yes I am so sure u understand him so very deeply just by watching his english speaking clip.... for real for real. No hate for Astel thou. But the viewer who think they know the person on the screen on a deep level to say something like "realest" should just take some tests. Even IRL streamers, the one job that who litterally show their real life to people, are not actually "show" everything to viewers but to think a Virtual streamer can "show" how "realest" they are to you just so dilusional.
You can really see from the comments who follows Astel and who don't. Also btw, Astel still interacts with the girls on Twitter. They're fine. He isn't avoiding them. He literally just joked about joining Neoporte.
@@heerotomoe Right! He had an entire stream following her around to find a griffin. That same stream he went around helping everyone hunt which included female streamers but people are still saying he's avoiding interactions 😅 I get only watching clips if you don't understand Japanese but being confidently wrong about something is a different level! Lol
@@tuner575 That Griffin hunt with Karubi is literally the only main thing he has done in VCR Ark with another female streamer... And even then it was Karubi who initiated it. He's not completely avoiding girls but he is very clearly not mingling with them as much as like in Rust.
@@Chaos2Frozen He quite literally plays alone in Ark majority of the time and only moves to groups of people when they approach him first or he thinks they need help. He was also in Rion's party at some point in the stream. I think a lot of people are blowing it out of proportion because they expect him to still do the "cursed man" skit since it's an open server game. Dude came from hours long of dance practices and recordings, he just wants to play the game without having to think much. He's been wanting to try and play Ark for months. Everyone's genuinely overthinking it.
@@Chaos2Frozen Comparing it Rust is also a bit different, he planned to play in the server with Nana and ToiToi from the beginning since they were all new to the game. In Ark, he just wants to play.
I'm glad that Astel actually talked a bit about Holostars in general because not too long ago some members talked about Holostars' future as well. Like has it been hard? Yea, to no fault of their own because again, they weren't welcomed in the beginning but still continued on that path without throwing fire back. The small strides have become achievements. At the end of the day, even if not everyone is openly talking about their circumstances, they are all also aware that it is a business they're in, too. Regardless, I believe Astel will be fine no matter what happens. Even with the worry of black lash, it doesn't mean that he can't focus on himself. You can't please everyone and even when venturing out to make connections there's going to be some people in the fandom that takes it the wrong way or demands otherwise.
After reading the comments, I fear that people are drawing the wrong conclusions out of this video. The point of Astel's whole talk is not that 'Oh, no! Because of these damned so-called "fans", poor seaweed boy can't collab with girls, or be himself and do the things he enjoys. We should now go fight these people off of our community' Do you want to support him and make sure that we have him for the years to come? Then go watch him. Participate in chat, make fanart, clip stream moments, tweet at him with ideas for content that you would like to watch, and tell him when you enjoyed the content.
Those wrong conclusions are the easiest to make (I agree with you btw). A lot of people like the feel-good idea of "supporting da bois," but it unfortunately turns out to be lip service most of the time. Rather than focusing on those dang dirty parasocials it would be more beneficial to put that energy into actually watching streams.
Freaking THANK you. I don't get why this is a difficult concept to grasp. He realizes that doing those chaotic things aren't making him money and dedicated fans, just people that like to watch the chaos and not actually support the boys. People can't form their own thoughts and opinions and just repeat what other people say about "parasocials" without even knowing what the word means. These people who love to say "let them do what they want and collab with who they want" never actually watch or support the people they stick up for. I don't get these people.
Glad there are sane people in the comments. Never understood that concept. The "fan" , they constantly blame, at least watch them! They also give money, support , and will come to next stream. Problem for me is the money. . . and also language barrier but that no big deal.
people have said it many times before, if everyone who "likes the holostars" actually put the time and effort into supporting and promoting them they would be in a much better place.
While it's almost a par for the course to blame anything on parasocial unicorns / idol culture, *PLEASE* do not forget that there are other types of problematic fans that Astel also mentioned here. 1) Overly obsessive fans who keep bringing his pairing with Niu / cursed antics up even on unrelated streams and collabs. It's fine to ship them, but don't reduce one or both of them to just the ship and nothing else. 2) Overprotective fans. Not the same as unicorns and more of "normal" fans who otherwise just misinterpreted the situation and assumed that their oshi might actually be annoyed / uncomfortable with Astel. At the end of the day, *please respect stream rules* and do not bring up other streamers or topics unrelated to the stream unless the streamer themselves brought up it first. And while it's hard not to worry in certain situations(Niji fans know this too well), and it is good to provide constructive criticism, *diving straight into hate piling accomplishes nothing and only cause more damages. This applies even when you meet other problematic fans mentioned here.* I personally know all too well not all fans can be reasoned with, but please at least try instead of just throwing insults off the bat. As Astel mentioned, anything that happened on stream, no matter how wild, most likely already got approval beforehand. So if your oshi laughed along with the joke, just assumed that they're at least okay with it and if they truly was uncomfortable, they just would sort it out behind the scenes by themselves to make sure it never happens again.
Thank you for this note. It was frustrating to see this nuanced talk reduced to "unicorns/gachikoi bad" when they're rarely the issue for him... If possible could you pin your comment for better reach?
Parasocial is parasocial. Wanting to control the stream and the streamer, who they hang out with, what they do, how they act, being overprotective, shipping, etc etc. This is all parasocial behavior. Even just wanting the streamer to say hi to you. It's just different levels of being parasocial. So yes, the problem is people being parasocial to very unhealthy degrees.
I recently had a discussion with a niji fan who were on the hardcore side niji is family kind. That person saw most commentary aginst niji as hate comments rather that criticism and even admitted that it is difficulty to critique niji in their eyes. I were as neutral as I could be and tried to be polite but I will be honest hardcore fans do bring several issues not only parasocial ones in case of unicorns/gachikois. I mean sure niji is getting heat since atleast last year but the situations have been bad and course correction from them is needed imo. Said fan had a good point though, hate spamming and anti behaviour isn't the best way to do it and I agree with them on that.
Astel's always thinking about the Holostars name in anywhere he goes, but it makes me so sad whenever he tries to exclude himself out of it in order for the rest to shine (around 12:06). I got into Holostars because of Astel, and I enjoyed his cursed arc and trolling shenanigans A LOT, so its rlly a shame how some of his arcs can't stick around for too long cuz of antis and "fans" who can't take a joke. Also rlly appreciate him saying his thoughts behind the scenes throughout the early stages of his VTubing career and arcs. The thoughts of "oh i could do BL if management wanted me to" or "i'd be a teetee machine if thats just what girls would like" makes me glad we have the current version of Astel rn.
It's always fun to watch his cursed arc, as I know he's doing it just for fun. I felt delighted when he interacted with other streamers, especially girls because he used to be awkward around them and left no impression. I wondered why he doesn't do those cursed streams anymore or general live streams and keeps a distance from everyone. Now I understand that he may have lost interest in streaming due to this "fans" problem and may have almost quit.
recently vtuber called mysta rias graduated for (presumably) same reason, these "fans" are so delusional and cringe, but sadly these kind of fans comes with any streamer (especially holo and niji) if they don't set boundaries clearly so there's really no escaping them unless they openly and clearly admonish those viewers which isn't gonna happen because exploiting and taking these people's money is one of the ways the corpo get their income.
@@shinodamasaru7945 Y'know that's the problem, right? He says in this video that shippers are part of what made him stop. Shippers are a cancer to any community.
Astel's cursed arc was truly one of the most entertaining periods i had watching vtubers. Knew that it probably will end like that, but glad that now feels like astel is back in the saddle. Was watching him from almost the debut, and he is such a talent, i love him a lot. glad that bad fans didn't manage to drive him out fully as it happened with some vtubers.
15:05 Man, I got emotional when I heard this. It's so heavy. The Astel situation, from what I understand, is problem between Astel himself and his fans. This is a difficult time. The feeling where someone who supports you and you feel close to them, but it gets to the point where you don't understand each other. Stay strong, my man Astel. I've been following Niu since her subs was still under 100k. And at the point where Niu felt like quitting Vtuber because it wasn't working for her. Niu is one of the hard workers I know, and it has also been admitted by Hizuki Yui, her gen-mate. In my opinion, she is the only one from Neo-Porte who actively interacts with overseas fans while streaming, even though her English is not strong. well, I follow all the members. From what I remember, Astel was concerned about this matter, because he knew that Niu had talent. Astel cares about Niu. In my opinion, it was Astel who helped Niu gain exposure with the "cursed arc". For those of us who watch it, it may seem like Astel is crossing the line, but like he said, the line can be different for each person and he doesn't think he's crossing the line. He also makes sure everything is under control, planned, and also has the approval of whoever he's interacting with. I hope the fans can understand the Astel's circumstances, but most importantly, understand the Holostars' circumstances. My man is willing to do everything he could to maintain everything.
