Early Christians in Roman Eyes
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 ม.ค. 2023
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Christianity started out as a tiny sect of Jewish followers of Jesus, but within 400 years it was the dominant religion of the Roman world and a major political force. It had a rough start, however; Romans did not accept this new movement with open arms. But was Christianity actually an illegal religion? Did the followers of Jesus have to hide in the catacombs? Did the emperors consider it a threat to the social order? In this episode we talk about the early reception of Christianity, in particular the persecutions, in order to explode many of the myths one hears about the new faith in its early days.
In this episode, Bart and Megan discuss:
+the place Christianity occupied in the Roman Empire when it was first formed. A lot of historical movies show early Christians as a persecuted group, meeting in secret for fear of imprisonment or violence by the empire. Is this at all rooted in historical fact?
+recorded accounts or persecutions of Christians
+persecution of other religions
+the “Edict of Toleration” issued by the Emperor Galerias in 311 CE
+the conversion of Emperor Constantine to Christianity in 312, and then the Edict of Milan in 313, which essentially granted freedom of religion to all Roman citizens - including Christians.
+was Christianity actually made into an official state religion, or did it simply continue to gain popularity?
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I'm so sorry about the keyboard sounds, everyone, I know it's incredibly distracting when you're trying to listen to Bart. I very carefully mute my mic when Bart is talking and I'm taking notes...unfortunately, for this episode and the following episode, our recording software was recording the wrong mic. So muting did absolutely nothing.
Should have looked a bit further down...I just asked about the typing noise...4give me.
+qqwa++++++++++ææ+a
You bring this knowledge free , I can manage keyboard sound. Thank you
Thanks for the show! I appreciate the apology. I love what you guys do never stop!
I really enjoyed this series please keep up the great work brother
I like to think that their glasses are the same size, but Megan is small and Bart is huge
Thank you for this image hahaha 🤣
Typing was coming over the microphone, drowning Bart out a bit.
There was an empire wide Roman edict against loud keyboards.
Great content. However, the background typing is annoying.
Every time,I am so impressed with Bart’s knowledge. Can you imagine how much richer our culture would be if we had people like him studying the things that interested themselves?
Great installment, but the typing on a mechanical keyboard was really distraction. Maybe use a different keyboard for the next one?
It is funny that even though Bart became an atheist and is now loved by the anti-Christianity crowd, he is still fair and mostly faithful to the historical record. You can see he tries to moderate or even sometimes prevent the anti-Christianity spin.
@jetc4332
Why do you find it "funny" that Dr. Ehrman is fair and balanced in his remarks about Christian history even though he is an agnostic? Çould it be because theists generally make no attempt to be evenhanded? By the way, atheists and agnostics are NOT "anti-Chŕistian." What we are is anti-theocratic.
I, for one am not Anti-Christianity, in fact, I try to follow the precepts outlined by Jesus of Nazareth, be he a real person or a myth. I am, however, an anti BS person, and even a cursory bit of research will tell you that the Noah flood story is a carbon copy of the story in the Epic of Gilgamesh. The deeper you dig, the more you uncover BS. Take the so called exodus. It never happened. The Cannanites became the Israeli. They had to make up the Abraham/Issac story as an excuse to stop sacrificing their first born sons to a pagan god. Think about it. How are we going to tell the guy next door that he killed his son for nothing? It's kind of like trying to stop a war once you start one. What about the parents of the kids that already died? I am a Vietnam Vet. I was there in 66-67. We knew the war was a total crock of shit in 66. It went on until 73.
Absolutely. Honest scholarship requires no less. His lack of faith doesn’t preclude him from attempting to judge as fairly as the evidence allows.
He’s the senior scholar and popularizer of the Data over Dogma movement.
As an agnostic who is interested in Christianity, Judaism, and other ME religions, Bart and other notables from the academic side (the usual suspects*) provide me with valuable information and insights that I could never get from apologetic evangelism or the trite formulations of aggressive atheism.
I don’t think Bart is beloved by certain factions of atheism. His audience is generally thoughtful people who are both believers and non-believers and who are interested in the most important book(s) of Western Civilization.
* My usual suspects: scholars Dan, Kip, Megan, Josh, plus non-scholars Derek and Paul. They aren’t the only ones out there, but I’m watching their material on the daily.
@@spaceman081447I think the majority of atheists don’t even think about religious questions at all until those questions are shoved in their face. And until that moment (when they are confronted with questions about the beginnings of human life, for example) they prefer to just live their lives.
