Epic, like most game companies, was not happy with making a lot of money, they wanted to make ALL of the money, and by trying that, they got themselves in this mess
If they invested their money wisely into improving and expanding their storefront instead of bribing PC games to come only to their storefront, it'd be doing a heck of a lot better than it is now, that's for sure. Hades proved that.
People inherently don’t like being stonewalled into a less convenient option. Steam was the first of its kind and worked its way to being the most convenient option to buy pc games. Epic is subtly forcing players off the bat to buy curtain games they may like on their incomplete storefront, for a limited time granted but that’s still manipulative and inconvenient. Did Epic expect a positive reception to this brute-force market manipulation?
@@SomeFellow2000 I think the thing that says everything about Steam's success is Steam wasn't competing against other marketplaces, Steam was competing against *pirates.* Nobody's going to be a competitor to Steam until they can say the same.
He's so excited, giddy even. And it's a moment in general that makes you think "Aw man, he's having a good time, he's so happy to be talking here with his friend about this shit". Wholesome.
It's a well intentioned indie funding scheme, until Kingdom Hearts sells 4 games full price when the PS4 collection sells every single game in one bundle for like $20 during very frequent sales.
Just this week, Epic has given out 3 free games. I've never spent any money on the Epic store since it opened and my library on it still has 155 games in it.
Oh man, the one thing that was keeping me from downloading the Epic game store was my outright refusal to give them money, but I should have realized that I can do more than not give them money. I can take games from them and force them to spend some of their running costs on me in exchange for zero dollars and zero cents.
@@billvolk4236 i think the free epic games thing might be them trying to meet their guaranteed sales numbers that are a part of the "sort of" exclusive deals
the other reason that the epic game store doesn't have reviews is because of the ongoing trend of using it as a protracted alpha in contrast to the normal Early Access cycle that Steam demonstrates. "Yo this high profile indie game is a *burning rubber trashfire* (but they're working on it)" would probably be a bit of a hype killer. Or, y'know, the AAA angle of "oops we just didn't care about our PC port (and/or are Ubisoft)"
@@PuchuKt Now compare the good ones to the pile of shit ones they give away. Just look at the 3 ones they gave away for free this week. They look like hot garbage.
@@diegomedina9637 Civ 6, GTA 5, Borderlands 2, and Watch Dogs 1 and 2 were up there for free at some point. They are definitely not all shitty indie games.
@@Spootnik buddy, 3rd world sole proprietorships that rake in $10 of revenue a month can implement functional shopping carts. You're shilling for a multi billion dollar corpo that can't implement a simple quality of life feature for their consumers. Sit down.
If you're in indie game developer and want funding just got to epic game store where you will be given a full funding for exclusivity and no worries about it making a profit. Then when that runs out port to steam and elsewhere.
At first I was disappointed when I heard that Darkest Dungeon 2 signed a deal with Epic. But you know what? Take your free Fortnite money while it lasts, Red Hook, go with my blessing, I'll wait and buy your game when it comes out on literally anything else.
@@tequilawhiskey No, but Epic still doesn't have the cache Activision has. Epic only has Fortnite, so when that eventually goes they have nothing left but the engine which doesn't rake in those same dollars. Kotick at least could shield himself with multiple franchises that people will still throw money at if they lost money on another area of the business.
The best case scenario for Epic exclusive indies is that no one buys their games on Epic and everyone buys a copy on Steam. The Epic deal makes no sense, except as a charity fund.
I mean, they’d get more money if all of their sales were on the Epic store instead of Steam, Epic does take a smaller cut. The problem is that’s just... a delusion at this point, because the EGS has decided to power their building my throwing burning money into the boiler.
I'm confused as to why Epic's funding plan doesn't entail contractual exclusivity for longer than a year or two. I mean, I'm personally happy that games like Hades are able to find a larger audience on Steam in the end, but from a business standpoint why would Epic agree to pay for a certain amount of the dev costs if that game they're supporting just ends up being sold on Steam a bit later down the line anyway.
