I have a question for the group… Without the negative comments about the Yaesu-120A, can some one check my theory about mounting this in the middle of a steel or rout iron round picnic table to use as a ground plane/counterpoise? It is designed to be mounted on the iron railings of apartment balconies. So if that makes for a good ground plane, why wouldn’t a round metal picnic table?
Any videos on your channel about "working from an apartment" with antennas mounted on the balcony railing, particularly the HF bands; grounding from the 2nd floor, and running and amplifier? Thank you. Good video, KD8EFQ/73 Thumbs Up, and subscribed!
You’re going to get a lot of noise in apartment whether you ground or not. My buddy used a 9:1 with 60ft of wire in a square shape circumference of his living room ceiling. He also tried a 49:1 with 66ft wire in same Config. No ground needed you’re going to get noise regardless. He worked dx with that setup! Try it! Hopefully your on the second floor or above. The signal will still penetrate the roof. It is what it is for apartment setup. Try it though guarantee you’ll get some dx !
@@angpar8449 Sorry for the long-delayed reply and thank you! Yes, my apartment is on the 2nd floor and for at least a year now I have been running a Chameleon CHA MIL Hybrid matcher rated @ 500 watts with their 17-foot telescoping whip antenna all mounted to the balcony railing and able to work 80~6 meters all day with just the Icom 7300 radio! I prefer Single Sideband. The whole antenna is just slightly under 20 feet above the ground.
I can say that a trench ground with 2 8' ground rods screwed together works very well in the desert. I used that method many times in different deserts in my Marine Corps career. Another that works is three 4 foot rods driven into the ground in a triangle a foot apart, bond them with braid and attach your ground.
What if I want to put an Antenna, say, on my Ridge Vent on the Peak of my Roof? In my case the Antenna is the Tram 3500 Magmount which would be affixed to the Steel Ridge Vent, dimensions are 1'x 3' (give/take). I had one guy say to run a single length of Wire 104-106" long in as horizontal an orientation as possible, which sounds to me like a Ground Plane...he's calling it a Counterpoise. I was under the impression the Ridge Vent is the Counterpoise. As far as Grounding, the House has the *rebar* you speak of outside the Garage. the distance between the proposed mounting location and the Ground is roughly 35 feet (again, give/take), and it's my understanding that if the Ground is longer than the Antenna, it becomes the Antenna, which I'm also told you DON'T want. This type of installation is highly desirable if do-able, as the HOA here frowns on Antennas, specifically HF Setups...I'm surprised they let me erect my GMRS Antenna on a Pole out back...appreciate any help/advice on this, as I can't find much about this that I understand...
Will this concept work if I mount a 40 m mobile antenna to my aluminum pool cage, 10 ft above ground, and connect it to a ground rod directly below the antenna? Thanks, Gary
@@raymondlewis2055 I usually put mine about an inch below the surface when permanently installed, that's to keep the lawnmower from having it for lunch. I've always had good performance with them. That also kept my kid's from touching them. Safety first you know.
good stuff dave. i use my ham sticks and hustler mobile antennas when i`m camping. i put 2 mirror mounts with the 3/8x24 stud mounted on the side of the camper and away i go. i just need to remember to ground the camper i always forget. i never use radials but i want to try and see if they help. great info dave.
My first base CB antenna was a stainless steel whip mounted on an 8 foot square of four inch steel grid and I had a very low swr and was able to get out over 50 miles .
Nice video. In your drawing you didn't specify the radial lengths. I know you can use .125 wave length radials, but for a multi band antenna, say 10-40 meters, what radial lengths would you recommend? thx.
I have a height restriction in my backyard due to power lines. Because my dog at the time viewed my chickens as a delicious puzzle, I ended up using a 10x10x6 metal frame dog kennel with chain link siding. I added a chicken wire top to keep out hawks. At some point, I needed a 40M antenna so I purchased a MFJ hamstick and a mirror mount that got screwed to a 4x4 clamped to the top of the coop. A copper braid was used to bond the ground to the coop. The first night I was using FT8 on 40M, I was able to log a contact in Australia so I knew it was working. 73 de KM6KPW
That area now looks like a typical LA suburb. People actually communte from there down the El Cajon pass tp jobs in LA. it is no longer a nice place. It is definitely DRY. Use the suggestions for grounding and have fun.
Hello Dave! Nice to know you were once a southern Californian! I know that area you speak of very well. I used to do field day setup at the top of highway 18 near Wrightwood/Lake Gregory area and worked a lot of dx with a 10m hamstick !