The majority of atheists don’t care about anti-theism and anti-Christianity.
If you live in a society that is a part of “Western Civilization” or has its roots in the Western Traditions, your active atheism is going to take the form of anti-Christianity 99% of the time. So I don’t think your distinction between anti-Christianity and anti-theism is meaningful in any practical sense.
Honestly, do you spend time on Buddhist channels, debunking their beliefs? (and there are theistic Buddhist denominations.) Do you regularly debunk Hindu scripture? I bet you don’t. When was the last time you entered a chat about Navajo cosmology to explain why Navajo beliefs are based on the impossible?
I’m not telling you what to do (but now I’m going to tell you what to do). Just call yourself an atheist or nonbeliever.
Please do not keyboard during zoom.
A Bluetooth keypad would be better.
That was terribly distracting.
I love the clickity clack, whatever bro
I saw this when I started the video and didn't think much about it but then about half way through this vid I started to get really bugged by it. She's typing as he's saying things that are really important and it's hard to stay with his enthusiasm when she's not even interested :p
Yes, it's like scratching a chalkboard. A Lil cringe 😬
Gah! Megan, the typing!
😵💫🤪😵💫
This was another fascinating and informative video in this series. Megan you are a great interviewer but your keyboard is very loud and is a distraction when Bart is answering your questions.
Great episode, but the keyboard was too loud. Can it be muted when typing going forward?
Sorry, but the typing is very distracting
Lol - I was thinking the same thing. I was thinking there was a discussion; "I just assembled my keyboard from the rusty parts of an old Ford truck. Will that be OK for the podcast?"
All kidding aside, I really liked the podcast content. I am glad these are coming out regularly. Good stuff!
I was about to make the same comment😂
Just super rude.
You're the typing.
Great discussion. As usual, Bart is very informative. Megan’s typing is rather distracting. Perhaps she could turn off her mic while Bart is answering.
Perhaps she could just listen. There’s no excuse for this.
I mean why would she choose a mechanical keyboard??
28:07
Y'all it'll be okay. Human error. It's a great episode and Megan is an incredible host.
I am always excited when it's Tuesday and a new episode is released.
I'm really loving all of these. Thank you so much for sharing all of this information.
Megan's typing is really frustrating
Yes, horrible
Yes, very distracting. She should be muting her mic. Otherwise, a great webcast.
Great topic and I always love these two together! The typing was very distracting though.
The idea that the loss of income starved out the pagan temples and priests is something I've never heard brought up before. That's a very powerful thought. It suggests that pagan worship could collapse very quickly as more and more people convert in a kind of self-reinforcing process.
For the pagans, it was worse than that. Beginning with Constantine, emperors began taking away money and treasures from those temples to fund their Christian projects, and in some places took their buildings for Christian use. So they were robbed (essentially) and then starved of income. Combine that with everyone trying to advance their careers by joining up with the emperor's favorite religion, and the rest is "history."
Always interesting. Thank you again, Dr Bartman.
Please don't be typing in future broadcasts! Or get a less mechanical keyboard.
Agree, I had to stop watching because the typing was too annoying.
I support this. My wife and I found the typing distracting
I made the same comment. Especially when you're wearing head phones it's very distracting.
Oh, c'mon guys. She made a mistake. Leave the poor woman alone.
Thank you for sharing, something positive about this generation of students. Doesn't seem like older generations have too many positive things to say about younger ones.
I'm glad you believe that haha😄
Its a tale as old as time. The older generation thinks the younger generation is going to hell in a handbasket, but your younger generation seems to have trouble understanding thins. lol🤣
I'm 62 and I'd say the bell curve has flattened...both more outstanding and really clueless youth than my generation in the 70's
@@BandiGetOffTheRoof it sure does. seem" that way. The average IQ over time tells a different story tho. It's also known as the flynn effect. IQ is adjusted about 3 points every decade because we continue to learn off the shoulders of the past.
A fun test would be to give a 65 year old a smart phone and give a 6.5 year old a smartphone and ask them to change the setting of .... fill in blank 😂 Ive watch my son show my mom how to use a cell phone from the age of 3 and now he shows my wife of 41 how to change advance settings, he's ten.
very interesting stuff...... i dont know who is doing the typing whilst Bart is talking but it's really annoying
and the loud sniffing
And talking over him with quips
And talking over him with quips
Great show. Thanks. Love y'all.
