@@jgabrielcastro89 kinda: So vayne has 40mana. She has shojin which gives 15 mana. So she needs 3 aa to get her ability. But the 3rd hit also generates 20 extra mana cause of shojin, which would be wasted. The tft team made it so that the next auto after the spell gets the 20 extra mana now and it is not wasted. You can see that quite easy in the vid.
I must say I noticed this too with some champ, I don't remember which one. But essentially, every game start, the champ would always had that mana proc on the attack where only 10 mana was needed to cast. So, yea it is really good.
@@Shuraig7 Yeah its zoe, she starts doing some trolling and starts casting almost every auto and if she has enough AS she'll spam them on each auto, like guinsoos included it is insane XD
Shojin blue buff vayne will fire bolts at dying targets after every auto, and then mid-flight it'll retarget onto alive targets. Basically she's a guided missile jinx.
They basically made sojin more effective for high man units. This way they gain more overall mana. And Blue buff is for low mana burst dmg units. They are actually good now than they were.
This along side the AD scaling being better above 100 AD, seperates the use cases from Blue Buff. It's specifically good on high frequency auto attackers, and AD casters who don't want to skip the AD in a slot. Vayne, Kai'sa, Urgot are a few that come to mind as well as some dualists and Soraka (attack speed admin).
From what I understood, it seems that this is how it works: Shojin gives 20 mana every 3rd auto, if the mana it gives exceeds the champ's mana cap (if the champ only has 30 mana for example) any excess mana the Shojin provides is "saved" and given to the champ after the spell is cast.
@@kaeldeleon it doesn't save the mana, it saves the proc. If the you are 10 mana or less away from casting, the proc will be saved to the next auto after the cast. But say, you need 15 mana to cast, then shojin will still proc and the excess mana is wasted
Imagine not having in depth out of game tool tips to explain the depths of items and how they work. Or just watch infinite tft clips for tiny bits of info to be aware of bugs/ unexplained major interactions like this one. Nah thats just part of the “skill” of tft i guess
@@kimchijam and tbf the TFT team doesn't have to use their kit. ASol has gone through more iterations with abilities he doesn't have than ones he does (I don't remember him raining meteors from the sky or having a Brand W like last set, but what do I know). Urgot is for sure known for summoning a Nami wave that pulls the enemy team into him as well on Summoner's Rift.
@@amethonys2798 fair point, those make sense with their design but vayne is just a girl with 2 crossbows, she can roll and shoot bolts, she actually shoots with her large crossbow during the cast but it's kinda hard to notice I guess
@@amethonys2798 set 7 aurelion sol was just his Q with the idle animation combined, and this set it's his W but instead of floating around him it rains from the sky. Tf are you supposed to give Vayne to make it unique? Her ult? 🗿
I love how I obviously pay more attention then top tft players and I’ve been hard stuck plat since set 1💀 granted I only play maybe 10 games a week but still. What would make a pro player thing vaynes ability procs it
They are definitely way better at pivoting, accessing board strength, and all that jazz that it’s always funny to learn that they don’t know how most items and champions interact. lol
Maybe this was patched since PBE. On PBE Vayne went auto-auto-cast every single time, which is not what Mort is saying. I watched her closely every fight. I’ll have to test it out again on live.
That is exactly what is happening in the clip. What Mortdog says is that when the auto that would have activated Shojin doesn't need that mana to cast, it won't use the effect and instead activate it after the cast. What Vayne is doing is after the first 3 autos, she doesn't activate shojin in the third hit, instead in the first auto after her ult she gets the mana from shojin, then it seems that its a combination between her autoing during mana lock and then activating Shojin and that goes on loop
@@Slyo16 Auto-auto-cast shouldn't be 40 mana. She should need auto-auto-auto cast for 50 total mana, which would... leave her with 10? Not sure how it would work. Maybe it's not a true auto 2x cast tempo, and there's occasionally a 3rd auto in there. Another guess is that when it "saves" the auto, it does that if there's any mana remaining, but then gives you the full 20. This means that her first ult: auto, auto, auto(+20), cast (10 mana extra) would then grant her 20 mana for following cast, rather than 10. This leads to the second ult: auto, auto, cast. Now there are 2 autos banked for shojin, so the third ult: auto(+20), auto cast. Now we have one banked, 4th ult is: auto, auto(+20) cast Now we have no autos banked, and we're back at the beginning. If that's the case, undamaged, she fires on a loop of: auto 3x cast auto 2x cast auto 2x cast auto 2x cast repeat
@@johnnyblackrants7625 From what I can see in the clip, she always does 1 auto while she's manalocked so she doesn't generate any mana but it counts for the 3 autos of shojin, so it would be something like: Auto auto auto ult (shojin stores) Auto (shojin) auto ult Auto (manalocked) auto (shojin) auto And then it repeats
@@Ravnesss part of the game is learning and discovery. If they published a full rules break down every set it would become obligatory homework. If it's just info that's out there. Especially a niche interaction on a reworked item that will stay for multiple sets only the players who actually care will find the info and the ones who don't won't feel like they have to learn every little thing about the game. It's really just wanting to be spoon fed.
