Wanna make 18650 Battery Packs? WATCH THIS FIRST!
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 มี.ค. 2020
- All these years Ive been learning how to make battery packs and with every iteration I build a better 18650 Lithium ion battery pack every time.
This, is my safest battery pack to date. I have shared with you my experience and knowledge of building 18650 battery packs from over the years.
Hope you enjoy it.
Nickel Strips:
usa.banggood.com/custlink/GmD...
Fishpaper Orings
usa.banggood.com/custlink/mDm...
Build your Spotwelder here:
• DIY Spot Welder Build ...
Here's Lee's channel:
/ @leewright - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
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Wow! What an improvement! It's been an absolute pleasure talking to you and helping you to become a safe and competent battery maker and I love this platform that enables not only for us to learn off of each other, but to make friends all over the world. Your packs are now 100% safe and you should be really proud that you have become a better battery maker, I'm really happy I could help you! 🤘
Thanks Lee. Keep doing the amazing work you do. Love your video style and content. Heres to a lot more battery packs :D
Well done to both of you. These kinds of projects are brilliant and the content that you provide is an invaluable resource for novices like myself to learn and take inspiration from. Thanks fellas!
I love that our community helps other to build better safer pack ! Awesome Lee Wright btw you did a really nice pack for Thomas
Eskate For Life thanks brother!
@@SlightlyDazed. absolutely, I own a company that builds batteries in the UK. We have done a few ebike batteries. You can find us at www.electricskateboarding.co.uk
It's always good watching someone who actually admits their mistakes, learns from it then goes on to improve it, that's the way to perfection, well done Sir!
Yep Nick, I get the same vibes. I have taken these safety tips to heart and have eBay open on another tab and buying the "safety stuff" as I learn what's needed. I have learnt a lot from fungi and others (not the cowboys tho ;-)
While making a spot welder from a microwave transformer 👌
0:05 nope, TNT has an energy density of 4.6MJ per Kg, while Lithium-Thionylchlorid is the most energy dense lithium battery and has a density of 2,34MJ/Kg and standard Lithium Ion batterys are at 0,65MJ/Kg. This is at least what Wikipedia is telling...
like whatever
Looks great, although a couple extras to make it even safer:
For high power draw applications( > 2c) be sure to space the battery cells by at least 1 mm and allow airflow. Improves both safety and cell lifetime. Consider not shrink-wrapping the entire thing, and making sure that air can get in and around the cells. Bonus points if you use a rigid case with a few mm all around the pack and vent holes.
If you increase the gap to >4mm then one cell failing and catching fire _probably_ won't catch the surrounding cells. Not shrink-wrapping means all the heat and gas from the failed cell can escape.
2) See if rather than using the same size nickel strips, use thicker strips from one parallel group to another, and much thinner from each cell in the parallel group to that strip. If you size the strips correctly then if a cell catastrophically fails the strip to that cell will heat and fail, disconnecting the bad cell from the pack. That helps prevent an internal short on one cell from taking out the rest.
Watched this cause I wanna make a pack for my onewheel. Then I saw you riding, awesome! They’re so much fun! Thanks for the video.
I appreciate the sharing of knowledge especially being honest about your “errors” and even more impressive your willingness to share with us who’s videos you watch to learn from. Thank you! I I know first hand that often times the best way to learn something and retain it is by screwing it up. However, I think something this dangerous I’m going to watch lee’s videos and try to eliminate the errors.
I like a man talking about safety! Thanks for sharing!
Great video, definitely rethinking some of the safety aspects of a few of my upcoming projects...
Great improvement. You covered a lot of safety aspects. You don't need to have thick strips between the parallel cell and you only need 1 parallel connection for the whole group. There should barely be any parallel current in a group. That will reduce the amount of connections you have to make and less connections is less stress on the cell. I would also suggest fuse wire if you want to go the extra mile for more safety. With fuse wire, if one cell fails it wont bring the other cells down with it when it shorts the group.
Thanks to you and Lee Wright for the info on making a better battery pack. Gained alot of insight on this.
I am building batteries for my rc planes from a lot of time and and I learned good things from this video - thanks!
Thank you, I have been thinking about building a battery pack. Very helpful
Your new battery is excellent.
I love your commitment to safety and also your willingness to take advice from experts and improve. What an excellent attitude and excellent vid.
