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Hello dear David, First of all I just wanted you to know that you are awesome and you have a great great videos! I'm also a 4s geek on my own ,so... And secondly, I think that I know what the problem is. Sometimes the valves in saito engine get stuck without any knowing of us... and if you'll try to start a saito engine with a stuck valve,well the rod would probably get loose... This is why I always check that every part is moving smooth and free on every saito engine that I check, especially the movement of valves. Hoped that I helped, Best regards Or.
I previously bought a Saito Fa-62. I disassembled the engine for a magazine review prior operation. I found one push rod not inserted correctly, similar to the problem that you encountered. It was not engaged in the rocker arm. Saito has been cranking out engines like crazy in recent years. They might experience some manufacturing quality issues due to the high volume of orders. I always recommend checking important parts, such as carburetor, valves and rods prior break in procedure.
HI Dave Just want to say a huge thanks for uploading this video as you just saved my engine. Just removed my 100T to install into another plane and adjusted the valve gaps on the bench. Thought I would look up some videos on tuning this engine and came across your video. After watching, I went back to check mine before I had run it and two push rods were not seated correctly. I know the gaps were set correctly. What did I do. I pushed on each of the valves before putting the covers back on. Cannot thank you enough. Keith
I dont think that there will be any problem to fix this baby by the engine doctor that you are David. There is no other way... You must fix this and then we can all enjoy the beautiful sound of Saito twin again. Oh yeah... Stay well David and see you soon, Robert
Wonder if the rocker arm was broken before, and thats what dislodged the rod? I have Saito 62 that I checked once and the rod was not engaged, had no idea how it happened but luckily reset it and it was ok. Now the only problem I have with the engine is that it cuts out about halfway through a flight. Have no idea. So Im going to make sure there isnt a hole in the fuel line inside the tank, or maybe the engine is overheating due to being cowled … in any case, Im stumped. Nice videos, I appreciate your content and have learned a lot
"Craft Bones". That's what we call it here in Brazil. It is revolting. A similar thing happened to me when I started desassembly engines after watching your videos. It was with an OS90FS. I had no heat blower and tried to put the front bearing with hammering. The edge of the crankshaft cracked. What a mess !! I thought this activity was not for me. 3 months later I needed to change a ball bearing on Saito 56. That's when I bothered you more often, remember? But now, with the right tools, I was able to make the replacement successfully. Meanwhile the OS90 was thrown into a corner. Now I am waiting to get the new crankshaft to trace it back. Not wanting to compare. I was stupid. Different from your case. But still outrageous. I'm sorry for you. It was really cool that you posted this video. These are important lessons. Hugs.
Possible that the push rod came out as the result of valve float which is usually related to overreving of the engine and the valve train parts can't keep up - that relies on the strength of the valve springs. A valve hung up in the guide could perhaps contribute to this. Old motorcycle mechanic here with some years of operating the first four stroke engines back in the early '80s. I had several Saitos as well as O.S. engines - first Saitos had separate heads from the cylinders which they must have stopped to cut costs.
Ouch David...That's the exact reason why I run my Saito 182 without rocker covers...before every run you can check overlap (RH cyl inlet just closed, LH cyl exhaust just opening) also at that rock point you can feel if appropriate lash (.002" - .004") is on all the tappets...generally if something is in error, you'll spot it then before any real harm is caused starting it like that.
Really like your videos and appreciate the effort to produce them. I understand the frustration in this circumstance but I'd like to offer an observation. Your opening comment of "I am NOT seeking advice nor is any wanted, so save it" comes across rather rude. Unsolicited advice and comments are part of the fabric of this hobby. Again, offered as just an observation you may not see from your side as the presenter. Please keep making these very helpful and informative videos. BTW, I would check the push rod and cam for damage. :)
Well at the risk of sounding rude yet again. I publish these videos for several reasons. First documentation for my own purposes, that secondly DO help others. I am not making these with the reason of soliciting advice or assistance from others. I understand that advice and assistance will be offered at times, but is it not being solicited unless I specifically ask for it. I feel I have adequate experience in this hobby to diagnose and remedy 95% of the issues I encounter. On the occasion that I DO need help I certainly wouldn't ask for it from unknown people on TH-cam. I direct those queries in the RC Forums where I have a better knowledge of the people and their level of experience. I appreciate your comment but if I sound rude, oh well. It is my channel and I will post as I see fit.