Great topic for a lot of people who for whatever reason (commonly ability, mechanical attachment points, or authorization) cannot put up a big vertical or climb up to string a wire antenna. I use a mobile VHF/UHF antenna with a four-element counterpoise on an old camera tripod in my shack. It works well enough until I can find a way to appease my HOA. My house Ufer ground apparently goes up through the garage wall and connects to the breaker box and then to the meter on the exterior wall, where there's also a ground bus bar for bonding additional ground rods. I think that's a very common way of doing it in new construction these days.
I made contact with WE1SPN in Bristol CT. If I recall correctly, they had a tarheel antenna on the roof. They have about 4 acres of “ground plane”. Great signal for a bunch of engineers!
Thanks for the great explanation Dave. Do I need radials or a metal base for a 5/8th wave VHF/UHF mobile antenna with a mag mount, i.e., Diamond Antenna NR770HB, used as with a base station? TIA and 73!
I set my on top of my power supply and it worked. Maybe I should not sit that close. But. I just tried it . I also have a metal table and that also worked. I put up a GP1 outside so I do not run my mag mount on my base any more .
Question about ground, wouldn't your lightning arrestor to the same ground as your station ground be problematic if you took a strike? It seems I would want to keep this energy outside as much as possible
Hey Tim, yes the lightning arrestor is outside. If you haven't yet look back in Dave's videos, he has several on ground systems and lightning arrestor's. I wish I could site the exact episode's for you. Maybe someone else will remember and comment.
If you take a direct strike you will be in serious trouble regardless of almost any realistic counter measures. I use lightning arresters, but when a thunderstorm closes in, I disconnect all antennas from their arresters (which are of course outside) and I put the antenna connectors in a small waterproof box and lay it on the ground far away from the house. I have cut small channels in the box for the cables to go through. The arresters are nice for taking care of static charge build up - not against direct strikes. Now about your question. The idea about the antenna system and your shack gear sharing the same ground is to prevent ground loops and other interference. Any charge build up from the antenna will want to take the shortest path to ground. That would be the ground rod, not your shack. That being said, it is a best practice to disconnect the antennas during thunderstorms.
I have a question for the group…
Without the negative comments about the Yaesu-120A, can some one check my theory about mounting this in the middle of a steel or rout iron round picnic table to use as a ground plane/counterpoise? It is designed to be mounted on the iron railings of apartment balconies. So if that makes for a good ground plane, why wouldn’t a round metal picnic table?
Any videos on your channel about "working from an apartment" with antennas mounted on the balcony railing, particularly the HF bands; grounding from the 2nd floor, and running and amplifier?
Thank you. Good video,
KD8EFQ/73
Thumbs Up, and subscribed!
You’re going to get a lot of noise in apartment whether you ground or not. My buddy used a 9:1 with 60ft of wire in a square shape circumference of his living room ceiling. He also tried a 49:1 with 66ft wire in same Config. No ground needed you’re going to get noise regardless. He worked dx with that setup! Try it! Hopefully your on the second floor or above. The signal will still penetrate the roof. It is what it is for apartment setup. Try it though guarantee you’ll get some dx !
@@angpar8449 Sorry for the long-delayed reply and thank you! Yes, my apartment is on the 2nd floor and for at least a year now I have been running a Chameleon CHA MIL Hybrid matcher rated @ 500 watts with their 17-foot telescoping whip antenna all mounted to the balcony railing and able to work 80~6 meters all day with just the Icom 7300 radio! I prefer Single Sideband. The whole antenna is just slightly under 20 feet above the ground.
I can say that a trench ground with 2 8' ground rods screwed together works very well in the desert. I used that method many times in different deserts in my Marine Corps career. Another that works is three 4 foot rods driven into the ground in a triangle a foot apart, bond them with braid and attach your ground.
What if I want to put an Antenna, say, on my Ridge Vent on the Peak of my Roof? In my case the Antenna is the Tram 3500 Magmount which would be affixed to the Steel Ridge Vent, dimensions are 1'x 3' (give/take). I had one guy say to run a single length of Wire 104-106" long in as horizontal an orientation as possible, which sounds to me like a Ground Plane...he's calling it a Counterpoise. I was under the impression the Ridge Vent is the Counterpoise. As far as Grounding, the House has the *rebar* you speak of outside the Garage. the distance between the proposed mounting location and the Ground is roughly 35 feet (again, give/take), and it's my understanding that if the Ground is longer than the Antenna, it becomes the Antenna, which I'm also told you DON'T want. This type of installation is highly desirable if do-able, as the HOA here frowns on Antennas, specifically HF Setups...I'm surprised they let me erect my GMRS Antenna on a Pole out back...appreciate any help/advice on this, as I can't find much about this that I understand...
Will this concept work if I mount a 40 m mobile antenna to my aluminum pool cage, 10 ft above ground, and connect it to a ground rod directly below the antenna?
Thanks,
Gary
Thanks For All You Do Dave, 73's from
KD0FDF CA.