@@horticulturalist7818 as a matter of fact it actually makes sense to have a full breakdown the same way you do with League of Legends, Mort is contradicting himself every here and there considering the fact that selling champions post-carousel to increase econ or save items was removed due to "the majority of players not being aware of the mechanic" (Mortdog, 2019)
@@ivaniliev7819 there are tons of lol mechanics and interactions that haven't been expressly explained by riot and are only spread though the community members. Akalies E/stopwatch interaction comes mind. The fact that twitch R doesn't apply kraken to all targets hit only the first one. Etc
is he? when mort says ''it doesn't'' the guy replies ''it doesn't? it looks like it did'' which prompts an explanation from mort and they all accept it. He's not ignorant from seeing something unintuitive and asking about it
People act like this is a good thing. It isn't. It's indicative on the entire fucking company. Everything is buggy, nothing gets communicated correctly and everyone is just guessing if something is legit strategy or bug-abuse. Even the pros don't know what they're doing. Be better Riot.
@bootmanbill2362 that may not be a bug, but it looks like a bug, and since TFT and LoL as well are extremely buggy in general, you never know what is and isn't a bug. This definitely doesn't look like it's working as intended and many times people abusing bugs that looked very similar have been punished for it. There is not a single documentation, tool tip, patchnote, etc. Explaining if this is working as intended.
i hate how upset mort gets at them "spreading misinformation" when this clip was during the same stream where he adamantly misinformed everyone about picking up the orb from augments
He wasnt upset about the misinformation....its a bit of arrogance but when your the person who literally directs people who programs these things, and knows the literal actions cause again "you kinda made it", and a guy who only plays it even imagines of arguing when you say they are wrong. its like trying to tell Jordan how to make a turn around jumper. Do you really have an argument there?
Oh, that's actually insane. Well done by the TFT Team.
big buff
I dont get it. It gives mana every 3rd auto. Isnt it working for vayne?
@@jgabrielcastro89 kinda:
So vayne has 40mana. She has shojin which gives 15 mana. So she needs 3 aa to get her ability.
But the 3rd hit also generates 20 extra mana cause of shojin, which would be wasted.
The tft team made it so that the next auto after the spell gets the 20 extra mana now and it is not wasted.
You can see that quite easy in the vid.
why dont they include it in item text
You can actually see vayne sending out 2 autos almost like a auto-attack cancel XD makes sense
I must say I noticed this too with some champ, I don't remember which one. But essentially, every game start, the champ would always had that mana proc on the attack where only 10 mana was needed to cast. So, yea it is really good.
syndra
if you have 3 star guardian and a shojin, syndra would need to attack 3 times to cast, but the shojin mana would proc after she have casted
happens with zoe i believe
happens to velkoz when you play him with 2 civ, though I wonder if I'm the only one running that board rn
@@Shuraig7 Yeah its zoe, she starts doing some trolling and starts casting almost every auto and if she has enough AS she'll spam them on each auto, like guinsoos included it is insane XD
Shojin blue buff vayne will fire bolts at dying targets after every auto, and then mid-flight it'll retarget onto alive targets.
Basically she's a guided missile jinx.
ill try it next game
@@coolguys74 best case scenario is 4 recon with jeweled lotus. sprinkle in guinsoos or vayne tripleshot champion augment for maximum hilarity.
@@fredriks5090 why would you got 4 recon and jeweled lotus? they do the same thing..
@@ruaridevlin4438 excess critchance now automatically converts to critdmg.
true dmg that crits even more is never wrong.