Thank you Sarah for appreciating my work. Hope you enjoy the content on this channel.
Safety is paramount Ms Davis.
Speaking as an Electronics Engineer with decades of experience and knowledge,
The average Man with limited knowledge is thinking only of low voltage and low current.
LiOn, Lead_Acid and other types are capable of producing high current and present a
danger often overlooked.
Even with DC voltages, once one rises above 35 volts it starts to become dangerous, even
more so at high current.
I expect you will soon enough comment ask me; "what about woman?"
I am waiting for that one, then you will learn something you never knew before, nor will you
ever know unless I teach it to you.
The reason you do not know yet is that you have been successfully manipulated and programmed
to know something that is not correct.
Really great video! Very informative. I'm just getting into FPV and going to build my own packs and this info is invaluable and will keep my house in one piece lol
I was preparing to build my first battery pack and I am so glad I came across this video. Thanks for this very useful information! And Lee, too!
I successfully built my first pack - it is a small 4S2P pack for a model airplane - but I am very confident that it is safe and reliable, thanks to the information I gleaned from this video. Thanks again!
Great advice. I didn’t think about that either. Thank you for sharing.
well this sure is helpful. i just made my 1st diy battery pack using 120 sony vt6 cells in a 10s12p configuration and it doesnt exactly work. idk if i did something wrong or dont have the smart BMS configured properly yet but i just Barely did a better job than you did on your 1st battery attempt. i left out fishpaper and isolator rings because i thought id have more room between the cells for air flow because i was planing on adding 2 mini blower style fans in the chassis and exhaust ports.
this video kinda makes me wanna go over my prevous work and redo it all
Finally an attentive person who informs about all the risks of these batteries and suggests ways to avoid them
Good boy!
This is a very good video. I subscribed to the channel based on it. Excellent advice and instructions.
Great video Fungineers, I am learing so much hanging out with you guys, now to go the the link and have a look at Lee's channel..
I want to build a diy battery for my onewheel pint, I'd like to put some higher voltage in the battery to get more power. The normal highest voltage is ~62 volts, do you think there would be problems if I put 70?
Excellent demonstration and good advise! We were wondering, How to prevent battery pack fire spark, while cutting the cable that was originally installed with it ? We have used a steel scissor to cut and got a fire spark !
Very good video and Review. 6:47 The battery pack is it u= 4x 3,7 volt and I= 4x battery capacity?
Really well explained!
Nicely explained, and yes Lee Wright its one of the best DIY guys and an Amazing person. Thanks for sharing
Good points. I'm glad that I'm mastering the spot welding art on NiCd batteries first. Lithiums are no joke.
do you have more info on your new hand piece ? make, model, where to buy?
Is there such a thing as a voltage cut-off switch that can cut off the power to the li ion battery charger when you hit a specific battery pack voltage? Thanks Tom
Excellent points. Well done!
Great video and a great community you’re developing 👍
is the fish paper still necessary if i use those lego type battery holders? also i have one suggestion. Double the strips on the main positive and negative busbars to optimise heat dissipation. learnt from my 3rd 10s6p build for my ebike.
For safty, please install temperature sensitive FUSE(110~130 deg.C). At least every two or three segment(cell). I had seen some battery pack burned(flame and boom!)
extremly important for high discharge packs and (or) packs used in weather conditions (heat)
what a great learning experience! wonderful video, subscribed :)
hello can I ask what is the appropriate thickness of the nickle piece used to connect the those 18650 batteries?
thank you for sharing all of the safety upgrades that you incorporated
Looks good. We can always learn tricks and tips from people . Thanks for video
Great video, You really showed you can learn from mistakes and better yourself and your work. Really impressive
Nice demonstration,
Now in future, i can make these battery packs safer, thank you ❤️
Thank you very much for your guidance. Extremely useful video.
Really excellent video. Best practices well conveyed.
What welding machine do you use? (link?) . I wish to make a few battery packs a month, not industrial scale. Which welding machine would you recommend?
Thanks for this most interesting and important video. Safety is more important than technical
Excellent video. I appreciate a maker who does minimize risk prevention techniques. My question though with the fish paper, did you find it added significantly to the bulk of the pack? Even though they’re thin sheets, they do add up.
How to identify and connect the wire on the balance Port?