I think what he got was unfair to him. I'm the one who didn't ship Asniu. Because I know that Astel only did it to entertain the audience. I've been worried about this since the VCR rust. I'm so sorry that his audience treated them like a couple. Niu viewers say that Astel doesn't treat her well. During the Apex event with Matsuri Astel once said that doesn't want to have a relationship with a streamer. I think Astel doesn't want to have an official ship like Marine. When meet someone who doesn't oppose him. It made him stressed too.
This is really eye opening especially the last part of him not loving himself and that he would dissapear if he had a break makes you realise how fragile people are (In a good way)
Personally, I'd like him to continue his cursed arc since it was entertaining af and the way Astel interacts with others outside of holostars made me curious to check those people while he can spreading Holostars's name as he said he's leading the charge with Bessan Trully a based madlad and it kinda moves me
Astel often says he's one of the least idol-like members of Holostars, but he's the vtuber who has impressed me the most on stage. With that said, I think there is a pretty big problem with his way of communicating: he often says outrageous things that could induce drama like graduation or hating Holostars talk, and viewers have gotten used to wave it away with "astel is exaggerating again, he's not serious". That makes it hard for us to communicate though because clipping these things could get him in trouble and so a lot of his serious talk are sadly only known to people who watched him live
His dream of wanting Holostars to grow more popular is why he is my oshi. I recognize its a long and difficult path and I don't even know if it's possible with the current state of male idol Vtubers but I always end up rooting for him.
Seeing this makes me respect him even more. Astel is honest with these things and keeps it real in terms of how creators are people and no one is completely oblivious as to what’s going on. I’m glad he got these off his chest you go seaweed guy
I just discovered Astel a few weeks ago and after having watched all the Holostars, I really do feel like him and Roberu are the two people that stick out as genuine and not so much corporate. I do hope that he'll continue being Astel but I can also see him do way better as a solo streamer that is not chained down by company rules. He definitely has what it takes to earn a large following because he's funny af, he's relatable and he makes every collab he is in all the more better.
While I think the cursed arc brought a lot of popularity towards Astel, it also generated a small number of haters/antis as well. IMO, i personally enjoyed every single moment of Astels' before he even started this cursed arc. I think it's a very, very, very small number of haters that made him feel this way, his Japanese viewers are very loyal and understanding as well so it might be the very small minority that didn't like this type of content. It's always fun to see him interact with people (male or female). I noticed this very small number of shippers/antis as well very early on, with the interactions between Niu and him happening and mentioned this on a another video as well. Streamers aren't stupid and astel clearly is a very smart guy to notice these things quick. If we wanna have nice things, we gotta be nice. When the streamer has to mention these kinda stuff, then yknow we done goofed. It also saddens me extremely when he talks about leaving content creation or when he talks about holostars. Most of his usual fans also know he was in a very depressed state few months back, not streaming and being sick etc. I know he'll bounce back because thats the man I choose to support. (thanks for translating once again! it really helps people to come across and understand his point of view)
Astel is legit incredible, I could list virtues of his all day, but what I always come away from these serious talks with is the level of empathy and humanity he displays. He's pretty young, not much older than Izuru, but he has such a real understanding of the emotions and motivations of the people around him, and for as much as he can let something slide off him in the moment, he internalizes negativity really easily. Astel might not love himself, but he loves his fans, and he loves Holostars. If Holostars is thriving, and his fans are happy, then Astel can be content; if he feels like the fans aren't happy with him, or a Holostars project doesn't perform well, he blames himself for not being good enough. The best thing you can do to support him isnt to attack his antis, it's to watch his streams and give him real, constructive feedback on them. Astel wants to hear from his viewers, he wants to know what we want to see; even if there are games he plays and streams he does because he loves them (Fuga comes to mind), he wants to keep those other ideas for another time. I remember being in a karaoke stream of his a long time ago, and he asked chat to really hold back on commenting with just applause, and to give him like, real feedback. Do you like these songs? What do you want to hear? How was my voice? He's asked for merch feedback too; what kinds of merch would you want to buy? What would be worth it to you? Astel merch is always top-quality, by the way. The sweatshirt from "One Two Shine" is so comfy, the Pollneu wallet from his 2022 new model/birthday reveal is the perfect size, and the "Twin Crew Stars" shower set works great.
It's fun while it lasted. And a person can't control a whole crowd. I really do like how the viewers joke around and the ship was also strong (though there will also be some bad apples here and there). Though in my opinion, I do respect the decision because sometimes, when dragging it out for so long, the fans will be more divided and no one can tell who is the one troublesome anymore. People can't tell which is the ship, which is the joke and who are the aggressive ones anymore, especially on the internet where tone cannot be predicted through just merely texts.
I really hope Astel is able to come to the point where he can love himself no matter what circumstances he finds himself in. I've been there; it's truly hell on Earth.
astel is going through the same problem kanda had when gunkan was super popular. kanda was known for "being gundou's partner in gunkan" but not as "shoichi kanda". doing the gunkan skits and bits didn't help him grow at all. it's the same thing with astel. people stick for "the cursed thing" but not for "astel leda". kanda has had the same talk about it before as well. he's simply airing out the thoughts he had because he often does egosa and sees everyone opinions (also he has a list of all his fans on twitter so he definitely sees everything). no matter how small those comments are, there'd always be a loud minority that he will notice one way or another. but i think that's overshadowing the main thing he wants to convey, please support his solo content! his covers, lore videos, solo streams outside of fps tournaments, and 3d projects. he has lots of them! even if you can't subscribe to his menshi, leave at least one comment or even just a like. he has fought management a lot for his ideas to come to life. please give his solo content a chance!
additionally, it seems like most don't know about this, but he doesn't like being seriously shipped with anyone regardless of gender. especially under the comment section or in official tags. he has mentioned this time and time again. jokingly talking about ships in the context/nuance of the stream is okay but people also took the asuniu ship too far and started asking/bringing stuff about her at every chance. it wasn't only people against the ship but people pushing so hard for it as well. he was really faced with two extremes during the time of doing that bit.
Shame that this comment has so few likes but the comments talking about "no no no it's clearly those toxic unicorn gachikoi fans that are the problem" are getting all the attention. People really don't know how to form their own original thoughts.
@@TheMaleEnjoyer honestly was surprised a huge part of the comments was just about the fans and not the latter half but i guess it's because it was the opening topic... just wished people paid attention to the other half too
@@TheMaleEnjoyer Its because those people have been conditioned to call everything that they don't like or understand as "parasocial, idol culture, etc" everything has just become a buzzword that is meaningless now.
i appreciate this comment. it put my thoughts to words exactly. it's important to hear the words he actually says, and the overall feel for where they come from vs. viewing everything through our own biases
Astel really thinks a lot about these kinds of things, even though he calls himself dumb. He wants the best not just for himself, but for the boys as well, and tried to get their name out despite the possibile antis. You can also tell how caring he is. I'm so glad he decided to have a real talk with us instead of just disappearing. I myself am also that type of person, and it takes a lot of effort to communicate rather than just drifting away. I wish Astel would care for himself more, but I don't have the right to say that considering how I'm the same
Genuinely so entertaining in groups, and is very funny to watch. He truly shined in those moments for me (not that he doesn't on his own). Hopefully we can see more of him being himself. Like he said, his cursed self is closer to his real personality lol.
Aww, man. But his cursed arc is how I got introduced to so many new personalities. He basically opened the door for Holopro into these amazing VCR events.
It’s great that astel is open about this bullshit. No matter what there’s a lot of people still supporting holopro without being dumb and creepy so not all is bleak. My respect for this man at this point is unmeasurable
I noticed he took a long break. I'm not completely surprised he's not feeling well about streaming, but hearing him talk so in depth about it is shocking. It must be pretty bad if he's unable to keep the negativity to himself. I hope it goes well. He's a hard working guy that cares a lot about everyone.
I always have so much respect for Astel for being able to talk so openly about his feelings- he’s truly a real one. Something as self-destructive sounding like how he’s ok disappearing as long as his friends are unhurt speaks volumes. He deserves so much love🙏
It's all fun and games until people start taking everything too seriously. It's either he's taken too seriously about the collabs or he's not serious enough about his interactions with others in people's eyes. I was so glad to see him talking to people outside of Cover-- even collabing with Niji EN!-- because I love seeing him interact with different people, and all that turned into him almost giving it all up because people just *need* to put entertainers in little boxes where if they stepped out of it they'll get reprimanded for it. Real people and real life don't work like that.
