Can You Revive an Old Record? (Ultrasonic Cleaning vs Vacuum Cleaning for Vinyl)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 ก.พ. 2024
- We had an original vinyl pressing of Led Zeppelin's "House of the Holy" that was super dirty and scratchy sounding and we wanted to see if we could revive it using a couple of cleaning methods. We tried the soft brush vacuum cleaning method and ultimately ultrasonic cleaning to try to bring this record back to life. See how it turned out and how the cleaning methods worked on other old records that needed some love.
- บันเทิง
![[4K] TREASURE(트레저) “KING KONG” Band LIVE Concert 킹콩은 라이브를 찢어🦍 [it’s KPOP LIVE 잇츠라이브]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/p8bLLOxPDD8/mqdefault.jpg)
![โอ้มายก๊อด! ไม่ถึงชั่วโมงหมดเป็นแสน 😅 [cc] แดนแพทตี้ SS2 | EP.42 |](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/OH2ShXfO6tA/mqdefault.jpg)
For the old copy of the album, I would recommend another cleaning on the vacuum machine with an Enzymatic solution (i.e. MoFi). You may be shocked at what an improvement it makes in reducing the pops and crackles.
Thanks for the direct comparison guys. I just bought the Vevor cleaner. Just need time to dedicate to cleaning some records.
My Dad used to simply hand wash very dirty vinyl, with gentle cloth and soft detergent and they would come up a treat
My coworker, who is a music engineer does exactly the same thing. Works wonders.
Pretty good demonstration! I have a Nitty Gritty vacuum machine that works good and I'm thinking about getting a ultrasonic machine in the future. I also have a Sumiko Pearl in my collection that I use on my channel and I just recently got the Sumiko Blue Point No. 3 MC cart. Great carts that many people don't hear about.
I’ve found that the trick is you absolutely have to vacuum it AFTER the ultrasonic cleaning.
The real trick is to clean it in the ultrasonic again AFTER the vacuum. THEN vacuum it again and then another dose of ultrasonic and THEN another dose of vacuum and THEN throw it in the bin.
Yep, that'll do it! @@user-rr4ro4mq8w
That's a lot of time lol. I'd pull the CD out instead 🤣 but don't get me wrong, I love my vinyl.
@@miker.8282 LOL, it can be a pain! I use CD and high res files for anything that never got converted to digital in the mixing or mastering process when possible, but for stuff that's AAA recorded, mixed, and mastered analog, I like to stick with vinyl when I can so it's pure analog start to finish.
@@miker.8282 Ha. I was being sarcastic but it probably holds true. Ultrasonic first and then a rinse on the vac machine probably is the best way to do it.
Nice comparison. So many record cleaning pieces simply compare how the records look before and after. What matters is how they sound. I also use a Vevo unit. Results vary. You can't repair actual damage, but getting rid of dirt can make a huge difference. I wrote a large article for Australian HI-FI about six years ago comparing a vacuum system, ultrasound, Spin-Clean and VRCS, a system that involved putting a fluid on the record which would dissolve dirt and dry, which you could then pull off. I bought a bunch of really cheap, really awful second-hand records for the job. It turns out all three of the systems did a decent job with dirt. If you're buying second-hand vinyl, prepare to be mostly disappointed, but occasionally delighted!
I have been using a Ultra sonic cleaner just like you have for the past few years 99.9% of my records come out great!! I also spin them in a clean water bath for 3-5 minutes then vacuum them all off with my VPI machine. I some times spin them with a fan blowing on them as well, But, I feel you need to vacuum off all the water. I also use reverse osmosis water & photo flow 2000 in my mix. I really enjoyed your video... Thanks for sharing
Interesting video which I found informative. Thanks for the upload.
Night and day with that remaster.
Remaster is new........old record is old. How can the new record not sound better than the old record. Plus very poor cleaning on the original. Steams me to see hacks making videos not knowing what they are doing.........
The remaster sounded veiled and compressed actually
Why are people dicks.
Unfortunately, many remasters tend to not sound as good as the originals. Sometimes sounding worse largely due to trying to make the music sound louder overall by crushing the original dynamics of the music.
New subscriber from Bonnie Scotland 🏴
Great informative video.
Thank you so much 👍
This is how I do it for really dirty records - Squirt a little dawn onto a flat paint trim pad with water., give it a quick rinse, place record on towel, scrub in groove pattern with trim pad. It rides the grooves. For extra dirty stuff I scrub it good. Rinse in tap water and let dry. For this method I use my At LP120 USB to spin them during brushing after spraying them because that has a 78 speed and ridiculously high torque (it's DD).