Wow what a good dude kept it real with you. That’s who you need to be around. Someone who won’t lie to you.
What is it called u u are using to stack tht irpn heads connection
Thanks for sharing. Would you please share your spot welder model details (or other good brand) and website or if Bangood is selling it. Thanks
I would like to make a 3S1P using 3 18650 batteries. The batteries are protected, do I need a PCB in this case?
The finished product really turned out
.
I am working on a very small project to get the hang of making 18650 battery packs. Great video. Question I have is I currently am making a battery pack for a UE MegaBoom bluetooth speaker. I do not want to go the store bought preassembled as those batterys do not last that long. I need to make a pack that uses (2) 18650's and has at least the following specs. 7.4V, 3400 mAh with roughly 25Wh. Can I go bigger for this device. What brand of battery do you recommend? if I go with more mAH than 3400 will the charge last longer? I get the assembly and tools required but please forgive my ignorance on what I should use battery wise as this is currently Lithium Ion but I understand there are the IMR MXJO brand and unsure if 10A or 20A matter. Dont want to fry this thing. LOL. Thanks in advance for your reply. Todd
if i have 4 x 12V batteries and want to do a 24V system, is it better to hook them up into:
2 in series + 2 in series and those in paralel or
2 parallel + 2 parallel and those in series ?
as allways there are folks that say the first is better and other say the latter is better ...
I have over 200 18650 cells and a spot welder and still havent created a battery where to buy the bms shrink wrap and the nixkel strips
Alternate between cells for spot welds…. Hitting each cell with 3 quick welds is putting a lot of heat into it… also don’t spot weld in the centre of the cells… again to help prevent damage to the cell… nickel strips come with a space in the centre for this reason, so you can’t weld the centre 😉
Great vid. I’m a newb myself. So some great knowledge here… just thought I’d pass some of the knowledge I’ve learnt so far 👍
Thanks 🙏
How does charging a pack like this work?
I'm familiar with charging 6S lipo packs for my quadcopter.
Does the BMS handle balancing?
Or would you need to plug a balance lead into the charger like I do with my quadcopter batteries?
Excellent video, just what I needed.
Great video brother I am a new subscriber thank you for your knowledge and expertise I cannot wait to see all of the videos
Thanks for subscribing! Om still trying to read your name though :p
how do you know the correct order to place the nickel strips?
Wonderful video with excellent info. Thanks! ⚡⚡
Excellent tutorial. Cheers!
Is this safe?? For self made scooter for example.
Just small tip: discharge cells before making or disassembling back. Trust me, it really helps with making progress safer. With brand new cells I would just go without touching them (nominal voltage).
When I build my first bigger battery back, I almost burned house down. Biggest issue in that back was insulation between series connection because whole body of cell is negative and positive is only small circle on top. It didn't have any other insulation than cell warps that were damaged. And they were all fully charged cells.
Now I do have a quite lot of experience in making batterybacks and also have been using insulation paper between series connections after that one particular pack.
Never discharge a lipo battery! They're not capacitors and will suffer if discharged.
@@TheUniversalid yeah lipo battery are more vulnerable to overdischarge than normal 18650 sized LiCoO2 cells. And yes, I didn't mean fully discharging them, only to their cut off voltage
I never discharged my cells. It's pointless as even a 'dead' cell I removed from a laptop-battery got up to some voltage after removing the real bad twin-cell. Even though it was only at 0,8 Volt or so, an accidental short made the remaining piece of strip start to glow ánd smoke.
Besides pointless, it's also incredibly time-consuming. Even a 16 cell battery will take days to discharge all the cells (if you only have one Opus BT-C3100, like me). If you get your cells from a reputable store, they will all be charged at exactly the same level and you can start working right away.
When I accidentally shorted my 4S4P cell with my scalpel as I tried to remove some excess heatshrink from one of the extending strips that had to be connected to the gas gauge PCB, the cells were at storage level (all at 3,65 Volt exactly). The cells itself, Panasonic NCR18650B's, aren't exactly very beefy ones when it comes to their maximum discharge current and even though the moment of contact was very brief, the short was such a scary, loud and smoking short that I immediately stopped working: I was too tired and just didn't see it coming. It vaporized the blade at the point of contact (and this is what most likely saved me).