Thanks for the clip but I think a part of the conversation is also missing. Astel mentioned that some of Niu's fans were telling him that he doesn't treasure Niu enough and both Niu's and his fans started treating them like a real couple. He didn't mind it at first but then he realized it might affect Niu too which is why he distanced himself from it. He doesn't like it when it bothers other streamers that why he lowered down the jubutsu content when the fans are started to push hard for it. GunKan as another commentor mentioned, and OreApo themselves have mentioned it too. Maybe people are not familiar with it but OreApo had a period where they didn't collab because the shippers got too annoying. I think Hinano has a clip about it but it's in JP. No idea if that got translated. And for the lot saying "no wonder Astel doesn't do collabs anymore", he generally doesn't collab with other people though? He is very much a solo streamer unless invited. Not sure why that's such a big deal if you're actually familiar with his content. He has periods where he collabs a lot but then goes back to his regular solo content afterwards. It's pretty normal for him. 😅
I just noticed he started streaming less since the Rust series, I had assumed it was something related to this or he had a busy holostars schedule. I like Astel best when he is having fun, being himself, I hope he can be that again. I understand though, his position often comes with these delicate situations. I hope the fans can support him and also try not to bring up topics like these if he doesn't want to talk about it more.
I mean, it's probably is just busy schedules because even after Rust he was still teaming up with tons of people playing Valorant and doing his cursed stuff. But it's shortly after those initial Valorant streams he kinda reined it back a lot now.
At the end of the day, human have different tastes, feelings and understanding about the issues. There will never be a one direction answers or solution. Because you can't please *EVERYBODY* Just do you Astel, do yo.
I see a lot of people getting angry on his behalf and i get why they feel that way but try to keep it to a minimum anywhere outside of this comment section please. Attacking or berating people on his behalf won't help anything
I saw this on stream yesterday and couldn't quite catch all of it, and it turns out to be far more serious than I thought. But yeah it's painfully obvious even right now at this very moment he's avoiding interacting with any female streamers on the VCR Ark. Just purely talking to guys only.
Astel is a real bro, we all would love to hang out and play games with him 😭 It's always a blast watching his cursed arcs, I can't stop laughing, sad to see he can't do it anymore. Guess if it didn't make any success then it's ok for him to stop I'm glad that Holostars are successful now. But at the same time, it kinda sucks that they can't do things they like because of the "fans". People are easily get hurt even if it's not about them nowadays This kinda reminds me of GunKan. I miss them, guess they can't be together again for different reason. But this just reminds me of them
I love how open Astel is and how real he can be while still being genuinely kind to his viewers. I strive to be that kind of person someday. This brought back my urge to learn japanese because I'd want to watch JP streamers without this whole barrier language blocking the way
I know a lot of people already commented about the cursed arc, or his early days, but let me just say this. Bro is a really caring person. Yes sometimes what he did is kinda cursed, ksgk, but for real, bro cares about other more than himself. And yes, when the people you care about so much, do not understand you, it hurts like hell.
It's unfortunate, but it is what it is. On top of getting trouble from fans from both side and for both people involved, he's not making much money out of cursed arc. It's eye opener how much Astel is thinking how he conducts his business.
He literally said the opposite no ? His cursed arc did well for him , bought him a lot of traction and money but the hate of the antis on both sides got to him and he decided it was not worth it
@@Chaos2FrozenIt's not a mistranslation. But yeah the point that some people missed is, that it's not about making money. He knows that his cursed arc doesn't make money, but he just wants to have fun and interact with people. If it were only about money, interacting with a small group of people and giving them Fansa would be more lucrative.
I'm so sad that the community and fans have to give him a hard time about this, I really loved his clips and personality it also learned me a bit of charisma too; in an entertaining way.
I'd like to say that this is "it is what it is" moment, but nope, not this time around, cuz I've learned enough to know that it's not really their "fans" that were throwing tantrums over bits and jokes
These so called "fans" can't you realize Holostars are already struggling enough to get their names out there, to be more known to people, to make more connections, to answer all the expectations towards them? What they need right now is your understanding and support, not extra deadweight. Crap like these are the least thing they needed right now. Can you all please not stand in their way?
Yeah! I'm tired of hearing "WINNING SON" (not that it's bad, I mean it's okay, just overrated now) in some chats, when he's the "BARTENDER BOSS". And if not being able to offer them at least a single cent, why not try offering them free (or spread) artwork or custom merch of themselves or keep on listening/streaming to their own music perhaps? That's the kind of support I would most like to see more of, but haven't been able to see enough of really. Especially in the anime cons.
I still remember when astel embarrassed colab with coco and roboco at vsaikyou 3 and then to cursed astel. The cursed thing is funny for me but when it became potential damage on relationships or career its became dangerous. It's good thing for astel to step this up to talk with viewers why he kinda change thing one after another so the viewer kinda know what he thought. I remember whe he talk alot with viewer and interactive with them and now he kinda cold, i know some chat on astel kinda naughty so i kinda get it.
like fr the “fans(not really fans, just some delulu sick people)” are the one getting mad, meanwhile astel or not even the streamers talking to their fans, they are talking to each others and they are friends so like why the heck fans acting like they own their streamers?? 😂
Being a vtuber is a double edge sword. Sure it's fun to play games and do shit with friends, but at the end of the day they're entertainers and if people stopped being entertained, theirs and other's source of income is threatened.
I just wish for Astel to keep having fun in an unrestricted way, whether the “fans” approve it or not. Money is important too but I think that most of his viewers are already accustomed to his cursed arc to happen here and there, real ones will support him regardless
I wish for him to just enjoy doing what he want. I can't imagine what happen if he stop. Thank you for the translation. Because if it wasn't for your translation,im sure a lot of kaigai astellas won't fully understand what is happening and we might don't know what should we actually do to protect our alien. I'm really thankful for your thought to translate this clip for us.
He is in his mid life crisis, early in life. It was the stans, not the fans, that sped up the process. At least he recovered from it. Mid life crisis is different for different people, but for most it is questioning their life choices and drastically desiring to make a huge change to their life but most never did.
i mean lets be real with ourselves, with how people look at anime, there are people shipping those that dont even make sense at all. vtubing is just really that and it is just too obvious.
Shippers have ruined so many interactions and dynamics between people. Everyone loves to blame the dirty icky "parasocials" (a word they don't even know the definition of) but shippers have actually made people avoid each other before.
@@TheMaleEnjoyer doesnt change the fact that parasocial is a problem. shipper is a branch of the toxic fanbase. doesnt make parasocial guilt free of causing people to avoid collabs.
Well now I’m pissed. I only really learned of Astel because of his cursed arc. I thought the whole thing was funny and loved how smooth he was when talking to girls. Just enjoyed the content all the way through. I was hoping for more like this in the VCR collabs but now I see why not. Why can’t our fellow viewers accept the king as he is…
That’s some interesting and wise words from Astel here. I feel like I learned something from his values in streaming and in life generally. Astel is a real one, hope his streaming career sails smoothly!
@@akira8393 unfortunately it came at the expense of our nice things. Which sucks because they used emotions instead of logic to get what they want. You could also say they threw a tantrum and due to circumstances, Astel had to back down.
@@UtterlyShagged i mean the tantrum worked in their favor. you cant really use logic, what logic is there when his cursed streams arent even doing well? there's nothing to prove if anything just favors the emotional people
I respect his points and I'm happy he reached that point but also it's funny and I'm kind of glad he returned to his jubutsu with Reimu XD I guess he feels safer cause she doesn't follow it hard like Nui but rejects him as hard as he flirts so it's safer but still fun??
Didn't expect astel's fans to be like that tbh, i thought holostars fans are chill, like roberu and mea for example, haven't heard anything bad from them and they also still doing collabs from time to time
I've been thinking about this for some time now- but as much as people like to think some fanbases are immune to gachikois, there probably are still some of them lurking around everywhere, sending their shit DMs and marshmallow behind the scenes.
Sadly, gachikoi is there. Even more scarier than ever if u know the real gachi of holostars. They can hate simply the other party is "dangering" their idols. Dont underestimate parasocials. I once parasocials to irl idol. And I HATE that version of MYSELF now. Like, so much
Man that sucks. He's one of the vtubers that have prime comedian skills. The quickness and wittyness on his punchlines and jokes and how out of pocket it is, is one of the sides I like about him. It's unfortunate that maybe we can't see it anymore. I hope he can still find a way to show it. He's really a funny guy.
Such a shame, his cursed jokes were so funny and brilliant. But yeah if it actually doesn't have an economic return, and causes trouble, then his decision to stop is fair
i dont watch astel at all outside of the clips that sometime happen when these big collab server events happen but i watched this whole clip and this is some of the most real talks i have seen towards the viewers from a content creator from japan in regards to the whole idol/gachikoi culture, much respect for this dude
On one hand: there's a lot of doom posting in this comment section. What he said hasn't hit me as hard as it hit y'all, apparently. On the other hand: i sometimes forget that the boys have their overly attached weirdos, too. How easy one could forget the Vox Akuma incident.