@@YorkJonhson Because Epic doesn't have the upper hand in negotiations. Steam is the bigger market that most indie devs want to be on. Epic can't just bully indie devs into bad contracts, it doesn't work like that.
@@The5lacker Think of it this way: Epic are giving them X amount of money regardless of sales. Every sale on the EGS up to a certain point is zero profit for the devs. So, zero sales on EGS, they still get paid for them anyway, then real consumers buy it on Steam a year later and they get additional money from that. Sure if the EGS sales break past that free money point, the 12% cut is better for them, but before that point it is literally more beneficial for devs to have all their users buy on Steam instead of Epic. (This is assuming no people would buy on the EGS and then again on Steam, so a sale made on EGS is a sale that doesn't happen on Steam, and the total number of sales remains the same)
Epic is hoping they can make the store "throw money at something until it starts making an unyielding amount of cash" ala Uber and Amazon. Whether that happens or not remains to be seen
@@SeekSeekLest no, amazon makes about what you would expect for a company that size. They obfuscate it through reinvesting into r&d(like AWS) and "choice" tax haven investments
The difference being, nobody was doing what Amazon started doing, and nobody really is even now. Epic tried to muscle in on Valve's turf, and they're finding that that userbase just. Won't. Move. They could try making the store more feature-complete, but who knows if that will ever occur to them.
Epic Games put this out 2 days ago Epic Games announced that it completed a $1 billion round of funding, which will allow the company to support future growth opportunities. Epic's equity valuation is now $28.7 billion.
@@apricotapocalypse4818 Enjoy em man. They wanna give out free bread, all we need some butter. Eat it up! But, you're contributing to their slow demise. :)
So I’m guessing the earliest parts of the podcast may not be uploaded? Kinda hard not to think Woolie’s time with Arkham coming up might’ve been part of why
Imagine if Epic and Apple finally get to court and Epic can't foot the bill for their lawyers because giving away hundreds of games killed their Fortnite piggy bank.
Pat pointing out people would buy the one game they were desperate for reminds me of how my friend really wanted to play Borderlands 3 with me and I was a huge borderlands fan (I still hate Randy and Anthony, and had some major gripes with BL2 at release and still some gripes) so that was the one game I bought on Epic games store. I have like 6 or 7 free games and Borderlands.
Maybe the numbers I found were out of date, and to be fair I'm trying to remember numbers I read from a whole ago. But I swear I recall the Xbox did actually make money for a little bit. Like right at the very end of the 360 lifescale I think they went into the black. And then the Xbox One came out and it went right back into the red lol.
It's more like it got aborted before it could become Weyland-Yutani or Shinra. Thank goodness the lawfare campaign was defeated by the devils we know. Having a Microsoft with a total lack of self preservation would have done horrible things if it managed to get off the ground.
Wait if epic had achievements they'd have the % of people who got achievements available and that would reveal that basically everyone is redeeming games on epic and then just not playing them, meaning epic is paying publishers for games that people aren't even playing
If epic just made the store better I wouldn't even be that against. But as it is. The exclusives me and my friend just joke about how the game was announced for the year after as for fortnite I hate that it worked but they got me in when raven was in the new season.
Imagine this! Just Fortnite by itself makes enough money for Epic to waste millions of dollars on the epic game store with no expected income to come in years.
I get it’s funny to say Fortnite is keeping epic afloat but it’s probably a drop in the bucket compared to unreal engine 4 and 5. As without those engines running perfectly on your console, your console will be on life support it’s whole lifetime.
It should be noted that Epic doubled their value in the last 3 years (from ~15 billion to 30 billion dollars). Fortnite money is also only Monopoly bucks compared to what the Unreal Engine makes. So based on Epic's Total Income, the 300 million losses the store made were only ~4% of the total value of the company. Fortnite alone made more than $3 BILLION in 2018 alone. $300 million in losses is nothing to them. They see the EGS clearly as a LONG term investment and are willing to make losses over MANY years... because all the 12 year olds that only play Fortnite now have an EGS account and due to the free game program also have rown themselves their initial PC game library there, while they practically have nothing on Steam.