This was great to listen
Thank you!
Thanks so much Dr. Ehrman!
What are all the distracting crackling sounds going on while Bart's speaking? Very annoying.
I think Megan was looking something up. Wanna send her a quiet keyboard?
Sounds like a keyboard to me
@@stevespindler2088 So I have gleaned from the many comments that were made subsequent to my own. If I had realized it was the sound of Megan's keyboard I wouldn't have said anything. Obviously, she was unaware that the mic was picking it up, and I don't think she would have been typing unless it was important. I hope everything's okay with her and her family. I think she does a terrific job.
To the many (male) commenters who seem to think it's always acceptable for a man to make personal observations - insulting or complimentary, it doesn't matter - about a woman's appearance, know this: you are mistaken. You are arrogant. You are rude.
@@dorothysatterfield3699
You seem to be sensitive about alot of stuff. Maybe some yoga would be good for you.
@@Darisiabgal7573 Thank you for proving my point.
Great stuff! Keep it coming!
Mute button Megan.. the typing is very loud
Really appreciate this video.
I want to learn how Bart performs a kind of warm-up routine to smoothly ramp onto any topic. A very personal intro that doesn't waste time.
I love this show so. Thank you.
Megan's idea of the Superb Owl (in lieu of the Super Bowl) is total genius. Interesting video as always.
I really enjoyed the background music.
Truly.
LOVE ALL THESE SHOWS BART.
The WOW part for me was your "revelation" near the end at 44:59 regarding the emperors sometimes being called "Lord and Savior" or "Son of God".
That single sentence makes everything so clear (to me) now regarding Jesus as a mere mortal man/preacher. It's perspective.
So glad I stuck around to the end of this.
CONSTANTLY TAKING NOTES on your vids :-)
As was Megan, apparently.
That was absolutely mind blowing!
Flavians created/co-opted Jesus movement or the Nerva dynasty did. Roman creation either way
May explain why the Roman authorities saw Jesus and his cult as a threat.
I learned it for the first time about 12 years ago in Episode 1 of the CATHOLICISM series (I'll post link below. skip to 17:55 - 22:00)
That typing is multi tasking gone wild. Focus on one thing for 30 minutes.
Megan. You have a fantastic “business model” for your channel. Thank you for your time.
thank you dott Bart ehrman ✌️
very annoying the typing :(. btw excellent post as ever. kudos dr. Ehrman for an informative video. love it.
Megan, if you are going to host these sessions, please do not type while Bart is talking!
She’s well aware. Recording software discrepancy.
That typing in the background is crazy loud 😬
Excellent
Would've liked more explanation of why the monotheistic Jews were not persecuted for their exclusive devotion to God.
I know it has likely already been recorded but I would love to hear Dr. Ehrman and Dr. Goodacre discuss the synoptic problem. Q or Luke using Matthew.
Hi Megan. When I listened to your lovely program with an earphone, I noticed that the clicky-clacky typing sounds in the background are not really in the background; in fact, they become all the ground and I cannot hear Bart. All the best.
NO MORE TYPING
NT Wright and John Dominic Crossan both point out the competing titles of Caesar and Christ. Maybe others too
interesting discussion. irritating keyboard noise at the best parts. Megan, this is so easy to fix!
Recommendation for the editor: when one person is speaking, mute the audio from the other person's mic, if you have separate audio channels. It'll cut the typing and sniffling sounds
Read the pinned comment.
They know that. They just goofed this time.
30:42 typing/….. i wait for these every Tuesday and Dr Ehrman has opened my eyes in so many ways. Please if at all possible please get a quieter keyboard. Sorry to be annoying but thank you!
Wow, that was awkwardly timely! I have been studying the criticism against Christianity by Celsus and Prophyry recently.
Divine intervention!
Question for next week: is it true that the story in John about Doubting Thomas was an effort by the author of John to elevate his gospel above The Gospel of Thomas?
Megan: either get a quieter key board or stop typing during the video(PLEASE)
I was listening to the podcast in my car on my way back from work, so my initial thought about the keyboard sound was that Dr Ehrman was swirling some ice on a glass as he talked before he took a sip 😂😂😂😂
Thanks for that Megan...techno diff....just signed for blog
Awesome
Bart's comment about the connection between religion and government is interesting, particularly in the midst of our current argument about that. The Christianity I grew up with insisted religion had nothing to do with politics. Interesting.