@@ruaridevlin4438 you would only get 13% crit dmg from the augment. getting attack speed and/or AD would be much more efficient at that point
They basically made sojin more effective for high man units. This way they gain more overall mana. And Blue buff is for low mana burst dmg units. They are actually good now than they were.
damn good thinking by the dev team
GIGACHAD KEN saving Shojin
just as we were talking about vayne mechanics, we also witness her getting 1 shot by a 2 star full item viego
This along side the AD scaling being better above 100 AD, seperates the use cases from Blue Buff. It's specifically good on high frequency auto attackers, and AD casters who don't want to skip the AD in a slot. Vayne, Kai'sa, Urgot are a few that come to mind as well as some dualists and Soraka (attack speed admin).
Urgot sadly cant use shojin
People where actually trying to fight MORT on what shojin does....
I noticed this the very first time I saw shojin played in the new set…
Super job dude. Seriously, well done!
so that's why shojin kaisa is so good
they were all talking over each other
I realized this on Samira and Bel'Veth since I noticed it works with Hurricane and Guinsoos
i heckin love MORTDOG
was this always a thing? i don't recall overflowing mana ever going to the next cast.
only for new shojin
manazane in some ways
Omg I specifically didn't build shojin on 30 mana or 70 mana champs because of the fear it would waste the proc this is really good to know
I don't really understand what they mean can someone explain it simplier?
From what I understood, it seems that this is how it works: Shojin gives 20 mana every 3rd auto, if the mana it gives exceeds the champ's mana cap (if the champ only has 30 mana for example) any excess mana the Shojin provides is "saved" and given to the champ after the spell is cast.
@@kaeldeleon it doesn't save the mana, it saves the proc. If the you are 10 mana or less away from casting, the proc will be saved to the next auto after the cast. But say, you need 15 mana to cast, then shojin will still proc and the excess mana is wasted
Bro Mort, makes sure to credit Kent first before explaining
Can please someone explain to me? I didn't fully understand :(
If your 3rd auto completes your ability cast without the help of Shojin, then the mana from Shojin is saved for the auto after the ability
Is this the Smash Summit house?
Just include it in item text???
Imagine not having in depth out of game tool tips to explain the depths of items and how they work. Or just watch infinite tft clips for tiny bits of info to be aware of bugs/ unexplained major interactions like this one. Nah thats just part of the “skill” of tft i guess
You know, people wouldn't be confused with Vayne cast if it didn't look exactly like her auto.
to be fair vayne's whole kit is just her shooting bolts
@@kimchijam and tbf the TFT team doesn't have to use their kit. ASol has gone through more iterations with abilities he doesn't have than ones he does (I don't remember him raining meteors from the sky or having a Brand W like last set, but what do I know). Urgot is for sure known for summoning a Nami wave that pulls the enemy team into him as well on Summoner's Rift.
@@amethonys2798 fair point, those make sense with their design but vayne is just a girl with 2 crossbows, she can roll and shoot bolts, she actually shoots with her large crossbow during the cast but it's kinda hard to notice I guess
@@amethonys2798 set 7 aurelion sol was just his Q with the idle animation combined, and this set it's his W but instead of floating around him it rains from the sky. Tf are you supposed to give Vayne to make it unique? Her ult? 🗿
I will now force every game ty kent
I love how I obviously pay more attention then top tft players and I’ve been hard stuck plat since set 1💀 granted I only play maybe 10 games a week but still. What would make a pro player thing vaynes ability procs it
They are definitely way better at pivoting, accessing board strength, and all that jazz that it’s always funny to learn that they don’t know how most items and champions interact. lol
Maybe this was patched since PBE. On PBE Vayne went auto-auto-cast every single time, which is not what Mort is saying. I watched her closely every fight.
I’ll have to test it out again on live.
That is exactly what is happening in the clip. What Mortdog says is that when the auto that would have activated Shojin doesn't need that mana to cast, it won't use the effect and instead activate it after the cast. What Vayne is doing is after the first 3 autos, she doesn't activate shojin in the third hit, instead in the first auto after her ult she gets the mana from shojin, then it seems that its a combination between her autoing during mana lock and then activating Shojin and that goes on loop
@@Slyo16 Auto-auto-cast shouldn't be 40 mana. She should need auto-auto-auto cast for 50 total mana, which would... leave her with 10? Not sure how it would work.