Microsoft lost on the Xbox for the first couple versions of it. Nothing wrong with this sort of practice. Also the lower cut taken from developers is always a great thing to see. It is one of the good things about the Epic Game Store and I really want to see them improve that shitter so that it is a good alternative to Steam.
That’s really making the issue a bit too simple when you put it out there like that. It’s not like steam doesn’t have competition in the gaming sphere, all the consoles have gaming stores, and Nintendo has accidentally kinda setup a model to similar to steam by incentivizing companies to put up discounts so more people might see their games
Steam doesn't really have many PC competitors because they solved the PC gaming problem. GoG is the closest thing and they would do better if more people knew about them, but I digress. Point is, they do kind of own the PC market, but that isn't the gaming market. They can't do something outrageous on their storefront and not expect people to decided to play games on a different platform, so they are kept mostly in check. And Valve happens to be a company that isn't that predatory all things considered, and that's just pure coincidence. Also because Steam prints them money with very little effort.
@@AshGray2520 Steam could be the most abusive, battering boyfriend on the PC market and PC-for-lifers would NEVER give it up to play it on another platform. They would rather take the abuse and die clinging to their mouse and keyboards than switch to something else.
@@SvarogAristaeusAllen Yeah, because you're talking about spesifically PC-For-Life people. And those people likely know about other storefronts like GoG. Wait, is that your alt-account, Sweeny?
Ultimately, this is exactly what Epic has to do. Steam didn't have to go through a 'burning money' phase because they existed uncontested for so long. Epic on the other hand, has to go up against the reigning king, and has to burn money getting exclusives and features Steam doesn't have as the bare mininum to try to rope people in until it becomes profitable. And honestly, this approach is a good thing! There's a lot of indie and AA games and devs that would have died or gone under if EGS hadn't funded them, on top of Steam treating anyone who isn't AAA like dirt, so the 'throw money at it' approach has actually helped a lot of people. If only they'd throw that much money at their own platform, though.
If a company can't make money without EGS literally giving them money, it says they shouldn't be in the game business. It should be concerning that this business model mainly appeals to the Digital Homicides of the world, and not the Red Hook Studios.
@@crazyinsane500 Can't make money if the game dies from lack of budget before it even gets out the door. And even Pat and Woolie point out that a bunch of really beloved games took the Epic deal, such as Hades, first. Even Hitman did it.
@@SvarogAristaeusAllen Hades was published by Supergiant who had the funding from their previous successes and only the third Hitman game in the reboot series where each preceding entries were successful was EGS exclusive. These games had the funding absent Epic's intervention, and the fact that these titles are the ones you would point to instead of, say, Ooblets suggests a lot about how a studio *without* successes that *needs* the backing of Epic would perform.
@@crazyinsane500 I was pointing out that even developers that had success in the past were appealed to by the deal, which goes against what you said about it primarily appealing to the Digital Homicides of the world. There are dozens of indie gems out there that the EGS deal appeals to that are actually great but end up being money pits for the developers because advertising is just as important as actual game quality and if you don't have clout or the attention of people with clout to advertise for you, you're never gonna sell enough to recoup your development costs. When that risk exists, games that could be good die before getting a chance to be born, since it would be seen as just too risky and costly to put in that effort for something no one will see. A game can be good, with or without funding, indie games regularly prove it time and again; But funding would definitely help in ensuring lot of would-be games don't die because they just aren't feasible over a day job for the dev.
Epic, like most game companies, was not happy with making a lot of money, they wanted to make ALL of the money, and by trying that, they got themselves in this mess
Its not about profits. Its about profit margains.
If they invested their money wisely into improving and expanding their storefront instead of bribing PC games to come only to their storefront, it'd be doing a heck of a lot better than it is now, that's for sure. Hades proved that.
People inherently don’t like being stonewalled into a less convenient option.
Steam was the first of its kind and worked its way to being the most convenient option to buy pc games.
