can you REUSE crush washers? (mechanics secret)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 13 ก.ย. 2024
- A lot of people ask me the question, can I reuse crush washers? With the right technique of making sure they are flat, you can. I have been reusing crush washers for years. The trick to reusing them is you need to remove the distortion they have when they were crushed on to your part. This distortion is what makes crush washers so effective. If you try putting a crush washer back on without taking the distortion out, there's a good chance it will leak. Hope you find the video useful.
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Lol, my 50k usage on a nissan armada would argue that if the bolt is tightened enough... it wont leak.
Good video and explanation of your process. Cheers.
Glad I am not the only one that does this hack when I don't have one near by. Thank you, stay safe, God Bless.
I'm glad this video randomly popped up on my feed !
Dude I just did this on my Mercedes power steering hose fitting. Holy cow. Worked like a charm!! Saved me a lot of grief!
Thanks, you just saved me days looking for new crush washers for my fuel rail! Cheers
This video saved my project car. I couldn't find new washer for the gasoline filter! Thanks for the knowledge
Heat it with torch to a glow. Anneal it. Or do both…sand first and then anneal. You can also quench it in cold water after you get it glowing hot. Copper doesn’t harden when quenched like regular steel. The quench of cold water is just a second option…to rapidly make it draw up to a puffy shape ready to be squeezed.
Here is a proper video on annealing: th-cam.com/video/jHTe_W8w4F8/w-d-xo.html
I worked with copper pipe and annealed it for relief, this way when bolted in place with flanges that had been silver soldered to the ends, the flanges would tighten flat and squared..
I tell people the same principle applies to copper gaskets..
In the old days of auto repairs, the package might say annealed or pre-annealed..
I used copper gaskets for fuel jumper lines and injector gaskets in EMD Diesel Engines..
I would take those and anneal them before using and never had an issue..
Those that were used out of the box, at times, leaked..
So this is what people mean bye annealing them. I kinda pissed working on this Volkswagen Jetta as you can’t find metric hardened bolts locally and now I’ve learned the crush washers are captive and gotta replace the hole line! Do you think I can use old crush washers somehow?
Great video! Can I use a crush washer that's slightly smaller in thickness (1 mm in stead of 1,5) or will the fitting on banjo bolts not allow that?
"Crush" is an important property of crush washers. The Copper in a new washer is soft and crushable, which produces a good seal. But Copper undergoes work-hardening. Once you've crushed it, it becomes hard and doesn't crush well the 2nd time. You could anneal the metal but it's still going to be thinner than the original.
Brake caliper bolt will fit without the washers. It takes 2 but will fit with one. Stripped the tip of my banjo bolt so I’m slimming out my copper washers to save that 7$ for a new bolt. Worked great! Took some time though
I also heat them up glowing a bit with a torch or on the stove, it will help restore the thickness.
Works for Cooper head gaskets as well.
Exactly, because heating the metal and letting it cool will realign lattice and make it malleable again. Once you crush it, it becomes harder. Now, it that too much is whole different story.
That finger nail...
Very ugly but extremely practical.
First thing I saw...gross
...guitar player.
how else is he gonna pick up all those crush washers?
I should have tried reusing old fuel filter crush washer recently. I put the old ones back on only to have it leaked terribly and I couldn't find any shops with the appropriate size washers. Next time I'll try sending them down.
👍
I've got a stainless steel 12X22X1.0mm crush washer sitting here. Dealer order item, 6 weeks lead time and $25 from Germany. Will try this method instead, thanks!
You can only crush a crush gasket so many times... the process is called plastic deformation. You are crushing it to the point that from the inside out the metal is deformed and pushed outwards. Which is also the reason sometimes it is difficult to remove a crush gasket from a bolt.
Flattening it out with sandpaper does not make it safe to reuse... The gasket is too thin to be crushed and will take more force then prior to create a seal. Which means an improper seal and more torque required to seal, hence damaged threads.
Beings it copper, howabout heating slightly so it expands lil bit like handheld torch or heatgun. To b recrushed.
Just what I need. God bless you. Thank you SIR!
What a tip! Love it - thank you so much!
great tips, but sounds like a perfect episode of intergalactic television
Loooool
I must correct this. Copper is a soft elemental metal and will rapidly work harden when subjected to say, compression forces and will fail if exercised (try bending Cu cable back and forth and see what happens).
Cu gaskets CAN be reused, simply by annealing, whereas rubbing it with abrasive will simply drive carbide particulate into the softer metal.
To anneal: Heat to cherry red and drop in cold water.