Not rude at all. It is indeed your channel and I appreciate the fact that you don't pander and just say what you think. I was not implying you do otherwise. It's just most TH-camrs are trying to build a good subscription base and often ask for feedback on their material. If that's not your cup-o-tea then no problem here. Like I said, I really appreciate your videos. They've been a great help to me on a few of my own troubleshooting exercises. Please keep them coming.
First let me say, that I appreciate your subscription and feedback. I think you are mixing topics however. I AM trying to establish a large subscription base. Getting subscribers and using/accepting/commenting on unsolicited advice is a TOTALLY different thing from 'pandering' to viewers. I get and expand my subscriber base from my video content, honesty, and hopefully entertainment value of my videos and not by accepting advice from others. That would be like you making friends with a total stranger on the street that comes up and gives you advice on something you have been doing for many years. Not really the best ice breaker I think you would agree. 99% of my subscribers are complete strangers to me. I know nothing about them or their level of knowledge about anything. So why would I take advice from them? Now if they told me a bit about themselves first via email or whatever, that would be a different story altogether. Most do not do that unfortunately. I wish more would. I would like to establish a better relationship with my viewers and subscribers. In that way I could better tailor topics to best suit their needs and thus expand my subscriber base even more.
Been there...done that! I know that things like that really make you feel sick. I was replacing a compressor under warranty on a freezer, while brazing one of the copper lines it broke off flush with the case on the compressor, it was totally ruined. Naturally the warranty doesn't cover breaking something and the manufacturer would only pay for one compressor, so my company had to buy a new compressor to get us out of the hole, that was an expensive mistake! Everyone has a bad day once in a while, that was the most expensive mistake I ever made.
Hi David, Thanks for the quick reply, I like the 100T, I also bought a FA 325R which has a Kelio exhaust and never run, still trying to get the nerve to fly it. Love your videos, Appreciate all you're doing. Andrew
That really blows david! I think i was just as pissed as u were, haha! Happy u found another head, now we can see that beauty run again! Heads up! Happens to all of us buddy!
Wow that really sucks! I picked up a used fa100 not long ago that had a stuck valve and I noticed the pushrod also had slipped out of place. I caught it before I bench tested it thank goodness.
Wow, really? Any idea how or when it slipped out? Perhaps the cups used are somewhat different and a bit easier to come out. very interesting information. Thank you.
David. unfortunely we learn in the way. I did train in Bell helicopter academy and the instructor says heat it don't hit it!. So always use your monokote heat gun. Ir I remmember in. the salto 120 that broken support isn't a part of the head hoy can check if this is the same in yours
Believe it or not, my Saito 72 exhaust push rod dislodged while bench running it, I had even double checked everything before covers were screwed back on. Lucky for me no damage...... must be Gremlins
Current USPS tracking shows the replacement head is due to arrive tomorrow! That is June 30th. Theoretically I could have this airplane flying again this long holiday weekend. However, I think I will fly my Super Sportster instead. I will need to run a tank or two of fuel through the head at a break-in setting to seat the ring. Plus I have several other hobby related things I would like to accomplish over the long weekend too.
David McIntire did the rocker move when you took the cover off? Could it have seized in place "open" and come disconnected that way? Just wondering, like you said in the video it seems like a weird failure just from checking clearances.
I David, I have a 10 year old 100T with about 40 mins runtime on it and I can't work out if it runs a twin throw or a boxer configuration, never had it apart to check. In all honesty I didn't realise there was a choke till I noticed you clicking it down, I always prime with a bottle or my finger over the intake. I uploaded a video about 6 years ago of the first run - very oily and won't idle, plus the prop I used was way too big. Damn shame as the engine sounds fantastic when it's running. Andrew
No the 100T is not a boxer style engine. It has a single throw crankshaft. Read all about it here, sceptreflight.net/Model%20Engine%20Tests/Saito%20FA-100T.html
That arm was cracked to begin with, thats how the rod came out, I doubt it was your fault. Sometimes we blame ourselves for something we have no control over. I know this is old but shit happends, this I know. I had to rebuild a snowmobile engine twice because the factory specifications for the engine were wrong in the actual manual. Turns out all those engines were burning up because of a design flaw. After finding out how to fix the problem, the cure made the snowmobile a gas eating hog. The manufacturer ended up with egg on their faces and a bunch of returned snowmobiles. I learned never to rely on factory specifications after that. If I see a problem I recognize as a manufacturer issue,I correct it on my own. I really think that arm was already cracked, the pushrod slipped out when heated up. You hit the arm on the crack from a different position on cold metal and the crack broke. Inbother words, the crack was allowing the arm to stretch enough to let the rod opo out when hot. No, it was in no way your fault. My guess is there was a flaw in the metal to begin with. Only a magniflux machine would have spotted that crack. or persion blue ink. I found a crack in a cylinder head using the blue ink one time, it wasnt clearly noticeable at all. I would suggest getting a bottle for future testing of those arms.