Epic is subtly forcing players off the bat to buy curtain games they may like on their incomplete storefront, for a limited time granted but that’s still manipulative and inconvenient.
Did Epic expect a positive reception to this brute-force market manipulation?
@@SomeFellow2000 I think the thing that says everything about Steam's success is Steam wasn't competing against other marketplaces, Steam was competing against *pirates.*
Nobody's going to be a competitor to Steam until they can say the same.
This is like throwing money into a bonfire because you’re certain the resulting smoke cloud will eventually rain dollar bills.
Only to find out that all the pollution caused acid rain instead, but we'll get used to the acid rain by 2027!!!
*GLUTTONS THAT COULD NOT BE SATISFIED WITH ALL THE RICHES IN HEAVEN*
But if you through ENOUGH dollars....
Pat tweet your comment. You're famous
I don’t have Twitter, and I hadn’t checked my tabs yet so thanks for telling me. That’s super cool.
You see frame by frame Pat's eyes glow up when Woolie started talking about Epic
He's so excited, giddy even. And it's a moment in general that makes you think "Aw man, he's having a good time, he's so happy to be talking here with his friend about this shit". Wholesome.
He's all like, the moment is [FINAL]ly here!
Isn't it so great to be with friends guys?
My eyes do that every time Woolie mentions the Johnny the Homicidal Maniac blood wall, because I fucking love that comic and that concept
The three phases of life
Phase 1: Time and Energy but no Money.
Phase 2: Energy and Money but no Time.
Phase 3: Time and Money but no Energy.
If this is original, I love you.
I think the last one is valve
I hate how true this is.
4deep7u
@@thatcynicalbastard6636 Not original, but hasn't stopped being true.
It's a well intentioned indie funding scheme, until Kingdom Hearts sells 4 games full price when the PS4 collection sells every single game in one bundle for like $20 during very frequent sales.
Could buy all of the original titles used for less than the full price of one game... people are justified to pirate this bullshit imo.
I have my doubts it was well-intentioned.
@@XShrike0 more like happy accidents
@@sol2296 it feels more like giving to charity to divert attention away from the bad stuff being done.
Kingdom hearts isn't indie though, and I'm fully sure that's more on Square than it is Epic.
That's what happens when you try to brute force it instead of offering a good service.
A bunch of indie games being directly funded by Fortnite vbucks... what a weird timeline we're in. Thanks Tim!
I love how the "digital NTR" joke just flew under the radar. I see you wools, that woulda been a way better title
I love how perfectly some of these quotes capture the corporate MO. “HOW CAN WE GET MORE?”
*GLUTTONS THAT COULD NOT BE SATISFIED WITH ALL THE RICHES IN HEAVEN*
Just this week, Epic has given out 3 free games. I've never spent any money on the Epic store since it opened and my library on it still has 155 games in it.
At this point we’re looting.
184 am i winning yet?
"FREE SHIT"
Oh man, the one thing that was keeping me from downloading the Epic game store was my outright refusal to give them money, but I should have realized that I can do more than not give them money. I can take games from them and force them to spend some of their running costs on me in exchange for zero dollars and zero cents.
@@billvolk4236 i think the free epic games thing might be them trying to meet their guaranteed sales numbers that are a part of the "sort of" exclusive deals
the other reason that the epic game store doesn't have reviews is because of the ongoing trend of using it as a protracted alpha in contrast to the normal Early Access cycle that Steam demonstrates.
"Yo this high profile indie game is a *burning rubber trashfire* (but they're working on it)" would probably be a bit of a hype killer.
Or, y'know, the AAA angle of "oops we just didn't care about our PC port (and/or are Ubisoft)"
Epic giving away more games than pirates can pirate.
They're shitty indie games.
@@diegomedina9637 darkest dungeon, enter the gungeon, celeste, shitty indie games? im sure there are some other I didnt mention.
Plenty of non indies too
@@PuchuKt Now compare the good ones to the pile of shit ones they give away. Just look at the 3 ones they gave away for free this week. They look like hot garbage.