I honestly miss his cursed arc, its so refreshing to see someone not afraid to joke around in that manner and it ALWAYS produced entertaining results, but I understand how parasocial fans of vtubers can be. Some people just cant let things be jokes. I think it would beneficial for Holostars to have the "bad boy" type of idol for variety, and it shows how popular it can be, Astel's cursed arc actually blew his channel up quit a bit.
I appreciate his honesty. However from how he talks about his willingness to change behavior and speed of changing preferences, I wonder if Astel has a stable ideal he's pursuing or not.
This is probably just because I'm taking some classes about gender, but I can't help but ponder over the sexual harassment talk. The takeaway is that he discussed his cursed arc in advance with the other livers, so they would be in on the joke. That people should trust they would work it out behind the scenes if either of the livers themselves were uncomfortable. 6:33 I understand his point that the person receiving the comments is the one who can decide. I definitely haven't seen all the cursed streams, but I have seen some clips. I didn't think they went too far in the scheme of the vtubing space, seemed like same old same old. Broadly speaking however, the problem is that irl sexual harassment also can go the way of the man tells kinda crass/funny joke then the women is supposed to laugh and brush it off. Because when it's boys and boys talking it can be boys' talk, and when it's girls and girls talking it can be girls' talk with everyone on an equal playing field. This is an entertainment space so the cursed arc shouldn't be thought of in the frame of irl behavior, but Astel has to work against the irl perspective of man and women discussion of cursed topic in the "workplace" it seems🤔 7:37 See...the thing is sometimes it's a calculation of is it worth the fuss to bring it up in exchange for the possible response 😅 Again, back to the takeaway that people should trust they work it out behind scenes. Idk what research has been done about gender performance or embodiment in streaming, but it's interesting to think about how irl lives shape perceptions of online interaction.
It is sad that the boys and girls can't collaborate without getting heavy back lash. I mean there in the same company. Even if they are in different branches of it. I feel bad that if they ever want to do anything public even if its simply playing a game, people will be mad. I think thats how you know whos a real fan or not.
a really nice clip i get the feeling that holostars management not only compares their livers with hololive revenue, but also global market like nijisanji boys en (which is obviously not a fair comparison) can be eye opener for some ppl to remind them once again this is also a kind of business and the livelihood of ppl behind this also depend on it
@@thieftheodore yeah im not saying its the management fault, like astel said cover as a company must have certain expectation for holoboys since they take care of them etc unlike indie activity which cant be helped
@@akira8393 viewer that usually watch regular male streamer avoid the Idols and "Holo" association. While regular "Holo" viewers avoid them because male
@@akira8393 if you meant to compare to nijiboys jp like kuzuha, etc imo its bcs holo started very late to debut boys unit + they put idol label on it, and i think public only really recognize hololive side
Seems like it's also Astel's own overly attached "fans" that want him to themselves. Kinda weird to see considering how much he's been against being parasocial.
Astel said it goes both ways, sooo "You ain't allowed to interact with Astel because he's an idol! Know your place, he belongs to me! REEEEEEE" Joke aside, yea they're just delulu from the same pod.
@@king0vitrialit's not exactly that. most of his fans are used to him interacting with other people and aren't really possessive that way. he does get issues with shippers and "mama" fans who are overprotective sometimes. From my (flawed) perspective as a long-time fan, he really doesn't like being protected or seeing his fans fight with others. The cursed arc unfortunately led to a number of clashes between his fans an others. I'm not sure how bad it was, but Astel has (imo) an unfortunate tendency to look up what his antis say about him, outsiders, as well as his regular fans comments, and take all that in as feedback even if it wasn't intended that way. For example, if antis say something hurtful and a fan of his fights back against that, he hates it. Ultimately, it's best to just enjoy your oshi's content, be good and stay out of fights between fans and antis. No one likes to see your fans misbehaving, even if it's in your defense
I wish that more fans of Holopro as a whole would understand that Hololive's & Hololstars' idea of "idol" isn't the same as the the typical Japanese idol that's supposed to be pure and flawlessly perfect. Holopro's idols are flawed, they make mistakes, they are imperfect, they have have personality, they are human. They are the best idols, they are often rude, they are often loud, they are often lewd, they are often cursed, etc. These are the idols I love and will support for as long as it can.
@@Fishman465 Nah, she's a perfect idol alright. In the best way possible, she looks out for her fellow members and she will go along with them, even on more yabe things like we saw recently in that minecraft collab were she read Ollie's yabai books (lmao). Tokino Sora is more than just an "idol", or even a "perfect idol", she is "Hololive's Perfect Idol".
You know its funny that there are people in the comments here like "I never even watched his streams but he should have stuck with the cursed arc", maybe if you all actually did support him by watching streams instead of just being clip-only fans then maybe he would have kept doing what he wanted instead of having to focus on appealing to gachikoi again lol.
I mean, that does nothing to resolve the main problem that the people who do watch those streams have the tendency to take things too far in both directions.
![Lisa Is Afraid of Astel Spreading His Curse to VSPO Members [VSPO]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/VvN30cQSVWM/mqdefault.jpg)
Astel is legit one of the realest people in HoloPro. I love how open he is
not only holopro but the whole vtuber community
yes I am so sure u understand him so very deeply just by watching his english speaking clip.... for real for real.
No hate for Astel thou. But the viewer who think they know the person on the screen on a deep level to say something like "realest" should just take some tests. Even IRL streamers, the one job that who litterally show their real life to people, are not actually "show" everything to viewers but to think a Virtual streamer can "show" how "realest" they are to you just so dilusional.
@@H4444-f7g Alright dude. Tell me where the doll touched you? 😂
Being “real” isn’t about showing your true self, but about talking honestly about things that would usually go unsaid.
@@H4444-f7gI don't think you understand the concept of "being real"
You can really see from the comments who follows Astel and who don't. Also btw, Astel still interacts with the girls on Twitter. They're fine. He isn't avoiding them. He literally just joked about joining Neoporte.
Right? He recently had a whole mini-arc as a hero with Karubi-hime for goodness sake 😅
@@heerotomoe Right! He had an entire stream following her around to find a griffin. That same stream he went around helping everyone hunt which included female streamers but people are still saying he's avoiding interactions 😅
I get only watching clips if you don't understand Japanese but being confidently wrong about something is a different level! Lol
@@tuner575 That Griffin hunt with Karubi is literally the only main thing he has done in VCR Ark with another female streamer... And even then it was Karubi who initiated it. He's not completely avoiding girls but he is very clearly not mingling with them as much as like in Rust.
@@Chaos2Frozen He quite literally plays alone in Ark majority of the time and only moves to groups of people when they approach him first or he thinks they need help. He was also in Rion's party at some point in the stream. I think a lot of people are blowing it out of proportion because they expect him to still do the "cursed man" skit since it's an open server game. Dude came from hours long of dance practices and recordings, he just wants to play the game without having to think much. He's been wanting to try and play Ark for months. Everyone's genuinely overthinking it.
@@Chaos2Frozen Comparing it Rust is also a bit different, he planned to play in the server with Nana and ToiToi from the beginning since they were all new to the game. In Ark, he just wants to play.
I'm glad that Astel actually talked a bit about Holostars in general because not too long ago some members talked about Holostars' future as well. Like has it been hard? Yea, to no fault of their own because again, they weren't welcomed in the beginning but still continued on that path without throwing fire back. The small strides have become achievements. At the end of the day, even if not everyone is openly talking about their circumstances, they are all also aware that it is a business they're in, too.
Regardless, I believe Astel will be fine no matter what happens. Even with the worry of black lash, it doesn't mean that he can't focus on himself. You can't please everyone and even when venturing out to make connections there's going to be some people in the fandom that takes it the wrong way or demands otherwise.
Damn. This -seaweed- man spitting facts after facts..
I respect him even more now. All the love & support to Holostars ✊🏼 Never give up!!
After reading the comments, I fear that people are drawing the wrong conclusions out of this video.
The point of Astel's whole talk is not that 'Oh, no! Because of these damned so-called "fans", poor seaweed boy can't collab with girls, or be himself and do the things he enjoys. We should now go fight these people off of our community'
Do you want to support him and make sure that we have him for the years to come? Then go watch him. Participate in chat, make fanart, clip stream moments, tweet at him with ideas for content that you would like to watch, and tell him when you enjoyed the content.
Those wrong conclusions are the easiest to make (I agree with you btw). A lot of people like the feel-good idea of "supporting da bois," but it unfortunately turns out to be lip service most of the time. Rather than focusing on those dang dirty parasocials it would be more beneficial to put that energy into actually watching streams.