This is for goodwill finds, etc. I even got 80 or so records from a friend that had been in a flooded basement completely submerged, about 20 years ago. the records along with their jackets had been "glued" together in bricks of records. They had to be peeled apart and there were even trails of mold "root systems" on some of them. When I finished my method, they were as good as they were before they were flooded. And that means some of them sounded brand new, because most of them had never been played or only played once. FWIW, my friend owned a Jazz music production company back in the 70's. Oh, and yeah, the labels were shot and I had to use Shazam to find out what was on each one. Also, because of how they had set for decades, they were all perfectly flat. I actually created a thread on this with photos on Audiokarma.org.
I got a roll of 3" circular adhesive labels to make new "hand printed" labels for the records.
Note: This won't fix wear or scratches. It also won't make bad recordings sound good. It assumes a very good record under a lot of dirt, mold, oils, etc.
I sorta like the crackling, it gives me that nostalgic feeling! I've still got the half speed master of dark side of the moon. Be trippin!
I stopped using my ultrasonic tank. My project VC-S2 alu gets just a good results with a 2 step clean and rinse.
The project is all you need
Both helpful and interesting. Thanks.
Are those Totem Acoustic speakers? I have a pair of Rainmakers. Love 'em.
Those are Totem Forest speakers. We love them.
@@harmonyavl most excellent.
I have always used window cleaner, Mr Muscle specifically. The ingredient breaks down the grease and it's a gentle enough detergent, so as not to damage it. It works an absolute treat, used alongside a cloth you would use to ean an imac screen.
Some vinyl will never sound good, if the previous owners played the vinyl with a cartridge & stylus that was too heavy, digging into the vinyl itself.
For me I use warm water with a little washing up liquid, then dip a soft nail brush into the water & follow the grooves of the vinyl with no pressure, then wipe with a microfibre cloth to remove most of the water, then a second microfibre cloth to wipe dry.
Then I leave them to dry for 24 hours, I can safely say the results have been fantastic & believe you me I’ve cleaned a lot of filthy records over the years.
I have a project vac it works wonders sometimes you need clean to a record more than once to get the record to be almost crackle free and let the fluid soak for at least 3mins .
I heard that the crackling and popping keeps the tweeter diaphragm clean with sudden jolts of unregulated signal, violently shaking any dust or dirt particles off the tweeter diaphragm. Thereby extending the life of the tweeter. :)
Shock therapy 😊
@@timleelim9930 Its just common science. :)
Got it , I am getting a nail and scratching all my records.
@@darrengillesdarrengilles8336 Make sure buy the right nail. :)
@@darrengillesdarrengilles8336 good one 😂
I think the Kirmuss Restoration system could bring this back to life even more. It's a very involved process though.
I’ve found a 350 dollar machine called the Ultrasonic works wonders for old grimy records Is easy to use and people debate on the use of cleaners for records Distilled water is probably best as the added cleaners leave a film on the record
With the Triton 100 there should also be anti static chemicals mixed in that do not fight the Triton to get rid of even more static.
Just found your channel on my feed. Loved the video. Do you have a link to where you purchased your ultra sonic cleaner? Btw. I subbed your channel.
www.vevor.com/ultrasonic-cleaner-c_11064/6l-ultrasonic-vinyl-record-cleaner-cleaning-machine-complete-w-drying-rack-p_010265133877
There may be some static as well.. use a zerostat tool. .. will probably remove much more of the crackles
I use an inline filter that supresses sounds produced in the spectrum that cracks and pops exist which is completely different than that of actual musical notes the results have been mind-blowing. I can now play records with scratches on them and not one single audible trace of them gets past my filter no cleaning required.
What is the spectrum of cracks and pops?
I've heard the wood glue method can be very effective on albums like this. Sometimes, that dirt gets so far into the grooves that no standard method will break it loose - including ultrasonic. The glue will soak into the groove over a longer period of time trapping the dirt inside it. And then simply gets pulled out when you remove the glue (which is also one of the most satisfying things to do when you pull it off all in one piece). Expensive? Yes. But maybe worth it for an original pressing like that. Worth a try.
You can clean a lot of the noise out, but a lot of the cracks and clicke are literally burned in forever. Think of the dust causes a microspark to quite literally arc weld a click into the record.