Love the video, buuut can you mute yourself when you're typing please? I listen to this on headphones and it's super distracting XD
Comparative religion courses should be offered in high school.
To give students a wider perspective of what other cultures believe, as well as some of the history of non belief.
To help cut down on prejudice & intolerance.
I think that's a fantastic idea. I teach high school (in Europe, not the US, which is notable for this, I think), and the first challenge I see for your very good idea is that there are far, far fewer specialised secondary school teachers than there are university teachers. At the secondary level, a teacher will probably teach many subjects while having an undergraduate (and occasionally a master's) relating to the general field to which those classes belong. Someone with a degree in chemistry might teach Earth & Space Science one year, for example, while the next year someone with a degree in geology might.
Something so specific as comparative religion requires not just considerable content knowledge, which doesn't really gibe with that generalist approach, but also capability in presenting many viewpoints without personal bias. So it's a bit of an ask for high school, but I agree with you that it's well worth doing, and it is certainly not impossible.
Personally, my biggest worry would be someone wanting to teach that class (either because it's a fascinating subject, because it's so important for the students, or because they want their own team to come out on top) while not having the requisite knowledge to do so and do it well. I myself teach classical literature and mythology, and some of the things I have seen high school educators say and do (and teach) in those fields is appalling -- and far less impactful politically and socially than comparative religion! The hero's journey comes to mind... But that's a whole other story!
@@joshuapray Thanks for your kind words.
To me the biggest problem is agreeing on the curriculum.
The classes should be taught from an objective historical context.
Things like the culture that arose from those beliefs, and of course what they believed & why.
Do all believers of same religion, agree and come to the same conclusion ?
But never to be taught as _"this is most likely true",_ *no assertions about any religions potential, to be true of not.*
_Just The Facts & Nothing But The Facts._
The teachers just have to stay within certain guidelines, which they already have to do anyway.
I think that being 100% pragmatic & practical about the motives and benefits should make it an easy sell.
But people do push back against _critical race theory",_ as they fear that to closely examine all of the bad things that white colonial empires did will somehow cause more hatred.
We learned about the horrors Japan & Germany perpetrated in WW 2 and still treat them with respect.
I'm Canadian, and I was not taught about our gov't's program of abduction and indoctrination into western culture & Christianity that was perpetrated upon the children of natives, however today it's taught in the history classes of every province.
But I've babbled enough for now.
_Keep On Truckin'_ Joshua
Did Bart say "it depends" at all in this episode?
I can say firsthand as a 20-year-old that recent world events and people’s reactions to said events-especially responses from the religious-are EXACTLY why I’m personally invested in religious studies, as well as science and communication. From my perspective, you both hit it on the nose.
I like dr Yigal Binun's last sentence after lecture about Christianity that that well diversed religion started from here between Dan and Beer Sheva
Excellent as usual. Keyboard very loud and sounds like someone else in the background. Distracting.
Do we also have preserved Trajan's answer to Pliny's letter?
Where does one submit for "viewer questions?"
Dear Sir, what do you think about the “shroud of Turin“? -Thanks!
It has been shown repeatedly to be a fraud.
Like all of the so-called relics, it is a fraud. People are so easily deceived and eager to believe BS.
Amazed that Christianity dominated Rome and western civilization quickly and still going strong today, but never really picked up in Beijing and eastern civilization and is still struggling to make inroads today. Would like to know why is that, what so different between Rome and Beijing over the 2000 years of Christian existence in a future episode.
What made Christianity dominant in the Roman world was that it got government sponsorship - from the time of Constantine until Theodosius becoming a Christian became a path to social and political advancement. After Theodosius (the emperor who made Christianity the official religion in 380 CE) it became a necessary component of having any career at all. In China, Christianity was a minority religious sect that had a sketchy relationship to the official world, which followed Confucian teachings and a polytheistic official religion that included ancestor worship. So Christianity made little headway. It only really took off in China during the time of the European empires, when missionaries had more clout - but even then it remained a minority faith.
This in fact is the pattern more generally for Christianity - in Europe, in places where it became the official religion, it became the majority religion. In places where it didn't, it had little influence. The great spread of Christianity as an influential force outside Europe follows the path of European colonization.
