Yeah, I find it strange that the ColecoVision and Atari 5200 are considered the same generation as the 2600 despite coming out 5 years after, yet the Nintendo Famicom/NES is a different generation even though it came out just a year after!
@@TheLairdsLair the whole generation affair is pretty nonsensical. First of all, as you said, it is absurd to put the 5200 in the same generation as the system it was meant to replace (although it ultimately didn't, of course). Then you have systems like the 3DO and Jaguar, which were meant to be next-gen compared to the Mega Drive and the Super Nintendo while, at the same time, they never really commercially competed with the Playstation or Saturn (or maybe just in the year 1995). The same goes for the Dreamcast, which is considered part of the 6th generation but actually competed against the PS1 and N64.
@@danielespeziari5545 well said Been making similar arguments for years as a retro, vintage console fan. Wikipedia's console generation categories appear to be based solely on years released, not the tech specs, which imo is ridiculous. The CV and 5200 should be grouped with the nes and sms based on CPU, GPU, and memory metrics. Same goes for 90s consoles. The 80s and 90s were a time of non linear, rapid Innovations in the gaming world, both consoles and PCs. Using only time to classify them is erroneous. Historical console classification ought to be based solely on tech metrics, CPU, GPU, sound hardware and ram, ROM capacities, plus coprocessors and maybe storage tech, ie rom carts vs cd, DVD vs hard drives vs net play etc
Even though the CBS ColecoVision released in Europe, U.K., Australia and New Zealand had 50 Hz (PAL) output, unlike the later Nintendo NES there was no region lock and the games themselves were not changed from the original 60 Hz (NTSC) output, so consequently the CBS releases of those games play slower. This also means that if you use a CBS cartridge in the U.S. ColecoVision, it will play just fine because, again, the ROMs for the CBS releases were exactly the same as the U.S. Coleco releases.
I'm always impressed by some of the arcade ports, Congo Bongo in particular is outstanding and much better than the SG1000 port of the same game despite essentially the same hardware.
I used to have this friend with a ColecoVision. In the 90s I tried to talk her into selling me her ColecoVision but she refused every attempt. I'd like a CollectorVision Phoenix, a ColecoVision clone with the Super Game hardware built in. A lot of homebrew ports for the ColecoVision require the Super Game Module hardware, The first two batches of the Phoenix have sold out. I've asked CollectorVision to let me know when it's again offered. They have two offices, one in Montreal QC and (fittingly) Phoenix Arizona.
Great stuff is always lad. I purchased my ColecoVision when it was originally released, I also purchased the steering wheel later but the bloody thing was released with the game Turbo and for some reason they chose this bizarre sticky material to use on the steering wheel itself and it left your hands black for days after playing. Oh the memories.
You must be thinking of something else as there is no sticky material on the steering wheel that leaves your hand black. I am 100% certain of this fact.
Fun fact: The Nintendo Famicom was *this* close to being a ColecoVision clone (compatible). Coleco was riding high at the time and the two companies just couldn't make a deal.
Sega SG-1000 wasn’t all too different. I think the ram was enhanced and of course the cartridge slot. Glad Nintendo took a different route. Colecovision was cool but it’s time was short. Atari released the 7800 a couple years late and should have never released the 5200. Otherwise they would have given Colecovision quite a battle. I wasn’t disappointed to have a Texas Instruments Home Computer at the time despite a lack of titles. My neighbors had Colecovision, Atari 800, and C64 but everyone wanted to come to our house to play video games.
@@AngryCalvinspot on re 5200/7800 Other than the sound chip, the 7800 bests the NES in gpu, sprite specs easily. 7800 didn't get the quality resources for game, cart dev the nes got since Nintendo had huge coffers as the nes took off coupled with the typical Japanese long game approach to business, markets and products. Re 7800 late launch, I give that an unfortunate pass due to the market crash and sale, changeover of Atari from Warner to Tramiel, and subsequent business plan changes, some for the better like the st line and relaunch of the 8 bit lines. To further demonstrate the console generation nonsense, the xegs is classed as 3rd gen, even though it is identical hardware and tech as the 5200, classed as 2nd gen !? Demonstrates how Jay Miner's GPU, video designs from the 70s were ahead of their time
I have 5 adams still running...some expansion #3 and some standalone. I have every expansion module. I have every cart game and super game and some super games that werent released, like the kitchen scene where the gorilla is throwing knives and dishes at mario in Donkey Kong. I have megacopy which turns analog tapes into digital tapes. I have their disk drives and SD card reader which is relatively new.