Freaking THANK you. I don't get why this is a difficult concept to grasp. He realizes that doing those chaotic things aren't making him money and dedicated fans, just people that like to watch the chaos and not actually support the boys. People can't form their own thoughts and opinions and just repeat what other people say about "parasocials" without even knowing what the word means. These people who love to say "let them do what they want and collab with who they want" never actually watch or support the people they stick up for. I don't get these people.
Glad there are sane people in the comments. Never understood that concept. The "fan" , they constantly blame, at least watch them! They also give money, support , and will come to next stream. Problem for me is the money. . . and also language barrier but that no big deal.
people have said it many times before, if everyone who "likes the holostars" actually put the time and effort into supporting and promoting them they would be in a much better place.
Stop censoring their names when you talk about them is a good start for example
While it's almost a par for the course to blame anything on parasocial unicorns / idol culture, *PLEASE* do not forget that there are other types of problematic fans that Astel also mentioned here.
1) Overly obsessive fans who keep bringing his pairing with Niu / cursed antics up even on unrelated streams and collabs. It's fine to ship them, but don't reduce one or both of them to just the ship and nothing else.
2) Overprotective fans. Not the same as unicorns and more of "normal" fans who otherwise just misinterpreted the situation and assumed that their oshi might actually be annoyed / uncomfortable with Astel.
At the end of the day, *please respect stream rules* and do not bring up other streamers or topics unrelated to the stream unless the streamer themselves brought up it first. And while it's hard not to worry in certain situations(Niji fans know this too well), and it is good to provide constructive criticism, *diving straight into hate piling accomplishes nothing and only cause more damages. This applies even when you meet other problematic fans mentioned here.* I personally know all too well not all fans can be reasoned with, but please at least try instead of just throwing insults off the bat.
As Astel mentioned, anything that happened on stream, no matter how wild, most likely already got approval beforehand. So if your oshi laughed along with the joke, just assumed that they're at least okay with it and if they truly was uncomfortable, they just would sort it out behind the scenes by themselves to make sure it never happens again.
Thank you for this note. It was frustrating to see this nuanced talk reduced to "unicorns/gachikoi bad" when they're rarely the issue for him...
If possible could you pin your comment for better reach?
Parasocial is parasocial. Wanting to control the stream and the streamer, who they hang out with, what they do, how they act, being overprotective, shipping, etc etc. This is all parasocial behavior. Even just wanting the streamer to say hi to you.
It's just different levels of being parasocial. So yes, the problem is people being parasocial to very unhealthy degrees.
I recently had a discussion with a niji fan who were on the hardcore side niji is family kind. That person saw most commentary aginst niji as hate comments rather that criticism and even admitted that it is difficulty to critique niji in their eyes. I were as neutral as I could be and tried to be polite but I will be honest hardcore fans do bring several issues not only parasocial ones in case of unicorns/gachikois.
I mean sure niji is getting heat since atleast last year but the situations have been bad and course correction from them is needed imo. Said fan had a good point though, hate spamming and anti behaviour isn't the best way to do it and I agree with them on that.
Astel's always thinking about the Holostars name in anywhere he goes, but it makes me so sad whenever he tries to exclude himself out of it in order for the rest to shine (around 12:06). I got into Holostars because of Astel, and I enjoyed his cursed arc and trolling shenanigans A LOT, so its rlly a shame how some of his arcs can't stick around for too long cuz of antis and "fans" who can't take a joke.
Also rlly appreciate him saying his thoughts behind the scenes throughout the early stages of his VTubing career and arcs. The thoughts of "oh i could do BL if management wanted me to" or "i'd be a teetee machine if thats just what girls would like" makes me glad we have the current version of Astel rn.
A real informative talk. I learned a lot, thank you Special-Grade Curse-kun.
15:42 "The reason you hate someone might not be the same as what they're actually trying to do"
It's always fun to watch his cursed arc, as I know he's doing it just for fun. I felt delighted when he interacted with other streamers, especially girls because he used to be awkward around them and left no impression. I wondered why he doesn't do those cursed streams anymore or general live streams and keeps a distance from everyone. Now I understand that he may have lost interest in streaming due to this "fans" problem and may have almost quit.
They're not "fans." Don't be afraid to call them what they really are: unicorns and antis.
recently vtuber called mysta rias graduated for (presumably) same reason, these "fans" are so delusional and cringe, but sadly these kind of fans comes with any streamer (especially holo and niji) if they don't set boundaries clearly so there's really no escaping them unless they openly and clearly admonish those viewers which isn't gonna happen because exploiting and taking these people's money is one of the ways the corpo get their income.
Actually, I ship AstelNiu or any girl. He should have a date and normal life without worry.
Those days when astel just embarrassed boy with Coco and roboco in Vsaikyou and then became cursed so much change in him.
@@shinodamasaru7945 Y'know that's the problem, right? He says in this video that shippers are part of what made him stop. Shippers are a cancer to any community.
Astel's cursed arc was truly one of the most entertaining periods i had watching vtubers. Knew that it probably will end like that, but glad that now feels like astel is back in the saddle. Was watching him from almost the debut, and he is such a talent, i love him a lot. glad that bad fans didn't manage to drive him out fully as it happened with some vtubers.
15:05 Man, I got emotional when I heard this. It's so heavy.
The Astel situation, from what I understand, is problem between Astel himself and his fans. This is a difficult time. The feeling where someone who supports you and you feel close to them, but it gets to the point where you don't understand each other. Stay strong, my man Astel.
I've been following Niu since her subs was still under 100k. And at the point where Niu felt like quitting Vtuber because it wasn't working for her.
Niu is one of the hard workers I know, and it has also been admitted by Hizuki Yui, her gen-mate. In my opinion, she is the only one from Neo-Porte who actively interacts with overseas fans while streaming, even though her English is not strong. well, I follow all the members.
From what I remember, Astel was concerned about this matter, because he knew that Niu had talent. Astel cares about Niu. In my opinion, it was Astel who helped Niu gain exposure with the "cursed arc". For those of us who watch it, it may seem like Astel is crossing the line, but like he said, the line can be different for each person and he doesn't think he's crossing the line. He also makes sure everything is under control, planned, and also has the approval of whoever he's interacting with.
I hope the fans can understand the Astel's circumstances, but most importantly, understand the Holostars' circumstances. My man is willing to do everything he could to maintain everything.
I think what he got was unfair to him. I'm the one who didn't ship Asniu. Because I know that Astel only did it to entertain the audience. I've been worried about this since the VCR rust. I'm so sorry that his audience treated them like a couple. Niu viewers say that Astel doesn't treat her well. During the Apex event with Matsuri Astel once said that doesn't want to have a relationship with a streamer.
I think Astel doesn't want to have an official ship like Marine. When meet someone who doesn't oppose him. It made him stressed too.
This is really eye opening especially the last part of him not loving himself and that he would dissapear if he had a break makes you realise how fragile people are (In a good way)
i dunno if this good in some way but ogey
Many streamers are like that, such a "need" is often a driving factor in going into the profession
Seriously love this guy, he deserves so much more.
What I love about Astel & Holostars is that they are always so real.
in 15:20 he sounds like he's about to cry but is trying his best to hold it back, he doesn't deserve to take all of this burden alone.
It's okay if he has to or needs some space. It has been rough for him and for some members too.
Personally, I'd like him to continue his cursed arc since it was entertaining af and the way Astel interacts with others outside of holostars made me curious to check those people while he can spreading Holostars's name as he said he's leading the charge with Bessan
Trully a based madlad and it kinda moves me
the madlad unfortunately stopped
If it wasn't for him I wouldn't even know the agency neoporte existed till now.
@@nagajule7715same bro
Astel often says he's one of the least idol-like members of Holostars, but he's the vtuber who has impressed me the most on stage.
With that said, I think there is a pretty big problem with his way of communicating: he often says outrageous things that could induce drama like graduation or hating Holostars talk, and viewers have gotten used to wave it away with "astel is exaggerating again, he's not serious". That makes it hard for us to communicate though because clipping these things could get him in trouble and so a lot of his serious talk are sadly only known to people who watched him live
yeah pretty much
His dream of wanting Holostars to grow more popular is why he is my oshi. I recognize its a long and difficult path and I don't even know if it's possible with the current state of male idol Vtubers but I always end up rooting for him.
Seeing this makes me respect him even more. Astel is honest with these things and keeps it real in terms of how creators are people and no one is completely oblivious as to what’s going on. I’m glad he got these off his chest you go seaweed guy
I just discovered Astel a few weeks ago and after having watched all the Holostars, I really do feel like him and Roberu are the two people that stick out as genuine and not so much corporate.