@@njhoepner thanks for pointing out that the difference between the west and east is the western powers adopted Christianity while the eastern powers found little use for it. I still find it puzzling seeing that Christianity was successful in one place but not another. I'm reading something about it was might makes right. Christianity used force to convert the pagan natives in the west and all the places it colonized around the world, and that why it was successful. Since the east was never colonized by the west, they could not convert them like they did the rest of the world.
@@njhoepner you forgot the other two main religions of China: Buddhism and Taoism.
@@silvershadchan4085 True enough, although I wasn't trying to be exhaustive. In any case, while both were larger influences in China than forms of Christianity or Islam, they remained minority religions so long as the various Confucianism and its associated imperial cult remained the official religion. With the Communist revolution all religions find themselves disfavored, and all are minority faiths, some (like Buddhism, Daoism, and Falun Gong) larger than others. I think the overall pattern remains the same.
Christianity and Islam spread at the tip of a sword. From emperors and kings throughout their conquests and colonies.
Islam did make inroads in south and southeast Asia from Pakistan through Malaysia. Christianity took over a lot of Korea after persecution, then gaining royal favor.
Christianity also took hold of a lot of persecuted minorities in Asia, the indigenous peoples. It's good at converting people away from peganism (as those gods failed protecting them from oppression), but not good at converting people away from entrenched official religions with codified beliefs.
Christianity & Islam, without the tip of a sword, brings solace to persecuted minorities without strong *written* powerful, well financed, historical religious traditions. But it can't make much inroads when a religion has these things.
Buddhism, Taoism, Confucianism, and Hinduism also don't necessarily require fantastical stories from very far away. One can believe in polytheism with them, or one can have a very human, logical, agnostic belief system in them. They all have very academic, intellectual sects leading them.
This keyboard is really terrible. I can't focus when Megan is typing. Perhaps different keyboard or more directional mic is something to consider.
About Mithras- I’ve seen a lot of ‘information’ on Mithras, such as having a birthday of Dec. 25th, some sort of water baptism ritual, having 12 companions, being buried and resurrected after the 3rd day, and being called “the way, the truth, and the life.” Also, that Mithras was named the official protector of the Roman Empire by Diocletian in 307… not that long before Jesus took the same position in 325. If true, there are an awful lot of parallels between Mithras stories and Jesus stories. But it seems like we don’t actually know that much about Mithras? Are any of the alleged parallels historically verifiable? If not, any idea where the Mithras stories come from?
Almost everything asserted in your comment about Mithras is not supported by contemporary scholarship. Here's a good primer about the current state of research from Religion for Breakfast, a youtuber/colleague of Bart Ehrman's: th-cam.com/video/xlF0gVedODE/w-d-xo.html
@@joshuahorton-campbell3554 this is great, thank you!
From what I could gather the Diocletian persecution is somewhat overblown. It seems to have been more economically motivated, what they were after was the precious metals and gems that Christians had donated to the church that had been used to decorate scriptures, icons, and relics. Many of the martyrdoms occurred when the keepers of these valuable objects refused to hand them over.
What's a keyboard? The letter-number button thing?
What I don't understand is how Dr. Ehrman could concentrate on what he was saying with that noisy typing going on. I certainly couldn't.
You both have great frames
obsessed with Megan's glasses, and can't help staring at them as they speak!
Bart’s Weekly Update: Watching football. Lol. Good for you, Bart! Man of the ppl.
Great insight. Especially the statement on "the son of God". A term used by the Romans that the early Christians picked up on. Typing was very annoying.
I learned it first from this episode of CATHOLICISM series (skip to 17:55 - 22:00) th-cam.com/video/l_oZeebATfg/w-d-xo.html
I think as Dr. Ehrman's notoriety has grown on TH-cam young inquiring minds are seeking him at at university. He is a wealth of information about the history of the new testament and the development of Christian theology. Many young Christian are interested in history with this orientation.
Bart used to say his students were predominantly Christian. With the growing population of the “nones” (regarding religious affiliation), I wonder how this has reflected in his student population over the 30+ years he has been teaching.
@@rschreck He teaches in North Carolina, which is very much in the Bible Belt. He has stated in recent times (last few months) that the majority of students are still evangelical Christians. I'm sure he has said it more than once.
The typing and what sounds like “the sniffles”
Could someone please get Megan a quieter keyboard and a box of tissues?
I wish an account of the class/economic dynamics involving conversion to Christianity from the inception to at least legalization could be written. Especially focusing on the commercial classes.
the noise was a very weird distraction, but I did survive! Thanks to you both for another great interview! :)
Distracting sound of a keyboard here and there... amazing how BE has such wealth of information. I must read the book he mentioned.