Good video on annealing: th-cam.com/video/jHTe_W8w4F8/w-d-xo.html
Copper will worker harden in the direction of the force being applied to it. In this case, in reference to washers, will compress. Rubbing it applies a shear force. The point of this video is to give a geometric argument/solution as to how to reuse copper washers, by referencing deformation brought by compressive forces of the bolt. Ideally in theoretical world, compressing the washer past the initial first application torque, will also form a seal. I think your counter argument is to abstract for the application.
You wrote "simply drive carbide particulate" as if you are implying that is all it does, when the important factor is to have a fairly flat surface, and you seem to imply that there would be a significant enough amount of carbide particulates to create a problem, when that simply is not the case because this is a washer, not a bearing.
Further, it is not so clear cut as to state that copper will fail if exercised. Ever heard of multi-strand electrical wire? It can take more bending in use than needed for the (reasonable) lifespan of the product, before reaching a fatigue failure.
To rub a Cu washer with an abrasive will achieve nothing. The material must be deformed to make a seal and annealing will soften it to allow this to happen. If you don't believe me, take a used washer and bend it slightly to see how flexible it is. Anneal it and see the change. Hope this clarifies
Not sure why you're making up fiction. Getting rid of existing deformations (from prior use) helps to achieve and seal once it deforms again. Otherwise it is the existing deformations, which begin deforming again at the rated torque of the fastener, and these hills and valleys on the washer do not necessarily seal correctly, can leave gaps. This has been established time and time again by people who actually do it (is why the video exists). Sand away the existing surface irregularities, then anneal, then install and test for leaks. It is a little bit amazing that you don't think a sealing surface should start out flat. @@MrRunner
Great! I bought a caliper that didn't come with banjo washers, and non of the auto parts stores carry them. I will try re-using the old ones. And I did not know that Harbor Freight carried those. I go to Harbor Freight all the time.
This video is incredible, thanks for being so thorough and straight forward, I appreciate hearing the thought process.
👍
You deserve more subscribers. Thanks.
+Ken Young
I appreciate your support, if you know any other gearheads that might appreciate the channel, please let them now. Thanks again for your comment.
Thanks for the video, I did it once without issue. No leaking. But can you tell what many time can I do that? I have a hard time in finding a correct size of crush washer....
180°flip, worked on rear differential drain plug
You need to heat them orange/cherry red and cool in water. Then the metal reliefs. Do not use sandpaper!
great tip! thank you
I have changed oil on every car I owned for over 30 years. Never replaced a drain plug washer on any of them, and none ever leaked.
It isn't about leaking, its about damaging threads. Crush gaskets deform from the inside out to make that "lip" that seals. They can only make that lip by crushing them to the point they get thinner and longer. You are just lucky... I work doing lube and tires... I see it cause issues all the time.
Just flip em over
Wow, you must have saved like $1.79 over the years. Definitely worth the risk of ruining an engine.
Does not say how many cars he's had during those 30 years. Another comment by same guy "Gee I just don't understand why modern car engines only last a few years"
0:02 @@robertg262
Making the washers flat is only half of the process. Copper washers are annealed to be more ductile and tightening them, along of many random heatcycles, may remove that process' advantage. To do a proper job you'd have to first flatten them and then go through the whole annealing process again... Definitely a waste of time and money when copper washers are so cheap!
.... annealed to what?
Typically crush washers aren’t used in high heat applications so I don’t see how there could be the much work hardening
@@farmyardfab "Crushing" them is often times more than enough to require re-annealing. Better safe than sorry, i guess!
True. Copper becomes work hardened when tightened. It also becomes harder through heat cycles as heat cycles induce mechanical stress. This video and tip is pure bullshit. Reusing washers in this way is a last ditch resort.
This will work for oil drain plugs where it's only to stop seepage. I get away with reusing mine at least once.
Great tips. I'm sure I will use this in the future.
If you tighten the Banjo bolt (on the rear brake wheel cylinder e. g.) with crash washers on both sides of the fitting (in my case it was a brake hose end, where the banjo bolt goes) and then release it a bit to adjust the position of the end of the hose (in my case it was on the way of the Bleeder Valve), then you tighten it back, is it O'K or not, and you need to replace the washers? How such operations like slight release and followed tightening effect the washers? Would be good to know. Thank you for the film.
It is possible to do that, and have them still seal. It is also possible that they will no longer seal, so give it some brake pedal and see, and if it does leak, remove, sand as shown in the video, and anneal, then have more attention to detail when putting it back on.
@@stinkycheese804 I replaced the banjo bolts already, everything is fine. In practice it is not so hard as looks in theory 1st. I was confused by that hole inside, but it is a brilliant design, which seals everything despite that hole. Thank you for the explanations though, appreciate your attention to my question.