I agree, even with ultrasonic cleaning, some records are too far gone to get perfect. I use a similar homemade mix for my US cleaner (but with much less surfactant/Triton X). Unless doing a dedicated rinse after, that looked like too much (persistent bubbles as spinning). Thanks for the video!
Any details/links to the 3D model record drying rack?
www.vevor.com/ultrasonic-cleaner-c_11064/6l-ultrasonic-vinyl-record-cleaner-cleaning-machine-complete-w-drying-rack-p_010265133877
The rack comes with the ultrasonic cleaner.
With really bad records I soak them in warm water then use soft cloths to scrub them. Some take several tries but have not found anything better so far anyway and have spent stupid cash on machines.
Elmer's Glue FTW!
Water down some wood glue... spread.. er... glob.. it on the record... let it dry... peel it off... play record... cheaper method than borscht...
I've thrown better records than that in the trash ,lol. It's pretty abused. I use a vinyl- Vac system.$35. I vac 1st ,then adgitate w/ a painters corner brush , vac off cleaner , rinse ( distilled) , re- vac . Done . I think it does a great job .
I don't think anything would bring that record back to new , or even to a enjoyable level. I still have several albums I had when I was a a kid , thankfully I did have a cleaner called DiscWasher. I cleaned the record every time before I played it , and now they still sound pretty darn good ,50 years later. Never had an ultrasonic cleaner so I can't say for sure. I agree with one comment , vacuum always last step.
Great video but if you’re going to this much effort it’s well worth removing surface static - quite possibly some of those remaining noise heard. Unless you include a before and after using a device like a Destat III from Furutech I think it’s hard to call these tests conclusive.
Is that a Mono LP or stereo? if it is a Mono Disk you might be out of luck! most turntables/PhonoGraphs are mono and stereo mixed. and will play the stereo track of a mono disk as well as the song/track.
I appreciate the way the cleaning methods and equipment is used. However, these cleaning devices are expensive and not affordable for most audiophiles. Why not demonstrate a typical under $15 cleaning pad and confirm further your results. A cleaning method that most people would use and afford. I still gave you a thumbs up.
From my personal experience, I heard improvements using the simple Spin Clean for about 100 USD. Young people need to accept that old vinyl records will have some surface noise, pops and clicks. The main hypothesis is that the extra noise comes from dirt, but it's not always the case. If a record is old, has some wear and scratches, the more you clean it, the more likely you will create additional damage. Some users of ultrasonic devices have actually broken their records (this remains exceptional but happened), due to the small bubbles inside the scratches causing additional damage. Here, there is some improvement, but you still hear some noise after multiple cleanings. Save your money and buy reissues!
Has anyone ever did a shoot out with hand cleaning versus ultrasonic by playing the vinyl
There’s things I like about hand cleaning, especially with fingerprints
Unfortunately, if you don't clean BEFORE playing you are adding to the surface noise which cannot be removed once the damage has been done. This is because as you play the record the stylus pressure actually heats the groove up enough that as the stylus passes any gunk in the groove is embedded in the groove walls adding permanent noise to the surface of the record. Always clean before each play if you want the vinyl to last with the least amount of damage. This was the premise that fueled the popularity of Discwasher - clean first, listen next.
Nice video
However if you allow me and to be truthful to the scientific method
You could have cleaned side 1 only with the okki nokki then clean both sides with the US
Yes you would be comparing side 1 and side 2 which are different but if the record is dirty on both sides which is likely the case, you would have been able to tell which method is best but perhaps it was not your objective
I have both types of cleaning units and in my experience US is more efficient however for stubborn dirt I sometimes start with the okki the move to US. But in when the record is really awful I start with a lightly soaped warm water and a goat hair brush. Then rinse with distilled water then OKki or US or both
Vinyl is always a pain but the listening experience makes you forget the hassle 😂
I wouldn't call This record damaged, IT is stille dirty. I'd say woodglue tot the rescue !
The album was played dirty and ruins the grooves by grinding the dirt into the finer details. Removing the dirt now leaves pit damage which a decent stylus reads as audio information. Here's an odd one for you. I would always blow little particles of dust off my records and stylus. Nothing crazy , just little puffs. Over the years I kept getting these occasional pops, some pretty solid and loud. WTF? To make a long story short, when I would blow on the records, tiny saliva drops, and I mean tiny, get on the record. Given time, microorganisms grow in the saliva, then die off, leaving a tiny crusty chunk often no wider than a single groove. Wet cleaning can remove them given enough soak time. But I prefer to hand remove them prior to cleaning. First off is finding the little buggers. Then, I took a quality sewing needle, put it in a drill motor and rubbed it on a knife sharpening stone until it was even thinner. Then laid the needle as horizontally as I can in the groove and the crusty bit can be popped off. Similarly to the glue trick but on a tiny scale. Often the rest of the record is in pristine condition so a major cleaning is not required. Good powerful magnifiers will make this pretty simple. Just thought I'd share this unusual experience.