When you saw that inscription in Turkey about Augustus, son of God, I was reminded of John 18:36. I think to remember that this verse was probably a later addition. But anyway, during the questioning of Jesus in his trial, it was very clear that Pontius Pilate seems to have thought that Jesus was mimicking the Roman Emperor.
I learned about Caesar being called "son of god" for the first time about 12 years ago in Episode 1 of the CATHOLICISM series (link below. skip to 17:55 - 22:00)
th-cam.com/video/l_oZeebATfg/w-d-xo.html
Pliny the Elder gave an account of the eruption of Vesuvius that destroyed Pompeii in 79 CE
If Jesus had thousands of followers, where were they during his trial, when Pilate asked the crowd what to do with Jesus? Were they just not interested enough to attend the trial? Were they among those (apparently the whole crowd) who wanted Jesus crucified?
Conversely, how did they draw out a big crowd of random heckling jews during passover, when ur supposed to be inside? Lol
I have read that many Christian officials at the Council of Nicea had scars from persecution.
who is the secular equivalent to Dr. Ehrman for other religions or even for secularism itself?
Never mind, I looked up on the blog (Paul . . . ) Doh!
If it's possible, could you reduce the volume of the keyboard typing next time? Great video otherwise
I attended Super Bowl IV in Tulane Stadium in 1970 and watched your beloved Chiefs befuddle the Vikings. Maybe you could get Goodacre to discuss the Farrer hypothesis.
I know Bart has critiqued Atwill’s theory, but has he spoken with James Valiant/read “Creating Christ”? It’s probably the 1st time I’ve thought that someone could offer a lot of research and insight that Bart may not be familiar with lol (specifically on the topic of early christianity in Roman sociopolitical context, that is)
Also, is there specific evidence that leads u guys to think the Nero fire prosecution wasn’t a tall tale?
Bart, beginning at 5:00 in your video, you explain that Christianity grew from ~20 believers in ~33 CE to ~3,000,000 by ~300 CE. This may sound unbelievably high, but it’s actually a growth rate of less than 5%.
This implies that the initial 20 believers converted only a single person in the first year. For its first 300 years, Christianity grew at a yearly rate of one convert for every 20 believers.
Does your new book include Christianity’s historical rates of growth?
i read his book, "The Triumph of Christianity", and as I remember he goes through the math in detail.
Yes, an exponential growth rate less than 5% - actually just less than 4%. It sounds small to today's minds but quite amazing considering (lack of) speed of travel & communication, & relative immobility of peoples from 2000 years ago.
Very interesting, Dr Ehrman! But, Megan, the sound of that keyboard is so annoying...
If the names Mark, Matthew, Luke & John were added as part of church tradition,
what were they called before these names were added to the gospels ?
At 29:37 Megan says Constantine converted around 312, but didn’t he actually convert on his death bed? This was the way he could enter Paradise with a pure soul ... and allowed him to order persecutions and executions of enemies until the end of his rule.
... and then Bart says “Libanius” but he certainly means *Licinius*.
I know it’s kinda late but I’m wondering you didn’t mention the Edict of Thessalonica which DID declare Christianity as the state religion
FYI. Typing is really loud..
Did the "persecutions" or anti-social behavior apply to all varieties of early Christianity or just proto-Orthodox Christianity?
The pagans' lack of exclusivity prevented them from practicing the social insurance component of religious communities. Christians, because they were exclusively Christian, could rely upon one another to help in times of emergency -- food insecurity, supportive medical care, etc. Just the simple act of sharing fresh food (meat, fish, etc.) before it became poisonous could have made all the difference. And the simple act of supplying drinking water to someone battling food poisoning was likewise a service that required more than just association through the Baccus wine god. This is especially true when it's sometimes tough to tell the difference between food poisoning and a contagious disease. Ancient peoples prayed before each meal for a reason.
You can see from the glasses these two wear, who has the wider focus. Cheers
"I don't watch tv."
Also: "I watch lots of sports."
Where, then, does Ehrman watch these sports if not on tv? Does he see them in a personal vision, like St Paul?
Anyway, good discussion. Thanks.
How do you get from 20 Aramaic speaking people to the Roman Empire?
That would -- in part -- be due to Paul, and his outreach to Greek and Latin speaking readers and listeners.