@@diegomedina9637 Civ 6, GTA 5, Borderlands 2, and Watch Dogs 1 and 2 were up there for free at some point. They are definitely not all shitty indie games.
700 Million dollars spent on the epic store.
Do they even have a shopping cart yet?
Welcome to ground mart where we spent every last scent getting stuff into the store but forgot to put anything into the shelf making budget
It's like the store developers know nobody is buying more than 1 game at a time, if buying any at all.
@@Spootnik buddy, 3rd world sole proprietorships that rake in $10 of revenue a month can implement functional shopping carts.
You're shilling for a multi billion dollar corpo that can't implement a simple quality of life feature for their consumers. Sit down.
@@dreamcatcherpone i think you misread, or didnt read his comment lol
Sweeney boi puts you on a list if you dare mention the shopping cart to him on twitter. No joke lol
The Epic Game Store is just a machine that converts v-bucks into indie titles
Welp it's time to see if Epic Store has a shopping cart yet.
NOPE
does it have one yet?
If you're in indie game developer and want funding just got to epic game store where you will be given a full funding for exclusivity and no worries about it making a profit. Then when that runs out port to steam and elsewhere.
At first I was disappointed when I heard that Darkest Dungeon 2 signed a deal with Epic. But you know what? Take your free Fortnite money while it lasts, Red Hook, go with my blessing, I'll wait and buy your game when it comes out on literally anything else.
Oh man, Tim Sweeney has an actual chance to take a pay cut to make sure nobody gets fired.
You serious? Nah he's gonna fire everyone but himself
@@WTFisTingispingis If he doesn't he will be as demonised as Activision CEO Bobby Kotick.
Tim Sweeney wishes he was Iwata. No way in hell will another CEO pull a selfless stunt like that again. We didn't deserve Iwata.
@@Dungeon00X and has that effected bobby?
@@tequilawhiskey No, but Epic still doesn't have the cache Activision has. Epic only has Fortnite, so when that eventually goes they have nothing left but the engine which doesn't rake in those same dollars. Kotick at least could shield himself with multiple franchises that people will still throw money at if they lost money on another area of the business.
THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR CITING THE BLOOD WALL WOLLY
The best case scenario for Epic exclusive indies is that no one buys their games on Epic and everyone buys a copy on Steam. The Epic deal makes no sense, except as a charity fund.
I mean, they’d get more money if all of their sales were on the Epic store instead of Steam, Epic does take a smaller cut.
The problem is that’s just... a delusion at this point, because the EGS has decided to power their building my throwing burning money into the boiler.
I'm confused as to why Epic's funding plan doesn't entail contractual exclusivity for longer than a year or two. I mean, I'm personally happy that games like Hades are able to find a larger audience on Steam in the end, but from a business standpoint why would Epic agree to pay for a certain amount of the dev costs if that game they're supporting just ends up being sold on Steam a bit later down the line anyway.
@@The5lacker That's only after they've cracked the sales number or date Epic agreed to cover. Before that, it's eating into the money Epic promised.
@@YorkJonhson Because Epic doesn't have the upper hand in negotiations. Steam is the bigger market that most indie devs want to be on. Epic can't just bully indie devs into bad contracts, it doesn't work like that.
@@The5lacker Think of it this way: Epic are giving them X amount of money regardless of sales. Every sale on the EGS up to a certain point is zero profit for the devs. So, zero sales on EGS, they still get paid for them anyway, then real consumers buy it on Steam a year later and they get additional money from that.
Sure if the EGS sales break past that free money point, the 12% cut is better for them, but before that point it is literally more beneficial for devs to have all their users buy on Steam instead of Epic. (This is assuming no people would buy on the EGS and then again on Steam, so a sale made on EGS is a sale that doesn't happen on Steam, and the total number of sales remains the same)
Epic is hoping they can make the store "throw money at something until it starts making an unyielding amount of cash" ala Uber and Amazon. Whether that happens or not remains to be seen
@@SeekSeekLest no, amazon makes about what you would expect for a company that size. They obfuscate it through reinvesting into r&d(like AWS) and "choice" tax haven investments
The difference being, nobody was doing what Amazon started doing, and nobody really is even now. Epic tried to muscle in on Valve's turf, and they're finding that that userbase just. Won't. Move.