Maybe it's not a true auto 2x cast tempo, and there's occasionally a 3rd auto in there.
Another guess is that when it "saves" the auto, it does that if there's any mana remaining, but then gives you the full 20.
This means that her first ult:
auto, auto, auto(+20), cast (10 mana extra) would then grant her 20 mana for following cast, rather than 10.
This leads to the second ult:
auto, auto, cast.
Now there are 2 autos banked for shojin, so the third ult:
auto(+20), auto cast.
Now we have one banked, 4th ult is:
auto, auto(+20) cast
Now we have no autos banked, and we're back at the beginning.
If that's the case, undamaged, she fires on a loop of:
auto 3x cast
auto 2x cast
auto 2x cast
auto 2x cast
repeat
@@johnnyblackrants7625 From what I can see in the clip, she always does 1 auto while she's manalocked so she doesn't generate any mana but it counts for the 3 autos of shojin, so it would be something like:
Auto auto auto ult (shojin stores)
Auto (shojin) auto ult
Auto (manalocked) auto (shojin) auto
And then it repeats
Love that the info isn't put out for the public. Everyone just has to be wrong till the devs fucking say something.
Someone always finds a way to complain lmfao. Because every set should come with a design booklet explaining every little interaction
@@horticulturalist7818 If you watch the video, people who play the game for a living don't know how shit works till the dev finally tells them.
@@Ravnesss part of the game is learning and discovery. If they published a full rules break down every set it would become obligatory homework. If it's just info that's out there. Especially a niche interaction on a reworked item that will stay for multiple sets only the players who actually care will find the info and the ones who don't won't feel like they have to learn every little thing about the game. It's really just wanting to be spoon fed.
@@horticulturalist7818 as a matter of fact it actually makes sense to have a full breakdown the same way you do with League of Legends, Mort is contradicting himself every here and there considering the fact that selling champions post-carousel to increase econ or save items was removed due to "the majority of players not being aware of the mechanic" (Mortdog, 2019)
@@ivaniliev7819 there are tons of lol mechanics and interactions that haven't been expressly explained by riot and are only spread though the community members. Akalies E/stopwatch interaction comes mind. The fact that twitch R doesn't apply kraken to all targets hit only the first one. Etc
Would be totally cool if only one of you talked at a time🤐
TFT "Pros"
Am i going fucking crazy or is shojin proccing every second auto here?
It looks like that but if you count the small bolts(normal attacks) it's always 3 red bolts then 1 silver(the spell).
Why is that dude trying to argue with the dude who made the game. he sounds so ignorant lol
is he? when mort says ''it doesn't'' the guy replies ''it doesn't? it looks like it did'' which prompts an explanation from mort and they all accept it. He's not ignorant from seeing something unintuitive and asking about it
Mort on this set's trolling so.. the dude is right
only believe the devs even when they lie or wrong, they can fix it and made it right.
Baboons
Why dont just include it in item text? Why cringe gatekeeping? Is this the advantage mort needs to hit d2? XDD this f4t cringer
People act like this is a good thing. It isn't. It's indicative on the entire fucking company. Everything is buggy, nothing gets communicated correctly and everyone is just guessing if something is legit strategy or bug-abuse. Even the pros don't know what they're doing. Be better Riot.
>everything is buggy
how is this buggy, its a very clever QoL feature that makes sojin more viable
>nothing is communicated properly
???
@bootmanbill2362 that may not be a bug, but it looks like a bug, and since TFT and LoL as well are extremely buggy in general, you never know what is and isn't a bug. This definitely doesn't look like it's working as intended and many times people abusing bugs that looked very similar have been punished for it. There is not a single documentation, tool tip, patchnote, etc. Explaining if this is working as intended.
i hate how upset mort gets at them "spreading misinformation" when this clip was during the same stream where he adamantly misinformed everyone about picking up the orb from augments
He wasnt upset about the misinformation....its a bit of arrogance but when your the person who literally directs people who programs these things, and knows the literal actions cause again "you kinda made it", and a guy who only plays it even imagines of arguing when you say they are wrong. its like trying to tell Jordan how to make a turn around jumper. Do you really have an argument there?
Viego cancer broken in both games, what a lovely game design