I am virtual certain that the ColecoVision predated any and very MSX and/or MSX predecessor by a margin large enough to say that they copied its standard instead of saying that the CV was just one of many copies of the same thing..
The ColecoVision was the first machine to come out based on the initial design , which was partly taken from the Texas Instruments TI-99 from 2 years earlier but with a new much cheaper and easier to program CPU.
i had one but with the adapter for atari 2600 games. my atari at the time died and i got the coleco vision at yard sale, so i just used all my atari stuff with it, lost that in house fire of 99 but have since got another 2600 and nes which i also had.
Loved every arcade port although the steering of the plane/ship in Time Pilot is blocky. Actually prefer the Frenzy and Ladybug ports to the arcade versions
I remember the first time I used the pause function (* key) in Frenzy. Took a moment before I recognized the pause music as 'Rites of Spring) by Stravinsky, which famously induced street rioting at it's Paris premiere by the Ballet Russe. Now THAT was a genuinely sophisticated and witty jest! Still cracks me up.
Very impressive for the time ,made the Atari 2600 look like a joke,just to add ,Atari did come out in 1977, so apologies Atari, it in 5 years,1982, it was arcade quality ,very impressive for the time
Agreed re videogame console "generations" There needs to be better governance and specs driven assignment of generations of consoles. The Cv and 5200 shouldn't be in the same gen as 2600, intv, o2. This video gives strong evidence the cv should be in the same gen as the Nes, especially had newer carts had increased memory and mapper chips like the nes and even 2600 got. Even dumber, the Xegs is classed 3rd gen, but the IDENTICAL Atari 5200 is 2nd gen!? Wikipedia lists the Sg1000 as 3rd gen, while again, the identical, compatible cv as 2nd gen!? Way o erdue to reclassify the CV and 5200 as 3rd Gen consoles
Exactly, they are utter nonsense, but when you try to have this discussion with most people they won't listen. I was actually thinking I might do a separate video about it just the other day, so your comment is spooky timing, Personally I would argue that the ColecoVision, 5200, Arcadia 2001, CreatiVision and Vectrex are their own completely separate generation I think there is a very distinctive change in technology from the 2600/Intellivision/Videopac to the 5200/ColecoVision/Vectrex and then to the 7800/NES/SMS. I also think there is a good argument to put the early 32-bit consoles like the 3DO, CD32, 32X and Jaguar in their own separate generation too. I mean how can the Jaguar be the same gen as the Nintendo 64 if the Jag was already discontinued when the N64 came out?
I started gaming in 1986 with the Nes and Master System. I have no real connection with the 2nd generation of gaming and even less the first. However, if I was gaming during the second generation, you could bet the Colecovision would have been my choice for playing games. It is (I believe) the most powerful of the three consoles and had Coleco gone with their original plan to enhance it solely for gaming it might have challenged the Nes/Master System. They would have had to do something about their controllers in 1985/1986. However, I don't think it would have been a problem as this is the company that tried to convert their console into a freaking computer with disastrous results. Addendum - Out of all the generations, I still have issues understanding the change from the second to third generations. For example, the Colecovision is so far more advanced than the 2600 it's ridiculous. Yet, it is still considered a second-generation machine. The Nes and Master System were more advanced than the Colecovision but not by 2600 levels. Some even consider the TG-16 a third generation machine. Not me, with a 16-bit Video Display Controller and a Video Color Encoder, it was very much a fourth gen machine.
🤔🤔🤔🤔 Interesting how much view on retro computers differs depending on country. In mine, ColecoVision was almost "not existing", while Atari, Commodore and ZX Spectrum computers (and in case of Atari also consoles) were extremely popular...