No the 100T and Saito 50 are totally different. The 100T, being a twin, has the intake manifold on the left side of the head not in the back like the 50.
I like most have been there. It's a shit happens demon. Da little bastards! Go to the bathroom shut the door and let out a scream. You'll feel better .Then just fix it.
Well everyone is welcome to their own opinion. OS twins are very nice but Saitos are excellent engine as well. Seeing as I have owned and operated multiples of each, I think my opinion is most important to me. Disastrous design? Is that why Saito is still one of the few rc engine manufacturers still making engines? OS has had their share of poor designs and issue too. Like having 4 bearings in a single cylinder four stroke engine as opposed to 2 in a Saito. Have you ever tried removing the cam shaft bearings from an OS four stroke? If not, luckily I have made some videos on how to do that. It is completely unnecessary when working on a Saito engine.
Hello dear David,
First of all I just wanted you to know that you are awesome and you have a great great videos! I'm also a 4s geek on my own ,so...
And secondly, I think that I know what the problem is.
Sometimes the valves in saito engine get stuck without any knowing of us... and if you'll try to start a saito engine with a stuck valve,well the rod would probably get loose...
This is why I always check that every part is moving smooth and free on every saito engine that I check, especially the movement of valves.
Hoped that I helped,
Best regards
Or.
I previously bought a Saito Fa-62. I disassembled the engine for a magazine review prior operation. I found one push rod not inserted correctly, similar to the problem that you encountered. It was not engaged in the rocker arm.
Saito has been cranking out engines like crazy in recent years. They might experience some manufacturing quality issues due to the high volume of orders.
I always recommend checking important parts, such as carburetor, valves and rods prior break in procedure.
HI Dave
Just want to say a huge thanks for uploading this video as you just saved my engine. Just removed my 100T to install into another plane and adjusted the valve gaps on the bench. Thought I would look up some videos on tuning this engine and came across your video. After watching, I went back to check mine before I had run it and two push rods were not seated correctly. I know the gaps were set correctly. What did I do. I pushed on each of the valves before putting the covers back on. Cannot thank you enough.
Keith
I dont think that there will be any problem to fix this baby by the engine doctor that you are David. There is no other way... You must fix this and then we can all enjoy the beautiful sound of Saito twin again. Oh yeah... Stay well David and see you soon, Robert
It is already fixed! The new head arrived yesterday and I installed it today. Take care my friend!
Wonder if the rocker arm was broken before, and thats what dislodged the rod? I have Saito 62 that I checked once and the rod was not engaged, had no idea how it happened but luckily reset it and it was ok. Now the only problem I have with the engine is that it cuts out about halfway through a flight. Have no idea. So Im going to make sure there isnt a hole in the fuel line inside the tank, or maybe the engine is overheating due to being cowled … in any case, Im stumped. Nice videos, I appreciate your content and have learned a lot
"Craft Bones". That's what we call it here in Brazil. It is revolting.
A similar thing happened to me when I started desassembly engines after watching your videos. It was with an OS90FS. I had no heat blower and tried to put the front bearing with hammering. The edge of the crankshaft cracked. What a mess !! I thought this activity was not for me. 3 months later I needed to change a ball bearing on Saito 56. That's when I bothered you more often, remember? But now, with the right tools, I was able to make the replacement successfully. Meanwhile the OS90 was thrown into a corner. Now I am waiting to get the new crankshaft to trace it back. Not wanting to compare. I was stupid. Different from your case. But still outrageous. I'm sorry for you. It was really cool that you posted this video. These are important lessons. Hugs.
Possible that the push rod came out as the result of valve float which is usually related to overreving of the engine and the valve train parts can't keep up - that relies on the strength of the valve springs. A valve hung up in the guide could perhaps contribute to this. Old motorcycle mechanic here with some years of operating the first four stroke engines back in the early '80s. I had several Saitos as well as O.S. engines - first Saitos had separate heads from the cylinders which they must have stopped to cut costs.