They could try making the store more feature-complete, but who knows if that will ever occur to them.
I love how Pat kept saying he’s been running numbers then he couldn’t even do 30% of $1.2 billion.
Even chat got it wrong too. Its 360 million.
@@jay4.166 I think that might’ve just been them rounding
@@parodysam When you say 30% a lot of people just assume 1/3rd instead.
Sounded more like he misspoke.
Epic Games put this out 2 days ago Epic Games announced that it completed a $1 billion round of funding, which will allow the company to support future growth opportunities. Epic's equity valuation is now $28.7 billion.
Whenever I hear that something bad has happened to Epic it makes me feel a little happier inside.
4:16 Zangief appears if anyone wants to see
He was correct
I think he was asking Pat to pet him.
Digital NTR everybody
I got an ad exactly at 9:07
Honestly not even mad, that's hilarious.
Epic Godzilla fighting Apple Kong and we are just sitting, eating pop corn and just like Pat, saying - "what a bunch of stupid idiots"
Don't get it twisted. Apple is Godzilla in this metaphor.
finding out some of the Chinese stores take 50%
i feel like this is a them trying to move to that part
Me, only logging into the Epic Game Store to grab the new free game and never actually buying anything, glad to be actively damaging them.
Jesus zangief is huge now
yeah it's kinda weird that he grew a beard too but that's keeping in line with his namesake
What anger could not destroy, patience has. Let the battle cry of freedom ring out again!
"Fuck. Epic."
All these free games though. I haven't bought a game in years, and I'll still can't keep up with all the free games Epic shills out.
@@apricotapocalypse4818 Enjoy em man. They wanna give out free bread, all we need some butter. Eat it up! But, you're contributing to their slow demise. :)
Bless you for the JTHM reference, because that is as perfect a reference as it gets.
If they actually put money into making a great client it would have gone better
Reminder Pat spent hundreds on the predatory Epic Games Store on day 1
And got banned due to too many purchases at a short time
Probably the guy who spent the most money on egs
I don't expect Epic game store to EXIST by 2027, much less beat Steam.
So I’m guessing the earliest parts of the podcast may not be uploaded? Kinda hard not to think Woolie’s time with Arkham coming up might’ve been part of why
Epic knew they could not beat steam with v bucks. So instead of reflecting on themselves, they blamed the indies
Heaven or hell
EPIC vs STEAM
*SALE ONE*
**LET'S SHOP**
Wish you fuckers would put some sort of sound effect in the intro
10,000 reviews would still be a huge amount. That equals to at least around 500,000 copies sold on Steam.
Imagine if Epic and Apple finally get to court and Epic can't foot the bill for their lawyers because giving away hundreds of games killed their Fortnite piggy bank.
14:12 Wow, that is a deep cut.
Money pit? But who's the Voldo in this situation?
Epic supporters
I understood that reference.
The 12 year old fortnite players
Should the Epic Games store stop throwing money into a giant hole?
"surely this hole cant be bottomless," said the executive
Personally I’m ok with it, safety net for indie devs
Money for indie devs, free games for us, patched games on steam. Everyone is happy
So in the end they made a calculated risk but boy....
...Are they unskilled at logistical equations.
The thumbnail made me think they were talking about deathgrips money store for a second
Woolie pulling the JTHM reference
Thanks for the donations, Tim!
Pat pointing out people would buy the one game they were desperate for reminds me of how my friend really wanted to play Borderlands 3 with me and I was a huge borderlands fan (I still hate Randy and Anthony, and had some major gripes with BL2 at release and still some gripes) so that was the one game I bought on Epic games store. I have like 6 or 7 free games and Borderlands.
11:30 I can't believe they're just now figuring this out.
