i often look at bestigors as "bully" units, in that they will chew through inferior units faster than most others but when they pick on something their own size (or more expensive) they get annihilated. i've had a few games where they get their value for that reason.
Bestigors and black orcs fall to that unusable niche of being an expensive generalist AP infantry unit with relatively MA and MD. Halberd and elite anti-infantry units generally don't require any help if they can just reach their preferred target and great weapon longbeards, nurgle warriors/chosen and marauder champion have enough MD to win in grind. But both black orcs and bestigors need buffs from characters to cleave through defensive infantry in a sane timeframe. And while you can make that work, there is often mobile options that don't require similar pampering while being more tactically flexible.
black orcs are definitley useful i have seen them trade well into heavy cavalry and monsters in sustained combat and will do even better when waagh is active
@@rubric-eo5yj The RoR is good because it can actually hit something without help. But the regular ones need either Big Waagh spells or waagh trigger to deal damage in any sane timespan.
I took Bestigors here because in my experience they are kinda hard to take out for HE and are just enough of a threat that they can't be ignored. Technically archers, cav and monsters counter them but those have to focus on BM win conditions.
Bestigors have struggled since Warhammer I. They were good for a minute in WHII, when shock infantry in general was overperforming, but once that was corrected they went back to being a unit no one takes, because they don't want to have to cycle charge their heavy infantry. I don't see any improvements or variants coming either. The Tzaangor nerf was explicitly stated to be because the marked units are Gors not Bestigors, so marked Bestigors aren't going to be a thing, despite they're being one of the units that could take marks when that was a thing for BM. Sword and board varians would be cool but never existed on TT, so I don't see CA implementing them. Also I'd swear their charge bonus used to be 36 not 35, but maybe I'm hallucinating. PS-I know Centigors of Tzeentch are a good unit, but man do they look uninspired. And Centigors with their lifestyle of boozing and screwing always felt to me like they'd be Slaanesh worshipers if they picked one god.
@@nicolinrucker5181 aren't the kind of averse to devotion for a single god, seeing those that are marked as inferior? Someone was telling me that was part of BM lore.
@@sassyviking6003 No. The gods are largely bored AF with the Beastmen and mostly don't care. A Tzaangor or Centigor of Tzeentch is born with a mark of the Changer of Ways and that is something to be celebrated because it's a sign of something resembling interest. All the Beastmen do is done in the hopes of a mark of favor. Of the lords in the game right now, the only one who's actually attracted even momentary attention is Taurox.
Not being large while being heavily armoured against Elves' non-AP shooting and spears, they do seem like exactly the kind of anchor you'd need with a mobility heavy build like this. Not afraid to grind it out vs basic spears and lotherns, but fast enough to tie down units and stop them from bracing after the weaker ungors have dissolved, but then you're already in melee range. Gotta applaud that choice!
@@itscurrentyear3054Never said otherwise. I'll stick up a bit for the Manrippers though: unlike the basic Bestigor they at least know what they want to do.
It is a neat concept, an armored heavy infanty that sacrifices MD and a little MA for being fast (by heavy infantry standards) and having a high charge bonus. Super thematic for beastmen. Maybe they just need to be cheaper, or have access to better ways to buff leadership so they stick around.
If Rider of Rohan somehow has leverage on you to cast like seven of his replays in a row, blink twice.
🧝
i often look at bestigors as "bully" units, in that they will chew through inferior units faster than most others but when they pick on something their own size (or more expensive) they get annihilated. i've had a few games where they get their value for that reason.
Seems quite lore friendly for the elite of beastmen to be weak-chested bullies
Yeah you can use them like forsaken, but they are kinda expensive for that.
Bestigors and black orcs fall to that unusable niche of being an expensive generalist AP infantry unit with relatively MA and MD. Halberd and elite anti-infantry units generally don't require any help if they can just reach their preferred target and great weapon longbeards, nurgle warriors/chosen and marauder champion have enough MD to win in grind. But both black orcs and bestigors need buffs from characters to cleave through defensive infantry in a sane timeframe. And while you can make that work, there is often mobile options that don't require similar pampering while being more tactically flexible.
black orcs are definitley useful i have seen them trade well into heavy cavalry and monsters in sustained combat and will do even better when waagh is active
@@rubric-eo5yj The RoR is good because it can actually hit something without help. But the regular ones need either Big Waagh spells or waagh trigger to deal damage in any sane timespan.
Finally getting a computer that can actually play this tomorrow and I bought it on release
I took Bestigors here because in my experience they are kinda hard to take out for HE and are just enough of a threat that they can't be ignored. Technically archers, cav and monsters counter them but those have to focus on BM win conditions.
Bestigors have struggled since Warhammer I. They were good for a minute in WHII, when shock infantry in general was overperforming, but once that was corrected they went back to being a unit no one takes, because they don't want to have to cycle charge their heavy infantry.
I don't see any improvements or variants coming either. The Tzaangor nerf was explicitly stated to be because the marked units are Gors not Bestigors, so marked Bestigors aren't going to be a thing, despite they're being one of the units that could take marks when that was a thing for BM.
Sword and board varians would be cool but never existed on TT, so I don't see CA implementing them. Also I'd swear their charge bonus used to be 36 not 35, but maybe I'm hallucinating.
PS-I know Centigors of Tzeentch are a good unit, but man do they look uninspired. And Centigors with their lifestyle of boozing and screwing always felt to me like they'd be Slaanesh worshipers if they picked one god.
Beastmen don't get to pick though.
@@nicolinrucker5181 aren't the kind of averse to devotion for a single god, seeing those that are marked as inferior? Someone was telling me that was part of BM lore.
@@sassyviking6003 No. The gods are largely bored AF with the Beastmen and mostly don't care. A Tzaangor or Centigor of Tzeentch is born with a mark of the Changer of Ways and that is something to be celebrated because it's a sign of something resembling interest. All the Beastmen do is done in the hopes of a mark of favor. Of the lords in the game right now, the only one who's actually attracted even momentary attention is Taurox.
@@nicolinrucker5181Khorne only cares about Minos?
@@Nikolas5842 Khorne only cares about blood and skulls.
Not being large while being heavily armoured against Elves' non-AP shooting and spears, they do seem like exactly the kind of anchor you'd need with a mobility heavy build like this. Not afraid to grind it out vs basic spears and lotherns, but fast enough to tie down units and stop them from bracing after the weaker ungors have dissolved, but then you're already in melee range.
Gotta applaud that choice!
Bestigors are one of my favourite units overall (aesthetically speaking). I'd love to see more options for them (certainly dual weapons, axe & shield)
Best version of them in the game is the RoR with the halberds. Which certainly shows other loadouts could be viable.
@@KartarNighthawk 'best' is a very low bar to clear with regards to bestigors :P
@@itscurrentyear3054Never said otherwise. I'll stick up a bit for the Manrippers though: unlike the basic Bestigor they at least know what they want to do.
It is a neat concept, an armored heavy infanty that sacrifices MD and a little MA for being fast (by heavy infantry standards) and having a high charge bonus. Super thematic for beastmen. Maybe they just need to be cheaper, or have access to better ways to buff leadership so they stick around.
@@sassyviking6003Price cut might help. Or they could toss Devastating Flanker on them and see what happens.
Not gonna lie, that goon squad of 3 characters on chariots was insanely effective and totally stole the show.
Perhaps Bestigors should be given the Daze contact effect, even if only during their charge bonus?
Their melee defense is simply to low for what they are and their cost.
BEASTIE BOIS👍🏻
Rank 9 bestigors are op op