Ouch David...That's the exact reason why I run my Saito 182 without rocker covers...before every run you can check overlap (RH cyl inlet just closed, LH cyl exhaust just opening) also at that rock point you can feel if appropriate lash (.002" - .004") is on all the tappets...generally if something is in error, you'll spot it then before any real harm is caused starting it like that.
Really like your videos and appreciate the effort to produce them. I understand the frustration in this circumstance but I'd like to offer an observation. Your opening comment of "I am NOT seeking advice nor is any wanted, so save it" comes across rather rude. Unsolicited advice and comments are part of the fabric of this hobby. Again, offered as just an observation you may not see from your side as the presenter. Please keep making these very helpful and informative videos. BTW, I would check the push rod and cam for damage. :)
Well at the risk of sounding rude yet again. I publish these videos for several reasons. First documentation for my own purposes, that secondly DO help others. I am not making these with the reason of soliciting advice or assistance from others. I understand that advice and assistance will be offered at times, but is it not being solicited unless I specifically ask for it. I feel I have adequate experience in this hobby to diagnose and remedy 95% of the issues I encounter. On the occasion that I DO need help I certainly wouldn't ask for it from unknown people on TH-cam. I direct those queries in the RC Forums where I have a better knowledge of the people and their level of experience. I appreciate your comment but if I sound rude, oh well. It is my channel and I will post as I see fit.
Not rude at all. It is indeed your channel and I appreciate the fact that you don't pander and just say what you think. I was not implying you do otherwise. It's just most TH-camrs are trying to build a good subscription base and often ask for feedback on their material. If that's not your cup-o-tea then no problem here. Like I said, I really appreciate your videos. They've been a great help to me on a few of my own troubleshooting exercises. Please keep them coming.
First let me say, that I appreciate your subscription and feedback. I think you are mixing topics however. I AM trying to establish a large subscription base. Getting subscribers and using/accepting/commenting on unsolicited advice is a TOTALLY different thing from 'pandering' to viewers. I get and expand my subscriber base from my video content, honesty, and hopefully entertainment value of my videos and not by accepting advice from others. That would be like you making friends with a total stranger on the street that comes up and gives you advice on something you have been doing for many years. Not really the best ice breaker I think you would agree. 99% of my subscribers are complete strangers to me. I know nothing about them or their level of knowledge about anything. So why would I take advice from them? Now if they told me a bit about themselves first via email or whatever, that would be a different story altogether. Most do not do that unfortunately. I wish more would. I would like to establish a better relationship with my viewers and subscribers. In that way I could better tailor topics to best suit their needs and thus expand my subscriber base even more.
Just in case you haven't seen this particular video. th-cam.com/video/RNJzJJUxo3s/w-d-xo.html
I had not seen that video. You explain your channel well. Thank you.
Been there...done that! I know that things like that really make you feel sick. I was replacing a compressor under warranty on a freezer, while brazing one of the copper lines it broke off flush with the case on the compressor, it was totally ruined. Naturally the warranty doesn't cover breaking something and the manufacturer would only pay for one compressor, so my company had to buy a new compressor to get us out of the hole, that was an expensive mistake! Everyone has a bad day once in a while, that was the most expensive mistake I ever made.
Hi David,
Thanks for the quick reply, I like the 100T, I also bought a FA 325R which has a Kelio exhaust and never run, still trying to get the nerve to fly it. Love your videos,
Appreciate all you're doing.
Andrew
That really blows david! I think i was just as pissed as u were, haha! Happy u found another head, now we can see that beauty run again! Heads up! Happens to all of us buddy!
Wow that really sucks! I picked up a used fa100 not long ago that had a stuck valve and I noticed the pushrod also had slipped out of place. I caught it before I bench tested it thank goodness.
Wow, really? Any idea how or when it slipped out? Perhaps the cups used are somewhat different and a bit easier to come out. very interesting information. Thank you.
have many saito engines.. the only time the pushrod comes dislidged like that on a saito is when it BENDS, something bound someplace
What a nice looking engine. Looks like a pia though, two low ends and high ends on one crank all mechanical.