Can you use 600 grit sand paper and is annealing it a help too
Can you just use the other side of the washer?
I just bought 10 copper washers for two bucks on Aliexpress, what makes 0.2 apiece... is it worth sanding and reusing it for 0.2$? I only would consider reusing it if I was performing some sort of emergency repair and I found myself without a spare washer on hand, other than that, not worth it.
Wow....You've got patience for days!!!. Not alotta people are gonna go for this. Bless You.
Compared to driving maybe 5 miles to an auto parts store to buy them? I'll take that race any day. By the time you are back, I've got my banjo bolt already reinstalled and I'm having a beer. Plus now you'll probably run into some idiot without a mask on and you'll get covid and die. Meanwhile I'm still having my nice cold beer and doing other fun stuff.
For all the sanding effort and time I think I'll just put on a new washer and be sure it seals.
If you can buy a same size
Except that a lot of people don't have a stash of every conceivable washer size they might run into. "All the sanding effort"? You must be one of those people who is afraid to move his arm around or make other physical effort, when the truth is, it's only a mental block. Getting the new washers is a lot more effort than the minute to sand one down, or even the second minute it takes to anneal one. You spend a lot more time watching the video, IF you did.
Old copper pennies work probably. Project idea anyway.
i've been using that for years, pennies, and nickles work great for typical washer applications. drill a hole. debur it and done.
This is such great news! I waste so many hours of my life looking for the right size washers. With this, i can always use the original size :)
I do wonder if putting the washer in a flat-jawed vice first might help flatten it out some? It should reduce sanding time, but i've never tried it :) Next time I do an oil change i'll let you guys know.
As long as you verify that the vice is level, why not? One problem is if the washer significantly varies in thickness, crushing could warp it to be less round.
When using curved crush washers on auto brake caliper line, does it matter which way the washers are pointed? I had a leak once where I had a mechanic say I put the washers on wrong. Odd thing is, I tried it both ways.
Look at both surfaces it will be in contact with and decide based on whether the curve compromises sealing area more in one orientation, or more flipped over. I'd have to see the parts to be certain, but would imagine that more often, the curve would be concave towards the caliper. However some calipers come with a coating on them and if it is not carefully applied, it could be that this coating creates an irregular surface.
However if yours was not leaking when you did the repair but then started leaking significantly later, odds are that you just didn't torque the bolt down enough and it loosened up over time.
Genius!
Great video. Not always do I find useful videos like this. I tried the washer reheating trick and guess what, it made no sense. This seems to be the correct solution :)
How much both of crush washer and banjo bolt
Nice
would 120 grit paper work?
I think you just showed many guys how to create a wedding band from a crush washer and sand paper. Simple!
Next time clean it from oil then sand it so sand paper will last you thanks
Good tip. I assume you meant "drops into the engine bay" lol big difference.
Is it worth risking your engine for such a tiny tiny savings?
Do you have any evidence of engine failure due to someone doing this, properly? I bet not.
Would you rather a working engine with a perfectly acceptable solution or wait days or weeks to find the right part, order it, and wait for delivery, fit it, and sometimes it leaks anyway?
Can i do the same with my 1mm thick washer? engine oil leaking from there
The minimum thickness remaining that becomes acceptable, depends on the regularity of the surfaces it is in contact with. That can vary even from one specimen to another of the same make/model/year vehicle.
@@stinkycheese804 yeah it became thin and working well but just for one time.
Much arguing about minutiae. He makes the point that specific sizes can be hard to find or the needed size is lost. Also states you can thin too much. What about that one-off tractor hose repair in the field? Spend days waiting for the correct one? Surely the perfectionists wouldn’t settle for HF washers! Often this is on a job not planned and not in the shop. Guys, try to not get wrapped up in one way. Think outside the box. On topic, I have heated them and also reused them cold and have seldom noted a difference. Then again people won’t rebuild wheel cylinders or anything else anymore so... making due is now hack?
You make a good point but so do they. New crush washer is best so don't avoid it out of laziness. In situations where that isn't practical of course you need to make do. I've made crush washers by soldering a loop of copper wire together.
This is a normal brass washer, nothing to do with crush washers, u cannot reuse crush washers as they get crushed when using them ??
They’re like 2 cents..
i never replaced the oil drain crush washer of my camry for more than 10 yrs already....i always torque the bolt to 33ft-lb and never more
Some surfaces are flatter than others and barely needed the washer in the first place. Also some drain plugs have their own built in gasket.
Almost allways reuse those.
why would you go thru all this trouble for 39 cents. Really?