Early 80s it would have been Atari 2600, ZX Spectrum, Commodore 64 and BBC Micro. Then Atari ST and Amiga (and to a lesser extent the Master System) before the consoles started to take over in the early nineties.
@@TheLairdsLair Here in Poland it's quite similar with exception of BBC Micro which is almost unknown. Instead we had our Polish Elwro junior however it didn't gain too much popularity. I didn't know that we had so many in common with British guys...😎
Well am actually if the colecovision was really responsible for nintendo’s inspiration for the famicom because 1 the project gamecom to develope the famicom started in june 1982 while the colecovision was released in august 1982, hack even in october 1982 nintendo only had a alpha version of their famicom in it’s infency state,so how could the coleco could,ve inspire nintendo to make a famicom whey they started it’s gamecom to famicom project 2 month’s early before the colecovision was ever released??? Personally i would be not surprised if nintendo already wanted a cartride based game console once they saw atari & mattel with their game console in the late 70’s and early 80’s.
Never had a CV, but a friend did and, man, that was light years ahead of the Atari2600 at that time, now they are considered the same generation.
Yeah, I find it strange that the ColecoVision and Atari 5200 are considered the same generation as the 2600 despite coming out 5 years after, yet the Nintendo Famicom/NES is a different generation even though it came out just a year after!
@@TheLairdsLair the whole generation affair is pretty nonsensical. First of all, as you said, it is absurd to put the 5200 in the same generation as the system it was meant to replace (although it ultimately didn't, of course). Then you have systems like the 3DO and Jaguar, which were meant to be next-gen compared to the Mega Drive and the Super Nintendo while, at the same time, they never really commercially competed with the Playstation or Saturn (or maybe just in the year 1995). The same goes for the Dreamcast, which is considered part of the 6th generation but actually competed against the PS1 and N64.
@@danielespeziari5545 well said
Been making similar arguments for years as a retro, vintage console fan.
Wikipedia's console generation categories appear to be based solely on years released, not the tech specs, which imo is ridiculous.
The CV and 5200 should be grouped with the nes and sms based on CPU, GPU, and memory metrics.
Same goes for 90s consoles.
The 80s and 90s were a time of non linear, rapid Innovations in the gaming world, both consoles and PCs. Using only time to classify them is erroneous.
Historical console classification ought to be based solely on tech metrics, CPU, GPU, sound hardware and ram, ROM capacities, plus coprocessors and maybe storage tech, ie rom carts vs cd, DVD vs hard drives vs net play etc
Very underated system IMO
Even though the CBS ColecoVision released in Europe, U.K., Australia and New Zealand had 50 Hz (PAL) output, unlike the later Nintendo NES there was no region lock and the games themselves were not changed from the original 60 Hz (NTSC) output, so consequently the CBS releases of those games play slower. This also means that if you use a CBS cartridge in the U.S. ColecoVision, it will play just fine because, again, the ROMs for the CBS releases were exactly the same as the U.S. Coleco releases.
I'm always impressed by some of the arcade ports, Congo Bongo in particular is outstanding and much better than the SG1000 port of the same game despite essentially the same hardware.
I used to have this friend with a ColecoVision. In the 90s I tried to talk her into selling me her ColecoVision but she refused every attempt. I'd like a CollectorVision Phoenix, a ColecoVision clone with the Super Game hardware built in. A lot of homebrew ports for the ColecoVision require the Super Game Module hardware, The first two batches of the Phoenix have sold out. I've asked CollectorVision to let me know when it's again offered. They have two offices, one in Montreal QC and (fittingly) Phoenix Arizona.
Really interesting video, I didn't know much about the Colecovision but I do now!
I wish Coleco could have focused the Adam to be MSX compatible. I don't think that was ever on the table but its an interesting what if.
I agree, it wouldn't have been hard to make the Adam MSX based and then have a second cartridge slot for ColecoVision games with a switchable BIOS.
You can buy an adaptor for the almost MSX Spectravideo 328 (svi 603) that just plugs I and let's it run Colecovision games
Yes, exactly! That's a good example of how it could have been done.