I do hope that he'll continue being Astel but I can also see him do way better as a solo streamer that is not chained down by company rules. He definitely has what it takes to earn a large following because he's funny af, he's relatable and he makes every collab he is in all the more better.
While I think the cursed arc brought a lot of popularity towards Astel, it also generated a small number of haters/antis as well. IMO, i personally enjoyed every single moment of Astels' before he even started this cursed arc. I think it's a very, very, very small number of haters that made him feel this way, his Japanese viewers are very loyal and understanding as well so it might be the very small minority that didn't like this type of content. It's always fun to see him interact with people (male or female).
I noticed this very small number of shippers/antis as well very early on, with the interactions between Niu and him happening and mentioned this on a another video as well. Streamers aren't stupid and astel clearly is a very smart guy to notice these things quick. If we wanna have nice things, we gotta be nice. When the streamer has to mention these kinda stuff, then yknow we done goofed. It also saddens me extremely when he talks about leaving content creation or when he talks about holostars. Most of his usual fans also know he was in a very depressed state few months back, not streaming and being sick etc.
I know he'll bounce back because thats the man I choose to support.
(thanks for translating once again! it really helps people to come across and understand his point of view)
Astel is legit incredible, I could list virtues of his all day, but what I always come away from these serious talks with is the level of empathy and humanity he displays. He's pretty young, not much older than Izuru, but he has such a real understanding of the emotions and motivations of the people around him, and for as much as he can let something slide off him in the moment, he internalizes negativity really easily. Astel might not love himself, but he loves his fans, and he loves Holostars. If Holostars is thriving, and his fans are happy, then Astel can be content; if he feels like the fans aren't happy with him, or a Holostars project doesn't perform well, he blames himself for not being good enough.
The best thing you can do to support him isnt to attack his antis, it's to watch his streams and give him real, constructive feedback on them. Astel wants to hear from his viewers, he wants to know what we want to see; even if there are games he plays and streams he does because he loves them (Fuga comes to mind), he wants to keep those other ideas for another time. I remember being in a karaoke stream of his a long time ago, and he asked chat to really hold back on commenting with just applause, and to give him like, real feedback. Do you like these songs? What do you want to hear? How was my voice? He's asked for merch feedback too; what kinds of merch would you want to buy? What would be worth it to you?
Astel merch is always top-quality, by the way. The sweatshirt from "One Two Shine" is so comfy, the Pollneu wallet from his 2022 new model/birthday reveal is the perfect size, and the "Twin Crew Stars" shower set works great.
I miss him. I hope he feels better.
It's fun while it lasted. And a person can't control a whole crowd. I really do like how the viewers joke around and the ship was also strong (though there will also be some bad apples here and there).
Though in my opinion, I do respect the decision because sometimes, when dragging it out for so long, the fans will be more divided and no one can tell who is the one troublesome anymore. People can't tell which is the ship, which is the joke and who are the aggressive ones anymore, especially on the internet where tone cannot be predicted through just merely texts.
A few users need to watch the clip twice before leaving comments.
Its crazy to see how much dedication he puts into the company and his community
Astel is a good soul that really takes a lot into account with his actions. He's a real one for sure
I really hope Astel is able to come to the point where he can love himself no matter what circumstances he finds himself in. I've been there; it's truly hell on Earth.
astel is going through the same problem kanda had when gunkan was super popular. kanda was known for "being gundou's partner in gunkan" but not as "shoichi kanda". doing the gunkan skits and bits didn't help him grow at all. it's the same thing with astel. people stick for "the cursed thing" but not for "astel leda". kanda has had the same talk about it before as well.
he's simply airing out the thoughts he had because he often does egosa and sees everyone opinions (also he has a list of all his fans on twitter so he definitely sees everything). no matter how small those comments are, there'd always be a loud minority that he will notice one way or another. but i think that's overshadowing the main thing he wants to convey, please support his solo content!
his covers, lore videos, solo streams outside of fps tournaments, and 3d projects. he has lots of them! even if you can't subscribe to his menshi, leave at least one comment or even just a like. he has fought management a lot for his ideas to come to life. please give his solo content a chance!
additionally, it seems like most don't know about this, but he doesn't like being seriously shipped with anyone regardless of gender. especially under the comment section or in official tags. he has mentioned this time and time again. jokingly talking about ships in the context/nuance of the stream is okay but people also took the asuniu ship too far and started asking/bringing stuff about her at every chance. it wasn't only people against the ship but people pushing so hard for it as well. he was really faced with two extremes during the time of doing that bit.
Shame that this comment has so few likes but the comments talking about "no no no it's clearly those toxic unicorn gachikoi fans that are the problem" are getting all the attention. People really don't know how to form their own original thoughts.
@@TheMaleEnjoyer honestly was surprised a huge part of the comments was just about the fans and not the latter half but i guess it's because it was the opening topic... just wished people paid attention to the other half too
@@TheMaleEnjoyer Its because those people have been conditioned to call everything that they don't like or understand as "parasocial, idol culture, etc" everything has just become a buzzword that is meaningless now.
i appreciate this comment. it put my thoughts to words exactly. it's important to hear the words he actually says, and the overall feel for where they come from vs. viewing everything through our own biases
Damn I misses his cursed arc
Astel really thinks a lot about these kinds of things, even though he calls himself dumb. He wants the best not just for himself, but for the boys as well, and tried to get their name out despite the possibile antis. You can also tell how caring he is. I'm so glad he decided to have a real talk with us instead of just disappearing. I myself am also that type of person, and it takes a lot of effort to communicate rather than just drifting away. I wish Astel would care for himself more, but I don't have the right to say that considering how I'm the same
Genuinely so entertaining in groups, and is very funny to watch. He truly shined in those moments for me (not that he doesn't on his own). Hopefully we can see more of him being himself. Like he said, his cursed self is closer to his real personality lol.
Aww, man. But his cursed arc is how I got introduced to so many new personalities. He basically opened the door for Holopro into these amazing VCR events.
It’s great that astel is open about this bullshit. No matter what there’s a lot of people still supporting holopro without being dumb and creepy so not all is bleak. My respect for this man at this point is unmeasurable
Business and fun are hard to mix sometimes. Hope he can still do what he wants, cause it was fun watching his antics.
I noticed he took a long break. I'm not completely surprised he's not feeling well about streaming, but hearing him talk so in depth about it is shocking. It must be pretty bad if he's unable to keep the negativity to himself. I hope it goes well. He's a hard working guy that cares a lot about everyone.
I always have so much respect for Astel for being able to talk so openly about his feelings- he’s truly a real one. Something as self-destructive sounding like how he’s ok disappearing as long as his friends are unhurt speaks volumes. He deserves so much love🙏
It's all fun and games until people start taking everything too seriously. It's either he's taken too seriously about the collabs or he's not serious enough about his interactions with others in people's eyes. I was so glad to see him talking to people outside of Cover-- even collabing with Niji EN!-- because I love seeing him interact with different people, and all that turned into him almost giving it all up because people just *need* to put entertainers in little boxes where if they stepped out of it they'll get reprimanded for it. Real people and real life don't work like that.
Thanks for the clip but I think a part of the conversation is also missing. Astel mentioned that some of Niu's fans were telling him that he doesn't treasure Niu enough and both Niu's and his fans started treating them like a real couple. He didn't mind it at first but then he realized it might affect Niu too which is why he distanced himself from it. He doesn't like it when it bothers other streamers that why he lowered down the jubutsu content when the fans are started to push hard for it.
GunKan as another commentor mentioned, and OreApo themselves have mentioned it too. Maybe people are not familiar with it but OreApo had a period where they didn't collab because the shippers got too annoying. I think Hinano has a clip about it but it's in JP. No idea if that got translated.
And for the lot saying "no wonder Astel doesn't do collabs anymore", he generally doesn't collab with other people though? He is very much a solo streamer unless invited. Not sure why that's such a big deal if you're actually familiar with his content. He has periods where he collabs a lot but then goes back to his regular solo content afterwards. It's pretty normal for him. 😅
I just noticed he started streaming less since the Rust series, I had assumed it was something related to this or he had a busy holostars schedule.
I like Astel best when he is having fun, being himself, I hope he can be that again. I understand though, his position often comes with these delicate situations.
I hope the fans can support him and also try not to bring up topics like these if he doesn't want to talk about it more.
I mean, it's probably is just busy schedules because even after Rust he was still teaming up with tons of people playing Valorant and doing his cursed stuff. But it's shortly after those initial Valorant streams he kinda reined it back a lot now.
It was both, basically. I'm glad he finally felt able to express why he suddenly became burnt out, because as a fan it was worrying to see
At the end of the day, human have different tastes, feelings and understanding about the issues.