Shh nobody tell them, I'm livin for that free game every week
Maybe the numbers I found were out of date, and to be fair I'm trying to remember numbers I read from a whole ago. But I swear I recall the Xbox did actually make money for a little bit. Like right at the very end of the 360 lifescale I think they went into the black. And then the Xbox One came out and it went right back into the red lol.
Don't you love when a monopoly slowly burns down to the ground.
It's more like it got aborted before it could become Weyland-Yutani or Shinra. Thank goodness the lawfare campaign was defeated by the devils we know. Having a Microsoft with a total lack of self preservation would have done horrible things if it managed to get off the ground.
Don't you also get a free engine license if you take their deal as well?
they just got another billion in funding by the way
I only ever use the epic store to get free games that I like or want to try.
Wait if epic had achievements they'd have the % of people who got achievements available and that would reveal that basically everyone is redeeming games on epic and then just not playing them, meaning epic is paying publishers for games that people aren't even playing
So about 4 months in...is it profitable yet?
Thanks Tim
Does EGS have a shopping cart?
why didn't they throw some of those millions towards a shopping cart or some other features?
Just like trying to compete against Twitch or TH-cam, you don't have a chance against Steam. They are monopoly at this point.
If epic just made the store better I wouldn't even be that against. But as it is. The exclusives me and my friend just joke about how the game was announced for the year after as for fortnite I hate that it worked but they got me in when raven was in the new season.
How does a self sustaining economy work?
Not like this...
@@TurlasThe6 Video Game Autarky this is not
Money printer go brrrrrrr brrrrrrr!!!
Imagine this! Just Fortnite by itself makes enough money for Epic to waste millions of dollars on the epic game store with no expected income to come in years.
jesus, zangeif is huge now
He's a Chahunky Boi!
Pat can’t get 30% of 1.2 billion and Paige is shit at fractions, they really are made for each other.
Time to bet money on who will die first. EGS or Gamestop
I loved watching these guys piece this together because I wouldn't have but epic sucks I just take my free games lol
Good, I hope they go out of business.
I bought one game in epic, so, their balance is -$200 usd from my account.
I get it’s funny to say Fortnite is keeping epic afloat but it’s probably a drop in the bucket compared to unreal engine 4 and 5. As without those engines running perfectly on your console, your console will be on life support it’s whole lifetime.
They say the can’t sell the engine more but they did with Sony giving them millions upon millions in funding and for the right to showcase UE5 on PS5.
That's generally how marketing works. But fortnite has vbucks and millions more users than the engine. It's a different conversation like woolie said
and they said v bucks isn't real money
It should be noted that Epic doubled their value in the last 3 years (from ~15 billion to 30 billion dollars). Fortnite money is also only Monopoly bucks compared to what the Unreal Engine makes. So based on Epic's Total Income, the 300 million losses the store made were only ~4% of the total value of the company. Fortnite alone made more than $3 BILLION in 2018 alone. $300 million in losses is nothing to them.
They see the EGS clearly as a LONG term investment and are willing to make losses over MANY years... because all the 12 year olds that only play Fortnite now have an EGS account and due to the free game program also have rown themselves their initial PC game library there, while they practically have nothing on Steam.
we laugh at epic losing money at that deal, but people forget epic earns a billion dollar a month from fortnite probably
That's part of the story it's literally the second half of the video
its kinda crazy to know that that's barely anything to epic
also you kinda forget new games made with the epic engine do make them more money
Will the Epic Games Store be what finally kills Fortnite?
Most of Epic's money comes form the Unreal Engine not Fortnite.
i wounder how long till good'ol boy tim gets outed from epic for these just unendingly bad decisions
Say what you will about Epic subsisting on Fortnite encouraging children to gamble, I'm happy that indie devs like Supergiant have been getting a cut.
They brought in like 2 billion with fortnite. Epic store is just a side project.
Why does Pat always repeat the Sony fanboy line about Xbox not being profitable? Is he still on 2006 gamefaqs?