I at one time when I first moved in to my new home, used the rain gutter system with a buried counterpoise system , it worked.
A counterpoise is not buried but elevated above the ground. 73, AA4EZ
@@raymondlewis2055 I usually put mine about an inch below the surface when permanently installed, that's to keep the lawnmower from having it for lunch.
I've always had good performance with them. That also kept my kid's from touching them. Safety first you know.
I did that when I lived in an apartment
good stuff dave. i use my ham sticks and hustler mobile antennas when i`m camping. i put 2 mirror mounts with the 3/8x24 stud mounted on the side of the camper and away i go. i just need to remember to ground the camper i always forget. i never use radials but i want to try and see if they help. great info dave.
you mention high desert,is there a low desert then?
My first base CB antenna was a stainless steel whip mounted on an 8 foot square of four inch steel grid and I had a very low swr and was able to get out over 50 miles .
Great videos by the way.
Thanks KD0EBF
Nice video. In your drawing you didn't specify the radial lengths. I know you can use .125 wave length radials, but for a multi band antenna, say 10-40 meters, what radial lengths would you recommend? thx.
I have a height restriction in my backyard due to power lines. Because my dog at the time viewed my chickens as a delicious puzzle, I ended up using a 10x10x6 metal frame dog kennel with chain link siding. I added a chicken wire top to keep out hawks. At some point, I needed a 40M antenna so I purchased a MFJ hamstick and a mirror mount that got screwed to a 4x4 clamped to the top of the coop. A copper braid was used to bond the ground to the coop. The first night I was using FT8 on 40M, I was able to log a contact in Australia so I knew it was working. 73 de KM6KPW
That area now looks like a typical LA suburb. People actually communte from there down the El Cajon pass tp jobs in LA. it is no longer a nice place. It is definitely DRY. Use the suggestions for grounding and have fun.
Hello Dave! Nice to know you were once a southern Californian! I know that area you speak of very well. I used to do field day setup at the top of highway 18 near Wrightwood/Lake Gregory area and worked a lot of dx with a 10m hamstick !
How effective is let’s say a 20m ham stick attached to a 3 magnet mount centered on sheet metal on my back deck? Thank you!
AA4PW
Great topic for a lot of people who for whatever reason (commonly ability, mechanical attachment points, or authorization) cannot put up a big vertical or climb up to string a wire antenna. I use a mobile VHF/UHF antenna with a four-element counterpoise on an old camera tripod in my shack. It works well enough until I can find a way to appease my HOA.
My house Ufer ground apparently goes up through the garage wall and connects to the breaker box and then to the meter on the exterior wall, where there's also a ground bus bar for bonding additional ground rods. I think that's a very common way of doing it in new construction these days.
I made contact with WE1SPN in Bristol CT. If I recall correctly, they had a tarheel antenna on the roof. They have about 4 acres of “ground plane”. Great signal for a bunch of engineers!
My wife is from Lucerne Valley. Still a great area. We live in MA now, but I can't wait to operate out there next time we visit.
Great video
I'd LOVE to make a HAM radio....
When can we begin that video series???! ...hint, hint.
Hello Dave. Thanks Again.
Thanks for the great explanation Dave. Do I need radials or a metal base for a 5/8th wave VHF/UHF mobile antenna with a mag mount, i.e., Diamond Antenna NR770HB, used as with a base station? TIA and 73!
a metal cookie sheet works well as a ground plane for mag mounts - or a pizza pan - for VHF/UHV antennas
I set my on top of my power supply and it worked. Maybe I should not sit that close. But. I just tried it . I also have a metal table and that also worked. I put up a GP1 outside so I do not run my mag mount on my base any more .
Question about ground, wouldn't your lightning arrestor to the same ground as your station ground be problematic if you took a strike? It seems I would want to keep this energy outside as much as possible
Hey Tim, yes the lightning arrestor is outside. If you haven't yet look back in Dave's videos, he has several on ground systems and lightning arrestor's. I wish I could site the exact episode's for you. Maybe someone else will remember and comment.
If you take a direct strike you will be in serious trouble regardless of almost any realistic counter measures. I use lightning arresters, but when a thunderstorm closes in, I disconnect all antennas from their arresters (which are of course outside) and I put the antenna connectors in a small waterproof box and lay it on the ground far away from the house. I have cut small channels in the box for the cables to go through. The arresters are nice for taking care of static charge build up - not against direct strikes.
Now about your question. The idea about the antenna system and your shack gear sharing the same ground is to prevent ground loops and other interference. Any charge build up from the antenna will want to take the shortest path to ground. That would be the ground rod, not your shack. That being said, it is a best practice to disconnect the antennas during thunderstorms.
Did you ever have the notion of being an architect ? 😁
Hello ke zero og. I wanted to ask u a question.