IIRC the MSX standard was settled on after the ADAM was already developed.
Does someone like Mr Do?
Great stuff is always lad. I purchased my ColecoVision when it was originally released, I also purchased the steering wheel later but the bloody thing was released with the game Turbo and for some reason they chose this bizarre sticky material to use on the steering wheel itself and it left your hands black for days after playing. Oh the memories.
Never experienced it back in the day, but Turbo is a bloody good port.
@@TheLairdsLair Agreed lad. A great port indeed.
You must be thinking of something else as there is no sticky material on the steering wheel that leaves your hand black. I am 100% certain of this fact.
@@xeriland I have a similar experience as you (and I not only owned one at release, but own 5 or 6 now). Must have been a UK market value add. ;)
Colicovision was trying incorporate the pioneer laser disc player to include video games (dragons lair)
Another great video. Keep up the awesome work :-)
text interludes are WAY TOO LOUD
Fun fact: The Nintendo Famicom was *this* close to being a ColecoVision clone (compatible). Coleco was riding high at the time and the two companies just couldn't make a deal.
Sega SG-1000 wasn’t all too different. I think the ram was enhanced and of course the cartridge slot. Glad Nintendo took a different route. Colecovision was cool but it’s time was short. Atari released the 7800 a couple years late and should have never released the 5200. Otherwise they would have given Colecovision quite a battle. I wasn’t disappointed to have a Texas Instruments Home Computer at the time despite a lack of titles. My neighbors had Colecovision, Atari 800, and C64 but everyone wanted to come to our house to play video games.
@@AngryCalvinspot on re 5200/7800
Other than the sound chip, the 7800 bests the NES in gpu, sprite specs easily. 7800 didn't get the quality resources for game, cart dev the nes got since Nintendo had huge coffers as the nes took off coupled with the typical Japanese long game approach to business, markets and products.
Re 7800 late launch, I give that an unfortunate pass due to the market crash and sale, changeover of Atari from Warner to Tramiel, and subsequent business plan changes, some for the better like the st line and relaunch of the 8 bit lines.
To further demonstrate the console generation nonsense, the xegs is classed as 3rd gen, even though it is identical hardware and tech as the 5200, classed as 2nd gen !?
Demonstrates how Jay Miner's GPU, video designs from the 70s were ahead of their time
I have 5 adams still running...some expansion #3 and some standalone. I have every expansion module. I have every cart game and super game and some super games that werent released, like the kitchen scene where the gorilla is throwing knives and dishes at mario in Donkey Kong. I have megacopy which turns analog tapes into digital tapes. I have their disk drives and SD card reader which is relatively new.
I am virtual certain that the ColecoVision predated any and very MSX and/or MSX predecessor by a margin large enough to say that they copied its standard instead of saying that the CV was just one of many copies of the same thing..
The ColecoVision was the first machine to come out based on the initial design , which was partly taken from the Texas Instruments TI-99 from 2 years earlier but with a new much cheaper and easier to program CPU.
When I was little we had a pair of official Atari paddles and a pair of Gemini branded paddles that we used with our VCS.
I played the f*** out of this thing in the joysticks held up
i had one but with the adapter for atari 2600 games. my atari at the time died and i got the coleco vision at yard sale, so i just used all my atari stuff with it, lost that in house fire of 99 but have since got another 2600 and nes which i also had.
Must have been awesome at the time, sorry you lost it all.
LOL “Anna Lee” Quagmire would be proud
Loved every arcade port although the steering of the plane/ship in Time Pilot is blocky. Actually prefer the Frenzy and Ladybug ports to the arcade versions
I remember the first time I used the pause function (* key) in Frenzy. Took a moment before I recognized the pause music as 'Rites of Spring) by Stravinsky, which famously induced street rioting at it's Paris premiere by the Ballet Russe. Now THAT was a genuinely sophisticated and witty jest! Still cracks me up.
Very impressive for the time ,made the Atari 2600 look like a joke,just to add ,Atari did come out in 1977, so apologies Atari, it in 5 years,1982, it was arcade quality ,very impressive for the time
Agreed re videogame console "generations"
There needs to be better governance and specs driven assignment of generations of consoles.