There will never be a one direction answers or solution. Because you can't please *EVERYBODY*
Just do you Astel, do yo.
I love Astel and I'll support whatever he wants to do, as long as it doesn't have malice, ofc.
I see a lot of people getting angry on his behalf and i get why they feel that way but try to keep it to a minimum anywhere outside of this comment section please. Attacking or berating people on his behalf won't help anything
this. he hates seeing his fans fight with other people
I'm starting to wonder if "those" fans don't understand a "joke" and/or "sarcasm". It's obviously not a seat to a forced marriage.
I saw this on stream yesterday and couldn't quite catch all of it, and it turns out to be far more serious than I thought.
But yeah it's painfully obvious even right now at this very moment he's avoiding interacting with any female streamers on the VCR Ark. Just purely talking to guys only.
it sucks really
That is sad as for one, dome Rosetai were looking forward to interactions between Aki and the boys
Astel is a real bro, we all would love to hang out and play games with him 😭
It's always a blast watching his cursed arcs, I can't stop laughing, sad to see he can't do it anymore. Guess if it didn't make any success then it's ok for him to stop
I'm glad that Holostars are successful now. But at the same time, it kinda sucks that they can't do things they like because of the "fans". People are easily get hurt even if it's not about them nowadays
This kinda reminds me of GunKan. I miss them, guess they can't be together again for different reason. But this just reminds me of them
I love how open Astel is and how real he can be while still being genuinely kind to his viewers. I strive to be that kind of person someday.
This brought back my urge to learn japanese because I'd want to watch JP streamers without this whole barrier language blocking the way
Just remember that you cant please everyone. Even if 99% likes you, theres still the the 1%, plus the others the 1% brings.
wow, thats some legit deep talks right there
Astel : I don't actually love myself that much
Then Roberu : I FREAKIN LOVE MYSELF !!!!
2:03 Ah... That makes sense.
I know a lot of people already commented about the cursed arc, or his early days, but let me just say this.
Bro is a really caring person. Yes sometimes what he did is kinda cursed, ksgk, but for real, bro cares about other more than himself.
And yes, when the people you care about so much, do not understand you, it hurts like hell.
Kusogaki Astel is funny, love all his collab moments
It's unfortunate, but it is what it is. On top of getting trouble from fans from both side and for both people involved, he's not making much money out of cursed arc. It's eye opener how much Astel is thinking how he conducts his business.
He literally said the opposite no ? His cursed arc did well for him , bought him a lot of traction and money but the hate of the antis on both sides got to him and he decided it was not worth it
@@aravpradosh1244 Unless there's a grave mistranslation, he literally says "It's why I fully realized my cursed arc hasn't been making money." 11:36
Fans think they’re in a relationship with their vtuber. Para social people🤦♂️
@@Chaos2FrozenIt's not a mistranslation. But yeah the point that some people missed is, that it's not about making money. He knows that his cursed arc doesn't make money, but he just wants to have fun and interact with people. If it were only about money, interacting with a small group of people and giving them Fansa would be more lucrative.
@@rakunmonsterFRFR
0:36 dang it, 😔
I'm so sad that the community and fans have to give him a hard time about this, I really loved his clips and personality it also learned me a bit of charisma too; in an entertaining way.
16:34 is a real one
I'd like to say that this is "it is what it is" moment, but nope, not this time around, cuz I've learned enough to know that it's not really their "fans" that were throwing tantrums over bits and jokes
i mean they still won, fans or not. id say by vtuber nature, it is what it is
Oh they're fans alright. Short of actual fanatics. They're like 30% of the fandom and 50% of the income.
Agreed, I don't even watch him often & I knew he was just playing around. It was entertaining and for entertainment... stupid "fans"
@@ZeroXSEED that indeed, is the unfortunate truth
I think everyone in this comment section should calm down.
I swear some ppl are just so socially inept, irl and online, they'd make the hunchback of Notre Dame look like a social butterfly.
I will miss cursed object astel streams...
These so called "fans" can't you realize Holostars are already struggling enough to get their names out there, to be more known to people, to make more connections, to answer all the expectations towards them? What they need right now is your understanding and support, not extra deadweight. Crap like these are the least thing they needed right now. Can you all please not stand in their way?
Yeah! I'm tired of hearing "WINNING SON" (not that it's bad, I mean it's okay, just overrated now) in some chats, when he's the "BARTENDER BOSS".
And if not being able to offer them at least a single cent, why not try offering them free (or spread) artwork or custom merch of themselves or keep on listening/streaming to their own music perhaps?
That's the kind of support I would most like to see more of, but haven't been able to see enough of really.
Especially in the anime cons.
OBVIOUSLY THE RABID FANS WANT TO KEEP THE BOYS ALL TO THEMSELVES...
Man, I really enjoyed that arc. I’m glad he didn’t quit, but it’s just a shame that people can be so weird about things.
But Astel... I actually bought your merch because I love your Jubutsu arc😢
I still remember when astel embarrassed colab with coco and roboco at vsaikyou 3 and then to cursed astel. The cursed thing is funny for me but when it became potential damage on relationships or career its became dangerous. It's good thing for astel to step this up to talk with viewers why he kinda change thing one after another so the viewer kinda know what he thought.
I remember whe he talk alot with viewer and interactive with them and now he kinda cold, i know some chat on astel kinda naughty so i kinda get it.
like fr the “fans(not really fans, just some delulu sick people)” are the one getting mad, meanwhile astel or not even the streamers talking to their fans, they are talking to each others and they are friends so like why the heck fans acting like they own their streamers?? 😂
Being a vtuber is a double edge sword. Sure it's fun to play games and do shit with friends, but at the end of the day they're entertainers and if people stopped being entertained, theirs and other's source of income is threatened.
because they can. and astel is that living proof that they can. that's the only reason why they feel they have the power because they do have it.
@@insideidentity or just play a bf/gf for a living, i know vtubing is one of those that can be very easy to make if you can be consistent enough
@@akira8393 Not everyone want to do that. And people who don't do that knew they're forgoing potential prostitution money just fine.
I just wish for Astel to keep having fun in an unrestricted way, whether the “fans” approve it or not. Money is important too but I think that most of his viewers are already accustomed to his cursed arc to happen here and there, real ones will support him regardless
I wish for him to just enjoy doing what he want. I can't imagine what happen if he stop. Thank you for the translation. Because if it wasn't for your translation,im sure a lot of kaigai astellas won't fully understand what is happening and we might don't know what should we actually do to protect our alien. I'm really thankful for your thought to translate this clip for us.
He is in his mid life crisis, early in life. It was the stans, not the fans, that sped up the process. At least he recovered from it. Mid life crisis is different for different people, but for most it is questioning their life choices and drastically desiring to make a huge change to their life but most never did.
Haters make sense given the industry but shippers are a whole another set of cancer. Just enjoy the entertainment and pixels without making it weird.
i mean lets be real with ourselves, with how people look at anime, there are people shipping those that dont even make sense at all. vtubing is just really that and it is just too obvious.
Shippers have ruined so many interactions and dynamics between people. Everyone loves to blame the dirty icky "parasocials" (a word they don't even know the definition of) but shippers have actually made people avoid each other before.
@@TheMaleEnjoyer doesnt change the fact that parasocial is a problem. shipper is a branch of the toxic fanbase. doesnt make parasocial guilt free of causing people to avoid collabs.
Nah unicorns are way worse than shippers. They do pay though
@akira8393 not a blanket term though. Not all parasocial is evil/bad.
So this is why he seems lost interest in streaming those day, i hope he has a good decision :' I hope he can do whatever he want :'
Well now I’m pissed. I only really learned of Astel because of his cursed arc. I thought the whole thing was funny and loved how smooth he was when talking to girls. Just enjoyed the content all the way through. I was hoping for more like this in the VCR collabs but now I see why not. Why can’t our fellow viewers accept the king as he is…
I appreciate his honesty. It was fun while it lasted. Makes me realise how lucky we are that we still have Roberunightmea
That’s some interesting and wise words from Astel here. I feel like I learned something from his values in streaming and in life generally. Astel is a real one, hope his streaming career sails smoothly!
Sigh, this is why we cant have nice things.
i mean the winning side sure got the nice things they want
@@akira8393 unfortunately it came at the expense of our nice things. Which sucks because they used emotions instead of logic to get what they want.
You could also say they threw a tantrum and due to circumstances, Astel had to back down.
@@UtterlyShagged i mean the tantrum worked in their favor. you cant really use logic, what logic is there when his cursed streams arent even doing well? there's nothing to prove if anything just favors the emotional people
@@akira8393 true those cursed streams dont do well, but you can agree those cursed streams were entertaining.
@@UtterlyShagged yup. in the end the good content doesn't really comes with good rewards.
