Finally we got some anser gor this. Thank you for this!
Everyone on TH-cam Hates Mabel but literally they're 2 sides to the same coin.
What do you mean?
I really wish they explored Mabel having to grow up. It’s always Dipper having to learn lessons whilst Mabel rarely ever does.
Worst of all she gets obnoxious with rarely ever learning anything, and it saddens me cause it is fun when she’s in conflicts.
My favorite of these examples being the Boys Crazy and Gideon’s debut.
Idk why, but I love Candys party outfit
I think the show handled Dipper's arc very well... I wish Mabel had been handled a bit better. While Dipper is trying to rush ahead and become an adult, Mabel is really immature and is kind of clinging to her childhood too much... that she's unwilling to change as she grows up. We're sort of shown Mabel's flaws when she gets trapped in her fantasy land, but we never get a full on acknowledgment that Mabel is reckless, immature and selfish. Dipper needs to not be in such a rush to grow up. Mabel needs to grow up. And the show kind of indulges Mabel's bad behavior, always demanding that Dipper be the mature responsible one.
Well they do make it clear that Mabel does have a chance to grow up with Dipper by her side to help her, so there is a good reason to believe she will mature in later years.
And when people say she's selfish, I think they're kind of exaggerating. Her selfish reasons are never intentional, and if anything, they overtly say many times that what she wants to do is help people and make others happy (isn't that the opposite of being selfish). And needing help from someone to get through life doesn't immediately make them selfish.
Mabel really does have more growing to do, but it feels like that was the point, and that she doesn't deserve all the scorn she's gotten. Personally I think people wouldn't be so hard on her and would view her as the fun energetic character character she's meant to be seen as if not for the simple aspect of her being tricked into starting Weirdmageddon when she was in an emotionally vulnerable position.
@MC the Toonster There are plenty of episodes when Dipper goves up something he wants to fuel Mabel’s latest random obsession. The only two times Mabel gives something she wants up are when someone’s life is on the line. There’s a lot people CLAIMING Mabel’s generous, but no real examples.
@@Joseph_Drew_III Most of what Dipper gave up for Mabel were related to things that were never going to work out to begin with such as being with Wendy. It’s also implied that the apprenticeship would be the same.
@MC the Toonster It’s not implied at all. And even if it were, none of that disproves my point.
“always demanding that Dipper be the more mature responsible one.” That’s part of Dipper’s flaw. By trying to grow up too fast, to be mature and “take the high road” all the time, he becomes an enabler to his sister while he looks down on her behavior. The show doesn’t demand that he do that, he demands that of himself, and it creates a self-perpetuating cycle where Mabel thinks her brother can always be worn down by enough silliness and Dipper thinks his sister can always be taught a lesson with enough rationality. Their conflicting extreme ideals of what’s best drive the conflict and create angst for both of them.
Alexa Donne is another fan of the "need plot throw a party" Trope.
i just relized that gravity falls is kinda pg cabin in the woods but we dont get a answer to everything
I like FAQ
Glad Dipper didn't take Ford's offer. Ford was the worst version of Dipper. Dipper believed Ford was going to be the hero that will defeat Bill, but at the end, Dipper realizes that he was wrong. Stan was the hero not Ford.
Exactly!!
@@ThatGFFAN Dipper didn't believe Stan would be the hero to defeat Bill and also it was Ford's fault. Stan would have taken his hand to complete the spell if Ford didn't acted like jerk. Ford made too many bad decisions. Dipper was so caught up of his intelligence and making the journals, that he didn't see what Ford gave up and made him paranoid. Dipper didn't see what kind of person Ford really was.
@@AH-is5yg The apprenticeship would have wasted his teen years doing research or whatever judging by his own words.
(I find it really annoying when people keeps saying that Mabel forced him to reject it)
@@duduamrosh dipper would have ended like Ford. Ford made too many mistakes.
@@AH-is5yg Yeah it always irritates me whoever keeps saying that she forced him to reject it.
It is irritating to you as well,right?
Dipper in the show: (saves Wendy from a total creep and the town from various monsters)
Alex in the commentary: “Every writing decision I made went towards depicting Dipper as a war criminal.”
Actually, The Time Traveler’s Pig and Scary-oke do a good job of highlighting Dipper’s flaws, but they do so in a way that imply they are one-offs rather than a character arc of eventually overcoming a flaw
if that's his character Arc I don't think they did a very good job with that. Dipper accepts The Internship and then after like two episodes with no real indication that he's been thinking more about it about how silly he's been for wanting to grow up too fast he just gives it up because Mables throwing a tantrum and caused weirdmageddon. this show doesn't have many flaws but I would say that that is one of them that if this really is Dippers character Arc they didn't do a very good job with it.
I think they should have gone with the government agent thing instead of Ford.
The Apprenticeship with Ford is much better, they have a closer relationship and Dipper knows that he can see all the mysterious stuff that he wants to see through ford much better than with anyone else, including the government.
@@umariqbal7557 Exactly. Before he even met Ford, Dipper was practically idolizing The Author of the Journals. Finally meeting Ford and clicking so well with him did nothing to change that. So being offered an apprenticeship with The Author would be way more tempting than becoming a junior government agent.
@@umariqbal7557 yeah
JESUS WILL COME SPREAD THE WORD PLEASE ❤️💕
honestly i still think mabel is toxic and ford was the better option
Sorry I disagree
She is not toxic
She helps him whenever he needs her such as solving mysteries or getting close to Wendy and various sweet things.
She does grow as a character and faces the consequences.
Is he though? Ford's obsession with becoming this legendary scientific mind isolated him from everyone else and ruined his relationships, had Dipper taken the offer the same thing would have happened to him.
@@matti.8465 It is really irritating how people keeps talking about Mabel like she is the female younger version of Satan.
Dipper would have ended up isolated and spending most of his time doing research.
Especially since he was a kid.
That was better for him not to take it.
Am I right?
I respectfully disagree.
Losing your childhood and your family would not at all be worth it. And I disagree about Mabel. I do wonder if people forgot that children aren't the devil.
That's a lame flaw.