Just don't discharge them. Especially when you start pairing cells you quickly get to a point where it doesn't really matter anymore if they are fully charged or not. I shorted an INR 18650-15L from Samsung by accident: it was still a good cell, charged at 'just' 3,8 Volt but when the remaining strip (connected to the positive terminal) accidently pierced the insulation and made a short with the negative terminal, a small spark was seen and then the metal had already welded itself stuck.
The cell started heating up quickly so I ran outside and placed it there waiting for the possible things to happen. Nothing did happen except for a cell that warmed up to 70 degrees Celsius and started leaking some electrolyte.
But that was just 1 strong (very low internal resistance) cell. If you pair just 4 'less good' cells, you are basically at the same level. Really, discharging is completely pointless and won't make it any safer at all.
Good evening, I made a 48 volt battery, but after a full charge it does not exceed 51 volts. What is the problem? Thank you, my friend. I follow you from Egypt
Where can I get that heat shrink?
Awesome: Thank-you for your time and effort
Thanks for watching as always Wally.
I would strongly recommend using a cheap ceramic knife instead of the steel one. Far less electrically conductive.
Not only less electrically conductive but also non conductive (insulator)
I have around 30 of these battery is left from my years of vaping, I've been wanting to use them for a project. But after watching a few videos, now I want to buy a whole pack in bulk and really start experimenting does anyone no the best source for good LG batteries in quantity?
Hello
i will wish help please
I am a beginner in electronics and I would like to manufacture
a 3S3P battery and with the BMS card I can not understand where to solder the 4.2v and 8.4v on the battery ... I know this is a difficult question to explain here could you do an explanatory video? or a drawing?
thank you so much
Please make a video of how to use charge and wirings of a bms for lituim
Or use cell holders... instead of hotglue...
I use those black cell holder should I still isolate cells?!
@@koshitek most holders keep a distance between cells and uses that space as an isolator
@@koshitek I also use recovered or new battery holders, but I think it is safer to use fish paper or other insulation between cells that are in opposite polar orientation. Low cost, huge safety factor.
hi, i am try to improve my home made spot welding machine too. I noticed, that y have same double pulse module as me. I am little doubt that module works good. For me it weld max at current pulse to 70% with pulse length abut 15ms. But quality also not so good. if go higher with current by setting over 70, it not weld at all. Power setting on this module is so strange. Transformer is over 1kw and secondary wire about 15mm, so there is not problem. i noticed, that without module is power much more stronger. Dont know if new handle help me or new module buy.
It's fresh to hear somebody with humility these days that people are so narcissistic and afraid of constructive criticism.
Which is sad because it means they will never learn from their mistakes and they will never improve as a person.
You however have hacked The matrix sir.
Physically speaking out the constructive criticism of your peers,
And for that, we thank you.
Thank you very much sir I have learned a lot from your video the nickel stick method of spot welding using 18650 cell has been explained very well thank you sir keep making videos like this we learn Will remain great
I love those 18650's those are cool 🤓 and the BMS it's so small I like it keep up the good content Sir this is going to be great.
I bought a 48V/99999mAh pack but it got wet and a few weeks after it dried off, the tips along with the strip connectors got oxidized and it wouldn't charge any more. But it had 3.67 volts left after testing it with the multimeter. Can this battery pack be safely fixed?
Have you thought about getting a simple foot pedal for your spot welder? It'll make your life Sooo much easier 👍🏽
Well done!
GENIUS! GREAT VIDEO!
Are the nikkel 0.15 or 0.2 mm ??
Big fan of Lee! He knows his stuff!
Now a days there are big batteries which tend to be safer when joining together so they say and here is the link.
th-cam.com/video/kYx097cVR48/w-d-xo.html
Flipping hate messing about with these batts everytime the bike messes up, get more cuts that working with paper, one thing though batts can get quite hot that mixed with vibration will separate the batts, I tend to use gorillaglue.
I want to make battery pack for motor having 48 Rated voltage and 92 Amp continously current by using samung 18650 -30 Q cell ( 4.2 v max volt, 3.6 nominal voltage , 3000 mAh , 15 Amp continously discharge current )
11S6P Or
12S6P Or
11S30P Or
12S30P .
Which combination is correct please let me know
Thank you
Good info!
Why is it called fish paper? For electric eels or flammable fish?
Electrical Engineer here. The hot glue is really freaking me out.
However thanks for the video. You make some good points.