The Cv and 5200 shouldn't be in the same gen as 2600, intv, o2.
This video gives strong evidence the cv should be in the same gen as the Nes, especially had newer carts had increased memory and mapper chips like the nes and even 2600 got.
Even dumber, the Xegs is classed 3rd gen, but the IDENTICAL Atari 5200 is 2nd gen!?
Wikipedia lists the Sg1000 as 3rd gen, while again, the identical, compatible cv as 2nd gen!?
Way o erdue to reclassify the CV and 5200 as 3rd Gen consoles
Exactly, they are utter nonsense, but when you try to have this discussion with most people they won't listen. I was actually thinking I might do a separate video about it just the other day, so your comment is spooky timing,
Personally I would argue that the ColecoVision, 5200, Arcadia 2001, CreatiVision and Vectrex are their own completely separate generation I think there is a very distinctive change in technology from the 2600/Intellivision/Videopac to the 5200/ColecoVision/Vectrex and then to the 7800/NES/SMS.
I also think there is a good argument to put the early 32-bit consoles like the 3DO, CD32, 32X and Jaguar in their own separate generation too. I mean how can the Jaguar be the same gen as the Nintendo 64 if the Jag was already discontinued when the N64 came out?
Have you try the atari joy sticks they work great, the both use the same 9 pins.
I started gaming in 1986 with the Nes and Master System. I have no real connection with the 2nd generation of gaming and even less the first. However, if I was gaming during the second generation, you could bet the Colecovision would have been my choice for playing games. It is (I believe) the most powerful of the three consoles and had Coleco gone with their original plan to enhance it solely for gaming it might have challenged the Nes/Master System. They would have had to do something about their controllers in 1985/1986. However, I don't think it would have been a problem as this is the company that tried to convert their console into a freaking computer with disastrous results.
Addendum - Out of all the generations, I still have issues understanding the change from the second to third generations. For example, the Colecovision is so far more advanced than the 2600 it's ridiculous. Yet, it is still considered a second-generation machine. The Nes and Master System were more advanced than the Colecovision but not by 2600 levels. Some even consider the TG-16 a third generation machine. Not me, with a 16-bit Video Display Controller and a Video Color Encoder, it was very much a fourth gen machine.
lol, "..Tarzan the original swinger.."?
So the coleco Gemini is a Atari 2600? If my question steers true does that mean 5200 and 7800 games work on it
How? The 5200 and 7800 aren't compatible and the 2600 can't play games from either - I'm confused!
@@TheLairdsLair that's why I asked. I was so confused. Thanks for the correction. Keep up the good work
OK, lol, no worries!
🤔🤔🤔🤔
Interesting how much view on retro computers differs depending on country. In mine, ColecoVision was almost "not existing", while Atari, Commodore and ZX Spectrum computers (and in case of Atari also consoles) were extremely popular...
It was the same in the UK, I never saw a ColecoVision anywhere back in the day, although I know it was sold here.
@@TheLairdsLair Which models were the most popular in UK 30-40 years ago?
Early 80s it would have been Atari 2600, ZX Spectrum, Commodore 64 and BBC Micro. Then Atari ST and Amiga (and to a lesser extent the Master System) before the consoles started to take over in the early nineties.
@@TheLairdsLair Here in Poland it's quite similar with exception of BBC Micro which is almost unknown. Instead we had our Polish Elwro junior however it didn't gain too much popularity. I didn't know that we had so many in common with British guys...😎
Well am actually if the colecovision was really responsible for nintendo’s inspiration for the famicom because 1 the project gamecom to develope the famicom started in june 1982 while the colecovision was released in august 1982, hack even in october 1982 nintendo only had a alpha version of their famicom in it’s infency state,so how could the coleco could,ve inspire nintendo to make a famicom whey they started it’s gamecom to famicom project 2 month’s early before the colecovision was ever released???
Personally i would be not surprised if nintendo already wanted a cartride based game console once they saw atari & mattel with their game console in the late 70’s and early 80’s.
👍