Just get the remastered CDs, yo.
Ironically, the crackling and popping made that intro sound like it was cut fireside!
Both did knock down the crackling and pops, but give it another run through with both and you might get better results.
Dude, get a squeeze bottle for your cleaning fluid. You have zero control of it pouring it out of a water bottle. Also, get a better cleaning brush, those bristly ones suck. I'd recommend the LAST brushes. At the very least, you gotta do some scrubbing with the brushes. Get in those grooves. I've gotten excellent results my way. It's the key to getting them clean, not the vacuum. I just got the same okki nokki a few months ago after a nice 8 year run with a Record Dr. Same result, just easier.
Use wood glue. Lots of yt videos on this method.
1- For ALL I know you must clean that apocalyptic s..t for good ASAP.
2-.How , and who let it get this nasty to begin with?. No gusta, and that being an understatement if it ever was one.
3- ...Shema!!!.
Jet wash but not to close
"Original" pressing are better !
Too much surfactant in the water. Should not have bubbles on the record nor on the surface of the water. Ultrasonic works from cavitation, meaning micro bubbles get into the grooves of the record. The surfactant (soap type solution) thins the water to allow it to get deeper into the grooves and wash away the dirt. Given the soapyness, shown in the video in the water in the cleaner, the solution once dried, will leave a film of white powder in the record grooves and on the stylus from the over use of the surfactant. The record could have been better cleaned with a better solution, meaning much less surfactant and a DI water spray and dry after coming out of the ultrasonic cleaner. Heat should never be used. This guy has no idea what he's doing.
I clean all my vinyl with a lint roller, a shop-vac, and a sham-wow cloth. It has to be sham-wow, because it's made by Germans, and "Everybody Knows the Germans Make Good Stuff".
Some soap and water and then find a realistic tt from the 70s and steal the cartridge….
You put in more than one record at a time in the ultrasonic cleaner. That greatly reduces the effectiveness of ultrasonics cleaning. Sure many venders say “go ahead, clean 2-4 records if you want.” That is idiocy! Think about the energy of the wave hitting the record groove after even one reflection from a soft vinyl surface. Imagine more than one reflection: how does the waveform look now??? Use your brain with these processes, please.
More glycerine is what you dinos need so
Still sounds like shite
Why does ANYONE mess with vinyl anymore? I am an award-winning recording engineer and I was absolutely thrilled when vinyl died back in the early 80s, I have NEVER heard a vinyl record end up sounding like what I heard in the studio during mixing and mastering. Technology has marched on, people don't get around on the horse and buggy anymore. I understand the nostalgia regarding vinyl but vinyl does not and can not sound better than high quality digital. 48k-24bit is the minimum, it exceeds human hearing in every way. Let vinyl die.
I got into vinyl in 2017 and totally regretted it. It wasn’t until recent months I gave up on my vinyl hobby. I don’t miss it at all.
Mess with vinyl? Because I love the process- the tactile component. The jacket, liner notes, the smell,of the old jackets, etc. vinyl can die for you and that’s your biz - but for those of us who love it, it’s none of your business.
@@paulkaiser8834 - I notice you didn't mention sound quality, or the music itself. Like most vinyl enthusiasts, you're into the nostalgia. And it is my business, I'm the guy producing the recordings. With the entire flawed vinyl reproduction chain, you're never going to hear the music as it was intended by the people making the music and recordings, of course, you don't seem to care about that aspect.
@@JohnCline I’m a few things and musician is one of them. What is heard in a mastering session is a good as anything will sound - very few can replicate a mastering studio in their home. Masters even makes me want to go back and remix sometimes. And yes I bounce a earbuds (compressed), vinyl, and audiophile masters. I do prefer the vinyl mix/master the best and the nostalgia, the physical art piece, and process/ritual is as every bit as important also. The fact that some people like vinyl as it makes them happy and want to see it alive makes it none of your business.
Calm down, brother lol. It's not all about sound. It's about personal preference. Also, having something tangible to hold, smell and have lyrics, pictures etc that you can't experience with digital only music. CDs, yeah I like but it all comes down to preference.
Cleaning didnt make any difference