Stefan Hall, why is the hot glue freaking you out?
Stefan Hall
@@brucehamil-jr396 Maybe because some (not all) hot-melt adhesives [1] melt at temperatures exceeding the cell thermal runaway temperature [2]. If using hot-melt, then the trick may be to find a glue that melts at a temperature higher than the cell max operating temperature, yet lower than the temperature where permanent cell damage takes place, taking into account temperature distribution along cell enclosure etc etc. Tell me what you think...
[1] en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hot-melt_adhesive
[2] batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/types_of_lithium_ion
The hot glue bothers you but the kapton tape doesn't?
I second Stefan Hall here. When the hot glue dries overtime or collect debris, it will reach some point of reabsorption. (I'm talking out of my ass here but with relative experience). Depending on usage, it can fail in 2 years or down the road. It could also conduct a little bit in the long term. Since it is sealed off like that, it's going to be increasing its moisture absorption. Think oven. When charging the batteries, it gets warm or hot. So, I liked the idea of the video using hot glue with parallel batteries. But uh I guess the solution is to use cell holders. And if needed, just use neutral cure silicone gel instead. I mean add some spacers between serial batteries for extra safety too, ie; double insulating them from each other. Furthermore, anyone interested should look into the expensive UPS back up power supply designs. They have exceptional guarantees and warranties due to their design. A lot can be learned there too about avoiding faults.
what about cell level fusing?
Great video. Happy to see someone making sure it's done correctly and improving themselves. I know you are very careful, but I had to cring when I saw you cutting toward yourself.
5:45 I think you meant insulating the parallel groups from each other? Not the series groups.
Subscribed and thanks for sharing. I have built a 10s4p and do not have the fish paper isolation or o-rings. My wires are also not clean like yours and I can imagine if they melted they would short. I need to re-do it!
Yes please. Safety first!
True. Although why would they melt?
Sincere question.
@@MaximC putting out 20 amps continous sometimes packs can get pretty hot!
@@Fungineers
I see. So, depending on kind of currents used - additional insulation can be a good idea. Thank you for the reply.
Crossed balancing wires are a great way to start fires, even some professionally built packs (for instance: Bosch powerpacks) suffer from this.
Man....as a licensed HAM radio operator, I have put together several radio go boxes, with 12v battery. Im so interested in building out my own setup like this, but really need some solid advice and guidance. Ive got a civil engineering background, so I tend to be analytical and fairly OCD about my projects. Say that to say that I do believe in doing things clean and safe. Any advice on size, type of batteries, bms etc.?
Thanks for your input
Can you build a pack for my Segway?
nice improvement
wood has 4 times the energy density of TNT. so is my kitchen table even more dangerous than li ion ?
awesome vid man
Hey so you're saying in the beginning that li-ion battery are more energy dense than TNT? I think that might be false men... If we take a good 18650 cell with a capacity of 3,5Ah (samsung SDI 35E) that weighs 50g ( according to 18650batterystore) and we calculate it's eneregie density 3.6v x 3.5 Ah x (1000g/50g)= ? We find that it has an energy density of 252Wh/kg. After that we can do a quick research on internet and found that according to wikipedia TNT has an energy density of 4.184 MJ/kg which means 1162Wh/Kg because 1Wh= 3600J. So the TNT is far above 18650 cells in energy density. Aside from that, it was a great video !
Sorry for my english it's not my native language :)
its better to use cell spacer/holder for the air flow
What about Thermal control ??
Hey! I was wondering if the kapton tape you used to absolutely cover it would create a problem if the battery ever overheated... Or reduce any natural air cooling..... I have been binge watching these kinds of videos ( :P) and I have seen many people do this but I don't understand why...
Cheers! 😃
I suppose youre right. I haven't really tested it but the tape insures the pack is electrically insulated.
So apparently this is a very underrated channel.... keep up the good work mate
Thanks for your support. I have to be more consistent with my content :(
i have a cell of my 48v solar battery pack blown few months back. luckily, i have wrap them with adhesive tape, each 2 cells. she's blown from positive charge terminal. and yes, shes loud as hell.
inside 18650, is just paper rolled with no tobacco in it.
The explosion at the start of the video was The Slow Mo Guys throwing a grenade into a structure filled with drums filled with gasoline.
Spot on lol
yeah that’s misleading