Epic exclusive stuff is just nonsense i wish wasnt happening
Just wait for Fortnite NFTS
I'm still boycotting epic and will be waiting for hitman 3 to come to steam or Gog
Microsoft lost on the Xbox for the first couple versions of it. Nothing wrong with this sort of practice. Also the lower cut taken from developers is always a great thing to see. It is one of the good things about the Epic Game Store and I really want to see them improve that shitter so that it is a good alternative to Steam.
A billion dollars and still no shopping cart.
People don’t seem to realize that wishing for certain big brands to go out of business would just mean that their competitors get to monopolize.
That’s really making the issue a bit too simple when you put it out there like that. It’s not like steam doesn’t have competition in the gaming sphere, all the consoles have gaming stores, and Nintendo has accidentally kinda setup a model to similar to steam by incentivizing companies to put up discounts so more people might see their games
Steam doesn't really have many PC competitors because they solved the PC gaming problem. GoG is the closest thing and they would do better if more people knew about them, but I digress. Point is, they do kind of own the PC market, but that isn't the gaming market. They can't do something outrageous on their storefront and not expect people to decided to play games on a different platform, so they are kept mostly in check. And Valve happens to be a company that isn't that predatory all things considered, and that's just pure coincidence. Also because Steam prints them money with very little effort.
@@AshGray2520 Steam could be the most abusive, battering boyfriend on the PC market and PC-for-lifers would NEVER give it up to play it on another platform. They would rather take the abuse and die clinging to their mouse and keyboards than switch to something else.
@@SvarogAristaeusAllen Yeah, because you're talking about spesifically PC-For-Life people. And those people likely know about other storefronts like GoG. Wait, is that your alt-account, Sweeny?
@@SvarogAristaeusAllen I use PC for games because it’s easier to record for my LP videos.
Now you know why Fortnite Crew Exists.
Cause they fucked up and lost the mobile market.
it's 2023, the epic game store still sucks :)
Ultimately, this is exactly what Epic has to do. Steam didn't have to go through a 'burning money' phase because they existed uncontested for so long. Epic on the other hand, has to go up against the reigning king, and has to burn money getting exclusives and features Steam doesn't have as the bare mininum to try to rope people in until it becomes profitable.
And honestly, this approach is a good thing! There's a lot of indie and AA games and devs that would have died or gone under if EGS hadn't funded them, on top of Steam treating anyone who isn't AAA like dirt, so the 'throw money at it' approach has actually helped a lot of people. If only they'd throw that much money at their own platform, though.
If a company can't make money without EGS literally giving them money, it says they shouldn't be in the game business.
It should be concerning that this business model mainly appeals to the Digital Homicides of the world, and not the Red Hook Studios.
@@crazyinsane500 Can't make money if the game dies from lack of budget before it even gets out the door. And even Pat and Woolie point out that a bunch of really beloved games took the Epic deal, such as Hades, first. Even Hitman did it.
@@SvarogAristaeusAllen Hades was published by Supergiant who had the funding from their previous successes and only the third Hitman game in the reboot series where each preceding entries were successful was EGS exclusive.
These games had the funding absent Epic's intervention, and the fact that these titles are the ones you would point to instead of, say, Ooblets suggests a lot about how a studio *without* successes that *needs* the backing of Epic would perform.
@@crazyinsane500 I was pointing out that even developers that had success in the past were appealed to by the deal, which goes against what you said about it primarily appealing to the Digital Homicides of the world.
There are dozens of indie gems out there that the EGS deal appeals to that are actually great but end up being money pits for the developers because advertising is just as important as actual game quality and if you don't have clout or the attention of people with clout to advertise for you, you're never gonna sell enough to recoup your development costs.
When that risk exists, games that could be good die before getting a chance to be born, since it would be seen as just too risky and costly to put in that effort for something no one will see. A game can be good, with or without funding, indie games regularly prove it time and again; But funding would definitely help in ensuring lot of would-be games don't die because they just aren't feasible over a day job for the dev.
So does that mean they're going to start improving the store?
Noooooooooooope.