"All this trouble"? It boggles the mind, how lazy some people are. It takes less bother than getting onto youtube and posting your reply after watching the video. It even comes close to the amount of effort to go get your stash of washers and sort through them to find the right size.
So much labor and time for such a inexpensive part. Just replace it. Most auto oil filters include a new crush washer for the drain plug.
browse pals Wrong.
Not only have you reduced the thickness, the molecular structure of the copper has changed from being crushed once before. It will no longer deform as intended.
I once came across a motorcyclist on the side of the road that had an oil drain plug rattle loose at highway speeds because he reused a crush washer. His rear tire was instantly coated in oil. He had his girlfriend on the back and somehow managed to safely come to a stop. Don't ever reuse crush washers. Telling people to do this could be very dangerous.
wrong, he just didnt tighten the drain plug up properly nuffin 2 do with washers
It either seals or it doesn't. As someone already mentioned, if the plug rattles loose then it was not tight enough. This is even true if you use no crush washer at all, that it should never come loose if installed tight enough to begin with.
Also, when you told that story, you forgot to mention that the girlfriend had their baby in her arms and nobody was wearing a seat belt. ;)
it's like not even $10 to buy a box of every size of copper washer there is on ebay
so if i want to change my oil and need a new washer, any plug will do if i do buy it online?i saw amazon has a few when i input my car info but somehow said it doesnt fit my car and then on others with same sku it fits..
Okay, and it takes a minute to sand down a washer, another minute to anneal it. Going to get your caliper to measure the washer to be sure that this mythical "every size" pack on ebay has the right size, then finding that pack on ebay, ordering it, waiting to receive it, delaying your work because of that, vehicle out of commission and even the act of having to start over and put on gloves or wash your hands a second time, is far more of a burden than sanding and annealing a washer.
I'm not arguing against using new washers, but in many repairs, there are dozens of steps to take and if you likewise make every step 5X longer to complete, you get a lot less work done. I don't mean to suggest cutting corners, but this is an exception when you verify it seals good.
Thanks for the video but that seems like a lot of work for a 10 cent part...
lol
When working on old vehicles a lot of parts stores no longer carry the size you need so unless you value your time and fuel driving at zero value as you drive around trying to find the right size, this would actually save money.
as detailed as you seem to be in applications for sealing, the bronze bushing is no where near a crushable substance or it wouldn't last as a bushing. it's a mixture of composites according to the wear factors of it's application. they're not soft like copper. they're like brake shoes. the only thing i can think of as why to reuse and reshape crush washers even if new ones are so cheap is the quality of an old crush washer far outshines the quality of today's products, which are pure junk and not meant to have a service life that's expected to last. almost all new products are entirely junk, we sold ourselves out by thinking a savings of 10 cents was worth it, while china put businesses out of operation by having their wares a few pennies cheaper. and now that the quality companies are gone, who's the top dog now in sales? china. now they have monopoly and can regulate the prices for junk. to compete with that american retailers think they can only buy cheap junk too from china. assemble it here or not whatever and what happens? customer dissatisfaction 100% unless you're too young to know what quality once was. getting old sucks because of that.
My coolant pressure house won't stop leaking i hope to god this works i have been ripping my hair out all week
Get a new hose. A new crush washer for yer oil drain plug isnt gonna fix it. Hehe
The Smoking Rooster in a 120 years doing more than 5 times the recommended oil changes I have never replaced a washer on any of my cars, lawn mowers, motorcycles, boats, jet engines, tanks, rocket ships, or ufos, cause they are just way too damn expensive...
I lost a frigging $230M rocket ship last week because I cheaped out and did not replace a critical .50c washer. Don't be so cheap.
Flip em over
I make that sandpaper 😂🤙🏻
Oh I dislike youtube nails!!
Or you could spend a buck or two and buy a new one 🤷♂️
They are so cheap just buy new ones FFS
Compared to driving maybe 5 miles to an auto parts store to buy them? I'll take that race any day. By the time you are back, I've got my banjo bolt already reinstalled and I'm having a beer. Plus now you'll probably run into some idiot without a mask on and you'll get covid and die. Meanwhile I'm still having my nice cold beer and doing other fun stuff.
🤦🏼♂️ it’s 8 cents people. Is it really worth all this?
Or if you live in a place where these are impossible to find, this video will come in handy
What is "all this"? This is like a mere 1/500th of the effort to do a repair, not even worth thinking about. I can't imagine what life altering trauma it would be if you had to actually DO a repair, if this is "all this". EXCEPT, then driving your vehicle to a shop to have them do it, in total is still 3 orders of magnitude more effort, than "all this" WTFBBQ.
Bs crap. I have never replaced these in my life, well maybe once but they continue to work time after time. It is just a money making scam.