David. unfortunely we learn in the way. I did train in Bell helicopter academy and the instructor says heat it don't hit it!. So always use your monokote heat gun. Ir I remmember in. the salto 120 that broken support isn't a part of the head hoy can check if this is the same in yours
Believe it or not, my Saito 72 exhaust push rod dislodged while bench running it, I had even double checked everything before covers were screwed back on. Lucky for me no damage...... must be Gremlins
Current USPS tracking shows the replacement head is due to arrive tomorrow! That is June 30th. Theoretically I could have this airplane flying again this long holiday weekend. However, I think I will fly my Super Sportster instead. I will need to run a tank or two of fuel through the head at a break-in setting to seat the ring. Plus I have several other hobby related things I would like to accomplish over the long weekend too.
David McIntire did the rocker move when you took the cover off? Could it have seized in place "open" and come disconnected that way? Just wondering, like you said in the video it seems like a weird failure just from checking clearances.
No, I am certain that was not the case. Besides I was hearing strange sounds from the engine during the flight videos I have posted.
God speed and good luck!
I David, I have a 10 year old 100T with about 40 mins runtime on it and I can't work out if it runs a twin throw or a boxer configuration, never had it apart to check. In all honesty I didn't realise there was a choke till I noticed you clicking it down, I always prime with a bottle or my finger over the intake. I uploaded a video about 6 years ago of the first run - very oily and won't idle, plus the prop I used was way too big. Damn shame as the engine sounds fantastic when it's running.
Andrew
No the 100T is not a boxer style engine. It has a single throw crankshaft. Read all about it here, sceptreflight.net/Model%20Engine%20Tests/Saito%20FA-100T.html
Very sad... Hope this engine will run soon again...
Oh....It WILL!
OMG David... what the hell happebed there.. how is that possible? Sh.t !!!
I'm still trying to wrap my head around how this could happen...
David McIntire i'm so sorry for your bed luck ;(
david just saw your vid t had same trouble i bet you know if you press down on valve spring the push rod will jump out of rocker screw unit saito 150
That arm was cracked to begin with, thats how the rod came out, I doubt it was your fault. Sometimes we blame ourselves for something we have no control over. I know this is old but shit happends, this I know. I had to rebuild a snowmobile engine twice because the factory specifications for the engine were wrong in the actual manual. Turns out all those engines were burning up because of a design flaw. After finding out how to fix the problem, the cure made the snowmobile a gas eating hog. The manufacturer ended up with egg on their faces and a bunch of returned snowmobiles. I learned never to rely on factory specifications after that. If I see a problem I recognize as a manufacturer issue,I correct it on my own. I really think that arm was already cracked, the pushrod slipped out when heated up. You hit the arm on the crack from a different position on cold metal and the crack broke. Inbother words, the crack was allowing the arm to stretch enough to let the rod opo out when hot. No, it was in no way your fault. My guess is there was a flaw in the metal to begin with. Only a magniflux machine would have spotted that crack. or persion blue ink. I found a crack in a cylinder head using the blue ink one time, it wasnt clearly noticeable at all. I would suggest getting a bottle for future testing of those arms.
At least you found it before the engine let go in mid flite
No shit! The airplane it was on was a gift from an awesome subscriber. I felt a certain obligation to get a flight video of it.
Unfortunate! such a nice engine
Hey David, do you know if the cylinder/head is the same as the Saito 50?
No the 100T and Saito 50 are totally different. The 100T, being a twin, has the intake manifold on the left side of the head not in the back like the 50.
I feel your pain man
Ever get this one up and going?
I have several videos of this after the repair. You just need to search my channel for them.
Man, what a kick in the dick.
Oh my god David Breckenridge. You must wash your mouth with the holly water ;)
Robert Petrinčič you tell him captain ohh yeah
Super #saaad. But this is part of the Business. Hope you 'll find parts to fix it.
A new head is in the mail to me right now. Thank you!
Fix it 'til it's broke
ya i bet that had a stress crack in it
what a bummer!!!!
I like most have been there. It's a shit happens demon. Da little bastards! Go to the bathroom shut the door and let out a scream. You'll feel better .Then just fix it.
that sucks man
There's your problem!
Dam it 😪
Saito disastrous design OS gemini twins are much better
Well everyone is welcome to their own opinion. OS twins are very nice but Saitos are excellent engine as well. Seeing as I have owned and operated multiples of each, I think my opinion is most important to me. Disastrous design? Is that why Saito is still one of the few rc engine manufacturers still making engines? OS has had their share of poor designs and issue too. Like having 4 bearings in a single cylinder four stroke engine as opposed to 2 in a Saito. Have you ever tried removing the cam shaft bearings from an OS four stroke? If not, luckily I have made some videos on how to do that. It is completely unnecessary when working on a Saito engine.