I respect his points and I'm happy he reached that point but also it's funny and I'm kind of glad he returned to his jubutsu with Reimu XD I guess he feels safer cause she doesn't follow it hard like Nui but rejects him as hard as he flirts so it's safer but still fun??
Honestly its been fun for the jubutsu arc, although I really qant astel to be back grinding music and maybe making an album. Loved his voice!
@@heerotomoe Nice, didn't know about this so I'm looking forward to it!
Astel is a real one!
Astel position right now is in the Middle hate and love from both side . I miss astel cursed arc 💔 😂
Astel : **real talk**
Astel's character : 🦜🪓🦜🪓
You know, I felt how he feels in this clip but.....
Why in tarantula he used pickaxe on tree and axe for stones?
Didn't expect astel's fans to be like that tbh, i thought holostars fans are chill, like roberu and mea for example, haven't heard anything bad from them and they also still doing collabs from time to time
I've been thinking about this for some time now- but as much as people like to think some fanbases are immune to gachikois, there probably are still some of them lurking around everywhere, sending their shit DMs and marshmallow behind the scenes.
Sadly, gachikoi is there. Even more scarier than ever if u know the real gachi of holostars. They can hate simply the other party is "dangering" their idols.
Dont underestimate parasocials. I once parasocials to irl idol. And I HATE that version of MYSELF now. Like, so much
@@Chaos2Frozen the gachikois and unicorns are different but they are same by spirit, parasocial shit. both of them sucks
i couldnt agree more@@kaigaikarano
you should see some of the Tempura lmao, I've seen some shit here and there
Man Astel is speaking facts here
Man that sucks. He's one of the vtubers that have prime comedian skills. The quickness and wittyness on his punchlines and jokes and how out of pocket it is, is one of the sides I like about him. It's unfortunate that maybe we can't see it anymore. I hope he can still find a way to show it. He's really a funny guy.
Such a shame, his cursed jokes were so funny and brilliant. But yeah if it actually doesn't have an economic return, and causes trouble, then his decision to stop is fair
So this is why he rarely colab with another streamer , poor astel, he just dont want anyone get harras
the unicorns won
Astel talk real there. Good TL as always.
Also. I think the title kinda too click bait.
i dont watch astel at all outside of the clips that sometime happen when these big collab server events happen but i watched this whole clip and this is some of the most real talks i have seen towards the viewers from a content creator from japan in regards to the whole idol/gachikoi culture, much respect for this dude
man... astel ;;
On one hand: there's a lot of doom posting in this comment section. What he said hasn't hit me as hard as it hit y'all, apparently.
On the other hand: i sometimes forget that the boys have their overly attached weirdos, too. How easy one could forget the Vox Akuma incident.
I honestly miss his cursed arc, its so refreshing to see someone not afraid to joke around in that manner and it ALWAYS produced entertaining results, but I understand how parasocial fans of vtubers can be. Some people just cant let things be jokes. I think it would beneficial for Holostars to have the "bad boy" type of idol for variety, and it shows how popular it can be, Astel's cursed arc actually blew his channel up quit a bit.
I appreciate his honesty. However from how he talks about his willingness to change behavior and speed of changing preferences, I wonder if Astel has a stable ideal he's pursuing or not.
Astel's so real fr
This is probably just because I'm taking some classes about gender, but I can't help but ponder over the sexual harassment talk. The takeaway is that he discussed his cursed arc in advance with the other livers, so they would be in on the joke. That people should trust they would work it out behind the scenes if either of the livers themselves were uncomfortable.
6:33 I understand his point that the person receiving the comments is the one who can decide. I definitely haven't seen all the cursed streams, but I have seen some clips. I didn't think they went too far in the scheme of the vtubing space, seemed like same old same old. Broadly speaking however, the problem is that irl sexual harassment also can go the way of the man tells kinda crass/funny joke then the women is supposed to laugh and brush it off. Because when it's boys and boys talking it can be boys' talk, and when it's girls and girls talking it can be girls' talk with everyone on an equal playing field. This is an entertainment space so the cursed arc shouldn't be thought of in the frame of irl behavior, but Astel has to work against the irl perspective of man and women discussion of cursed topic in the "workplace" it seems🤔
7:37 See...the thing is sometimes it's a calculation of is it worth the fuss to bring it up in exchange for the possible response 😅 Again, back to the takeaway that people should trust they work it out behind scenes.
Idk what research has been done about gender performance or embodiment in streaming, but it's interesting to think about how irl lives shape perceptions of online interaction.
Is tough to be a streamer, especially VTuber. I'm new to this community and still can't understand that there are so many types of fans
i mean in a nutshell you boiled down to three groups really.
its not vtuber, its idol culture.
@@cryst01 i mean at this point it is pretty much integral to it
dem i was expecting joke but i got deep talk
It is sad that the boys and girls can't collaborate without getting heavy back lash.
I mean there in the same company. Even if they are in different branches of it.
I feel bad that if they ever want to do anything public even if its simply playing a game, people will be mad.
I think thats how you know whos a real fan or not.
a really nice clip
i get the feeling that holostars management not only compares their livers with hololive revenue, but also global market like nijisanji boys en (which is obviously not a fair comparison)
can be eye opener for some ppl to remind them once again this is also a kind of business and the livelihood of ppl behind this also depend on it
It's not really management but more of shareholder pressure. The big change happened at the same time as Cover IPO
@@thieftheodore yeah im not saying its the management fault, like astel said cover as a company must have certain expectation for holoboys since they take care of them etc unlike indie activity which cant be helped
although i always wonder what part of holostars that failed but what part of nijisanji males worked?
@@akira8393 viewer that usually watch regular male streamer avoid the Idols and "Holo" association. While regular "Holo" viewers avoid them because male
@@akira8393 if you meant to compare to nijiboys jp like kuzuha, etc
imo its bcs holo started very late to debut boys unit + they put idol label on it, and i think public only really recognize hololive side
astel is cool man since i discover his channel i guess its hard being a idol & a streamer i do miss his jokes with female vtubers
"You can't jokingly rizz female streamer on stream! She belong to ME! REEEEEEE"
"you shall not taint her you criminal scum!!!"
Seems like it's also Astel's own overly attached "fans" that want him to themselves. Kinda weird to see considering how much he's been against being parasocial.
Astel said it goes both ways, sooo
"You ain't allowed to interact with Astel because he's an idol! Know your place, he belongs to me! REEEEEEE"
Joke aside, yea they're just delulu from the same pod.
@@king0vitrial i mean it's like watching kiara really and you know how kiara is.
@@king0vitrialit's not exactly that. most of his fans are used to him interacting with other people and aren't really possessive that way. he does get issues with shippers and "mama" fans who are overprotective sometimes. From my (flawed) perspective as a long-time fan, he really doesn't like being protected or seeing his fans fight with others. The cursed arc unfortunately led to a number of clashes between his fans an others. I'm not sure how bad it was, but Astel has (imo) an unfortunate tendency to look up what his antis say about him, outsiders, as well as his regular fans comments, and take all that in as feedback even if it wasn't intended that way. For example, if antis say something hurtful and a fan of his fights back against that, he hates it.
Ultimately, it's best to just enjoy your oshi's content, be good and stay out of fights between fans and antis. No one likes to see your fans misbehaving, even if it's in your defense
I wish that more fans of Holopro as a whole would understand that Hololive's & Hololstars' idea of "idol" isn't the same as the the typical Japanese idol that's supposed to be pure and flawlessly perfect.
Holopro's idols are flawed, they make mistakes, they are imperfect, they have have personality, they are human. They are the best idols, they are often rude, they are often loud, they are often lewd, they are often cursed, etc. These are the idols I love and will support for as long as it can.
The idea of a "perfect idol" sounds so boring to me, I would never watch that
@@clowny3605 Agreed
Including Sora (I feel the "perfect idol"/etc labeling hurt her growth in the past)
@@Fishman465 Nah, she's a perfect idol alright. In the best way possible, she looks out for her fellow members and she will go along with them, even on more yabe things like we saw recently in that minecraft collab were she read Ollie's yabai books (lmao). Tokino Sora is more than just an "idol", or even a "perfect idol", she is "Hololive's Perfect Idol".
I've run out of watching Astel's interactions with women. I need more
just watch his naruto gameplay. You dont understand what he saying but atleast you can reminisce the nostalgia
You know its funny that there are people in the comments here like "I never even watched his streams but he should have stuck with the cursed arc", maybe if you all actually did support him by watching streams instead of just being clip-only fans then maybe he would have kept doing what he wanted instead of having to focus on appealing to gachikoi again lol.
I mean, that does nothing to resolve the main problem that the people who do watch those streams have the tendency to take things too far in both directions.